Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Boroda on March 18, 2004, 04:57:16 PM
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Did I miss a discussion about current Albanian violence in Kosovo? Can anyone give me a link to a thread where it is discussed?
Or doesn't Western media speak about it at all?... :rolleyes:
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has been all over norwegian tv.
one of our soldiers there had to kill a person that tried to drive through the blockades. Some 20 norwegian soldiers have been injured trying to keep the 2 sides form clashing.
more troops are beeing called in from around the world and it has been declared that the troops can use force (deadly?) to keep the 2 sides separated.
This looks real messy :(
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Looks like things are going to hell in Kosovo.:(
750 brit troops being sent to reinforce AFAIK
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Originally posted by thrila
Looks like things are going to hell in Kosovo.:(
750 brit troops being sent to reinforce AFAIK
American media is ignoring Kosovo, Supposedly over after the fall of Milosivic (spelling?) Is he still on trial? It seems ethnic Albanians are breaking through barriers to attack Serbs. (ethnic cleansing in reverse?)
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Fox just had a little blurb on it. Not much info other than Albainians accused the Serbs of killing a couple of kids and the Surbs said we're going to start slaughtering you. And that NATO was adding another 1000 troops to the force there.
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Please notice that, unfortunately, everything is going on exactly as I predicted.
This is no more then a result of a NATO policy to close their eyes on Albanian slaughter of Serbian population that lasted since 1999. The situation is exactly like in Chechnya in 1991-94. Now you have to solve this problem, and it will be worse then Chechnya.
I wonder when NATO "peacekeeppers" will run to Serbian army for assistance. They started a 1999 war to stop Serbian police operations against Albanian terrorists, and now we see a logical result of US and friends supporting terrorism.
In autumn, 1998, US Senate declared KLA a terrorist organisation. Now Kosovo is run by former KLA. You don't have to be an Einsten to understand what exactly will happen there: Chechnya is a good example.
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we wont here much on this in the states.... Why?
More tarnish on the Clinton legacy......:D
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Originally posted by weaselsan
American media is ignoring Kosovo, Supposedly over after the fall of Milosivic (spelling?) Is he still on trial? It seems ethnic Albanians are breaking through barriers to attack Serbs. (ethnic cleansing in reverse?)
"Ethnic cleansings" is a newspeak term invented to justify agression against Yugoslavia. In fact before bombings started the number of Serbian and Albanian casualities was equal, about 300 from each side.
Miloshevich is still on trilal. It's surprisingly similiar to Georgiy Dimitrov's process in 1936... The only difference is that Miloshevich's defence speeches are kept away from public. BTW, he is not accused in genocide anymore.
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Miloshevic was a victim of what happend in the 1990s, namely the vil western plot to make it seem that serb armies were invading slovenia, croatia and bosnia - when in fact all that was done by NATO commandos using stolen Yogoslav national army weapons.
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Miloshevic was a victim of what happend in the 1990s, namely the vil western plot to make it seem that serb armies were invading slovenia, croatia and bosnia - when in fact all that was done by NATO commandos using stolen Yogoslav national army weapons.
GH, did you read the transcript of first Miloshevich's speech in Hague? I bet it was never published in the West. After some of his speeches the "jury" decided to classify everything that he says, because he was "winning the propaganda war" with them. Damn. Even nazis have allowed Dimitrov to speak. God bless euro justice.
Grun, you said you completely justify Croatian/NATO operation in Srpska Krajna. For those who don't know what happened there: Krajna was a part of Croatia populated by 350 000 Serbs, and they were all thrown away or murdered in a matter of days by Croatian army backed up and supported by NATO forces. That's why I think you are too biased to be taken seriously. Sorry.
Don't you understand that Serbs were fighting terrorists in Kosovo while US supported an organisation declared "terrorist" by their own Senate?
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Boroda your complete unbiasedness simply is a shining example to us all.
As of 1995 1/3 of Croatia's soverign territorywas still under the control of a foreign enemy power. Moreover this are was located as to almost cut the country in half at a very narrow area, especially restricing terrestrial acces to the coast and key sources
of revenue for the nations future, toursim, shipping and fishing.
This could not be allowed and the Croatians, Bosnians and USA military came together in stunning show of cooperation and military strenghth to stop this. The offensive lasted a few weeks and the nation was mostly liberated, with one small part also later returned to croatia. It was a hard fast offensive done with modern tactics and US planning.
