Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Jackal1 on November 15, 2003, 12:13:37 PM
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To start with I`ve always said we will play the MA as it is set up or not play at all, and that`s the way I still look at it.
I salute anyone who has taken the time to produce a new map.
I see numerous folks, as a matter of fact the majority, singing the praises of the FesterMA. Most I have seen says that you can get in a quick fight anytime , anywhere on this map or that us strat dweebs can do our thing also.
I first saw it and said ............ well it`s deffinetly different and tryed to figure out how to approach it. I`m still working on this.
I just figured if we want to take a base , just up a field or so back, grab alt and pork the sucka. The problem with that is it don`t work. There`s too many fields so close together that it doesn`t make a differnce.
My second thought was..........OK that don`t work this is a furball map, and the furballers are due one, so I can do this thing and might learn something in the process. Sooooooo I go into furball mode. This don`t work either because basicaly all I have seen is a mass of Lalas and Niktards that you give the benefit of a doubt on the first pass not to HO and your screwing up because your about ot catch a face full.
Somebody had to say it , so I did. There is no point to this map because trying to reset is a lesson in futility. Trying to furball here will get you HOed 9 outa 10 times by a N1k or a Lala.
Once again I will say that a lot of folks say this map is the cat`s meow because of all the good fights. I have yet to see one. Looks to me like it`s either a 1 to 10 hoardefest or a HO fest of N1ks and Lalas.
Like I say we will play in the MA with the cards that`s dealt us and I applaud Fester`s hard work and effort on creating this map.
I have a couple of questions.
#1 Does anyone besides me find the gameplay boring and wirhout a point on this map?
#2 If this was meant to be the ultimate furballer map that has been so sought after and requested for early war planes and to suit the " get down in the dirt furballer" map , then why the hell is Fester flyin a 262?
:D
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Originally posted by Jackal1
I have a couple of questions.
#1 Does anyone besides me find the gameplay boring and wirhout a point on this map?
#2 If this was meant to be the ultimate furballer map that has been so sought after and requested for early war planes and to suit the " get down in the dirt furballer" map , then why the hell is Fester flyin a 262?
:D
1. Not boring. And do any maps really have a point when it comes down to it? You get 20 perks and the chance to do it all again. If those perks are that big a deal, well... if I can't say something nice, I won't say anything at all.
2. Because he's cherry picking the furballs. Try it sometime; it's a blast.
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Is it possible to wipe out enemy strat targets to push the line forward?
Maybe this is an alternative for strat player.
I don't know, I've logged a whole 15 mins. this tour.
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Originally posted by Tarmac
1. Because he's cherry picking the furballs. Try it sometime; it's a blast.
Muck your a man of astounding intelligence and depth that can put things in perspective in a heart beat.:eek:
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Is it possible to wipe out enemy strat targets to push the line forward?
Maybe this is an alternative for strat player.
I don't know, I've logged a whole 15 mins. this tour.
Muckmaw
Muck is a real strat player. I don't think very many of you're brothers have quite the same idea of strat though, which is too bad. It would be nice if the game system someday encouraged real strategic gameplay instead of steamroller tic-tac-toe.
Charon
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Never has so little been said with so many words>:cool:
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:rofl
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Ok.. we (the AoM, including Fester) were winging in 109's for quite some time yesterday...
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Originally posted by wetrat
Ok.. we (the AoM, including Fester) were winging in 109's for quite some time yesterday...
Well watermelon then I take it back! ............................. ............................. ............................. ............................. ............................. ............................. ..............and?
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Jackal...maybe u just need some more seat time in fighter if HOs are the big problem?
Not sure where folks get the assumption that the only kills come to those constantly pulling g's at 1k. All this map does is provide a high number of targets in close proximity, what you do after that is wide open.
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Originally posted by Hornet
Jackal...maybe u just need some more seat time in fighter if HOs are the big problem?
Not sure where folks get the assumption that the only kills come to those constantly pulling g's at 1k. All this map does is provide a high number of targets in close proximity, what you do after that is wide open.
A high number of targets? Maybe if you consider 10 of one side hammering 2 of the other side. Rinse and repeat!
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Originally posted by Jackal1
A high number of targets? Maybe if you consider 10 of one side hammering 2 of the other side. Rinse and repeat!
some guys see 10 enemies and think "problem", other guys see 10 and think "lunch". Guess attitude really is everything. ;)
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When I see 10 enemy planes to my 1, I think "Lunch!"
As in, "They gonna put my dog in a bun and chow down!"
:D
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yes but doesn't a maw have to work pretty hard to end up out numbered? Like do u guys post special missions for that to develop your 1 vs many skills? :)
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Originally posted by Jackal1
I just figured if we want to take a base , just up a field or so back, grab alt and pork the sucka. The problem with that is it don`t work. There`s too many fields so close together that it doesn`t make a differnce.
...
