Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: nugetx on June 01, 2017, 04:25:14 AM
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(http://i.imgur.com/SFQvWJ6.jpg)
Grinding for planes (which would likely cause a current player mass exodus) or grinding for cosmetics. Personally I think it would rub the vast majority of longtime players wrong, although there aren't THAT many of them still around and it might bring in more than they'd lose.
That's why there needs to be a solution to satisfy many players.
There are people who want
1) All planes unlocked
2) RPS
3) Ability to fly their 'favourite plane'
4) Grind
5) No Grind
Combining all of these is not an easy task, because they contradict each other.
Just brainstorming, with this you have RPS + all planes unlocked (for purchase before the 'release date'). In Late war early and mid war planes could still be viable by having higher score to unlock the late war planes. The planes would be gradualy unlocking, but you can unlock later war plane or your 'favourite' plane if you accumulate enough cost points, and have a few uses of it if you die, if use all the 'uses' you have to accumulate points for it again, that is if the plane is not unlocked already by the current year.
This IMHO would work pretty well for game and balance shifting. Early war player would gain a lot of points for hunting down a late war player, thus getting a lot of points for 'his' late war plane. On the other hand a late war player would had to be very cautious and think twice is it worth risking to fight a early war plane for low ammount of points risking his own plane ?
The stakes would make the game so much thrilling :cool:
(http://i.imgur.com/SFQvWJ6.jpg)
Anyone likes this idea?
The numbers are just a visual representation to get the point of the idea..... pay no attention to the numbers ;)
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I like your enthusiasm...but
-1
You pay...you have everything...if you suck but you pay...you have everything....if you are an ace pilot and you pay....you have everything...
If you want to unlock something, do the achievements...
I don't even think anyone has finished all the achievements...
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You pay...you have everything...if you suck but you pay...you have everything....if you are an ace pilot and you pay....you have everything...
Yes and you still have everything, the point of this is to have players play the early and med war planes, so it doesn't get boring playing with and VS late war planes only.
Also i think it would add to the excitement of possibly meeting a late war plane and downing it and earning enough points to instantly jump to a later war plane yourself.
Or possible frustration loosing a late war plane to a early war plane, but it's part of the excitement.
It's the little things in the long run that make people stay..... if you constantly fight in a p51 vs p51 and nothing happens.... it gets boring after time, that's why people leave, there need to be a hook.
War Thunder has a hook in grinding, same with WoT, that's why so many people play there, but it's an ugly hook, because you don't have everything and it's locked out.
What I proposed is what i would consider an elegant hook, that treats every player fairly, because no matter if you are good or not, you have everything to fly with in the end.
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-1. We had the early- and midwar arenas for that purposes, noone used them (to fight)
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oh well :rolleyes:. I could probably write also why no one used to fight at them, but i need a rest right now :old:
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Also i think it would add to the excitement of possibly meeting a late war plane and downing it and earning enough points to instantly jump to a later war plane yourself.
Then fly an early war plane or midwar plane...
It's the little things in the long run that make people stay..... if you constantly fight in a p51 vs p51 and nothing happens.... it gets boring after time, that's why people leave, there need to be a hook.
War Thunder has a hook in grinding, same with WoT, that's why so many people play there, but it's an ugly hook, because you don't have everything and it's locked out.
Don't fly a pony all the time and it wont get boring...
Also I know what my definition of "grinding" is and it has nothing to do with playing games ...if you want something to strive for do the achievements...as I said...I don't think anyone has finished them all...
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Then fly an early war plane or midwar plane...
Ha! Good answer, and I would if in the back of my mind I wouldn't knew that I will be facing 90% late war planes.
It's about the sense of variety, you won't be eating the same type of 1 food untill your death, won't you ?
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Ha! Good answer, and I would if in the back of my mind I wouldn't knew that I will be facing 90% late war planes.
It's about the sense of variety, you won't be eating the same type of 1 food untill your death, won't you ?
I normally don't fly the same plane more than 2 sorties in a row...I try make sure the game is exciting for me and my guys...By doing other stuff the game has to offer...
Nug...You should show up in the WWI arena or DA and play with us... Remember...Those arenas are free to play
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I normally don't fly the same plane more than 2 sorties in a row...I try make sure the game is exciting for me and my guys...By doing other stuff the game has to offer...
Nug...You should show up in the WWI arena or DA and play with us... Remember...Those arenas are free to play
Ok but that's the players that play now....... those 500+ there were here before..... are not here anymore, for those or other various reasons.
Online games live and die with their audience.
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Ok but that's the players that play now....... those 500+ there were here before..... are not here anymore, for those or other various reasons.
Online games live and die with their audience.
And... your conclusion is those guys would come back if there were an RPS? :headscratch:
Wiley.
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I like the OP trying original thinking. It's this kind of discussion we need around here.
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I like the OP trying original thinking. It's this kind of discussion we need around here.
"Original" does not automatically equate to "good idea". RPS, limiting number of times you can up plane X, and perking more planes is not exactly original thinking either. Those ideas have been brought up a couple times in the past.
Wiley.
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And... your conclusion is those guys would come back if there were an RPS? :headscratch:
Wiley.
They would come back or new would come.
Lets say 500 players were here before..... 100 of them were RPS crowd........ 100 didn't get hooked or got bored.... 300 for other reasons.
So that's 200 people
The game currently caters to 1 type of players, I do not like this wording but it describes what is currently as 'air quake arena'
Look, how it would look with the proposed system:
It's 1939, 1 type of player who doesn't care about achievements or what plane to fly, takes a spit I and flies, 2nd type of player who wants his favourite plane, also takes a early war plane to get enough points for his 'favourite plane'.
3rd type of player who wants the sense of achievement does the same, not because he wants a specific plane, he wants to feel 'moving up the ladder'.
So that's 3 type of players serviced compared to 1.
Everyone in the meantime is using early and mid war planes...... changing the balance of late planes which are currently used in 90% to about 20-30% overall. Once the years move forward the ratio naturaly changes, because as the years move forward, the 1st type of player flies the planes of the current year, 2nd type of player has his favourite plane unlocked by default and 3rd type of player still goes for the most advanced plane.
So it's not 'only' RPS, it's the next generation of RPS lol.
Add to that a realistic map and axis vs allies and the 4th type of crowd comes back - those that want the game to be more realistic.
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They would come back or new would come.
Lets say 500 players were here before..... 100 of them were RPS crowd........ 100 didn't get hooked or got bored.... 300 for other reasons.
So that's 200 people
That's some pretty cool unsubstantiated wishful thinking. Show me one place where an RPS was a success and brought in many players.
The game currently caters to 1 type of players, I do not like this wording but it describes what is currently as 'air quake arena'
Look, how it would look with the proposed system:
It's 1939, 1 type of player who doesn't care about achievements or what plane to fly, takes a spit I and flies,
And gets crushed by the enemy guy who paid perks to fly his Spit IX. The guy in the Spit IX flies ultraconservatively so he doesn't lose one of his 4 available Spit IX's, leading to all kinds of timid gameplay, encouraged by the system.
2nd type of player who wants his favourite plane, also takes a early war plane to get enough points for his 'favourite plane'.
...Or logs because he doesn't want to grind with a crap plane to fly the one he wants to.
3rd type of player who wants the sense of achievement does the same, not because he wants a specific plane, he wants to feel 'moving up the ladder'.
So that's 3 type of players serviced compared to 1.
Everyone in the meantime is using early and mid war planes......
...Or logging.
changing the balance of late planes which are currently used in 90% to about 20-30% overall. Once the years move forward the ratio naturaly changes, because as the years move forward, the 1st type of player flies the planes of the current year, 2nd type of player has his favourite plane unlocked by default and 3rd type of player still goes for the most advanced plane.
So it's not 'only' RPS, it's the next generation of RPS lol.
It's RPS. It's just RPS with the added twist that if you're good enough you get to be in better gear than the guys that aren't, which isn't conducive to good gameplay. You don't want the good players having the additional bonus of an equipment advantage over the worse players.
This is not air quake. This is air Planetside 2. War Thunder is air quake.
Wiley.
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Your 2nd type of player would simply quit playing until his favorite ride is available...or quit the game entirely. Very few of these one-uber-LateWar-plane-or-nothing players would fly old and slow planes for any reason, and I'm pretty sure they would not pay a full monthly subscription to fly their favorite plane for a few days each month.
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Show me one place where an RPS was a success and brought in many players.
I cannot show you in AH, because MA was never it to my knowledge.... but every other flight sim game is AvA, people are EXPECTING a WW2 game to be AvA, once they see that it's not, they just go away.
And gets crushed by the enemy guy who paid perks to fly his Spit IX.
What do you mean paid? Everything would be as it is now, you would first need to fly to get enough perks.
The guy in the Spit IX flies ultraconservatively so he doesn't lose one of his 4 available Spit IX's, leading to all kinds of timid gameplay, encouraged by the system.
And Spit 1 player goes after him for the fat points ! This is great excitement to me.
Or logs because he doesn't want to grind with a crap plane to fly the one he wants to.
...Or logging.
So just make it when he logs, he looses the 1 plane out of the pool.
It's RPS. It's just RPS with the added twist that if you're good enough you get to be in better gear than the guys that aren't, which isn't conducive to good gameplay.
As currently, you would be getting points for doing damage and other targets, so you don't have to be superman to get a better plane, maybe even we would see more players playing differently, to get points for more things.
This gives incentive for early and mid planes, currently there is very little, and this is only expanding on what is currently, so how it is not better gameplay?
You don't want the good players having the additional bonus of an equipment advantage over the worse players.
'worse' is a subjective term, because when players play long enough they get better. New players even in late war planes will perform poor.
Is it better to everyone fly late war plane?
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Your 2nd type of player would simply quit playing until his favorite ride is available...or quit the game entirely. Very few of these one-uber-LateWar-plane-or-nothing players would fly old and slow planes for any reason, and I'm pretty sure they would not pay a full monthly subscription to fly their favorite plane for a few days each month.
And if they fly the one-uber-latewar-plane to 'own' other players..... wouldnt this give them even more incentive to have that uber plane knowing that other playears are still in spit 1 ? bigger chance for 'owning noobs'.
I can see suddenly the grin on those players faces.
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Ha! Good answer, and I would if in the back of my mind I wouldn't knew that I will be facing 90% late war planes.
You would still be facing 90% late war planes under your own proposed system. Do you really think that the vast majority of players will forgo spending perks (most veteran players have enough to spend without problems) and wait until their ride of choice is available through the RPS? The vast majority will ignore the RPS and just spend their perks to immediately unlock their plane.
It's about the sense of variety, you won't be eating the same type of 1 food untill your death, won't you ?
Players should be less concerned on what other people fly, it makes the game less frustrating that way.
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You would still be facing 90% late war planes under your own proposed system. Do you really think that the vast majority of players will forgo spending perks (most veteran players have enough to spend without problems) and wait until their ride of choice is available through the RPS? The vast majority will ignore the RPS and just spend their perks to immediately unlock their plane.
But you first have to fly the early war plane to get the perks.
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But you first have to fly the early war plane to get the perks.
I have over 100k perks, are you proposing that I have 17 years worth of perks erased? I don't think so.
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I have over 100k perks, are you proposing that I have 17 years worth of perks erased? I don't think so.
yes :bolt:
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yes :bolt:
Then your proposed system just lost one long time customer.
