Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: leitwolf on December 15, 2003, 05:44:48 PM
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Change fuel burn rate to 1.0 on the big maps.
It's not the perfect solution but a very simple and effective workaround.
Think about it. :)
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but we all have FUN watching lazs minid slapshot and beetl make fools of themselves...and ANY form of solution would stop them from doing it...thus ruining our FUN and we cant have that now can we???
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Wow, a good idea that only takes one sentence to explain. Go figure :rolleyes:
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that would fix the fuel shortage problem but the bases would still be too far apart on most of the maps to have good fights for early war/slow planes.
lazs
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I suggested this idea a long time ago. :)
-- Todd/Leviathn
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Or just make the fuel amount mean gallons/litres instead of percentage of plane's fuel tanks.
This way the planes with smaller fuel tanks would not be affected with 100% and 75%. They would get less fuel maybe only after reduction to 50%.
After all it does not make any sense to give different planes different amount of fuel from a suffering base!!!
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Originally posted by BlauK
Or just make the fuel amount mean gallons/litres instead of percentage of plane's fuel tanks.
Yes I fully agree with this one. I'm not sure what the objective was for the current percentage-based method, but it doesn't make much sense to me.
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Originally posted by vorticon
but we all have FUN watching lazs minid slapshot and beetl make fools of themselves...and ANY form of solution would stop them from doing it...thus ruining our FUN and we cant have that now can we???
Ooooo ... Slayed by the rapier wit of a 14 year old boy who wears lipstick and always partakes in deep witty conversations in the "Free Multiplayer Forum".
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just go to the quake arena (dueling) and stop the whining.
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what fuel problem? the only prob that might exist is when nit/rook bases have gas on their front line.
if you see this, let me know. will do my best to rectify.:rofl
hap1
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Originally posted by leitwolf
Change fuel burn rate to 1.0 on the big maps.
It's not the perfect solution but a very simple and effective workaround.
Think about it. :)
yes i agree this would go a ways in addressing the ever increasing wide-spread fuel porkage and hosed re-supply.
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Originally posted by SlapShot
Ooooo ... Slayed by the rapier wit of a 14 year old boy who wears lipstick and always partakes in deep witty conversations in the "Free Multiplayer Forum".
ooooooo... he's the *one* with the purty mouth?
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There is an easy fix to this and all the problems here on these boards. Turn AH into a simulation instead of a game. The numbers are there, why cant we just use what was actually available during the war. why must there be debate on how to set "fuel burn/multiple other complaints" to increase game play. If you didnt have parts for the aircraft they didnt fly it was just that simple.
RHIN0
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If I want to deal with attrition, I'll go play ww2ol
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Thats a good idea.
I never understood the fuel pork thing till this week. More time in the bigger maps opens your eyes. Course I actually hunted the bastards that were doing nothing but porking, was kinda a fun hunt. Thing is they are relentless, and never even turn to fight, just blaze by and go suicide, kill it at any rate. Up again, repeat.
Not sure there is anything wrong with it though, it's fair. Just have no idea the drive?
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never understood the fuel pork thing till this week. More time in the bigger maps opens your eyes. Course I actually hunted the bastards that were doing nothing but porking, was kinda a fun hunt. Thing is they are relentless, and never even turn to fight, just blaze by and go suicide, kill it at any rate. Up again, repeat.
Not sure there is anything wrong with it though, it's fair. Just have no idea the drive?
The Drive - thats easy they suck at ACM and can't fight. They hate the people that are having fun fighting. They have to ruin the fun for the people that want to fight.
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Isnt attrition what we are talking about here. If you only have 25% fuel at a base then thats all you have. Your option is to fly with it or come from another base. To decrease burn rate is simply insane to me. Why even have fuel tanks/ammo/troops at a base. That is the goal of porking a base. Should we take that element out of the game also?
RHIN0
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If the resupply was not porked then fuel porking would not be an issue, because it takes an inordinate amount of resupply trips compared to the one suicide dweeb pork run it is an issue.
