Aces High Bulletin Board

Originally posted by Shamus
Looks like somone got his feelings hurt :)

shamus

Originally posted by Lye-El
See Rule #4

Looks like somone got his feelings hurt

Originally posted by mars01
we all know you are probably the best cherry picker in the game

Secondly, part of the argument by the community to ask for this map back was that it allowed everyone their style of gameplay, so whats wrong with having the landgrabbers and milkrunners??

Also, apparently even the FT people want to landgrab. Im not saying the actual people the want to furball only are landgrabbing..they are supprting the people that do landgrab. MA last night had two FT bases..didnt see any chatter about giving one back to knits. Bish apparently got p.o'd and went up in force and took the additional base.. I logged off soon afterword, but i didnt hear anything even then about knits getting the field. After bish took the fieild, rooks went in force and capped both of them. Doesnt sound like a majority are interested in the furball afterall.

Originally posted by mars01
No Doubt - Of course Zazen you take Laz telling you that you have no idea what a furball is and turn it into your sarchastic crying.

The point is what you deem furballing is really cherry picking guys that are furballing.  Which is fine and just adds another challenge and level of complexity for the furballer,  but you are in no way really furballing and that is what you so characteristically ignored and instead started your little cry.

We all know you would never get down low in the nitty gritty of the furball and we all know you are probably the best cherry picker in the game, but that doesn't make you a furballer.

I do appreciate your support for furballing  having some place that we can fight.

I see alot of words in here about alot of things that are...well...in a video game.

Yea, its OK to get pissed or emotionally disturbed here and there...but jeez people, calm down.

Voice your opinions if you wish, yay! Thats what this community is about (I think, anyways). But this community is damn childish at times...its a useless forum anymore.

Can't we all just get along?
 

Originally posted by mars01
Zazen I am not going to read that, it would be almost as boring as cherry picking.

The bottom line is, when I see you down low mixing it up with the rest of us contributing to the furball rather than leaching off of it, I will believe you have a clue till then you are just talk.

Originally posted by Casper1
I see alot of words in here about alot of things that are...well...in a video game.  

Yea, its OK to get pissed or emotionally disturbed here and there...but jeez people, calm down.  

Voice your opinions if you wish, yay!  Thats what this community is about (I think, anyways).  But this community is damn childish at times...its a useless forum anymore.

Can't we all just get along?  

:(

Originally posted by lazs2
ok.. so everyone is agreed that zazen has no idea what a furball is except a bunch of low planes that are busy so that he can take risk free kills?

I didn't really read his long diatribe about what a great guy he is or how skilled he is or how mean we all are to him either.  

I don't really care if you are the best in the game and the best shot and have the whitest teeth... if you want to cherry pick I got no use for you.

If you can't get down and dirty and mix it up on the deck with fairly even odds then no amount of telling us how good you REALLY are is gonna have much effect on us..  

I'm not much good at this.... when I am dodging 3 or 4 spits and a few HO lalas on the deck... I might be open to the "great hunter of human prey'" swooping down from his high alt foxhole with cannon blazing..  

The two lala's that just tried to HO me are more memorable and impressive to me tho.

lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's

Originally posted by mars01
Yep just befor that the bish had the two fields and were vulching the crap out of the one Rook base.  I switched side to stop the totall control of FT by the bish and as a Rook we broke the vulch, repelled the goons and turned the tide.  Unfortunately the Bish ran from FT once that happend.  And then the, unbelievable to me the Rooks went into status Quo and capped both fields.  It was rediculous watching about 30 Rooks flying around with each other with out anything to fight for about an hour.  During this time the call went out to the knights that the rooks would keep the bish down so they could get a goon into FT and take back the knight base, but there were no takers and the Rooks just flew around with each other doing nothing.

The rest of he map suced for the Rooks so I logged in frustration, once again foiled by the maroons in this game lol.

Originally posted by Zazen13


2) I'd want people who were in faster/better armed planes who refused to turn with me but instead negated my turnrate advantage by using well-timed and accurate high speed passes to tear me apart to rot in hell and DIE!!! ;)

It's ok Lazs, it's perfectly natural for you to hold contempt for those who occupy the strata above you in a furball, you are their prey, just as they are potential prey for the strata above them.

Zazen

Originally posted by RedTop

Zazen , although you may have a high KD and all that , I never seen ya in the mix of anything other than blowing thru at 500 mph so you don't even think of getting shot at by someone. So please....just leave the furballing to those that know what it is. YOur more of the Air Racer type. Don't they have an arena for that BTW?

Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+

Vulching and Cherry Picking are in the same league as Gang banging and HOing. That is; Vulching and Cherry Picking are moves that only the lowest of the low would use. And I will use any of the four, because that is what the arena has become. It is a snake pit where only snakes survive, and FT has become the biggest snake pit of them all.