#1 Does anyone besides me find the gameplay boring and wirhout a point on this map?
#2 If this was meant to be the ultimate furballer map that has been so sought after and requested for early war planes and to suit the " get down in the dirt furballer" map , then why the hell is Fester flyin a 262?
The closeness of the fields was intentional to avoid just what you described. A couple of suicide field porkers shutting down a field, making it impossible to put up any kind of defense. On festerma, its more practical to up from nearby friendly bases to help. If you want to take a field, you have to take it and hold it.
#1, I stopped flying in the ma for a few months, festerma made the main arena fun again.
#2, There is no requirement saying you have to stay in the dirt. None saying you can't come in with a massive energy advantage. The difference is that in festerma, everything just happens much lower. Instead of climbing to 25k, theres little reason to go above 15k or so.
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Originally posted by Hornet
yes but doesn't a maw have to work pretty hard to end up out numbered? Like do u guys post special missions for that to develop your 1 vs many skills? :)
Not really.
I flew today for the first time in a while and there was only 2 squaddies up. We usually spread out on non-squad nights.
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Originally posted by Jackal1
#1 Does anyone besides me find the gameplay boring and wirhout a point on this map?
#2 If this was meant to be the ultimate furballer map that has been so sought after and requested for early war planes and to suit the " get down in the dirt furballer" map , then why the hell is Fester flyin a 262?
Yes, Jackal. I agree with #1. My own analogy is a Chess game without Kings on the board. What would be the point? It also goes further away from REAL in attempt to get closer to FUN, but as I've said before (several times) there's a limit to how far we can move away from REAL and still be moving closer to FUN. For guys like you, me, MiniD etc. that point has been passed. But we have to remember that flat rate games have to operate on a "bums on seats" basis. The game needs to cater to the masses, and regrettably there is a large swathe of the masses who want nothing more than to pummel a fire button and make stuff go BOOM.
As for #2, I posted before about the furballers pining for arena parameters which would supposedly make the game better for the early war planes. But when you go and look at the stats for those guys, don't be surprised if they get MOST of their kills in planes like the LA7 and P51.
Much to his credit, Cit/Fester is now asking what he can do to encourage buff runs on HQ. Apparently he took on board the comments that I and others made about HQ being too deep behind enemy lines for an HQ buff run to succeed, and is now giving consideration to locating HQ in a position which might encourage more buff runs. That is good. Fester.
But I had to laugh the first time I flew this map, to the echo of the furballers proclaiming this map as an early war plane paradise. But oh! I wasn't alone in observing wall to wall LA7s. Well there's a big freaking surprise. :rolleyes:
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well yes beetle it is just like chess without kings.... if the chess pieces all moved in 3 dimensions and were armed with machine guns and/or cannon and they all could move anytime they wanted and could start from any spot on the board they wanted that was their teams and if there were 3 teams instead of two and each piece had a different flight model and each piece had a different damage model and the pieces could be damaged and still escape and... you were still in the game even if an oppossing piece was on the same square and each piece was controlled by a different player and there were upwards to 500 different pieces and...well .... a bunch of other stuff...
other than that it is just like chess with or without kings. Most of us have to stop and let go of our ch jstick and throttle to scratch our heads and say.... "Hmmm let me see.. am I playing AH or chess right now?".... the sounds of explosions are usuallyu the first clue for a lot of us.
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
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Originally posted by Jackal1
#1 Does anyone besides me find the gameplay boring and wirhout a point on this map?
Perhaps if you find this question familiar and are actually bored on FesterMA, might i suggest that you try a different game?? One that does not involve fighter tactics, squad tactics, or individual tactics in a WW2 fighter.. Civilizations comes to mind. Risk is another good game for land domination. LMAO To be in a flight sim game based on WW2 dogfighting, and not like to fly and fight?? Find it boring?? lmao Wow dudes, just when I thought I had read it all. And to think peps are comparing these whines to legitimate whines made about pizza.
k
AoM
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Strat guys can get pretty much their same gameplay (as any other map) along the coastlines of Fester's map...not bad at all.
The middle of the map is one big Mindanao A44.
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My heart was also filled with joy and anticipation when I saw the promise of a early war plane MA map.
After I got the taste for the "not-so-super" planes, I've said to myself that I'll have to live with all the über planes whirling around. Not whine about it, just deal with it.
Forgive me, for I am about to sin.
I flew to a fight that looked promising. When I got there and the dots turned from black to red, the letters "l", "a" and the number "7" appeared in ludicrous abundance.
I wept.
I admit it, I'm just terribly bored with the lala. They say: "If you cant beat 'em, join 'em". I can't bring myself to up a lala anymore. It just feels so... common, boring. I fear the sense of loneliness I would feel as a lala driver in a sea of lala's. See me! notice me!
No
It's better to be beaten by a lala in a crappy plane than to up one.
Yes, this is a whine.
A hopeless whine.
