Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Furball on November 22, 2003, 08:12:25 AM
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http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=101877 This post inspired me to share this with you guys, let you know the beauty of the Mosquito.
Just typed this out, selected different extracts from a speech given by Russ Bannock 30 May 1981 who served in 418 Squadron.
Please excuse any typo's on my part :)
However the great turning point in the history of the squadron came in March 1942, when it converted to the de Havilland Mosquito Mk. VI fighter bomber-aircraft. At that time, it moved to ford aerodrome, near arundel, surrey, a very picturesque part of the South English coast... The move to this base really was the turning point in the fortunes of the squadron. It went to a part of england where the weather was better, and of course, aquired the new and very fast Mosquito.
Let me tell you a little bit about the Mosquito. This was the Mk. VI. It was capable of carrying a good bomb load : four 500lb bombs, and was armed with four 20 mm Hispano cannons mounted beneath the aurcraft. It had, as well, four .303 machine guns in the nose, and all of this really provided devastating firepower. It flew more like a fighter than a bomber, and furthermore, it was at the time the fastest aircraft in the world. At sea level, it could do about 375 miles per hour full out, the odd one could do about 385. At altitude, say 20,000 feet, the mosquito was capale at flying over 400 miles per hour. Now this doesn't sound very fasttoday, but in those days it was the fastest aircraft around....
Then the Squadron started going for bigger game, and this is when intruding against enemy airfields really got going in earnest. There were only two squadrons in the U.K., 418 squadron and 29 Squadron RAF, assigned to the low level intruder role against enemy airfields. There were three or four squadrons that were on the high-level rold assigned to go with the bombers to try and intercept some of the nightfighters; but at this early stage they didnt have much success because they weren't allowed to carry radar over Germany. Our intruder role involved three different types of mission. One was this assignment in support of bomber command which we called, by the code name "Flower Operations".
They were planned as follows. Bomber command would advise fighter command that to-night there would be a 500+ aircraft raid on a city like Hanover. Fighter command would advise 11 group, which was our group, that we were to provide cover over the german night-fighter airfields on the routes that the bombers were taking to the target, such as Hanover, and we as a squadroun would be assigned a half-dozen known german nightfighter airfields on their route. We would try and catch them taking off and climbing up, and then we tried to catch them after the bombing raid was over when they were coming in. Sometimes there would be three or four bomber raids over a two-hour period, so we would have to send somebody else to spell off the first fellow. Usuallyit was a two hour trip to the target area and you would stay on patrol for two hours, and then head home. So, if we had to patrol the same area for four hours, we would send a relief crew to take over that particular field. Until D-Day time, June 1944, the Luftwaffe usually burned navigation lights, when they got back to the airfield for obvious reasons to prevent collisions and to allow their own ground defence crews to know that they were friendly aircraft. We would arrive in the area and suddenly see a set of navigation lights flying around; we'd go after them and try to shoot them down. Gradually, of course, after they suffered considerable casualties, they wisened up to this, and they didn't burn navigation lights except perhaps to flash them on final approach to advise their anti-aircraft crews that they were on final. So it became much tougher, later on, to spot these fellows. We had to work a lot harder and the only way we had of finding these aircraft was to get into the airfield area, where we knew there was activity, and do right hand circuits in hope of passing a set of exhausts suddenly flying overhead. Then you would wheel around and try to pick up the exhausts. If you were within 400 yards, and dead astern of an aircraft at night, you could see the exhausts, even though they had shrouds on them.
Typical of one of these "Flower" operations was my own experience on 10 June 1944, just immediately after D-Day. the bombers were attacking railway yards just south of Paris, and i was assigned to a known Luftwaffe night-fighter airfield called Bourges Avord. It was about 100 Miles south of Paris.... I arrived at Bourges Avord at about 11:00pm. I was supposed to patrol it from eleven until one. An hour after i arrived at the airfield lights and the approach lights suddenly came on. The German Luftwaffe had an approach system that we called the Lorenz system. It was a single line of lights with cross lights at different intervals which indicated to the pilots that they were supposed to be at a given height at each intersection. I saw these lights come on and realised there must be some activity, there must be something trying to land. So i got closer to the airfield and started doing right hand circuits at about 800 feet. Sure enough, when i was going right on the down-wind leg for a left hand circuit i spotted a pair of exhausts overhead. I immediately wheeled around and by this time the aircraft was on base leg and probablyturning final, and at that point a search light went up right at the end of the Lorenz system. Well, i'd been briefed enough to know that when that light went up, it meant the aircraft was on final and already had passed it. It was a signal to the anti aircraft crews on the approach to shoot at anything that passed the light after the friendly aircraft. However i went boring in hoping to spot this guy's exhaust on final approach. Sure enough as soon as i'd passed te light, all hell broke loose, and there was a complete curtain barrage of flak! I had to break off my attack and turn steeply to one side of the aerodrome. Unfortunately for the German aircraft, just before he touched down, he made the mistake of turning on his landing lights. I was able to wheel in and fire a burst, broadside with cannon and machine guns, and he exploded just as he was touching down. We could tell by the light that it was a Messerschmitt Bf-110 nightfighter.