Long live FT!   :aok :aok

Originally posted by Zazen13
They aren't really the same at all. Cherry picking is engaging a con who is already engaged. That doesn't mean he was losing, he could have been about to blow yer friend away or is diving  into a 2 vs 1 on a friend to make it a 3 vs 1 on your friend. Vulching is engaging a con who is in a totally 100% vulnerable position on the ground and no threat whatsoever in his current state to you or your friends and therefore unable to defend himself in any way. Anytime I cherry someone, provided he has decent SA, he always has the option of breaking off my friend to attempt to avoid me, turn and try to Ho me etc. If he has poor SA he is dead, if he has decent SA and chooses to not to attempt to avoid me, he's dead. The point is the cherry has options or potentially skills such as SA to change his fate. The guy getting vulched has no options except play elsewhere.

Zazen

Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+
My friend you vulched me last night
I took off from my base that was being vulched in a Spit16. I was just past wheels up  I spotted this LA7 who looked like his engine was shot out, the LA was coming back on my base to make another vulch before he died. As I tried to finish that vulcher off, you boomed through with your Typhie and vulched me.  I did not have, nor never did have enough E to avoid you.  Now I would have done the same thing to you.

I am just honest enought to admit that I am a vulching scumbag.

You have lost any credibility with me about how fair a fighter you are.  And others see through it also.

Originally posted by Zazen13
I did not vulch you, you were airborne and attempting to kill Crambo as he was ditching. I do not kill planes on the ground, it's a religious obsession with me. If you have enough E to bring your guns to bear on someone you have enough E to jink out of the way of my fast tiffie booming through. I was trying to save Crambo the ditch because I'm a nice guy. ;)


Vulching is killing planes on the ground. You were not on the ground.

Zazen

Originally posted by Zazen13
I did not vulch you, you were airborne and attempting to kill Crambo as he was ditching. I do not kill planes on the ground, it's a religious obsession with me. If you have enough E to bring your guns to bear on someone you have enough E to jink out of the way of my fast tiffie booming through. I was trying to save Crambo the ditch because I'm a nice guy. ;)


Vulching is killing planes on the ground. You were not on the ground.

Zazen

Originally posted by RedTop
:rolleyes: his perspective is just as credible as yours. IMO

Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+
I was killing a vulcher at my field, you then killed a defender who had just upped, and that is not vulching?

Then most of the kills I made at your fields were not vulches either, because there wheels were off the ground.

You are at an large enemy field close enough to shoot a fighter who never left the field, who has been airborne less than a minute, and you shoot him and it is not a vulch?

Originally posted by RedTop
Also , don't talk about milk running bases as if this were the only place it happens. Knights go back door on Rooks , Rooks go back door on Bish and Bish back door Rooks. Happens EVERY map. Best part of the whole thing is when they FINALLY meet and have to fight one another.

Originally posted by Skuzzy
The goal is to have fun.  Sounds simple enough.  However, as many people as there are playing the game, there are an equal number of ideas of what is fun.

Saying one player's idea of fun is not right due to the idea not being your idea of fun is not right.  Trying to dictate to others your idea of "fun" being the only right idea is akin to telling a car buyer they cannot buy that luxury car because you do not like it.  You will have as much success telling the car buyer he is wrong as telling other players they cannot have fun in the manner they are having it.

 

Originally posted by Zazen13
That is correct, a vulch is destroying enemy aircraft on the ground, either stationary or taxiing down the runway. Read some WW2 Air Combat literature, they are very specific on the definition of Air to Ground kills and Air to Air kills. The rule is if the plane is airborne it's an air to air kill. In fact, one pass high speed killing planes that have just taken off who are smart enough to build up a little E is very difficult to do sometimes as the speed differential makes the defender far more manueverable than the attacker. The attacker can fairly easily be forced to miss or blow his E advnatage in an attempt to retain an angle on the defender for a shot. Watch guys who tend to up Zekes for base defense they are masters of this tactic.

Zazen

Originally posted by Zazen13
Fortunately, "Your Humble Opinion" means absolutely nothing to me. ;)

Zazen

Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+
You keep digging a hole zazen.

I would bet most people would have called me a vulcher if I had done the same thing.

If you consider only a vulch to be wheels on the runway, that is pretty nit picky.  I think most people consider a vulch to be when the other guy is upping at his field and has not had any chance to gain a decent state of energy.  

If you aren't a vulcher, why were you in a position to shoot bogeys off of guys who were vulching the field?  And not only in position, but did it.

Again, I have no issues with what you DID, I have issues with your definitions.

Originally posted by RedTop
I may need to make some coffee to help let this keep me up worrying. ;)

Continue your higher than thou attitude. It's what your best at.:aok

Originally posted by Zazen13
Hey, I don't make the rules I just live by them. The difference was very important in WW2, there was alot made of whether kills were air to air or air to ground during debriefings and such. I was near your base because the guy I wacked before you was trying to run to his base ack, (was Turn in a Niki), he had altitude and blew it and I ran him down, he broke over the field I blew him away with a deflection shot to the left. Was just happy luck I found myself 500 off your six lining up for a shot on Crambo as he was attempting to ditch. I had no idea what he or you were doing previously, 5 seconds before I nailed you  I was below the drop-off and unable to even see A94 field.

