Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Axis vs Allies => Topic started by: Jester on November 19, 2003, 08:22:06 PM
-
DRIVE ON THE REICH
Time period Late 1944 early 1945. The scenario is to represent the tactical air war against the Axis Forces in the last stages of the war.
ALLIES: (ROOKS)
P-51B
P-51D
P-47D-25
P-47D-30
P-38L
Typhoon
Tempest (5 Perk Points Each) (Limited from one base in the rear)
Mosquito
Spit XIV
B-26
A-20
B-17 (From one base in the rear)
Lancaster (From one base in the rear)
C-47
All M's
Ostie
Panzer IV
GERMANS: (KNIGHTS)
Me-109G-6
ME-109G-10
Fw-190A-5
Fw-190A-8
Fw-190F-8
Fw-190D-9
Ta-152C (5 Perk Points Each) (Limited to one base near capital)
ME-110G
JU-88
C-47
ME-262 (From one back Base) (10 Perk Points Each)
AR 234 (From one back base) (5 Perk Points Each)
Me-163 (From one base near HQ) (10 Perk Points Each)
All M-s
Ostie
Panzer IV
Tiger 1 (Perked 10 points Each)
NOTES:
Map: Rhine
Fuel Burn: 1.8
Down Times: Hangars 20 min., Flak 25 min., All the rest 30 min.
Troops to capture: 15
All the rest CT Norms
DO NOT BOMB BISHOP BASES AT A1 AREA
PERKED AIRCRAFT FIELD LOCATIONS
B-17G.............................A3
LANCASTER.................... .A3
TEMPEST...................... ...A71
TA-152C..........................A6
ME-262............................A10
AR-234............................A10
ME-163............................A2
TIGER I............................ All Axis VH's
GOOD LUCK AND GOOD HUNTING! :aok
!
Jester
CT STAFF
-
Why no Spit XIV?
-
agreed, lose the spit9, add the 14. 14's were much more prevalent by this time.
but then i guess the great unwashed masses need thier crutch.
-
Before you guys get your knickers in a twist - that was a misprint on my part. There will be no Spit IX just the Spit XIV. Sorry to send everyone running for the antacid. :D
Originally posted by Shane
but then i guess the great unwashed masses need thier crutch.
:rolleyes:
-
Thanks
-
No P51B?
-
Are you going to reset everyones perks this time? Please don't! Again I request modification of the CT maps for airstarts with Bombers. 10K airstarts for buffs from limited rear area bases. That way people start using them often enough. It is no fun being in the CT when the NME is busy climbing out 100 miles behind lines for 1 hour.
-
No PTO? Blah! ETO getting boring for me :p
-
Resetting the perks makes it fair for everybody at the start. CT isnt the MA. Perk rides are only meant for some setups. I have a bunch, I dont care if its reset to 0.
-
Originally posted by Squire
Resetting the perks makes it fair for everybody at the start.
Yup.
- oldman (also: appreciate that there is no spit 9)
-
I LOVE YOU MAN :aok
-
To hell with resetting the perks. They are mine, I earned them.
With the perked planes being available at 1 base a piece. Why not do with out the perks? Give it a try for a few days.
:aok
-
Originally posted by Shane
agreed, lose the spit9, add the 14. 14's were much more prevalent by this time.
but then i guess the great unwashed masses need thier crutch.
Which is it Shaneman? Prevalence or your overwhelming concern for the "unwashed masses?" Geeze, for such a hot stick and all it sure is a shame to see you become just another luftweeniewhiner. So ... how prevalent was the A5 during this timeframe?
Oh well, since it's just a typo I guess you'll hafta dirty your diaper over other things. Yeah, we know you're up to the task.
I would say "Fly more and whine less" but you do fly often enough so just try to drop your "whine per sortie" stat. :D
Oh ... nice setup Jester.
:aok
-
Late war setup, great!
Allied, use your heavy bombers much in next week, because Lentolaivue 32 needs many targets to our Me-262's sorties!:D
-
Nice setup Jester
Just to chime in, I'm for resetting perks also.