Then the fun started. The whole airfield it seemed to me, was like the CNE on the fourth of july. I've never seen so many coloured lights coming up at me from all directions. There was a wall of flack that seemed to span the airfield. We did a very tight 180 degree turn, at 100 feet and got out the area. That was a typical "flower" operation.
In addition to these so-called "Flower operations", we did "Night Rangers", The night ranger was sort of a trip tp a target of opportunity which usually resulted from intelligence information directly from fighter command. Fighter command would tell us about some special activity at a German airfield and we would plan a trip there..... I'd like to give you another personal example of a Night Ranger trip i did on 17 July 1944, to an airfield called called Altenburg, south of Berlin. Intelligence reports indicated that the Luftwaffe were moving their training fields from France to deep into Germany, and at this particular airfield they were converting Focke-Wulf day units into night fighter units... It was to be about a six hour trip at low level. We planned a course to be flown about 500 feet to avoid radar detection. These trips were always accomplished on dead reckoning navigation. I find it amusing today to hear of so many pilots today who can't able to go anywhere unless they have a VOR, and ADF and all the latest aids, when i think we flew right across Germany, into Poland and so on, at 500 feet, on D.R. and we usually arrived on target right on schedule... bear in mind that the whole of Europe was black with no lights anywhere; so you could pick out water, little bodies of water such as a resivoir. From this resivoir, I set a course and arrived at Altenburg to find a couple of searchlights flailing around the air, working witha couple of Fw-190's who were practising on eachother. We managed to shoot down one Fw down and damage the other one. As we weren't sure if it crashed or not we claimed one destroyed and one damaged. And that was a typical night ranger operation that the crews planned on their own initiative.
...Paul introduced another type of operation to the squadron, the Day Ranger. These sorties were usually carried out in pairs and were flown at tree top level, being designed to disrupt daylight air transports and training activities all over France, the low countries and Germany. They were highly successful and brought the squadron much fame and publicity, particularly in late 1943 and throughout 1944.
The first big occasion was 27 January 1944, when two seperate pairs went out, ranging in southern and eastern France, and came home having destroyed seven enemy aircraft in only six minutes combat! They got two Ju-88's, two W-34's, one He-177, one He-111, and a Fw-200 transport. Can you imagine the morale of the Luftwaffe wiith these Mosquitos roaming around in the tree tops, suddenly popping up, destroying three or four aircraft, getting back into the tree tops and disappearing? The Mosquitos soon became such a pest to the Luftwaffe that they literally drove those training schools i talked about earlier into far Eastern Germany and severely limited transport operations...
Continued
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Charlie Scherf became the top destroyer of aircraft in the squadron. He got 22 aircraft mostly on Day Rangers and won the DSO, DFC and bar. Interestingly enough most of these were shot down after he finished his tour and went on a rest tour to 11 group. He kept calling up the squadron on weekends and asking "Can i come down and visit you fellows? Can i borrow a Mosquito for a couple of hours?" Then he would talk somebody else into going with him in another mosquito and come back six hours later, having shot down six or seven aircraft. He really was an incredible gentleman....
In November of 1944, the squadron moved to Hartford Bridge accepting a new and final role for the last four months of the war. It was put into Number 2 Groupin the Second Tactical Air Force. They were put into a wing with 29 Squadron and their job was to attack all kinds of road and rail transport - anything that moved behind the enemy lines - the same role performed by the squadron when it was equipped with bostons. By this time of the war, the day fighters, the Typhoons and so on, had very effectively neutralised road and rail transport in the daytime. So the role of 418 Squadron, was to go out and attack transport, anything they saw and they certainly racked up a tremendous score in that period: they destroyed and damaged 300 mechanical transport, 15 trains, 13 locomotives and some 20 goods wagons.....
By this stage of the war, every available man in Germany over 18 had been put into the army, and a lot of the ack-ack guns were manned really by these boy scout troops they called the "Hitler Jugend", or Hitler Youth. The Mosquito was so feared by the germans at this point, that it was counted for the top score towards getting a "Ritterkreuze", the German Iron Cross. If a pilot or ack-ack crew shot down a single-engined aircraft he got one point towards a "Ritterkreuze", a twin-engined aircraft he got two points, for a bomber or transport - three points, and for a Lancaster, Halifax or Fortress - four points. But if you shot down a Mosquito, you got Five points!
