Aces High Bulletin Board

General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Russian on November 21, 2003, 11:44:57 AM

Title: Lock-on
Post by: Russian on November 21, 2003, 11:44:57 AM
FYI

LOCK-ON is out today in USA. UK will get their hands on LOCK-ON December 5th.

I'm going to pick up copy today. :cool: EBGames should have it. Also word on the street is that patch will be released in two weeks :aok
(http://www.lo-mac.com/ss/Carrier_Takeoff-03.jpg)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: muckmaw on November 21, 2003, 12:00:25 PM
Thanks for the heads up.

I'm going to hold off until I read some reviews from AHers.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Makarov9 on November 21, 2003, 12:04:02 PM
Will grab a copy today. Several in the 332nd Mongrels squad will be picking it up. Perhaps we can get a group of AH'ers to do some co-op missions. :)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: gofaster on November 21, 2003, 12:06:46 PM
Quote
Originally posted by muckmaw
Thanks for the heads up.

I'm going to hold off until I read some reviews from AHers.


Same here.  I've been burned with bad games before (iF-22 immediately comes to mind).
Title: Lock-on
Post by: zroostr on November 21, 2003, 12:07:29 PM
the game definitely looks amazing ;)


(http://1badjedi.freewebspace.com/0HSF/p007.jpg)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Ripsnort on November 21, 2003, 12:12:34 PM
Hell, it might be worth it just for eye candy alone!

Post your systems when you review this as well. I want to know if my Coal burning AMD 2200 with Geforce 3 will run this thing.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: 214thCavalier on November 21, 2003, 01:43:43 PM
Sure looks purdy.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 21, 2003, 02:15:46 PM
This is another Russian/French project.  No thanks.  These guys are trying to rewrite history.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: pugg666 on November 21, 2003, 03:00:44 PM
Downloading the demo now.

Sure does look good though.

a few shots that I like

A-10 locking a Maverick

(http://www.lo-mac.com/ss/A-10_Maverick_01.jpg)

a pair of fulcrums taking off in the rain

(http://www.lo-mac.com/ss/15Jan_04.jpg)

mountainous terrain

(http://www.lo-mac.com/ss/terrain_mtns1.jpg)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Charon on November 21, 2003, 03:04:45 PM
Looks sweet. Another one of those systems managment games I imagine. What's the learning curve like?

Charon
Title: Lock-on
Post by: pugg666 on November 21, 2003, 03:07:24 PM
Quote
What's the learning curve like?


dunno probably somewhere along the lines of flanker 2.5

I'll let ya know when I install the demo, only downloading at 26K though :(
Title: Lock-on
Post by: gofaster on November 21, 2003, 03:12:01 PM
Quote
Originally posted by pugg666
dunno probably somewhere along the lines of flanker 2.5

I'll let ya know when I install the demo, only downloading at 26K though :(


Yeah, let me know.  If its like the "Flanker" series, I may have to pass.  I just don't have the time to sit through it all.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Charon on November 21, 2003, 04:06:18 PM
Thanks Pugg

I always like the idea of those super complex games (the 688 type too) but have a hard time grinding them out.

Charon
Title: Lock-on
Post by: pugg666 on November 21, 2003, 07:38:29 PM
I don't know if they dumbed it down for the demo or not (probably did) but it seems pretty easy. basic radar functions, modifying the azimuth etc, bore sight mode. Haven't had much chance to try out the atg modes yet.

flight model seems pretty basic, wasn't able to stall or spin either the Mig-29 or the warthog

Load times are too long imo, but that's probably just my old slow assed hard drive.

otherwise, looks great and I get good frame rates.

and again, this is just the demo so I'm gonna wait until I get a chance to try out the full release.

might be just what your looking for Gofaster, except maybe the flight model.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: boxboy28 on November 21, 2003, 07:39:45 PM
Well i hit the Media Play and the best buy today and no one has it so its , Dang  oh well what the  going price here in the states?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: zroostr on November 21, 2003, 08:14:10 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Ripsnort
Hell, it might be worth it just for eye candy alone!

Post your systems when you review this as well. I want to know if my Coal burning AMD 2200 with Geforce 3 will run this thing.



i have an xp2100+/512ddr/R9500pro. :)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Martlet on November 21, 2003, 08:17:07 PM
Talk about your eye candy.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Dawggus on November 21, 2003, 09:22:52 PM
Hmm, level of detail is pretty amazing!  Pugg, if ya pick it up and wanna go H2H, lemme know :).

(http://www.nightmares.org/images/LOMACF15C.gif)

Cya Up!

Dawg
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Animal on November 21, 2003, 09:33:55 PM
hows the framerate, any better than the demo?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Nefarious on November 21, 2003, 10:34:23 PM
Although, I dont have all the super eye candy, IL2FB runs pretty damn good on my machine, and if it runs anything like it, I'll pick it up.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: pugg666 on November 21, 2003, 10:40:39 PM
hell yes dawg, if I can find a cheap copy of it ;) because my impression of the demo wasn't that good

just have to wait until they model a 190 A5, just to give you a fighting chance :D
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Dawggus on November 21, 2003, 11:07:35 PM
Quote
Originally posted by pugg666
just have to wait until they model a 190 A5, just to give you a fighting chance :D


Roger that Pugg.  I was looking for the 20mm's, but all I found were these things called Sparrows and Sidewinders?  Oh yeah, and a Gatlin Gun ... didn't they use those in the Civil War?  I thought this was 'Modern' air combat ;).

Cya Up!
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Fishu on November 21, 2003, 11:21:12 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
This is another Russian/French project.  No thanks.  These guys are trying to rewrite history.


Americans, besides rewriting the history in every game and movie, are also trying to rewrite the physics :>
Title: Lock-on
Post by: B17Skull12 on November 21, 2003, 11:47:35 PM
Nice!
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Chairboy on November 22, 2003, 02:02:09 AM
Quote
This is another Russian/French project. No thanks. These guys are trying to rewrite history.


Errrr....  if this was a WWII game, I suppose that would make sense....  but how could they be re-writing history for a game that takes place current day?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 22, 2003, 06:22:11 AM
heeh its out in US, in UK it gonna be in 14 days or so... so in my country it gonna be in 2 months ...


i vote for download
poor programers will not get any money, pitty


anyway Demo was quite coool

what about mutilplayer ?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Slash27 on November 22, 2003, 10:01:17 AM
Americans, besides rewriting the history in every game and movie, are also trying to rewrite the physics :>   Where's Finland?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 22, 2003, 02:52:49 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
This is another Russian/French project.  No thanks.  These guys are trying to rewrite history.


Trying to rewrite history? Are you talking about the governments or the game designers? ANd how so?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: AKcurly on November 22, 2003, 03:01:41 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Fishu
Americans, besides rewriting the history in every game and movie, are also trying to rewrite the physics :>


Oh yeah, movies that are historically accurate would be really interesting. ;)

Most of us are familiar with history ... adquately educated.  And, most of us go to movies for entertainment value.

curly
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 22, 2003, 03:11:49 PM
Quote
Originally posted by AKcurly
Oh yeah, movies that are historically accurate would be really interesting. ;)

Most of us are familiar with history ... adquately educated.  And, most of us go to movies for entertainment value.

curly


Are you saying that Independance Day, Star Wars, SwordFish and Down and Out in Beverly Hills weren't historically accurate?... Great. Now I have to reevaluate everything.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 22, 2003, 03:37:04 PM
well pork ... im not sure if any of them was historical movie...

but nice example is U-XXX (dont know that number) .. about WW2 submarine

anyway another example of entertaiment value was Farm of animals sponsored and modified by CIA (there was cool dialog on BBC, with guy from CIA, whitch used to work on that )..... what a lovely hollywood fairy-tale :D
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Martlet on November 22, 2003, 04:02:11 PM
any more screenshots?

I really didn't like IL2, it's not the same idea is it, only with jets?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: straffo on November 22, 2003, 04:07:24 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
This is another Russian/French project.  No thanks.  These guys are trying to rewrite history.


good one :aok


:rofl :rofl :rofl
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 22, 2003, 04:36:49 PM
All I'm saying is the F-15 is like 200-0 in real combat.  I'm already hearing from Lock-On community that the Mig29 dominates Online.  Those UBI guys are having a ball with this I'm shure..can you imagine, "Oui Oui we'll show those American Cowboys , Oui Oui.. pass the Goose Liver."
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Russian on November 22, 2003, 04:39:02 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Martlet
any more screenshots?

