Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: 3Fingers on December 26, 1999, 06:06:00 AM
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Thunder and Joemud where using a documented bug tonight, You know the one where the b17s gunner bails out , but still has the ability to fire.
Anyway Joe bailed out and floated down on our runway and proceeded too rack up 30+ kills.
Now normally this wouldn't make me too mad but , I've seen Joemud do this before. he said " I just wanted to see what would happened " well he knew what would happen, he has done this before!
Even after Joe and Thunder were called cheaters on radio 1,1 they still decided to EXPLOIT THE BUG!
(my man Raxx has a film of it ) Believe me, these 2 guys knew about this bug!
I just don't want to see our sim turned into an Arcade Game by the likes of cheaters like these 2 guys, and I hope WE have the kind of COMMUNITY that won't permit this sort of Exploitation of known bugs in the
future!
BTW I thought you fixed this HT
3-Fingers
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They reached 43+ kills when I was online.
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Hey opie Thunder said he wanted to see what would happen not me,and ya ive done it before...ONE TIME! and I didnt know what it was then and even better yet ive had guys do the same thing to me I didnt loose it on them like you did chasing us all night long and bugging the hell outta me. Btw about 37 of those kills where in the air and if you didnt wanna get shot at the feild we were trying to capture you should have stayed in the tower of came from a differnt feild instead of comeing up about 15 times like a dumby.........ok I think that covers it....oh and btw Thunder was completely new to this and it wasnt his fault point all flames at me please.
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Gijoey,Joetwo,JoeMud=me
DHBG!!
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46 kills Hristo
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Gijoey,Joetwo,JoeMud=me
DHBG!!
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One thing I want to make REAL clear.
1. This is a beta and there are bugs which the crew at HTC are trying to sort out. My flying tonight was to try and capture on film four problems currently outstanding.
a) gunners still able to fire from a chute.
b) kill messages not showing for the "last man standing", (usually from HO or Bomber attacks).
c) gunners streaks not resetting when shot down.
d) a minor ground handling glitch with wing damage and gear down ditches.
I had thought that the gunner bailing from a plane and retaining guns was fixed. This may be a separate problem where a pilot bails taking the gunner with him and the gunner then retains the guns. The old fault allowed a gunner to bail seperately and take the B17's guns, (leaving the B17 defenceless btw =).
The film shows joemud shooing down maik, (don't take this personally maik but it was a godawfull attack and my half blind grandfather coulda made the kill), then me killing the B17.
I followed up making two non firing passes past the chute, (closest was about 150 yards), to make joemud and thunder *think* I was straffing them. Hopefully joemud would shoot back.
He did. My right wing parted company with the fuselage on the second pass with no tracer seen from the chute. There's film if needed by the team at HTC. It doesn't *prove* anything other than a bug with gunners in chutes and the kills for gunners not resetting each sortie which I'll post in the appropriate forums.
All the other stuff I don't give a rats bellybutton about. It's 4am and I'm going to sleep. Hopefully Pyro will lock this thread and then delete it.
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3fingers,
I just read your post and first it is not accurate and secondly the 46 kills joe got were and accumulation of all kills that he made in my buff. He gunned for me for about 8 hours and did not unattach. We were shot down over 24 on a bomb run and I bailed. We landed and ...YES I walked over to the end of the field. And YES joemud shot you 15 times in a row.. .. not too smart on your part. Yes HiTech needs to decide what they want to do but you failed to mention that you changed colors and followed us around and you directed your friend to us. Joemud got about 4 more to his total there too. Then to get away from you we flew under radar for 30 minutes and came up way north and you were still WHINING! I have really had it with guys like you who think they can flame & whine and don't understand ...ITS A BETA. Report it but everyone has a deferent point of view and mine is not the same as yours. You only showed me that you know how to whine and wimper. We tried to take that field 4 times and died every time trying. I guess if I was DUMB enough to keep coming up 15 times in a row I might be stupid enough to make a post like you did! Yes .. I do take your kind of dribble personally!
Thunder
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raxx,
I wasn't watching your passes at us, I was the pilot and we had been shot down and in the chute. But if you stated you made 2 passes at us and were 150 out and close enough to fire I would have pulled the trigger too. If we are dead and going down ..you should have let us fall. If you were trying to staff.. you deserved to die. If you are trying to explore what the BETA can or can't do then it should be no harder for others to follow the smae logic for us to do what we did. HiTech is aware of the bugs or non bugs and will or won't fix them on there time and discression. But if I were in Joemuds gunner possition and you made thoughs passes I would have done the same thing until its fixed.
Thunder
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Interesting posts, Thunder & Joemud. Reading them, I have to wonder whether your motivations are truly to help discover bugs for HT to squash or you are more interested in exploiting them to pad your score or to get a cheap thrill from instigating the response you are getting now.
One thing that you need to keep in mind is that this product being in beta does not give you the right to exploit the bugs you find. People don't have a problem with you finding bugs. They have a problem with you abusing them over and over at their expense.