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Ack-Ack,
You have worked in the computer gaming industry now for what, 20+ years, and have helped launch games onto Steam. How long do games survive when the owners decide their current game has to become a clone of all the attractive parts from the other games they are competing with to survive? This is what nuget is telling Hitech he needs to do to make AH3 successful in nuget's world.
If Hitech lost his mind and initiated a plane availability system, he would have to eliminate everyone's perk points they have earned over the last decade or longer to be fair to nuget, or we would still fly our favorite planes. I have a squad mate with 50,000 fighter perks, I think I had a drunk night and reduced mine to about 10,000. All of these ideas have an interesting side effect, the core membership with a decade or so of perks would probably cancel their subscriptions cleaning out most of the old veterans. They are almost the equivalent of an arena full of level bosses and overnight turn AH3 into a genX-Y haven by design or accident.
I wonder if during nuget's 2 week trial he got really scalped by all the hungry for kills old vets in our game?
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yes :bolt:
WHAT? I was not gonna pile on until I saw you were absolutely crazy. :rolleyes: -1
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current game has to become a clone of all the attractive parts from the other games they are competing with to survive? This is what nuget is telling Hitech he needs to do to make AH3 successful in nuget's world.
Bustr with all respect, AH would not become a clone, but the best WW2 semi-historical plane/vehicle combat game in the world, because there is no such a game currently.
he would have to eliminate everyone's perk points they have earned over the last decade or longer to be fair to nuget
Not to me but to all the new players who are just starting. Old players however could get something special for all the years of support.
I don't know currently how much perks are important to the old players..... but seeing you have over 50,000 which are not used, are they really that important?
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WHAT? I was not gonna pile on until I saw you were absolutely crazy. :rolleyes: -1
Someone has to :rock
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Then your proposed system just lost one long time customer.
but wait untill you hear the news about the special goods for the long term customers...... :angel:
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-1
I see nothing of value anywhere in your proposal including the random numbers your are guessing at.
BTW, once again, what is your in-game name?
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If kappa drops in here and admits this is his troll...nuget have you ever played AH2 or AH3 even for a two week trial? This is beginning to remind me of 4chan.
This could more likely be a troll by gnat....
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BTW, once again, what is your in-game name?
Currently none as i'm waiting for AH to be on steam
even for a two week trial?
Yes I played the trial
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And if they fly the one-uber-latewar-plane to 'own' other players..... wouldnt this give them even more incentive to have that uber plane knowing that other playears are still in spit 1 ? bigger chance for 'owning noobs'.
I can see suddenly the grin on those players faces.
...and the punching bag newbs do what in this scenario? Oh, right. They will just bear down and get better because fighting against people who have more skill plus an equipment advantage encourages them at every turn. There's no way they'd get frustrated and quit.
I cannot show you in AH, because MA was never it to my knowledge.... but every other flight sim game is AvA, people are EXPECTING a WW2 game to be AvA, once they see that it's not, they just go away.
I didn't say AvA, I said RPS. Surely there is plethora of examples of an RPS being used in games like this that have worked, right?
If what you say above is the case, AvA's on the left. Why's it empty?
What do you mean paid? Everything would be as it is now, you would first need to fly to get enough perks.
Which would be trivial for a vet. Paid with their perks. They've got them, they use them.
And Spit 1 player goes after him for the fat points ! This is great excitement to me.
And can't begin to catch up with him or climb with him, unless the Spit 9 pilot's a complete numpty, the Spit I gets killed.
So just make it when he logs, he looses the 1 plane out of the pool.
He never launched it. He just didn't bother launching anything and logged.
As currently, you would be getting points for doing damage and other targets, so you don't have to be superman to get a better plane, maybe even we would see more players playing differently, to get points for more things.
Ah yes... the awe inspiring ground attack ability of the Spit I.
This gives incentive for early and mid planes, currently there is very little, and this is only expanding on what is currently, so how it is not better gameplay?
Ah... you're expanding on current gameplay by restricting what people can do. Gotcha. :aok
'worse' is a subjective term, because when players play long enough they get better. New players even in late war planes will perform poor.
Is it better to everyone fly late war plane?
It's better to not limit peoples' options.
If people wanted AvA, the AvA arena would be populated. If people wanted mid or late war matchups, those arenas would've been populated.
Wiley.
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"If people wanted AvA, the AvA arena would be populated. If people wanted mid or late war matchups, those arenas would've been populated."
Its more along the lines of cows...one cow in a field does what he wants. One cow in a herd, goes where the herd goes..
Wouldn't recommend splitting arena's with current map size and players and ability NOT to fly....
If anything, I'd have an arcade style arena (like War Thunder) for the noobs to cut their teeth in.
Those who want more can wander over to the Melee in their baby seal outfits....
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"If people wanted AvA, the AvA arena would be populated. If people wanted mid or late war matchups, those arenas would've been populated."
Its more along the lines of cows...one cow in a field does what he wants. One cow in a herd, goes where the herd goes..
True but if AvA was a driving force, why did the MA become popular?
Wiley.
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...and the punching bag newbs do what in this scenario? Oh, right. They will just bear down and get better because fighting against people who have more skill plus an equipment advantage encourages them at every turn. There's no way they'd get frustrated and quit.
It's not as simple as that..... many more factors would come in play, i know that you know about them also. Like you said, would a spit 9 pilot would want to fight vs spit 1 potentialy risking his plane uses?
the higher tier planes would have much more to loose than lower tier planes.
I didn't say AvA, I said RPS. Surely there is plethora of examples of an RPS being used in games like this that have worked, right?
AvA and RPS usualy go hand in hand, look at IL 2 1946, cliffs of dover, rise of flight, the new Il-2 all AvA and RPS.
If what you say above is the case, AvA's on the left. Why's it empty?
It's more of a mental thing currently in AH. People flock were people are, no one is at AvA so no one goes there.
If there was only one WW2 arena everyone would be there.
Which would be trivial for a vet. Paid with their perks. They've got them, they use them.
About that perk reset......
And can't begin to catch up with him or climb with him, unless the Spit 9 pilot's a complete numpty, the Spit I gets killed.
Then the spit I deserved it..... a good pilot in spit I would not do that..... a new player will learn
Ah yes... the awe inspiring ground attack ability of the Spit I.
Still.... there is the damage
Ah... you're expanding on current gameplay by restricting what people can do. Gotcha. :aok
mmm..... again it's a mental thing..... adding layers of complexity gives players incentive to do things in different ways to achieve different things.
Giving players different paths of gameplay, leads to different people playing in various ways. A game is not real life.... untill a game simulates real life 100%, you need to have systems which lead players in one way or other, otherwise a game will not be a game.
It's better to not limit peoples' options.
You see it as limiting, I see it as expanding.
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It's not as simple as that..... many more factors would come in play, i know that you know about them also. Like you said, would a spit 9 pilot would want to fight vs spit 1 potentialy risking his plane uses?
If he's at advantage, why wouldn't he? He loses advantage, he walks away from the fight. No different than a 262 in the MA today.
AvA and RPS usualy go hand in hand, look at IL 2 1946, cliffs of dover, rise of flight, the new Il-2 all AvA and RPS.
Single player portions where you go through your career. When it's multiplayer time, you fly the matchups you want to fly. You don't have to grind multiplayer to fly the planes you want.
It's more of a mental thing currently in AH. People flock were people are, no one is at AvA so no one goes there.
If there was only one WW2 arena everyone would be there.
Again. AvA's been around here for long enough. Why isn't it full if that's what people actually want?
About that perk reset......
Yeah. Good luck with that idea.
Then the spit I deserved it..... a good pilot in spit I would not do that..... a new player will learn
So the Spit I doesn't chase the retreating Spit IX because he knows he can't catch him... So no fight occurs. Do you see the problem here?
Showing players different paths of gameplay, is an indication of good game design, having no path is bad for gameplay.
There are multitudes of games that tell you where to go and what to do. Why do you insist on changing one of the rare exceptions to be like them? Why not go play something that already is doing what you want to be doing?
Wiley.
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If he's at advantage, why wouldn't he? He loses advantage, he walks away from the fight. No different than a 262 in the MA today.
This is tit for tat..... if 262 is starting from the field and spit I is vulching him... spit I has the advantage. Everything depends on the situation.
Single player portions where you go through your career. When it's multiplayer time, you fly the matchups you want to fly. You don't have to grind multiplayer to fly the planes you want.
Yes but this is a purely online game.... there needs to be the hook, to keep people for long time, as a player myself, I proposed something which I think of would be as enjoyable.
Again. AvA's been around here for long enough. Why isn't it full if that's what people actually want?
No idea.
So the Spit I doesn't chase the retreating Spit IX because he knows he can't catch him... So no fight occurs. Do you see the problem here?
but in the skies it's impossible to cherry pick fights..... in the end you will end up in a fight surprised by other plane, if a few fights will be a stalemate, so be it.
There are multitudes of games that tell you where to go and what to do.
I'm -not- saying to have a game where you are told where to go and what to do. The game systems designed correctly do it by themselves.
For example: to fly the me 262, you know you need the perk points, so you keep the perk points to fly the plane. - the game system tells you what to do, without telling you to 'go past this hill and kill 5 trees'. How you do it, it is up to you.
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It's not as simple as that..... many more factors would come in play, i know that you know about them also. Like you said, would a spit 9 pilot would want to fight vs spit 1 potentialy risking his plane uses?
the higher tier planes would have much more to loose than lower tier planes.
Basically that ends up promoting a non-fight.
AvA and RPS usualy go hand in hand, look at IL 2 1946, cliffs of dover, rise of flight, the new Il-2 all AvA and RPS.
Those games aren't similar to AH, as they are single player games with a multiplayer component. Also, the multiplayer in those games isn't necessarily going to be RPS, that all depends on the game mode on whatever server you wish to play on
It's more of a mental thing currently in AH. People flock were people are, no one is at AvA so no one goes there.
If there was only one WW2 arena everyone would be there.
Why do people flock to the Melee Arena and not the AvA, or the Early/Mid-War arenas (despite the MW arena have the best plane match up) when those two arenas were around? Because people really don't like to be limited on what and when they can fly the plane of their choice.
If there was only a single arena using the system you've proposed, there soon wouldn't be a game to host that arena before too long.
Then the spit I deserved it..... a good pilot in spit I would not do that..... a new player will learn
All you've done is create a frustrated player, one that will most likely not go past his free trial if he feels he's become nothing more than a constant baby seal just waiting to be clubbed each time he gets into a fighter.
You see it as limiting, I see it as expanding.
Restricting and ultimately penalizing (new/casual players) with your proposed system is hardly what one could call "expanding".
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This is tit for tat..... if 262 is starting from the field and spit I is vulching him... spit I has the advantage. Everything depends on the situation.
Again. The 262 driver is a complete numpty in that example. Nobody would do that with a limited access plane. They're coming from 1 or 2 fields over.
Yes but this is a purely online game.... there needs to be the hook, to keep people for long time, as a player myself, I proposed something which I think of would be as enjoyable.
So... you have no examples of it working in a game similar to this one, where people have provided an example of it being wildly unpopular in a game that's very similar to this one.
but in the skies it's impossible to cherry pick fights..... in the end you will end up in a fight surprised by other plane, if a few fights will be a stalemate, so be it.
If you have SA and are flying conservatively in the fastest thing available, the number of times this happens dwindles to near 0.
I'm -not- saying to have a game where you are told where to go and what to do. The game systems designed correctly do it by themselves.
Ok I'll play. The only thing you have available to you is a Spit I. Explain the profoundly wide options you have in gameplay.