Zazen

Originally posted by SLED
Here's a rule I like to use in the MA.


If your plane is in front of my plane.........   I pull the trigger.:D

Originally posted by SLED
Here's a rule I like to use in the MA.


If your plane is in front of my plane.........   I pull the trigger.:D

Originally posted by Zazen13
I contribute to furballs just fine cherry picking folks like yourself with no patience, attention span or impulse control. To allow you and Lazs run amok un-checked would be a dis-service to the game. ;)

Zazen

Originally posted by SLED
Yeah but chutes don't help my score. So why bother:lol

Originally posted by Morpheus


And cherry picking a plane that is already engaged by 5-6 other planes is nothing. And you're dumb to boast about it.

Originally posted by Delirium


We all need AH vacations, some of them in this thread need it more than most.

Originally posted by Shane
because it's highly amusing to watch the little meatbombs explode.

Originally posted by Morpheus
  snip........The problem is not the game, or the map, its the people who play and their conflicting ideas of fun. More people today think its more fun to take a base, vulch and gang rape a single con than ever before. That cant be fixed and its going to keep getting worse with the more players the MA gets. There's far too many new players today who think that vulching, taking bases and ganging in hordes is the way the game should be. Its a lost cause, and arguing about it will do nothing.

Originally posted by Morpheus
There's far too many new players today who think that vulching, taking bases and ganging in hordes is the way the game should be. Its a lost cause, and arguing about it will do nothing.

Originally posted by hubsonfire
The "war" used to a premise for the fights; now, it's an excuse to avoid them. Where we used to have massive aerial engagements taking a base, now it's a 10 to 1 mob attacking a base, while a 10 to 1 mob attacks their base. I used to fly in missions that would turn into monstrous furballs as defenders upped like mad to meet the incoming raid. Now, with the huge maps, the path of least resistance is the one most followed.

Anyhow, that's how I see it. There are, of course, exceptions, but it seems that things overall have declined. It also appears that as the MA populace grows, or rolls over, the newer players learn via the "monkey see, monkey do" principle, and what they learn, the next newbs will see, and so on, until there are 700 people in the MA who haven't a clue as to what it's like to actually fight other people. AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH :eek:

OK, do you think it would be fair to say that the knowledge level of the pilots in the MA has decreased, as far as Turn & Burn tactics (knife fighting) goes?

Originally posted by Morpheus
Absolutely. Over all the ratio of good sticks to bad is way out of balance.

Like I said. With more new players every week, if not every day, that ratio can't do anything but get even more lopsided. Will it eventually even out? Who knows.... Some like to learn how to fight, some can learn because they have the patience to do so, some want to but do not have the patience, and some think they're learning because their score is getting "OK" but really they still couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag.

Originally posted by Dead Man Flying
Sled, I don't have the time to take people aside and teach them.  At some point, people have to self-motivate like many of us and put in the effort to get better.  Every few months, I post films that I hope people find useful, but unfortunately that's about the best I can do.

Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+

You took the vulch as would most people.  

Originally posted by Morpheus

And cherry picking a plane that is already engaged by 5-6 other planes is nothing. And you're dumb to boast about it.

Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+
Such Cherry Picking is really no different than a HO or a vulch.  You are putting yourself in a situation in which there is almost no risk, and in which your opponent has little to no real chance of either defense or offense.

Unfortunately, like you I got sick of being cherry picked in furballs.  

But I turned to the dark side. That was early in my AH1 days, probably about '99.  I was used to furballing in  Flying Circus and Red Baron, but in there it was very difficult for someone to boom and zoom and get a kill. You had to get in there and knife fight.  But these WW2 sims are different, one quick pass with a cannon plane, and some skill less cherry picking BNZ dweeb just ended all the e and angles you just built up on your opponent.

So you become either a fast cherry picker, or a slow cherry.

Cherry pickers are really just gang bangers, and like vulchers and HO'ers, they are scum.

Originally posted by SLED
So, maps in AW and WB were much smaller? It was harder for people to go to an area of the map away from the action?

Originally posted by hubsonfire
Regarding training: no one who's gotten good at the game should have to pay to teach others to play the game. That's just silly. I doubt that the names you listed (and i could be wrong) had someone holding their hand throughout the process. I have, in 5ish years of AW/AH/AH2, a total of 1 hour of formal training, which I received in the last year. This is a game. You either want to learn, or you don't. No one should have to teach you.

Originally posted by mars01
Get with the program Ohio -

First if HTC pulled everything that caused controversy in this game he wouldn't be in business.  Also if he pulled this map he would be sending the signal that he could careless about the fighter population in this game and I for one would be done for good as I would think others would be too.