So thats what i have to say. read what boroda says and compare. I think the "true" truth is somewhere in the middle.
Boroda did serbs actually ever kill anyone in the 1990s wars? for example just tell me which ethinc group ringed sarajevo with snipers and alitriert under a seige lasting several years?
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So, in other words - Serbs in Krajna wanted to live without Croatians throwing them out of their homes and taking their possesions. This could not be allowed and the Croatians, Bosnians and USA military came together in stunning show of cooperation and military strenghth against local self-defence militia - tanks against hunting guns, and threw away or murdered 350000 ethnic Serbs. This could not be called "ethnic cleansings" because US inspired and planned the whole genocidal operation. Another victory of Democracy and Freedom over common sence and human lives.
Grun, I am biased here, and I have always admitted it.
How about US forces supporting KLA terrorists in 1999? Don't you see now who was right and who was wrong?
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Based on the history of miloshevic during the 1990s the USa had no choice. You cant go back and stop a genocide before it starts if you wait for it to start and only then act. Clinton had to make a tough decision and act. No more BS from milosevic after he signed all those peace traties. Whatver the difficulties in Kosovo now I'm happy that another milosevic adventure was averted in 1999.
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Boroda did serbs actually ever kill anyone in the 1990s wars? for example just tell me which ethinc group ringed sarajevo with snipers and alitriert under a seige lasting several years?
Sorry, you edited your post.
Serbs were not angels. So were Croats, Bosniaques etc. But I don't like a media tendency to show only Serbs as bloody murderers and agressors. Most of the times they were victims as well.
Did you see a movie "No man's land"?
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Originally posted by Boroda
Did you see a movie "No man's land"?
Sure did, i own a copy.
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Based on the history of miloshevic during the 1990s the USa had no choice. You cant go back and stop a genocide before it starts if you wait for it to start and only then act. Clinton had to make a tough decision and act. No more BS from milosevic after he signed all those peace traties. Whatver the difficulties in Kosovo now I'm happy that another milosevic adventure was averted in 1999.
So - do you admit that US supported terrorists with military force and helped forming a terrorist anclave in the middle of Europe?
Don't you know that Al Quaeda has strong connections in Kosovo and Albania? Instead of crushing them together with Serbs US preferred to bomb Yugoslavia to help Moslim fundamentalist gangsters and drug-dealers.
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KLA were a bunch of manipulative opprtunist thugs, no doubt bout it. But Miloshevic was and is far worse plus he was fixing for another genocide like he did vin 1990s and that had to be stopped.
USA allied itslef with KLA very much in te same they allied selves with your country Russia in the fcae of a greater common problem in the form of Hitler..
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
KLA were a bunch of manipulative opprtunist thugs, no doubt bout it. But Miloshevic was and is far worse plus he was fixing for another genocide like he did vin 1990s and that had to be stopped.
USA allied itslef with KLA very much in te same they allied selves with your country Russia in the fcae of a greater common problem in the form of Hitler..
Miloshevich was "far worse"?! Sure, he didn't kill Serbs...
Fixing for another genocide? Did you read what I said: before bombings started the number of victims was ~300 on each side. KLA was declared terrorist organisation several months before the war.
Comparing KLA to the USSR is funny :) Now I understand: it was Serbs who blew up WTC. :rolleyes:
Look how much trouble you have got from Serbs and compare it to the number of terrorist acts from Moslim fundamentalists, then employ your thought-producing gangle and guess who is a bigger threat.
US supports Albanian terrorists, host Chechen terrorists, and, according to President Bush must be bombed to stone age. It's not me, it's your president who suggested it...
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Yes, indeed!! The US media is totally ignoring the newest Crisis In Kosovo! There's just no true international awareness in the US at all.
CNN: NATO rushes troops to Kosovo (http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/europe/03/18/kosovo.violence/index.html)
MSNBC: NATO sends reinforcements to Kosovo (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4547376/)
CBS NEWS: 22 Dead In Kosovo Ethnic Clashes (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/03/18/world/main607082.shtml)
ABC NEWS: NATO Sends Backup As Kosovo Unrest Wells (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/03/18/world/main607082.shtml)
Fox News: NATO Sends Troops Into Strife-Torn Kosovo (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,114534,00.html)
weaselsan: American media is ignoring Kosovo,
Oh yes, obviously. There's just nothing about it anywhere.
