Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: United on January 08, 2004, 10:03:22 PM
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I've noticed all the anti-Bush posts here, but have never noticed a single anti or pro-Tony Blair post. What do you Brits think of him?
Is he really that good or do you just keep quiet about him?
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Heh.
If you read what the British are saying and doing about Blair you'd realize that Bush got a "Get out of jail free" card.
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In typical English fashion, they eat their best first.
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lol Yeager, you haven't lived in Blair's Britain for the last 6 and half years.
Increased taxes with little or no improvement in public services
No income tax rises, but Stealth taxes by the hundred (petrol etc)
Raiding of pension schemes
Unbelieveably convoluted child benefit system to hide increased government hoarding of cash
Diluted Higher Education standards
Meaningless salamandering about with Secondary schooling
Endless spin
Broken manifesto promises (x2)
Implementation of the Strategic Defence Review (basically less troops but more high tech at a time when we are sending on more troops abroad... weird)
Same shrecked up public transport system (although decades of underfunding meant it was never going to be easy [a big thanks to Maggie Thatcher in particular for that one])
There's really no-one to vote for in this country. I hate to say it, but they really are all the same. The tories won't recind what labour have built in terms of taxation, and the Tories record on public services is appalling to say the least.
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Originally posted by United
I've noticed all the anti-Bush posts here, but have never noticed a single anti or pro-Tony Blair post. What do you Brits think of him?
Is he really that good or do you just keep quiet about him?
He's a lying pos who will do ANYTHING to stay in power, type in
Hutton Enquiry and hit google - when 9/11 happened a Labour spin doctor sent out an email to her dept telling everyone that they should release any bad news on the same day as it wouldn't be reported due to 9/11 filling the headlines - scum is not a strong enough word - using a tragedy to cover your bellybutton and make yourself look better....her name was Jo Moore.
I could go on and on but watching Blair and current gov on tv is sickening - you know they're lying about every time they speak - squirming to give the absolute best view of themselves in every possible circumstance.
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Bah!
You lot have nothing on the invisible man John Howard our PM.
The more he bows and scrapes the less people care about it!?!?!!!!!
He got out of Iraq scot free, with almost zero backlash.
Old Johnny is lucky George W. doesn't stop suddenly or ole George would end up with Johnny's feet hanging out of his arse!
Tronsky
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Originally posted by -tronski-
Bah!
You lot have nothing on the invisible man John Howard our PM.
The more he bows and scrapes the less people care about it!?!?!!!!!
He got out of Iraq scot free, with almost zero backlash.
Old Johnny is lucky George W. doesn't stop suddenly or ole George would end up with Johnny's feet hanging out of his arse!
Tronsky
Oi!!.....I take grave exception to the claim that your PM is more disgusting and slimy than ours....ours is WAY more slimy, if you continue to make these wild accusations I will be forced to bring up the matter of the Rugby World Cup.
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Tronsky
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At least your PM is funny. The look on his face as he was 'congratulating' the England team was great. :D
Blair is an act. Pure and simple. His public personality is a superficial construct - I really can't take him seriously anymore.
I thought things were about to change for the better in 1997... that feeling lasted all of 3 weeks.
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For all you Yanks out there who don't understand, this is an example of what Blair doesn't seem to understand:
The Euro. For years now the debate has raged throughout parliament over the Euro. Lot of MPs seem to want to hold a referendum, a country wide vote on the subject. Lots of Brits also hold this view. Tony Blair doesn't. Tony Blair once said on camera that he'll decide whether or not we'll have a referendum on any subject and he doesn't think we need one on the Euro.
He doesn't think.
Well I'll tell you what I think shall I Mr Blair? I think you work for me, you are my Prime Minister, you do what I damn well tell you to do and if there's any confusion about what I want you to do then you can damn well ask me and find out.
How dare you think you can tell me what I think you should be doing for me.
That's what pisses me off about Blair, that he thinks he can do what he likes even when it's blatently clear that the British public doesn't like it. The power of peaceful demonstration is gone in England, even if 50 million people demonstrated outside No.10 it wouldn't make any difference simply because the PM doesn't give a toss. The only defence we have against Tony Blair are other MPs, but like all politicians they're still only out to fill their own agendas anyway so eventually, with plenty of dealing by Blair, he'll get whatever he wants.