I really didn't like IL2, it's not the same idea is it, only with jets?


http://forums.frugalsworld.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=53413
Title: Lock-on
Post by: straffo on November 22, 2003, 04:55:47 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
All I'm saying is the F-15 is like 200-0 in real combat.  I'm already hearing from Lock-On community that the Mig29 dominates Online.  Those UBI guys are having a ball with this I'm shure..can you imagine, "Oui Oui we'll show those American Cowboys , Oui Oui.. pass the Goose Liver."


If you're  an AH player and still can't see the difference between on-line and IRL ...
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Gixer on November 22, 2003, 05:23:52 PM
LMAO what's the record in real life of a fighter got to do with any sort of comparison in some computer sim? Always find the detailed discussion of how a plane might be modeled in some computer sim compared to the real thing very laughable.



...-Gixer
~Hells Angels~



Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
All I'm saying is the F-15 is like 200-0 in real combat.  I'm already hearing from Lock-On community that the Mig29 dominates Online.  Those UBI guys are having a ball with this I'm shure..can you imagine, "Oui Oui we'll show those American Cowboys , Oui Oui.. pass the Goose Liver."
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 22, 2003, 05:30:10 PM
Quote
Originally posted by maslo
well pork ... im not sure if any of them was historical movie...

but nice example is U-XXX (dont know that number) .. about WW2 submarine

anyway another example of entertaiment value was Farm of animals sponsored and modified by CIA (there was cool dialog on BBC, with guy from CIA, whitch used to work on that )..... what a lovely hollywood fairy-tale :D


are you speaking of U-571 and the film adaptation of Orwell's Animal Farm? Never saw the latter but liked the book. Thought U-571 was pretty spectacular but what was up with Submarines firing torpedoes at each other while submerged? I was under the impression that WWII era subs barely had the ability to hit surface ships with their straight-running, contact and magnet-fuzed torpedoes. Here they were firing screws at each other like it was out of a Clancy Novel... Always found Mathew Maconoghey(or whatever the spelling is) to take away from the credibility of whatever movie he's in, with the exception of Dazed and Confused, of course.

Anyway, sweet.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Hristo on November 22, 2003, 05:32:20 PM
Yea, it is the Russo-French-Euro liberal conspiracy ! ;)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 22, 2003, 06:09:32 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
All I'm saying is the F-15 is like 200-0 in real combat.  I'm already hearing from Lock-On community that the Mig29 dominates Online.  Those UBI guys are having a ball with this I'm shure..can you imagine, "Oui Oui we'll show those American Cowboys , Oui Oui.. pass the Goose Liver."


Strickly IRL, I'd like to see the two pilots of equal skill and physical condition dogfight f15s and mig29s(with both planes also being in equal states of repair). I bet the kill/death ratio wouldn't be nearly as lopsided as indicated by the one improvised statistic you provided. Baring any mechanical/electronic failures from poorer Russian production standards, I'd say a late model Mig29 would be a great match for the Eagle.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: OIO on November 22, 2003, 07:00:07 PM
As far as I know only a US sub scored a sub-to-sub kill with torpedoes by catching a Jp. submarine charging their batteries in the surface.

There was no way for them to fire on a submerged vessel, unless they could see the periscope sticking out and know for a fact that its not one of theirs.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 23, 2003, 12:48:58 AM
Quote
Originally posted by OIO
As far as I know only a US sub scored a sub-to-sub kill with torpedoes by catching a Jp. submarine charging their batteries in the surface.

There was no way for them to fire on a submerged vessel, unless they could see the periscope sticking out and know for a fact that its not one of theirs.


exactly my point, and yet in the movie, they were exchanging fire like it was routine. Underwater battle among subs was simply not possible prior to sixties technology, and even then it was iffy at best.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: mrblack on November 23, 2003, 12:51:56 AM
OOPS!! Did I miss something?
Or is this the Aces High BBS?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Chairboy on November 23, 2003, 01:25:05 AM
You DID miss something, this is the O'Club.

If you stay quiet, the rest of the kids won't point and laugh as much as they do right now.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: mrblack on November 23, 2003, 01:30:39 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Chairboy
You DID miss something, this is the O'Club.

If you stay quiet, the rest of the kids won't point and laugh as much as they do right now.


You know they  have a cure for acne now:D
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 23, 2003, 03:42:08 AM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
 I'm already hearing from Lock-On community that the Mig29 dominates Online.  Those UBI guys are having a ball with this I'm shure..can you imagine, "Oui Oui we'll show those American Cowboys , Oui Oui.. pass the Goose Liver."


may be you should blame HT, coz 262 dominate AH



anyway if you realy belive, that F15 is superior compare to mig29, bring some technical parameters.... and stop crying my little doll
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Slash27 on November 23, 2003, 05:28:10 AM
as lopsided as indicated by the one improvised statistic you provided.   Its closer to 150-0 in air to air. But now there's the F22 so piss on the Mig:D
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 23, 2003, 08:06:06 AM
LOL thats cool score :D

anyway we dont fear F22,coz Fool with a tool is still fool :D

im so looking for this game .... i hope it gonna be more stable that Falcon 4.0 :)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 23, 2003, 08:56:31 AM
Have any of you followed the performance curve scandal that hit IL2?  Well sombody figured out how to extract performance curves directely from IL2.  The Russian planes had at least 20% "fluff" in them.  I read a rather long post on Lock-On's BB by a F-15 mechanic complaining about how the F-15 was modeled during beta.  He offered to help but they Eagle Dynamics didn't care.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 23, 2003, 09:11:24 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Slash27
as lopsided as indicated by the one improvised statistic you provided.   Its closer to 150-0 in air to air. But now there's the F22 so piss on the Mig:D


THere's also the su-37, the s-37 forward swept flanker variant and the mig 1.44, all designed with the f-22 in mind as a rival.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: AKS\/\/ulfe on November 23, 2003, 01:21:08 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
Have any of you followed the performance curve scandal that hit IL2?  Well sombody figured out how to extract performance curves directely from IL2.  The Russian planes had at least 20% "fluff" in them.  


Yeah, and if you actually bothered to read it - you would of noticed it was the performance of the AI planes. And that "20%" fluff number you are throwing around is greatly exagerated.

Everytime you post about FB or Lock On, you prove you don't have a clue what you're talking about.
-SW
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 23, 2003, 01:38:31 PM
OK ..OK ..AI planes only????  Why don't the German planes have this AI 20% "fluff" ??  Last time I checked the German planes can be flown by the computer ??
Title: Lock-on
Post by: AKS\/\/ulfe on November 23, 2003, 01:45:04 PM
Like I said, that 20% is a complete exageration... and its only in climb rates.

Guess what? Certain angles produce certain climb rates - it wasn't even remotely close to a scientific test... just a quick run through with one set of inputs.

In any event, it doesn't matter with the AI since its all simplified calculations.

The only planes that really matter are the human flown planes since they are the ones that are supposed to match real world data. Using anything else to show a bias is a pathetic attempt at proof. But apparently it works on the simpletons.
-SW
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 23, 2003, 01:55:49 PM
Oleg's pathetic attempt to model the P-47 is another example.  Worst cockpit of all in plane-set.  Roll pathetic, E-retention pathetic everything was secondrate on that plane.  

  It's like UBI told him, "Oui Oui- put an American plane in there so we can Milk these American cowoys."  

and then Maddox was like, "I don't want to put a Yanke plane in ..Pass the Voka."  

and then UBI was like, " Oui Oui-I understand ...but I didn't say you had to make it good..Oui Oui-Jerry Lewis is a bloated pig but I love him."
Title: Lock-on
Post by: AKS\/\/ulfe on November 23, 2003, 01:57:13 PM
Man, you really are a handsomehunk.
-SW
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Chairboy on November 23, 2003, 02:29:39 PM
That, and he only seems to know one french word, their word for yes.  This is puzzling, as I suspect the word he hears most often in a social context is 'No'.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 23, 2003, 03:38:29 PM
AKwulfie your just anrgy that you can't defend Oleg and Crew.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: AKS\/\/ulfe on November 23, 2003, 03:41:12 PM
I can't really defend a product against asinine accusations which aren't researched.
-SW
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 23, 2003, 05:04:17 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
Oleg's pathetic attempt to model the P-47 is another example.  Worst cockpit of all in plane-set.  Roll pathetic, E-retention pathetic everything was secondrate on that plane.  

