Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: Rich46yo on July 20, 2013, 01:01:02 PM
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Name the best 30+ eny planes and vehicles and state "why".
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Bf 109F-4
Great plane for perk farming IMO.
Many people in the MA seem to underestimate its ability to do well, but as far as 109s go it is my favorite. It feels nimble and turns very well, the gun's are good enough to down any aircraft you come across, however it does not carry a lot of 20mm ammo so getting in close and making those count is important.
:salute
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My two choices
109G-2
Powerful (one of the best sustained climbers in game), maneuverable, nose mounted armament, flexible (gunpods/drop tank/bomb). Very survivable and competitve for a ENY 30 bird in the MA. Capable over a broad range of altidudes.
La-5
Basically a La-7 with just some less top speed. I was actually very surprised that the ENY was recently raised to 30...
Very capable base defender & furballer.
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Mosquito Mk VI:
+Speed on WEP
+Firepower
+Ballistics
+Centerline guns
-Speed on MIL
-Size
-Agility
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My two choices
109G-2
Powerful (one of the best sustained climbers in game), maneuverable, nose mounted armament, flexible (gunpods/drop tank/bomb). Very survivable and competitve for a ENY 30 bird in the MA. Capable over a broad range of altidudes.
La-5
Basically a La-7 with just some less top speed. I was actually very surprised that the ENY was recently raised to 30...
Very capable base defender & furballer.
La-7 all have 3 guns in AH.
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P39 and P40s
P39s for base defense very fun not that slow good guns turns with spitys pretty good
P40s for attacking or a fighter sweep decent speed great guns the C model is the lightest weight which makes it the most formidable P40 as it has 2 50s and 4 30s climb rate does not drop off until 14k stalls nicely just a bit weak on the power side
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I had no idea the LA-5 was raised to 30. Yes its a great airplane.
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109G6, G2, and F4 - All excellent dogfighters with nose mounted guns.
109E4 - Also a superb fighter, just not as able to keep up with some of the later war planes like the other 109s can. This can be fixed with lead turns though. :D
Mossi 6 - Pretty fast, great diving ability, and THE GUNS ON THAT THING!
P-38G - Very underestimated fighter, light and nimble, nose mounted guns as well.
P-47D11 - Again, very underestimated fighter, great turn fighter, BnZer, and 8 50cals!
The ones I can remember off the top of my head.
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La-7 all have 3 guns in AH.
As an option... You can select two guns if you prefer. Saves a little weight.
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38G hands down.
Climbs decent, isn't slow, turns well, and has guns that can end the fight quickly.
:rock
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I like the Spitfire or Hurricane Mk.1, I find it hard to catch people, but once you do, the 8 303s are more than good enough to get a kill with
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- pretty much the 109s up to G6 (I reacall G6 having higher eny since this is the least used 109 in game)
- new Yak-9M but with the "-9T" designation :headscratch:
- La-5FN (this is basically an La-7 but with unrefined aerodynamics)
- P-38G and P-47D-11 (for long trips)
- P-39Q (its got modest power but it can get fast down low)
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All this and no bomber love... :(
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I16.........I has a sweet roll rate and turns pretty well until you run out of energy.
Get the kill quick and you don't have to worry.
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All this and no bomber love... :(
KI-67 no doubt. I call it the fighter plane where the pilot shoots backwards.
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As an option... You can select two guns if you prefer. Saves a little weight.
We had these discussion long time ago, but i recall something about the 3 guns being as heavy as the 2 guns (different cannon types). Can easilt be tested in the game.
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Saying things like the Spitfire Mk I and P-40C is absurd. Even the best players in the game have significantly reduced success in things like that. When people talk about perk farmers they are talking about aircraft that have ENY rates well above their real level of effectiveness. You can land a bunch of perks with things like the Spitfire Mk I and G4M1, but your perks per hour would be far, far better with the Bf109G-2 and Ki-67 and this effect is even more extreme as you get towards the MA average skill levels where the P-40C and He111 become simply free kills to most other players but some perks might be earned in a Spitfire Mk IX or Boston MK III.
