Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: RAM on May 06, 2000, 11:15:00 AM
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I was on a Fw190. I chased a P51 that was running away through ack, in IMHO the cowardest way to fly a P51.<edit>That guy was Trppr,and I have no problems with him<edit>. I was telling that to him and some people came into the discussion.
Ok. There is a "guy" called Rude here. He called me NAZI,because I said that I love to fly fw190.<edit>I was wrong,see next posts> Isaid that it is a nice plane if you know to fly it, he answered that "yeah it is, if you are a nazi". Ok. other guy called me NAZI, too. he is SPONGE. ok
I asked politely both if they were serious...and they answered in a manner that confirmed me that they were. I have Screenshots on it, but no of what followed...but I'll repeat here word by word.
RUDE, SPONGE: diddly YOU! GO TO HELL AND BURN YOU THERE!. My gradfather (my mother's dad) was killed by Franco's fascist regimen ,here in Spain, in 1950. My mother had 5 years. She had 2 brothers one 7 years old other 1 year old.
SO THE STUPID diddlyING BASTARD THAT CALLS ME NAZI AGAIN CAN BURN IN HELL FOREVER!
I fly German planes because I love them, not the ideology that produced them in WWII. You are calling all German stuff flying people "NAZI"? maybe some people wont say anything if called it. I do. And I do it loud.
from now, I'll do 2 things just after going into AH. .squelch Rude and .squelch sponge
And I wont regret all I said and all I wrote here. I say it as I feel it, and so I write it,too.
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 05-06-2000).]
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Rude and Sponge were both out of line with their comments. I think an apology is in order.
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I understand your anger at being labelled in this way but I think the better way to handle this would be to have posted your screenshot evidence to HTC and demand they take action against these two individuals.
Just for the record the NAZI regime killed many Germans too, it was a part of history that we should not forget but NOT dwell on and let hatred fester, history is there to be learnt from so that the sames mistakes are not made again and let humanity progress into a more civilised future.
This is a GAME
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Revvin
249 Squadron RAF
Tangmere Wing
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zip it
[This message has been edited by Citabria (edited 05-06-2000).]
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Originally posted by Citabria:
haha
No Comment
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haha
Your point is?
Az
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ladies and gentlemen of the jury...
exZipIt A
[This message has been edited by Citabria (edited 05-06-2000).]
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Oh well, that was meant to be funny then?
Hmmm... it wasn't.
Az
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look I'm Zippy Longstockings
[This message has been edited by Citabria (edited 05-06-2000).]
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Ram,
Here is some honest truth. Take it to heart:
No one is obligated to lose a good sortie to fight your attack. Extending for the cover of ack is pure common sense! Calling folks *cowards* for doing this can get your virtual nose punched. I suspect this is what happened.
You might want to edit down your post some.
Its a tad bit over done (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Respectfully,
Yeager
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"Calling folks *cowards* for doing this can get your virtual nose punched. I suspect this is what happened"
i absolutely agree with you Yeager.
Gh0stFT
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Yeager...
Umm,not the point of this thread...but;I've been flying a lot P51 on TOD #3,so I know what I am speaking of about the guy that hugged and ran away...he even dindt attack when he gained advantage over me...so doing a long run a boring loss of time...(and IMHO, he flew cowardly).
I understand the running when you are in disadvantage, not the ack huggin. And then when he was higher than me and faster,and i turned home, he didnt try even to catch me. HI-E P51 over low-E Fw190.(am I so scary? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif))
But as I said, that isnt the point of this thread. I wont change the original post because I feel and I think what I posted. And did I do bad calling the P51 rider a coward?. Umm. Well maybe I must shut up more...but what I think is clear.
I dont mind getting my virtual nose punched,as you say. I mind a lot being called "THAT". If someone thinks I am a stupid then I can fully understand it.(sometimes I get myself surprised of how do I react when I am too hot).But I wont accept and Iwont keep the silence if someone calls me NAZI. NO WAY IN THAT!.
As I said ,the first post will remain untouched because I feel what I said. I have nothing to hide bout it. If someone finds it over done and too hard(as you say)...well then I am sorry about it. But I warned it yet on the thread title.
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 05-06-2000).]
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Ram....
when we were talking, I typed two seperate lines to you...
the first was "yes the 190 is a good plane"
the second was "if your a nazi (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)"
Now if you took that wrong than I'm sorry, but i dont see how you could if you would have noticed the stupid little smiley thingie at the end of that sentence!
Furthermore, anyone who has taken the time to get to know me, knows damn well that I am not the kind of person to say anything of that nature to anyone!
When you asked whether I was serious or not, I responded to you "of course not"!
Finally, I have listened to your sniveling little rear end on this board for too long and have held my peace...as a matter of fact, I have always been polite to you whenever we have spoken. That was clearly a wasted effort.
You were mistaken regarding what I said, and if you have a screenshot, POST ALL OF IT!
I have nothing further to say other than dealing with crap like this wears me out!
Rude Out!
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I must say in Rude's defence he's a hell of a nice guy.
