Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: SunTracker on February 06, 2004, 08:59:57 PM
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Going white-water canoeing tommorow morning with my friend. Air temp is about 35, I imagine water temp will be about the same. Its rained all week, so the creek will be flooded. Here is a picture of the creek http://www.kyadventure.com/Images/large/white`otter7.jpg We will launch the canoe, paddle seven miles to the Ohio River, and paddle about one mile downstream to a boat ramp. I have never been white water canoeing before, but I think it ought to be a blast. Going to take my camera and an extra pair of clothes in a water-proof bag. Hypothermia could set in very quickly if we capsize.
I have looked for websites on how to negotiate rapids in a canoe, but cannot find any. If anyone has any advice/tips, they would be appreciated.
(http://www.kyadventure.com/Images/large/white`otter7.jpg)
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i have done white water rafting in Pennsyvania in the middle of summer, it was very wet and cold and i did not capsize.
i'm not sure what you mean by "white water", are you in a canoe or kayak? if your going white water in 35F in a canoe, wear a life vest and helmet and tell someone where you are going so they will know where to look for the bodies.
if you can , it's best to stop before each set of rapids and check how the water is running, you want to aim for the chute where most of the water is going, then keep the boat from going sideways and miss the rocks and hope.
have fun
good luck.
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Roger, going in a canoe. Am bringing dry clothes with me.
I should have bought a wetsuit.
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Ever seen the movie deliverence LOL.
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If you've never done white water before, you have a good chance of capsizing... it even happens when you're experienced. Definitely take extra clothing in a watertight bag, but secure it to yourself with a lanyard. Trust me on this.
I don't know if you're renting the canoe or your buddy owns it, but make sure it's a RIVER canoe. River canoes have no keel (lake canoes do have a keel). A keel will catch the currents and take you places you do not want to go. River canoes also tend to be wider and lower to the waterline.
As far as negotiating the rapids... best advice I can give you is, put the better paddler in back. The front paddler's job is to avoid the nasty stuff, but the rear guy keeps the canoe headed straight. As long as you're headed straight, you shouldn't capsize.
DO NOT sit in the seats! Kneel on the floor, with your knees as far apart as they go... it makes the CoG lower.
Bring a cell phone in a ziploc bag.
Good luck! You'll have a great time as long as you keep your wits and stay "ahead of the canoe". :)
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water is rated in classes 1-5
if the water is below 50 deg you up the rating by one.
buy or rent a wetsuit, or at the very least a splash suit (nylon with rubber cuffs and neck like on a dry suit)
if the water is truly 35 deg you will have less than 5 minutes in that temp of water before you are incapable of self-rescue.
I hope your friend is experienced enough.
and heres the most important white-water advice I could ever give anybody- Leave the beer in the take-out vehicle, do not drink before or during the trip.
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I've canoed white water my entire live. If you've never done it before, I sure hope your friend is experienced. If you're soloing it, heh, good luck.
There are numerous things to learn about canoing white water. You have to know how to read the water so you follow the currect path. Otherwise, you'll find each half of your canoe heading downstream seperately. You have to know a variety of strokes, J, draw, back, etc and the commands that go with them.
Heavy white water is not for the novice. It can be an expensive lesson.
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Hey guys, I'm alive :) Made it about 2 miles (out of 8 miles total) over consecutively larger rapids. We were sitting on our knees, which was extremely painful (my knees were bloody). My friend was sitting in the front of the twelve foot canoe, myself in the back. At one point we got lodged on some rocks and I thought for sure we were either going to capsize or freezing water was going to rush into the canoe.
My friend and I each had a pair of dry clothes, and several wax logs to start a fire with. Even so, we decided to abort the mission while we could still portage the canoe out. So I said to my friend "Hey, lets pull off to this cove on the left". The cove was right before the next set of rapids. I don't know what we hit, but somehow we got the canoe going backwards down the rapids. We slammed into the bank, I grabbed a big vine that was hanging down, and we finally stopped. Then we carried the canoe about 3 miles on our shoulders and were happy to be dry and non-hypothermic.
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lol... glad you made it okay.
Do it again after the winter thaw is almost over, when the current's not so heavy, and the water is much warmer.
What was the canoe made of?
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Fiberglass, and it actually got a small crack in it. Do you know if I can use epoxy to fix it?
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Yeah, just remember that resin adds weight. You'll want to patch it good.
Here are some tips.
Buy a book on white water canoing, and read it.
A 12' canoe is rather large for a white water canoe. REALLY large.
Wear rubber carpenter knee pads. They're cheap.
If you suck at white water, buy a dry bag. Again, they're cheap.
If you're good at white water, buy a dry bag.
Go with someone that's gone before, or start small.
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Hey Martlet, what about attachable out-riggers for canoes and kayaks. Would those make a canoe capable of handling class II rapids?
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Originally posted by SunTracker
Hey Martlet, what about attachable out-riggers for canoes and kayaks. Would those make a canoe capable of handling class II rapids?