Essentially when you say "Spitfire Mk I" or "P-40C" you're saying "Look at how good I am!", a "Look at me!" post in other words and not helpful at all.
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We had these discussion long time ago, but i recall something about the 3 guns being as heavy as the 2 guns (different cannon types). Can easilt be tested in the game.
2 guns instead of three saves 5lbs.
But you get about 33% more firing time, which (for a good shooter) may be a reason to prefer them.
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Saying things like the Spitfire Mk I and P-40C is absurd. Even the best players in the game have significantly reduced success in things like that.
Yup.
You get only 33% more perks perk kill in an ENY 40 plane like the Spit 1 over something like a ENY 30 109G-2, but on average you will have a much harder time getting the same number of kills over time. The lack of speed is one of the biggest problems.
So usually the perk gain efficiency is substantially lower.
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Essentially when you say "Spitfire Mk I" or "P-40C" you're saying "Look at how good I am!", a "Look at me!" post in other words and not helpful at all.
i dont think they are trying to do that dont be so snappy there just giving input :bhead
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i dont think they are trying to do that dont be so snappy there just giving input :bhead
I don't think so. I don't think they are so unaware of relative skill levels, capabilities and such to actually think the Spitfire Mk I and P-40C are good perk farming aircraft. Those posts were classic "look at me" posts disguised as advice and they were bad advice. If a new player, looking to earn perks were to follow them and grab that P-40C he'd hardly earn any perks because it is so hard to be successful in those aircraft.
The very notion of a perk farmer is a unit that has effective high perk point per time unit generation, something the Bf109s generally excel at. Slow fighters that yield mostly assists and that require skill to survive in do not make good perk farmers. Years ago, before the Spitfire Mk I or P-40B was added, Citabria (as I recall) set out to hit a 5/1 or 10/1 (don't recall which) K/D ratio in each fighter and the only one in which he could not do so was the C.202. Too many of the things that ought to have been kills were turned into assists by other players using large banks of heavy machine guns or cannons and his final K/D ratio was less than 3/1 in the C.202.
The C.202 out performs the Spitfire Mk I and P-40C by a noticeable margin and if Citabria, one of the better players, had his success level heavily curtailed by the C.202, what is Joe Average going to do with those fighters?
The P-40C and Spitfire Mk I, and all other fighters in that category, are not perk farmers. They are challenge aircraft that one uses because one either really likes the aircraft's history (Flying Tigers, Battle of Britain, ect) or because they want the challenge. Recommending them as perk farmers does a disservice to anybody who might be using the discussion to learn and be more effective at their chosen task, in this case earning perk points.
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In a perk farmer you want a plane that will be able to land and benefit from the perk bonus it yields. Spit1 and such are unable to disengage from a fight and getting to land them usually requires to fly with the horde or kill everthing in the vicinity.
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And flying things like the Spit I in a horde is a recipe for many assists and very few kills.
I disagree that you need to land the sorties though, in fact I suspect that taking the time to land may often not be worth the multiplier as compared to dying in the fight and getting a fresh fighter. What you do need is the speed to play with the big boys and the guns to kill fast.
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Mine is the Ki-61 and the A6M3 :airplane:
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Mine is the Ki-61 and the A6M3 :airplane:
So THAT'S why my A6M3 had a funny smell to it... :noid
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Saying things like the Spitfire Mk I and P-40C is absurd. Even the best players in the game have significantly reduced success in things like that. When people talk about perk farmers they are talking about aircraft that have ENY rates well above their real level of effectiveness. You can land a bunch of perks with things like the Spitfire Mk I and G4M1, but your perks per hour would be far, far better with the Bf109G-2 and Ki-67 and this effect is even more extreme as you get towards the MA average skill levels where the P-40C and He111 become simply free kills to most other players but some perks might be earned in a Spitfire Mk IX or Boston MK III.