"When I was young I thought the world revolved around me, I was wrong!" -Bono
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Originally posted by lazs2
well yes beetle it is just like chess without kings.... if the chess pieces all moved in 3 dimensions and were armed with machine guns and/or cannon and they all could move anytime they wanted and could start from any spot on the board they wanted that was their teams and if there were 3 teams instead of two and each piece had a different flight model and each piece had a different damage model and the pieces could be damaged and still escape and... you were still in the game even if an oppossing piece was on the same square and each piece was controlled by a different player and there were upwards to 500 different pieces and...well .... a bunch of other stuff...
other than that it is just like chess with or without kings. Most of us have to stop and let go of our ch jstick and throttle to scratch our heads and say.... "Hmmm let me see.. am I playing AH or chess right now?".... the sounds of explosions are usuallyu the first clue for a lot of us.
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
Lazs - you need to look up "analogy".
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go to the coastlines strat dweebs
the only way to reset a country on festerma is to go up the flank and dont stop.
the center is designed to fold in on itself and sucker any country that tries taking over the center to be fighting both countries at once.
strat targets are all flaking zones
as for strat, ive seen more buffs on festerma than any other map.
hell ive even been flying buffs from the 10k a21 field regularly since i only have to climb to 15k and I can do a bomb run on 2 nearby enemy cities within 75 miles or less and tons of factories.
stop whining and start seeing what works
pathetic field porkers dont know what to do with themselves with all these bases to fly from they are having trouble ruining the fun.
oh but wait
guess what
u have to kill the city and the fuel factory now and they are within range,
and then pork the fuel so it dosnt come back up in half an hour
then you can pork every bases fuel in the area.
but you cant do it alone you need to work together with other players to do such a task..
omg teamwork????
*gasp*
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Too defensive Fester.
If everything about the map that was posted in the first post was true. It still would just be a nice alternative to maps that are the absolute oposite and in the majority. If its impossible to make a perfect map then lets at least have diversity.
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"1. a similarity between like features of two things, on which a comparison may be based: the analogy between the heart and a pump. "
I see nothing analogous between the AH MA and chess. I believe my previous post was pointing out why.
lazs
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Thank god you said Citabria. I didnt want to type that much, but was thinking the same thing.
This map is brilliant in that it is playable for every aspect this game has to offer. All it needs is a Tiger Town and this map would have it all.
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Originally posted by lazs2
I see nothing analogous between the AH MA and chess. I believe my previous post was pointing out why.
lazs
Read Jackal's original post again. It wasn't about the MA as such. The MA can be a very different place according to which map is up, as we both well know. Jackal's post was about gameplay on one particular map.
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ok... so now I really am lost. if AH is nothing like chess then how is AH gameplay like chess ... with or without kings?
oh wait.. i get it.. AH would be like chess without kings if chess kept stats on kills per death and hit percentage and all that other stuff if... nobody cared who won a chess game. plus all that other stuff I mentioned before.
lazs
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It isn't! That was an analogy. I believe Jackal was alluding to the futility of the gameplay he had seen - kind of like what I said in the first place. ;)
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Fester hit the nail on the head. Don't complain about there being no strat opportunity just because the same-old tricks don't work in the same way.
The same old tricks not working is the strat opportunity. If you are a true strat monger, you'd totally love it - a new challenge.
Or you can complain about how boring chess is because you can't jump multiple times and the pieces don't stack, like in checkers.
As for late model vs. early model planes: the furball is the great equalizer. Tooling around in my trusty FM2, I lick my chops at the sight of a half dozen LA7s turning low with a couple of friendlys. On the other hand, I roll my eyes and wonder why I should bother with a flock of twenty Typhoons/190s/P51Ds coming in at 15K to pork a base and either crash or run like hell.
Late model planes are far, far more unballancing on AKDesert than on FesterMA.
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Originally posted by Samiam
Late model planes are far, far more unballancing on AKDesert than on FesterMA.
Well, that happens when people get in different planes..
It can't get very unbalanced when it's la7 vs la7 :p
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well this is confusing.... I don't think it is possible to win a chess game without kings nor is it possible to achieve personal goals... It is possible to do both in the fester map.... plus all those other things I mentioned.
maybe you meant that you sit down for both?
lazs
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Originally posted by lazs2
well this is confusing.... I don't think it is possible to win a chess game without kings nor is it possible to achieve personal goals... It is possible to do both in the fester map.... plus all those other things I mentioned.
maybe you meant that you sit down for both?
lazs
I'll give you one thing.. you really are the master troll. :p
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Originally posted by lazs2
I don't think it is possible to win a chess game without kings nor is it possible to achieve personal goals... It is possible to do both in the fester map.... plus all those other things I mentioned.
Oh yeah? you can win a Chess game without Kings on the Fester map?
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blah blah...lets be blunt here.