Plain and simple. No body want to s remove the fuel pork strat affect they want an equally easy resupply.
To decrease burn rate is simply insane to me. Why even have fuel tanks/ammo/troops at a base. That is the goal of porking a base. Should we take that element out of the game also?
panties unbunched now?:D
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I agree it is a pain. However to inflict damage is substantially easier that to repair damage. It seems that is simulated well in the many resupply trips required. Otherwise porking would not be effective.
Also
The Drive - thats easy they suck at ACM and can't fight. They hate the people that are having fun fighting. They have to ruin the fun for the people that want to fight.
Not everyone that is good at ACM is equally good at A2G. That is a very fun part of the game. Winning the map is what drives me and if porking is required I am a willing pilot. Taking out a full field of ack, ammo and fuel with only a couple of pilots is better that shooting down 1 enemy.
Panties sufficiently unbunched :aok
RHIN0
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I agree it is a pain. However to inflict damage is substantially easier that to repair damage. It seems that is simulated well in the many resupply trips required. Otherwise porking would not be effective.
BS - It takes too many trips to resupply fuel. Your fuel porking would be just as affective except it would not last as long.
You strat guys are all the same, you don't care about the affect on furballing and you want your strat to be easy targets. What a joke.
If this were simulated well - A) it would be hard to find the fuel supplies. B) There would be a whole lot more of them. C) They would be much better defended and hardened.
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I agree. Resupplying should be a lot easier.
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B.S. - It takes just the right amount. A) Have you ever seen a real fuel storage facility? The real ones are much easier to see, they are huge. B) They are generally grouped together C) a 250LB bomb would be more than sufficient to destroy one. Or even a few incendiary cannon bursts would rip through and burst it into flames "its flammable!!”
10-15 trips will bring a field back up to full potential. Get some teamwork together and grab an M3 (Unless I already porked your back base troops in advance).
And I care all too much on the affect on furballing. I want it to stop (in that area) so my country can gain air superiority and capture your base. I have no problem with furballers if that’s what you want to do you pay your $15 the same as I do. Go furball somewhere else so I can get my job done more efficiently! After I have captured enough bases and I am bored Ill come furball with ya! Watch out for my 202.
Fuel burn should still be same as history dictates!
RHIN0
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And I care all too much on the affect on furballing. I want it to stop (in that area) so my country can gain air superiority and capture your base.
If you were any good at capturing bases you would take the base in tact and would not need to pork fuel. When I gave a crap about strat and was in the MAW we never porked the field and always took it in full. Like I said fuel porkers are just looking for the easy way out.
And your wrong about the fuel being stored in the open etc. Maybe in the rear where attacks were nill, but up front the fuel would be well hid, protected and hardened.
Also a few goons should be able to bring in enough fuel to supply many planes. It shouldn't take as many trips
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Originally posted by kevykev56
B.S. - It takes just the right amount. A) Have you ever seen a real fuel storage facility? The real ones are much easier to see, they are huge. B) They are generally grouped together C) a 250LB bomb would be more than sufficient to destroy one. Or even a few incendiary cannon bursts would rip through and burst it into flames "its flammable!!”
10-15 trips will bring a field back up to full potential. Get some teamwork together and grab an M3 (Unless I already porked your back base troops in advance).
And I care all too much on the affect on furballing. I want it to stop (in that area) so my country can gain air superiority and capture your base. I have no problem with furballers if that’s what you want to do you pay your $15 the same as I do. Go furball somewhere else so I can get my job done more efficiently! After I have captured enough bases and I am bored Ill come furball with ya! Watch out for my 202.
Fuel burn should still be same as history dictates!
RHIN0
kevy .... So if WE start a furball in an area of the map where YOU are not and eventually YOU decide that the base that WE are flying out of is next on your list, then WE should have to move or endure your porkin-dweebery so that YOU can "get your job done".