Vote Bug
-
Originally posted by Arlo
So ... how prevalent was the A5 during this timeframe?
wanna bet the a5 would see much less use than the spit9 by a factor of... ohhh... 5?
wanna bet that even with the spit14 you're not gonna see much a5's...
however, i'd bet you'd see much more spit9's than 14's.
get your head out of your arse, seal, and you might actually be able to arp a valid point someday.
why don't *you* fly more and anklehump less? who knows, you might actually find a clue.
-
I dont aggree with the reset perk points every week thing,
Too much benifit to the guys that live in there.
-
Hey .... your whine was in the best interest of all even though a bit hasty and excited as it turns out, luftweeniewhineruberfuhrerboo tenlicker Shaneman. I don't know about everyone else but I sure appreciate your hyperactive bladder signal going off every 30 seconds or so. It's sacrifices like yours that keep both Aces High and Pampers in business. :D
-
JAZZ: Sorry, no airstarts for Bombers. The only place this has any place would be in a SEA set-up IMO. This is kinda the "Quake" mentality - no one is interested in it if you actually have to put some "effort" into flying it historically.
PERK POINTS: They will be reset to make it fair for everyone. With a little "effort" you can run them back up pretty quick. The reason for the perked planes is to limit their use - because they were fairly rare and few in number historically.
KEGGER: No P-51B model Pony as the D model had pretty well taken over by the time of this set-up. Sorry.
STORCH: No 109F with RATO till I get "THE MYSTERIOUS MISSING" ventral gun on the Boston! :p
-
Originally posted by Arlo
Hey .... your whine was in the best interest of all even though a bit hasty and excited as it turns out,
well, son, you see, if not for this, the typo would have been overlooked, then you'd have all you slobberdonkeys whining "where's the spit9?!?! it was in the setup posted!!!" we saved jester a few hassles.
sorry to disappoint you in that you're gonna have to try rides that take a little more skill than you possess. :aok
-
The record is stuck..The record is stuck..The record is stuck....The record is stuck..The record......................
-
WHACK!!!!!
-
Originally posted by Shane
well, son, you see, if not for this, the typo would have been overlooked, then you'd have all you slobberdonkeys whining "where's the spit9?!?! it was in the setup posted!!!" we saved jester a few hassles.
sorry to disappoint you in that you're gonna have to try rides that take a little more skill than you possess. :aok
Never had a problem with it. Yeah ... all your whines are beneficial. You've served the community well. There'll be a bronze statue of you wearing a diaper and holding a half a ruler "erected" in front of the HTC offices someday. :aok
-
There there were still a small # of P-51Bs in 1945, if it makes a few happy I would add it, why not? it doesn't alter the balance any. No big whup either way I suppose.
Nice setup Jester. .
-
Warloc, did a little research and seems there were still some early model Pony's around after D-Day into 1945. Seems they would most likely be C models though.
No biggie. Will add the B model Pony though I don't see why anyone would want to fly it when you got the D model. Guess so they can "Extend" faster. :D
-
Gimme my P51B ! rather fly it than a D anyday ..for you P51C
lovers ..buy IL2FB ...expansion pack is coming in Jan. with P51C
as one of the many add ons ! Storch I look forward to popping
your 109 :rofl
Love , Bolty
-
Who wound your spring up and set you loose, Storchie-poo? I haven't whined a syllable over this setup. You may be trying to sound like Shaneman but I don't think that's your road to success, fame and glory given the fact you obviously lack his autistic ability with a joystick. But, unlike Shaneman, you at least have reason for your phobia against practically any plane in the HTC collection. And you'll whine about them all given time. Shane mainly does it for attention and an excuse for the occasions he dies due to lack of SA. :D :aok
-
Originally posted by Jester
JAZZ: Sorry, no airstarts for Bombers. The only place this has any place would be in a SEA set-up IMO. This is kinda the "Quake" mentality - no one is interested in it if you actually have to put some "effort" into flying it historically.
PERK POINTS: They will be reset to make it fair for everyone. With a little "effort" you can run them back up pretty quick. The reason for the perked planes is to limit their use - because they were fairly rare and few in number historically.