Essentially when you say "Spitfire Mk I" or "P-40C" you're saying "Look at how good I am!", a "Look at me!" post in other words and not helpful at all.
karnak I respect your opinion very much but that is not why I said the P40C the P40C if you are experienced in anything else is a forgiving aircraft and a joy to fly I guess it just must be me but I have a lot of success in that airplane from time to time it doesn't matter if I'm on base defense or flying solo over enemy territory to go find a fight it is one of my favorite rides because people underestimate it and want to get an easy kill and commit to the fight it makes a wonderful 1v1 and 1v5 aircraft I just love it is my perk farmer
just my little speel
<S> Karnak
from Eric19
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I mistook the OP as name your favorite 30+ eny plane as opposed to name the best, imho if you want the best one its the LA-5 it is pretty quick down low, has 2 cannons, but only has short range so I think the pros outweigh the cons here
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Yeah, name your favorites is a totally different discussion in which any and all are valid answers.
The La-5FN is a very good perk farmer.
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Yak-9T and Mosquito VI.
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With sufficient familiarity, I find the P47-D11 is far more capable than an ENY 35 would indicate. Particularly if there's bombers in the area.
Now that the LA5 is ENY 30, it looks awfully attractive too. Great performance, just a bit slower.
Wiley.
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P39 and 38G
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No one mentioned the Yak-7B.
I know, it's new....
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Bf 109E, F, G-2, G-6.
P-40 E,F,N
Yak-9M (Yak-9T w/ 20mm)
La-5FN
Ki-61 is also a very decent fighter, just a bit lacking in top-end speed.
For bombers
He-111 (when used smartly)
Boston III
Ju-88
G4M
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47D-11
Decent climb and cruise. Great diver/turner/stall fighter
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Bf 109E, F, G-2, G-6.
E-4, no. F-4, G-2, G-6 yes. E-4 is too slow and too hard to be successful in. The other three are all top dogs for perk farming.
P-40 E,F,N
No, P-40s are all too hard to be successful in to keep up the K/T. A6M2 and A6M3 would be better, but they are also too slow.
Yak-9M (Yak-9T w/ 20mm)
Not too bad, but it is slower than you really want in a perk farmer.
La-5FN
Another top dog for perk farming.
Ki-61 is also a very decent fighter, just a bit lacking in top-end speed.
Yup, pretty much the same place as the Yak-9M/T.
For bombers
He-111 (when used smartly)
No, OBJ is too high, it is too slow in climb and speed and it is too vulnerable.
Boston III
It is ok, but the range is too short to really be great and it is excessively vulnerable.
Ju-88
No, OBJ is too high and it is too vulnerable.
G4M
About the same as the Boston, trading the range weakness with being slow.
For bombers the Ki-67 stands head and shoulders above any other for perk farming due to its combination of speed, range, decent guns and high OBJ.
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If we are speaking bombers now, the Boston, Ki-67 and especially the G4M stand out as perk farmers.
The G4M and Boston may have a relatively low ord capacity, but it's very much compensated by the high OBJ. The short range on the Boston does not matter in the pure perk farming role, a short town dash and then race back to base. Even if you are shot down after the drop, you wont 'lose' much perks. The G4m can make similar dashes, because while the top speed ain't impressive in any way, it climbs extremely fast to altitude which makes survival in frontline attack much higher than expected.
Both planes can attain very high perks/hour that way, even for the average player, which is all what a perk farmers efficiency is about.
I'm using the G4M a lot recently, not only in pure "perk farming" (i.e. pure town dropping) but actually mostly for tactical attacks (porking bases, with only one bomb of for going for the town at most), and still attain average perks/h rates of more than 25.
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Addendum on perk gain in bombers
The following is to be taken as 'anecdotal', as it's only the results of the bombers missions of a single player. Other players will have different results depending on their mission profiles and individual success.