Read my lips ... take a BIG drink'a MY nose.
That is one of those most selfish and assinine statements I have seen in a long time.
Also, major fuel supplies at most fields were not layed out in the open ... and whatever fuel that might have been present on the field was more than likely not left out in the open either.
With that, I am sure that Chuck Yeager and the boys, on their way home, taking pot shots at targets of opportunity, more than likely didn't shut down a WHOLE base with just a couple of passes. Your weak attempt at a historical anecdote to justify the conseqences of AH fuel-porkin' dweebery, is weak at best.
And what Mars said ... As a past member of the MAW also, if you are any good at taking bases, porkin' is not a requirement. Porkin' is a sign of poor cooperation and weakness ... something that the MAW does not suffer from when it comes to strat and base taking.
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Sometimes we do take bases intact, indeed that is the preferred way, however you can’t do that without air superiority (Numbers). If the nme is just going to up and kill a goon. Unless of course it is a sneak. It can be done as long as numbers are on your side, and then it is still no guarantee.
I however agree fully with you that goons should have a larger airfield cargo capacity. However 1 or 2 trips still aren’t enough...Example
P51 internal tanks 180usGal full. SpitIX 102usGal (Average 141Gal). 1 Gallon of fuel @ 8.66lbs. Average fuel weight per Aircraft 1221.06 lbs. C-47 full cargo load 8700lbs, you now have enough fuel for approx 7 Aircraft fully loaded. Furballers up by the dozens (Some more than others).
M3s should have a decreased affect on the re-supply as compared to the Goon.
Fuel storage may not have been in the open but it was still at or near the aircraft. If you want to make it more realistic I have no problems with having the fuel come up at a random spot on the field and your ability to see the fuel not until you are at a low and relatively close say 1.5-2k away. Inside ack range would be good. That would require someone to kill ack before diving in on fuel (more realistic in my book). It would decrease the effectiveness of bombing drastically!
Guess I gave $.04 on that one.
RHIN0
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Rhino,
You are confused. In the MA the fuel burn rate is set to 1.5x's the real world burn rate. In essence 67% time aloft.
What is being requested is to turn the multiplyer back to 1x.
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kevy .... So if WE start a furball in an area of the map where YOU are not and eventually YOU decide that the base that WE are flying out of is next on your list, then WE should have to move or endure your porkin-dweebery so that YOU can "get your job done".
Absoloutley right on!! You have it now!!!
Call it selfish, assinine , dweebish all you want. It doesnt bother me. Nobody is going to tell me how to play a game that I pay for. I dont tell you how dweebish it is to furball, I dont care. If your base is in the path of victorious reset and our country dont have the numbers, it will be porked. If anything it enhances the ability to furball for my countrymen! they have more fuel and alt now.
I was posting when you posted this one or would have added my previous comments. I am in agreeance that the fuel is out in the open and should be harder to identify no probs there. If fuel was harder to see at distance then "Some" probs solved.
Also I agree that porking is a sign of poor cooperation and weakness. However you cant make people join missions, or even try to achieve a common goal. They are mostly too busy furballing with you! Too many generals not enough airmen.
RHIN0
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Rhino, You are confused. In the MA the fuel burn rate is set to 1.5x's the real world burn rate. In essence 67% time aloft.
Furious, I just got a little sidetracked on this post. It is moving away from its initial direction and it seems I am to blame. Fuel burn rate should be at the 1.0. Not my beef, just that on the side note of porking. It is not to blame!
I agree with the 1.0 multiplier, was just defending fellow porkers.
RHIN0
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Nobody is going to tell me how to play a game that I pay for.
Play the game anyway you want, pork to your little bovine heart's content ... just give me the equal ability to repair strat as easily as it took you to destroy it.
With this tremendous imbalance, YOU dictate how I play the game that I pay $15 a month, but on the otherhand, you have contempt for those that would try to force you to play any other way than what you paid $15 a month for.
See the irony in any of this ? I hope so.