  It's like UBI told him, "Oui Oui- put an American plane in there so we can Milk these American cowoys."  

and then Maddox was like, "I don't want to put a Yanke plane in ..Pass the Voka."  

and then UBI was like, " Oui Oui-I understand ...but I didn't say you had to make it good..Oui Oui-Jerry Lewis is a bloated pig but I love him."


Right or wrong, your insulting little attitude takes away from the credibility of anything you say.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Pooh21 on November 23, 2003, 06:06:22 PM
How is the Su-25?


Mig29 would give it to the f15 in the  arse in a turnfight. Thankfully IRL most migs are flown by skilless dweebs.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Slash27 on November 23, 2003, 07:00:23 PM
THere's also the su-37, the s-37 forward swept flanker variant and the mig 1.44, all designed with the f-22 in mind as a rival.

I thought the Mig 1.44 project fell apart?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 23, 2003, 07:04:43 PM
My friends the F-15 is porked.  I've been watching the Lock-on boards and am seeing posts like these:

sadly, im also having trouble with the radar. i made a custom mission with an il76, 2 mig 27s flyin low, and 2 su 27s flyin high. i was able to pick up the il76, but only after like the 3rd time of flyin the mission was i able to pick up the su27, and it was still only like 30 mi out....ive been also having trouble with the amraam. it seems that it has a very short range....i had a su 27 out run one from like 10 mi out, and i was supersonic with a height advantage...i feel like the russian aircraft got way more attention than the american aircraft sometimes.....other than this stuff, the game is so damn fun, im addicted!

when are you "slaves" going to understand that UBI and thier Russian allies are trying to screw American Flight Sim fans.  But here's the catch- Unlike Il2- there are many US Airforce personel who are familiar with those aircraft and on those boards already.  Radar tech's , mechanics and at least one F-16 pilot.  They are complaining already.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Creamo on November 23, 2003, 07:42:11 PM
Time to upgrade to the ATI card(s), wait for a patch, and a sale at Wally Word, in that order.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: AKS\/\/ulfe on November 23, 2003, 08:03:37 PM
I'm a F16 pilot.
 
   
   
   
   
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Can you verify that statement?
-SW
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Vulcan on November 23, 2003, 08:10:59 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
when are you "slaves" going to understand that UBI and thier Russian allies are trying to screw American Flight Sim fans.  But here's the catch- Unlike Il2- there are many US Airforce personel who are familiar with those aircraft and on those boards already.  Radar tech's , mechanics and at least one F-16 pilot.  They are complaining already.


Easy option... buy the competitive American product ;)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Creamo on November 23, 2003, 08:12:33 PM
Doh! good one
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Gadfly on November 23, 2003, 10:41:02 PM
"but only after like the 3rd time of flyin the mission was i able to pick up the su27, and it was still only like 30 mi out" -unnamed moron from post above.

I tend to dis-avow the knowledge of anyone that posts two or more usages of the word "like" in a single sentence, as in the example above.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: moose on November 23, 2003, 10:59:46 PM
MC I find it hard to believe you're anything other then an immature teen, or a conspiracy-theroy middle aged single adult living in the middle of the woods somewhere. Your opinion that 'they' are out to get us and screw our A/C is ridiculous and petty. Sounds like you've got a personal gripe with someone.

Oh, and about the F-15 radar - http://oldsite.simhq.com/simhq3/sims/boards/bbs/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=37;t=002200

I'm waiting to hear what Matt is gonna say bout the radar difficulty. Im sure if it proves to be inaccurate they WILL fix it.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 23, 2003, 11:07:06 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Gadfly
"but only after like the 3rd time of flyin the mission was i able to pick up the su27, and it was still only like 30 mi out" -unnamed moron from post above.

I tend to dis-avow the knowledge of anyone that posts two or more usages of the word "like" in a single sentence, as in the example above.


You're clearly not a Valley Chick.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: moose on November 23, 2003, 11:10:23 PM
btw, even if the american avionics were porked could you really pass up a sim that looked this good?

(http://www.x-plane.org/users/dylan/f-15-takeoff.jpg)

more screens here...

http://forums.ubi.com/messages/message_view-topic.asp?name=lomac_gd&id=zshme
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Mathman on November 23, 2003, 11:19:48 PM
I got LOMAC and am having fun with it.  It works better for me right out of the box than Falcon 4 and Janes F-18 did.  Gotta love the F-15 and A-10.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: gatt on November 24, 2003, 03:30:37 AM
[edited] no need to post after reading previous posts ;) [/edit]
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 24, 2003, 03:53:38 AM
LOL

HT look at that 109, your 109s are all porked :D
Title: Lock-on
Post by: moose on November 24, 2003, 07:30:28 AM
finally got lomac working last night. had some problems after installation with the system rebooting but an update of my nvidia refs fixed that

immediately got some stick time in the f-15 and couldnt find the problem they were referring to regarding the radar. maybe cuz i had alot of time in JF-15, but then again this system isnt exactly the same. who knows.

jawdropping dogfight in a thunderstorm with an su-33. i'd get on his tail and he'd dive into the clouds. visibility was NIL. aircraft was getting beaten all over the place. the turbulence was a HUGE factor. ended up losing my SA and almost crashing, then putting her into a flat spin while desperately trying to regain alt.

im gonna go practice landings in that weather. it was insane.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: kappa on November 24, 2003, 08:39:08 AM
I looked up the game to see where to buy it.. Says there are only 9 planes in it? 2 american, 1 german, 6 russian? I've seen more than that in screenies..   what gives??


k
AoM
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 24, 2003, 08:45:35 AM
The screenies that UBI are promoting are the NONFLYABLE American planes.  Again, same tricks by UBI.  They rushed in a Zeke and Ki-84 for the Japanese release of IL2.  Guess what- they put a Japanese plane on the box but never mentioned that there were no Jap objects, vehicles, armor, ships ...NOTHING.
Same old smoke and mirrors from UBI and the Axis of Evil, French-Russian simulator alliance.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: kappa on November 24, 2003, 09:00:50 AM
really? On the game bbs the F14 and F16 screenies where requested and later put up... how'd they do that??

k
AoM
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Russian on November 24, 2003, 09:03:44 AM
Quote
Originally posted by kappa
really? On the game bbs the F14 and F16 screenies where requested and later put up... how'd they do that??

k
AoM



Those are AI aircraft. Player cannot control them.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Rude on November 24, 2003, 09:05:43 AM
Quote
Originally posted by maslo
may be you should blame HT, coz 262 dominate AH



anyway if you realy belive, that F15 is superior compare to mig29, bring some technical parameters.... and stop crying my little doll


It's the pilots not the planes
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Mini D on November 24, 2003, 09:07:11 AM
So... the F4 was AI?  Damn.  I take it the Tornado was the German plane?

MiniD
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Russian on November 24, 2003, 09:09:43 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Mini D
So... the F4 was AI?  Damn.  I take it the Tornado was the German plane?

MiniD


http://www.lo-mac.com/aircraft_flyable.php

Wrong again. ;)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Russian on November 24, 2003, 09:12:48 AM
(http://pages.sbcglobal.net/simfreak/pics/Scre14.jpg)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Mini D on November 24, 2003, 09:17:43 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Russian
http://www.lo-mac.com/aircraft_flyable.php

Wrong again. ;)
Wrong again?  First post I made in this thread.

Too bad it wasn't the tornado.  3 Allied planes and one of them is a Mig-29. :(

MiniD
Title: Lock-on
Post by: LePaul on November 24, 2003, 09:19:38 AM
Yea, that attention to detail (the scratches in the plexi) are outstanding
Title: Lock-on
Post by: kappa on November 24, 2003, 09:27:00 AM
nono, those are scratches on his monitor........ 8)

k
AoM
Title: Lock-on
Post by: kappa on November 24, 2003, 09:28:03 AM
Will they add more planes anyone think??

k
AoM
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Russian on November 24, 2003, 09:38:09 AM
Quote
Originally posted by kappa
Will they add more planes anyone think??

k
AoM


ED is thinking of releasing F/A-18, if LOMAC sells well.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: moose on November 24, 2003, 11:03:22 AM
the more i play this game the more im in love with it.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Mini D on November 24, 2003, 11:06:20 AM
Stop whining?  Not whining.. just disappointed.  No allied multi-role fighter (except the Mig?).  4 different Russian planes, with 2 variants.  2 U.S. planes with no variants.  Hell... it's not even a 15-E... just a C.

