Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: BaronVonDeath on November 04, 2018, 08:57:06 AM
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The T34-85 is WAYYYYY over modeled and needs a perk upgrade!! It's like when the c hog ruled the sky, the T34-85 only costs 1 perk most of the time!!!! WTF.
It's WAYYYY to powerful and damage resistant. Every one drives them and "most" of the time, you can't kill it with one shot, unless I'm in it, I die with 1 shot hits 95% of the time. The T34-85 should be at minimum equal to or more then the Jagpanther. It should start at 25 perks a least.
HTC please review the K/D data and rework the over modeled T34-85. Thanks my rant is over. :)
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I do not see it as overmodeled.
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It is the spitfire of tanks. It is easy to use but it is not got the sights or armor of the perk vehicles. I vote status quo.
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I want to point out that there were no changes to the T-34 and all other tanks in recent times. The current dominance is simply a result of the new terrains of AH3 and the resulting different battlefield & tactics.
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Yet its perked about the same as a m4/76...
It should probably have a slightly higher perk. Fast with good armor and one of the best guns at short range in the game. Theres a reason it leads the kill tables every tour.
Last tour it had 11k+ kills. All other tanks combined for 7.5k or so. The plane imbalance isn't event close to that.
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The T34-85 is WAYYYYY over modeled and needs a perk upgrade!! It's like when the c hog ruled the sky, the T34-85 only costs 1 perk most of the time!!!! WTF.
It's WAYYYY to powerful and damage resistant. Every one drives them and "most" of the time, you can't kill it with one shot, unless I'm in it, I die with 1 shot hits 95% of the time. The T34-85 should be at minimum equal to or more then the Jagpanther. It should start at 25 perks a least.
HTC please review the K/D data and rework the over modeled T34-85. Thanks my rant is over. :)
What exactly is overmodeled?
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What exactly is overmodeled?
It has thicker paint.
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The reason we see so many is the T34/85 is still the fastest "real tank" in aces high other than the lighter t34/76.
The spawn campers like using the speed to get the green "end sortie" light even while being pursued by anything other than the M3, M8, or M18s that carry ap ammo.
But they still get stuck while traversing a relatively shallow slope that other tanks can make with ease.
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It has thicker paint.
Yer killin me Shuffler! :rofl
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I don't know why it is that good in AH, it only have 45 mm of armor in it's chassi.
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well mine always seem paper thin
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+1
It should be at least perked like firefly
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Yeah the t34 85 is superior to the firefly in 90% of situations..
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Yeah the t34 85 is superior to the firefly in 90% of situations..
Exactly
Drop the perk down on the Firefly and up it on the 34/85 :aok :aok
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Yeah the t34 85 is superior to the firefly in 90% of situations 10% of the time :rofl
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jusr one shotted one at 2.8.. i spent three rounds ranging it. hit it in the side, poof dead of course i was using the 85 as well if that counts lol
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Thread resurrection!
There are certain things that can't be modeled in AH that were attributes of a tank in WW2 (radio, doctrine, crew fatigue/comfort/ergonomics, maintenance issues, etc).
There are certain things that CAN be modeled in AH there were attributes if a tank in WW2 but are not (optic quality/clarity, recoil reset, range, tiered damaged [all or none], etc).
No tank in AH benefits from this better than both models of the T34. The easiest to fix would be optics, the optical clarity on both T34's is far too good. Even the Soviets admitted their optical quality was lacking. In AH there is zero difference. None. A T34 can find an enemy tank just as easy as a German tank and that is a travesty. I've been playing AH since Jan of 2008 and if there is one thing that I can't figure out is HTC's unwillingness to adjust this (modeling optical clarity).
Secondly, since certain Achilles Heel traits of the T34 can't be/will not be modeled, then for the Love of God PLEASE consider increasing the T34/85 perk cost to 10-12. It is on par with the Tiger and Panther tank and far exceeds the M4A3 Sherman (76mm), Firefly, and the Jagdpanzer IV which are perked as "contemporaries".
Just step back and look at the figures. Look at what the T34/85 can do vs its "contemporaries". Better armor, better speed, better HE, equal or greater AP (don't forget the overly abundant HVAP round!), reload rate is very similar, did I mention the armor (the armor is on par with the Tiger and Panther)?
Please consider increasing the perk cost of the T34/85.
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It would also be fun to model the reliability of of each vehicle. I can already here the tigers calling for veh sups!
Or maybe model gun jams and malfunctions? I read somewhere that the outboard guns on the 190s jammed more then not if they were shot under g load.
Or maybe the accuracy of the Wirble goes to crap after you melt the barrels?
