Aces High Bulletin Board
Help and Support Forums => Aces High Bug Reports => Topic started by: 214thCavalier on February 11, 2004, 04:20:21 PM
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Very nice addition.
However it seems very wierd reducing map to minimum (P51D) and barely being able to hear the engine.
I think its a nice idea but perhaps a touch overdone currently, reducing the range the volume drops would be good.
Engaging wep makes no difference to engine note, i reckon it needs to especially if the wep model is at some point going to inflict a penalty for overuse.
If plane 1 flies alongside plane 2 while 2 is altering engine map and hence engine noise.
Plane 1 will hear no difference in plane 2's engine noise.
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I agree. This is extremely bothersome and disorienting.
If it's right ... that's kewl, I'll get used to it, I guess.
BTW, is RPM management supposed to have a real effect on flight in AHII? ... I mean are variable-speed props and/or prop pitch (depending on the plane) to be modeled ala Il-2 --- or is this just an aural thing?
If it's just ear kandy ... I'd druther have the old sound back.
I don't fly real planes .. but something seems amiss to have the engine sound nearly disappear as if it's getting farther away as I throttle back.
Splash1
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The sound change with throttle doesn't sound right at all.
BTW, is RPM management supposed to have a real effect on flight in AHII?
Open your e6b and you'll see it does effect efficiency.
ra
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Whew!! Glad to hear we all agree. It's totally wrong. I'm sure it will be fixed. Hehehe it's like I turn the volume up and down on my speakers when I move the throttle.
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Cavalier, I think it's either a bug or a feature on the P-51s.
I can hear all other planes slightly changing its engine pitch when WEP is engaged - along with both manifold and RPM increase.
However, for some reason, the P-51s get increase in manifold when WEP is engaged, but the RPM stays the same.
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Wow, you guys need to research a bit of this. Here is a quick and easy way to figure all of this out.
1. Get in an old chevette with no muffler and an automatic. Pull on the emergency brake, stomp on the brake pedal. Rev the engine up just till the rpms wont go any higher, and relax the gas until it begins to just start dropping rpm. Listen to the sound. Now floor that sloppy little four cylinder and listen to the sound it makes. The RPMs did not increase, yet the sound is much much louder.
2. Get an old chevette with no muffler and a stick shift. Get her up to her top speed (about 20 mph) on a flat road. Put it in 3rd gear and keep her at 20 mph. Listen to the sound. Check the rpms, we will assume they are at 1500 rpm. Now, down shift into 2nd and get her back to 1500 rpm and keep it at 1500 rpm (not 20mph). The engine will make the same sound as long as you are not accelerating. Now press the throttle half way down. Dont move it, just shift gears as you speed up. You will notice that the volume does not change, just the pitch.
3. WEP does not necessarily do anything to your rpm. In a constant speed prop, your pitch will increase to take a bigger bite, cause you have more power, and you can keep the prop at the speed you set. All it does is create a denser charge in the cylinder (at least for nos) and thus more oxygen to burn the fuel.
Now the only bug I see is the sound problem in the mustang. Personally I think it should just scream when you turn on the wep. Even if not realistic it would be cooooooooool.
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Oh come on now?? The whole engine sound thing is totally goofy. Or...it sure is on my Rig??? It truly sounds as if some is turning the volume up and down on my speakers???
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How would you suggest you represent the sound of something getting louder?
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I have no problem with the effect, but as i said feel that currently the P51D engine noise drops so much at idle its hard to tell if its still running.
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Well I have a huge problem with the effect!
ergRTC, Not sure who you are, but....I a am NOT a sound engineer, programer, SIM builder, or conqueror of worlds! I do know that an Engine sitting in any WarBird makes an enormous racket, near deafening, even in the cockpit. Yes, I've sat in one, running.
The engine sounds in AH 1 are a fine replication IMHO only. In AH-II the sound of all engines are like my Grandsons push Lawn mower. It makes a heck of a racket until he stops pushing it. Then it makes NO sound at all.
Just a thought ergRTC, have you installed and run Beta 13? Sounds like your talking without having expierenced it?
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Yes I have installed it (darn nice b17), and do not see the same issue. I also have a dual throttle, with one setup as pitch control (rpm control). Have you played with the rpm control? That may the sound you are missing. You may have your engine volume set too low, have you looked in setup? I hear the engine when my throttle is down.
Are you running mitsus sound pack? That may explain the lawn mower problem. Going from mitsu in ah1 to no mitsu ah2 is always going to suck. If you havnt gotten the mitsu soundpack, omg you are going to love that. Not sure if it works with ah2.
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Yep, RPM programed to an axis. Nope Mitsu's in AH 1, not AH2
Engine set too low? Nope, any louder at full throttle might crack my CRT.
I'm not going to worry about this. At this rate there will be 2000 more Betas and No one is playing it anyway.
Actually the graphics are just not that much better, FPS is poor, the Clipborad expands on the wrong side, and on and on. Not ready for Prime Time. Guess we'll see what it ends up being hey?
Cyas!
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yep
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3. WEP does not necessarily do anything to your rpm. In a constant speed prop, your pitch will increase to take a bigger bite, cause you have more power, and you can keep the prop at the speed you set. All it does is create a denser charge in the cylinder (at least for nos) and thus more oxygen to burn the fuel
That makes sense.
If the P-51s, Bf109G-10 and the D-9 all have a WEP system that doesn't necessarily increase the RPM values, then I can understand the pitch of the sound staying the same.
The Spitfires it seems, increases both Boost pressures and RPM, which brings out a different pitch when WEP engaged.
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Yes, I had not noticed that before, didnt he mention something special about the spit? I also noticed that you cannot reduce rpms with WEP engaged.