Eye candy only lasts so long if it's a plane I don't really care to look at.

MiniD
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Spooky on November 24, 2003, 11:36:37 AM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
Same old smoke and mirrors from UBI and the Axis of Evil, French-Russian simulator alliance.


(http://www.austinpowers.nl/pix/evil1m.jpg)

Installing Lock-on or IL2FB will trigger a hypnotic "laser" from your monitor : it will instantly turn you into a rude smelly french waiter or a die-hard bolshevik...

We will soon rule ze world !

Jerry Lewis will be on every channel !

KFC will only serve froglegs in garlic sauce !

Coca cola plants will only produce Vodka...

Straffo will be defense secretary !

Boroda will be President !

Long live the French-Russian Alliance !
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Kirin on November 24, 2003, 11:37:06 AM
Slightly off topic but since McHonky (or similar) keeps with his Russo-Euro conspiracy putting up IL2:FB with the P-47 as example:

Quote
Worst cockpit of all in plane-set.


RTFM: SHIFT+F1 --> beautfiul view which 190 can only dream of... :)  About instrument setup - blame the designers. But P51 with fuel gauge in the back beats em all - maybe Pony drivers just didnt have to care about fuel. ;)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Mini D on November 24, 2003, 11:39:03 AM
Ya... twist that a bit.  Let's just be specific:

U.S.:

F-15C
A-10

Russian:

Su-27 Flanker B
Mig-29 Fulcrum A, C
Su-25 Frogfoot
Su-33 Flanker D

So.. they gave the allied side a Mig-29A... that doesn't make it any less of a Russian plane.

I will enjoy flying the A-10, though I'll reserve judgement for later.  The F-15C will be a bit more disappointing.  The soviet fighters hold no interest for me.

This game would have been much better if it would have had the Tornado and F4 in it.  I find it rather funny that you're wasting time trying to convince me otherwise.  I also find it odd that nobody mentioned this here when posting the screenshots.  That is why I'm disappointed.

The other thing is in regards to any chance of on-line play.  More modern Russian vs 2 mid 70's U.S. planes and 1 late 70's soviet plane.  Hardly the makings for any kind of battle.

MiniD
Title: Lock-on
Post by: OIO on November 24, 2003, 12:11:35 PM
gorgeous pics.

If any plane was to be added to it, i hope its the Harrier.

VTOL would be amusing to have in a multiplayer sim :)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 24, 2003, 12:20:52 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Rude
It's the pilots not the planes


well rude he used to whine about undermodeled F15 ...

but its may be due to pilot as well :D
Title: Lock-on
Post by: gatt on November 24, 2003, 12:22:28 PM
They will probably hook up US/UK/EU people to this sim with promises of new flyable and add-ons (F-16, FA/18, Eurofighter, Tornado ... ).

AI controlled? Probably krap, since they usually fly with a simplified FM (i.e.: porked and/or uber). Same thing happens in IL2-FB.

BTW, very nice pics.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Mini D on November 24, 2003, 12:29:44 PM
I have a tendancy not to fly LW planes in AH and stick to the allied planes instead.  I have flown the 262, Ta-152 and a bit of a few others.  I have flown the Yak-9u quite a bit.  I don't fly the Japanese stuff much at all.  None of them really interest me.  If I only had a choice of those aircraft and no allied planes, I would be playing a different game.

As for LOMAC... I was hoping that the game had more planes available than the screenshots we saw... not less.  Disappointed is an understatement.

MiniD
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 24, 2003, 12:40:53 PM
Well Guys .... according to link from miniD ...

Mig 29A is quite ok .... as you can see, there is list of NATO (whitch contain more countries that only US) airplanes....

You can see Mig29A in NATO(german) colours practice with  Mirages for example in Swiss (it was quite cool to watch them take off and on landing )


here are polish migs in NATO colours
http://www.astercity.net/~karol1/miginatoang.html
http://www.aeronautics.ru/polishmig29.htm


So there is nothing wrong with mig 29 on  NATO side ....



edit:
one more :)
http://www.aeronautics.ru/nws002/ap028.htm
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Mini D on November 24, 2003, 12:52:27 PM
I did not link anything.

And I never said there weren't Mig-29's in NATO.  But to treat them as a mainstay NATO aircraft is pretty silly.  Hell... even a mirage would have been more fitting.

"Well... we modeled a Mig-29 for the soviets... why don't we just paint one up for Germany and call it NATO... and make it the most dominate fighter on their side."

MiniD
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 24, 2003, 01:00:42 PM
yup mini sorry you did only quote Russian...
ok so link was by russian..


well miniD .. IMAO but if you still separate world on US and Russian, you are a bit off.... Most of North,central Europe use Mig29 you can find some countries here http://www.astercity.net/~karol1/swiatmigiang.html nobody saying that Mig-29 is main NATO airplane in lomac.... its only the best NATO/Russian airplane in Lomac for now :D

anyway im not soviet and i will be glad to fly mig29, because there wasnt much sims with flyable mig29

im not sure if mirage can compare to mig29.... dont know much about mirages....

anyway what would you recomanded as dominate fighter for NATO ?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Saurdaukar on November 24, 2003, 01:18:22 PM
Very pretty - but I couldnt figure out how to shoot anything.  :D
Title: Lock-on
Post by: straffo on November 24, 2003, 01:30:40 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Spooky
(http://www.austinpowers.nl/pix/evil1m.jpg)

Installing Lock-on or IL2FB will trigger a hypnotic "laser" from your monitor : it will instantly turn you into a rude smelly french waiter or a die-hard bolshevik...

We will soon rule ze world !

Jerry Lewis will be on every channel !

KFC will only serve froglegs in garlic sauce !

Coca cola plants will only produce Vodka...

Straffo will be defense secretary !

Boroda will be President !

Long live the French-Russian Alliance !


We are not supposed to say that ... yet !
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 24, 2003, 02:07:56 PM
Don't you see!!! I haven't seen Lock-On's retail Box but I bet the F-15 or A-10 is featured prominently. You’re right- this IS A RUSSIAN SIM.  But Nobody in the civilized world gives a CRAP ABOUT RUSSIAN HARDWARE and UBI knows it.  So they use smoke and mirrors to trick us.


Russian hardware is for some third world army that can’t afford American or Euro equipment.

When I want to outfit a band of terrorists I’ll go out and buy RPG’s and Ak-47’s.

When I want to outfit an Air Force I go buy F-15’s and F-16’s.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: pugg666 on November 24, 2003, 02:18:37 PM
...
Title: Lock-on
Post by: pugg666 on November 24, 2003, 02:19:57 PM
Quote
But Nobody in the civilized world gives a CRAP ABOUT RUSSIAN HARDWARE and UBI knows it. So they use smoke and mirrors to trick us.


(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-11/505497/STFU.jpg)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 24, 2003, 02:28:22 PM
Last I heard the French haven't secured a single foreign contract for the Rafael. 0 ! As for the Gripen- only the South Africans have purchased it.  The F-16 Block 60 has been spanking all Euro-Russian hardware.  Koreans made a huge purchase of the Block 60 F-16’s.  Saudi bought a ton of F-15’s.

Now lets talk backwards third world countries.  Yep..Russian hardware.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: moose on November 24, 2003, 03:09:53 PM
mc honkey = 62namnug?

anyway, i have a weird attraction to the su27 and 33. the r73 missiles which have the capibility to be fired from a high angle using the headmounted target system are a blast. im gonna buy track IR just simply for that feature.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Maniac on November 24, 2003, 03:16:27 PM
Quote
As for the Gripen- only the South Africans have purchased it.


Havnt read the whole thread but i reflected upon this.... Purchase and purchase... They were given so much bribes that they almost got it for free...

