Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Gunthr on November 07, 2003, 12:12:19 AM
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From Drudge:
Jessica Lynch criticized military for exaggerating accounts of her rescue and recasting her ordeal as patriotic fable.... MORE.. Asked by ABCNEWS anchor Diane Sawyer if military's portrayal of rescue bothered her, Lynch said: 'Yeah, it does. It does that they used me as a way to symbolize all this stuff. Yeah, it's wrong' ... Asked how she felt about reports of her heroism: 'It hurt in a way that people would make up stories that they had no truth about. Only I would have been able to know that, because the other four people on my vehicle aren't here to tell the story. So I would have been the only one able to say, Yeah, I went down shooting. But I didn't' ... Asked about claims the military exaggerated danger of the rescue mission: 'Yeah, I don't think it happened quite like that'...
I think she's a good kid.
(http://srg2000.tripod.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/jessica.jpg)
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by ur quote i feel your trying to put down the US military..
yes propganad must be doen..
you think she has any idea of how the whole war game works?..i dont..
but i thank her very much for what she has done..i glady pay here salary
im pissed the frikn Liberal anti amercan media who wraps itself in our flag loves to plaster all over.." she said "ya its wrong"..lord knwos war is supposed to be all flowers..and us military are bad bad poeple..:rolleyes:
love
BiGB
xoxo
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by ur quote i feel your trying to put down the US military..
yes propganad must be doen..
you think she has any idea of how the whole war game works?..i dont..
but i thank her very much for what she has done..i glady pay here salary
im pissed the frikn Liberal anti amercan media who wraps itself in our flag loves to plaster all over.." she said "ya its wrong"..lord knwos war is supposed to be all flowers..and us military are bad bad poeple..
love BiGB
xoxo
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Actually, I'm a huge supporter of the military, and of the war in Iraq. I have absolutely no problem at all with propaganda during a war either - if it is done by people who know what they are doing.
But I have to call a spade a spade. The propaganda in this case was pretty transparently amateurish in my opinion. It stank from the beginning. And instead of giving America and the US Army a hero, whatever cowboy engineered the legend of Jessica Lynch gave us a black eye, subjected the Army to ridicule, and politically damaged the Commander in Chief. That pisses me off.
As far as Jessica Lynch herself is concerned, she is just a country girl - a kid. I don't think we can expect her to lie about what happened, or expect her to try to live a lie and face the media and keep up a facade. She had no business being in a combat zone anyway.
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In the words of Funked....
"I'd hit it".
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Well, duh :D
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My only comment on this is ...was she even aware of what was going on when she was rescued?
Not saying the military didn't milk it for everything they could but from what I've read she wasn't totally coherent during the rescue.
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What the heck are you talking about, people?
In a democratic country the people are souvereign and the government is the servant of the people.
The people are supposed to manipulate the government through the vote or elected representatives and the government is obligated to inform the electorate so the people can make the informed decisions.
Propaganda that involves any degree of falsity is competely contradictory to the democracy and in fact destroys democratic process by depriving the people from ability to make informed decisions.
Totalitarian regimes engage in propaganda to prevent their subjects from revolting. At least they openly espouse the idea that people are worthless, not entitled to have an opinion and should be ruled.
Of course so does our government but I would not expect of you guys to approve of it.
If you believe that the majority of the US population would not approve of some actions if it knew the truth, than maybe we should not undertake that action. After all that is what your beloved democracy and "will of majority" is all about. You may think that majority is stupid and wrong but as long as you are a for democracy, you should not act or approve of defying the peope's wishes or manipulating the people into acting contrary to their inclinations.
As for Jessica, I hope that her great looks reflect the improvement in her health.
I would have sudgested that she becomes a spokesperson for re-arming the non-combat personnel of US military with Mini-14 - which do not jam if left uncleaned. But if Mini-14 gets adopted by the military, it will promptly join the list of the "evil assault weapons" and get's banned in NYS, where it's the only legal rifle of a kind. So I will not suggest it to her.
miko
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Some call it lies, some call it propaganda, depends on the spin.
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It Sucks when you come to our country and it doesn't meet your expectations doesn't it? To bad we can't be as good as your home country.