Hopefully this will inspire one or two of you use the mossie in the MA :D
(http://www.milartgl.com/Images_b/b-prelude-to-peace.jpg)
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Good read Furby! :)
BTW, for those that don't know, the Mosquito in AH belongs to 418 Sqn! :)
(http://www.btinternet.com/~nexx/MosquitoAH.jpg)
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Terrror in the Starboard Seat, by Dave Macintosh, a Mossie navigator is a great read too for Mossie fans.
Glad our two ship Mossie Intruder in AH got you th share this stuff :)
Dan/Slack
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Already use it a fair bit, and will try to use it more in the future. Excellent 1 vs 1 plane, a bit too big and flammable for furballing however.
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I loved the Mossie in AW, that's why when we switched to AH I took the MOSQ handle. Alas, the Mossie in AH is not as good relative to the planeset as the Mossie in AW. In AW the only planes that could catch you in FR Europe were the P-51 and later on, the D9. In AH most of the planes can run you down.
Plus the fuel burn rate in AH is too fast. Mossies could fly to Berlin and back like a 51, but here the 51 has a long range, the Mossie a very short one.
And one ping from a field ack and the wing burns like a roman candle! You've got about 30 seconds before the wing comes off.
I wish it weren't so. I have an awesome print of Mossies attacking a german airfield, signed by original veteren aircrew of the RCAF. It hangs above my monitor, to inspire my nightly flights in the old AW, and now AH.
MOSQ
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If you're ever rooks Mosq, come find me and we'll wing up. I generally do very well in them.
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At sea level, it could do about 375 miles per hour full out, the odd one could do about 385. At altitude, say 20,000 feet, the mosquito was capale at flying over 400 miles per hour.
from the help pages, our mossie can do only 340 mph on the deck (with wep) and can't reach 400 mph no matter the altitude.
also, the mossies range in AH is nothing to write home about.
any reliable sources about it's preformace?
I hope it will be fixed in AHII.
Bozon
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Originally posted by bozon
from the help pages, our mossie can do only 340 mph on the deck (with wep) and can't reach 400 mph no matter the altitude.
also, the mossies range in AH is nothing to write home about.
any reliable sources about it's preformace?
I hope it will be fixed in AHII.
Bozon
Our Mosquito hits the RAF numbers for a Mosquito FB.Mk VI Series 2 equipped with exhaust flare dampers exactly. Look at the engines on the AH Mossie and you'll notice that it doesn't have the exhaust stack like the Spitfire or P-51 do. Those curved tubes blocked the exhaust flare so Germans couldn't see them at night. However they also blocked the thrust from the exhaust stubbs. To give an idea of how much effect exhaust thrust could have, the A6M3 and A6M5 had the same engine, but the A6M5 had exhaust stacks setup for thrust and was 20mph faster.
The exhaust flare dampers knocked about 15mph off of the top speed.
With 150 octane fuel the Mosquito FB.Mk VI Series 2 without exhaust flare dampers could probably hit the numbers in the original article, 375-385mph.
As to the range, they said they're looking at it. Here's hoping it gets fixed.
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thx karnak
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Would be nice to have a Mosquito set-up for day fighter-bomber operations. In AH it feels so sluggish and this is supposed one of the fastest operational aircraft in the world 1942-1943, if not, the fastest.
I really don't want to start one of those exhasutive performance discussions (just read the 109 k/d thread) but can anyone explain why the Mosquite bleeds energy so badly? Ok, it's big, but is streamlined and has quite a good power to weight ratio... let's not forget that Mossies were used too to catch V1's and Fw-190 nuisance raiders. (Please correct me if I'm wrong).
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Originally posted by Furball
http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=101877 This post inspired me to share this with you guys, let you know the beauty of the Mosquito.
Just typed this out, selected different extracts from a speech given by Russ Bannock 30 May 1981 who served in 418 Squadron.
Is that in print in a book? Wouldn't mind having a longer read. :)
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Why dont you 418 lads come by the CT more often? you want Mossie missions, thats where to find them.
Some quick notes:
*The Mosquito VI top speed was under 400 (@380).
* It did down V-1s but it was the Tempest and Spit XIV that did most of that, along with the P-51 and P-47.
*It was not the fastest combat a/c in 1942-3, but it was one of the fastest.
*340 on the deck is nothing to sneeze at.
*Mossie VI was not a day fighter, and was never used as one, it was a fighter-bomber, night fighter, intruder, anti-shipping a/c.
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Manx, I am a Rook ! . I fly in the NightHawks squad. I'll look you up for a mission!
GoFaster, I have two Mossie books I bought used from Amazon:
Mosquito Wooden Wonder by Edward Bishop 1971, and The de Havilland Mosquito by M.J. Hardy 1977.
The Bishop book is a paperback and originally sold for $1. I think I paid $16 or more. The Hardy book is a hardback, original price $11.95, I think I paid about $30.