Nothing Quake mentality about it. What is Quake mentality and currently in operation in the CT is the 2K dive bombing hvy bomber (JU-88s are not included in this since they have dive flaps). Why do ppl do this... well heck it takes 15 to 60 minutes to get a hvy bomber to altitude and another call it 15 to 30 min to reach target and then another 15 to 30 min to get home. At best we are talking about 45 minute turn arounds. The majority of which is spent climbing in safety (read AFK while watching TV). On the other hand they could grab a buff and fly it NOE to target in about 5 min with a 1000' to 2000' grab at the very end die almost immediately and then repeat. They could also grab a JABO and use about 10 to 15 min to kill a target, get into the furball, and RTB. Not using airstarts is causing the Quake mentality behaviour not avoiding it.
Resetting Perks is not the fairest way. What happens? The guys who fly the CT regularly get set to 0 and build back up in a day or two. Even a few hours if they are having a good day. After this point the Perk Rides start coming out. For the infrequent flyers they come back for their 1 or 2 hour stays in the CT once a week and find all their perk points are missing again and never get a chance to fly the perk rides.
I'll repeat myself on the subject of perk points.
1) Every setup should have a ride perked. Preferably 1 in each category buff/ftr/gv. Perhaps only a majority since I can't think of anything that was worth perking in the last setup.
2) The ENY/OBJ values for all aircraft should be set to MA standard and forever left alone.
3) Do these two simple things and the subject of resetting Perks becomes moot.
-
I cant believe you are even talking about reseting perk points. They are my perk points assoctiated with my account. I have very few of them but they are mine. Leave them alone and design your map so that you dont have to **** with peoples accounts to make it play ballenced.
All you are doing is taking almost any chance away for me to use a perk ride in the CT. Not just for your map but for furture maps. You wanted tones of cheap perk rides in your set up-fine. Why should I pay a price for that. Your map might absolutly suck and I wont fly it and all that will happen is I lose my perk points to your experiment.
I dont think that my perk points are available as a design criteria to every one who wants to run a set up. Leave them alone.
I think this should be a fundimental rule of the CT.
-
I'm a bit curiouswhy the 152 is perked...realistically it falls below both the spit 14 and tempest in regard to performance...certainly it is "rare" but not unbalancing...maybe perk it at 1 or 2...but not the same as a tempest. I'd also question the 163 perk value...again maybe a 1 or 2 perk ding at most givin its limitations.
Just my 2 cents...realistically you wouldnt see either 262's or 163's...or B-17's in the "tactical" war anyway. I'd love to see 163's enabled at all "large" fields in a CT map...unrealistic...probably. ..but would be fun for a week:)
-
hooray!!!
i for one support the air start for bombers. actually, i think it should just be for the allied bombers. there was not much of an axis bombing campain at this point in the war, and the allied bombing campain was the whole reason for their air corp. an air start might get alot more bombers up and sorta lead the arena into a more historical setup.
either way ill have fun, thanks
-
Pongo, as it was mentioned before, the use of perk points in the Main Arena is to limit overuse and you get a special ride because you earned it.
In the Combat Theatre, we use perk point assignments with a point reset every time to balance the arena by limiting their use based historical availability during that period. That's why for example the Spit XIV is freely available and not perked like it is in the MA. The late model Spit was widely used by that time.
Hope this makes sense to all. If you have any questions, please email any of the staff at ctstaff@hitecreations.com or me at mister_fork@hitechcreations.com. We'll be glad to answer any questions or address points and concerns you have. Jester, Brady, Sabre, Eddie and the rest strive hard to make everyone at the CT happy. :aok
-
in mr. burns' manner......
EXxxxxCEeeeeLLENnnnnT!
:D
-
Ooo, Spitfire F.Mk XIVc. My favorite WWII fighter.
-
"In the Combat Theatre, we use perk point assignments with a point reset every time to balance the arena by limiting their use based historical availability during that period. That's why for example the Spit XIV is freely available and not perked like it is in the MA. The late model Spit was widely used by that time.
"
You use perks in exaclty the same way as the MA does. If it is strictly rarity based then unperk the 262 as it wasnt rare.