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What the heck are you talking about, people?
In a democratic country the people are souvereign and the government is the servant of the people.
The people are supposed to manipulate the government through the vote or elected representatives and the government is obligated to inform the electorate so the people can make the informed decisions.
Propaganda that involves any degree of falsity is competely contradictory to the democracy and in fact destroys democratic process by depriving the people from ability to make informed decisions.
Totalitarian regimes engage in propaganda to prevent their subjects from revolting. At least they openly espouse the idea that people are worthless, not entitled to have an opinion and should be ruled.
Of course so does our government but I would not expect of you guys to approve of it.
If you believe that the majority of the US population would not approve of some actions if it knew the truth, than maybe we should not undertake that action. After all that is what your beloved democracy and "will of majority" is all about. You may think that majority is stupid and wrong but as long as you are a for democracy, you should not act or approve of defying the peope's wishes or manipulating the people into acting contrary to their inclinations.
As for Jessica, I hope that her great looks reflect the improvement in her health.
I would have sudgested that she becomes a spokesperson for re-arming the non-combat personnel of US military with Mini-14 - which do not jam if left uncleaned. But if Mini-14 gets adopted by the military, it will promptly join the list of the "evil assault weapons" and get's banned in NYS, where it's the only legal rifle of a kind. So I will not suggest it to her.
miko
When I say that I have no problem with propaganda , in war I am referring to the efforts to minimize problems and emphasize successes.
I'm actually referring to disinformation rather than the dictionary definition of propaganda, ie, "The systematic propagation of a doctrine or cause or of information reflecting the views and interests of those advocating such a doctrine or cause."
War is all about disinformation. Armies have engaged in disinformation during wartime from the begining of organized warfare, including psychological warfare. Its just crazy to expect the US Army to be transparent while its conducting a war.
I'm naturally against the practise of propaganda by government.
And Lynch should have maintained her rifle better. She was responsible for that. And you are correct in not recommending the mini 14 for support personnel - in effect, you could call that "shooting yourself in the foot"
:D
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And Lynch should have maintained her rifle better. She was responsible for that. And you are correct in not recommending the mini 14 for support personnel - in effect, you could call that "shooting yourself in the foot"
I place more blame on a command structure (and not just local command) that doesn't prioritize weapons maintenance (or training, or common soldier skills, etc.) for troops that will be in the line of fire from time to time but not as a main focus of their MOS. It was a cluster**** and she certainly wasn't the only soldier with a weapon jam. The whole "spin" applied to highlight the "heroics" does no favor to the soldiers whose lives are still on the line in a combat zone. All it does is help cover some senior command ass.
Charon
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well about command and training. i was a sgt squad leader i did all that it was my resoposiblity to keep then trained and up td date. Your told frm day 1 almost on keeping the weapon cleaned an doperational cuase it will save your life.. that was pounded into their heads . Sgts go thru NCO school and are trained over and over again what they are to do for the people below them. the indivdual soldier to the CO have to train theor people. Why in a desert situation some werent pushed to keeping weapons clean.
as in mini 14 -- rather have a ak47 with some kick bellybutton power and worked even though the enemy never or hardly cleaned a gun the whole time they used them. Or i would rather for samll size gun would be the M4 swat type 223, mini 14 wasnt that good as the M14 which some gals would hate to tote around.. about 15 lbs. and alsmot as tall.
As In the word "HERO" well Audey Murphy and those that went above and beyond the call of duty that is a hero. being ambushed and defending your self then being capture not a hero . many hero's left Viet Nam dead and alive and mamed they got what.. (read PS below)
J. Savage well i feel for her cause of went she went thru till she was rescued. I think the hype was done for army reasons for moral. Army PIO are newspaper inclined soldiers for the story, new papers and tv well they do it for the buck, ratings and to hell with the truth or what ever it takes to sell their stuff.. I think she knows what is what and wouldnt lie about anything . for she will have to live with it. and face the ones that did not survived that incident. Being a Pretty woman and a POW isnt what you would call a picnic. I am happy she survived and back home . to her for being there. I also would like to thank her for replying to my letter i sent telling her what i thought about it. Was niice to do that to all the mail she got.