That being said... Therese are all bombers I have at least 10 missions in since 09/01/12. It shows # of missions (all but 2-3 Mossie runs in formation), distribution of mission type and the perk gain per hour flight time
(http://i1145.photobucket.com/albums/o507/Snaildude/buffperkers_zps35b6634c.jpg)
Mission type clarification:
"Tactical" are mostly porking runs (ords, dar, vh's ect), mixed with some attacks on town in support of captures
"Milking" are the notorious town-center smashing runs for perks and/or score
Since the Mossie OBJ rating was increased recently, I'm actually getting positive perks/h in it.
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Last time I sunk a CV with a 111, I got 16 perks for it. I don't remember the bonus though. If I really want to farm perks though, I'll use the Ki-67. It has solid range with excellent speed and decent defenses if I'm intercepted. :aok
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Spitfire V's ENY is 35 now. That might put it as a semi-decent perk farmer. A bit slow and small clip though.
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I like killing boats with the SBD. That 1600lb AP bomb can sink a cruiser or destroyer in 1 drop. Think I got 20+ perks for sinking a full health cruiser once.
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Spit5, Mossie, P38G, 109E-G14, 190A5/8, Ki61, A6M3/5b, La5, Yaks, F4U-1, and P47D25.
Use all of those when I want to perk farm with great success, all fantastic airplanes with fantastic ENY's IMO.
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Spitfire V's ENY is 35 now. That might put it as a semi-decent perk farmer. A bit slow and small clip though.
I'd rank the P-40 F and N above the Spit V. And the 109E isn't far behind it. Why are those dismissed almost offhand by you, but the spit V is "semi-decent"?
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I like killing boats with the SBD. That 1600lb AP bomb can sink a cruiser or destroyer in 1 drop. Think I got 20+ perks for sinking a full health cruiser once.
SBDs are awesome. After you drop that big egg, instead of crawling home like a normal bomber you can pull out the two forward 0.5 guns and go fighter mode.
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La5FN & Boston............
and they are both fun birds
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I swear SBDs soak up more damage then anything with one engine in the game. Wildcats as well, but SBDs most of all. Most of all with a skilled driver wiggling around in one making it hard to get a good spray on.
I'll add Brewsters to the list, or agree if they are already on. With 4 0.50s converging at 250 or 300 you dont want to get in the gun sights of one and its a wonderfully handling air craft. I dont know what their current eny is however. They are best defending from CV groups with 4,000' of air under you. Yak-9Ts are also very good in this role. That big cannon makes short work against PTs, LVTs, and any fighter dumb enough to get in front of the sights.
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I'd rank the P-40 F and N above the Spit V. And the 109E isn't far behind it. Why are those dismissed almost offhand by you, but the spit V is "semi-decent"?
The P-40s are too hard to be successful in, all of them. Both the Spit V and Bf109E handily out perform them. The Bf109E is slower than the V and has inferior guns and has worse handling than the F. The V and F are much improved over the I and E. In this case I'd say the difference comes down to Hispanos.
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I'd rank the P-40 F and N above the Spit V. And the 109E isn't far behind it. Why are those dismissed almost offhand by you, but the spit V is "semi-decent"?
I wish I was flying the P40s other people seem to be flying. They're one of my worst planes. I think it's mostly the lack of climb rate/acceleration. I agree with Karnak. The Spit 5 has a short clip and is slow, not that great a climb rate, but it still handles like a Spit.
Wiley.
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Having spent most of my time this tour in the P-40E/F before the YAK update, you certainly will get mega perks IF you land kills. But the problem is you have to change your entire mindset flying a P-40 against late war uber rides. Can it be fun to kill P-51s, 109s? Yes. Challenging? Certainly. But because from the time you spawn on the runway till you land, you have to be 100% in a defensive mindset. You have to always be checking for a threat or some clown blowing a 10K FT advantage for an "easy" P-40 kill, because once they get saddled up and you have blown you're E, you're done. Always being on the defensive and having to take opportunities when they present themselves is time consuming and can get very boring. Any P-40 is NOT a good perk farmer for those reasons.