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Somewhere we have a disconnect. I do understand your grief; I live it daily as a bish! However in order to prevent my country from being rolled daily I will continue to pork. If there is a change made I will roll with those punches also.
My goal is not to stop people from furballing I believe that seems to be what you’re getting from this. I do understand that I am forcing your hand when I pork your base. But my hand is being forced also because there are so many of you in the air. I love to furball its one of the greatest aspects of the game! Above all the people are what make this game great!!!
RHIN0
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Connected now ... <
> RHINO
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i disagree with making the fuel burn rate lower
its this high because fighters that could not fly far should be showen in the game a LA7 could not fly very far at all in real life and i think that should show in this game
i agree about the making the goons and m3's have a bigger inpact on the time it takes for the fuel to come back up
right now its just dumb it takes 1 dweeb a few gun passes to down everthing and it takes 4 to 5 goons to bring it back up
i think it should be 2 goons
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Simshell, simply put it takes 1 guy in a P51 Mustang 30 seconds to drop a field to 25% and it takes 10x as long to resupply it back to where it was.
Whats the fun in porking fuel? Those same fuel tanks are offline, the dogfights aren't.
I'd be happy with the fuel burn decreased or (better yet) increase the hardness of fuel to the hardness of a hanger. I have YET to see any gun cams of fuel tanks being so obviously placed around a field as they are in AH.
Yes, I can see it now...
"Gentmen, good morning. Today, you are taking part in the greatest mission in the history of the USAAF. The target for today is... fuel tanks! No, no, no... we will not be hitting a refinery but instead we'll hit fuel at every field in Europe. This way we'll only need about 50 of you, the rest turn in your wings and go into the infantry.
Alright pilots, come in at 15k, and make 3-4 passes upon the fuel tanks they have laid across their airfield with such obvious disregard and they will be grounded. Sure, they can send in supplies but we'll just send you in later, no big deal. Its not like they are ever going to hide the fuel, they'll just rebuild those same tanks.
Dismissed!"
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I believe this may have been buried in the mess from earlier. I would like to repost this...any thought on this as a somewhat fix?
I have no problems with having the fuel come up at a random spot on the field and your ability to see the fuel not until you are at a low and relatively close say 1.5-2k away. Inside ack range would be good. That would require someone to kill ack before diving in on fuel (more realistic in my book). It would decrease the effectiveness of bombing drastically!
Also it would be nice to see more field ack and a shorter down time for the field ack. I love to pork but it is too easy and should be a bit more challenging. It would take a concerted effort to take out fuel and not a rogue pilot.
RHIN0
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Glad to see youve come around RHINO,
The problem is HTC is never going to change anything that would require a programming mod (what you would like to see above) in the current AHI. They could however change the fuel burn very easily for the arena and that is what leitwolf was saying.
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Right, I understand the not changing the program as it stands now "VOX still has issues with no change". However it would be nice if voices were heard as the new AH2 is still in production/final development. I havent had a chance to play it much. Is this something that will be addressed in the future to prevent this situation?
Glad to see youve come around RHINO,
Hmm... I still believe in porking..:rolleyes:
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Hmm... I still believe in porking.. :rolleyes:
Yes ... I noticed ... but at least you are in agreement that it needs to be harder to actually "pork". If "pork"ing required much more skill and a concerted effort, than what we have at the moment ... I probably would not be as concerned about as I am now.
I say fuel needs to be hardened to at least 500-1000 lbs of equvialent ordinance to be destroyed.
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the fuel burn rate is this high because they want to simulate the short range of the LA7 109E-4 and many other aircraft that had short range
if you lower the burn rate
the short range fighters would not have to worry about fuel anymore which does not simulate the real planes weakness of range :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by kevykev56
why cant we just use what was actually available during the war. RHIN0
It's called the CT...:cool:
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It's called the CT...
I love the CT, Only thing missing there that was really in the war...Pilots, and just people in general.