( the only time i will salute ever for those who serve and die) those men and women that wear a Uniform I will wanted to add that too cause you dont see me do that in game.. So dont be upset if i dont give a in online game.
opinion from a Vet from the RVN era.
ps
thats right baby boomers still wont forgive ya for spitting on us you dogs
For civilians that talk out thier butt that dont know much about military except what they read cause they have a billions excuses why they didnt serve.. bite me
dumbest excuse of them all is "i dont like being told what to do" you are told what to do till the day you die for your info
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I dont believe you were in the military............. Sorry, I cant believe an officer after seeing action would type/talk like that...............
k
AoM
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I dont believe you were in the military............. Sorry, I cant believe an officer after seeing action would type/talk like that...............
office no way Sgt, and yes you can questions me on it if you want.lol as i look at my two honorable disharges on the wall you know what a 95B30 is.. talk like that...lol well what is it i said that was wrong. excpet the ps part but that was truth back then ..
The Heros part, well why should she be a hero medals (valor) above and beyond what is excpected of you as, as in what a hero means in the army , how many guys saved others lives that could of easly ran and took cover, stayed till help arrived fighting. You better look up hero , being captured and wounded is a purple heart. losing blood for your country, that she deserves and hope she was awarded one.
what you didnt like what i said about those that spit on Us returning ..
you dont like what i said about training
it must of been my opinion of the mini 14 then
or that wasnt posted to what i said. youshould clearify that post abou t not being military .. if wasnt for me then forget this post if . since it was under mine i assume it was meant for me
i would like to know what was bad..
I was and is and will always be for the USA and for which our country stands for, And will always defend all fellow soldiers and our country , reguardless of what all the countries say about us. they sure did forget that most aren speaking all german and japanese. Not all countries just the select few that forgot
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She was called a liar despite having not said a word.
Now she's being championed despite barely being conscious.
I find it funny that people are blaming military propaganda for this. I can't deny they tried to build it up, but the media took very little and ran in all directions with it. They are continuing to do so, and somehow spinning it so the military is being blamed for it. How ironic.
MiniD
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Personally i think this stuff isnt proper to talk about in a game. this is a game board and for fake war where no one dies. or gets hurt.
But i dont like posts that flame anything about the US from anyone , instead they should be thankful that they have the freedom of opinion and the right to do as they please.
Or any one that questions wether or not i served. I can Prove i did can you prove i didnt .
So lets talk games where all is not real and the worse that can happen is your tiger or plane gets pinged once and blows up.. you know the real tragic stuff most will see in their life, till they get out of school..
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I'm sure of one thing: We can't blame Jessica Lynch for this fiasco... (other than for not keeping her weapon clean)
Sarge
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The poor kid has been thrue enough
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Mini D: They are continuing to do so, and somehow spinning it so the military is being blamed for it. How ironic.
Military knew immediately after her "rescue" that she had no gunshot or stab wounds. All they had to do was say so, not let media print lies for weeks.
Military knew before they've got her that it was a retrieval, not a rescue. Military knew immediately after the operation that there was no enemy contact, no shots firedm no fire taken. All they had to do was say so, not let media print lies for weeks.
Sarge,
Mini-14 is may not be as good as M14 but it uses the same ammo as M-16, has the same low recoil and weight and is as reliable as an M14 chambered for .223 can be.
.223 is a much deadlier round at close range (<150 yards) than an AK-47 round. One fragmented M855 bullet would turn your insides to mush where 7.62x39 would punch clean through with minimum damage.
As for making tens of thousands of second-line personnel clean their weapons every night, you would get tens of people got shot by accident - as actually happened before the brass forbade such practice and took away their bullets.
miko
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Originally posted by Mini D
I can't deny they tried to build it up, but the media took very little and ran in all directions with it. They are continuing to do so, and somehow spinning it so the military is being blamed for it. How ironic.
I agree.
Originally posted by miko2d
Military knew immediately after the operation that there was no enemy contact, no shots firedm no fire taken.
Not entirely true. Support choppers ahead of the landing craft did fire on guard towers.
.....not let media print lies for weeks. .
Nice. It's the military's fault the media printed false information?