Jackal claims FesterMA is a failure because he tried to play air-to-air on the "furball map" and failed. Is that really any sort of argument? Is this really the maps problem? The real question is, has Jackal had any success furballing on any map?
All this whining about maps, I see the guys who are fighter guys getting their fights on most every map, and I see guys I know are good buffers hitting their targets on FesterMA just fine.
As much as the "strat" guys emphasize planning, patience and coordination -- the buffs who get busted up are the idiots who come in low, alone, down the most likely path of attack, with no escort, and bad gunners.
They deserve the beatdown just like every idiot in a fighter who strings 2, 3, 4 tactical no-nos together.
Face it, the map whines protect more egos here than they ruin anyones gameplay.
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i hope to address the needs of the strat dweebs in a new map as well as the furball dweebs.
but for now with festerma averaging over 600+ people a night at prime time. well thats a good sign people are having fun.
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is this on sundays? That's just rook's 'Bring your Kid to Work' day, it don't count..
Plus i've seen those kinda numbers on trinity and pizza.
It's a good map, but one can only battle hoards of la7s so long before it becomes.. erm.. dull.
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Originally posted by Citabria
omg teamwork????
*gasp*
Standing Ovation,,
you drove the nail home in 1 shot Fester wtg
I personally love this map for 1 reason alone it totally confuses most people. Including myself
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Originally posted by Hornet
Jackal claims FesterMA is a failure because he tried to play air-to-air on the "furball map" and failed.
Hold the phone there Marie! I damn sure didn`t say FesterMA was a failure, far from it. On the second point, I don`t call Lalas and N1ks in droves having a HO fest air-to-air. Maybe you, but not me. :D
There`s an observation from my point of view, simply put, an opinion, and 2 questions, nothing more.
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Originally posted by lazs2
ok... so now I really am lost.
lazs
Now aint that a real news flash.:D
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lmfao..
i really wan tto cuss at any1 who says this map sucks...
i fly any plane in here,,,churri to typ..
and get all sorts of kills..
its a bueatiful map..
and 262's?!! hell thsi is the best map for it..how else do u kill ftrs in a ajet unl;ess they furballn?
and ..Muck i find ur lack of faith disturbing..as D. Vader says it..
Strat aALWAYS will play a part in this game....
you want long term strat?? then u flattn factoires..
you want short term strat?? u lazer bom airfileds...
Am i wrong??...no..im not:)
and btw..i fly a churrican/typ in there often..you can FLY ANY PlANE in here and kill....and its sweet..crap..i hear u gusy complaing about this map..seriuosly..i want u to leave and die
Love
BiGB
xxoxo
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Originally posted by Rutilant
It's a good map, but one can only battle hoards of la7s so long before it becomes.. erm.. dull.
Hehe, now you know why I li.. er, appreciate the pizza map. Because it provides adequate field spacing and the altitude gets planes like the Lala out of their comfort zone. Fuel porkage missions get boring quickly, so instead of doing that the porkers whine on the BBS - waaah, no fights, waaah - more than 5 minutes to the nearest enemy base...
Hordes of LA7s, huh? Y'all do remember that the LA7 hordes was exactly what I predicted if the fields were moved too close together? Yep, and LA7 opportunist hordes are what we seem to have ended up with.
I don't blame Fester's map, and indeed I applaud him for wanting to make it more interesting for the strat guys. The difficulty is in working around the hordes of people who engage in gameplay based on numerical supremacy and/or opportunism.
I've just read some old laments about gameplay. This thread (http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=86416) by Hazed makes intersting reading 6 months down the line. The somewhat lamentable gameplay being discussed within could only be made worse by moving the fields closer together, which is why I was always against it.
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But.. butbut.. lazs said it would work.. that means it will.. right?
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Originally posted by Rutilant
But.. butbut.. lazs said it would work.. that means it will.. right?
Absolutely! No doubt about it...........and Britney aint knockin boots and Madonna don`t fool around.:D
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Yeah because there are only Niki and La7 hords on Fester map.
The LA7 and Niki are very effective planes on any map. Quit crying about the planes. If your a good pilot you can fly and fight anything, if your not you can cry about it. God La7s and Nikis are easy kills.
The horde mentality is on every map. The team with the numbers is always going to come in hords. The team with the least amount of people will always be overwhelmed. The maps have very little to do with altering this fact.
The one thing some other maps do is reduce the ability to furball, while every other aspect of the game is kept in tact. Fester map is one of a few maps that has encompased all facets of the game.