-
Originally posted by Pongo
If it is strictly rarity based then unperk the 262 as it wasnt rare.
I have a sneaky suspician that you're being serious here which makes it even funnier! :aok
Get over the "I earned my perks, dammit, and I'll be damned if I'm just gonna stand by and let you abuse the perk system to keep me from flying a 262 24/7 this week because I earned it, dammit! I EARNED it!!!!!" attitude. If the staff is perking a ride and resetting the perks universally then it's probably because they don't wanna see "perk vets" fill the arena with jets (or whatever uberplane they deem a bit too much to see all of the players on one side in) from the first second the arena opens. If you earned them before, you can earn them again. Hop to it, Hop-sing! ;) :D
-
If the perked rides are available from "rear fields" only, then why perk them at all? The distance from the fight would be limiting their use enough wouldnt it?
I dont think this perk resetting system is as balancing as some of you think. I dont see where it helps people new to the CT or people who dont dont fly it regularly.
Get over the "I earned my perks, dammit, and I'll be damned if I'm just gonna stand by and let you abuse the perk system to keep me from flying a 262 24/7 this week because I earned it, dammit! I EARNED it!!!!!" attitude.
No, dont think I will get over it. Its crap, plain and simple. You get to fly some late war vs late war stuff, but they're perked, and we took away your perk points. Have fun. **** that.*
*Not a personel attack on you Jester, I just dont like the system.
-
CT Staff,
Regarding perks, perk resets, and limited plane availability, and airstarts.
I watched 4 people log in today ask wtf happened to their perks, find out, and then log out. As I pointed out earlier and true to my statement these were all the infrequent flyers. They figured rightly that they wouldn't have the time to build up their perks and get a perk plane and were disgusted by the reset.
As far as limiting the number of perk planes I flew for about 9hrs total today and saw only 4 perk planes in the sky. I was flying all of them. 3 Tempests and a 262. At no other time did I see any other perk plane on either side. I know that others had the perks at this point to fly a perk ride but no one else chose to do so. Evidently, even when people have excess perks they won't spend them on perk rides so often that there is a problem.
While you all might be convinced that your correct, again experience dictates otherwise. Naturally, I expect one of you to say "I've been a CM for and I know from experience that you are wrong". That is fine... go right ahead... never see any of you flying anyway (except EddieK 1 time) so whatever experience you might have had doesn't appear to correlate with reality anymore.
Regarding airstarts for bombers I saw a single B17 formation at 10k. 4 B26 formations at under 4K. 1 JU88 formation at 6K. The B17s and 1 of the B26 formation executed a lvl bombing run. All others dive bombed. Sorry but you can't honestly expect me to beleive that airstarts are more "Quake-like" than the dive bombing hvy bombers.
-
Arlo. there were around 2000 Me 262s made. It was not a rare plane.
What ever these guys can do what they want with "their" arena.
I wish they would leave "my" perk points alone but what do I know.
-
Are they gone for good? Or can the perk points be resurrected once the CT perk slate is wiped clean? If it's the latter then what is the staff supposed to do from this point on? Promise to never wipe out perks again and hope the disgruntled perkie collectors will come back to the CT and play? Does it even really matter (on more than an individual "I had a perkie treasure chest that went nowhere but up for the longest time and now somebody emptied it just when the free cash coulda turned me a profit!" thang)??? After all, any perks earned in a setting where perkie planes were free and losing them didn't cost ya nothing weren't really worth squat in any sense.
Did we regain our lost perks after the late Pac AAF perked P-38/perked N1K setup? They were reset then and nobody seemed to mind. If we got `em back then I missed it - I never keep track of `em.
So now we once again see a setup using the perks as an uber-ride flow control ... with a perkie reset (which keeps players who horde perks from hopping in a 262 (or a Tempest ... etc.) on their first sortie ... well damn!) and now the sky is falling!
I don't see the problem, myself. This ain't the MA. Like I said before ... perkies didn't mean squat in the past in the CT and now all of a sudden it's the end of the world for some players.
Maybe any plane that costs perks in the MA should never be used in a CT setup. Then players wouldn't be suffering so much "perkie anxiety."