LOL!
Title: Lock-on
Post by: LePaul on November 24, 2003, 04:10:37 PM
Say what you want, that Rafale is a sharp looking plane
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Rude on November 24, 2003, 04:15:01 PM
Quote
Originally posted by GScholz
LOL you have to be trolling. So the US soldiers I see on TV using AK's in Iraq are terrorists? I like to think it's because the M-16A2 is an unreliable overrated POS. Which air force is buying F-15's or F-16's? Last I heard only Israel have bought F-15E's, and Greece opted to buy some used F-16's as an interim measure until the Eurofighter or JSF becomes available. Upgrading your air force nowadays it's all about Eurofighters, Rafaels, Gripens and Sukhois.


While that may be true, the quality of the pilot will be the weakness....are you saying that Euro pilots are more skilled than USAF or Navy jocks?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Dnil on November 24, 2003, 04:15:25 PM
umm saudis bought the export version of the strike eagle.  And I believe the hungary deal fell through and they are leaning towards 16s again.....
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Pooh21 on November 24, 2003, 04:24:48 PM
Does it have backfire R-72s for the russians? I loved that in Fighters Anthology online, coldmerge weapons free after pass, then a kill 2 seconds later.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Maniac on November 24, 2003, 04:27:25 PM
Quote
Does it have backfire R-72s for the russians? I loved that in Fighters Anthology online, coldmerge weapons free after pass, then a kill 2 seconds later.


Cool! :cool:

Never tought of that solution! Why aint this like a world wide standard? Any American AC´s do this?

Dnil?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 24, 2003, 04:37:40 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
Don't you see!!! I haven't seen Lock-On's retail Box but I bet the F-15 or A-10 is featured prominently. You’re right- this IS A RUSSIAN SIM.  But Nobody in the civilized world gives a CRAP ABOUT RUSSIAN HARDWARE and UBI knows it.  So they use smoke and mirrors to trick us.


Russian hardware is for some third world army that can’t afford American or Euro equipment.

When I want to outfit a band of terrorists I’ll go out and buy RPG’s and Ak-47’s.

When I want to outfit an Air Force I go buy F-15’s and F-16’s.


Nobody gives a crap eh? Then why, pray tell, are we spending over 400 billion on defense--about 7 times what the Russians  can afford. Paranioa?

Also, unless you're brain dead, you'd understand that military purchases are motivated as much by politics as they are by quality. More countries want to be on our side than not(and I'm by no means saying this is a bad thing). Buying American weapons says a great deal about your allegiance. Buying weapons other than American says something else, and those who do are in a shrinking minority.

If the Chinese wanted to swallow their pride, they could buy all the f-16s they need. It's the swallowing that they're trying to avoid.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 24, 2003, 04:54:41 PM
GScholz,

  Look.  My Dad is a defense contractor who has lived in Saudi and I've been there and seen the Saudi F-15's in person.  Not everyone can afford the F-15.  It ain't cheap and they don't take cupons.  Hell all you need to buy a Mig29 is a case of Voka and a carton of American Cigarettes.

All this doesn't matter anyway because we all know that Putin or Chirac would personally blow George Bush for a F-22 or B-2.  Let's all settle down now.

GScholz- put on your Ski's and play your ABBA Cd's.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Maniac on November 24, 2003, 05:01:02 PM
Quote
GScholz- put on your Ski's and play your ABBA Cd's.


ABBA is from Sweden....
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 24, 2003, 05:03:56 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
GScholz,

  Look.  My Dad is a defense contractor who has lived in Saudi and I've been there and seen the Saudi F-15's in person.  Not everyone can afford the F-15.  It ain't cheap and they don't take cupons.  Hell all you need to buy a Mig29 is a case of Voka and a carton of American Cigarettes.

All this doesn't matter anyway because we all know that Putin or Chirac would personally blow George Bush for a F-22 or B-2.  Let's all settle down now.

GScholz- put on your Ski's and play your ABBA Cd's.


My dad's a surgeon and I've been in the operating room as an observer, doesn't mean I know how to pull a bullet out of somebody's brain. Saudi Arabia may be a rich country, but they're also trying to maintain, albeit on the very surface, a good relationship with us. Like I said before, the Chinese have more then enough funds for American Weapons.

BTW, ABBA is Swedish, those things you put on your feet to go down a snowy hill are SKIIS  and the clear liquid you drink is spelled 'VODKA' (there's a d in it). Master those facts first before moving onto more serious topics.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 24, 2003, 05:16:20 PM
Never said I could Spell...


Sweden ..Norway...all the same to me...
Title: Lock-on
Post by: -tronski- on November 24, 2003, 05:17:10 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
GScholz,

  Look.  My Dad is a defense contractor who has lived in Saudi and I've been there and seen the Saudi F-15's in person.  Not everyone can afford the F-15.  It ain't cheap and they don't take cupons.  Hell all you need to buy a Mig29 is a case of Voka and a carton of American Cigarettes.

All this doesn't matter anyway because we all know that Putin or Chirac would personally blow George Bush for a F-22 or B-2.  Let's all settle down now.

GScholz- put on your Ski's and play your ABBA Cd's.



Honky , put your dad on the phone... :rofl

(Why are we messing with the monkey, when we should be talking to the organ grinder?!!)

bloody kids....  :p



 Tronsky
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Pooh21 on November 24, 2003, 05:29:37 PM
Quote
Originally posted by -tronski-
Honky , put your dad on the phone... :rofl

(Why are we messing with the monkey, when we should be talking to the organ grinder?!!)

bloody kids....  :p



 Tronsky



:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :aok
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 24, 2003, 07:15:09 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
Never said I could Spell...


Sweden ..Norway...all the same to me...


I have a question: Does your brain require breathing and blood circulation to be a conscious act? If so, I suggest you sit back and let your mind wander for a few hours.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Animal on November 24, 2003, 08:16:27 PM
Honky is by far my favorite poster in this board.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 25, 2003, 04:54:25 AM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky

Russian hardware is for some third world army that can’t afford American or Euro equipment.

When I want to outfit an Air Force I go buy F-15’s and F-16’s.



:rofl
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 25, 2003, 04:59:06 AM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
Last I heard the French haven't secured a single foreign contract for the Rafael. 0 ! As for the Gripen- only the South Africans have purchased it.  The F-16 Block 60 has been spanking all Euro-Russian hardware.  Koreans made a huge purchase of the Block 60 F-16’s.  Saudi bought a ton of F-15’s.

Now lets talk backwards third world countries.  Yep..Russian hardware.


our country is about to buy Gripens
we got 2 offers....

old used POS F-16
or new Gripens

Price ??? same :rolleyes:

btw First world country is US, second UK and rest is Thirdworld isnt it ? :rofl
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 25, 2003, 07:19:09 AM
GScholz,

Another thing to remember.  The Greatest moment in Norwegian Aviation History was made possible by the USA.  This is, of course, when a Norwegian F-16 shot down a Serb Mig29.  

Has a F-16 or F-15 ever been shot down by a Russian fighter….EVER??
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 25, 2003, 09:31:22 AM
Was there ever conflict  Honky ?


geeez i trough that great moment in norwegian history was 1st 109 :D
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Rude on November 25, 2003, 09:55:16 AM
Awww C'mon!

Americans do everything better...everything. How many years must you folks live under our shadow before you realize that?

Oh, and we're the best lookin group of Earth dwellin humans too.

Euro Fighters? Think about it.

:p
Title: Lock-on
Post by: SFRT - Frenchy on November 25, 2003, 12:10:24 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Rude
While that may be true, the quality of the pilot will be the weakness....are you saying that Euro pilots are more skilled than USAF or Navy jocks?


Sorry to burst your bubble Rude, but the word on the street in Europe is yes.
We didn't have all the fancy performances and equipment that you guys have. American pilots are over reliant on those and have a tendancy to loose it when faced with something out of the mold. Quind of like the LA7 pilot in AH.:D

I remember red flag 95, when I was following it from my Air Force days. The f16 agressor pilot was disapointed when he came back from the mission, he got shot down by the guys he was supposed to kill, the bomber version of the M2000. His preflight cockyness received a direct hit.

In the similar time frame, I recall an engagement between the Fosh and an American carrier. Oh man, what a whooping, we didn't even detected you that we were already sunk:cool:

Pratriotism glossing appart Rude, it would be foolish to think that USA pilots are the best. Europe have high standards of training and admission. They fly planes who have less "row power" and train into more chalenging environements. The Suiss alps come to mind, with their live gun range in the lakes of the parks or at the corner of a mountain range canyon. It's not the 15,000 mile long landing strip in the middle of the desert.

look at the job of the British pilots in their bunk jaguars in desert storm one, daylight raids. I would not say that they have more skill than a F15E pilot, but they deserve a hat off.