Secondly who is saying no land grabbers and milk runners?  Yeah it would be nice it these guys would leave FT alone for the guys that want to fight, or they themselves would just go there to fight, but some can't do that because they are griefers.

And yes you missed it last night when the Bish were making a grab for the last field in FT from the rooks.  They got repelled and then ran leaving nothing to do in FT.  So we put out the word for a knight to drag a goon to one of the base so they could get their base back.  Unfortunately the closest knight base was 3 sectors away.

Yes I agree it takes players on both sides having balls to up and fight in FT, unfortunately that was not the case and FT sucked last night.  If the base were uncapturable this problem would be solved and a true FT would be the jewel of this game.

Originally posted by Skuzzy
The goal is to have fun.  Sounds simple enough.  However, as many people as there are playing the game, there are an equal number of ideas of what is fun.

Saying one player's idea of fun is not right due to the idea not being your idea of fun is not right.  Trying to dictate to others your idea of "fun" being the only right idea is akin to telling a car buyer they cannot buy that luxury car because you do not like it.  You will have as much success telling the car buyer he is wrong as telling other players they cannot have fun in the manner they are having it.

In the game, there are moments of grandeur.  Revel in them.  There are also moments of frustration.  It will happen and nothing can prevent it.  Moments of frustration make the moments of grandeur even better.

Persisting in chasing the goblins you create when players are having fun, and you cannot accept they are having fun, just adds more frustration.  If your idea of fun clashes with another players idea of fun, someone is going to get frustrated.  How that frustration is dealt with is the key.

You can brush it off and try to get back to that moment of grandeur, or you can revel in the frustration and expound on it to the point of getting other players irrirtated.  All the while you accomplish very little to nothing.

Finding a way to turn a negative into a positive takes more effort than just staying in the negative mode, but it can be far more fun.

Originally posted by Guppy35
It's just a game.  

Originally posted by Edbert in another currently active thread
Play the game the way you want, but let them play their game too. These maps are more than large enough for all of us to have fun, but if your idea of fun is preventing others from having theirs then AH would be better without you...IN MY OPINION.

Originally posted by lazs2
I don't really want to fight your typhoon with my FM2... it is possible in the game but I would rather not...  pinging you as you make a clumsy pass and run away is not that fun...  even if you die it is not as fun as the spit I just FOUGHT... If I die because you vultched me on the runway or when I was trying to keep track of 5 or 10 planes all in the fight  and you dove in and ran...that is inconvienient...

 

Originally posted by lazs2


You can frustrate but not impress...   If you really belived all the drivel you have been spouting then you would leave the low slow and early planes in furballs alone,   go something besides rook, and then go hunt other timid cherrypickers..

now that would be real "hunting of men" eh?

lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's

Originally posted by lazs2
I don't really want to fight your typhoon with my FM2... it is possible in the game but I would rather not...  pinging you as you make a clumsy pass and run away is not that fun...  even if you die it is not as fun as the spit I just FOUGHT... If I die because you vultched me on the runway or when I was trying to keep track of 5 or 10 planes all in the fight  and you dove in and ran...that is inconvienient...

I can understand your point of view and I feel your pain in a most empathic way. If I flew nothing but an FM2/Spit/Niki low n' slow on the deck in a seething mass of cons I'd certainly want two things badly:

1) I'd want people in fast planes with an innate manueverabilty disadvantage to get low n' slow and attempt to turn with me so I could get EZ kills in the TnB fashion.

2) I'd want people who were in faster/better armed planes who refused to turn with me but instead negated my turnrate advantage by using well-timed and accurate high speed passes to tear me apart to rot in hell and DIE!!!

It's ok Lazs, it's perfectly natural for you to hold contempt for those who occupy the strata above you in a furball, you are their prey, just as they are potential prey for the strata above them.

Originally posted by mars01
Bwahahhahahaa

As usual you have your blinders on so you can't see anything that you don't want to see.

Yeah Zazen we want the fasl, poorly turning planes to get low and slow and turn fight.  Man how stupid that sounds and how stupid it is that you would go there.

The point is you rather fly the faster less turning planes, and that is fine.  So you have two choices

1) Climb and fight other planes at alt.
2) Climb and sit on perch and pick off lower slower planes (Cherry Pick)

Yeah I would love to see your vast years of playing expieriance :rolleyes: down low in a TnB some times till I do you are all Blab.

The goal is to have fun. Sounds simple enough. However, as many people as there are playing the game, there are an equal number of ideas of what is fun.

Saying one player's idea of fun is not right due to the idea not being your idea of fun is not right. Trying to dictate to others your idea of "fun" being the only right idea is akin to telling a car buyer they cannot buy that luxury car because you do not like it. You will have as much success telling the car buyer he is wrong as telling other players they cannot have fun in the manner they are having it.

...