They are both chock full of every detail on the history of the planes with stats on the enormous number of variants. Also a lot of flying history, including the Ranger flights, the raids on Gestapo HQ and Gestapo prison, and of course their use as Pathfinders for Lancasters. In that role they would use the bomber only version of the Mossie, fly ahead of the Lancaster bomber stream, and mark the city to be destroyed with incendiary bombs. The Lancs would then home in on the fires.
One of the problems in any discussion of Mossies is the numerous variants have such different performance. The pure bomber versions were typically faster than the FBs. And the photo recon were screamers. The PR 34 could fly 425 mph at 35,000 ft, with a range of 3,500 miles!
Two interesting variants to add would be the B XVI (B for Bomber) that could carry the 4,000 lb blockbuster bomb; it was capable of 408mph at 28,500 ft. Nice Tiger blaster or HQ raider.
And if AH2 adds night operations, the NF 30 nightfighter, 424 mph at 26,500 ft.
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Hmm Great story! I think we need to get REDDG to post his own artistic vision of it..
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Great Thread!
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Didn't the Mosquito have a very low loss rate?
Wouldn't surprize me at all that they used 150 octans a lot to keep their edge in speed. And cruising fast at high alt they were practically uninterceptable.
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(http://www.brooksart.com/Rampage.jpg)
Below is the text that goes with my print. I have the signed edition from the RCAF aircrew. I hadn't realized that the planes in my print were the same as the one in AH. Now I'll have to fly more Ranger missions. In Air Warrior I started a Mossie Squad, the Mosquito Rangers. I'm thinking of it again in AH. Hmmm, maybe the 418 Rangers? Let's fly Manx!
Rangers On The Rampage
by Robert Taylor
Flying the high-speed low-level 'Day Ranger' missions in the Mosquito was one of the most exhilarating forms of aerial combat experienced by aircrews in WWII. Given a free hand at squadron level to select targets of opportunity deep inside enemy held territory, operating the fastest piston engine aircraft of the war, the Ranger Mosquito crews wreaked havoc in the air and on the ground literally all over occupied Europe.
Approaching their targets at tree-top height, often completely undetected, the element of surprise was usually total; one pair of Mosquitoes arriving over an airfield near Kronigsburg found a ceremonial parade in progress, broke up the party, and departed within seconds leaving five aircraft burning and a bunch of German Generals diving for cover beneath their staff cars!
Typical of the Day Ranger squadrons was No. 418 (City of Edmonton) Squadron R.C.A.F. Flying the Mosquito Fighter-Bomber MkVI, they completed over 3000 effective missions, destroyed 172 enemy aircraft - 73 on the ground - damaged a further 103, and in addition brought down 83 buzz-bombs and destroyed countless other ground vehicles. In company with other Mosquito Ranger squadrons, they rampaged across Europe with outstanding courage in the best traditions of the R.A.F. and Commonwealth Air Forces.
Robert Taylor's painting RANGERS ON THE RAMPAGE dramatically brings to life a Mosquito attack on a German fighter station deep inside Germany. Arriving over the target at little above hangar height, the two-ship mission announces their arrival by raking the field with cannon and machine gun fire. Within seconds both aircraft have scored direct hits with their 500lb. Bombs, and before the defensive flak guns can get the range, the pair have departed for home.
The Signers:
Wing Commander RUSS BANOCK
Air Marshal SIR IVOR BROOM
Squadron Leader T.J. 'Tommy' BROOM
Squadron Leader R.R. 'Bob' COWPER
Group Captain JOHN 'Cats-Eyes' CUNNINGHAM
Wing Commander MOOSE FUMERTON
Squadron Leader T. KEARNS
Squadron Leader CHARLES PATTERSON
Air commodore E.B. 'Ted' SISMORE
Flight Lieutenant F.S. 'Fred' STEVENS
Group Captain BRIAN 'Black Jack' WALKER
Flight Lieutenant S.J. 'Stan' WILLIAMS
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Originally posted by Squire
*Mossie VI was not a day fighter, and was never used as one, it was a fighter-bomber, night fighter, intruder, anti-shipping a/c.
This is not entirely true. Many Mosquito FB.Mk VI strike missions that flew during daylight were excorted by other Mosquito FB.Mk VIs that were not carrying bombs or rockets. RAF Mustangs were also used to escort these missions.
The specific Mosquito FB.Mk VI we have in AH gained many of its kills on day intruder missions. Intruder missions are simply missions to go and destroy targets of opportunity, mostly enemy aircraft.
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Yes, I agree. I just meant it was not used as a regular day air superiority fighter ala Spitfire, P-51, ect.
Its one of my favorite rides for strike missions in the CT, 880 just did one tonight. Great fun.
Long live the Mossie.