I don't think it's in his nature to say anything seriously rude. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Rude I am sorry about that; when I asked you twice that if you were calling me Nazi, I made the shot. Unfortunately I havent the answer...cuz I got no more screenshots (anthough I was quite sure I did)
I never saw that "of course I'm not" answer. If you said it, then I must admit I didnt see that, but the following messages...that surely made me go into a wrong understanding...more considering that English isn't my language and sometimes I lost track on what is said...
Rude,there were people that online answered that I was spanish,not American,and so I couldnt be of those american neonazi groups that one of you two mentioned naming me. I couldnt recall the one who said that, sponge or you, because in that moment,after I took your answers as a "yes", I was blind, raged and I barely could type. So I guess that comment came from Sponge...
I thought I had taken at least 3 shots, and now I see that I took only one (guess I pressed ALT S instead CTRL S). So I must present my apologizes to you...seems I really mistook your answers.
If someone has a video or shot of those moments PLEASE send it to me. ebringas@airtel.net
and ,Sponge is out there...
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 05-06-2000).]
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"HI Shindi Ro!"
(subtitle: Zip It)
[This message has been edited by Citabria (edited 05-06-2000).]
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Originally posted by Citabria:
this is the stupidest thread I've ever seen.
have you ever lost a relative by police going into his home at 4 am, taking that relative with them with violence and never seeing him again?.Only because his political beliefs?.
My mother lost his dad that way. In 1950 Spain wasnt a rich country, exactly, but a poor destroyed country. My grandma had to go ahead with 3 little kids, alone. and 50 years after it I still dont know what happened to my grandpa. I guess they shot him. And I pray that he died with no suffering, cuz I know some torture stories, too.
Do you know what was my granddad's guilt? he fought on the republican side in the Civil War. He had some bad times after it, already.But then he commited the TREMENDOUS crime of saying in public that Franco's regimen (100% fascism those days) was unacceptable. 3 days after it he "dissapeared".
So,if you have something WISE to say, please tell it. If you dont, please RESPECT SOME THINGS THAT YOU CANT LAUGH AT!
You seem to think that all things told here,in UBB, are funny or stupid. Some aren't.Hope it is clear
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 05-06-2000).]
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www.zipit.com.org (http://www.zipit.com.org)
[This message has been edited by Citabria (edited 05-06-2000).]
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Citabria, shuddup. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Rude says he's sorry, RAM says he's sorry.
They had a problem online and they settled it here.
That makes it a good thread.
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www.zipit.com.org (http://www.zipit.com.org)
[This message has been edited by Citabria (edited 05-06-2000).]
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Guys, now you see why Cit pisses me off.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Zippetitit zipeeet
[This message has been edited by Citabria (edited 05-06-2000).]
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RAM, i was present and surprised to see the word "Nazi" adressed to a person.
I prefer to see "F*ck you st*pid *ss h*le" than "u are a nazi? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)".
I fully agree whit you RAM, no one must adress to a person "nazi or fascist" word.
Remember that fascism and nazism was not a game, was a real problem that killed a lot of innocent people.
RAM, leave these guys alone, i was insulted whit these words a lot of time (cause i am italian) and the better things to do is not giving them the possibility to reply.
U send them to hell, ok now forget them.
PS: sry for my very poor english (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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www.zipit.com.org (http://www.zipit.com.org)
[This message has been edited by Citabria (edited 05-06-2000).]
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Originally posted by Citabria:
Go read your original post RAM, how is that supposed to win respect?
"I was on a Fw190. I chased a P51 that was running away through ack, in IMHO the cowardest way to fly a P51. I was telling that to him and some people came into the discussion." -RAM
That says it all.
No, it doesnt. I had absolutely no problem with Rude until I thought he had called me "that". Then Sponge came in, too and all that toejam happened. So it has NOTHING To do with the P51 thing.dont take things out of context.
please do me the honor of being added to your squelch list.
what do I say to this?
haha
this is the stupidest thread ever.
You'll be squelched, dont worry. And ,BTW,you are laughing at my Granddad's death. I have a very low concept of people that can sleep after doing that.
Damned you, you dont deserve a single second more of my time, so I wont lose it.
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Hi all
I just have a few words...
Rude isn't one to just run away, look at his stats... he often returns with a 5 or 6 kill sortie.
Even if he did run into ack, who cares, afterall the ack, though not physically manned, are friendly! It's no different to dragging an enemy plane to another friendly plane, or to a M16 or whatever.
In some ways I would like to see a only country broadcast, as how many people would actually contact the enemy and say 'you coward' or 'your flying sucks' or whatever. To some honourable people being called a coward is a very provoking insult, and yet others might laugh such a thing off. For me, I am far from a good fighter pilot and I really try my hardest and most times I'm still crap at fighters and then when sometimes they channel something at you, you end up feeling angry and then thinking 'what a tosser' to the other person for letting their anger get to you! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif) If I ever get angry, the last thing I do is take it out on someone else...
As for 'Nazi', well, we've all lost loved ones throughout some stage of our life whether it was to Nazi's, communists or capitalists from which ever view point you have. It is a unfortunate sign of life and we can all identify with you regarding your family experience.