In the game, there are moments of grandeur. Revel in them. There are also moments of frustration. It will happen and nothing can prevent it. Moments of frustration make the moments of grandeur even better.

Persisting in chasing the goblins you create when players are having fun, and you cannot accept they are having fun, just adds more frustration. If your idea of fun clashes with another players idea of fun, someone is going to get frustrated. How that frustration is dealt with is the key.

You can brush it off and try to get back to that moment of grandeur, or you can revel in the frustration and expound on it to the point of getting other players irrirtated. All the while you accomplish very little to nothing.

Finding a way to turn a negative into a positive takes more effort than just staying in the negative mode, but it can be far more fun.

Unless you are likely to be in a place where a 1 vs 1 or 2 vs 2 etc. is likely being low n' slow in a TnB plane is a huge liability usually resulting in you getting gang-raped. Unfortuantely, the MA only provides situations conducive to that type of engagement on relatively rare occassions. It just the nature of the MA, it isn't anything personal. If you're getting gang-raped, cherried, BnZ'd you are flying the wrong plane in the wrong tactical environment and you are paying the price you should expect to pay.

AMEN Skuzzy..!! Lazs, mars01, RedTop, read what Skuzzy wrote here Over and over and over. Memorize it, breathe it, believe it, live by it, let it soak in deeply and permeate your very souls!  

but... I give more credit to the newbie who is the one in the spit in the furball that dodges me and gets the kill on me.

You can frustrate but not impress... If you really belived all the drivel you have been spouting then you would leave the low slow and early planes in furballs alone, go something besides rook, and then go hunt other timid cherrypickers..

now that would be real "hunting of men" eh?

Originally posted by Shane
one cannot get better if one doesn't push oneself...  the virtual world of AH is full of sheep who fear to leave the comfort zone for whatever reason.

Originally posted by mars01

These frustrations stem out of the dicotomy of the Fighter Pilots and Win the War folks.  And 99% of the time the Win The War folks are reducing the fights for the Fighter Pilots and not the other way around.

Donut has given the Fighter Pilots a small morsel of hope and with uncapturable bases would end this frustration or at least minimize it's affects.

You have this notion that good fighters/pilots must TnB. The fact is, and I know this may shock you, a good pilot is one who flies whichever plane he is in as close to its maximum potential as his talent, skill, abilities and tactical context allow.

Originally posted by Zazen13
I did not vulch you,  I could care less about my score, take a look at it, it's pretty obvious. ;)

Zazen

Originally posted by Zazen13

I never cherry someone engaged by more than 2 people. This is my rule of thumb.

If there's 2 there's room for you.
If there's 3 let them be.

Originally posted by mars01
I don't really care about your accounts and shades.  I was just making a point.  I know your Zazen account is your cherry picking account.

As for the above, I like to be in situations where it is 3 or 4 vs 1.  The action is sizzleing fast,  your SA is taxed to the extream and you better be good to get even one or two befor they get you.  And if you do everything right you might even kill em all and that is a feeling no amount of playing it safe can achieve!:aok

The only time this style of play sucs is when you have to fly a sector or more to get there.

It's a fact that ALOT of 'Win the War" land-grab types are people who basically 'flunked-out' of fighters. They tried fighters, they got their arses handed to 'em, they found they lacked the patience, aptitude, dedication, etc. to compete on a level that made it fun.

I have never not once seen or heard of a guy who was very good in fighters say, "Well, enough of this fightering, I'm going to hang-up my wings and pork stuff from now on".

Originally posted by mars01

 When I could get enough of the fighting aspect of the game, I do like to go back and do the land grab.  It is a nice change of pace and a different game.  The problem is it has been so hard to fill my jones to fight that I don't land grab.

You think if you swirl your spitty around and snap-shot a couple of guys before you die as some great success or some proof of manhood?

Originally posted by mars01
Dude if you are putting the words in peoples mouths then it doesn't count.  I never said anything of the sort.

Yes I do think it takes much more skill to fly at a disadvantage and win than the way you fly.  So we will always disagree till you come down and mix it up with the rest of us.:aok

Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+


What we are talking about here is ethics.   And your ethics are such that you will admittedly take advantage of a player who is at a gross disadvantage in a game play situation.  



You have already stated that (at least according to you) the difference between a “vulch”and a “Cherry Pick” is that if the bogey has it’s wheels on the ground it is a vulch. If the wheels are off the ground then it is a cherry pick.

Originally posted by Morpheus
A radio transaction from Zazen after he flew through a furball at mach 3.

Radio trans. (http://www.furballunderground.com/freehost/files/1/imuphere.mp3)

Originally posted by Morpheus
And after he bounces one at mach 3...

Radio Trans (http://www.furballunderground.com/freehost/files/1/you%20guys%20give%20up.mp3)

:)

Originally posted by Zazen13
I never once in a million years said I do not shoot down people who have, for whatever reason put themselves in a situation of gross disadvantage. I do, constantly, obsessively with vigor and enthusiasm.