RHIN0
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Originally posted by simshell
i agree about the making the goons and m3's have a bigger inpact on the time it takes for the fuel to come back up
There's a simple way to address the problem for goons... If you've got supplies, allow goon formations. Hell, just allow formations regardless of what a goon is carrying -- they're vulnerable enough already; given the limitations on drones following the lead plane, you're pretty much just going to pad someone's score if they bounce you in a goon formation.
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Originally posted by mars01
The Drive - thats easy they suck at ACM and can't fight. They hate the people that are having fun fighting. They have to ruin the fun for the people that want to fight.
mars, i'm sure you're correct for some but not all. and i suppose not many as well.
the "drive" stems from a desire to win the war. shooting down a pilot, 1 of the game's resources, really makes no sense from a tactical point of view unless they be a goon, i think.
if you can expend time destroying something that stays dead for 2 hrs versus a pilot who stays ded for 1 second, from the pov of wanting to win the war, there's no choice.
as to why folks play, they play for fun. as to how they play, to each their own.
to make the game suit your preferences, all you need do is convince dale to make fuel unporkable. done deal.
on the help menu, the very 1st page lays out the strat system which i think mimics well enough what real nations must master to wage war effectively. (awful notion isn't it) so, here's the game for good or ill copying fairly well real war. rommel lost his supply line in africa and the theater closed on germany.
the 1 aspect of real war that the game does not replicate is getting killed and a country having to come up with trained and able soldiers. that also, with manufacturing reduction and/or destruction of base resources, accounts for just about the whole deal in aces high.
as far as your "they suck at acm and can't fight." i'm sure for some, maybe many your're spot on. for many, you're not.
all in all, your beef should be with hitech and co. you telling us, won't change our tactics. talk to the folk who can. if they won't do it your way, why complain?
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MMMMMMMMMMMM
Porkers... The other white meat :D
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The "drive" comes from the fact that winning the war lays heavily into people's minds, but doing the job to help your country win is very easy as long as you don't care about scores.
Average or less skilled pilots who are not so confident with their skills, still want to make themselves useful. They want to help, and become a part of something. Their hearts are in good place.
Unfortunately, the motivation towards learning proper methods and skill is heavily outweighed by temptations to help your country as immediately as possible.
Would fuel porking be so easy if everybody took the time to do it correctly?
To kill field strats in an ideal manner one must;
1) Organize people(which is hard most of the times)
2) Analyze enemy activity(needed for planning flightpath)
3) Making decisions as to continue with the attack or abort(if enemy field is heavily defended, going into an attack run without lot of friendly fighters would be suicidal)
4) Start attack runs from appropriate altitudes(which takes time)
5) Execute proper dive bombing, pulling out from a safe distance/alt(which makes the accuracy suffer)
The irony of fighting off unskilled jabo pilots is, they are so unpredictable, that their attacks cannot be stopped.
Sure, they don't intend to die on purpose, but nine times out of ten, their lacking methods will end up getting themselves killed in the process. But the problem is, while the death of a pilot is short, and has no profound price to pay, the effect of their senseless attack is devastating.
Shouldn't the MA at least encourage pilots to indulge deeper into the fun and joy of learning?
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The 'deal', was set in the days when AH was still young. It's a new AH MA now, a new era.
It's an era where the trained experts are few, and don't make any large impact in the warring states, as compared to the days when MA was small, where the elites of famed squads would fight other elites, and it was the fight which was important, rather than the outcome of the war.
Now, it's a whole new era of the norm - some 200 pilots per each countries, among them only a handful can be called "skilled".
Most are average grade pilots who knows only the basic concepts of dogfighting and bombing, but lacks practice and training. Those guys make the MA now. And that's one of the reasons why the veterans complain that they don't see any real fights anymore.
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"Real war" is upon us guys, whether we like it or not. It's about which country has more manpower, the large scale fights of largely average people, rather than the "duel" type of mentality seen in the early days of MA. "My country winning", is a lot more important than itused to be.