For example: to fly the me 262, you know you need the perk points, so you keep the perk points to fly the plane. - the game system tells you what to do, without telling you to 'go past this hill and kill 5 trees'. How you do it, it is up to you.
And the player has the effective tools to do it with. Under your system, they don't.
Wiley.
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Everyone here who has created an RPS. Please raise Your hand.
:old:
HiTech
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Everyone here who has created an RPS. Please raise Your hand.
:old:
HiTech
That was the first time in WBs, right? I've heard old players say it was wildly unpopular. Their bias, or true?
Wiley.
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Everyone here who has created an RPS. Please raise Your hand.
:old:
HiTech
From experience, when you do this, it's the other shoe you drop, if you choose to, that is more important to see.
The new and old laundry getting corked in this post is loosing it's buzz.
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So... you have no examples of it working in a game similar to this one, where people have provided an example of it being wildly unpopular in a game that's very similar to this one.
Yes I have none, because Aces High would be the first one to do this.
Ok I'll play. The only thing you have available to you is a Spit I. Explain the profoundly wide options you have in gameplay.
Ok, but first you need to set your mind accordingly.
You have to think now that you are playing the rps + perk system AH (and idealy ava also).
It's 1939 and you look through the plane hangar and you see all planes that cost points (except the current year ones), do you want a higher one? or you do not care and just want to fly? Naturaly people would want a higher tier plane, so now you think 'how many points i need and how do i get it'. So you read info and you learn that you can get perks by damaging stuff, kills or attacking targets.
So do you go jabo and attack nearest empty fields to get points? raising alarm and thus upping the enemy planes? or do you head in base defense or in search of targets? You start and decide to attack the nearest field. Meanwhile while you are going to your target you see a low 1942 plane - the 190 A5, he is damaged.... do you drop the bombs and head in for the fat points? he desperately wants to get away so he can keep his last two plane uses. What will you do ? You decide to let him live and head for the target but a 109 E4 jumps on you.... the 109 E4 pilot is not good enough and starts to dogfight with you not knowing that spit I turns better, you gun him down but took some damage and decide to RTB to hold the points.
You land and check how much more for that plane. You calculate that 3 Acks should be enough, so you go fast and low, kill 3 nearest acks and then go home to unlock the higher plane, meanwhile while you started to attack the field more players started attacking it also, thus making a full assault.
Now in your new p40 from 1940 which you can use 5 times because it's still 1939, you go high to clear the skies and hold the air superiority over the field from the 109's e4.
And the player has the effective tools to do it with. Under your system, they don't.
It's the same
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Yes I have none, because Aces High would be the first one to do this.
WBs did it first. From all I've ever heard about it, spectacularly unpopular.
Ok, but first you need to set your mind accordingly.
You have to think now that you are playing the rps + perk system AH (and idealy ava also).
It's 1939 and you look through the plane hangar and you see all planes that cost points (except the current year ones), do you want a higher one? or you do not care and just want to fly? Naturaly people would want a higher tier plane, so now you think 'how many points i need and how do i get it'. So you read info and you learn that you can get perks by damaging stuff, kills or attacking targets.
So do you go jabo and attack nearest empty fields to get points? raising alarm and thus upping the enemy planes? or do you head in base defense or in search of targets? You start and decide to attack the nearest field. Meanwhile while you are going to your target you see a low 1942 plane - the 190 A5, he is damaged.... do you drop the bombs
What bombs?
and head in for the fat points? he desperately wants to get away so he can keep his last two plane uses. What will you do ? You decide to let him live and head for the target but a 109 E4 jumps on you.... the 109 E4 pilot is not good enough and starts to dogfight with you not knowing that spit I turns better, you gun him down but took some damage and decide to RTB to hold the points.
You land and check how much more for that plane. You calculate that 3 Acks should be enough, so you go fast and low, kill 3 nearest acks and then go home to unlock the higher plane, meanwhile while you started to attack the field more players started attacking it also, thus making a full assault.
And run headlong into a squad of 190s at alt. Carnage ensues. No points gained, and they move closer to your field to vulch you as you come off of it.
But eventually you figure out to go after a base where there are no enemies, so you get your points by strafing down those nasty ack guns...
Now in your new p40 from 1940 which you can use 5 times because it's still 1939, you go high to clear the skies and hold the air superiority over the field from the 109's e4.
...And run into that same flock of 190s over the field freshly replaned and at alt.
Are you having fun or what?
Wiley.
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WBs did it first. From all I've ever heard about it, spectacularly unpopular.
But this is RPS v 2.0 hehe, with AH perks.
What bombs?
Oh yea forgot Spit I has no bombs... still strafing lighter targets is always an option, and there was plenty of strafing in WW2.
And run headlong into a squad of 190s at alt. Carnage ensues. No points gained, and they move closer to your field to vulch you as you come off of it.
But eventually you figure out to go after a base where there are no enemies, so you get your points by strafing down those nasty ack guns...
...And run into that same flock of 190s over the field freshly replaned and at alt.
Are you having fun or what?
Wiley.
tit for tat ;)
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like my words of wisdom for troubled employees "remember the day you walked in here looking for a job." There is a core reason we play this game, and what makes it fun. If we forget the simple truth that AH is a massive arena that allows for a unparalleled combat experience, we are abandoning the core of the game. I have been disappointed every time changes were made that went against the "Free World". Reinventing the game is a possibility, but htc seems to be doing a somewhat proper job of exploring other gameplay possibilities at the side of the main product, a wise move imo. The other gimmicks to drive or slow a hooked customer are not more than nuances of a good business model, the product is still what dives the sale.
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But this is RPS v 2.0 lol with AH perks.
No really guys! This time it will work! Honest!
Oh yea forgot Spit I has no bombs... still strafing lighter targets is always an option, and there was plenty of strafing in WW2.
With .303s on anything larger than troops? Oh yeah, heard about it all the time.
Your entire argument is entirely based on everything going spectacularly right for the new player. That's not how it happens. Your idea is similar to games like DayZ or Rust. The guys with the gear get richer, the new guys without the gear get squashed over and over and over until they quit.
Wiley.
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Wiley,
Think about something. This Frankensteinian monster happened because Hitech chose to post that he was seriously considering Steam since early April just after nuget posted his wish list about Steam. Unless this is a TROLL or a rigged coordination to see how the forum really feels about this subject, which it's keeping the responses honest and no kissing up to Hitech for favors yet. Nuget is not listening to anyone because he believes Hitech validated his position over anyone's in the forum. Otherwise all he has is Pie-in-the-Sky and no substance because of Hitech's posting in a coincidental time slot.
It's that old thing that never goes away, you saw it back when the Beatles first came to the US. One of the Beatles would touch some random girl's hand by accident and she wouldn't wash it for days because he touched her out of thousands of girls on that day. Back then she was the envy of other teenagers, her parents just told her to wash her hand and get over it.
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-1
I see nothing of value anywhere in your proposal including the random numbers your are guessing at.
BTW, once again, what is your in-game name?
Cybro! :old: :rofl
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Wiley,
Think about something. This Frankensteinian monster happened because Hitech chose to post that he was seriously considering Steam since early April just after nuget posted his wish list about Steam. Unless this is a TROLL or a rigged coordination to see how the forum really feels about this subject, which it's keeping the responses honest and no kissing up to Hitech for favors yet. Nuget is not listening to anyone because he believes Hitech validated his position over anyone's in the forum. Otherwise all he has is Pie-in-the-Sky and no substance because of Hitech's posting in a coincidental time slot.
It's that old thing that never goes away, you saw it back when the Beatles first came to the US. One of the Beatles would touch some random girl's hand by accident and she wouldn't wash it for days because he touched her out of thousands of girls on that day. Back then she was the envy of other teenagers, her parents just told her to wash her hand and get over it.
Meh. I really don't care if he's trolling or not. He's got ideas. I'm explaining why they're not good. Life will crush the optimism out of him eventually and he'll realize why you can't always assume the best when it comes to game design.
Wiley.
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Wiley,
Steam since early April just after nuget posted his wish list about Steam.
Was before nuget posted.
HiTech
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And he's convinced you validated his wish list idea and is now back for the double whammie sales pitch of "you can be the first in the industry if you just try out my idea"....
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And he's convinced you validated his wish list idea and is now back for the double whammie sales pitch of "you can be the first in the industry if you just try out my idea"....
I still have no idea (nor does anyone else) if it would generate many new accounts. But even if it only generates a 150 it will have been worth it. Most of the coding is also being written for the Oculus store front.
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I still have no idea (nor does anyone else) if it would generate many new accounts. But even if it only generates a 150 it will have been worth it. Most of the coding is also being written for the Oculus store front.
LOL for a split second I thought you were talking about the RPS.
Wiley.
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I still have no idea (nor does anyone else) if it would generate many new accounts. But even if it only generates a 150 it will have been worth it. Most of the coding is also being written for the Oculus store front.
:aok
Here's to hoping for way more than 150. :cheers:
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If you make it opt-in only, it would remove all the troubles with the RPS idea. All you need to do is add incentive and thus (farming perk points) fills the void for these type of players.
It would be no different then having easy mode or combat trim enabled/disabled like we have now.
A game within a game, to say.
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There is a core reason we play this game, and what makes it fun. If we forget the simple truth that AH is a massive arena that allows for a unparalleled combat experience, we are abandoning the core of the game.
Yes AH is a massive arena..... and it can be a WW2 massive arena with a historical background, doesn't that sound better as a concept ?
The front page 'Welcome to the best WW2 combat experience' would ring with a strength of thousand bells.
People would come and say 'WOW ! I never knew a game like this existed, why haven't I heard of it before?'
:airplane:
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In order to win the war the last based must be taken/defended with EW planes :old:
:rofl
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You guys are killing me :rofl :rofl :rofl
If you want to play axis vs allies with a rolling plane set get with Jaeger or one of the other AXIS VS ALLIES ARENA STAFF and they will make your wish come true...This I am almost sure of...You guarantee them players they will find you a time with the arena settings you are wanting...
OTHER THAN THAT YOU ARE NOT GOING TO SEE A ROLLING PLANE SET IN THE MELEE ARENA...
I hope you understand what I have been saying and others have been saying...We have a whole separate freaking arena for AvA...If you want a rolling plane set...Set with the AVA STAFF...If you want to continue with the idea that a RPS is what the game needs in the Melee arena...Well... :bhead
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Just have an AlliedvAxis arena like before on the side,
(pssss its been done already , they know what they are doing..)
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You guys are killing me :rofl :rofl :rofl
If you want to play axis vs allies with a rolling plane set get with Jaeger or one of the other AXIS VS ALLIES ARENA STAFF and they will make your wish come true...This I am almost sure of...You guarantee them players they will find you a time with the arena settings you are wanting...
OTHER THAN THAT YOU ARE NOT GOING TO SEE A ROLLING PLANE SET IN THE MELEE ARENA...
I hope you understand what I have been saying and others have been saying...We have a whole separate freaking arena for AvA...If you want a rolling plane set...Set with the AVA STAFF...If you want to continue with the idea that a RPS is what the game needs in the Melee arena...Well... :bhead
The settings in the AVA are not the same as the OMA. Thus I am not interested. I *AM* interested in an OMA with an RPS--which is completely different than an AVA with an RPS (and other settings). :old:
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If you make it opt-in only, it would remove all the troubles with the RPS idea. All you need to do is add incentive and thus (farming perk points) fills the void for these type of players.
It would be no different then having easy mode or combat trim enabled/disabled like we have now.