Perhaps you mistook Rude's nazi taunt a little too seriously as Rude is a very great guy who is always up for a laugh. If I was in, say, an AH squadron - RAF No 1(Fighter) Squadron flying typical RAF planes then I would expect such a comment as to be British or whatever and a little tongue-in-cheek banter. So, with you RAM, flying mostly German aircraft in a German sqn....
Don't get me wrong RAM, I'm not having a go or anything, just sticking up for Rude because as he's my XO, I know what he's really like! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I remember just starting AH in February and I was in a P51 and you came in after me from a higher altitude... I had been on auto climb with eggs so I leveled out, dropped my eggs and tried to get some speed. I then had to manouvre (Sp>?) and I ended up stalling... argh! As there was a friendly field below I went down to get some speed and hopefully try and get some alt again. Then I read your comments on the radio saying coward running into ack and such stuff. At the time it really made me angry but since then... who cares?! Everyone knows their options... but I remember seeing a film of Rude once going down into ack (when it was really pinpoint ack) a couple of times, evading ack and shooting down the nme planes...
Right... can we all be friends now? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Regards all
'Nexx'
PS.. Hangtime, can you please return my fluffy dice to my tank please? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
[This message has been edited by Replicant (edited 05-06-2000).]
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Just shutup and fly.
Wab
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Replicant, the guy that ran in a P51 wasnt Rude, but Trpper.
Rude came into #1 asking me if I used to dogfight on Fw190, I answered that used well Fw190 could win a Dogfight,if it has enough E. he then told me that he'd love to have a fight with me,then (whenever you want, Rude (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) As I said online, Fw190 can do hi yoyos and loops ,and hammerheads quite well (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)). He asked me,too if I thought that Fw190 was a good plane...All this in nice and good terms, and friendly chat.
Then was when I asnwered that yes, if flown properly,fw190 is a nice plane. Rude answered that yes, it was if you were a nazi (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif). I lost the (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) in that one, and i started asking if he had been serious calling me Nazi,or not. Then all that toejam happened.
I agree that in P51 you MUST run sometimes. I dont use the word Runstang any more. But ack huggin is a hole different thing...its a cowardice, IMHO, in WWII planes wont go into Acks cuz they could well be shot down by frriendly Acks.
I called Trppr coward brecause the ack hugging, not the running.
I still came close to him, and he started to win the race, then I turned home and the P51, with enough fuel (Trppr asked me If I had enough fuel to the pursuit, cuz he had more than enough), he ran away with altitude and speed advantage. That is, too a cowardice.
but again dont confuse this, Rude wasnt the guy in the P51. I hope that this now is more clear I may have said it poorly before.
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 05-06-2000).]
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Citabria, you sure are good at bushing buttons. However, there are times when pushin buttons is so easy it is really a cheapshot, no?
Say if some nonazi's beat a loved one of yours to death, it would be rather simple for me to push a button and say "hey, Cit, those dudes sure beat the crap outta [insert loved ones] huh?".
With Spain having the history it has, it is quite easy for me to understand RAM's reaction when someone calls him a nazi. Even if it is obviously clear it is a joke, it could be offensive. If it is less obvious, all it takes is a nudge to push his buttons, and once it is pushed, in the heat of the moment it is very easy to miss additional comments.
When I had a discussion (ok, argument) with Bermillion, I missed a smiley at the end of one of his comments. I didn't see it until much later even though it so obviously was there. I suspect the same happened with RAM.
Europe suffered through WWII, on all sides. European civvies, that is. The US and Canad did send combat troops, and lots of them, but mainland America did not suffer the horrific effects of full blown war. We have parents and grandparents here who as civilians experienced the brutal forces of war. That means everyone alive at the momen. As a result, maybe the memory is a little stronger here than in the US.
Losing a loved one in a war is terrible. Losin several ones and then being subjected to terror is even worse.
Just my .02, not meant to be criticism in any way.
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StSanta
II/JG2
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What dice?? (hang again gets them out of view)
Wasn't me man!
Gents.. this sim is a true meltingpot of nationalities and ideologies. here we have repesenatives from all races; creeds; religions and nationalities going at each other's throats every day in the worlds most deadly aircraft in emulation of the worlds most deady game... a war... the one war in modern history that had at its heart good vs evil.
Often, things are said and done that are regretted the next moment or the next day... atrocites in and out of the textbox or bbs.
I fully understand that some things,no matter how well intentioned; can be misunderstood, and misinterpeted. The English language.. the language of flight the world over; is also, oddly enuff, the most imperfect of mediums for the expression of concepts or ideas. It is more than reasonable to expect that a comment could be misconstrued.
RAM; I have great respect for your squad, and yourself.. have known you all to always be straight-up in pursuit of your mutual objectives. Rude I also have immense respect for... and have always known him to be very much the same; never know him to go for anybodys throat in the textbox.
Exclusive of any third parties involvement, allow me to say I'm glad that the two of u have reached a more equitable understanding of the events, and I wish you both well...
For the rest of us.. lets not forget that there is much we don't understand about the others we fly against; and ideologies and respective national undertones.