I'm so full of ideas today! :bolt:
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No tank in AH benefits from this better than both models of the T34. The easiest to fix would be optics, the optical clarity on both T34's is far too good. Even the Soviets admitted their optical quality was lacking. In AH there is zero difference. None. A T34 can find an enemy tank just as easy as a German tank and that is a travesty. I've been playing AH since Jan of 2008 and if there is one thing that I can't figure out is HTC's unwillingness to adjust this (modeling optical clarity).
That is not correct, I use the T34/85 and the Panzer, the Panzer optics, in game, are noticeable better than the T34/85, end of discussion. :headscratch:
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That is not correct, I use the T34/85 and the Panzer, the Panzer optics, in game, are noticeable better than the T34/85, end of discussion. :headscratch:
For comparison:
(Files had been uploaded uncompressed and had been converted to lossless png)
(https://i.imgur.com/67FRsjx.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/xkNgpcW.png)
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For comparison:
(Files had been uploaded uncompressed and had been converted to lossless png)
(https://i.imgur.com/67FRsjx.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/xkNgpcW.png)
For a fair comparison, try again at 1.5k, 2.0k, 2.5k, & 3.0k+. There is a noticeable difference. Or maybe there isn't. . . . .
What does Kenai know? He is only one of the more experienced players. I am sure he has some devious underlying reason for telling the truth and trying to correct misinformation.
Ok. . . . gotta go, somewhere there is a carcass of a horse that needs a good pummeling.
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For a fair comparison, try again at 1.5k, 2.0k, 2.5k, & 3.0k+. There is a noticeable difference. Or maybe there isn't. . . . .
What does Kenai know? He is only one of the more experienced players. I am sure he has some devious underlying reason for telling the truth and trying to correct misinformation.
Ok. . . . gotta go, somewhere there is a carcass of a horse that needs a good pummeling.
Please sign me up for your first Tank Clinic.
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For a fair comparison, try again at 1.5k, 2.0k, 2.5k, & 3.0k+.
Unlike AH3, very little combat happens at such ranges in AH III any more. Most combat is rather 'close', at least compared to AHII.
That's why the T-34/85 is doing so much better in AHII than the Tiger I (which has 10 times(!) the perk cost) - long range performance hardly matters any more.
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The majority of my kills are from 1400 yds. or less, but I do long range shots also, actually enjoy them more. :x
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Best to use a 1000lber for those pesky t34s.
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For a fair comparison, try again at 1.5k, 2.0k, 2.5k, & 3.0k+. There is a noticeable difference. Or maybe there isn't. . . . .
What does Kenai know? He is only one of the more experienced players. I am sure he has some devious underlying reason for telling the truth and trying to correct misinformation.
Ok. . . . gotta go, somewhere there is a carcass of a horse that needs a good pummeling.
No noticeable difference in optics. The T34/85 has a haze, or a film, pr whatever you want to call it that the Panzer IV does not have. Obviously that isn't an issue and doesn't equate to any measurable handicap for the Soviets. The Soviet optics do NOT suffer any penalty that a noteworthy inferior optic would possess. None. End of story. I'm not sure why Kenai is holding on to that fallacy either for it isn't "truth" he is telling. The comparison Lusche provided above makes it clear as glass (pun intended).
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No noticeable difference in optics. The T34/85 has a haze, or a film, pr whatever you want to call it that the Panzer IV does not have. Obviously that isn't an issue and doesn't equate to any measurable handicap for the Soviets. The Soviet optics do NOT suffer any penalty that a noteworthy inferior optic would possess. None. End of story. I'm not sure why Kenai is holding on to that fallacy either for it isn't "truth" he is telling. The comparison Lusche provided above makes it clear as glass (pun intended).
And you don't think that degrades the optics?? Where are you from?? Short range, it has little impact, agreed. Long range it has a significant impact, and that is during the day time. At night it impacts your ability to "see" significantly at any range. It is nice to note you do see the difference, albeit you don't "see" the impact. ;)
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No noticeable difference in optics. The T34/85 has a haze, or a film, pr whatever you want to call it that the Panzer IV does not have. Obviously that isn't an issue and doesn't equate to any measurable handicap for the Soviets. The Soviet optics do NOT suffer any penalty that a noteworthy inferior optic would possess. None. End of story. I'm not sure why Kenai is holding on to that fallacy either for it isn't "truth" he is telling. The comparison Lusche provided above makes it clear as glass (pun intended).
It would appear your definition of “ Noticeable” and my definition of “Noticeable is noticeably different….lol I didn’t say anything about a handicap. I did however agree w/ Kenai that your statement was/ is not correct.
I am having difficulty understanding the emphasis on the T34. Will it make others feel better getting shot with another model of tank?