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The best perk farmer for tanks has to go to the Hetzer. It is ludicrously powerful for its 35 eny.
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The best perk farmer for tanks has to go to the Hetzer. It is ludicrously powerful for its 35 eny.
Yes, it will absolutely take over this role from the IVF. Especially now with the 5x gunsight, which alone should result in a severe reduction of it's eny. :old:
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Yes, it will absolutely take over this role from the IVF. Especially now with the 5x gunsight, which alone should result in a severe reduction of it's eny. :old:
You mean to ENY 30?
Its still firing the same shell, you can just aim maybe a bit further out now, and have an easier time doing it.
What I question is why HTC thinks the Jagdpanzer IV is equal to the Firefly, if perk price is anything to go by.
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You mean to ENY 30?
Its still firing the same shell, you can just aim maybe a bit further out now, and have an easier time doing it.
What I question is why HTC thinks the Jagdpanzer IV is equal to the Firefly, if perk price is anything to go by.
the gun on the firefly is superior to the 75mm L70 that is on the JagdPanzer4 but the JagdPanzer4 has a better chance of ricochet because it has 80mms of armor sloped at the front
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Easiest perk farmers? Mossie, 38J, Ki-84, 109G2/G6/G14/F4, Spit9, Yak9s.
All those planes can land kills with relative ease in the MA environment with decently high ENY. The early war planes might be fun, but against even a mediocre pilot you're dead unless you have plenty of alt. these planes still offer a fighting chance against almost all planes.
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I'd add more about bombers.
My favorite bomber to get perks is Ki-67 and Boston.
Boston climbs better but virtually defenseless - it allows you to get faster to safe altitude, get fast to target and escape. But if someone actually would intercept you (which is not easy task if you get to 18-20k) you are dead but in generally after you did your damage.
Ki-67 has lower climb rate but still decent (in comparison to B-17/B-24/B-29/Lanc/B-25/B-26) so you get to safe altitude quite fast. Has great top speed at 20k making it easy to escape, and even if it is intersected has great defense. Also its quite good for taking out towns as it has small bombs as well.
My favorite bomber to invest perks on is Ar234. :x :x :x
Go to enemy territory blow up 3 radars and come home - also it is quite easy to fly.
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The Boston is defenseless only in a formation. Once free from your drones it can frustrate many fighters and is quite fast. I used Bostons to get the required perks to fly the MossXVI. The turret is indeed worthless, but after my drones were killed I evaded a 262, made a few slow red to give up the chase and shot down the K4 that followed me with 1000 hits from the forward fixed pea shooters.
Which begs the question: to get the 1.25 perk bonus, do I need to land just one bomber out of the 3?
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Which begs the question: to get the 1.25 perk bonus, do I need to land just one bomber out of the 3?
Yes.
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Yes.
Thanks.
I now know what my MO will be if I need to harvest perks again for a MOSSXVI...
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Just a note... since the Mossie OBJ was raised, it's the only perk ride that (for me) earns so much perks as to fully sustain it's usage on it's own.
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Favorite perk bomber is Boston Fast and decent bomb load
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I would love to fly the P-38G, but I can't see well out of its darkened gun sight. I wish that HTC would fix that.
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Guess I'll throw my $.02 in. My ranking below is based on personal impressions and not limited to the 30+ ENY range but simply overall perk farming efficiency which includes A-G ability.
1. 109G2 for reasons already stated. I'd also add that the swing-role diversity of gondies+centerline bomb give it the edge over the F-4.
2. P-47D11
3. 190A5
4. F4U1
5. P-47D25
6. 109F4
7. 109G6
8. P-47D40
9. Ki-84
10. Brew
P39/P40 don't even get close. Yak series and P-38 series deserve honorable mention.
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For GV perk farming the jagdpanzer Hetzer 38 is tops for me. The 109F-4 and 109G-2 are planes I like. I don't recall what the Yak-3 is but I flew it in the DA and that is a pretty good plane. I may have to give it a try in the MA.