FACT: Flying a German aircraft does not make the pilot a nazi sympathizer or extremist. Flying a P51 does not make the pilot a wall street capitalist dog. The jury's out on those commie pinko bastids flyin rooski planes tho.. (tounge-in-cheek)
Peace; my brothers... I enjoy tremdously the community here. I'd hate to see this forum and the folks outside it jaundiced as to it's TRUE nature by an explosive cannonade of commentary as explified by the opening of this thread.
Salute all!
Hang
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a-ha... missed that RAM.. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Well, as not being the best fighter pilot out... I will still run to ack if I am in deep doo-dah! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) (but mostly only to gain speed and altitude so I can return a little higher still only to get my butt kicked! - think I've only done it once... or twice (?) to be honest)
I know what you mean about in WW2 about even friendly aircraft were shot at by ack because it was very difficult to identify friendlies etc. Hey, I have been getting that a lot lately anyway, good job for killshooter! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) Apparantly the Tiffy looked like the Fw-190 from the ground hence the under D-day markings being kept for the rest of the war! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
As for some taunts, I know that if anyone mentioned the IRA in any term then I would go ballistic whether it was a joke or not! So, thinking of that, I can imagine the Nazi taunt if you felt so strongly against it.
Regards
'Nexx'
[This message has been edited by Replicant (edited 05-06-2000).]
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Very well said hangtime (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Ram contacted me on private and had enough consideration to discuss what happened regarding what was said.....we worked it out!
I for one have a new found respect for the guy....he cared enough to make it right between the two of us, and was man enough to say he was sorry.
Not bad for a guy from Spain huh? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Jus kiddin Ram (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Rude Out!
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Salute to both of you!! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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O.K people ... it's huggy time now! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Cheers
Teapot.
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Phoenix Squadron
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Please!! No group hugs. Last time someone had their hand....well, it wasn't on my shoulder. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Flying a 109G10 since my first flight in AH.
so i must me Adolf hitler personel????
and i'm form germany, wohhhhhhhhh.
a the moment, germany is the land with the
smallest patriotism in the world.
one of my hobbies is LW WWII planes.
when talking to someone about this hobby in
germany, i'm really fast a NAZI for him/her.
i must apologize for my HOBBY in germany.
THAT really sucks!!!!!!!!!
a kind of:" you know what a bf109 is?, so u
MUST be a nazi"!. this is realitiy in germany.
(at the age of 8, i knew nearlly all variants
of the 109er series. so a young little nazi?)
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(http://saintaw.tripod.com/habicht.jpg)
JG2 "Richthofen" (http://www.busprod.com/weazel2/)
[This message has been edited by HABICHT (edited 05-07-2000).]
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Habicht:
Aye, I've got German friends and family, and this topic has come up under discussions. One is a former Luftwaffe pilot (flew in the 60's) and he said that when was out in the public, he never discussed his work. When peiole asked him what he did, he just said "I am a pilot for a large organization" and didn't elaborate further.
Germany has been so wrecked with guilt that any sense of pride derived from being in the armed forces often is misunderstood as nazi-like patriotism. Now, I am not a big fan of patriotism, thinking that arbitrary lines on a map shouldn't dictate who to like/dislike/kill and so forth, and the values I support are all humanitarian and readily adoptable by all cultures. But *still*. Was watching the European Championships in soccer in '92 when one of my oldest brother's friends said, when seeing the German fans, "that patriotism is pure nazism". *That* told me how bad it was; if there's one thing I am a true blood flag waving hand-to-the-heart patriot about, it is soccer. This attitude seems to exist to comparatively large degree in the world.
Now, RAM is a great guy. One night, there was a misunderstanding between him and me, which lead to me hutning a Spit while he engaged two hi 38's, thinking I covered his 6. He was shot down, got a little angry and basically just asked me "where the HELL were you?!?". The next day I saw an apology on the JG2 board, even though the fault was mine for not reading the text buffer (can you say target fixation?).
Looks like rude and ram can work it out like Real Men(tm) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
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StSanta
II/JG2
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Good comments StSanta and Hangtime.
Sorry about your relatives RAM.
JagdNine (Musketeer Escadrille)
[This message has been edited by NineZ (edited 05-07-2000).]
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I still ain't huggin none of you bastards.
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Fatty
Fat Drunk Bastards (http://fdb.50megs.com)
"I ain't givin none of you bastards a hug who ain't bought me at least 6 beers."
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Sniff........sniff........not eeeeeven me?
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Originally posted by Beefcake:
Guys, now you see why Cit pisses me off.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Yes, there´s some guys that just dont know when to stop.
Sooner or later they´ll find themself being very lonly.
"just added another one to the squelch list"
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BORK,BORK,BORK!!!"
Crabofix <What happend?...:A stranger morgie turndee burndee ,flip flip flip flip flip flip>
Flygflottlj.19(Lento R5)"swedish Gladiators"
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Hugs aside, Hang, you spoke well.
I want to share something with you people.
I am a second removed generation German Jew. My family was protected by another German family during WWII.
This family died in an air raid and my great-grandmother and her daughter escaped by using the families papers to get to America.