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It should be more like -
50% Volume at idle -
100% Volume at full manifold
Right now it is too drastic of a change - In real life, the engine noise was deafening at idle even inside the pit....
But for the game - I don't know how they're gonna do it
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Agree Black Sheep!
WEP, Yes there were many types of WEP systems. Dry, Wet, Nitrous and on and on. Considering a static total plane weight, the only two ways to increse speed is for the pitch of the prop to take a bigger bite or for the prop to spin faster. WEP increases the cyclinder loading/manifold Pressure. This increases power and the resultant torque which at 100% pitch is an increase shaft RPMs. So, the pitch-lock is because the pitch is already at 100% when WEP is applied thus the shaft/Prop turns faster, RPM increases. Keep this up too long and the resultant engine heating and vibration results in the engine coming apart. I have always heard that this is altitude dependant.
WEP is also altitude dependant.
Fun Subject!
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The sound is awful. AH I sound is better. No engine sounds as though it is doing the same RPM no matter where the throttle is. It's the ENGINE that makes the noise NOT the prop. AH I sound was fine!!
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ouch fogold. The rpm of the prop is directly proptional (via the transmission) to the rpm of the engine. As the engine rpm increases the pitch increases. Go out side now and try it in your car.
Now, if the rpm is kept constant, and the throttle is depressed, the volume increases.
Under normal circumstances it is hard for the average person to separate the two unless they have a) a good understanding of the internal comubstion engine and means of transfering that power, b) a turbocharged car or c) a family member or there own pilots liscense. This is because as you increase the throttle, under normal driving, the rpms increase as well.
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I don't care. The sound is all wrong. At the moment it sounds as though the engine is still at full revs when you shut the throttle, just quieter. How come Forgotten Battles sounds right. When you shut the throttle, it doesn't get quieter, the engine revs just drop.
Maybe Forgottenm Battles is wrong too:confused:
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Originally posted by ergRTC
Under normal circumstances it is hard for the average person to separate the two unless they have a) a good understanding of the internal comubstion engine and means of transfering that power, b) a turbocharged car or c) a family member or there own pilots liscense. ...
...or an Audi with a multi-tronic gear box. (keeps you at optimum rpm for acceleration or fuel saving)
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Jeez, this is a nerdy subject! lol:rolleyes:
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Originally posted by FOGOLD
I don't care. The sound is all wrong.
I guess you just didn't expect the technical approach to such a statement. :rofl
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Its not that complicated. Are you sure FB does what you say it does? Seems a little off to me unless it is in an old hurricane or a biplane, which likely had a constant pitch propellor.
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the way I see (or hear) it:
In the car, when you keep a constant speed (RPM at a certain transmission) and reach an incline, you have to press the peddal down in order not to loose RPM. The sound effect of it is actually a "deeper" hum from the engine - not much change of volume and only a slight change of pitch.
So, the simplest way of implementing this I think, would be:
1. to make the engine sound depend on RPM almost entirly - both pitch AND volume!
2. As a secondary effect, REDUCE PITCH when throttle is added AND DO NOT CHANGE VOLUME. This mean that adding throttle but keeping a constant RPM you get a lowered pitch.
Bozon
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Problem here lies in the muffler. To really understand the sound you need to toss the muffler out. When you start dumping more fuel and air into the cylinder, it gets louder.
There are changes in the sound itself, but I am not sure if that is from a pitch shift, which i dont think it is, or rather from being able to hear more of the variety of tones the engine is producing.
If HITECH moves to the pitch change, that would be grossly inaccurate for the planes modeled in AH. The only plane without a variable pitch propellor that I know of in this plane set is the hurri 1, and ours may be a later model with the fancy prop.
I think the best answer would be to introduce a new sound on top of the engine sound which would produce the loud "BRAAAAAAAP" sound kids imitate, and mustangs make when you stomp on the gas.
Hell, when I think about, just imagine yourself when you were 6 years old trying to make car sounds, its not the sound getting louder as the imagined car speeds up (increased rpms) its the sound moving up in pitch.
Now think of that car with its wheels held tight and you flooring it, it will get loud, but not higher pitch.
talk about flogging a dead horse.
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ergRTC,
Better re-read yer posts man! I am not trying to be rude in any way, shape, or form. However, you seem to have contradicted yourself on several occassions.
Point here is, the current BETA sounds suck! They are not even worth discussing further as they will be changed. I'm not talking for Pyro and HT, however what the have attempted to show us appears to be layers of sound that will need to be integrated to make the more REALISTIC sounds we will have in AH2. These sounds are RPM, Throttle, Climb, and Dive.
It will be great I am sure
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Contradiction where?
Do you understand what I am trying to get across?
Yes I am sure the sounds will be improved, the general idea behind the new changes are fundamentally correct. Volume is a function of the throttle, pitch is a function of rpm.
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Originally posted by ergRTC
Yes I have installed it (darn nice b17), and do not see the same issue. I also have a dual throttle, with one setup as pitch control (rpm control). Have you played with the rpm control? That may the sound you are missing. You may have your engine volume set too low, have you looked in setup? I hear the engine when my throttle is down.
Are you running mitsus sound pack? That may explain the lawn mower problem. Going from mitsu in ah1 to no mitsu ah2 is always going to suck. If you havnt gotten the mitsu soundpack, omg you are going to love that. Not sure if it works with ah2.
Yo Bro...When one reads this he is led to believe YOU think everything is Peachy-Keeno. Later you are admitting that all is not well. I say again......This BETA sound Sucks! Copy That?
Ugh!
PS: I'm outta this thread
Dracon