Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: -lazs- on November 05, 2000, 09:48:00 AM
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Seems simple really. Most of the stuff except the planes is in place.
Early war planes won't do well in the current mid/late war planeset. Options include some kind of "RPS" or "generations". Neither allow people who will only fly one type of late war plane a place to go when it isn't that planes time...
Sooo... One big map. Not much bigger than what we have but at one end.. Canyon world! Canyons and hills. Early war only planes enabled at those fields. Close fields that are tucked into the canyons and immune to high alt bombing. Sure, late war planes might be able to take enough fuel to get to the early war fields and back and maybe a tiny bit of fighting but... How good would they do twisting and turning amongst the canyons and hills? Make the fields far enough away that long range (U.S./jap) fighters lose interest and short range euro and Soviet planes can't get there and back.
It's a way to add early war planes without the inevitable "I quit cause I cqan't fly my ____ for a day or 10" whines.
lazs
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I like all the planes in AH but would be for just about anything to get some early planes in the air!
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Just put up a force field or a big net to keep the late war planes from getting to the early war area!
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Canyon style fighting would probably be enough of a force field.
Think about it... If you wanted you could fly a different set in a viable way all in the same arena! P40's Zekes, Spit 1's, wildcats, 109e's and 110's, Ki43's and P39's etc.
lazs
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Any idea that brings early war AC´s to AH is an good idea imho.
Regards.
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AH : Maniac
WB : -nr-1-
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I like the idea of being to fly early war aircraft against each other but I don't think this particular one would work.
Either:
1) The "field isolation" would work in which case we would effectively have 2 arenas. The early war area would probably be unpopulated as players would flock to the late war area because that is where the action was.
or
2) The "field isolation" wouldn't work. The early war area would be filled with late war aircraft.
Hooligan
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I still dont understand why a ww2 A/C simulator game, does not have early war planes?????????????. Can anyone explaine this to me.........
May I point out that the war started in 39, not when America entered in 42-43.
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Patience. The game hasn't even been pay-to-play for a year yet.
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How about a western europe map, with 40-41 plane set. Set it up to only have two countries, allied, and axis. With all the 19.95 flyers around HC should have enough to populate both this and the MA.
Maybe if the customer base gets spread around a bit, we won't have such excessive lagging in any particular arena.
Never seen such lagging in the MA as since the expanded customer base arrived.
...Weave
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hooligan.. u may be right. I tend to feel tho that just having the early war planes in place and in the arena is a plus. I also feel that most people will still fly the latter planes and... I think that is fine. I think that with "canyon world" (and radar)we won't need a large number of early war planes to make it an active/fun corner of the map to be in.
I believe that a dozen planes in each country flying in the canyon world early war will be plenty but I also think that 30-40 planes flying the early war planes won't particularly siphon off 30-40 planes from the other (late) war area of the map. I can't help but feel that most of those numbers (after a settling in period) will come from people who are not flying at all or not very much currently.
lazs
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I think I'll fly the 109F4 for a bit, and see if it is competitive.
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StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
(http://www.angelfire.com/nt/regoch/sig.gif)
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st... not sure of what your point is? Are you saying that the 109F is an early war plane like a Spit 1 or P40B? or... are you saying that the F is early in comparisson to the current set? There is a world of difference between the 109E and the 109F. I believe that the F is marginal in the current set and hopless as more late war planes are added.
My point for some type of seperation between aircraft generations without causing a total exclussion for days or weeks of an entire set remains.
If your point is that you are heroic for flying a marginal plane then, ok..... Your a hero. Most people are not heroic or martyrs tho so we do need some way for them to fly less advanced planes without getting beat up.
lazs
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They can Laz, fly WB.
Just kidding. Actually, I think the idea of flying Early/Late in the same arena is mutually exclusive of the idea of having plane choice.
What I mean is, sure some persons like to fly early mods, but why would/should they when they can fly the improved late mod of the same plane?
Lizking
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This (http://www.hitechcreations.com/images/rivets/200700.gif) is just one opinion on what would happen if a certain early war plane was modelled...
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I think the answer is a RPS will be valid WHEN we get many more planes.