My great-grandmother decided to keep that families name, to honor them and to allow thier name to live.
Through the generations we have been told the story by our parents and once a year, on the day of that fateful bombing, which changed so many lives, forever, we honor that family that gave thier lives so we could live.
My children do it, and thier children will do it.
That day is ceremoniously closed with the following statement;
"We cannot change the past, but we pray the future never forgets it".
Each generation of our family has a picture of the family that gave thier lives to protect us.
History has been very unkind to many Germans. The Nazi regime was but a small faction of the overall population of Germany. Most Germans hated this regime, but were terrified of it.
Many Germans that fought during WWII, were not Nazis, but were people like you and me, and only fought with the Nazis out of fear for thier families lives.
With that perspective, calling anyone a Nazi, to me, is no different than calling a black person a n*gg**.
Those of you may recall the other day, when HiTech booted a person out of the arena for using the latter word, repeatedly.
Everyone was pretty happy that HiTech did that, including me.
Yet, the word Nazi, is not considered as harsh. The closest analogy I can come up with would be, Would Americans like to be called "slave owners", even in gest?
Please note, my point here is just to remind us all, we as a global community, may not be as aware of how things can be taken, when those things did not have a direct impact on our lives.
Just rememeber, any slang term used to reference any race of people, will probably cause some amount of pain to someone in our global community.
Okay, now for a group hug (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Roy "Skuzzy" Neese
President, AppLink Corp.
http://www.applink.net
skuzzy@applink.net
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Originally posted by Rude:
Not bad for a guy from Spain huh? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Jus kiddin Ram (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
OUCH RUDE!!! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
<S> and sorry again. You are, really, a nice guy.
Skuzzy, I salute the family that risked its existence to help people in such peril as your Grandmother and mother.
But I also Salute! you and your family because your actions in memory of them. Many people forget about people that helps in some bad times...it is awesome to see that you keep in your minds and in your souls a great respect and admiration for them,and its good to see, also,that you honour their memory keeping their name alive.
There is really a lot of nice people in this world...it is wonderful to know it.
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 05-07-2000).]
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20 years ago; I was stationed in West Germany for over a year. I lived on the 'economy' off post in a little town called Birkenfeld.
This town was leveled by a B17 raid in 1944; just a few miles away was a large german panzer training base called Baumholder. The rail network for the area was between Birkenfeld and Baumholder; and tho the town was not specificly targeted; it was utterly destroyed. Many hundreds of townspeople lost loved ones...
I was befriended by an older gentleman who lived in my apartment block. One spring day; he came to my door and said 'come; bitte'. There was a smallish procession of people waiting outside, all of us quietly walked from the town; out into the woods and up the hill overlooking the town.
I was taken to the site of a bomber crash; the mangled remains of a B17 I'd guess; hardly recognizable as a plane, only the engines made the wreckage discrnable as an aircraft..
Near to the remmanants was a stone cross... and the townspeople had come to lay a wreath. I was greatly moved... these people had lost so much; suffered so much. And they come there every year to honor those that did this to them.
I asked "Why do you do this.. " The reply was "We were not, and are not Nazis. We honor those American airmen that died here, who fought to stop the Evil Austrian.. they died so far from home. We fought against Hitler too; but we could not fight with guns... we had to find other ways. We hid from them the jews; we hid our young people... we did other things too. We honor these brave flyers for what they did, for their sacrafice... and we wish you to understand that not all Germans are nazis."
Quite a lesson for a very young very prejudiced 19 year old boy a long way from home... but we get our civics lessons, the ones that matter; in odd surroundings sometimes.
For what its worth....
Hang
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damn.. has it been so long?? *sigh* That was 30 years ago...
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30 years ago, aye, but life is still good, is it not?
More experience, more nuances, a greater understanding.
Accumulating that unquantifiable insight into the working of things.
Sometimes I feel old, and I am 25 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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StSanta
II/JG2
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<Salute> Hangtime....
A great number of people at that age don't have the capacity to internalize and understand what you witnessed. Apparently you saw its significance and I would bet that the experience has served you well over the years.
Regards,
Badger
[This message has been edited by Badger (edited 05-07-2000).]
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THATS IT......Im starting the script for a new soap opera....."Days of Our Aces High"
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Hangtime,
Thank you for your post. <S>
Skuzzy,
Thank you too! <S>
(Hmmm.. Hangtime..30 years ago? Hehe, I been a pilot for 26 years. Makes us sound old.) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Yeager hit it on the head, I was present, didn't see Rude's and Sponges replies on 100, but did 'witness' RAM tearing into Trppr! RAM, how do you fit into your cockpit with tha GREAT BIG EGO! I'll post here what I said on 100 when you were giving Trppr a hard time, and that was "he pays $30 to fly any way he wants to", and that is all anyone has to say in defense of their style of 'flying/fighting' in any 'online sim'. I don't think you realize this RAM, but not everyone is as 'good' as you are or think you are. Hell, sometimes I fly to the ack to 'survive' a hi bounce, just something we all have to live with. Another thing, he might be new, and learning, and with people like you talking 'sh*t' to 'em while they are trying to have fun, it's a wonder any come back to try again.