Also, next time your on look to see how many people are furballing in the middle, then go to another city on the coast and pork it. lol
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I don't mind niks or la's much... at least they will fight, especialy the niks... I also see hurris and spits and F6F's and 190's and typhies and p38's and all sorts of different planes... not a lot of 109's but.... who cares? lots of spits but I like to see spits.... they will fight. Still see pee 51's and deee 9's taking sissy little kicks at the furball... flights of fluffs at 2 or 3K...
seems to be working out about how I thought/said it would... more choice... more players having more fun.... new guys staying longer... bigger numbers. More choice more action..
lazs
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and jakal... if you don't admit to being lost by one of beetles post then you are a liar.
beetle... ya still have me confused with your analodgy... it seems that if you can win, both on a personal level and overall, on the fester map but you can't win in a chess game with no kings then the two are not analogous... that and all the other things I mentioned of course.
lazs
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Originally posted by mars01
Yeah because there are only Niki and La7 hords on Fester map.
The LA7 and Niki are very effective planes on any map. Quit crying about the planes. If your a good pilot you can fly and fight anything, if your not you can cry about it. God La7s and Nikis are easy kills.
The horde mentality is on every map. The team with the numbers is always going to come in hords. The team with the least amount of people will always be overwhelmed. The maps have very little to do with altering this fact.
The one thing some other maps do is reduce the ability to furball, while every other aspect of the game is kept in tact. Fester map is one of a few maps that has encompased all facets of the game.
Also, next time your on look to see how many people are furballing in the middle, then go to another city on the coast and pork it. lol
I don't really give a flyin fediddle which planes i come across, it's just when i ONLY come across those planes it gets BORING..
But i've said it before, the only people that defend N1Ks or La7s are the ones that fly em, and 99% of the time it's true.
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People..
If festers map was perfect..
No one would complain..
But the fact that it caters strictly to furballers makes it imperfect.
Simple enough?
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The point is that FesterMA doesn't just cater to furballers.
The fact that the strat folks can't get their brains around a different challenge doesn't equate to no strat.
And this is just my personal experience, but I've found more equitable fights at a wider variety of altitudes in the last four days on FesterMA than in the whole previous month.
And there seems to be a whole lot more bombers around and they are more likely to have escorts. Or maybe it's just that I can actually find them and get to them without a 30min yawner of a flight.
Any argument that FesterMA is a furballers-only map that includes whining about the fact that you can't milkrun your way between dot-dar coverage unescorted and laser-bomb cities without being accosted isn't going to stand up in these forums.
Actually, FesterMA is a fine map for milkrunnig. Just do it offline. It's the same challenge and you save $15/mo.
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Originally posted by lazs2
beetle... ya still have me confused with your analodgy... it seems that if you can win, both on a personal level and overall, on the fester map but you can't win in a chess game with no kings then the two are not analogous... that and all the other things I mentioned of course.
lazs
Yeah? Well tell me then. How do you know when you have won? What momentous event trumpets your victory? Getting a kill? The guy you just killed is already back up with a full clip before the smoke has dissipated. In Chess terms, I'd equate that to taking a piece. Momentary gratification, maybe. Checkmate? Hardly.
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Isn't it the furballers that can't get thier ADD fogged brains around a longer than 5 minute flight on maps other than festerma?
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But i've said it before, the only people that defend N1Ks or La7s are the ones that fly em, and 99% of the time it's true.
Not in this case Rut. I do fly the LA7. Most of the time when I am tired of rooks coming in at 25k diving on the base at 500+ mph killing fuel then running like the strat porker potatos they are. What shoud I up? Hmmmm f4f maybe yeah that'l catch em.
Or hmmmm lets see, since I am a knight and usually out numbered, yeah I'll fly an la7.
Or let see, hmmm when losers pork fuel down to 25% yeah I'll up a Niki.
But if you check my stats I fly majority; La7s, Spits, F4us, 190s, some 109s, Typhoons, 51s etal. whatever Im in the mood for or the situation demands.
But my earlier comment still stands.
I don't really give a flyin fediddle which planes i come across, it's just when i ONLY come across those planes it gets BORING..
Yeah it only happens on Fester map lolh
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Gimme a ring sometime, i'll pork yer base with the utmost of glee from my 15k buffs :)
Oh, and.. Just 'cuz they don't play your way by leavin your fuel up, doesn't mean they're losers ;)
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beetle... it is not possible to win a chess game without kings... it is possible to "win" the fester map... reset is possible. If you can "win" on the other maps you can "win" on the fester map... so.... where is the analodgy?
course for me... a night of having fun is considered a "win" but I'm just peculiar that way.
lazs
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Oh, and.. Just 'cuz they don't play your way by leavin your fuel up, doesn't mean they're losers
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
LoL
No problem on the buffs, I love killing Buff formations. Bring em up any time!!!
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Originally posted by lazs2
beetle... it is not possible to win a chess game without kings... it is possible to "win" the fester map... reset is possible.
No it's not, not if everyone flies like you it's not, because no buildings would be battled and the toolsheds would remain intact. If you had your way, bombs would be perked and the field capture movement would be killed off forever. And after all, it is for those players that Fester designed his map in its current form - the folks who want an instant gratification kwikfix, and have no interest in strat. Which makes me wonder why there are so many fields on the map. Three would be enough for the way you play, and want everyone else to play.