Originally posted by Zazen13
It's bound to make them wiser in the future and therefore better opponents.

Originally posted by Zazen13
All I have ever said is I do not, under ANY circumstances, vulch people.

Originally posted by Zazen13
Once they become airborne if I happen to be in their vicinity, which is an exceedingly rare occurrence by the way, they are fair game.

One could now start to wonder what you definition of “rare” is. You have a habit of using different definitions than the rest of us.

You are by your own admission a player who preys on the weak; looks for players who are at severe disadvantage to cherry pick them, even if they are just taking off from a base. You gang bang, and you deliberately avoid knife fights or other low percentage situations.

You are identical to me, except that I will shoot you with your wheels still on the runway, and not wait the 10 seconds it takes for your wheels to leave the runway.  In my understanding of the world there is little difference between hitting a guy who just starting to roll, who is rolling, or who just got his wheels up, or has been flying for about 15 seconds, or even who has been flying for a couple of minutes but can’t get alt or speed due to having to avoid vulchers.  I call any of those and anytime I am hitting defenders at a field a vulch.  And so would most people.

The fact that I am vulching defenders who chose to up at the field at a disadvantage does not somehow make my actions honorable, or fair.  I have no honor, I am a deranged psychopath.

But I am honest enough to call myself what I am, rather than act like a scumbag, and then get on the BBS with a bunch of BS trying to justify my actions.

Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+
Like it or not by your own admissions you are a Vulcher



 

Originally posted by Zazen13
Ok Akfoder, I'm done with you. You make no sense. You define vulching however you like. I will define vulching how I like. I really don't care whether you think I vulched you even though you were airborne. If it makes you feel better about it to say I vulched you then you go for it buddy. According to my definition, the US Army Air Corp's and the RAF's I did not vulch you, and do not vulch anyone. By your definition I am vulcher, on that we can agree. As for what you do, to be honest I really could care less, if vulching planes with their wheels down makes you happy enough with AH to pay 15$ a month then good luck to you. Soooooo.....


Have A Nice Day! :aok

Zazen

Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+
The US Airforce was describing a Air to Ground kill verses a Air to Air kill, not a vulch in game play.

You use a nit pick definition to try to put yourself above others in here as if you are some sort of player with a high standard of ethics.

You can get as low as the rest of us.  And thinking hitting a guy who's wheels just came off the runway is more ethical than hitting him 2 seconds before that doesn't wash.

If that is how you cherry pick, to quote Jabba the Hut "You are my kind of scum" :)

Originally posted by SlapShot

They are called GRIEFERS ... and GRIEFERS are not covered in your post. They are anti-FUN ... they get their jollys by destroying other's fun. They don't look to what the game has to offer for fun, but rather what the game offers them to spoil someone elses fun.

There is not much that we can do about griefers ... but you can.

Take away the tools or make it real hard (to the best of your ability) to GRIEF in the FT area and this storm will subside.

Eliminate Bombers from the 3 fields.

Eliminate Troops/Ordinance from the 3 fields.

Eliminate PT Boats and their spawn points from the 3 fields.

Thats just a start ...

Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+
You are amazing at how you twist and squirm.

Most of the players will say they were vulched if they are wheels up at the base.

You know it, you know what the common understanding in this game is, you just nit pik the definition.

I vulch, you cherry pick.

But I don't act like I am some great moral player.  By all the other things you have said, you have little in the way of ethics to differentiate you from the other dweebs in this game who HO, Cherry Pick, Vulch, and Gang Bang.

You admit to gang banging, you admit to cherry picking aircraft that have just taken off of a vulched field and you admit to avoiding tough fights if possible.  I bet you even HO when no one is looking.  Although you probably call it a deflection shot.

You are certainly a pillar of sportsmanship in the AH community to which we can all stand in awe.

But you are still a decent guy, :)

Originally posted by Skuzzy
Allow me to put this to rest.  You cannot section off those three fields.  It would make getting to the fields around the center very long and ardous for everyone else playing the game.  Stop and think about it.

Originally posted by Skuzzy
Allow me to put this to rest.  You cannot section off those three fields.  It would make getting to the fields around the center very long and ardous for everyone else playing the game.  Stop and think about it.

Originally posted by Morpheus
They dont have to recode anything NB. All they have to do is take 2 minutes to go into the game and disable C47's and M3's at all three of the fields in Fighter Town. A big part of the problem would be solved.

 

Originally posted by NoBaddy
Morph...

The recoding would be required to change the reset parameters to deal with uncapturable fields. According the the God of Coad, this would be a serious pain in the nether regions.