Suggesting a change which forces the gameplay of the MA going back into the early days is retro, but that doesn't mean it should stay as it is.
Currently, the MA is sort of like a real war in that "average soldiers" dictate the outcome of the war than a few handful elites. But in another sense, it lacks some of the aspects of the "real war" which at least forced the average skilled soldiers into certain amount of discipline and organized activity.
Death means nothing in virtuality, so fear means also nothing. People just group hordes of people and do what they do in the fastest way they can - an organized group attack is actually less effective than chaotic kamikazes, in this sort of environment! Taking time to learn skills to enjoy the full extent of what the game offers - the "learning curve" - is broken!!
In that sense, suggestions to implement different strat systems is valid - it's not just about doing away with the current tendency of MA because you personally hate it. It's about a more subtle system which can encourage the people to learn the proper ways and methods of combat.
The old days of AH MA was like medieval ages, where a group of chosen blue-bloods engaged in duel like fights. The real war is different in that it mobilizes huge forces of amateuer soldiers and trains them for effective use.
The current MA, is like a modern state war where many people are mobilized and huge armies gathered, but the strat system being primitive pushes the countries to just push everyone into a single battlefield where tactics remain in the stone ages. All the possible fun factor is killed, and replaced by the motive to win..and people no longer the fun of simulated combat they used to.
Suggesting a better strat system, is suggesting to bring back some of the combat techniques and disciplines once needed in the old days, without reverting the arena into the old days.
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Originally posted by Kweassa
Suggesting a better strat system, is suggesting to bring back some of the combat techniques and disciplines.
if you mean "how to" i agree. i don't see the relation 'tween a "better strat stystem" and techniques and disciplines.
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Bottom line is the fuel resupply vs hardness is greatly offset and unbalanced. It reduces the kind of gameplay to only one form - Strat. BORING!!!!!!!!!
I myself have gotten beyond the take off, climb, drop bombs die by ack or auger, take off climb drop bombs ... wake me when its over, strat game - who cares who wins the war. If I want to drop bombs I can offline yippeeeee and get the same dull feeling.
The fule problem and the base too far apart have removed the furball game. But obviousely you dont furball and you could careless about the furball community or you would understand the problem.
As for this BS all in all, your beef should be with hitech and co. you telling us, won't change our tactics. talk to the folk who can. if they won't do it your way, why complain?
I didn't start the thread, I responded to people who think there is no problem with the fuel resupply. It's not a complaint its a fact. Fuel resupply is porked and affects anyone who logs on to fight.
I would venture a guess that anyone worth their weight as a fighter doesn't pork fuel except out of desperation or payback. If you disagress produce the lemmings. I find most peopl that can fight are looking for one and not wasting time porking fuel.
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if you mean "how to" i agree. i don't see the relation 'tween a "better strat stystem" and techniques and disciplines.
Sorry for the long write, I tend to get carried away.
To make it simple and short, killing strat is easy, while it's effect is immediately devastating in the case of fuels.
Average/newbie pilots don't need to spend time and effort to properly master techniques and discipline needed for combat.
They want to do something for they country, and all they have to do is fly a plane with bombs and go run in to something. The suicidal, "kamikaze" jabos we see in MA is not only the same thing in form, but also in the mindset, of the real-war, Japanese kamikaze jabo pilots. (Or at least, the guys who ordered the kamikaze attacks)
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The old days of AH MA was like medieval ages, where a group of chosen blue-bloods engaged in duel like fights. The real war is different in that it mobilizes huge forces of amateuer soldiers and trains them for effective use.
The current MA, is like a modern state war where many people are mobilized and huge armies gathered, but the strat system being primitive pushes the countries to just push everyone into a single battlefield where tactics remain in the stone ages. All the possible fun factor is killed, and replaced by the motive to win..and people no longer the fun of simulated combat they used to.
Suggesting a better strat system, is suggesting to bring back some of the combat techniques and disciplines once needed in the old days, without reverting the arena into the old days.