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so beetle.... you are saying that....
given a choice people will have fun and not fly they way you like even if it is possible to do so? That the only way that people will fly the way you want them too is if they are forced to by having a map where the option to have fun is removed?
reset is possible but people are too busy having fun! this is criminal! Remove all choice imediately before people become to accustomed to it!
lazs
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Originally posted by lazs2
so beetle.... you are saying that....
given a choice people will have fun and not fly they way you like even if it is possible to do so? That the only way that people will fly the way you want them too is if they are forced to by having a map where the option to have fun is removed?
reset is possible but people are too busy having fun! this is criminal! Remove all choice imediately before people become to accustomed to it!
lazs
ROFL! Erm, not quite. I think we have stumbled upon a fundamental truism of Flightsim gaming. What is one person's idea of fun might not appeal to the next man, and vice-versa. Remember, it was you who wanted to have the game changed to favour the way you play and want everyone else to play, it was you who wanted to have bombs perked to prevent the antics of the suicide fuel porker. SFP is the antithesis of your good self in this game, and you wanted to see him eliminated because the way he played did not accord with your furball agenda.
...plus everything else you've said!
:D
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Originally posted by beet1e
If you had your way, bombs would be perked and the field capture movement would be killed off forever.
I've never once seen Lazs or anybody else state that they want to eliminate the strat game.
Just my interpretation, but I hear the strat guys saying,
"I just want to play my game the way I want to play it and I don't care if the furballers are all complaining 'caus they're never happy and they don't get what the MA is for anyway."
I hear the furballers saying,
"I just want to find a good fight quickly. The strat guys can knock themselves out, but I do have a problem if one suicide tiffie can spoil my fun for the night."
Play my way or Suffer vs. Live and Let Live.
But Rude is right, it's and endless debate. Kudos to Fester for trying to strike a good balance. (I think he already has, but what do I know).
Originally posted by Rutilant
Oh, and.. Just 'cuz they don't play your way by leavin your fuel up, doesn't mean they're losers.
Actually, porking fuel all over the map so that you can avoid any actuall A2A combat may just be the definition of the word loser. :D
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Originally posted by lazs2
and jakal... if you don't admit to being lost by one of beetles post then you are a liar.
lazs
Well Humpy.errr Liz, I don`t admit to it because I`m not, but I do believe you said you are. Seems like that little comprehension prob flaring up on you again. Guess you calling me a liar , HUH?:D
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Originally posted by Rutilant
is this on sundays? That's just rook's 'Bring your Kid to Work' day, it don't count..
Plus i've seen those kinda numbers on trinity and pizza.
It's a good map, but one can only battle hoards of la7s so long before it becomes.. erm.. dull.
sunday 9:30 pm est 650 people online
monday 9:30pm est 600 people online
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Furballers have to adapt on maps such as pizza(DIE DIE DIE). Whats wrong w/ you strat dudes? How can i be all that different? Up a bomber, get alt, bomb... Sounds simple to me. Seems to me that since 3-4 fekers cant pork all the fuel around and force defenders to fly 75miles for a fight is the only problem here for some. It seems that I have just not seen a good arguement in this thread as to why FesterMA isnt a good strat map.
La7/niki hordes? That dont last long a AoM horde around. 8)
O, and furballers dont have contempt for strat guys. Most furballers have been on the 'strat' wagon and know they are just plain better than that now..
k
AoM
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Let's give it a chance. I played today and last night on the Fester map. It was OK. I had a good time. :) But flippin' eck, those cons appear from nowhere!
I don't think Cit/Fester is the type of guy to implement a map that ordains one kind of play style and discourages all others. He's looking at the strat angle, and I think improvements will continue to be made.
For one week in five, I can be a furballer. ;) Let's keep all the maps.
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Except for mindy, SFMA, and baltic ;)
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Originally posted by Jackal1
I just figured if we want to take a base , just up a field or so back, grab alt and pork the sucka. The problem with that is it don`t work. There`s too many fields so close together that it doesn`t make a differnce.
This is one of the very best features of festerma.
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You mean the part about strat not working and being useless on this furball-centric map?
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Strat players are those who attacking the resupply system in proper sequence. The airfields are the least significant part of the strategic system.
Primary Target #1 is the City which resupplies the
Secondary target which are the Facilities which resupplies
the last significant Strat which are the fields.
http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html
http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html#targets
Field porkers aren't Strat players, they are ignoring almost the entire Strat system. So sure "it isn't working" for em - it isn't supposed to!
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zanth i dont agree..
hittinh-porking an airfiled is strat..its short term strat
long term is ..fuel factory-city..ect...
becuase if u say porking fuel isnt ..especially rear bases ..ur wrong..
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Originally posted by Rutilant
Except for mindy, SFMA, and baltic ;)
Naah! We have to agree to keep those, so they'll let us have a week of Pizza!