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Originally posted by miko2d
Military knew immediately after her "rescue" that she had no gunshot or stab wounds. All they had to do was say so, not let media print lies for weeks.
Like I said... it's being spun to be the military's fault... even by you. Military knew before they've got her that it was a retrieval, not a rescue. Military knew immediately after the operation that there was no enemy contact, no shots firedm no fire taken. All they had to do was say so, not let media print lies for weeks.
Second paragraph in a row that had "midia lies" in it. Second paragraph in a row where you blamed the military for it.
Like I said... ironic.
MiniD
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Military had several press-conferences during that time. They only had to say once what truth they knew about Jessika.
You damn right I am blaming military for it. I am sure they were the ones that gave the media the false information.
I bet there was no reporters persent during the "rescue" raid. How did the media learned about that raid and got hold of the IR video recording but not about any of other raids by SF?
I bet it was not a lucky guess or a crystall ball that made media attribute the Jessica exactly the same wounds that the body of Donald Walters had.
They leaked false info, than sat and watched it being spun. What's so ironic? They are liars with "plausible deniability" as long as the journalists keep shut about their sources. Noting unusual.
miko
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The only thing this whole ordeal has done is to reinforce my assertions that the media is the spawn of a Hitler/Stalin/Elton John love fest.
Its amazing that people still don't see the media for what it is, going for ratings and nothing more. You don't need truth or facts to get ratings, and people will still gobble it up like Thanksgiving leftovers.
The only thing that seperates the National Enquirer from Fox or CNN, or any other media outlet, is that the National Enquirer knows they are full of it.
-SW
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http://www.newtotalitarians.com/TheViolationOfJessicaLynch.html
It all started with an article in The Washington Post by Susan Schmidt, the resident feminist columnist (along with a male colleague). She quoted an unidentified U.S. official and reported that [10] "Pfc. Jessica Lynch, rescued Tuesday from an Iraqi hospital, fought fiercely and shot several enemy soldiers after Iraqi forces ambushed the Army's 507th Maintenance Company, firing her weapon until she ran out of ammunition...Lynch, a 19-year-old supply clerk, continued firing at Iraqis even after she sustained multiple gunshot wounds and watched several other soldiers in her unit die around her in fighting March 23, one official said...'She was fighting to the death,' the official said. 'She did not want to be taken alive.' Lynch was also stabbed when Iraqi forces closed in on her position, the official said, noting that initial intelligence reports indicated that she had been stabbed to death. No official gave any indication …, however, that Lynch's wounds had been life-threatening."
Although not identifying her sources by name, Schmidt wrote that, "Reports thus far are based on battlefield intelligence [the officials] said, which comes from monitored communications and from Iraqi sources in Nasiriyah whose reliability has yet to be assessed. Pentagon officials said they had heard 'rumors' of Lynch's heroics but had no confirmation." But such cautions did not stop the radical feminist propaganda mill onslaught in the nation's mass newspapers. They simply had to invent a hero image for the tiny soldier in the face of the embarrassing accounts that three females in the 507th had either been captured or killed. Two of these women were single mothers with toddler dependent children. How could America face the fact that the feminists, purely for career and political considerations, were responsible for orphaning these little children by sending their mothers into combat zones where death and capture were their constant companions? How, indeed. The simple defense was to override the dark side of women-in-combat by beating the media drums for the heroic little 'warrior,' Pvt. Jessica Lynch.
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Originally posted by Mighty1
It Sucks when you come to our country and it doesn't meet your expectations doesn't it? To bad we can't be as good as your home country.
I gotta say that the above statement firmly plants you in the realm of "handsomehunk".
What Miko wrote about how a democratic society is supposed to work is quite correct.
Originally posted by Sarge1
...But i dont like posts that flame anything about the US from anyone , instead they should be thankful that they have the freedom of opinion and the right to do as they please....
You see the contradiction?