Now it should be obvious that I've found my fair share of faults in various CT practices but this one sure doesn't seem like it's worth frettin' about ... much less poppin' a vein over.
*ShruG*
-
Originally posted by Pongo
Arlo. there were around 2000 Me 262s made. It was not a rare plane.
What ever these guys can do what they want with "their" arena.
I wish they would leave "my" perk points alone but what do I know.
I hate to tell ya but 2000 examples ... not all of which saw actual active combat duty .... does not qualify an aircraft model as "not rare." ;)
Did you anticipate CT perkies being worth something someday back when you were flying perkie planes for free? Didn't cost ya a thing. Wait ... you've never once lost perk plane in the CT?
If HT did away with the perkie system altogether .... in all arenas ... would you be cancelling your account the next day? All that perkie hordin' for nuthin'?
Well the good news is that HT is leaving the perkie gravytrain in the MA alone. The "bad" news is now that perkies serve a function in the CT ... it ain't quite the function you're used to.
I bet you'll get to fly a perk ride this week if you put as much energy into a half dozen sorties as you just did in this thread.
p.s. Let's have a contest to see who can find the first post asking the CT staff to start perking rides? :)
-
Two of the best things about the Combat Theater are its historical matchups and its role as a sort of focus group cutting edge innovator.
Many of the issues debated in the Main Arena often are explored in action in CT, including perks variations. This week features the midpoint of perk points starting from scratch at the beginning of the scenario.
Beginners benefit from no perks, aces benefit from max perks, and most of us are somewhere in between. So isn't it a good function of CT to more or less beta a one-week scenario that offers perking but only from the start of that week?
-
looks good jester (w00t 262 time!)
-
The perks should be left alone only if the CT is going to have every setup with perk rides. Otherwise, they should be reset every time a new setup in done. The MA has perk rides all the time, so they are not reset. Thats the MA. This is the CT.
There is no point in trying to limit certain types with perk points if everybody already has 150 of them from flying the last 3 setups with no perk rides. I could have had 30 Tempests with my current points. Or 4 a day (2 hrs or more at least?) for the whole week, and never worry about not having one to fly. Thats not limited.
-
Nail on the head, Squire.
-
Can you please give to Spit XIV light perk value of 2 perks or maybe 1.5. I can see at CT only Spit and time to time some other plane in strike mission.
This perks will not prevent from Spit to fly but at least half of your sorties you will have to do in Mustangs of Thunderbaltes.
It is suprior plane at CT, not problem with its supriority but when it is only plane allies fly it is just not fun.
-
Originally posted by artik
Can you please give to Spit XIV light perk value of 2 perks
It is suprior plane at CT, not problem with its supriority but when it is only plane allies fly it is just not fun.
(all in 109g10)
31 Kills of Spitfire Mk XIV
13 Deaths by Spitfire Mk XIV
-
Spit14 is a g10 with roundels, nothing more.
-
One of the reasons for seeing a large number of Spitfires is the planes climb and acceleration rate. Of all the Allied planes the Spitfire is the only one that can approximate the climb/acceleration abilities of a 109. Yes a P51 can climb but it doesn't accelerate well. I won't comment on the acceleration or climb rate of a Typhoon or Jug. When the fight gets close to an Allied base the Spitfire is the only reasonable choice for dealing with Hi E Hi Alt LW ACs.
-
Originally posted by scJazz
I watched 4 people log in today ask wtf happened to their perks, find out, and then log out. As I pointed out earlier and true to my statement these were all the infrequent flyers. They figured rightly that they wouldn't have the time to build up their perks and get a perk plane and were disgusted by the reset.
As far as limiting the number of perk planes I flew for about 9hrs total today and saw only 4 perk planes in the sky.
These two observations seem to confirm that resetting the perks is accomplishing it's stated goal - to make perked planes rare. It's too bad that four people left the CT, because we can always use more folks here. OTOH, it seems like they may have come in expressly to fly the perked planes. That trend, of course, would result in this setup being nothing more than a battle of the perked planes.