I agree with you about the mentality of the majority, but I disagree with you that it has to be one way or another. If the maps and the strat model allowed for a furball environment to exist then there would be little problem.
But today with the fuel resupplly being so porked and the bases on some maps being so far away it has essentially killed furballing.
There are still people that want to furball, they just have no were to go and most strat people could care less.
Furballers don't want the strat game to go away we just want to be able to log in and find a nice furball. This means adequate fuel and closer bases. A simple fix to end all this BS between the two groups.
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Personally I don't think it's the newbs that hit the fuel and choke up the game - it's normally a old hand who knows exactly what he's doing and can close down a field in two passes.
Most newbs have no idea what to hit or how to hit the fuel on a field.
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yup you right. and to "fix" it, ask dale to make fuel unporkable.
i think that would be awful. but it would give you the game you want.
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yup you right. and to "fix" it, ask dale to make fuel unporkable.
How would this help those who want to play the game to reset the map and win the war. All this would do is give the country that has more players an unfair advantage. Give me 10 green newbs and let them go in on the best ACM pilot in this game and let’s see who will win. The real deal in this is the numbers, without fuel porking you can’t stop an enemies onslaught when your country is severely out numbered. Porking is essential to gameplay! Porking is the stone in David’s' sling.
RHIN0
cant we all just get along and fly multi-national formations around the arena...wouldn’t that be nice.
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It's not about making fuel unporkable, but it is about making fuel resupply more balanced. The way it stands now it takes too much time and effort to resupply what one fuel porker can do.
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If the fuel is precious to you why dont you simply defend it rather that go off furballing in some irrelevant location. Do your furballing defending your base and its fuel supply.
Sometimes it sounds like far too many players just want to score (lazy men from offence) no matter how many times the opponent scores against them (bah.. defenders are sissies). ;)
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If the fuel is precious to you why dont you simply defend it rather that go off furballing in some irrelevant location. Do your furballing defending your base and its fuel supply.
OK I guess your new or have not been following these threads for too long, because as it has been said countless times, that no matter how many defenders you up, you are not going to stop a fuel porking 51 from diving in from 20k and killing the fuel bunkers. He will get at least one or two passes killing at least 50% fuel. If he has at least on buddy with him they can drop it to 25% with ease. Or you dive after him he augers and your left to climb back up to get a front row seat to watch another weenie auger.
How many base defense sorties have you put up against determined fuel porkers? How many resupply runs have you made trying to get the fuel back up? I would venture a guess not too many since you still have not realized how uneven the fuel pork vs resupply model is.
ALSO - Defending against suicide fuel pork dweebs is one of the most boring ways to play this game!
Sometimes it sounds like far too many players just want to score (lazy men from offence) no matter how many times the opponent scores against them (bah.. defenders are sissies).
What the hell are you talking about here? Much to popular belief this is a combat game, the whole point is to go up fight and fight some more. So I guess upping to kill again would make sense, no? Unless your a sky accountant - then your not looking for fights your looking for easy non opposed kills.
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Aren't you an unfriendly little furballer.... :)
Originally posted by mars01
How many base defense sorties have you put up against determined fuel porkers?
Plenty enough to know that I can kill them if I attack them when they begin their dive (or before). Climbing high enough to be of any use to base defence just seems to be a concept most furballers cannot grasp. If there were a few more friendlies a bit higher, many fuel porking attacks could be stopped.
ALSO - Defending against suicide fuel pork dweebs is one of the most boring ways to play this game!
A kill is a kill, but certainly you are entitled to your opinion. I assume that the most enjoyable way is to chase a single con at the deck with 5 other friendlies in a line :)
What the hell are you talking about here? Much to popular belief this is a combat game, the whole point is to go up fight and fight some more. So I guess upping to kill again would make sense, no? Unless your a sky accountant - then your not looking for fights your looking for easy non opposed kills.