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Toad, thank you.
But the impression told by the ordinary Americans was precious to me. Here in Russia Albanian riots were the number one news. It's interesting to compare media attitude from different countries. Media are the most dangerous provocators and public opinion manipulators (and the 1999 agression was a great example), so it's usefull to know how our countries medias cover the events.
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been on every night since the start...
http://www.cbc.ca/stories/2004/03/18/world/serb_alb040318
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/1079608316248_47///?hub=World
http://www.canada.com/search/story.html?id=2b9e6371-8c31-47b2-b0e5-d51dfe35f97a
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Originally posted by Boroda
Did I miss a discussion about current Albanian violence in Kosovo? Can anyone give me a link to a thread where it is discussed?
Or doesn't Western media speak about it at all?... :rolleyes:
All over the BBC - UK sending more troops.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/default.stm
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Originally posted by Boroda
GH, did you read the transcript of first Miloshevich's speech in Hague? I bet it was never published in the West. After some of his speeches the "jury" decided to classify everything that he says, because he was "winning the propaganda war" with them. Damn. Even nazis have allowed Dimitrov to speak. God bless euro justice.
Grun, you said you completely justify Croatian/NATO operation in Srpska Krajna. For those who don't know what happened there: Krajna was a part of Croatia populated by 350 000 Serbs, and they were all thrown away or murdered in a matter of days by Croatian army backed up and supported by NATO forces. That's why I think you are too biased to be taken seriously. Sorry.
Don't you understand that Serbs were fighting terrorists in Kosovo while US supported an organisation declared "terrorist" by their own Senate?
I heard his opening statement, albeit a condensed version. It was incoherent and its pivotal point was him challinging the jurisdiction of the Hague tribunal in this matter. It was pathetic nonsense and completely unimpressive, however ironic, it was probably in his best interest to shut him up.
Furthermore you appear to resort only to Pravda or some obscure Russian/Slavic Yugoslavian source to develop a view of what happened in Kosovo. It's kind of surprising to someone who is so polarized in his perception of the conflict calling someone else 'biased' in all seriousness.
Ah well, the whole Kosovarian conflict was just a cover to allow the NATO-agressors to bomb the Chinese embassy, didn't you know? :rolleyes:
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Whatever you say Boroda there is scumbag on both side of the fence.
Btw Milosevic defense at the Hague was as pathetic as him.
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Originally posted by Boroda
Toad, thank you.
But the impression told by the ordinary Americans was precious to me. Here in Russia Albanian riots were the number one news. It's interesting to compare media attitude from different countries. Media are the most dangerous provocators and public opinion manipulators (and the 1999 agression was a great example), so it's usefull to know how our countries medias cover the events.
Boroda it should be simple for you to think of reasons why this would be bigger news in Russia than in the USA which don't involve media conspiracy.
Actually if there is a media conspiracy it is probably Russian media exploiting residual Cold War hatred of the USA in order to increase ratings/viewership/readership. English-language Russian media seems to be filled with anti-American topics.
In the USA we have "bigger fish to fry".
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Thud, Boroda considers Pravda to be unbiased and truthful. He believes 1940s articles in particular are very reliable.
The Balkans again, eh? What a wonderful little armpit of a place, where hatred is the only common language.
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Originally posted by straffo
Btw Milosevic defense at the Hague was as pathetic as him.
That is BS straffo. Have you actually read the transcripts? I have, it takes quite a while because it was a 3 hour speech, and he makes some VERY valid points in that defense.
I can understand why Grunherz is agressive towards the serbs, because after all Grunherz is a croatian, and that makes him the most biased person on this BB when it comes to this subject. But you should not talk garbage like that straffo.
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Originally posted by Thud
I heard his opening statement, albeit a condensed version. It was incoherent and its pivotal point was him challinging the jurisdiction of the Hague tribunal in this matter. It was pathetic nonsense and completely unimpressive, however ironic, it was probably in his best interest to shut him up.
Yes, you saw the condensed tv-version...kinda hard to condense 3 hours to what...10-15 seconds in some news media?
Read the transcripts instead.
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Enlighten us as to what VERY valid points the head of a state involved in active genocide could make.