A game within a game, to say.
....and why would anyone opt in?
New guys dont have the perks, and old guys dont need the perks. There is no incentive for anyone to use the system.
Thankfully, we wont EVER see a RPS in AH. It doesn't work for the masses. It has been proven before.
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Yes AH is a massive arena..... and it can be a WW2 massive arena with a historical background, doesn't that sound better as a concept ?
The front page 'Welcome to the best WW2 combat experience' would ring with a strength of thousand bells.
People would come and say 'WOW ! I never knew a game like this existed, why haven't I heard of it before?'
:airplane:
why not helping us increase the numbers by having an account instead of the 2 free weeks. then you can come and enlighted every about how you could save the game
semp
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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Guys you have to remember that changes can bring in more players......along with steam AH can once again see 300-500 arena players.
If you like the game now, i see no reason why you wouldn't like it if it would play even more fun.
It's a win-win for everyone, HTC because he gets more players and players old and new alike, because they get to play a even better game.
Will it be different to what it is now? Somewhat, but the core of the game remains the same, you would play the same game you knew and loved for years but with a twist.
Even old players would re-subscribe to check out the new gameplay and maybe they would stay again, because the game now could hook them for a longer time.
Gameplay change is a solution to draw in a new crowd and re-subscribe the old crowd, the only ones are in the hardest opposition currently I see are the old crowd who are currently subscribed...
The the old crowd who are subscribed - you loose nothing out of this, you only gain together with HTC, as the game moves forward and expands, move with it together and help it grow, you are not being left out, you are foundation block of AH as you were standing there like a wall for many years, in the future as in the past, you were here for past 17 years and you can still be here for the next 17 years, but for this there need to be a new blood also, you need to make more space available now to new people, new type of crowd, everyone can co-exist together in what AH can become. AH NEEDS YOU :salute
I see nothing but only positives that can come out of this.
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Guys you have to remember that changes can bring in more players......along with steam AH can once again see 300-500 arena players.
Yes, changes to the game play do have a potential to bring in new players, it also has the potential of driving players away from the game as well.
If you like the game now, i see no reason why you wouldn't like it if it would play even more fun.
I am all for adjusting the game play if it benefits the game, however, your idea doesn't. No matter how you twist it, a RPS system isn't good for game play in the Melee Arena, where the game is an open world sand box.
It's a win-win for everyone, HTC because he gets more players and players old and new alike, because they get to play a even better game.
It's not a win-win for everyone. A RPS system will not make AH a better game, it will turn it into a virtual ghost town.
Will it be different to what it is now? Somewhat, but the core of the game remains the same, you would play the same game you knew and loved for years but with a twist.
No, the core game play will not remain the same. It will promote even more timid flying as players flying tend to avoid combat more in order to preserve their perks and ride.
Even old players would re-subscribe to check out the new gameplay and maybe they would stay again, because the game now could hook them for a longer time.
You might get a handful but I doubt they'd stay for very long if forced to play under a RPS system. Remember that a lot of these old time players also played WB and remember how much the RPS messed up that game and left.
Gameplay change is a solution to draw in a new crowd and re-subscribe the old crowd, the only ones are in the hardest opposition currently I see are the old crowd who are currently subscribed...
Some of us have been playing these sort of games for 20+ years (I started in AW DOS back in '94) and have seen ideas like yours implemented in some sort of fashion and seen first hand how these changes have failed and in some cases led to large number of players leaving. Your idea isn't new or revolutionary and as evidence from other games, not likely to succeed as well.
The the old crowd who is subscribed - you loose nothing out of this, you only gain together with HTC
I see nothing but only positives that can come out of this.
No, you're wrong. The "old crowd" does have something to lose, as does HTC and that's watching more players leave because of a bad decision to change the game to a RPS system.
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Yes, changes to the game play do have a potential to bring in new players, it also has the potential of driving players away from the game as well.
True, that's why they have to be smart changes.
I am all for adjusting the game play if it benefits the game, however, your idea doesn't. No matter how you twist it, a RPS system isn't good for game play in the Melee Arena, where the game is an open world sand box.
This is just an idea of what can be done...... i'm all for changes for the better..... i'm not saying the RPS is a perfect solution, but i'm not seeing other ideas currently discussed, so I made one.
No, the core game play will not remain the same. It will promote even more timid flying as players flying tend to avoid combat more in order to preserve their perks and ride.
On one hand this is true, but on the other hand you would get offensive players that want to go for that kill no matter what, it all balances out and you would get a thrill of excitement knowing that something might go very right......or very wrong, a new type of factor would be introduced, you would have a sense of accomplishment returning to a field with kills with a purpose, or sense of dread loosing it all and then you would have to start and repeat it again.
This is what online games are about, re-starting and re-playing it again and again, that's how players are hooked for a long time, 1 in every 50 times if you would get that uber plane, you could be 'dominating' in the arena for a short period of time, but then every player would try to hunt you down, because you would be worth the most points in the game.
There could even be a live in-game top 10 aces list, with their planes and points, so people know who to hunt for or avoid.
This would really bring the 'Aces' into Aces High
Your idea isn't new or revolutionary and as evidence from other games, not likely to succeed as well.
I'm not saying it is though, but AH is currently in category of its own as there are no copycat games, and for example having RPS+perks as a combination was never done in any flight sim before, not saying -it is- the perfect solution, it's just one of possible solutions, but AH has a chance in the industry to be revolutionary once again.
I see the potential of what AH can become, and i'd like to see this potential become reality.
Steam now is a great time for those changes, it will potentialy decide the future of AH, as an member of the old joysticks you need to help HTC in that transition.
No, you're wrong. The "old crowd" does have something to lose, as does HTC and that's watching more players leave because of a bad decision to change the game to a RPS system.
That's why the change has to be a smart one, to move the game forward and not back, so the old crowd remains and new subscribes.
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Nugetx
not long ago you wrote this...
'Hello, I would like to get into this game but there are a few points which prevent me from doing so, Dear Developers, help me help you make some money...'
Steam etc...
What I would like to ask is how come you think you are so knowledgeable about this game if you only got 2weeks free and are waiting to play when it comes out on steam and you can use your paycard thing..
How much playing of Aces High have you actually done? whats your ingame name?
With all due respect
Jimmy
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What I would like to ask is how come you think you are so knowledgeable about this game if you only got 2weeks free and are waiting to play when it comes out on steam and you can use your paycard thing..
True i'm not knowledgeable a lot about this game, but there are things about a game, call it 'first impression' that you get instantly, and those are my impressions after playing the trial.
I acknowledge the game for what it is, but I also see the potential that there is but is not being used, that's where the ideas come from.
I will still play the game in current state when it is on Steam, it's just I know it can be even better.
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And there me Lord .. I rest my case..
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And there me Lord .. I rest my case..
I will post the ad that was posted in other thread
(http://s3.amazonaws.com/bwgcommunity/monthly_2017_06/large.AH_ad.png.0818527d4b52c3d03a5a33b37d25947e.png)
Now think about the current gameplay...... and compare it to the gameplay idea of what was posted in this thread and especialy my last post with having in-game top 10 aces list where you can see their top plane and points...
Which style of gameplay fits more to this ad ?
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Hell, even without AvA and realistic map, the RPS+perks would instantly make the game something more special.
It's like RPS+perks is a match made in heaven for the current 3 side OMA.
Can you be an ace in a day? Can you get that uber plane in 1 day and become the top ace on the list ? Can you hunt down the top player and get all his points ?
Aren't you getting excited yet ? I AM !
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Play the game for a year then you will ..maybe.. understand
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Play the game for a year then you will ..maybe.. understand
I have told my case, so now you tell me, what gameplay elements I will experience by that year that I haven't experienced by now
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Too many to list there are already so many variables to this game..the learning curve is steep.. every sortie is different
Lots to learn
Everyday is a schoolday
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Keep repeating 'Can you become the top ace get the uber plane and hunt down the top player in a day' while watching trailer that i made
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GllEW7qK8To
That JU88 is the highest rated bomber pilot on Arena and you've been chasing him for an hour, to finaly get him, cashing the fat points, now you have to RTB, but you are unsure you can make it safe.
Can you feel the energy? :rock
Can you feel the perked RPS? This is the energy you will get while playing AH :rock
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Would be amazing if the 'top aces' had a higher bounty on them than regular players. :D
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See Rule #2
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Would be amazing if the 'top aces' had a higher bounty on them than regular players. :D
hunting certain players is frowned upon and can even get you banned, ask skyrr and Sfox oh that's right you can't they are banned.
-1
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-1 This should be opt in only. It's happened to me and it's really not a fun type of game play.
Would be amazing if the 'top aces' had a higher bounty on them than regular players. :D
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See Rule #4
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-1 This should be opt in only. It's happened to me and it's really not a fun type of game play.
Opt-in only..... coupled with more ways to spend perks.....
It's at least an original idea.
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It's at least an original idea.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,380215.msg5063429.html#msg5063429 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,380215.msg5063429.html#msg5063429)
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:noid
But this time it's different and better. Really!
Wiley.
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:noid
But this time it's different and better. Really!
Wiley.
Looks different to me.
I applaud the effort.
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I have told my case, so now you tell me, what gameplay elements I will experience by that year that I haven't experienced by now
Just because you went to Disneyland for one day it doesn't mean you know everything there is to know about it
Some things you are proposing like getting rid of current perkiest and your RPS have shown to be so wrong.
Semp
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See Rules #4, #2
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Just because he is vocal about the changes he wants to be made to the game doesn't equate him with being a troll. Think some are reading far more into this.
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See Rule #5
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See Rule #5
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See Rule #5
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See Rule #5
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See Rule #5
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rules #2, #4
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nugetx-this sim or game or what ever it's supposed to be called, is fine the way it is-it's just we need more than 8 terrains and more people, we have a few new people coming in and some vets coming in but it's not enough. we need more people NOW, if we get more people like the old days, HiTech may have to open more arenas. this week is passing and in the AVA the Guadalcanal was running and no one was in it. we don't need changes like you suggested and are arguing to try get done we just need more people to start with.
I'm -1000 on a rolling plane set. when the new people see what planes that they can fly, at anytime even perkies they will like it.
and it doesn't take long to earn perks to fly perkies, except the 262's and the B-29's, I know V-man prolly won't agree with me but that's his right.
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #2
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #5
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rules #2, #4
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See Rule #4
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oops i pressed wrong button :P
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I explained why perks + rps would be better for the game.... but no one explained to me why it would not work.
I think because when people log into the game they want to fly:
The plane they want
The time of day they want
On the map they want
And they want to do their activity. fighting, or gv or bombing.
If any of these things are out of wack is seems to cause them to log. (I know some stick it out, but I'm talking about the folks who won't)
If you had limited time to play and it was a RPS AND you just wanted to fly some very specific plane, You'd be not flying most of the time. Because there is only one Melee arena.
If something is wrong with that arena, the option isn't to just switch arenas. There IS nothing else.
Well, there are other games...
RPS + Perks is based on denying some users what they want in favor of giving them something that is limited plus a reward that many don't care about.
I like seeing all of the ideas, even when I disagree with some of them or even most of them. There may be some really good ones just waiting to be floated. They may even be ones that I don't like. :cheers:
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RPS + Perks is based on denying some users what they want in favor of giving them something that is limited plus a reward that many don't care about.
There is another solution for this but i'm 100% it gonna get flaked, but i'll say it anyway.