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i only chose the ak47 cause you can get it with a folding stock,30 round and drum clips for it, and it dont have to be cleaned cleaned like our M16's do. Ask any one on the reciving end of a Ak 47 if it wasnt that good. rmemebr Machine guns were made for fire suppresion making the enemy duck and to take many out and to slow forward progress of the enemy..and i was taugt to clean weapon every chance i got even if under fire but not under direct fire. that is why we were trained to field strip it clean it fast and put it back together. and we also used (rubbers) to cover flash compressor to stop sand and dirt from enetering bore....lol sine rifle was more important than women to protect it from the sand. and it does have a dust cover on it to protect reciever. but if your not under fire and your sitting there knowing you are at war and can be fired upon at any moment i would clean it .. cause getting killed cleaning it and getting killed cause it jammed is still dead, So better chances field striping it and doing basic cleaning is your better bet. This was from experience in field you always have time to clean it after using it. If your alive that is.
your Weapons are you Tools of the trade neglect them and your trade suffers and people Die , well if you clean it people die but the right ones...lol come to thinnk about it the mattel toy i had the M16 full auto was jaming alot. but mostly from the magazine . I remember one time firing it it jammed and when i looked inside i had two rounds trying to go in. we adjust the spring in the clip and hit the magazine against leg or helmet to seat rounds in clip which helped till they fixed that problem..
Funny feels like in training again and teaching 09boo's the benefits of a clean weapon..lol so they should stop shaming and clean clean clean..lol
and for Furiuos that was from statements i seen on channel one actually not with anything posted in this thread.. But they say it to ruffle feathers there and piss people off i guess. but that refers to them and to the ones that flame us on TV and in Print and it just aggravates me when it is done, that what that meant, was on my mind when typing.
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I remember a time a few months ago I was ranting how her medals did many others who sacrificed for their country discredit. At that time some of BushCo's Hemorrhoids (thats right MiniD im calling you out) were chastising saying envy and other fargan bastage BS..
http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=92045
Hate to sound arrogant (not really) but looks like im right once again...
The numbskulls may be able be able to pull the wool over some 50 million americans (do not call list, yeah right. ) but Im not so easily mislead...
Hats off to the Brits at least your population hasn't been brainwashed to the degree of our warmongering nation; and keep the pressure on.. (Blair has been under the hotseat lately in the House of Commons, thanks cspan I wish our govt ran with that intensity)
If Bush does not get elected (unless another travesty, hanging chad, diebold riggable software anyone? take your pick) I got 3 to 1 odds whole bunch of skeletons and other trash will start spewing out of the white house..
Any reason the 9-11 commision still doesn't have the information or they going to stall till after election time...
My 2 cents.
Doctor YO
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well about command and training. i was a sgt squad leader i did all that it was my resoposiblity to keep then trained and up td date. Your told frm day 1 almost on keeping the weapon cleaned an doperational cuase it will save your life.. that was pounded into their heads . Sgts go thru NCO school and are trained over and over again what they are to do for the people below them. the indivdual soldier to the CO have to train theor people. Why in a desert situation some werent pushed to keeping weapons clean.
Absolutely. That's why this whole engagement started to stink for me when the first reports came out of the epidemic of jammed weapons. Something is FU, and it doesn't seem to be only at the isolated small unit level according to some of the stuff posted over at SFTT/Hackworth.com It's not unlikely that much of this "hero" spin was to cover up serious training infrastructure problems and cover Pentagon ass. You can have all the tag lines and all the black barets in the world, but without training and combat focus good people die that didn't need to die.
As I posted in the other thread on the topic:
The real story from that incident continues to go mainly uncovered -- the high percentage of jammed weapons, lack of basic CTT training and lack of solid leadership and soldier skills when it counted. It's not the soldiers fault, it is the fault of their senior commanders and command policy.
- It's telling that Pvt. Miller hadn't shot a weapon in about a year before the ambush. You're in a combat support unit granted, but obviously you are operating in a hostile envoronment and no range time before deployment? No opportunity to zero a weapon or knock the rust off markmanship? Anybody's who has been in the Army or Marines please tell me that this is not an outrage.
- The M2 .50 jammed. I wonder if there was range time to set headspace and timing? A reliable weapon once it's adjusted.
- Aside from NBC, how solid were these soldiers on CTT? How many could perfrom immediate action automatically?
- Who was riding their bellybutton to make sure the weapons were clean, dustcovers closed, barrel end capped and ready for action? Was that a priority?