:aok
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Rude on November 25, 2003, 12:36:53 PM
Quote
Originally posted by SFRT - Frenchy
Sorry to burst your bubble Rude, but the word on the street in Europe is yes.
We didn't have all the fancy performances and equipment that you guys have. American pilots are over reliant on those and have a tendancy to loose it when faced with something out of the mold. Quind of like the LA7 pilot in AH.:D

I remember red flag 95, when I was following it from my Air Force days. The f16 agressor pilot was disapointed when he came back from the mission, he got shot down by the guys he was supposed to kill, the bomber version of the M2000. His preflight cockyness received a direct hit.

In the similar time frame, I recall an engagement between the Fosh and an American carrier. Oh man, what a whooping, we didn't even detected you that we were already sunk:cool:

Pratriotism glossing appart Rude, it would be foolish to think that USA pilots are the best. Europe have high standards of training and admission. They fly planes who have less "row power" and train into more chalenging environements. The Suiss alps come to mind, with their live gun range in the lakes of the parks or at the corner of a mountain range canyon. It's not the 15,000 mile long landing strip in the middle of the desert.

look at the job of the British pilots in their bunk jaguars in desert storm one, daylight raids. I would not say that they have more skill than a F15E pilot, but they deserve a hat off.


:aok


This simply cannot be true....only American fighter jocks have skills....haven't you seen Top Gun???

:)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Wmaker on November 25, 2003, 01:54:03 PM
Quote
Originally posted by SFRT - Frenchy
I remember red flag 95, when I was following it from my Air Force days. The f16 agressor pilot was disapointed when he came back from the mission, he got shot down by the guys he was supposed to kill, the bomber version of the M2000. His preflight cockyness received a direct hit.


Ouch! :)

Ok, no need to mention what happened in the NAS Fallon when FAF pilots were converting to F-18s there... :D
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 25, 2003, 02:01:28 PM
SFRT - Frenchy,

     If US decided to evade France...we're talking just a "what-if."  How long do you think you guys would last ??  One week?  I'm not a French basher- I think you guys have a world class military.  Just think- B2's take-out your command and control.  Its just academic from there.  US doctrine revolves around stealth-everything we do is a function of stealth.  You don't have it + you have no counter measures.
   After the lights go out in Paris- its party time for the USMC baby!!!!!!
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 25, 2003, 02:04:42 PM
Wmaker,

can you explain NAS Fallon to me ...and or give me a link.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Wmaker on November 25, 2003, 02:16:04 PM
http://www.google.com
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Chairboy on November 25, 2003, 02:21:37 PM
Ouch!

MC Honky, you have been zinged.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 25, 2003, 02:33:12 PM
NAS Fallon is a Naval Air Station.  I assume you are talking about a meet that was held there or something ..please explain...
Title: Lock-on
Post by: SFRT - Frenchy on November 25, 2003, 02:40:12 PM
MC_Honky,

You are exactly right, the objective for France is to be able to hold 2 weeks (not 1) till NATO kicks in. With such a defense politic, we do not have to tie up massive $$$ for an hypothetical attack, and use the money to prosper our economy instead.

As far as counter measures, we do have some. As far as CCC being destroyed by a bomb, we have many CCC, some as deep as 1,000ft+ The whole CCC with allied/NATO are linked to each other as well as the radar stations. Meaning a CCC in Dijon will still be able to operate his zone after an attack thank to the data collected by other radars of other regions.

For your information, stealth technology relies on new radar technology. Taking some short cuts/over simplification in the explanation, it would work like this: You send a micro-wave lenght who is "absorbed" so the return is inexistant. France and other european countries still use the old 30cm wave lenght radar mixed with the newer radars, allowing a better detection of the stealth planes. Send a 30cm wave lenght, the plane absorb a micro-millimeter, the return is still 29cm +. That's maybe how you end up having a F117 shot down by a bunch of drunken Serbians.

In case of you are not aware with it, Europe builds some nice weaponery, some even being used by USA, like the Durandal. The matra Majic, was a better infrared missile than the contemporary AIM9 Sidewinder, it could be fired under a higher G loading, fairly practical in dogfighting.

No country can compete with the amount of technology and hardware quantity of USA, but it would be foolish to believe that other countries are using wooden arrows and voodoo sorceres.:p
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Wmaker on November 25, 2003, 02:43:31 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
NAS Fallon is a Naval Air Station.  I assume you are talking about a meet that was held there or something ..please explain...


USA vs. the whole wide world, USA won.

...basically, in this thread you have proven normal discussion with you is either fruitless and/or impossible.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 25, 2003, 02:52:23 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
SFRT - Frenchy,

     If US decided to evade France...we're talking just a "what-if."  How long do you think you guys would last ??  One week?  I'm not a French basher- I think you guys have a world class military.  Just think- B2's take-out your command and control.  Its just academic from there.  US doctrine revolves around stealth-everything we do is a function of stealth.  You don't have it + you have no counter measures.
   After the lights go out in Paris- its party time for the USMC baby!!!!!!



well older version of this system was called Tamara.
Even Tamara was able to detect F-117 ..... stealth planes are probably stealth only for Americans radars and movies :D
http://www.era.cz/en/download/vera-e.pdf

here is taht sweeetie... :)
http://www.aeronautics.ru/tamara02.htm (daamm we are terrorist arent we ? :) )
http://216.26.163.62/2002/me_iraq_1_14.html
http://www.caausa.org/articles/saddamassistance.htm

anyway Tamara is realy outdated version now.
New version was called Vera and has been developed by http://www.era.cz http://www.era.cz/en/download/vera-e.pdf

just keep belive in nonharmable B2,B1

and 1 more question ... why do you think that US didnt Bomb Iranian Nuclear power plant now, like they did last time ?

in case you have no  clue, here is part if Nuclear technology subcontract http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Central_Asia/EI05Ag02.html


viva your army, be sure god bless it :rofl
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 25, 2003, 04:30:23 PM
So your telling me that the B-2 can be detected by radars -older radars that all you europeans are using.  Since you Europeans have no morals- these radar systems will undoubtly be sold to hostile 3rd world countries.  So that means the US Armed Forces "Stealth Doctrine" is flawed.  We are pouring billions into the F-22 and JSF and have spent billions on the B-2 and F117 and all of this is wrong?  


My God ..we need to send this link to George Bush PRONTO- before we spend anymore money on defense...

Like I'll believe it...
Title: Lock-on
Post by: LePaul on November 25, 2003, 04:42:14 PM
Ah...I remember when this thread was about a cool new game and not about beating ones chest loudly with a flag waving overhead....

:cool:
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Russian on November 25, 2003, 04:47:05 PM
Maybe if DoD would stop spending all f#48ing money on defense and start warring about education we wouldn’t have this argument.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Rude on November 25, 2003, 04:47:05 PM
Quote
Originally posted by LePaul
Ah...I remember when this thread was about a cool new game and not about beating ones chest loudly with a flag waving overhead....

:cool:


I can't help it....jets are for girls:)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 25, 2003, 05:04:33 PM
Russian,

We don't spend enough on defense and too much on education already.  You got it wrong.  Can't fix dumb people by throwing money at them.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Mathman on November 25, 2003, 05:24:29 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
Russian,

We don't spend enough on defense and too much on education already.  You got it wrong.  Can't fix dumb people by throwing money at them.


Holy ****, that is ****in brilliant.  Keep up the good work! :aok
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 25, 2003, 05:29:22 PM
Hey I ain't no Genius ..never said I was.  I smart enough to know that if Europe messes with the USA they's gett'n a BIG CAN OF WUPASS...
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Ack-Ack on November 25, 2003, 06:00:14 PM
Quote
Originally posted by gofaster
Same here.  I've been burned with bad games before (iF-22 immediately comes to mind).



Any game from iMagic should have been looked at with caution...



ack-ack
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Hortlund on November 25, 2003, 07:08:33 PM
Well, graphics look nice and all. I'm not gonna buy it though.
Reason -> UBI = French company.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Hortlund on November 25, 2003, 07:26:53 PM
Quote
Originally posted by GScholz
So you've got something against the French now Hortlund?