You dont actually have to die every 10 or 20 minutes to be able to play this game or to enjoy it. Boxing is some kind of combat too and you dont have to take a blow for every blow you give. You can actually try to avoid them, thus, try to give more than you receive.
What I meant earlier was that many people just chase the first possible kill no matter what.... and get killed in process. Very few look around and really try to defend a base (and its fuel) by trying to see where they could be most useful for a larger picture.
Many player enjoy the game quite enough even when they take off from the 2nd line bases behind the front. Typical furballers NEED the closests possible bases and their fuel but they do not put much effort in trying to keep what is precious to them.
IMO fuel porking is just fine, but the way it affects fuel availability at the moment is wrong!!! It should affect amount of fuel available, not percentage of each plane's fuel tanks (which are quite different). Thus, most likely normal fighters should still get 100% from a base which has only 50% fuel left. Only the largest bombers would then get filled to 50%. Base down to 25% would still offer 50% fuel for fighters and even furballers would be happier ;) This same system should concern refuelling - if a base has no fuel how can it refill the same fuel one had earlier from a "100% fuel" base? It cannot and should not.
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Aren't you an unfriendly little furballer....
How So, because I dont agree with you?
Plenty enough to know that I can kill them if I attack them when they begin their dive (or before).
Yeah because I want to spend 20mins+ waiting around at 20k. You may enjoy the boredom but I dont.
Climbing high enough to be of any use to base defence just seems to be a concept most furballers cannot grasp. If there were a few more friendlies a bit higher, many fuel porking attacks could be stopped.
And you base this on what. The furballers I know have a concept they just dont want to do it, because they are as safe at 5k as you think you are at 20k. It's the cherry picker sky accountants that need that 20k safety net and have no concept how to survive below 5k.
When I log onto maps like Pizza Crap or Big Isles the only options are long boring flights to 10 or 20 k only to meet guys like beetle and the like flying around at 25k. Again, when I log on I want to fight more than I fly. If all I wanted to do is fly around I could fire up MSF2004 and get a better experiance. This is a combat sim, forgive me for wanting to fight.
A kill is a kill, but certainly you are entitled to your opinion. I assume that the most enjoyable way is to chase a single con at the deck with 5 other friendlys in a line
Yeah you assume and you are wrong. I hate flying around gagles of friendlys and one enme. This is exactly what you proposed in you first thread. Defending against fuel porkers is exactly that. How can you say a kill is a kill then cry about a type of kill in the next breath. Your losing cred fast.
You dont actually have to die every 10 or 20 minutes to be able to play this game or to enjoy it. What I meant earlier was that many people just chase the first possible kill no matter what.... and get killed in process.
We'll I think anyone worth there weight knows this is a game of angles and situations. You have to pick or create the best situation and work the angles. When I log on I want to engage in a series of fights that push pilot and plane to the max. I want to end a run with my heart racing and adrenalin pumping. Your typical climb high and cherry pick does not do that for me. I find the cherry pick, while easy, in a word boring. No blood pumping, no adrenalin flowing. Just surgical boredom.
Many player enjoy the game quite enough even when they take off from the 2nd line bases behind the front. Typical furballers NEED the closest possible bases and their fuel but they do not put much effort in trying to keep what is precious to them.
Good, let them climb to their little hearts content. So you are saying that no players other than furballers want full fuel at the front line. What about your precious base defense? You guys like flying around on 25%?
IMO fuel porking is just fine, but the way it affects fuel availability at the moment is wrong!!! It should affect amount of fuel available, not percentage of each plane's fuel tanks (which are quite different). Thus, most likely normal fighters should still get 100% from a base which has only 50% fuel left. Only the largest bombers would then get filled to 50%. Base down to 25% would still offer 50% fuel for fighters and even furballers would be happier This same system should concern refueling - if a base has no fuel how can it refill the same fuel one had earlier from a "100% fuel" base? It cannot and should not.
Only thing you said that makes sense.:aok