Look what he's done / is doing to students. When he first came to power he cut student grants and introduced the student-loans company, didn't matter how many people protested. Now he's making it even worse with these 'top up fees', again doesn't matter how many people protest, the only thing he's worried about is the back-bench rebellion going on so in return he's just double dealing with the back benchers until they're no threat anymore.
In other words, the ruler has said "Mwaaahahahahaa, I'm going to sacrifice all your children to the Dragon." And no matter how much the people cried out he took no notice. Then the rulers own advisors said "No, you cannot do this." and so, in turn, the ruler spoke to each of them until enough of them have said "Doh, of course you can, I was being silly and incidentally thanks very much for the new estate in Buckinghamshire."
America, the next country you liberate from the shackles of a tyrant......can ya make it Britain please?
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-9/48257/20029211530-0-Swoop.gif)
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Good posts Dowding & Swoop.
I found this thread when doing a search for something else using 'taxes and tories' as a search argument.
Yes, it's very depressing with Blair/Labour in power, and likely to be re-elected next year by default.
What I would like to see is a rejuvenation of tory fortunes - not another Thatcherite government. I don't want to see another administration which creates divisions - haves/have-nots, and a north-south divide. I don't believe in what Labour is doing/has done. This massive explosion of the public sector is quite alarming - armies of civil servants who achieve... nothing.
Dowding/Swoop - if there were to be a referendum on joining the € , which way would you vote (if you don't mind my asking)? I'm inclined to say I would vote NO. Loss of control over our interest rates is not something which can be taken lightly.
Will we get a € referendum?
(http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/graphics/2004/03/30/ixd30big.gif)
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Originally posted by United
I've noticed all the anti-Bush posts here, but have never noticed a single anti or pro-Tony Blair post.
We don't complain about Bush's dog either.
See a pattern here?
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Gee, sounds like Blair is a diehard Democrat liberal. At least from the posts I saw here by the Brits.
He knows better than you how you should live.
He knows what you should think.
He knows that you should pay more of your money for government.
And all on your money! :p :p ;)
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anyone read the readers digest article this month where they compare bush/blair with churchill/roosevelt?
good article
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Originally posted by Swoop
For all you Yanks out there who don't understand, this is an example of what Blair doesn't seem to understand:
Well I'll tell you what I think shall I Mr Blair? I think you work for me, you are my Prime Minister, you do what I damn well tell you to do and if there's any confusion about what I want you to do then you can damn well ask me and find out.
How dare you think you can tell me what I think you should be doing for me.
That's what pisses me off about Blair, that he thinks he can do what he likes
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-9/48257/20029211530-0-Swoop.gif)
Heh, sounds familiar. Didn't we "colonists" have pretty much the same issue with King George a couple hundred yrs ago?
"...and the beat goes on..."
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The Brits just love Bliar
(http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2003/09/17/3bell.jpg)
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Originally posted by slimm50
Heh, sounds familiar. Didn't we "colonists" have pretty much the same issue with King George a couple hundred yrs ago?
"...and the beat goes on..."
Hey we had the same issue with him........but what say did a peasant have 200 years ago? 'bout the same as he does now really, bugger all.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-9/48257/20029211530-0-Swoop.gif)
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Originally posted by beet1e
Dowding/Swoop - if there were to be a referendum on joining the € , which way would you vote (if you don't mind my asking)? I'm inclined to say I would vote NO. Loss of control over our interest rates is not something which can be taken lightly.
I'd vote no. For various reasons. 1) Sterling is a great name for a currency don't ya think? 2) It's our bloody currency and we wanna keep it. 3) Who gives a toss about the convenience of a single currency, we've been using exchanges for years without a problem anyway. 4) If we'd have lost in 1940 we'd have a single currency, it may even have been named the Euro. Or maybe the ReichEuro.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-9/48257/20029211530-0-Swoop.gif)
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maybe they should give the power back to the Queen ....couldnt be any worse than what the have now
GOD SAVE THE QUEEN!!
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Ha the Euro. Despite all the arguments in Britain about the Euro. Not one country who has joined the Euro wants to go back.
But I find it mildly hilarious when Blair or Brown or whoever mumbles on about the 'five economic tests' Why five,why not six or four? It's a snowjob. They are waiting until public opinion swings towards the Euro.
That's because most arguments against Britain joining the Euro are more emotional than sensible, like Swoop's comments.