I have no problem with you RAM, but sometimes your 'mouth' is a bit loose on ch. 100, and I think it is you who needs to be squelched and you also need to give others a chance to fly the way they want to. You taunt more people on ch. 100 for the way they fly than anyone else I've seen in Aces High.
ts
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First time ever I was forced to squelch CH1 because of RAM's rantings on last saturday and now I have to see same toejame in this BBS?
Get a grip RAM. Nobody is interested if somebody called you nazi. Nobody is interested if you think running Mustang is coward. That kind of things should be dealt in private and save the innocent bystanders from seeing these worthless tirades.
I have been called a nazi and I have been called a first class banana (by daff incidently) but I don't take it too seriously.
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jochen
Geschwaderkommodore (on leave) Jagdgeschwader 2 'Richthofen' (http://personal.inet.fi/cool/jan.nousiainen/JG2) (Warbirds)
Jagdflieger JG 2 'Richthofen' (Aces High)
Thanks for the Fw 190A-5 HTC!
Ladysmith wants you forthwith to come to her relief
Burn your briefs you leave for France tonight
Carefully cut the straps of the booby-traps and set the captives free
But don't shoot 'til you see her big blue eyes
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Ram ,
a good way to avoid uggly discussions on ch1 + on the board is:
1.Show respect to all of your enemies
2.Don't attack pilots verbaly cause their flying + fighting style is different from yours.
3.Don't forget that this is a game
4.Don't take everyting serious
5. Please wait 24hours before u post letters like this.
btw. I hate nazis, antisemithisim, rassisim & all of that crap
blitz (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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I hug ack!!
Am I a coward? Yea damn right I'm a coward!!! Alot of you bastaiges are good and it make no sense for me to add to your score if I don't have to. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
RAM, If I knew I was fighting you, I'd run for ack if I had the chance. You are a good stick RAM and being a good stick sometimes you don't always get the fight ya want. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Just relax and enjoy! It's all good! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Swager
I/JG2~Richthofen~
"Damn.....I can't believe I missed that shot!!!"
(http://saintaw.tripod.com/swager.jpg)
JG2 "Richthofen" (http://www.busprod.com/weazel2/)
[This message has been edited by Swager (edited 05-08-2000).]
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This is the last thing I say on the "coward" matter. I started a thread on calling someone "nazi" not on flying ways...but...
Originally posted by tshred:
RAM, how do you fit into your cockpit with tha GREAT BIG EGO! I'll post here what I said on 100 when you were giving Trppr a hard time, and that was "he pays $30 to fly any way he wants to", and that is all anyone has to say in defense of their style of 'flying/fighting' in any 'online sim'. I don't think you realize this RAM, but not everyone is as 'good' as you are or think you are
First: I suck flying. I know it and I dont mind it.
Second:He has the right to fly the way he wants. But I have the right to tell him that the way he flew was the cowardest I've ever seen on a P51. And I flew it quite a lot on last tour.
Third:The only "hard" word I called him was "coward". Is that so hard?. The guy dived right into ack, and then ran away. I understand that he tried to run, but not the ack huggin. When he had the advantage over me, 5K of separation, and 3K alt advantage over my fw190A8, he didnt dare to come back and fight me,one on one. He ran like a screaming girl. I call it cowardice. And I stick with it.
Fourth; If that is someone's flying style I reccomend him/her to fly Fligt Simulator,or NASCAR Racing. We are here to fight, not to run.
I have no problem with you RAM, but sometimes your 'mouth' is a bit loose on ch. 100, and I think it is you who needs to be squelched and you also need to give others a chance to fly the way they want to. You taunt more people on ch. 100 for the way they fly than anyone else I've seen in Aces High.
I fully agree, and that is one of the reasons I left JG2. But ,still, when someone makes me lose 20 minutes for NOTHING, i feel really offended. If he had come back and shot me down at least I'd have had some fighting!!!
-------------------------
Originally posted by Jochen
I have been called a nazi and I have been called a first class banana (by daff incidently) but I don't take it too seriously.
Call me a banana, an a***ole a f***ng bastard...what you want. But I'll NEVER shut down if someone dares to call me nazi. And I'll answer in the same way.
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Originally posted by BLitz:
Ram ,
a good way to avoid uggly discussions on ch1 + on the board is:
1.Show respect to all of your enemies
2.Don't attack pilots verbaly cause their flying + fighting style is different from yours.
3.Don't forget that this is a game
4.Don't take everyting serious
5. Please wait 24hours before u post letters like this.
1: I respect everyone on AH...until I lose my respect on them. Trrpr lost it. And "someone" that posted some "things" in this thread and zipped them after it, lost it too.
2: I dont attack people with different stiles of fighting. I attack NO FIGHTING PEOPLE. I should attack noone, I know. But when I am pissed by losing 20 minutes for nothing, I usually get quite hot. I pay 1$ the hour on telephone line here, so that guy stole me money FOR NOTHING!
3:I agree,that is what loses me. But If I'd take this only as a game I wont be here...possibly.