Have the perks on microtransactions and make the game f2p..... this way player numbers would skyrocket for sure with game being free, and old timers instead of paying 15$ monthly, would pay to play their 'plane' by unlocking perks.
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There is another solution for this but i'm 100% it gonna get flaked, but i'll say it anyway.
Have the perks on microtransactions and make the game f2p..... this way player numbers would skyrocket for sure with game being free, and old timers instead of paying 15$ monthly, would pay to play their 'plane' by unlocking perks.
Might as well call it pay to win. -1 If you want perks, earn them.
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easier way is to have the full game ftp with all planes unlocked. then to make up for lost revenue then play an ad before each sorty, sell advertisement to Budweiser, cragganmore, cereal companies. kind of like youtube does it. and if you dont want to see ads then pay 15 bucks a month.
this way all players would be on an even field.
semp
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easier way is to have the full game ftp with all planes unlocked. then to make up for lost revenue then play an ad before each sorty, sell advertisement to Budweiser, cragganmore, cereal companies. kind of like youtube does it. and if you dont want to see ads then pay 15 bucks a month.
this way all players would be on an even field.
semp
Well, personaly 3rd party ads in a game are probably the worst thing that could happen.
btw going back to topic, It seems the current subscribers don't want any changes at all.
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btw going back to topic, It seems the current subscribers don't want any changes at all.
You're wrong. If you were to poll current subscribers, I'm sure that the majority would be in favor of changes to the game play if the changes were beneficial. Just because the majority do not like your idea does not mean they don't want change. We just think your idea is terrible for the game and we're not alone, HiTech also feels the same way.
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I'm sure that the majority would be in favor of changes to the game play if the changes were beneficial.
So where are those ideas discussed ? I don't see other threads that talk about beneficial game play changes. Either there are no ideas to enhance the gameplay or no one wants them.
The major argument against this proposition is that people could not fly the plane -they- want -instantly-.
And people talk about instant gratification young crowd...
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See Rule #4
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If you had limited time to play and it was a RPS AND you just wanted to fly some very specific plane, You'd be not flying most of the time.
And that is instant gratification my friend, the very thing which people claim to fight against here.
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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I'm playing the game for fun.... just wanted to say how the game can be even more fun with a few simple tweaks of what already is here in the game.
Having to wait days just to fly the plane you want is not the definition of fun.
Yes, you would NOT be able to play your plane -instantly-, you would had to make it count, but isn't it worth to have a better gameplay experience over all ?
You're restricting player's choices, definitely not good for game play. You're also promoting even more timid flying that already goes on, as people would avoid fights to preserve their plane. Again, not the definition of fun game play.
Aren't there more pro's to this over 1 negative that you would not had your plane instantly?
Your idea has no pro's.
It seems it's blown way out of proportion..... there are OTHER planes to have fun with, not only one or two.
Yes, there are other planes to fly if the player so chooses to. However, your idea does not give players a choice, you're limiting what they can fly.
There are over 50 planes in AH, so why would you want to use one only......
Because none of the other fights in the game give me the thrill than flying the P-38 does.
Honestly, what does it matter to you if someone chooses to fly only one plane? It does not affect your game play in the slightest, all you're trying to do is pretty much tell people what to fly and when to do it.
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Having to wait days just to fly the plane you want is not the definition of fun.
I'm sure HTC would find the perfect balance so it does not take too long, like every few sorties you could get a higher year plane or just hold the points untill you have your ride.
You're restricting player's choices, definitely not good for game play. You're also promoting even more timid flying that already goes on, as people would avoid fights to preserve their plane. Again, not the definition of fun game play.
I answered already to this very argument on previous pages......
Your idea has no pro's.
Said about them previously also......
Yes, there are other planes to fly if the player so chooses to. However, your idea does not give players a choice, you're limiting what they can fly.
Because this way everyone effectively flies all the planes, from early mid and late war, adding to the variety of gameplay.
Players can choose to fly different planes - but they don't and this is the reality of current gameplay.
Because none of the other fights in the game give me the thrill than flying the P-38 does.
Ok, make a special 'Ack Ack' P-38 that only he can use in the game :angel:
Honestly, what does it matter to you if someone chooses to fly only one plane? It does not affect your game play in the slightest,
It totaly affects the game play, because late war planes mainly are being used, and if there will be new players... everyone will instantly rush to get the most 'uber' plane..... instead of flying spit I , E4 , Hurr I etc.
There is this beautifull game made, with plenty of planes, and half the content or more is not being used at all, because everyone wants to fly the most 'uber' plane, to have a chance of competing.
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I'm sure HTC would find the perfect balance so it does not take too long, like every few sorties you could get a higher year plane or just hold the points untill you have your ride.
I answered already to this very argument on previous pages......
Said about them previously also......
Because this way everyone effectively flies all the planes, from early mid and late war, adding to the variety of gameplay.
Players can choose to fly different planes - but they don't and this is the reality of current gameplay.
Ok, make a special 'Ack Ack' P-38 that only he can use in the game :angel:
It totaly affects the game play, because late war planes mainly are being used, and if there will be new players... everyone will instantly rush to get the most 'uber' plane..... instead of flying spit I , E4 , Hurr I etc.
There is this beautifull game made, with plenty of planes, and half the content or more is not being used at all, because everyone wants to fly the most 'uber' plane, to have a chance of competing.
And forcing people to fly early war planes is going to make the game more fun? New players have a hard time getting their first kill in an uber plane. How long before they get one, and the perks for the better rides? Im guessing they will quit long before that happens. How is that "good for the game"?
Many other ideas have been bantered around on these boards and some have made it into the game. Some failed miserably like the line of base captures, others worked well like the arena reset from 2 LW arenas down to 1 when the numbers in Europe couldn't support the dual LW arenas.
Your idea would do what you said it would do as far as getting other to fly different planes, but it would chase away more players than it would make happy. That is the defining factor.
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ok nugetx, your beating a dead horse, you propose changes that will hurt the game, that's not going to happen. if HiTech thinks some of your ideas are feasible he probably think about it. but from what I see, and from what I see here from veteran players esp ones that have been here from day 1, I will follow them to hell and back. game wise that is lol. why are you so intent on a RPS? -1000 again by the way. people have certain planes that they like to fly, I try to fly planes that match the planes that the enemy are flying or attacking in. if a 190-d9 is attacking a base i'll either take up a pony d or a 109-f4-or a c-205- if I'm already up then I will attack him in whatever I'm in wether its a sbd-a6m or il-2 or what ever I'm in. sure you have some players that complain when eny kicks in and say 14.95 and I can't fly the plane I want, well they have a couple of things they can do fly a different plane, switch to a side that has no eny side switch is only for 6 hours, or log off, and I have never heard of anybody logging off because they could not fly their fav ride. the bish almost always have eny but you don't see them switching-they as I do roll with the flow...
you not going to convince ups to vote or flow or go your way, so just STOP IT.
-1000 to all Nugetx's ideas
by the way what is your in game name, because I never see anybody with the tag Nugetx in game. do you even play here, if you don't then you have no business telling us what changes HiTech needs to do, and if you do-then you need to find better ideas, because the ones you are suggesting STINK.
right now we can fly any planes we want-it doesn't take long to build perks, to fly perk planes-I personally have enough perks to fly a 262 anytime I want-but I don't because I don't like the duce-I have enough perks to fly sets of B-29's but I don't because I don't like the B-29's--I like the B24j's better. it's diversity of planes and the freedom of choice is one of the things I love about Aces High.
Wait THATS IT: nugetx is trying to infringe on our freedoms--in WWII one guy tried that and look what that got him-he ended up committing suicide.
and no nugetx I'm not telling you to commit suicide lol-JUST QUIT TRYING TO CONVINCE US TO GO WITH YOUR FLOW/IDEAS.
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So where are those ideas discussed ? I don't see other threads that talk about beneficial game play changes. Either there are no ideas to enhance the gameplay or no one wants them.
Right here. It's also where they're criticized. It's not only "don't want" it's also "bad idea and here's why".
The major argument against this proposition is that people could not fly the plane -they- want -instantly-.
And people talk about instant gratification young crowd...
When people talk about instant gratification in here, they're not talking about what they fly, but how the gameplay works. Instant gratification is the people who want to jump in a plane and be in combat within 1 minute.
Wiley.
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Players can choose to fly different planes - but they don't and this is the reality of current gameplay.
So they don't want to fly different planes but instead of giving them incentive to, your idea is to force them to.
This would end very badly.
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And forcing people to fly early war planes is going to make the game more fun?
yes, have you ever seen a game where you start at level 80 with everything unlocked (late war plane and all planes available) and not level 1 without anything (early war plane) ?
New players have a hard time getting their first kill in an uber plane.
Why worry so much about new players if there will be also aces from other flight sims that can whoop your 6 ?
How is that "good for the game"?
more planes used = more variety = unpredictable engagements = less boredom = players interest kept for longer
but it would chase away more players than it would make happy. That is the defining factor.
Maybe the current subscribers who are opposed to this idea, but this is why there are 30 players during euro time in the first place.
Instant gratification is the people who want to jump in a plane and be in combat within 1 minute.
So exactly like you jump into a plane in a base under attack? :rolleyes:
So they don't want to fly different planes but instead of giving them incentive to, your idea is to force them to.
This would end very badly.
This is an incentive, incentive to get a better plane, it's not forcing...... are you saying that every game where you start from the opening and not from the end is forcing you to play through the whole game? isn't this the whole point of playing a game? To experience it as a whole and not play only 'the end' ?
In every game you start with a fresh start....... you never start at level 80, starting with early war plane is equivalent to starting at level 1 as opposed to starting with a late war plane which can be considered 'end game'.
In other flight sims there is RPS which governs that, and you can't even use planes from different years.
There are good things in AH, but there are also things that in the long run make people go away or not try the product at all.
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Nugetx you haven't even played this game 1 total month...Yet you act like you've played for years and are bored and want something different...
Here's a suggestion...Want AvA matchups...Make a freaking free arena with the account you don't have and play freaking AvA if not you don't know what the hell you want and are posting because ur a troll
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yes, have you ever seen a game where you start at level 80 with everything unlocked (late war plane and all planes available) and not level 1 without anything (early war plane) ?
we are not playing world of warplanes or world of tanks. and yes we have seen many games with all planes unlocked. aw, wardbirds...
semp
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yes, have you ever seen a game where you start at level 80 with everything unlocked (late war plane and all planes available) and not level 1 without anything (early war plane) ?
Well as this game isn't "starting" now the new players are NOT going to start at level 80. They will start where we all did, at the bottom.
Why worry so much about new players if there will be also aces from other flight sims that can whoop your 6 ?
The only worry I have about new players is the lack of them. This game is different than other games and there will be very few that could come in here and start handing our butts to us.
more planes used = more variety = unpredictable engagements = less boredom = players interest kept for longer
Agreed, but FORCING new players into inferior planes to try and compete with skilled players will do nothing but raise the frustration levels of those players.
Maybe the current subscribers who are opposed to this idea, but this is why there are 30 players during euro time in the first place.
I highly doubt it, you dont play because you dont have a credit card. Im sure there are a lot more reason as to why we lost so many, economy, lack of advertising the list could be huge.
So exactly like you jump into a plane in a base under attack? :rolleyes:
Happens all the time, great way to find a fight. Do I expect the newbies to do it. Im sure many will, not that they will enjoy it, but its where the dar is, and so the fight.
This is an incentive, incentive to get a better plane, it's not forcing...... are you saying that every game where you start from the opening and not from the end is forcing you to play through the whole game? isn't this the whole point of playing a game? To experience it as a whole and not play only 'the end' ?