I'd vote no. For various reasons. 1) Sterling is a great name for a currency don't ya think? 2) It's our bloody currency and we wanna keep it. 3) Who gives a toss about the convenience of a single currency, we've been using exchanges for years without a problem anyway. 4) If we'd have lost in 1940 we'd have a single currency, it may even have been named the Euro. Or maybe the ReichEuro.
It rates alongside warm beer, the English banger. 'It's British and we're proud of it' with a tear in their eye. The loss of soverignty argument, it's tedious. The French, as the Yanks noticed haven't stopped being French nor have the Germans gained a sense of humour since joining the Euro. It's just money, guys, money. I personally don't care what colour the money is as long as I have lots of it.
Despite all the fuss over the issue not one country in Euroland seems to have suffered because of it. Only Britain it seems would lose it's identity becoming a Euro statelet, ruled from Strasbourg, the Queen exiled and be forced to drive on the right.
There won't be a referendum until public opinion favours the Euro. Anti Euros want a referendum because they know they'll win this time and that sets back the any chance of joining for many years. Another reason for the lack of a referendum is the fact that they are rare in British politics. Maybe it's to do with the lack of a written constitution, woudn't you say?
But like it or not Britain will join the Euro eventually. Probably just after it's realised that the economy has been damaged by staying out. I would even venture to suggest that it will be a Tory government who makes the decision. There are bigger issues at work here than mere holiday exchange rates and misty eyed sentimentality. No country truly controls it's own economy these days. The markets decide. Even the USA cannot change that. This is all about big business. When big business decides they want in. Britain will join.
That's the reality.
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The arguments against joining are not all emotional.
1) Joining the Euro means Westminster losing power to the EU. I have enough trouble getting Westminster to do what I want, let alone Brussels.
2) Joining the Euro means changing economic policy to be more in line with the other Euro zone countries. Take a look at how the French and German economies have fared in the last few years compared with the UK economy.
3) The single currency is a one size fit's all solution. One size doesn't fit all: there are significant differences between the different economies and good policy for one might not be good policy for another.
4) The EU has done a poor job management and control throughout it's lifetime (how much money has the CAP lost to embezzlement and fraud?). Look at the so called convergence criteria (i.e. public debt and spending): the Germans are allowed to violate it at will because they are a big country, likewise France has been manipulating it's figures since before the Euro was launched in order to meet the restrictions. How can you have a well run economy when the various regions can do whatever they like?
I'm all for open markets and a certain amount of standardization. After that further european integration makes no sense. The countries involved are just too diverse culturally, politcally and economically for it too work. Maybe after a few generations of convergence it might work well: for now it is an interesting experiment that I don't wish to be part of.
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The EU is a mistake IMO. I feel it's a big disaster waiting to happen.
Im not anti European though......I just feel the EU is a big powder keg and I honestly believe it could be the root cause of a major war in Europe some day.
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Originally posted by Eagler
anyone read the readers digest article this month where they compare bush/blair with churchill/roosevelt?
good article
hahahahahahahahaHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHA...........
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Pei, you were spot on with that post. If only joining the € were as easy as adapting to new bank notes and coins - something we did here in 1971.
But it isn't as easy, for the reasons Pei gave - particularly points 2 and 3. The individual economies do not work the same way, so it's pointless to pretend that they do. And yes, Germany was in the doo-doo last year as their economy was flagging. They needed interest rates to be set at around ½%, but were stuck with the Brussels mandated €-wide 3½%.
Disparate economies exist between the individual states of the US, but there they have a federal govt., federal taxes, federal grants etc. We don't have that - yet. I'm almost tempted to suggest that the single currency has been implemented to precipitate some form of economic crisis, and the only way to deal with it is... federal govt., federal taxes etc.
No thanks.
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Blair is a total avacado,Id sooner have a sheep in power..............mmmmmmmm:aok
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Originally posted by cpxxx
Ha the Euro.
So you've first hand experience of this then have you? You've polled every single European citizen and found every single one of them very happy with the Euro have you?
Well pal, I've lived in a European country that's switched from it's sovereign currency to the Euro.....in fact I was living here when the switch happened. The price of everything went up. Everything. If there was a round up or down to choose from it went up. And if there wasn't a round up or down to choose from they put the price up anyway.
I know plenty of Cloggies who'd like the Guilder back.