4:I usually dont. Thats why I asked if they were serious after "that". But I mistook answeres...and KABOOM!
5:If I'd have waited 24 hours I'd had been hating 24 hours a guy that didnt deserve it (Rude). So better to bring this kind of things here as sooner as possible (IMHO).
-----------------------
Originally posted by Swager:
RAM, If I knew I was fighting you, I'd run for ack if I had the chance. You are a good stick RAM and being a good stick sometimes you don't always get the fight ya want.
LOL Swager (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) . I know you and the one that would hug ack would be me!!!! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
No, seriously. I suck and I accept it. On a one-on-one fight I also know I usually have the worse plane (190). So I dont mind to be shot down. I DO MIND ,again, to lose my time. I followed a P51 for a long time , I started to close on him, then he starded to win the race, and win some alt, too. Then I expected a good fight, but in his terms not in mines...but he kept on running away!!!...when I turned home I thought "he'll turn around and come for me, so here we have the fight"...HE KEPT ON RUNNING HOME!!!!!
Damnit, Swager. you, and I and all here have extended from a con!!! BUT WHEN YOU GET THE ADVANTAGE YOU COME BACK AND KILL THE GUY!!! If he had dived on me and killed on ONE single pass,OR EVEN HEADON!!! I'd be much less pissed off than truning back to home after an useless waste of time.
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For all. I know I rant too much, but in this one I think I'm not quite wrong. The guy ran away (thing that I had to do a lot when I flew P51), he ack hugged (thing I NEVER DO,and I consider a cowardice), and he broke combat when he had a gread advantage over me (¿¿¿???!!!). If that is not a cowardice, then tell me what is?...Flying love?.
As I said, I wont say a single word more on the P51 matter. I have no problem with him, I called him what I think he is and he answered. I accept his answers (Textually: "I love to piss off hotshots") with no problem. What I dont accept is that someone calls me "nazi".
<PUNT>
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If I'd have waited 24 hours I'd had been hating 24 hours a guy that didnt deserve it (Rude). So better to bring this kind of things here as sooner as possible (IMHO).
But why did you bring it here at the first place?!?! Because if you had solved this privately, you would not be so though guy as you are now?
Do you really think we give a flying f*uck about what somebody has called you? Or what you call somebody? I mean really? I personally couldn't care less.
Posts like yours only degrade this community and makes us all look bad to eyes of outsiders. Your post is about private issues and public media is not the place to deal with them.
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jochen
Geschwaderkommodore (on leave) Jagdgeschwader 2 'Richthofen' (http://personal.inet.fi/cool/jan.nousiainen/JG2) (Warbirds)
Jagdflieger JG 2 'Richthofen' (Aces High)
Thanks for the Fw 190A-5 HTC!
Ladysmith wants you forthwith to come to her relief
Burn your briefs you leave for France tonight
Carefully cut the straps of the booby-traps and set the captives free
But don't shoot 'til you see her big blue eyes
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Coward ?
Everithing is relative.......check my Signature & tell me I am not one...
Again, Tell me I am one...
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Saw/Saintaw
=XO=II/JG2~Richthofen~
GMT T.O.D. SITE (http://www.wardogs.org/ah/)
(http://saintaw.tripod.com/saw190.gif)
JG2 "Richthofen" (http://www.busprod.com/weazel2/)
Don't shoot ! I am only an observer......
[This message has been edited by Saintaw (edited 05-08-2000).]
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Did you leave Jg2? Well, You should know the 101 has enough space for insurrect pilots.
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mmm Forgot to say... If you accept to enter 101 as an insurrect, all the hard words used should be in spanish. This way you'll never be able to call anybody in the squad coward, you should use the appropiate expression: "maldito cobarde mamon de los huevos metiospadentro" or even harder and more elaborated scaring expressions. English ones are too lite and absolutelly inappropiate to upset quickly a pilot (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Thanks guys... Very droll.
lazs
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Manoble, Ram left JG2 under his own free will, we were very sorry to see him go, if you do manage to land him, you've got a good stick, regardless of what he feels about his flying abilities.
Good luck Ram, hope you find 'Piece' in wherever you fly! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Rip
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What a study in cultural clash!
Mighty1 and I are brothers. When we see each other, one is as likely as the other to slide up to the other and whisper "you're gay". Contextually it carries the same meaning as "dude". We then proceed to berate each other's sexual preferences, mentality, physical stature... all in fun. I would never dream to pull that on any of you, as you could never understand.
The thing that bugs me here is that Rude appears to have been having a pleasant conversation with you, then he made the "nazi" comment in an offhand manner. While that may not have been appropriate with a stranger, didn't his conversation with you up to that point seem friendly? English is not your native language, so I can kind of see where you might have been confused, but... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
I assume the best out of people when online until proven otherwise. There are people who will pull chains for the fun of it, but there aren't that many that are really mean about it. As to the nazi comment, well... it just isn't the word here (US) it is in Europe. I understand where Europeans are coming from, and would not disrespect what I know to be strongly held feelings concerning this issue. But you must admit, there is no way Rude could have known your family history.