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MOSQ's print sent me to the film viewer as it reminded me of how that AH flight looked over the target. My son and I were'nt close enough to get both Mossies in the image, but we clearly flew ourselves a 2 ship Day Ranger. Up on one wing to get the heck out of the flak after getting hits.
Not exact to the print, but similar :)
Dan/Slack
(http://[img]http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/ah_169_1069829427.jpg)[/IMG]
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The Mosquito Mk VI remains my favorite aircraft in AH despite its poor performance compared to the late war super fighters in AH. It is simply more fun.
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IGShill was on a Mossie streak a tour or so ago and he got me to fly some Mossie runs, too. Its a fun ride if you don't plan on yank-n-bank too much. Go in fast and hot, pickle your ord, climb away and come around again.
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Nice Pic Guppy ! I've never noticed the maple leaf on the Mossie before. Too bad HTC doesn't have a way to take a walk around the planes in the hangar. It would be cool to do a close up 3-D visual inspection of your plane, like a pre-flight.
Noticed you still have your wing bomb. HTC needs some way to indicate in the weapons selector which bombs are set to drop. After ripping numerous wings in the A-20 accidentally from dropping my internal bombs first, then pulling up to sudden death, I learned to carry the 250lb bombs on the wings and 500's internally. Then I know exactly which bombs are going to drop.
If the Mossie could really do 375mph at sea level, now that would make this a much more competitive plane in AH. I "wish" HTC would increase the speed and the fuel burn issue. They've been saying they would fix the fuel "bug" since I started flying here in Nov. 2001, but nothing ever happens.
Angus, in answer to your question about low loss rate, I have read that the Mossie had the lowest crew loss rate of all bombers used by all combatants in WW2. A prime reason why Mossie aircrew are so devoted to their plane.
There were studies that showed that the Mossie was a much more efficient means of applying the same tonnage of bombs to a target because when a Mossie was lost, it was only 2 aircrew to replace vs a hvy bomber's 8-11 crew members, only two engines instead of four, wood instead of metal, ect. And far fewer of them were shot down anyway because the best defense for a bomber is speed. I have heard it was these studies that convinced the USAAF to drop using defensive guns all over a bomber and build the next generation of jet bombers for speed (like a Mossie). I'm sure the advent of AA missles had a lot to do with dropping gun turrets on every side of a bomber as well.
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yep, still had the wing bombs on. Problem is I didn't know I had em when I took off. Couldn't figure out why the kid was always pulling away from me :)
I was re-reading "Terror in the Starboard Seat" by Dave Mcintosh last night. He was a 418 RCAF Squadron Nav and they were flying "M-Mother" on at least their first few sorties. That's the AH Mossie code letter too.
He mentions Bannock a lot too.
As for Mossies to Berlin. Mosquito at War, by Chaz Bowyer, mentions Mossies going to Berlin 36 nights in a row.
Dan/Slack
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Apologies for repeating posts on the same subject - but have a look over in the O'Club forum re: Toronto Aerospace Museum, December 6.
They are holding a "Mosquito Symposium" - Russ Bannock (mentioned above) is the featured speaker!
The AH Mossie FB.VI doesn't prosper quite so well as in real-life. As in the posts above, it's equipped with the speed-robbing flame dampers used for night operations. Plenty of Mossies on daylight operations used the ejector exhausts, which added 12-15 mph (not inconsequential when being chased by Fw190s).
Also, many, but not all (according to the pilot's discretion!) of the daylight Ranger sorties took place on days when low cloud layers offered some cover should the Mossie be spotted by enemy fighters. In the right hands, it could hold its own against 190s, but it wasn't recommended.
Various other gameplay issues make the Mossie fan's job harder. For instance, the flashing icons give the game away on Intruder flights, when really aircraft taking off and landing generally didn't realise the danger until the Mossie was on top of them.
In addition, the glowing icons make night ops rather unrealistic. Finally, the boost figures in the Mosquito cockpit are also out by several pounds (for the standard Merlin 25 engine) - given the fact most of us fly flat out all the time, that's probably a minor issue.
The 150-octane issue is problematic. I don't know what the state of the research on this is now, but from what I've seen, the Mossies had it in 1944 for (night-time) anti-V1 operations only. I've seen documents related to 2nd TAF, in which many Mosquito Fighter-Bomber squadrons served, as having 150 octane available later in the war. If you give it to the Mossies though, you'd have to give it to the Mustangs etc. as well.
Incidentally, with 150-octane, +24lbs boost (required Merlin 25 engines), and ejector exhausts, the Mossie VI could indeed manage 375 at sea level - 377 to be exact I believe. With the addition of nitro, it got up to 395, but I don't believe it was ever used in combat in that configuration. However, some radar-equipped home-defence nightfighters did have nitro tanks, the first kill for this setup coming in January 1944.