Just because the numbers show it’s the preferred tank, what is it about the T34 that bothers those concerned? You emphasize what it can do. Does the T34 have any shortcomings? Just asking for those that use it.
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I am having difficulty understanding the emphasis on the T34. Will it make others feel better getting shot with another model of tank?
The T-34/85 is totally dominating the arena. It is priced way too low for its superior all-round performance. It's not only being used a lot, but is also killing much more efficiently at the same time. For example, despite much higher usage, especially on the offense, it has a better K/D than the Tiger I which costs 10 times(!) as much.
I have posted all relevant data in the General Discussion forum.
All I would be asking for is a perk point adjustment, so it's more in line with Tiger I or Panther. After all, that's what the perking system was made for.
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And you don't think that degrades the optics?? Where are you from?? Short range, it has little impact, agreed. Long range it has a significant impact, and that is during the day time. At night it impacts your ability to "see" significantly at any range. It is nice to note you do see the difference, albeit you don't "see" the impact. ;)
The difference in optical quality between the T34 and the Panzer IV are negligible, we can see the example. If Lusche would not have posted a side by side most would have never have known it. My tests from way back in 2011-2013 when I compiled all the hard data for the gv's allowed me to denote such in my notes, and on my spreadsheet, but conclude there was not enough of a difference to hinder performance at all so much so that I almost left it off the final version. The target is still seen the same at 600 and 2000 yards out albeit a "haze" in the T34 optics. HTC could turn that dial a bit more and like Lusche mentions the T34/85 is far under priced for the value it brings (firepower, armor, speed, ammo load). In AH the T34/85 is superior to the Tiger in almost every way, the two obvious differences are the Tiger's very slow turret traverse and slower travel speed.
My goal, like other players, is to get that T34/85 perked to where it needs to be (I say 10). Its contemporaries (Firefly, M4A3 Sherman 76mm, M18, Jagdpanther IV) lag far behind it for a plethora of reasons.
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All I would be asking for is a perk point adjustment, so it's more in line with Tiger I or Panther. After all, that's what the perking system was made for.
So, from an interested, but uninvolved, bystander: If the T-34/85 were perked roughly equal to the Panther (duplicating history)...what would people choose to drive around in...?
- oldman
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So, from an interested, but uninvolved, bystander: If the T-34/85 were perked roughly equal to the Panther (duplicating history)...what would people choose to drive around in...?
- oldman
Depends a lot upon the perk cost is just increasing to the Panthers 15, or if it goes up just a bit (10?) and Panther & Tiger I get a bit lower perk price.
Generally, we would see much more Panzer IV (free) again (how much depends on the above). Smashing towns: The M4(75) ratio would go up. For deacking fields maybe a bit of the T34/76, which once was popular due to its speed (no need to take now because of the almost free /85).
For dedicated tank combat, along with the Panzer IV I expect to see much more of the other tanks, most notably Panther and the nowadays almost forgotten M4(76).
I don't expect German tank destroyers to make a big comeback, it's just not their terrain anymore.
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By the way, that being said, I don't expect to happen anything soon. Such adjustments were rare in AH even back when there were more people working on it. Remember how long it did take to get the Spitfire 14 unperked? :old:
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Depends a lot upon the perk cost is just increasing to the Panthers 15, or if it goes up just a bit (10?) and Panther & Tiger I get a bit lower perk price.
Generally, we would see much more Panzer IV (free) again (how much depends on the above). Smashing towns: The M4(75) ratio would go up. For deacking fields maybe a bit of the T34/76, which once was popular due to its speed (no need to take now because of the almost free /85).
For dedicated tank combat, along with the Panzer IV I expect to see much more of the other tanks, most notably Panther and the nowadays almost forgotten M4(76).
I don't expect German tank destroyers to make a big comeback, it's just not their terrain anymore.
The "Stats" have determined the T34/85 is "Superior" in performance (Which it is not), and so there is a need to change things up because a couple of others think it should be? I would agree its "Popular" (Not Superior).
Either way - Excellent suggestion! Raise the perk on the T34/85 to 10 or whatever the Stats suggest. That way we can have 4 tanks instead of 3 that are rarely used. It would be exciting to watch another GV sit on the side lines in the name of making the game better and it should add oodles of fun too!
Players rarely pay the perks for the T2, T1, or the Panther as it is now. You say there is a need for change, I say that things are in balance. I do not hear anybody complaining in the Main about this. Everybody is free to choose whatever Vehicle they want. Raise the perks, lower the perks, cancel the perks, everybody will always find their Happy Medium. If this was 15 years ago and Player participation was what it use to be - then this is a conversation to have. But it isn't and it ain't. To Restrain play at this point in the life of Aces High seems controlling for the sake of control.