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Guy hitting as many fuel as he before he dies can calling himself a Strat player is like a 30k cherry picker calling himself a furballer.
The Field porker gets his fun from pissing off as many people as possible. A Strategic player, as the term strategy would imply, is working the map.
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Originally posted by Zanth
Strat players are those who attacking the resupply system in proper sequence. The airfields are the least significant part of the strategic system.
Primary Target #1 is the City which resupplies the
Secondary target which are the Facilities which resupplies
the last significant Strat which are the fields.
http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html
http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html#targets
Field porkers aren't Strat players, they are ignoring almost the entire Strat system. So sure "it isn't working" for em - it isn't supposed to!
Yeah, that's all fine and stuff, but hitting factories is too much work for mostly un-noticable gain. Ask anyone and they'll tell you, unless they're in a goon resupplying the HQ, a strat target at 0% makes little, if any, difference to them.
That, and we can pork the resupply all we want, but it won't do jack if the things it resupplies doesn't need to be resupplied!
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oh... i get it.... no body will notice you if you don't get to pork the fuel?
lazs
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Originally posted by Rutilant
Yeah, that's all fine and stuff, but hitting factories is too much work for mostly un-noticable gain. Ask anyone and they'll tell you, unless they're in a goon resupplying the HQ, a strat target at 0% makes little, if any, difference to them.
and you guys say *furballers* have ADD!
why should you care about the effects, or lack thereof, on others as long as you get points for a successful drop and rtb?
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'cuz i don't fly for rank, or points?
Edit - And yes, i still believe they have ADD. :)
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Originally posted by Rutilant
'cuz i don't fly for rank, or points?
Edit - And yes, i still believe they have ADD. :)
so if you can't pork something within 15 mins....
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right on the money shane... If they can't get their attention fix in a very short time with very little effort then they want the map to help them by focusing all the good gameplay on a very few spots...
that way... they can talentlessly pork those few spots and .... by gawd.... people will notice them then!
with a lot of close fields people will simply go to the next good place to play when the strat guys have crapped in the sandbox.
lazs
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Huh? Where'd anyone say anything about too long of flights to.. pork?
All i hear are whines about fields not being within walking distance.
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Originally posted by lazs2
right on the money shane... If they can't get their attention fix in a very short time with very little effort then they want the map to help them by focusing all the good gameplay on a very few spots...
that way... they can talentlessly pork those few spots and .... by gawd.... people will notice them then!
with a lot of close fields people will simply go to the next good place to play when the strat guys have crapped in the sandbox.
lazs
Here, lemme borrow this.
"If they can't get thier furball fix within 5 minutes with very little effort, then they want the map to help them (i.e. fields closer) by kicking out the whole aspect of war to play airquake.
That way, they can talentlessly furball to get thier kills in lights and, by gawd, people will notice them!
With a lot of fields closer, we get to negate any strat."
I'll say it again..
Pot, Kettle, kiss my shiny metal arse. :)
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Originally posted by Rutilant
Huh? Where'd anyone say anything about too long of flights to.. pork?
All i hear are whines about fields not being within walking distance.
care to clarify this, then?
Originally posted by Rutilant
Hitting factories is too much work for mostly un-noticable gain.
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It's true, too. :)
You can pork every factory and city down to 0% and it makes no difference in how stuff goes, besides a few minutes.
But, despite this, i routinely make 45 minute bombruns to strat targets 4 sectors behind the front line because.. It's fun to see stuff go boom.
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Originally posted by Rutilant
But, despite this, i routinely make 45 minute bombruns to strat targets 4 sectors behind the front line because.. It's fun to see stuff go boom.
and this relates to this?
Originally posted by Rutilant
'cuz i don't fly for rank, or points?
you know you can have quicker flight times, see stuff go boom and live up to the above assertion by.....
flying offline.
and you can pretend the effects were enormus!! shutting down an entire map with the only 4 remaining defenders circling thier base in a fear-based luftberry!!
and that your awesome skills have made them too frightened to even consider engaging you while you pork their field under their noses!
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Originally posted by Shane
and this relates to this?
Originally posted by Rutilant
'cuz i don't fly for rank, or points?
you know you can have quicker flight times, see stuff go boom and live up to the above assertion by.....
flying offline.
and you can pretend the effects were enormus!! shutting down an entire map with the only 4 remaining defenders circling thier base in a fear-based luftberry!!
and that your awesome skills have made them too frightened to even consider engaging you while you pork their field under their noses!
I'll consider doing that when furballers do thier furballing in the DA.
AAAAAAaaaand, why would i fly offline? There's no one to intercept me or anything. It'd be milkrunning.
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Originally posted by Rutilant
AAAAAAaaaand, why would i fly offline? There's no one to intercept me or anything. It'd be milkrunning.
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But, despite this, i routinely make 45 minute bombruns to strat targets 4 sectors behind the front line because.. It's fun to see stuff go boom.