No outriggers. They will hang on stuff and swamp you. Class two rapids are pretty gentle. You shouldn't even need floatation. While I disagree that a 12' boat is too big for two people, the knee pad suggestion is right on--I use a closed cell foam kneepad--they are much softer than the rubber ones and don't scar the boat but they don't last all that long.
Another solution is to glue a neoprene backed strip of foam to the area your knees will be resting.
Class 3 and above, I wouldn't go out without floatation--center, bow and stern. When you dump, it displaces water and makes the canoe float high.
As to the crack--it depends--on a glass boat, in stress areas, I would use the full fiberglass patching kits--it is not hard to learn, but your first results will be less than aesthetic so I would take it to a marina or outfitting shop for the repair.
If you want a boat that will last and is dang near invincible, look into ABS canoes rather than glass/kevlar. A bit heavier, but worth it.
This is a very nice boat--16 foot, good handling. You will see that whitewater SOLO boats run about 12'. Best of luck--it's a blast.
http://www.madrivercanoe.com/products/canoes.php?f=Freedom#Freedom-16-RX
h
(former upper Arkansas River guide)
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definitely no outriggers. They also make turning hard.
I was off on the boat size, though. I don't know what I was thinking. I used to solo in a 12', and do week white water trips in a 17' old town with 2 people. My apologies.
One of the keys to whitewater is maneuverability. Once you read the water, you have to get there. Avoid canoes with keels, and learn the strokes/commands. Stern and bow are both important positions, but traditionally the more experienced canoist is in the stern.
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(grin).. come on up, we have a bit of white-water here . . .
but you might want a better boat ;)
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True white water canoes are shorter than normal canoes and usually have built-in flotation either in the nose and tail or as a styrofoam block amidships.
For water that is as cold as you say, you're lucky you didn't kill yourself without wearing a wetsuit. Fortunately you exercised good judgment before things got out of hand.:aok Rent a wetsuit until the temps warm up.
Check this (http://gorp.away.com/gorp/activity/paddling/pad_how.htm) out.
Now that you know what not to do, you can do it again the right way.
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Originally posted by SunTracker
Going white-water canoeing tommorow morning with my friend. Air temp is about 35, I imagine water temp will be about the same. Its rained all week, so the creek will be flooded. Here is a picture of the creek http://www.kyadventure.com/Images/large/white`otter7.jpg We will launch the canoe, paddle seven miles to the Ohio River, and paddle about one mile downstream to a boat ramp. I have never been white water canoeing before, but I think it ought to be a blast. Going to take my camera and an extra pair of clothes in a water-proof bag. Hypothermia could set in very quickly if we capsize.
I have looked for websites on how to negotiate rapids in a canoe, but cannot find any. If anyone has any advice/tips, they would be appreciated.
(http://www.kyadventure.com/Images/large/white`otter7.jpg)
Cool pic ST! I've done some swift-water canoeing, but not in water that rough.
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Fiberglass, and it actually got a small crack in it. Do you know if I can use epoxy to fix it?
if it's not too bad you can fix it. use fiberglass resin instead of epoxy. dril out both ends of the crack so it can't 'run' as the boat flexes. if the crack is fairly long drill it in a couple other places. besides 'killing' the crack the holes will also allow resin to flow through and conect the resin on the inside to the resin on the outside, making it much stronger. you see a lot of people who just slap some resin on the outside, without drilling and they hit a small rock and the patch falls off.
Would those make a canoe capable of handling class II rapids?
you should be able to do class 2 in an open canoe, ( in the summer my kids swim down 2's in just a wetsuit and lifejacket) outriggers are a mistake in whitewater.
here is what the river class means-
1. moving water with a few riffles and small waves, few or no obstructions.
2. Easy rapids with waves up to 3 ft, wide clear channles that are obvious without scouting, some manuvering is required.
3. rapids are high, irregular waves often capable of swamping an open canoe. narrow passages that often require complex maneuvering. may require scouting from shore
4. long difficult rapids with constricted passages that often require precise maneuvering in very turbulent waters. scouting from shore is often necessary, conditions make rescue difficult. generally not possible in open canoes (except by experts). boaters in in covered canoes and kayaks should be able to eskimo roll.
5. exteamly difficult, long, and very violent rapids with highly congested routes that almost always must be scouted from the shore. rescue conditions are difficult and significant hazard to life in event of a mishap. boaters in in covered canoes and kayaks MUST be able to eskimo roll with confidence.
6. 5's carried to the extream, nearly impossable extreamly dangerous. for teams of experts only, after close study and all precautions taken.
water below 50 deg increases class by one level.
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Ok, for the most part its a class II stream/river. However, it had rained every day that week, and the water was freezing. So I think that bumps it up to class III.
We could have done it had the water been 75 degrees or so. But I didn't feel like dieing that day :)
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Hillary going too?
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Not unless I can use her as a seat-cushion.
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Originally posted by SunTracker
Not unless I can use her as a seat-cushion.
Hardly a seat cushion....try a Lazyboy:)
Have fun!!!