Uh..yeah... But what do you mean "now"? Ive had something against the French since the UN debacle pre-Iraq... what was that, about a year ago?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Hortlund on November 25, 2003, 07:31:12 PM
Actually I started way back there sometime. The only French thing Ive bought since January was IL2-FB.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Hortlund on November 25, 2003, 07:39:24 PM
Well, basically its the same thing as recycling. If you're the only one doing it, it wont make a difference, but it makes a difference to me.

*shrug* I mean it would be pretty dumb to start some armed struggle against France. Instead I try not to buy anything French, and I try to convince my friends not to buy anything French if there is a reasonable alternative, and at work I do my utmost to avoid any French vendors.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Hortlund on November 25, 2003, 07:45:55 PM
Another law firm. Doing family law mostly. Started working there in August, I like it alot, will prolly stay. Its a big firm with lots of offices all over Sweden, good pay, good co-workers, no need to travel anywhere so I've got plenty of time for the kids. All in all, Im very pleased with it.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: -tronski- on November 25, 2003, 07:51:15 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Hortlund
Actually I started way back there sometime. The only French thing Ive bought since January was IL2-FB.


So you'll only buy French things you really want?

 Tronsky
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Hortlund on November 25, 2003, 07:57:47 PM
Quote
Originally posted by -tronski-
So you'll only buy French things you really want?

 Tronsky


Basically yeah... Like I said, I try to avoid buying anything French whatsoever, although there is the odd slip-up :)
But anyway, if I spend less than $50/year on French products I think Im doing a good job.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Pooh21 on November 25, 2003, 09:00:11 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
Russian,

We don't spend enough on defense and too much on education already.  You got it wrong.  Can't fix dumb people by throwing money at them.

well straight from the source,stupid taxes paying for other peoples kids education is like simply flushing it down the crapper.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: maslo on November 25, 2003, 09:34:38 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Rude
I can't help it....jets are for girls:)


sure iron birds are for girls :)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 25, 2003, 10:40:10 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
Hey I ain't no Genius ..never said I was.  I smart enough to know that if Europe messes with the USA they's gett'n a BIG CAN OF WUPASS...


Honky, I can't help it anymore. I'm gonna go ahead and accuse you of testing out a comedy routine on us. Gotta admit, it was annoying at first, but you're one hell of an entertainer. If you want a good venue,  the Comedy Store Sunset BLVD does amatuer nights during the week. Get in and sign up, and definitely bring your mastery of the English Language.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: straffo on November 26, 2003, 01:28:19 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Hortlund
Basically yeah... Like I said, I try to avoid buying anything French whatsoever, although there is the odd slip-up :)
But anyway, if I spend less than $50/year on French products I think Im doing a good job.


You would better check this affirmation
(no Danone product in your fridge ? would be surprising :))

To bad you won't taste our good wines :D
Title: Lock-on
Post by: mrblack on November 26, 2003, 02:09:56 AM
Pass the Grey Poupon Please:aok
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Fishu on November 26, 2003, 02:35:24 AM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
So your telling me that the B-2 can be detected by radars -older radars that all you europeans are using.  Since you Europeans have no morals- these radar systems will undoubtly be sold to hostile 3rd world countries.  So that means the US Armed Forces "Stealth Doctrine" is flawed.  We are pouring billions into the F-22 and JSF and have spent billions on the B-2 and F117 and all of this is wrong?  


My God ..we need to send this link to George Bush PRONTO- before we spend anymore money on defense...

Like I'll believe it...


To my knowledge russians has already had the radar technology for ages.
B2 and F117 could easily be detected by older radars, if they'd make a sharp turn ;)
They're meant to fly straight with slow turns in order to maintain stealth.
F22/JSF aren't even close to the stealth of B2/F117, they're made with lower radar profile, therefore making those harder to detect over range.
Nothing unique there, russians and europeans do have these partial stealth fighter designs as well, even if not with all the same technology.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: straffo on November 26, 2003, 04:36:40 AM
Quote
Originally posted by mrblack
Pass the Grey Poupon Please:aok


Had to ask GOD (http://www.google.com) to figure what you were speaking about :)

I've 5 kind of moutarde at home (I'm addicted  ... obvioulsy)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 26, 2003, 07:39:04 AM
Straffo,

 I read  that the Eurofighter Consortium couldn't stand working with the French contingent.  That the French contingent made unreasonable demands and fought the consortium on such trivial things like the name of the fighter.  When France pulled out- the consortium basically celebrated.  France justified the pull out in part- by predicting large oversees orders for the Rafale- which would in turn offset the very high production costs of “going it alone.” To date- France hasn’t secured one overseas order.  Ha Ha.  First- we humiliate your country by dominating your dumb bicycle race.  Go Lance Armstrong!!  Then we take all of your fighter business costing your country billions.  Viva La USA.  Na na na.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Pooh21 on November 26, 2003, 07:42:34 AM
While all you people pick ceaselessly on france,not that france doesnt deserve it. Canada has gone and developed the V2. That evil empire in the north is gonna start lauching them willy nilly. Nuking Totonto(oops) Mexico(oops) farmland in nebraska, and last but not least their launch site.:p
Title: Lock-on
Post by: straffo on November 26, 2003, 08:10:47 AM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
Straffo,

 I read  that the Eurofighter Consortium couldn't stand working with the French contingent.  That the French contingent made unreasonable demands and fought the consortium on such trivial things like the name of the fighter.  When France pulled out- the consortium basically celebrated.  France justified the pull out in part- by predicting large oversees orders for the Rafale- which would in turn offset the very high production costs of “going it alone.” To date- France hasn’t secured one overseas order.  Ha Ha.  First- we humiliate your country by dominating your dumb bicycle race.  Go Lance Armstrong!!  Then we take all of your fighter business costing your country billions.  Viva La USA.  Na na na.


BS and misinformation,it only show you don't know what you're speaking about.

Each time you post you dig more the hole you're sit in.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 26, 2003, 08:28:45 AM
I'm at work now but I return home I'll provide you my refrences.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: boxboy28 on November 26, 2003, 09:31:44 AM
this post sound like bunch of WOMEN having a biggest salamander contast!

none of them have it but there sure there is biger and better than the others........
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Capt. Pork on November 26, 2003, 09:35:03 AM
Quote
Originally posted by boxboy28
this post sound like bunch of WOMEN having a biggest salamander contast!

none of them have it but there sure there is biger and better than the others........


Where did you get that avatar? It's funny as hell!
Title: Lock-on
Post by: boxboy28 on November 26, 2003, 09:42:27 AM
i stole it from a guy on the AMD forums
Title: Lock-on
Post by: muckmaw on November 26, 2003, 09:43:04 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Capt. Pork
Where did you get that avatar? It's funny as hell!


http://www.stupidvideos.com

Theres a bunch of them there. I think this one is called Evil Penguin
Title: Lock-on
Post by: AKIron on November 26, 2003, 11:48:42 AM
Quote
Originally posted by GScholz
The B-2, F-117 and F-22 are not invisible to radar. However the stealth technology reduces the radars effective range opening up gaps in radar networks that allow these aircraft to avoid detection and slip through defences. And European made radars are not "old", they are very much comparable to US systems, even Russian radars are getting up to speed now that they can import important computer technology.

The Eurofighter, Rafale and Gripen are all stealthy from the front aspect (heading towards you).


Don't know about the others but the F-117 is effectively radar invisible. That effective radar range you mentioned is so short as to be unimportant. No matter how sophisticated the computer controlling the transmissions or analyzing the radar returns it'll come up negative if there is no  reflected energy to analyze.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: SFRT - Frenchy on November 26, 2003, 12:08:23 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
Straffo,

 I read  that the Eurofighter Consortium couldn't stand working with the French contingent.  That the French contingent made unreasonable demands and fought the consortium on such trivial things like the name of the fighter.  When France pulled out- the consortium basically celebrated.  France justified the pull out in part- by predicting large oversees orders for the Rafale- which would in turn offset the very high production costs of “going it alone.” To date- France hasn’t secured one overseas order.  Ha Ha.  First- we humiliate your country by dominating your dumb bicycle race.  Go Lance Armstrong!!  Then we take all of your fighter business costing your country billions.  Viva La USA.  Na na na.