If you're bound and determined to fly a perked plane, it really doesn't take too long to build up the points to do it. If you're only dropping by the CT so that you can fly a perked plane....well....guess you're out of luck.
- oldman
-
Whats the point in perking planes that are available from 1 field in the rear? Either perk them and make them available from more fields or lose the perks.
-
I agree that we could use a few more bases for the perked rides to roll from. That wouldn't hurt.
-
The ppl weren't here expressly for perk rides. Each of them has flown infrequently in the CT either because they don't fly much or because they fly most of the time in the MA. Perking planes always limits use that isn't the issue. Resetting perks is the item I've been commenting on. If we do some quick math we might reasonably assume a larget impact than just 4. I was present for roughly 1/3rd of day and caught perhaps half the text buffer/logons. It may be that as many as 15 or so ppl chose not to fly and left.
-
OK, My opinion about perk points. I don't fly in the MA so I don't know what is perked and what is not. I pretty much fly only in the CT and I am at best an average player.
Through any effort I make-I earn perk points that count for nothing until we have a set up that has perked planes-then all is reset to zero. I understand the historic and plane balance issues, but I think this works best for arena balace.
For instance in this set up we have a lot of toys to choose from, if nothing was perked, the MA players could come in and grab for free the rides they usually have to buy in the MA-thereby "porking" the CT.
If we are going to rack up perk points then let's have a set up every week that features a perked ride for each side. That way the points we build will mean something, and there would be no reason for resets to the CT regulars, and anyone coming in from the MA would have to spend some time to build up the points needed to fly "the choice rides"
Yeah-I know-"tried it/didn't work", "plane balance/historical introduction into theater", "Isn't that the way the MA works?",
Yada-Yada-Yada.........Had to say it anyway :aok
-
So, support my NPA.
-
Originally posted by Pongo
Arlo. there were around 2000 Me 262s made. It was not a rare plane.
About 1430 if I recall correctly. Of which just over 100 saw active service so far as I've been able to tell. Most were never delivered or never had fuel available.
If you have better info on service numbers I'd love to see it. I have never had much luck finding good late war German service numbers. Everything always seems debatable.
Certainly the Me262 saw less service than did the Fw190D-9, even though the D-9 had just over 700 examples in its production run.
-
An enjoyable setup.:aok
When in doubt, run this one. :)
-
I really don't think "perkies" are really a big deal...I've only flown 1 hop in a 262 this setup so far. For the most part #'s have kept me on the luftwabble side of the equation (easily hardest plane set for me). I've found G-6 to be best plane in the set (for me at least)...eats ponies up and can give the spit14 a decent fight. Since I rarely get up into the strtosphere the G10 doesnt do much for me.
The biggest issue I see is the imbalance in numbers combined with the dominant allied plane set. Add in a few folks who cant tell the difference between a gangbang and a fight and I can see why some folks check in and then leave. I really dont think its all perkies...some folks see a choice between joining the horde or being gangbanged simply elect not to participate. There are a some like me that will flop to the side with the low numbers but not everyone will. I certainly recognize historical and squad allegiences are important to many...but many of the "real" squads (those with histories going back to AW/WB's in the 80's/early 90's) gladly split up and even out and gleefully beat each other to death if they cant find enough opposition.
From what I've seen in the CT a majority of the squads simply gangbang when/what they can.
azhacker
-
Here we go again...
Squads get blamed all the time for doing because we are easily recognised during a roster check. Stop blaming us for your woes.
"I've found G-6 to be best plane in the set (for me at least)...eats ponies up and can give the spit14 a decent fight."
"The biggest issue I see is the imbalance in numbers combined with the dominant allied plane set"
Ok, which is it???
"but many of the "real" squads (those with histories going back to AW/WB's in the 80's/early 90's"
Again with the squad slamming.
"From what I've seen in the CT a majority of the squads simply gangbang when/what they can"
And again...
What a whiney "I got my a** shot off in the CT so blame squads" post.
Solid 7/10, but I have seen better.
Cya.
-
After ore squadron had a duel with LLv32 at CT I can assume that really we do not need perks for Spit 14. Even it is fast spit will allways remain Spit.
Kanttori - LLv32