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Originally posted by Dowding
Enlighten us as to what VERY valid points the head of a state involved in active genocide could make.
The transcript is something like 200 pages long, I suggest you read it. If I try to make some bullet point list here it will just look silly.
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I don't have time unfortunately. He's also a lawyer IIRC. I'm sure it's convoluted and lacks brevity which would practically double the reading time.
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Originally posted by Boroda
Did I miss a discussion about current Albanian violence in Kosovo? Can anyone give me a link to a thread where it is discussed?
Or doesn't Western media speak about it at all?... :rolleyes:
Dont worry Boroda,
italian newspapers talk a lot about it. About 130 paras and 80 Carabinieri are leaving Italy to strenghten our 2,400 contingent there.
Yesterday our soldiers had to shoot to protect Serbian houses from Albanian ppl attacks. Finnish soldiers did the same.
BTW, the so called military actions of Milosevich against the albanian terrorists turned soon into the genocide we all know. All those mass graves are obviously western propaganda ... :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by Dowding
Enlighten us as to what VERY valid points the head of a state involved in active genocide could make.
I Slobodan Milosevic am a victim.
I Slobodan Milosevic am a victim.
I Slobodan Milosevic am a victim.
I Slobodan Milosevic am a victim.
I Slobodan Milosevic am a victim.
I Slobodan Milosevic am a victim.
I Slobodan Milosevic am a victim.
I Slobodan Milosevic am a victim.
I Slobodan Milosevic am a victim.
BWAAAHHHHHBWAAHHHH
There you go dowding, 200 pages of that. :)
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Sorry Grun. This is a topic where no one will take you seriously.
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Originally posted by Hortlund
That is BS straffo. Have you actually read the transcripts? I have, it takes quite a while because it was a 3 hour speech, and he makes some VERY valid points in that defense.
I can understand why Grunherz is agressive towards the serbs, because after all Grunherz is a croatian, and that makes him the most biased person on this BB when it comes to this subject. But you should not talk garbage like that straffo.
You read me wrong , it's nothing else than my perception
(I'm pretty far from understanding any legal discution I've not the minimal legal knowledge of the inner working of a legal system)
I only pretend his position were BS, I think he is a [**censored**]
And yes I'm biased :D
I can understand some part of his speech were valid but I put Milosevic in the same categorie as : Pol Pot ,Mugabe ,Amin Dada Kagame etc ... (it's obvious I know more about Afrika than Yougoslavia ;))
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Things seem to be quiet now but more trouble is expected during the weekend.
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Originally posted by Hortlund
Yes, you saw the condensed tv-version...kinda hard to condense 3 hours to what...10-15 seconds in some news media?
Read the transcripts instead.
Sure, 10-15 seconds. If you mastered everything as you do the noble art of thoughtless assumption...
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Originally posted by Hortlund
Sorry Grun. This is a topic where no one will take you seriously.
And why should you be taken seriously seeing that you side with Boroda on this one. Be careful of the company you keep... :)
And I'm not agrresive towards the "serbs" I have serbian relatives, my cousin is serbian - I would be agressive towards myself if I was agressive towards him. But I am agressive towards milosevic and his butchers and the other's butchers though for they carried out idiotic desires of greatness. I am agressive against what was done and the suffering and why it was done, but not against the people. It weasnt the people who set Yougoslavia on fire, it wasnt serbs it wasnt croats it wasnt bosnians - though all pysically commited the acts. It was the evil hateful destructive ideas that came from the mouth of degenerates like miloshevich that set people against each other. Thats what I'm ultimately agressive about, thats the problem. And I dont care one bit what that bastard is whining about now that he is being put to justice, on him rest the souls of 250,000
dead.
I spit on him, the filth that he is...
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Originally posted by Dowding
Thud, Boroda considers Pravda to be unbiased and truthful. He believes 1940s articles in particular are very reliable.
Dowding, don't you please twist what I have said. I said that Pravda is a good source if you understand the 1940 situation in USSR and if you read between the lines. If you'll believe everything Pravda said - you'll get insane quite quickly.
Miloshevich is a to blame for all the bloody nightmare that happened in the Balcans in 1990, but not for "genocide" (this accusation was abandoned, if you don't know) or "ethnivc cleansings" in Kosovo.
Again: why did the euro "justice" shut him up? Even in nazi Germany Dimitrov was allowed to speak in public.