Dale and I went round about this when I set up TT in Trinity.  Removing C-47s and M-3's from the fields would, effectively, make the fields uncapturable. While this would suit the needs of some of the players, it could also, effectively, make the terrain unresetable. The way I understand it, there really isn't a way to turn off ordinance at the fields and just removing the bombers would do nothing (can you say "suicide Tiffy's" :D). Frankly, the only really affective way, with the current system, is probably peer pressure. For that to work, the community (as a whole) would have to 'step up'. Unfortunately, the community is too large and too fragmented for this to happen, IMO. It would be nice if the 2 major factions ( the furballers and the war winners) would put aside their differences for the betterment of the game. Who knows, maybe pigs will fly tomorrow :O .

Originally posted by Zazen13
If you look under arena settings on the clipboard, there are 2 reset conditions, they are base count and airfield count. These are different values for large and small maps, they are arena settings, therefore they can be defined by modifying the settings table. I am pretty certain from what I know of special events arena settings and such that this could be changed on a whim without any coding required. All they would have to do for Donut is to make a reset able to occur by needing one less base /airfield than it does currently, that would in effect make the FT bases inconsequential as far as map reset conditions are concerned.

Zazen

Originally posted by Morpheus
See Rule #4

Originally posted by Zazen13
If you look under arena settings on the clipboard, there are 2 reset conditions, they are base count and airfield count. These are different values for large and small maps, they are arena settings, therefore they can be defined by modifying the settings table. I am pretty certain from what I know of special events arena settings and such that this could be changed on a whim without any coding required. All they would have to do for Donut is to make a reset able to occur by needing one less base /airfield than it does currently, that would in effect make the FT bases inconsequential as far as map reset conditions are concerned.

Zazen

Originally posted by NoBaddy
Dale and I went round about this when I set up TT in Trinity.  Removing C-47s and M-3's from the fields would, effectively, make the fields uncapturable. While this would suit the needs of some of the players, it could also, effectively, make the terrain unresetable. The way I understand it, there really isn't a way to turn off ordinance at the fields and just removing the bombers would do nothing (can you say "suicide Tiffy's" :D).

Originally posted by lazs2
I simply don't understand why you would go to the fighter town area of the map (especially as a rook) in a very fast plane unless you wanted nothing to do but cherry pick...

you hang with the horde and watch the fight from above and then swoop down to steal the kill from the either the good guy or the bad guy...

We don't do it because... it is boring and cheezy... not because we can't.

and... people do hunt on game preserves where the game is pretty much fat and tame.. they have the guide drive em up to the spot where the salt lick is and they get in a blind 50 yards away with their 9 power leopold scope mounted on a 7mm magnum that the guide has zeroed in for em and loaded for em...

Originally posted by lazs2
zazen...  that is all well and good that you fly all these other planes.. I fly the yak and even the tempest on occassion.  Mayber the f6f in the ct.. whatever they have.  I got to tell you... the only skill required for the fast planes is patience.  I will switch from the FM2 to the tempest and back in the space of 20 minutes.   It's not that hard.  

Originally posted by lazs2

We don't do it because... it is boring and cheezy... not because we can't


lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's

Originally posted by Morpheus
The only times I have fun flying E fighters is when I am the only friendly in 20 miles amongst a sea of red. A wingman is nice to have too. And can be just as fun. I used to fly the 51 and the 38 all the time like this. I'd try to stay faster or higher and when I turned it was because I had no other alternatives. Tuckin tail and running just wasnt ever fun. When you are alone, the faster they die, the longer you will live. If they dont die fast, that's because you aren't being agressive enough yet still retaining your advantages in E and or Alt.

Dont get it twisted. I love to E fight. Its alot of fun in the right situation. But cherry picking an already engaged con who has 2-3 and more friendlies on them is the lamest, dumbest, girliest watermelon in the game. And if Im the ganged con, and I see some pony ining for a bounce like that, I will do everything I can to pull up my nose and fill his face with lead.

But taking a 38 and going into a furball on the deck is and always will be dam good fun.

Originally posted by Morpheus
The only times I have fun flying E fighters is when I am the only friendly in 20 miles amongst a sea of red. A wingman is nice to have too. And can be just as fun. I used to fly the 51 and the 38 all the time like this. I'd try to stay faster or higher and when I turned it was because I had no other alternatives. Tuckin tail and running just wasnt ever fun. When you are alone, the faster they die, the longer you will live. If they dont die fast, that's because you aren't being agressive enough yet still retaining your advantages in E and or Alt.

Dont get it twisted. I love to E fight. Its alot of fun in the right situation. But cherry picking an already engaged con who has 2-3 and more friendlies on them is the lamest, dumbest, girliest watermelon in the game. And if Im the ganged con, and I see some pony ining for a bounce like that, I will do everything I can to pull up my nose and fill his face with lead.

But taking a 38 and going into a furball on the deck is and always will be dam good fun.

Originally posted by DipStick

So you shot AKFoder only after you asked Crambo if he needed help? :) [/B]

Originally posted by Simaril
OK, this is not a troll....really!  
Lazs, a question.