- Who taught the immediate leadeship NCOs and Officers in the convoy (hell the troops of course too) how to react to an ambush? What was their security posture? How much had they trained for such events?
Here a take on our current "Two Armies of One" coddled support soldiers atmosphere. March of the Porcelain Soldiers (http://www.hackworth.com/article04032002c.html)
It does heroic soldiers who did the best with what they had to work with (training wise) no favor to ignore what appears to be serious lapses in focus. This wasn't a victory, but it does represent a chance to promote change.
Charon
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DoctorYO... you were being a tard in that thread. If you still feel that response was merrited then you are still a tard.
I've never met a single person that had the bronze star that felt they earned it. I've met plenty that criticize any metal any individual receives.
One I respect... the other I don't.
MiniD
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And one more thing, while your comments about weapon jams etc are very valid, In my opinion the real catalyst to this cluster was the baboon commander who upon getting lost decided to back track in a hostile enviroment.. This action alerted the iraqis to mobilize and then engage them..
Rule number 1 in a convoy is never stop..
Rule number 2 never backtrack..
Both rules were broken.. and as a result that commanders unit got maimed..
Hope our goverment takes a good long look at this.. you can have the best shooting soldiers on the planet and still fail if your troops cannot find the battlefield...
Rants end...
DoctorYO
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the traing part is true too. we had our annual Qualifying for m16 and pistol but no tmuch in between. the only reason i kept up with it i was part of the range NCO's and was on the MP pistol / rifle team and had lots of time on the range. Military should if anything take you out once a month and spend a weekend firing your assigned weapon and keeping it up to par and sighted in, and in the field we had a head space gauge was was told to keep it adjusted (50cal) . there is always down time even in war, and time to take care of things, that will save yours and your buddies life. In war mistakes casue people to die, when they shouldnt have to die. so if any military guys or gals read this.. rememebr when it comes to you living or dying dont let it be cause you didnt clean your weapon
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Oh yea .. She sure was cute..lol we had WACs when i was in . they werent around except for mainly nurses. and not many looked like that.. When i was asked where i wanted to go when i got back to the states i tried to go to Ft mcclellon Alabama as a MP where the Wacs had thier basic training. so i got Ft Dix instead..lol damn army..lol
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Sarge1: i only chose the ak47 cause you can get it with a folding stock,30 round and drum clips for it,
Same with Mini-14 - folding stock, 30-rd mags, even shortened barrel in GB or AC556 models that law-enforcement and correctional officers commony use.
There is also Mini-30 which is Mini-14 but chambered for AK-47 7.62x39 round. After all, it would not look good for US to arm it's military with russian weaponry.
I'd say that a Mini with it's open receiver is better than other rifles. All the sand that pours in pours out right away. Detach the mag, blow out the dirt and it's ready - just like M-14.
And you do not have high-pressure gasses blowing the dirt into every crevasse of the receiver like M-16 does.
miko
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Originally posted by DoctorYO
Any reason the 9-11 commision still doesn't have the information or they going to stall till after election time...
They need more time to think up new ways to kiss Saudi Arabia's butt.
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Tough being the press.
You print the lies the pentagon tells you and your a dumb bellybutton evil commy
You print the truth you see with your eyes and your a dumb bellybutton evil commy
The press should never have given that woman a bronze star in the first place.
They should never have staged the made for tv Jessica rescue special. Or the made for TV Shock and Awe special. Or the made for tv The war is over Carrier landing special.
The press should stop justifying thier decisions to go to war or wage that war with leaks that they can later deny.
Bad press.
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The only time in my life I've seen the press act responsibly was the morning of Sept. 11th. A few weeks later, and their focus was firmly set once again on ratings.
omg, a priest in some backwater says that gays are bad, OMG OMG. We found out some foods will kill you if you take a bite, find out what they are later tonight!
Pigs.
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But if Mini-14 gets adopted by the military, it will promptly join the list of the "evil assault weapons" and get's banned in NYS, where it's the only legal rifle of a kind. So I will not suggest it to her.