In every game you start with a fresh start....... you never start at level 80, starting with early war plane is equivalent to starting at level 1 as opposed to starting with a late war plane which can be considered 'end game'.
In other flight sims there is RPS which governs that, and you can't even use planes from different years.
There are good things in AH, but there are also things that in the long run make people go away or not try the product at all.
Sure you start "fresh" in all those games, but the rest of the player who have been there a while dont restart fresh when new guys show up. Why handycap the new players so hard? Wouldn't it make sense to make it as easy as possible for the new guys to get in and get around until they are hooked? Less frustrations, they stay longer.
Changing game play is fine, but chasing away new players would be stupid.
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A way to wipe out perks is to just raise the cost of planes, while also raising the rates at which you earn them.
T35-85 for 300 perks
also why not have factories on the map that if bombed out, lower the "year" of plane you can get.
if all 2 are up you get all planes
if 1 is down you only get upto midwar
if 2 are down you only get early
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yes, have you ever seen a game where you start at level 80 with everything unlocked (late war plane and all planes available) and not level 1 without anything (early war plane) ?
Yes. MMORPGs that have been around for a long time and had many expansions will offer a new player the opportunity so they don't have to waste their time griinding through old content to play the new content. WoW and Final Fantasy XIV are just two of the games that offer this, many others do as well.
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A way to wipe out perks is to just raise the cost of planes, while also raising the rates at which you earn them.
T35-85 for 300 perks
Will frustrate new players that have to grind perks to get enough to take out a tank. You're just adding a WT/WoT type of grind into the game and also would promote less fights as player will be less likely to risk his expensively perked tank to danger.
also why not have factories on the map that if bombed out, lower the "year" of plane you can get.
if all 2 are up you get all planes
if 1 is down you only get upto midwar
if 2 are down you only get early
In AW you had Spitfire factories. If you bombed the Spit factory to destruction you prevented one side from being able to use Spitfiire IX's for, IIRC, an hour. You'd be able to keep one side from using Spitfire IXs longer than an hour if you bombed their supply depot and shot down the supply goons, in some cases keeping one side from upping Spitfire IXs for hours. One time my squadron kept the Spitfire factory down for 5 hours, it was the last time we did that. The result was that the side we did it to (Az), most of the players logged because the Spitfire IX wasn't available to them.
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Nugetx you haven't even played this game 1 total month...Yet you act like you've played for years and are bored and want something different...
I inted to play it for long time once it's out on Steam..... the long time gameplay will be the same as in those 2 weeks I had. You don't have to play a game for a year to understand the concepts.
Well as this game isn't "starting" now the new players are NOT going to start at level 80. They will start where we all did, at the bottom.
and the circle repeats.......because they can take a late war plane... see where this is getting at.
This game is different than other games and there will be very few that could come in here and start handing our butts to us.
and if nothing will change, the situation will return to as it is now after time, because in the long run they will leave.
Currently this game does not cater to a ww2 flight simmer - because of fantasy maps, 3 sides and all planes fighting vs each other
Nor does it cater to a world of tanks, war thunder player - because it has no hook for them, is too realistic and what they consider 'old'.
This game is for a very narrow crowd, the ones subscribed...... and those that enjoy the type of gameplay in OMA, but as you can see there are not A LOT of those people, and the numbers have dwindled past the years..... simply saying people got bored and left.
Agreed, but FORCING new players into inferior planes to try and compete with skilled players will do nothing but raise the frustration levels of those players.
This is like this in every game, if you start world of tanks or war thunder now, you start at level 1 and have to face higher level players, and somewhow people there play.
Sure you start "fresh" in all those games, but the rest of the player who have been there a while dont restart fresh when new guys show up. Why handycap the new players so hard?
because if AH is a game, it's a good gaming system of having players enter the game and progress through it, that's why every game in the world makes you start at level 1, or have stuff which you unlock as you progress.
If AH is a ww2 sim, then all planes can be unlocked, but its needs to be realistic to draw in the ww2 simmer crowd.
Currently it's neither one of those, it lies in the middle of a game and a sim.
Changing game play is fine, but chasing away new players would be stupid.
It's the other way around, the current gameplay is chasing the players away, that's why there are so low numbers in the first place !
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we are not playing world of warplanes or world of tanks. and yes we have seen many games with all planes unlocked. aw, wardbirds...
semp
or world of warcraft for that matter.
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A way to wipe out perks is to just raise the cost of planes, while also raising the rates at which you earn them.
T35-85 for 300 perks
also why not have factories on the map that if bombed out, lower the "year" of plane you can get.
if all 2 are up you get all planes
if 1 is down you only get upto midwar
if 2 are down you only get early
don't you start randall172
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A way to wipe out perks is to just raise the cost of planes, while also raising the rates at which you earn them.
T35-85 for 300 perks
also why not have factories on the map that if bombed out, lower the "year" of plane you can get.
if all 2 are up you get all planes
if 1 is down you only get upto midwar
if 2 are down you only get early
this is still forcing people to fly certain planes at certain times.
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With correct gameplay changes i'm not saying the game will play better and have a bigger audience that will stay for a long time......... but it will.
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certainly not with your ideas--I can guarantee you HiTech will not use any of your ideas.
you need to quit trying to force the issue.
Hitech Creations has been here 18 years, probably longer than you were old enough to play on your computer.
yes he's having people number problems, that's why he's considering steam.
if he go's to steam and he needs to make changes he will, what he doesn't need is people like you trying to tell him what he needs to do. and by the way, if in case you haven't noticed euro time is different than American prime time, and you can't expect players in our time zone to stay up 24/7 to accommodate euro players--don't get me wrong I feel bad that when the euro players log on in their prime time that there is not many players on here when they log in, to see only 30 players playing, usually 1 country rolling undefended bases.
you really need to stop trying to convince us you ideas are better and will work because they aren't and they won't.
there are 10 pages here of you tripe and that is 10 pages too long. there are people here that have played this type of game/sim for 20 years, and I will trust their judgement long before I would ever ever trust yours. these people are my friends you and aaik are not. so beat it bub. either join us and play the game we love as is or don't. it's solely up to you.
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certainly not with your ideas--I can guarantee you HiTech will not use any of your ideas.
Great ! Old subscribers made plenty of other good ideas, i'm sure he will use one of them, as they have more knowledge than me about the game.
you really need to stop trying to convince us you ideas are better and will work because they aren't and they won't.
How are those my ideas? Perks are already in the game, RPS was created by Hitech,,,, it's everything that people know already, just combined together to create a different approach to the dynamism of the gameplay.
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don't you start randall172
ive got some radical ideas that have worked in other games
-(no more troops just capture points (only tanks can cap).
-more vehicle bases in proximity (no more teleporting and more of a visible front line).
-sortie limits on fields that can be exceeded with resupply
basically less of a reliance on planes, and more of a gv war with planes supporting.
less static targets, more CAS.
runners give up local superiority, bomb and bailers now have to look for targets.
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ive got some radical ideas that have worked in other games
-(no more troops just capture points (only tanks can cap).
-more vehicle bases in proximity (no more teleporting and more of a visible front line).
-sortie limits on fields that can be exceeded with resupply
basically less of a reliance on planes, and more of a gv war with planes supporting.
less static targets, more CAS.
runners give up local superiority, bomb and bailers now have to look for targets.
-1
No! Just No!
Less of a reliance on planes? NO!
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I'm not sure I understand why you want these changes.
Removing troops and only using tanks doesn't really change the game play other than to remove the necessity of cooperation from C-47/M3/... troop carrying vehicles. It takes a more or less realistic aspect of the game and turns it into a stand on this spot until the timer expires video game mechanic.
I can kind of understand wanting more density to vehicle bases (maybe not bases per se, but occupied territory), but I don't think the player numbers would support that. However, it would make for interesting front line battle of the bulge counter plays. If a supply line mechanic was built into this, then it might be interesting.
I'm opposed to sortie limits on fields without resupply unless a full resource management system is put in place. I would really like to see that to put more emphasis on interdiction missions. The closest we have to that now is strategic bombing of factories. It would be very cool to allow rail, bridge, and road lines to be cut to prevent resupply, causing an impact to what forces a military can use.
Less reliance on planes is a bad idea for a flight sim. CAS is more of a desire thing. Anyone can fly CAS missions today. I regularly load up a Mossy and go tank plinking, but it's not something everyone enjoys.
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owever, it would make for interesting front line battle of the bulge counter plays. If a supply line mechanic was built into this, then it might be interesting.
Man, you just sparked my imagination.... i'm not sure this forum is ready for this... lol
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RPS has been tried and died. See past evolutions in the AVA. Tying perks to RPS befuddles me. Especially when you are talking about wiping the perk slate clean for those who have earned them by playing the game. Still a -1 from this long term subscriber.
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NUGETX
Thank you very much for your interest in the game and you ideas.
Unfortunately at this time, I am in favor of absolutely nothing you have suggested so far. Sometimes an idea just does not work out. There are unintended consequences to everything and in my opinion your ideas will negatively affect gameplay.
I, for one, know what you are saying, I understand what your suggestions are but again, I do not agree with them. At this point I feel you are trying way to hard to sell us on your suggestions, you are having to defend them way to much. If they were are of more value, you wouldn't have to push them so hard.
In my opinion you should let this go at this point and move on.
Thank you
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RPS has been tried and died. See past evolutions in the AVA. Tying perks to RPS befuddles me. Especially when you are talking about wiping the perk slate clean for those who have earned them by playing the game. Still a -1 from this long term subscriber.
Yeah, I put that one up. I had Skuzzy delete everyone's perks in the AvA (there was quite the uproar over that one) and the idea was to set small perk amounts for more advanced variants of the aircraft.
The concept worked - but the amount of effort required outweighed the benefits. The arena's aren't setup to allow perk points reset and then adjusted by an admin. I do know that in the Early and Mid war arena's, they did offer some perk points for the more advanced rides.
For example, we had all 1939 variants of aircraft free, and then have growing # of perk point amounts for the later rides. I.e. Spit I is free, Spit MkII 2, Spit V 3, Spit IX 5 - I think though we only offed 3 years - like 1939-42.
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NUGETX
Thank you very much for your interest in the game and you ideas.
Unfortunately at this time, I am in favor of absolutely nothing you have suggested so far. Sometimes an idea just does not work out. There are unintended consequences to everything and in my opinion your ideas will negatively affect gameplay.
I, for one, know what you are saying, I understand what your suggestions are but again, I do not agree with them. At this point I feel you are trying way to hard to sell us on your suggestions, you are having to defend them way to much. If they were are of more value, you wouldn't have to push them so hard.
In my opinion you should let this go at this point and move on.
Thank you
I concur.
Nugetx: Please understand I have been creating online flight sims for 22 years. Feel free to post your ideas, but rest assured trying to CONVINCE me your idea is good because ..... (insert your reasons here), is a futile endeavor. If ideas are worth pursing I either do, or respond with detail questions.
See this thread as an example of ideas I liked and implemented.
A while ago a returning player gave a fairly harsh critique of AH3, saying among other things that the graphics or colors were visually assaulting. That stuck with me, and I believe one of the things he could have been referring to is the clipboard map:
(http://i.imgur.com/1NNsnL8.jpg)
For kicks, I made an attempt at reducing the clutter and busyness of the map above. I reduced the saturation and opacity of the land layer, changed the ocean color to be more consistent with a typical physical map, with coastal shallows depicted as a lighter shade of blue. I reduced the color saturation and size of all the map icons and removed the chess piece graphic because it has such a DOS-character set look to it and its redundant anyway; the color of the icon being an indication of the owning country. Radar coverage areas are shown shaded now rather that white circles. I chose a simple sans serif font for a cleaner look, and the labels are more tightly placed to the icons.