Just to see what all the fuss was about, I tried upping an FM2 in almost capped base defense. I knew it would be mostly a theoretic exercise, because 1) Those guns dont favor the weak; 2) My accuracy isnt the best; 3) that plane is so slow that the firing windows are very short.

Over that swarmed base, all i really had to do was keep looking all over and break like mad. It didnt require tons of skill (which is why I was able to do it, lol), and it didnt seem to be a superior experience. There was more adrenaline, and I had to be alert, but....didnt seem to be a higher "plane" of being. Most every craft that engaged me had to break off; the slow Ki84 made me work, but he seemed surprised that I didnt automatically overshoot into his gunsite. I pinged up several, got some assists, killed an M3 or 2.


So its fun, its different...but I dont see the superiority complex that seems to get thrown around, under the assumption that low-n-slow TnB is the only fight style worthy of the skilled. Energy fighting, team activity, picking the unwary or target fixed, base capture squad work, flying to land kills -- regardless of the different skills required, you seem to treat everyone else's style with disdain. You love the low-n-slow, which is great-- but why dis everyone else?

Just as I think taking up the best or one of the very best turnfighters in the game latching onto someone's 6 who is guarenteed to be in an inferior turning plane you know will not be able to EVER out-turn you is cheesy. That proves nothing. A Spit or your FM2 out-turns every plane in the set save possibly a well flown Zeke all day long, it's hard-coded, you have a critical advantage that really has nothing to do with your skill or talent, it's a built in characteristic of your plane.

You are going to win, it's a forgone conclusion unless he runs or manages to HO you somehow. That to me proves nothing, you have secured yourself the maximum advantage for that situation, the other fellow has no chance if he plays the turnfight game, the best way for him to kill you is to NOT play your turnfight game and use speed and firepower to kill you. This is why you strictly TnB guys have a problem with speed fighters, because they refuse to play YOUR game but instead do the only logical thing they can to kill you, use speed and firepower.

When someone like you or mars01 take up a Spit or Fm2 in your case, you hold all the cards in the turnfighting dept. an opponent has three choices: 1) turnfight you with a severe handicap in intrinsic turnrate 2) Fly the same plane as you 3) Do not turnfight with you but instead kill you in another fashion. So, basically unless everyone in the arena flies Spits you are going to get killed by people in other ways besides turnfighting (ganged, cherried, bounced etc.), it's not the other plane's fault, he's doing what he should to a slow guy in a great TnB'ing plane.

When you guys start TnB'ing in planes that don't out-turn the entire planeset I'll be impressed. Until that day all you are doing is exploiting the strength of your uber-turner to it's maximum advantage, just as I exploit my uber E-fighters to mine. I remember watching +mir in AWFR TnB'ing down low in a Fw190A8, now THAT was IMPRESSIVE

So its fun, its different...but I dont see the superiority complex that seems to get thrown around, under the assumption that low-n-slow TnB is the only fight style worthy of the skilled. Energy fighting, team activity, picking the unwary or target fixed, base capture squad work, flying to land kills -- regardless of the different skills required, you seem to treat everyone else's style with disdain. You love the low-n-slow, which is great-- but why dis everyone else?

Allow me to put this to rest. You cannot section off those three fields. It would make getting to the fields around the center very long and ardous for everyone else playing the game. Stop and think about it.

Originally posted by mars01
Nice story Sim, but there is no "superiority complex" and the assumption, "that low-n-slow TnB is the only fight style worthy of the skilled." is also incorrect.  Again putting words in peoples mouths doesn't make your point.  

Originally posted by lazs2

In a furball... it is not as zazen says at all... that is not surprising since... like you, he really doesn't know what one is...  In a furball.... If you are in say... an FM2... about half the planes turn better than you...  

Originally posted by Zazen13
I was furballing before you ever knew there was such a thing as WW2 Air Combat sims. I have been in more furballs, just in  a turnfighter than you have in any plane in your entire life I promise you that. ;) I know exactly what a furball is, and I know exactly what it takes to be successfull in one in every role. You presume far too much from your little world of contempt. ;)

Originally posted by lazs2
I said "in a furball half the planes can out turn you"..

In a furball...  obviously you have no idea what one is if you think that the entire planeset is represented in the furball in equal numbers.   Mostly it is spits.   more than half I would say in most good furballs... some hurris and... if a carrier is involved... a few zekes.... very very few FM2's despite what a simple plane they are to fly.

lazs

Originally posted by lazs2

In a real furball or... a cap that includes some spits or even niks or whatever... you are gonna get tied up...  soon as that happens... the cherry pickers will lose their timidity and come at ya..

 

and not ahve it decided by any old passer by with the ammo and the desire to do you in the bum while you are bent over the kitchen sink

Originally posted by lazs2
simar.. I don't think we are talking about the same thing.   I have noticed that a capped base you can stay alive in the FM2 or a spit or a hurri or a zeke or... whatever if.... If the cappers are timid.  If they take timid little shots at you and run back as you dodge

... snip...
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's