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The gas bolt on my Mini-14 would sieze tightly if allowed to seat for more than a few days without being fired due to carbon build up on the seating face of the gas bolt, even when cleaned it tended to freeze up after a few days. The running joke in the crowd I used to shoot with was the mandatory rubber mallet accessory for using for banging down on the charging lever when the action froze up.
The accuracy of my Mini-14 beyond 50 yards was a joke. Sighted with good optics it became no better. I recall at the time it supposedly had something to do with barrel length and rifling twist (1-14) and the only bullet that would maintain any sort of acceptable repeatable accuracy was the 65 grain boat tail. This problem was compounded at the time by all military surpluss being the 55 grain variety. Even then I recall 65 grain rounds grouping at something like 36 inches at 100 yards with a good scope discounting the occasional round that missed the target clean. For comparrison, my M1 Carbine could group under 12 inches at 100 yards with the old iron sights and that wide pattern usually took into account one or two rounds throwing out what tended to be a 5-6 inch group.
Apart from looking rather cool, the Mini-14 is, in my opinion, undesirable for anything greater than wall hanging.
Lots of better guns avaliable.......
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wow..my mini 14 is very accurate
36" groups at 100ydsa!!!??
no frikn way..some1 suks at shooting...
i routinenly put multiple rounds on a 12 inch iron plate at 100yds..rapid fir at that....
"this is w/ 1x red dot scope..
what other semi auot 223. american made is bettr?? bushmaster ..etc..yes m-16 variants wee...anything else?
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Mini-14 is not as accurate as M-16 due to two lugs and looser tolerances - but those also make them more reliable. The barrel is very thin and that contributes to inaccuracy while reducing weight. That's a trade-off. Mlitary could have specified heavier barrels if it wanted.
Mini-14 out fo the box shoot 3-4 MOA (inches at 100 yards). A $90 worth of home-done accurising usually reduces it to 2 moa. 3 inch groups at 150 yards is plenty accurate for this type of a weapon.
I have not bedded mine and I shoot 2"-3" groups at 30 yards - offhand through the iron sights with increased diameter apperture using rusian Wolf 55gr HP ammo. And I am not a great shot.
I participate in a forum for Mini-14 owners and that's the first I've heard about the slide assembly freezing to the gas piston - that's what you ment, right?
I would suggest first losening and retightening the gas block (torque 25-35 inch-lbs) to make sure the piston is aligned with the slide assembly. If it persists, I'd sand the inside of the slide assembly where the piston fits with fine sand-paper over a wooden dovel and than polished it with a dremel.
miko
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This was back in 92 and I didnt keep the mini very long. I sold it for about what I paid and put that money towards an Olympic Arms CAR-15 which was a far superior weapon imo.
I do have a 10/22 which is a cute little shooter :aok
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Originally posted by AKS\/\/ulfe
Its amazing that people still don't see the media for what it is, going for ratings and nothing more. You don't need truth or facts to get ratings, and people will still gobble it up like Thanksgiving leftovers.
And politicians dont? :rofl
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The military used the media to get the story they wanted out. Both are equally to blame. If there is blame left over, it's for the people who believe and lap this stuff up. Supply and demand 'ya know.
yowser
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she's cute in that redneck way :)
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I must unique...she does nothing for me at all...
All I get is a real Jerry Springer vibe off the whole thing.... :p
Tronsky
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so if "terrorists" and whole this connections are only FAKE?
all reasons of this war are FAKE right now.
Is that mean US invide other country without reason, violate human rights, international law.........
Its smell like september 1 over 60 years ago
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Originally posted by ramzey
so if "terrorists" and whole this connections are only FAKE?
all reasons of this war are FAKE right now.
Is that mean US invide other country without reason, violate human rights, international law.........
Its smell like september 1 over 60 years ago
I lived in California for Six years and am thus fairly acquinted with the somewhat skewed, passive-aggressive liberalism that pervades the atmosphere from time to time (more so during the summer months, I've found, when it seems to be more in style), but when, exactly, did it become fashionable to butcher the English language with every phrase?
Just wondering.
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She looked cuter with shorter hair. Her new hair style looks East Coast trailer trash...trying to get that Beyonce look. Cute though. Best Western Inn style !