I'd love to see a Mosquito bomber in AH - as noted above, the bomber versions were quicker than their fighter counterparts, due at least in part to the vee windscreen. The later versions got well above 400 mph at altitude with a max 4,000 lb bombload.
Anyway, go check out the post in the O'Club forum - there's a link to the Toronto Aerospace Museum there.
Cheers,
Scherf
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Did the make 400 mph WITH the bombload? if so, WOW!!!!!
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I wish we had these sounds in our AH sounds file: Mosquito Startup and Fly By (http://www.mossie.org/sounds/mosquito_complete.mp3)
Maybe someone can figure out how to do it?
For more info go to http://www.mossie.org/Mosquito.html (http://www.mossie.org/Mosquito.html)
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There's not many finer sounds than a Merlin engine flypast. I feel sorry for those people that have not seen/heard a Spitfire fly by!
Thanks for the link :)
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One final point of course, is that in AH the Mossie has to contend with lots of fast allied fighters, when in real life the only real danger it faced, apart from flak, was the 190.
Cheers,
Scherf
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Originally posted by Scherf
One final point of course, is that in AH the Mossie has to contend with lots of fast allied fighters, when in real life the only real danger it faced, apart from flak, was the 190.
That is true, though 109s are more dangerous than 190s. The fast Allied fighters have always been the reason I thought the Mossie had the most trouble in AH. Still, even with the Allied fighters an undamped Mossie in 1943 was among the fastest aircraft.
It is also true that in WWII a 109 was most likely a 109G-6 and a 109 was most likely a 190A whereas in AH a 109 is most likely a 109G-10 and a 190 is most likely a 190D-9. A Mosquito without exhaust dampers will out run a 190A, but not a 190D. It will come closer to pacing a 109G-6/AS than a 109G-10 and will outrun a 109G-2 or G-6.
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Hi again:
I believe the Mossie's claim to being "the fastest aircraft of its day" was based on a series of tests done (going from memory here, got the details at home) at Boscombe Down. The Mosquito with (again, memory!) Merlin 66s was clocked at 427 mph, faster than the P-51 and P-47 which were tested subsequently by the same authority.
Incidentally, the airframe used for this test was the prototype, W4050, which can still be seen today at the Mosquito Museum at Salisbury Hall.
The late-war mossie bombers actually dispensed with the flame dampers in favour of ejector-type exhausts, the belief being that the increased speed was more valuable than the reduced visibility offered by the dampers.
Cheers,
Scherf
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Originally posted by Scherf
Hi again:
I believe the Mossie's claim to being "the fastest aircraft of its day" was based on a series of tests done (going from memory here, got the details at home) at Boscombe Down. The Mosquito with (again, memory!) Merlin 66s was clocked at 427 mph, faster than the P-51 and P-47 which were tested subsequently by the same authority.
Incidentally, the airframe used for this test was the prototype, W4050, which can still be seen today at the Mosquito Museum at Salisbury Hall.
The late-war mossie bombers actually dispensed with the flame dampers in favour of ejector-type exhausts, the belief being that the increased speed was more valuable than the reduced visibility offered by the dampers.
Cheers,
Scherf
The Prototype was much lighter than the FB-VI that we have in AH.
(http://www.btinternet.com/~nexx/Mosquito-prototype.jpg)
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More Mossie stuff.
A pilot's view of the Mosquito Mk VI FB by Jimmy Gill. First published by the Mosquito Museum Newsletter on the
50th Anniversary of the first flight of the Mosquito (by Geoffrey de Havilland at Salisbury Hall on 25 November
1940).
1. Initiation
When converting to the Mosquito from single-seat Merlin-engined aircraft the immediate thought was that the Mosquito
was too big and too heavy to fly in similar roles and should never have been allowed. However, a few sessions in a
T3 accompanied by a 'true believer' started the process of convincing yet another doubter. To be told that "this
aircraft will do all that your singles will do - and what's more they'll do it on one" - and then to have it proved
on the spot - not only made for a very impressive and telling start, but also set the nerve ends tingling in the
right direction of excitement.
2. The Next Stage
Transfer to the Mk VI FB, however, was the ultimate experience. With the possible exception of a few bad habits -
and even those evaporated during the first 50 or so hours of flying - here was the aircraft. It had all the controls
necessary to make it do what the pilot wanted, at an early stage and progressively. It inspired the pilot to greater
confidence in his ability to extract its full potential. On the one hand it was sufficiently docile to ease the
flying of it but on the other it could impose significant penalties for laxity, abuse or blatant over-confidence.
The line between these two conditions needed to be learned, recognised, and thoroughly understood at the earliest
possible stage. Stick control helped to make it exceptionally manoeuvrable up to medium altitudes and particularly
so at ultra-low level where good speed into wind and down sun made its unnaturally quiet approach even more
difficult to detect.