:rofl

When France pulled out, they alone designed and test flew the Rafale and posted an operational version way before the "consorsium". France was not pleased with the Eurofighter was conceived, especially the slow down created by having to please all parties. (Before you extrapolate, I didn't say the Eurofighter was a POS, or the Rafale better).

Honky, what sales do the Eurofighter have so far?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: SFRT - Frenchy on November 26, 2003, 12:13:35 PM
(http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/B00004D0FM.02.LZZZZZZZ.jpg)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: AKIron on November 26, 2003, 01:11:20 PM
Quote
Originally posted by GScholz
The F-117 has a RCS about the size of a bird, however radars (even very old radars) are able to detect bird sized targets albeit at a drastically reduced range (80-90% compared to large aircraft). The F-117 is not invisible, just very stealthy.


And there ya have it. Most militaries aren't going to waste their missiles shooting down birds on the off chance it might be an enemy plane even if they can track a bird. If they do they'll run out of missiles long before the 117 gets there. And besides, a 117 could easily destroy the radar site before detected.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Chairboy on November 26, 2003, 01:21:49 PM
Devils advocate, what if all they need to do is look for birds that are flying at a couple hundred miles per hour?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: AKIron on November 26, 2003, 01:26:25 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Chairboy
Devils advocate, what if all they need to do is look for birds that are flying at a couple hundred miles per hour?


Range is a key factor. I don't think that F-117 is going to show on anyone's radar at greater than 5 miles. Not enough time to do much of anything about it even if you can track it then, which I doubt.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: straffo on November 26, 2003, 01:51:44 PM
Quote
Originally posted by SFRT - Frenchy
(http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/B00004D0FM.02.LZZZZZZZ.jpg)


Stop tu vas finir par facher les 70% de commandant sylvestres présents ici :)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 26, 2003, 03:26:47 PM
The Illustrated Directory of Fighters by Mike Spick

page 106

"In, 1983, Britan, France, Germany, Italy and Spain had more or less agreed on a common spec. for a multi-role fighter, but in the case of France, this was less rather than more. Dassault
demanded both design and industrial leadership....this was unacceptable to the other four"

You see France needs to step back a moment and look in the Mirror and repeat the following:

"We are no longer a first rate power.  The World is dominated by an alliance of Anglos including the US, UK and Australia (intentionaly omits Canada).  The Worlds most powerful man is a Texan who has an I.Q. of a cucumber and our national pastime (Tour de France) is dominated by a Texan with one testical (Lance Armstrong)."

Quel Dommage
Title: Lock-on
Post by: straffo on November 26, 2003, 04:52:56 PM
how this :
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
"In, 1983, Britan, France, Germany, Italy and Spain had more or less agreed on a common spec. for a multi-role fighter, but in the case of France, this was less rather than more. Dassault
demanded both design and industrial leadership....this was unacceptable to the other four"


compare to this :
Quote
fought the consortium on such trivial things like the name of the fighter
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Nilsen on November 27, 2003, 06:05:08 AM
The 117 can be tracked by radar at close/medium ranges depending on the radar used if the operator and/or the software knows what to look for.

When they set waypoints for a 117 mission, the route is planned so the plane is flown inbetween known radar stations to minimise the risk of detection. They also has ESM gear that makes them able to change their route when they detect a radar emition (like almost every other military plane)

When i was in the navy the software for our radar systems was modified to "detect" both the 117 and other new planes as the data came in.  

The 117's are great planes, and they are alot harder to dectect than any other "standard" operational fighter, but if you belive that it is even close to invisible to a modern radar system with a skilled operator you are sadly mistaken.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Spooky on November 27, 2003, 06:39:29 AM
Quote
Originally posted by GScholz

For your information a Russian made SA-6 shot down an F-117 in Kosovo. The SA-6 is a radar guided SAM system that became operational in 1966.


I read somewhere that the SAM which killed the F117 in Kosovo was guided optically, and since the 117  seemed to have flown the same route twice, they were expecting him...

seems like a lucky shot to me, caused by poor mission planning : if you know there is "probably" a plane in a particular sector and at a particular time, it gets a lot easier to successfully engage it.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 27, 2003, 12:36:16 PM
The F-117 is not but the B-2 is....
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Nilsen on November 27, 2003, 01:17:15 PM
are you trying to tell us that the B" is "invisible" ?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Nilsen on November 27, 2003, 01:18:08 PM
are you trying to tell us that the B-2 is "invisible" ?
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 27, 2003, 06:14:17 PM
"If the F117 reflects the radar energy of a Large bird then the B-2 reflects the radar energy of a small insect."


Direct Quote from B-2 Pilot
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 27, 2003, 07:26:04 PM
Saw it on the Discovery Channel...don't remember the dude's name...hey do you guys still drink Rain-Deer Milk in Norway...just a question??
Title: Lock-on
Post by: pugg666 on November 27, 2003, 07:49:46 PM
GS don't bother with the twit
Title: Lock-on
Post by: moose on November 27, 2003, 07:54:26 PM
since airhead went soft, i think honkey is his new handle to troll with

oh, and btw, to get back on topic::

lock on is so good that it's impossible for me to even load up AH. I need a WW2 fix but im too spoiled.

i blew away an f-14 coming straight at me with an r-73, and as i flew through the debris it sucked into my left intake and fouled my engine in my su27

unbelievable.

so you guys can get back to your ****-slinging but the truth of the matter is that this game is the best $40 ive spent all year, with FFXI close behind.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Chairboy on November 27, 2003, 08:36:47 PM
Final Fantasy IX (IX is the number 9 if you have a public school education).
Title: Lock-on
Post by: MC_Honky on November 27, 2003, 09:23:02 PM
GScholz,

I remember I met this exchange student from Norway...ah she was so hot.  I spent the whole summer trying to bang her.  All summer.  Tried everything but she saw through my tactics.  I guess Norwegian Chicks are smarter than US chicks...I often think about her.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: moose on November 27, 2003, 09:33:27 PM
Final Fantasy 11. First RPG ive ever played, ever, but its got me pretty hooked. Great way to save money because all i do is spend my free time playing it ;)
Title: Lock-on
Post by: AKS\/\/ulfe on November 27, 2003, 10:27:56 PM
AAAAAHHHHHHHHHH! DAMN IT!!!!

FOR THE LOVE OF... ITS REINDEER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
-SW
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Chairboy on November 28, 2003, 12:20:22 AM
Quote
Originally posted by GScholz
Btw. Chairboy I have a public school education, I'm from evil socialist Norway remember.


Sorry, GScholz, I wasn't making a crack at you, I was making a crack right back at my home country.  I too have a public school education, and with the continual budget reductions, it's amazing I got out of there able to read books.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Fishu on December 09, 2003, 05:40:29 AM
Hrmm..  no dynamic campaign...  why can't they make dynamic campaigns into games anymore :( :confused:
Would be a good alternative ... i guess prolonging the experience isn't anymore as important as the instant selling figures.

Anyway.. wheres the patch, it needs one badly...
After getting shot down and reflying the mission, some things might be inoperable etc. carry overs from mission to mission which shouldn't be there.
Title: Lock-on
Post by: Saintaw on December 15, 2003, 10:50:20 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Capt. Pork
... Always found Mathew Maconoghey(or whatever the spelling is) to take away from the credibility of whatever movie he's in, with the exception of Dazed and Confused, of course.

Anyway, sweet.

Lol ! :lol
Title: Lock-on
Post by: _Schadenfreude_ on December 15, 2003, 12:04:23 PM
Quote
Originally posted by MC_Honky
Don't you see!!! I haven't seen Lock-On's retail Box but I bet the F-15 or A-10 is featured prominently. You’re right- this IS A RUSSIAN SIM.  But Nobody in the civilized world gives a CRAP ABOUT RUSSIAN HARDWARE and UBI knows it.  So they use smoke and mirrors to trick us.


Russian hardware is for some third world army that can’t afford American or Euro equipment.

When I want to outfit a band of terrorists I’ll go out and buy RPG’s and Ak-47’s.

When I want to outfit an Air Force I go buy F-15’s and F-16’s.


Geesh if you're going to get your panties all in a wad why don't you just refuse to buy it - that'll show them!! But stop whining for christ sake.