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Tyfoo why not make chogs 1 perk?
T34 85 is the most well rounded tank in game. Even i can get occasional kills in it!
Or maybe perk the panther and tiger 3 perks? That would bring them back some.
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Either way - Excellent suggestion! Raise the perk on the T34/85 to 10 or whatever the Stats suggest. That way we can have 4 tanks instead of 3 that are rarely used.
This makes no sense at all.
Players rarely pay the perks for the T2, T1, or the Panther as it is now. You say there is a need for change, I say that things are in balance
But they aren't. Have you looked at the actual number, usage and k/D? Shall I post the comparison yet another time?
Other tanks are hardly used now because the T34 is vastly superior especially considering the perk costs. It's performing far better than the Tiger one which has 10 times the perk cost.
That's what is out of balance. Perk points had been introduced to prevent superior rides from dominating the arena.
Compared to the 2 point T34/85, the 20 point Tiger and 15 point Panther or the 4 point Sherman VC are way overpriced - that's what is out of balance. The perked vehicles are not worth to be taken out any more.
The aim is to get some rebalance to the arena.
. Everybody is free to choose whatever Vehicle they want. Raise the perks, lower the perks, cancel the perks, everybody will always find their Happy Medium
Cancel the perks and everybody will find their happy medium? With free Tempests and Me 262s buzzing around? That's some odd kind of wishful thinking. :headscratch:
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Using a T34/85 to kill Panthers, Tiger 1's, Firefly's is relatively easy in our current combat environment, you ambush them. That in and of its self is not due to the "uber" capabilities of the 34/85, but is a result of the tactics. My personal nemesis is the Jagdpanzer I70, and specifically one with 27th driving it, lol. Between the tanks impressive capabilities, his knowledge of its strengths and weaknesses, and his ability to see you where ever you are, makes it a daunting task.
Be careful increasing the perk cost of the 34/85, many gv'ers say they will leave if they increase it. You could lower the cost of the other perked tanks, to bring everything "back into balance", what ever that means. It really depends on what the objective overall is, if it is to reduce the usage of the 35/85, that's not going to happen. If it is to increase the usage of other tanks, then change their perk cost.
As a side note to this discussion, it is interesting to note, most of the comments for the increase in perk cost of the 34/85, are coming from players that don't even gv the majority of the time. :rolleyes:
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. It really depends on what the objective overall is, if it is to reduce the usage of the 35/85, that's not going to happen. If it is to increase the usage of other tanks, then change their perk cost.
That's contradictory.
As a side note to this discussion, it is interesting to note, most of the comments for the increase in perk cost of the 34/85, are coming from players that don't even gv the majority of the time. :rolleyes:
:rolleyes: indeed
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Be careful increasing the perk cost of the 34/85, many gv'ers say they will leave if they increase it. You could lower the cost of the other perked tanks, to bring everything "back into balance", what ever that means. It really depends on what the objective overall is, if it is to reduce the usage of the 35/85, that's not going to happen. If it is to increase the usage of other tanks, then change their perk cost.
As a side note to this discussion, it is interesting to note, most of the comments for the increase in perk cost of the 34/85, are coming from players that don't even gv the majority of the time. ‘:rolleyes:
Exactly, reduce perk cost of Panther and Tigers not the T34/85. It would drive away players that use it for a huge % of their sorties. But lowering the cost of the others could get them to use other tanks!
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Snailman for airplanes does K/D roughly correlate to ENY/perk cost?
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I think there's an easy fix to this. Make perks and eny dynamic. I bet you could use some of the same code that's used to calculate the eny based on the numbers.
The more people that up a vehicle/plane the more perks it costs. The less people that use it he less it costs.
That way the plane isn't just assigned an arbitrary number that is rarely reviewed. The Hurri mkII comes to mind. There are so many planes that are better at 20 or even 25 eny that you rarely see one. If the eny started out at 40 on all the planes and decreased based on the number of people that are flying them I'd bet that would even get some of the hanger queens out.
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Personally I think the T34/85 is overdesigned, not just for the perk price, but in general. It absorbs way too much punishment, more than a real T34 would have in actual combat. I think doubling its cost from 3 perks to 6 would work, but perhaps the better approach would be to lower the perk cost of Tigers and Panthers (as a few of you have said).
If Panthers were 7 perks instead of 15 and Tiger IIs were 50 instead of 100, we'd see more of them.
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I'm with the gv guys on leaving it alone. T34/85 is easily killed with a m4/76, panther and tigers are not. No need to lower their perks either. The game is fun like it is. Why change it?