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Yeah, that's all fine and stuff, but hitting factories is too much work for mostly un-noticable gain.
soooo...
:confused:
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Don't you worry your little head trying to understand. :)
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i'm more worried the centrifrugal forces are gonna make *your* head exlode.
:eek:
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But, despite this, i routinely make 45 minute bombruns to strat targets 4 sectors behind the front line because.. It's fun to see stuff go boom.
The above sums it all up....and you seem qualified to speak to actual air to air combat?
Someday you will take off the training wheels and actually learn how to fight another aircraft....when you do, you will look back on this time of confusion and misunderstanding and come to know the error of your ways.
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They avoid questions and can't defend what they say, so they resort to personal attacks..
What i said in a previous thread, it's just takin em off thier high-n-mighty perch.
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Originally posted by Rutilant
They avoid questions and can't defend what they say, so they resort to personal attacks..
What i said in a previous thread, it's just takin em off thier high-n-mighty perch.
Stop being so sensitive.....you have the skin of a delicate flower.
It's so simple....Furballers are better looking, better educated, more intelligent and are highly competitive folks....we don't waste time defending anything in text, only in our aircraft and we do that by going on the offense.
Stop taking things of which you have no understanding and making them personal...the furballers understand that in life, yes, even those lacking in character and substance, have a place in the world....just stay out of our way and you'll be fine. :eek:
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Originally posted by Rutilant
You can pork every factory and city down to 0% and it makes no difference in how stuff goes, besides a few minutes.
You just don't understand the strat system. Hitting the City and the corresponding stratIt makes HOURS of difference.
http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html
http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html#targets
HTC's explanation of the strat system is TERRIBLY written but it is all we got. Hopefully you will get a general idea because right now you totally don't get it.
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Don't I?
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rutt said..."You can pork every factory and city down to 0% and it makes no difference in how stuff goes, besides a few minutes."
well.... either you don't understand how it works or you are not being truthful.
I believe rude has summed up the essential differenc es between noble furballers and cowardly strat guys.
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
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2.9 for attempted smoke screen + 1.0 for mentioning a lap sitter. :D
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...and Fester will have to start buying toilet paper again. :lol
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jakal...I only mentioned your lap sitter rutt (although I think you take turns) because he claimed that strat only worked for a few minutes.
lazs
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-1.09 for repetitive smoke screen attempt.
- 1.0 for confusion.
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First whine has been promptly rejected. Please come back later :aok
Morph
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Originally posted by beet1e
...and Fester will have to start buying toilet paper again. :lol
Why would he need to do that when he can use you instead:lol :rofl :rofl :lol
Morph
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Originally posted by streetstang
Why would he need to do that when he can use you instead:lol :rofl :rofl :lol
LOL - sounds like you're saying Fester has a big arse! :lol
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Nope simply stating you have a very big mouth that is backed by mere meaning less words and nothing more :)
From what I've seen, you've made the BBS your life long pursuit to be known as somthing greater than what you really are.:p Disputes over the smallest things prove to me that you are nothing less than the little boy stoking the fire then promptly running back to the corner to hide of the intelectual room of dweebs:aok
M
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Originally posted by streetstang
Nope simply stating you have a very big mouth that is backed by mere meaning less words and nothing more
Disputes over the smallest things prove to me that you are nothing less than the little boy stoking the fire then promptly running back to the corner to hide of the intelectual room of dweebs:aok
M
Hmmmm interesting:rolleyes:
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Originally posted by streetstang
First whine has been promptly rejected. Please come back later :aok
Morph
Seems like you have a lot to say.
When you figure out what it is, get back to us.
;)
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Well we sure know how you feel about this great tradity called "FesterMA"...
Its amazing what will happen when jealousy is mixed with pure stupidity...
This problem is simple really, your problem that is... If you don't like the map stop the dam whinning and make one of your own!!! There are many that dont like Pizza Map or that gawd awful thing we refer to as Big Isles. But what do we do? Yep we stfu and play of em for a week until the disapear:aok
I try not to frequent BBS too much due to the fact that it is just so cluttered with amazing amounts of BS whines about BS topics. Once in a while someone will say somthing smart and well, that makes the trip here just a little worth it. But seeing threads posted about FesterMA and the 6 pages of replies/*****ing/moans and groans... I am forced to abliege myself in saying you guys need to just get over it already and just fly the dam map. Like i said, rather than making your selves look like little babies by doing nothing but whining, go make your own map. But in the meantime, "your whine has been recorded"
M
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Originally posted by streetstang
There are many that dont like Pizza Map or that gawd awful thing we refer to as Big Isles. But what do we do? Yep we stfu and play of em for a week until the disapear:aok
M
Read the first two lines of the original post Einstein.:D
Public Service Announcement: There will be a shortage of turnips this season due to a leaky cargo hold on truck 1. :D
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EDIT- Christ save me Skuzzy