Ram, you are a good guy, but you do have to think about what you say here and on open channel. Of course, you can say and do what you like, but there are consequences for everything we say and do. Maybe Rude shouldn't have said what he said, but did you really think he meant anything malicious by it? And if you did, couldn't you tell him on private that is a very offensive term to you? If he responded poorly to it, you could squelch him and end it.
All that happens when you bring something like this here is you put everyone involved on trial unnecessarily. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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Originally posted by Jochen:
But why did you bring it here at the first place?!?! Because if you had solved this privately, you would not be so though guy as you are now?
Do you really think we give a flying f*uck about what somebody has called you? Or what you call somebody? I mean really? I personally couldn't care less.
Posts like yours only degrade this community and makes us all look bad to eyes of outsiders. Your post is about private issues and public media is not the place to deal with them.
Oh, well. I dont consider me nothing near "though". Why did I came here with this? because there are things I dont accept, and I want everyone to know them. That "Nazi" call ,as I thought It was, was one of that things I wont accept.
With this in mind ,then think whatever you want about me. I wont say I dont care cuz you were a squaddie until last week, and I really mind what you think. But you are free to think whatever.
I know how I am. I know that sometimes I go too far. But I wont apologize about this thread because if someone calls me seriously "nazi" I'll start another one just the same way.
Mandoble: jeje thanks for the offer, again. But I am Knight at heart. When I left Jg2 I thougt on changing country but I wont feel ok fighting all that nice people that flew with me so many times.
Ripsnort:...I miss you,guys. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
Kieren: Yep Rude and I were chatting in a friendly way. And I understand you find difficult to understand that I mistook Rude's answer.
I went ballistic...thats why I lost the answer from him and I took subsequent answerd by Rude the wrong way.
I know that Rude couldnt be able to know my family's past. But, still if someone calls anyone nazi...well I find it REALLY offensive...
And again if you think that I did wrong bringing this here...well I disagree. But thats only an opinion, isnt it?.
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Ram-
You got a big mouth that’s a fact.
Not that I'm faulting you for that. But if you have to run yer piehole, have something RELAVENT to say.
I won't call you a Nazi, that's ridiculous. The complex political insight to being a "NAZI" is not worth comparing in this goofy gaming format ala this BBS.
You’re just a punk in reality.
Shuddup for Christ's sake!
Fly, or join a squad that will embrace your whining. (ahhh hamm, WRECKING CREW needs a few good men)
Wank and squeak and Cry and Piss and Want and This and That.
Good Lord yer tiring...at least whine about a topic with a purpose. Sheesh
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Originally posted by Creamo:
Ram-
You got a big mouth that’s a fact.
Hihihi, look who's talking (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Saw <---- Putting Salt on the fire, err , maybe oil (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
COME BACK RAM !!!!!!!!! (http://geocities.com/r337m0nk3y/cwm/crying.gif) (http://geocities.com/r337m0nk3y/cwm/crying.gif) (http://geocities.com/r337m0nk3y/cwm/crying.gif)
[This message has been edited by Saintaw (edited 05-09-2000).]
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Creamo..
your gona get me fired with posts like that...
I still have tears in my eyes....
I got the coffee out of my nose...but how do i get the mixture off the keyboard?
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The answer is you don't. Let it grow into complex life forms. Wait for it to demand rights, then quickly opress them and make their lives very tough indeed.
Of course, their guerilla warfare will result in WE WANT RIGHTS! the occasional typo.
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StSanta
II/JG2
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LOL (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
WTG Ram! A self proclaimed "Whiner". Maybe you should contact the TWC.
To my delight, this might give Creamo more incentive to Whine about Whiners Whining.
BTW this makes Creamo a "Whiney Whiner". A very good one, I will add. <Salute> (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
So what am I? I am a Whiner cubed. Yep, I Whine about the Whiney Whiner. I am the one who is Whining about the Whiney Whiner who is Whining about the Whiner.
That makes me a "Whining Whiney Whiner". I guess that I fit into The Wrecking Crew mold just fine. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Use caution because, mathematically speaking, anyone who Whines about my Whining is off the "Whine Rictor" scale. I am not really sure how to lable that person, but "Whiney Whining HINEY Whiner" seems as though it might be appropriate. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Mino
The Wrecking Crew
[This message has been edited by Minotaur (edited 05-09-2000).]
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Originally posted by RAM:
Second:He has the right to fly the way he wants. But I have the right to tell him that the way he flew was the cowardest I've ever seen on a P51. And I flew it quite a lot on last tour.
Third:The only "hard" word I called him was "coward". Is that so hard?. The guy dived right into ack, and then ran away. I understand that he tried to run, but not the ack huggin. When he had the advantage over me, 5K of separation, and 3K alt advantage over my fw190A8, he didnt dare to come back and fight me,one on one. He ran like a screaming girl. I call it cowardice. And I stick with it.
And he had the audacity to call me CHILDISH!
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Liz-
"The time may come when your State will need your services; and if that time does come, then draw your swords and throw away your scabbards" T.J.(Stonewall) Jackson
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*double*
[This message has been edited by Lizard3 (edited 05-09-2000).]