And have you seen the current situation in France and Germany?
Not suffered, my arse.
In fact I don't even want to be a part of the Common Market anymore, but getting out of that would be difficult to say the least.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-9/48257/20029211530-0-Swoop.gif)
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Originally posted by Swoop
And have you seen the current situation in France and Germany?
Not suffered, my arse.
Seriously for myself and my familly : nothing happened , nada ,zlitch ,nib ,que dalle !
Sure the price went up a bit but nothing like a disaster.
And those who cheated by increasing their prices got the previsible pay back : they lost customers.
@Pei I don't understand your sentence about Westminster as an Australian how will it have an impact on you.
Excuse my ignorance ,I don't know the link bewteen UK and commonwealth.
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Pei isn't an Australian.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-9/48257/20029211530-0-Swoop.gif)
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Maybe it's to do with the lack of a written constitution, woudn't you say?
Britain does have a written consitution, it's just not all written in one place. I think you're mistaking constitution for bill of rights.
As for the Euro, I'd rather not until the EU is seriously reformed.
As for Blair, he's a scumbag but he's the best we're going to get until either Brown replaces him or someone like Ken Clarke takes over the Conservative party.
When he first came to power he cut student grants and introduced the student-loans company
Nope, the Conservatives introduced the SLC in 1990 and froze the grants at the same time. I should know, I was in my 1st year at Uni at the time.
I just feel the EU is a big powder keg and I honestly believe it could be the root cause of a major war in Europe some day.
I'm sure you can expand on this theory Nuke, please enlighten us poor benighted Euros. :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by Dowding
I thought things were about to change for the better in 1997... that feeling lasted all of 3 weeks.
Yep, and you weren't the only one. I had hopes - not high hopes, just hopes - and yes, it lasted a few weeks, no more.
All this Blair spin about "New" Labour is just that - spin. It isn't New Labour. It isn't even Old Labour in a new disguise. It is, quite simply, Old Labour. Tax & Spend. Hurl money at public services but with no control over how it is spent. By 2006, the number of civil servants will be back to 1979 levels. Oh wait, they say they're cutting back. Oh well then it must be true. :rolleyes:
Labour has been discredited at every level - including immigration policy.
(http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/graphics/2004/03/31/ixd31big.gif)
Pei - nice avatar - Ringwood Old Thumper. I don't think I've ever had a pint of that, but if I do I'll drink to you mate! :cool:
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Actually, I think that having Avatars based on beers is a wonderful idea.
Ravs
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Originally posted by Momus--
Nope, the Conservatives introduced the SLC in 1990 and froze the grants at the same time. I should know, I was in my 1st year at Uni at the time.
Grants were halved again in 1998 for all current students and not available at all to new students. I should know, I was in my 1st year at Uni at the time.
But yes, the conservatives came up with the idea in the 1st place.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-9/48257/20029211530-0-Swoop.gif)
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Blair is only interested in his own ego. He doesn't care about anyone else unless he decides to use it towards his advantage. What I'd like to see is a mutiny! :)
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Originally posted by Replicant
Blair is only interested in his own ego. He doesn't care about anyone else unless he decides to use it towards his advantage. What I'd like to see is a mutiny! :)
Yarrrrrrr!!! Say no more mate!
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Originally posted by Eagler
anyone read the readers digest article this month where they compare bush/blair with churchill/roosevelt?
good article
Wow, just wow. I am sure readers digest is the source of all your most supreme intelligence.
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Originally posted by Frogm4n
Wow, just wow. I am sure readers digest is the source of all your most supreme intelligence.
no its actually crapper material ... sorta like ur posts :)
did you read the article or just another knee jerk reaction post..?
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Originally posted by Eagler
no its actually crapper material ... sorta like ur posts :)
did you read the article or just another knee jerk reaction post..?
"FLUSH!"
OWNED!!!! :rofl :rofl :aok
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Yo,
United,
IMHO he's a banana pure n simple (brit term of effection ;) )
Just the samo samo parasite in office, Can't see him lasting much longer myself
Pitty darn tories aint got their act together to aid in elections
Ahh, Voted labour once and that was a protest vote at the tories
After seeing new labour in action and all the hidden and not hidden taxations etc it seems to me heir blair is more tory than the darn tories ever were !!!!