I don't bu the "i cant fly my plane whine" if westart from say 1941 then you get
p40-p36-mustang Mk 1-p51b-p51d
109e-109f-109g
190a4-190a8-190d9
wildcat-hellcat-bearcat
f4u-1a f4u-1d f4u-4
a6m2 a6m5
yak 1 - yak 9 - yak 3
lagg - la5 - la5fn - la7
on and on and on
you get the idea. Most planes were available in *some* (sometimes very different) form throughout the war (exceptions being like teh N1k2, P47) But i think most p47 drivers wouldnt mind flyin a warhawk, or nik drivers wouldnt mind a zeke if they only had to fight warhawks and p-39s (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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There are two very easy and effective ways to incorperate early planes into the current arena and they are probabaly best when you use both ideas at once.
First of all a "rolling plane set" is a very effective way to introduce early planes. Have each day represent a month in time and you could have the entire gambit of planes within each month.
The second way is to make "earlier" planes be more resistant to being disabled by tactical bombing. If you made it so a field had to be damaged to the point of being flat before early planes were disabled, you would surely have valiant (impatient) players taking to the skies in older planes instead of flying for 15 minutes from a far off base. This not only helps gameplay, but represents a somewhat real world reality that older left over technology is often used when supplies of newer better stuff is unavalable.
Just my 2˘
8)
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I feel an RPS is the only way to go long term. I dearly hope this isn't an instance where the desire to be different from WB for the sake of difference (which is what I believe led to the unfortunate decision to add the C-Hog which, as far as I can tell, really violated Pyro's own principles for inclusion of "representative aircraft" but I digress) causes AH never to have an RPS.
Separate arenas simply do not work....the early war arena inevitably ends up deserted.
Nothing is more irritating than the pathetic whiners who moan about not being able to fly their uberplane for a few days.
Guys in the real war didn't get to fly their countries' uberplane all war, either (if they survived that long.) Plenty had to make difficult transitions to radically different aircraft.
If you can only fly one late war uberplane well you ain't much of a pilot.
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I believe arena numbers dropped when they instituted the RPS in WB. Even though I prefer a "generations" type RPS to the current AH everything arena, I think that AH needs to get a bigger customer base and figure out a way to make 2 viable arenas, rather than force an RPS down customer's throats.
Hooligan
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Hey guys i like early war dogfites. there is a lot more acm and action. It fits into my 1 or 2 hr a session style of flying but.... As hooligan said (and many of us know) People do not like to be forced to fly early war.
Any "generation" or RPS will force people to fly early war. Face it... some guys just aren't comfortable with the pace of early war just as a lot of us don't enjoy WWI sims that much or, on the other end, jet sims. The middle ground is the most fertile player base.
While one large arena may seem to some as no different than 2 seperate arenas, I say that there is a very large difference. When there is a lag in the action or when it can be observed that there is an upswing in action or even when you are just pissed off with the fight for one reason or another..... All you have to do is click on a field and be in a completely different environment using different tools and skills. Maybe you are exhausted from the rush of canyon fighting and turn and burn or... maybe you are bored with the long flights with no radar or not much action. Switch fields and enter a new war.
I love early war planes it's just that I don't want to force people to fly em. I don't want to hear the whining. I can't help but feel that the canyons and clouds of AH are the perfecrt place for em.
lazs
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I dont like early war stuff. Haveing said that, let me add, this sounds like a geat idea. Very creative. Nobody has to fly anything they dont want to.
Also. I know HTC has no interest in pulling players from WB (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif). But even so, this is bound to pull some of the nerf bullet guys from there.
[This message has been edited by easymo (edited 11-10-2000).]
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Interesting thread. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Guys... we have a plane set right now that has a lot of parity. There is a lot of viable planes to choose from in the arena. If we add late or early war planes we run into problems....
Late war planes??? Idiotic perk plane is one way.... Just dump some late war uber planes into an arena full of mid war planes and hope for the best.. Rps is another... have a period or two that is underused. Hope for the best.
Early war planes? Anti perk? if you don't do well or do often you get..... de-perked? you have to fly a P39? I guess the "perk" plane idea kinda makes every other plane a punishment anyway but.... Rps? Sorry, I love early war but it would be underattended and we would also have a lot of the aforesaid animosity.....
Seperate arena's? All but one would simply die. With arenas it seems... there can be only one.
Seems the only option is to have "arena area's" that allow some fairness but..... I'm open to suggestions.
lazs