The map below shows all of the the same information displayed on the original above, it's the same scale and area shown. The reduction in icon and label font size think helped the readability a lot:
I guess my wish would be for a more map-like clipboard map, with a less cluttered look.
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Yeah, I put that one up. I had Skuzzy delete everyone's perks in the AvA (there was quite the uproar over that one) and the idea was to set small perk amounts for more advanced variants of the aircraft.
The concept worked - but the amount of effort required outweighed the benefits. The arena's aren't setup to allow perk points reset and then adjusted by an admin. I do know that in the Early and Mid war arena's, they did offer some perk points for the more advanced rides.
For example, we had all 1939 variants of aircraft free, and then have growing # of perk point amounts for the later rides. I.e. Spit I is free, Spit MkII 2, Spit V 3, Spit IX 5 - I think though we only offed 3 years - like 1939-42.
Fork I have nothing but mad respect for what the fellas in the AVA do, please do not take it as disrespect. This fella is gone beyond whooping a dead horse. He's beating the earth where the dead horse used to be.
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Fork I have nothing but mad respect for what the fellas in the AVA do, please do not take it as disrespect. This fella is gone beyond whooping a dead horse. He's beating the earth where the dead horse used to be.
:aok
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Feel free to post your ideas, but rest assured trying to CONVINCE me your idea is good because ..... (insert your reasons here), is a futile endeavor. If ideas are worth pursing I either do, or respond with detail questions
Dear Hitech Sir, these ideas are yours.... perks and RPS, I'm one of people who loved your creation - RPS, and is sad that it's not in Aces High, I believe that bringing RPS back would enhance Aces High and combining it with perks and expanding it which are currently for only a handfull of planes would make the game more fun to play.
The whole of this idea is yours, of what is currently in the game, and I believe it can be tweaked further to make it play even better.
I'm not trying to convince anyone..... was just trying to give my point of view on this as a player who played RPS before with taking in account what the current subscribed people are saying here.
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Dear Hitech Sir, these ideas are yours.... perks and RPS, I'm one of people who loved your creation - RPS, and is sad that it's not in Aces High, I believe that bringing RPS back would enhance Aces High and combining it with perks and expanding it which are currently for only a handfull of planes would make the game more fun to play.
The whole of this idea is yours, of what is currently in the game, and I believe it can be tweaked further to make it play even better.
I'm not trying to convince anyone..... was just trying to give my point of view on this as a player who played RPS before with taking in account what the current subscribed people are saying here.
:rofl :rofl :rofl I call BS, you ARE trying to convince EVERYONE, and I am one you have FAILED to convince. :neener:
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Dear Hitech Sir, these ideas are yours.... perks and RPS, I'm one of people who loved your creation - RPS, and is sad that it's not in Aces High, I believe that bringing RPS back would enhance Aces High and combining it with perks and expanding it which are currently for only a handfull of planes would make the game more fun to play.
The whole of this idea is yours, of what is currently in the game, and I believe it can be tweaked further to make it play even better.
I'm not trying to convince anyone..... was just trying to give my point of view on this as a player who played RPS before with taking in account what the current subscribed people are saying here.
Again, ask yourself why didn't HiTech add a RPS system in AH when he did it for WB?
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Again, ask yourself why didn't HiTech add a RPS system in AH when he did it for WB?
Violation of rule 15.
Rule 15, you are not allowed to use logic in a discussion on the BBS
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Again, ask yourself why didn't HiTech add a RPS system in AH when he did it for WB?
Maybe it was a legal thing?
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I don't think it's a legal thing.
I think it's a THIS DANG R.P.S. thing that won't and don't work, HiTech saw that it didn't work in Warbirds and knew it wouldn't in Aces High. if one day I logged in and found I and everyone else had to fly the same plane for 2-3 weeks or a month I'd would just log back off and go find something else to play..
if you go to home page-scores and stats and search my name you will see the may planes I fly, planes I can fly at any time I want unless eny stops me so then I just pick another plane, as many others do.
and again you have made another post where you are beating a dead horse with a broken stick. GIVE IT UP.
if if HiTech does go with Steam- HiTech will make changes if he needs to, I can guarantee their won't be a RPS in this game unless u make one in the AVA or some other arena but their probably won't be any other players there.
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I think it's a THIS DANG R.P.S. thing that won't and don't work
What about just having perks on planes ?
I mean it is currently on planes like 262 , 163, tempest....... why not make it on more planes ? So the early war planes are used more ?
The early war planes would have biggest ENY and cost little.... the late war planes would have low ENY and cost more
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Maybe it was a legal thing?
It wasn't a legal thing, it was bad for business.
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What about just having perks on planes ?
I mean it is currently on planes like 262 , 163, tempest....... why not make it on more planes ? So the early war planes are used more ?
The early war planes would have biggest ENY and cost little.... the late war planes would have low ENY and cost more
Planes and ground vehicles are assigned a perk cost if the planes/vehicles cause an unbalance in the game play if they were left unperked. The C-Hog was an example of this.
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Nugetx,
For the sake of everyone, why don't you post the full itemized list of your what if's that you still have left to go since it appears that list is what you will keep using to maintain a reason to keep this post alive. Then everyone including Hitech can get this over with. At the same time the answers would give you an education about this game that took some of us 15-17 years to learn unless you don't care about that aspect of this game. And by the end of the responses to your list, you might understand how the game works to keep us playing it for almost 2 decades, or forum members will move on to something else and ignore your posts.
Hitech has "politely" addressed you and your initiative with direct language which is more than many of us ever get in the Wish List, still, any forum has a point of diminishing returns unless dancing on the bleeding edge of the fire is your goal.
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RPS rocked. I miss it.
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RPS rocked. I miss it.
go play it in the game that has it.
semp
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go play it in the game that has it.
semp
No.
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No.
then it must not be that important.
semp
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then it must not be that important.
semp
You would know.
Then again, I never asked your opinion on what I should or should not do in this game or any other.
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Nugget you honestly are everything this community needs.Please don't let them discourage you.I love your enthusiasm and fresh take on things because these old timers are afraid of change and because of it their beloved and our favorite flight sim will die.Keep it up man these ideas are great and start up well needed discussions <S>
Cheers
-giantz
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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I actually like the ideas that nugetx puts forward. Not that i agree with allot of them but i like the discussion. There is also to much hate on him..
Now back to the subject at hand. I do not feel allot for a RPS but i actually would like to see more perked planes like the pony, lets say 2-3 perks. The 5 planes that do use perks never really made allot of sense to me. Remove all my 40k perks, ill donated them to the haters :cheers:
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I would like to add to that, that the idea about the pilot career (one of his earlier post) really appealed to me.
Especially the KOTH and FSO awards :x
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Nuget, why not test your ideas out? You can create and run your own arena for free. Set it up anyway you like. You can advertise it in the "General" forum, or get any of your friends to join in.
Just a thought.
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Nuget, why not test your ideas out? You can create and run your own arena for free. Set it up anyway you like. You can advertise it in the "General" forum, or get any of your friends to join in.
Just a thought.
People go where there is critical mass. That's the OMA right now. Nothing will dislodge that short of closing it.
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I would like to add to that, that the idea about the pilot career (one of his earlier post) really appealed to me.
Especially the KOTH and FSO awards :x
*Cough* *Cough*
(http://s3.amazonaws.com/bwgcommunity/monthly_2017_06/large.Careers_delta.png.2d05db4f7d9d7f98fbc8c60ab3084d96.png)
(http://s3.amazonaws.com/bwgcommunity/monthly_2017_06/large.Careers_delta_stats.png.f42cf42cde0bed190e05af690341bf29.png)
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People,go,where there is critical mass. That's the OMA right now. Nothing will dislodge that short of closing it.
If people want what he wants, they will go where they can get it, unless they are all about trying to force others to play the game the way they think it should be played.
You know how many people it takes to have a dog fight? Two.
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If people want what he wants, they will go where they can get it, unless they are all about trying to force others to play the game the way they think it should be played.
You know how many people it takes to have a dog fight? Two.
:aok
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If people want what he wants, they will go where they can get it, unless they are all about trying to force others to play the game the way they think it should be played.
You know how many people it takes to have a dog fight? Two.
People want targets. Those are only found in Melee.
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People want targets. Those are only found in Melee.
Again, a dog fight takes two people. Some of the best fights I have been part of and witnessed happen to have involved two players. If you do not want to play in nugets arena, then don't. Seems simple enough.
Just because you will not want to play in it, does not mean others will not want to.
Gives me an idea. We should drop showing arena numbers and see what happens. :) People should be logging into the arena which offers the game play they want, instead of trying to force everyone else to play the game the way they think it should be played.
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Gives me an idea. We should drop showing arena numbers and see what happens.
Now there's an original idea for curing RPS issues!
+ 1
- oldman
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Now there's an original idea for curing RPS issues!
+ 1
- oldman
+1
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Again, a dog fight takes two people. Some of the best fights I have been part of and witnessed happen to have involved two players. If you do not want to play in nugets arena, then don't. Seems simple enough.
Just because you will not want to play in it, does not mean others will not want to.
Gives me an idea. We should drop showing arena numbers and see what happens. :) People should be logging into the arena which offers the game play they want, instead of trying to force everyone else to play the game the way they think it should be played.
Empty arenas are boring and unproductive.
I have an idea. Make an Open Melee with RPS and run it on the server. That coupled with hiding numbers would be interesting.
Player-based arenas cannot be relied upon.
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I have an idea. Make an Open Melee with RPS and run it on the server. That coupled with hiding numbers would be interesting.
You'll have an empty arena.
Skuzzy has the right idea, create a custom arena with the game play you desire. When the H2H arenas were first available many years ago, they were quite populated and varied in game play but you weren't around here then.
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Sooo, you want us to convert the Melee to an arena which will force everyone to play the game the way you want to? It certainly would be easier than creating your own arena and working to fill it.
Who was talking about empty arenas? All it takes is two and by any measure, that it not an empty arena.
Player based arenas can be relied upon. They are just as viable as any arena.
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Sooo, you want us to convert the Melee to an arena which will force everyone to play the game the way you want to? It certainly would be easier than creating your own arena and working to fill it.
Who was talking about empty arenas? All it takes is two and by any measure, that it not an empty arena.
Player based arenas can be relied upon. They are just as viable as any arena.
To be fair, it's not exactly an apples to apples comparison if the arena's capped at 16v16 or whatever it is. At least that'll be the first dodge comment. My opinion is whatever nuget's proposing this week or the no icon guys wouldn't hit that cap, but they'll claim it's a limiting factor.
I'd be curious to see what people could do with custom arenas if there were no cap to the numbers. The guys who claim there's just oodles and oodles of people dying to play this game without icons or whatever settings they believe kills the arena could have their way and prove us all wrong.
It could be an interesting test bed for new ideas. Edit: Actually, it just occurred to me. Can a custom arena be set up to earn perks for it?
Wiley.
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The cap means nothing if you are not hitting it.
If the user who created the arena has enable perk points, then yes, they apply, but they are kept apart from the subscription game arenas.
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The cap means nothing if you are not hitting it.