At least with maggie ya knew she did wnat she said she wanted to etc
These slippery gits called new labour can't tell their r's from their elbows
And as for blunkett i think he did too much lsd at college or somert because he surely aint floating in coordination with the rest of us on this earth (his dog seems more inteligent at times)
Not one to dig at afflictions but this dudes not only visually blind he is blind to normality and common-sense
He is steamrolling a ID card through asap
Means all will have to carry one, Well that's all well n good but he uses this ID scheme as a way to comabt illegal aliens
Hmm let's see,,, OHH I SEE so these illegals will of course rush to get an ID card !!!
And if that's not bad enough millions was wasted testing this scheme sometime ago in netherlands (certain) and other surrounding countries i think
But hey up good ole new labour will find a way to make somert busted work :D i think not
Tories, Let's build a canvas dome on thames bank at greenwich...Labour, Damn you tories that's a stupid idea we are against it !!!, Tories topple, Along comes new labour n says hmm we like this canvas dome let's pump tax payers money into it seeing as it's only got a short lifespan !!! (weekly gaurding/main/etc still costing joe bloggs public here in uk btw lmao) new labour phewy more like pooh labour
Ohh he's an interesting fact for all you labour fans out there, Supposed to be for the working man wasn't it labour party eg Labour Party !
Funny how they aint up for unions anymore aint it ;)
Hmm who they just booted out the good ole largest union in uk the railworkers 1st time in history, Truth is new labour aint after working mans votes as it's been shown
Another, When labour got elected all the officials etc are given residencies etc and labour only trebled the price they could spend tarting the pads up, Not to mention all the works of art they brought out from secure places so they could impress colleagues etc lmao
Samo samo, Tories tell ya to ya face New labour slugs hide n sneak stuff in
IMHO of course
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Originally posted by cpxxx
Not one country who has joined the Euro wants to go back. ... Despite all the fuss over the issue not one country in Euroland seems to have suffered because of it.
Countries that have joined the Euro cannot go back to their old currencies. The EU is said to have form but no heart, because it is driven by politicians with their eye on the Euro Gravy Train, and not by the will of the people in those countries. (Neil Kinnock ? ;) )
The Euro ideal reminds me of the ERM. Each country is tied into interest rates set by Brussels, even though each country's economy is entirely different. I recall White Wednesday, when Britain was forced to put up interest rates to a staggering 15%, because Britain's economic cycle was not in line with those of other EU countries. And then it fell outta the ERM. :lol
I think Britain is doing very well (despite Tony Blair) without the Euro. It will do even better when TB and his cronies are gone.
Good riddance, I say!
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Blair just tries every trick in the book to win support. His constant ramblings though of how bad it was when the Tories were in control before 1997 is somewhat irrelevent now because Labour have done so little since coming into power.
The recent announcement of up to 40,000 civil service jobs to go within the Department of Works and Pensions is another attempt to try and win favour. Many people think civil servants are overpaid, well, I'm a civil servant and I can assure you that most are paid below the national recommended average wage. So, this might make an initial saving but then they'll end up have to recruit agency staff to fill in civil servants swapping jobs early, pay redundencies, pay consultancy fees for people wishing new jobs/retiring etc. Then they'll realise it hasn't worked and will have to recruit and retrain staff at added cost. I really don't think it's been thought through very well at all!
Another issue that many aren't familiar with is that when Labour entered Government they spent the emergency war treasure chest worth billions to try and influence the people into believing how good they were. Unfortunately they didn't expect another Gulf War and other peace keeping campaigns around the world leaving them heavily strapped for cash. This has meant reducing the armed forces and making other unnecessary cuts that could, and have, cost lives.
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It runs in cycles.......the Tories tighten belts and prep the country for economic stability and get voted out. Labour reaps the benefits of all the Tories careful book keeping and come up smelling of roses for a year or two.......and then it all falls appart and labour get voted out. Then the Tories come back and spend years repairing the damage done.......and get voted out.
Rince and repeat ad nausium.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-9/48257/20029211530-0-Swoop.gif)
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Originally posted by Swoop
It runs in cycles.......the Tories tighten belts and prep the country for economic stability and get voted out. Labour reaps the benefits of all the Tories careful book keeping and come up smelling of roses for a year or two.......and then it all falls appart and labour get voted out. Then the Tories come back and spend years repairing the damage done.......and get voted out.
100%