3. The Armament
A large well-tailored stick (cannily cranked to cause the pilot's position to conform with the contour of the
fuselage) bound with raw hemp was truly a man's stick and right-hand on, was surrounded by a cluster of controls all
within easy reach of fingers/thumb on the same hand - transmit button, 4 x .303 Brownings (in the nose), 8 x RPs
(under-wing) with 25 lb or 60 lb heads, 4 x 500 lb bombs (in the enclosed bomb-bay) and a large hooked trigger for 4
x 20 mm cannon (in the forward fuselage) which was operated by the right fore-finger. This concentration of
potential destructive power spawned a flow like an adrenalin of liquid invincibility into the blood stream. An acrid
tang in the nostrils via the oxygen mask of burnt cordite fumes seeping up into the cockpit from the forward belly
after the cannon had been fired served to stimulate further the sensation of absolute power. The gun-sight was
adequate and simple enough to avoid attention being diverted unnecessarily from flying the aircraft. With
experience, bombs and RP could be aimed very accurately at low-level merely by looking straight ahead through the
flat windscreen and releasing when the relative positions looked right! This required a little practice (primitive
wax pencil lines on the inside of the windscreen helped some) but the indivisible bond between pilot and aircraft
allowed the skill to be acquired naturally - and for the most, quite quickly. Same seat/pilot head height in
relation to windscreen/cockpit was essential for consistent accuracy in these respects. The VI was a particularly
stable weapons platform and even a stoppage on an outer cannon had no adverse directional effect.
4. Crew/Aircraft Relationship
With the navigator positioned slightly to the rear of the pilot (9" or so ) but physically touching, the bond
between them was, and needed to be, exceedingly close. Problems arising internally from any loss of RT were
virtually eliminated. This same proximity however did give rise to special difficulties in the event of emergency
exit being necessary. The drill was for the navigator to move forward, turn through 90 deg facing the escape hatch
and open his legs; it was then for the pilot to move to the right and get his head firmly between the navigator's
thighs. At this point the navigator released the hatch and both went out as a 'bundle'. The drill was practised on
the ground using inflated and inverted 'L Type' dinghies to break the fall. the navigator had generally the same
field of forward vision as the pilot which reduced the use of RT between the crew and a nudge and fore-finger sign
made pinpointing much easier. Affinity of ground crew to aircraft and complement was well above the average. It was
as though the very character and nature ofthe aircraft produced and exuded an aura of indelible quality which
automatically fused the aircraft, its crew, and the ground crew together to form an indivisible whole which inspired
the performance of each contributory element to a level well above its individual 'norm'.
5. The Later Stage
The aircraft carried with it a bad reputation on several aspects such as a severe swing to port during take-off and
an unheralded stall. It seems highly probable that both were overdone, having been magnified during the process of
being handed down by those, who wittingly or otherwise, had frightened themselves by attempting too much too soon.
With experience a tactical take-off was easily possible - even off PSP - by turning left from the peri-track to
runway with plenty of starboard engine to urge the motion and when still about 25° short of runway alignment,
opening the port engine firmly and fully to check the turn. This would produce tail-up in 50-100 yards and take-off
in 4-500 yards, and enabled a 'clean' attitude to be achieved much earlier. Similarly, a tactical landing was
another worthwhile precaution at the advanced stage. On return to base, aligned with the in-use runway, into wind,
50 feet over caravan at 240 mph then hoick the aircraft into a continuous climbing turn to port, a gravity-assisted
wheels-down at the apex of the turn (about 1000 feet high and 6-800 yards radius), continuing turn under reduced
power, flaps while still turning at about 130 mph, bringing nose gently up still turning to cross runway threshold
at about 115 mph, close any small amount of remaining engine and complete an almost three-point landing. Done well,
the port main wheel would just touch whilst the starboard and tail wheels had about 6" to go. It is significant that
the aircraft could be flown safely to those limits. The main advantage of the tactical approach and landing was that
from the initial point of 50 feet above the caravan the aircraft was within the airfield circuit and had sufficient
speed to be landed no matter if one or both engines failed during the subsequent approach. The main undercarriage
was big and accounted for considerable drag when down. One of the worst possible situations a pilot could face was
the loss of an engine (especially the port) during the take-off, or, in the case of a long-winded 'airliner' type
approach, on the approach when the undercarriage was down. In this event, to overcome the drag and stay in the air
required the use of more power from the live engine (even if it had been possible to feather on the dead engine) but
the more power the greater the torque and the consequential loss of directional control. By dint of very careful and
judicious use of everything - rudder, aileron and live engine - it was possible to keep the aircraft flying (albeit
on the 'skew') until the main gear and flaps were up. On 4 Squadron this flying attitude (not to be practised) was
known as a 'skunt'. Once the aircraft was clean its performance on the live engine was more than adequate to permit
its recovery. If, however, it was ever necessary to do a wheels up landing in a paddle-bladed aircraft with the port
engine running or wind-milling, there was a fear that, unlike the slimmer de-Havilland type, the stiffer paddle
blades would not 'banana peel' on impact but would cause the prop-shaft to shear behind the reduction gear leaving
the anti-clockwise turning port propeller (looking from the front) free to cartwheel through the cockpit.