I agree, but on the other hand if people know it'll only ever be 16v16, they're more inclined to dismiss it out of hand because they're after bigger fights or the ability to impact more people with their high alt bomber or stealth play.
Wiley.
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I agree, but on the other hand if people know it'll only ever be 16v16, they're more inclined to dismiss it out of hand because they're after bigger fights or the ability to impact more people with their high alt bomber or stealth play.
Wiley.
If you want to do those things, then the Melee arena is where you want to be. If you want an RPS, then make an arena and set it up. If you want quick start fights, then Melee ain't it. If you want to play where bases cannot be captured, then you do not want to play in the Melee arena.
In other words, if you have a specific thing you want to do and it is not being served in the Melee arena, for you, then make it happen.
We really need players to stop focusing on going where the numbers are and, instead, go where they will get the kind of game play they want. Those custom arenas can be pretty powerful, but it is up to the players to make them and feed them.
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If you want to do those things, then the Melee arena is where you want to be. If you want an RPS, then make an arena and set it up. If you want quick start fights, then Melee ain't it. If you want to play where bases cannot be captured, then you do not want to play in the Melee arena.
In other words, if you have a specific thing you want to do and it is not being served in the Melee arena, for you, then make it happen.
For the most part, I'm devil's advocating, but say for example I wanted to make an arena that works the same as the Melee except it's got no enemy icons. I think you'd agree 32 players split between 3 countries is not going to go anywhere or provide anything close to what the Melee would be if it were no icons.
Scale is vitally important for that kind of arena to work. The same with whatever nuget's on about.
Wiley.
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For the most part, I'm devil's advocating, but say for example I wanted to make an arena that works the same as the Melee except it's got no enemy icons. I think you'd agree 32 players split between 3 countries is not going to go anywhere or provide anything close to what the Melee would be if it were no icons.
Scale is vitally important for that kind of arena to work. The same with whatever nuget's on about.
Wiley.
That would depend on the terrain. You can have 32 square mile terrain and it can feel as crowded as a 512 square mile terrain with 250 players in it. One person per two square miles.
But then again, you can set it up where it is two sided as well. All you have to do is disable flight for one of the countries and design the terrain giving that one country 1 map room. Set the parameters correctly and it will work.
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That would depend on the terrain. You can have 32 square mile terrain and it can feel as crowded as a 512 square mile terrain with 250 players in it. One person per two square miles.
But then again, you can set it up where it is two sided as well. All you have to do is disable flight for one of the countries and design the terrain giving that one country 1 map room. Set the parameters correctly and it will work.
But it still doesn't provide the same gameplay options a larger arena does. In peoples' minds, it is not the same as having a big open arena available for unlimited players to come into.
Wiley.
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No offense, Wiley, but you can't read peoples' minds, so possibly you mean in your mind? "To you" that's the case. The TA has all the action in one area. The melee arena has most of the action centered in just a few sectors. The empty spaces in big maps only serve to make it seem less populated, sometimes. It's all very fluid and depends on many factors.
For anybody wishing to test the waters with 2-sided teams in custom arenas, look at the maps the AvA arena uses -- they often use custom maps with 1 side disabled or minimized for setup purposes, and it might save you the trouble of creating your own terrain map.
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But it still doesn't provide the same gameplay options a larger arena does. In peoples' minds, it is not the same as having a big open arena available for unlimited players to come into.
Wiley.
And again, it is not about trying to establish another Melee arena. It is about catering to other types of game play which players may want.
The problem arises when those players who do not really like the Melee arena game play try to make everyone else play their game, instead of them opening up their own arena to satisfy that different game play.
As long as you insist on looking at it purely from a numbers perspective then discord in the Melee arena will be the result. Too many people want everyone to play the way they want to play and that is not conducive to a healthy game environment.
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See Rule #4
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Sooo, you want us to convert the Melee to an arena which will force everyone to play the game the way you want to? It certainly would be easier than creating your own arena and working to fill it.
Who was talking about empty arenas? All it takes is two and by any measure, that it not an empty arena.
Player based arenas can be relied upon. They are just as viable as any arena.
Never said that.
And no they're not. When the player logs the arena is gone.
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You'll have an empty arena.
Skuzzy has the right idea, create a custom arena with the game play you desire. When the H2H arenas were first available many years ago, they were quite populated and varied in game play but you weren't around here then.
Yes, I was.
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What is the life span of a custom player created arena? Someone creates a great arena and when they log what happens? The Melee is far from perfect but it is always there.
For that matter, where are the scores kept for custom arenas? What history is stord or can be stored? Achievements?
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See Rule #4
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Never said that.
And no they're not. When the player logs the arena is gone.
It stays up for X amount of time, depending on an arena setting, after it is completely empty, unless someone joins it. It does not go down as long as there is a player in it (any player).
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What is the life span of a custom player created arena? Someone creates a great arena and when they log what happens? The Melee is far from perfect but it is always there.
And even there with numbers three times what a player created arena can support it's becoming increasingly difficult to find a good fight.
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It stays up for X amount of time, depending on an arena setting, after it is completely empty, unless someone joins it. It does not go down as long as there is a player in it (any player).
Is that set by the player or is it a default on your side?
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The melee provides far more than a custom arena ever could, it's a great concept , but custom arenas only scratches some of the things you get from a company sponsored arena .
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And even there with numbers three times what a player created arena can support it's becoming increasingly difficult to find a good fight.
Which goes to show numbers are not always indicative of being able to find a good fight (it also depends on what the term "good fight" means to any given player).
I never have a hard time finding a good fight. I do not wait for it to come to me. If I see someone I want to fight, I ask them to meet me. It is pretty easy to find a fight.
The melee provides far more than a custom arena ever could, it's a great concept , but custom arenas only scratches some of the things you get from a company sponsored arena .
I am going to make this bold and big because I have said it a few times already and it does not appear to be sinking in.
And again, we are not talking about recreating the Melee arena!
If the Melee arena provides what you want, without you trying to force others to play your game, then you have found the arena you want to play in. We are talking about those who want something different than the Melee arena!
Is that set by the player or is it a default on your side?
It the the disconnect timeout setting. I am not sure if that setting is a God only (read HTC employee only) setting though.
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And again, it is not about trying to establish another Melee arena. It is about catering to other types of game play which players may want.
I really, really hate belaboring the point, but if the gameplay these players want is the same as the Melee, with whatever their pet settings are, that option is not available to them.
Wiley.
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I really, really hate belaboring the point, but if the gameplay these players want is the same as the Melee, with whatever their pet settings are, that option is not available to them.
Wiley.
I have no idea why you are belaboring it either. Your point is moot. If you want to play in the Melee arena, then play there, as long as you are not trying to convert everyone to some other style/type of game play.
The custom arenas are not meant to replace any arena. They are there (mostly) for players who want specific things not available in the other arenas.
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I have no idea why you are belaboring it either. Your point is moot. If you want to play in the Melee arena, then play there, as long as you are not trying to convert everyone to some other style/type of game play.
The custom arenas are not meant to replace any arena. They are there (mostly) for players who want specific things not available in the other arenas.
His point is we can't duplicate the Melee settings so it's back to apples and oranges.
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Exactly.
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I have no idea why you are belaboring it either. Your point is moot. If you want to play in the Melee arena, then play there, as long as you are not trying to convert everyone to some other style/type of game play.
The custom arenas are not meant to replace any arena. They are there (mostly) for players who want specific things not available in the other arenas.
If it's a moot point, why isn't the entire game revolving around 32 player arenas? Because there is a difference.
If you're looking for gameplay that is like the Melee but with your own settings, you cannot do it in any meaningful capacity.
His point is we can't duplicate the Melee settings so it's back to apples and oranges.
Yes. This.
Wiley.
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I made the suggestion to nugets to start a custom arena with the settings he wants, which is nothing like the Melee arena.
I have no idea why you guys are not letting this go. It has NOTHING TO DO WITH THE EXISTING ARENAS!!!
I'll say it one more time, only differently.
If you want to play in an arena already configured the way you want, then there is no need to start or play in a custom arena.
What is it about that, which cannot be comprehended? You cannot setup and configure a custom arena exactly like the Melee arena. You cannot do it. It cannot be done. IT IS ALSO NOT WHAT IS TRYING TO BE DISCUSSED HERE!
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Okay... Put another way as well, a lot of peoples' ideas (like some of nuget's) pretty much need scale to work. Without it, they don't get a fair chance IMO. That's not available with the custom arenas.
Wiley.
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His idea does not really need a bunch of players. It is all about the configuration.
For example. We discovered very early on, that the WW1 arena works best with about 10 to 15 players in it. There is no reason why a custom arena cannot be just as much fun with 16 players in it.
But to be more direct. You are not talking about the Melee arena, you are talking about the specific cap size of the arenas. Yes, some things need a large scale arena. Special events, for example, but a number of things work well in a small arena.
The 16 player limit is a good number for custom arenas and would work for what nuget wants to do.
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Okay... Put another way as well, a lot of peoples' ideas (like some of nuget's) pretty much need scale to work. Without it, they don't get a fair chance IMO. That's not available with the custom arenas.
Wiley.
Maybe he can talk with some of the AvA staff about setting up the arena for a week and see how it works out.
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Maybe he can talk with some of the AvA staff about setting up the arena for a week and see how it works out.
Yes, but nuget cannot play as he does not have a subscription, which is fine. I am just offering an alternative if he wants to go for it.
HiTech told me if he can keep the arena bumping 16 players for a week, he will raise the cap to 32.
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Yes, but nuget cannot play as he does not have a subscription, which is fine. I am just offering an alternative if he wants to go for it.
HiTech told me if he can keep the arena bumping 16 players for a week, he will raise the cap to 32.
That was the catch 22. :D
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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But what you want IS possible. Build yourself a smg8 map, load it up, call it the Furball arena and have at it.
And to top it off:
HiTech told me if he can keep the arena bumping 16 players for a week, he will raise the cap to 32.
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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There is more than enough controls available to setup the arena and to be able to run it with a RPS system, as well as 2 sides.
That's only part of the picture.
I don't really care, in any event. I'm just keeping the record straight.
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That's only part of the picture.
I don't really care, in any event. I'm just keeping the record straight.
V quit arguing and try it. Sometimes I think you would rather argue than fight. :rofl Remember if you don't try, you don't know. :neener:
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V quit arguing and try it. Sometimes I think you would rather argue than fight. :rofl Remember if you don't try, you don't know. :neener:
Honestly, it's not worth the hassle right now.
If numbers increase and we wind up with more control over our arenas I might try it on a lark...but truly, I don't have the motivation to bother at present. The OMA is king and nothing will change that unless it is closed down--which ain't happening.
:cheers: :salute
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Those custom arenas can be pretty powerful, but it is up to the players to make them and feed them.
This is interesting, i'll go and check it out.
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Skuzzy but how do I set up everything? lol. I have no idea how to do that, can you give me a step by step run down?
I can create the arena, but I have no idea how to configure everything, the planes, the sides etc
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Nuget, post the question in the "Help and Training" forum.
In the meantime, you can review arena settings offline (Options->Arena Setup->Environment->Arena Settings). You will also find the field configuration settings there (Options->Arena Setup->Fields).
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In the meantime, you can review arena settings offline (Options->Arena Setup->Environment->Arena Settings). You will also find the field configuration settings there (Options->Arena Setup->Fields).
Oh it's all very techy, and i'm not a very techy person :P
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I like your enthusiasm...but
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You pay...you have everything...if you suck but you pay...you have everything...
That's me, and I don't mind it. :aok