6. The Merlins
Whilst the loss of an engine during the take-off or landing was ever near the surface of the pilot's mind at these
critical stages, it rarely happened. The Merlins were all that one could wish for - powerful, reliable and 'sweet as
a nut'. They stood a lot of hammer and formed a vital part of this classic combination.
7. The Balance
The vices attributed to the Mk VI, real or imagined, were trifling when compared with the massive pre-eminence of
its design and performance. There can remain no doubt that by any standards the Mk VI FB was a most remarkable
aircraft - good pedigree, good looking, fast, long range, versatile, well armed, highly manoeuvrable, and capable of
being flown to extremely tight but safe margins. The affinity between aircraft and crew was absolute and its
excellence brought out the best in all; but like any true thoroughbred, it could be a bit temperamental with any
whom it sensed were not in full control. From a pilot's point of view - superb, well respected, and well loved. That
more of this magnificent aircraft were not retained in an airworthy state for posterity is both deplorable and
unforgivably sad.
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Took another Mossie Ranger flight tonite with the kid. Knights getting clobbered, so we went the long way around to hit the Rooks radar just to see if we could get through and maybe cause a little trouble. 40 minutes one way on the deck. Great fun.
The kid took a massive flak hit as the screenshot shows, losing an engine and most of his right wing. He still managed another run on the radar station before he went down.
I made three runs before the flak got me too. 40 minutes back solo seemed like too long a trip :) 24 buildings destroyed messages and 4 gun emplacements before we were down.
Don't know that it had any impact on 'the war' but it was a fun challenge to get through without getting clobbered by fighters
Dan/Slack
(http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/ah_169_1070345524.jpg)
(http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/ah_169_1070345558.jpg)
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Great article Furball.
I'm on the board of the NW Friends of the Aces and Jim "Lou" Luma is our ace advisor. He had five victories in the Mosquito flying for the 418 squadron as a night fighter. Roy Grinnell is almost finished with a new print with Lou's night kill of a Me-410 as the subject matter. The print will be available to the public this coming Spring.
All in all it's nice to hear ace's stories first hand, especially in a plane like the Mossie.
:aok
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Good pics of 418 Squadron, including Lou Luma (lower left photo) are at:
http://www.rcaf.com/photographs/418squadron/photo.shtml
The pic of Russ Bannock and Bob Bruce doesn't work for me, perhaps it's getting particularly high traffic with the Dec. 6 Mosquito Symposium coming up.
One can only hope. :D
Cheers,
Scherf
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We had a fun mossie run last night as a squad.
(http://4wing.obviousonline.com/forums/uploads/post-2-1070429402.gif)
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Got an AAR Manx?
Cheers,
Scherf
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Wish I did, I got blasted by a Spit IX a few minutes after the engagment started with 2 scalps and had to reup to join the fight. I got back with a new Mossie popped 4 and had to return about 4 minutes after the main group landed. I do know it was at a5 and the defenders did their best to stop us. We'd hit the base prior to that in about 12 formations of those Japanese bombers I can never seem to remember the name of. So they were a little surprised to see us again in Mosquito's to say the least.
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woooow.....
can you imagina that...10 fuggin mossies coming at your base.
man the firepower is awesome....nice one manx:cool:
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lol great sortie manx & co.
Wolfala needs a slap for taking the wrong plane ;) :D
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We started with 13, but 3 of us got smacked in the ensuing fight. Guess 13 really is an unlucky number for me and the other two.
Was fun though, and a run we'll definitelly do more of in the future.
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Originally posted by TheManx
We started with 13, but 3 of us got smacked in the ensuing fight. Guess 13 really is an unlucky number for me and the other two.
Was fun though, and a run we'll definitelly do more of in the future.
HAH! Manx has the Mossie addiction. :)
Now take it a step further and send your guys out in pairs on the deck from different bases and try and meet up somewhere deep in bad guy land to knock out the radar or HQ or the Gestapo prison at Amiens :)
Dan/Slack
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I've flown the mossie pretty much since I've been here. It's a great plane, but over the last few camps I've made more of an effort to make it a useful addition to our squad. It definitelly takes a bit of work.
Unfortunatelly our group isn't terribly well known for stratting radar factories. We generally only hit the strats of bases we're planning on owning or ones where the other team is stratting our field from. Having an enemy who has no idea where we are defeats the purpose of squad runs in my opinion.
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:aok