To sum it up, if the whining over bug exploitation troubles you so much, then by all means, quit exploiting and you won't hear it.
Gordo
[This message has been edited by Lance (edited 12-26-1999).]
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Sounds like cheating to me, sugarcoat it all you like. It's a known bug, and that it wasn't fixed doesn't mean you need to rack up 15 kills on the same guys... if you are truly testing, how many times did you have to do it before you figured it out? And you call him a dummmie?
What's more, Joemud weren't you one of the Allied 190's Thursday night disrupting the Historical fight? What bug were you looking for there? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Now I'm wondering if you might be testing a "warp-on-command" bug that many of us have seen... I guess that would be ok too, eh?
If you don't get what I'm driving at (and I suspect you might not) we have many people here playing and testing for different reasons. Simultaneously the community is building, and friendships (and in your case, enemies) are formed. If you are willing to go over the intended boundries in such an excessive and blatant manner, all in the name of making a better game, then you are doing far more damage than you realize. The thing I hate most about your "tests" is that they always have unsuspecting participants. You plop down smack in the middle of a big fight, heated emotions on both sides, and start cheating. Are you too thick headed to see people will get pi**ed off, or do you simply enjoy that thrill?
This all reminds me of Itm* of Brand W... "sure, I cheated, but I did it to improve the game". Yeah, right. Anytime your name is on the winning side of the kill buffer is now suspect.
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Dolomite,
No one said we were testing this! All of us are testing Aces High it and we post things about it that we observe. What HiTech does with that information is up to them. But WHAT IF they decide to leave it in...don't think so, but what if they do... is it cheating? We got wacked tonight over and over be larger numbers. I never once whined but I had a blast watching Joe frag 3fingers 15 time at the end of the runway. Sorry, you guys had 4 other fighters there and could have killed us but you didn't. I personally would never try to take off a field 15 times in a row with a gunner at the end of the runway.. I laughed my a** off ..masterful display of intelegence..or was he just testing the game (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)! We didn't go out of our way to get shoot down over 24 and you could have killed us on the way down or on the end of the runway. You had the numbers..! I don't know about the Historical thing.. wasn't there! But I do know that when I hear guys talking of warp on demand I don't give there posts much credence! Most of that has to do with connections ...NOT hackers. As for the community I've been in the online Flight Sim communities for nine years. People that know me know who and what I am...someday you might too if you got out from behind your santimonious biased postings. You seem to be setting yourself up as a self serving BS artist... Cut the Crap! The only thing we did was get shot down and walk to the end of the runway and shoot one (not so smart) pilot down 15 times. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) But It was fun to watch! That simple... I wouldn't go out and deliiberaty do it but when you get shot down over hostile territory we only used resources that were available to us. I for one enjoyed the evening, sounds like you didn't! Gosh we died a lot
too..
Thunder
[This message has been edited by Thunder (edited 12-26-1999).]
[This message has been edited by Thunder (edited 12-26-1999).]
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Thunder and Joemud, I understand what has happened here and I dont have any complaints about either of you guys for doing such things. Hell, I might go out and try to get a 40+ kill floatie tonight! It is a bit cheezy though (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Yeager
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Part of the fun of a beta is having a jolly good time with the bugs. And when it lights up the common channel with a flurry of rants it's just all the more fun. Any of you guys got brothers? When they react to teasing it's nearly impossible to stop; I think it's some kind of vestigal male instinct that drives us onward to tease them until they go insane. I see this as all in fun, life's too short to live it with dyspepsia (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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"..ITS A BETA..", that is begining to sound like some cheap excuse already..
Say this, do that.. always they just say "its a beta", like it would make a right to abuse bugs and cheat.
In finished versions I've heard something similar several times... it goes like this: "why is it possible then? I can do it as long as they dont fix it!".
..and they really do put out updates every day just because of new bug has been found.
Also theres one important point, if people abuses bugs or features just to annoy people, it will not make the game any better, it will be just more restricted!
Heres example: why you guys think that shots at friendly plane bounces back to your plane?
simple: because few has tend to shoot down friendlies just for their own fun. (did others like it? no)
Also they have been saying same excuse.. "why is it possible then?" (go figure)
STOP abusing bugs and features, by saying out some cheap excuse, it will ONLY hurt the game and the community.
If you still havent got it, scroll up and read about "killshooter" which makes shots at friendly planes bounce back to yours, that is example what abusing bugs/features does.
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Joemud has done this on a number of occasions now,he did the same thing in the Volcano with server kills.
He has no intention of becoming part of the AH community.When i log on and check roster,he gets squeclhed right off. Beta or not,we are trying to build a community untill we go public.
Think this is the first time ever i have agreed with Fishu (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I have no use for anybody who abuses known bugs..
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Wardog === Mighty 13th ===
== Death From Behind ==
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Thunder-
1. I wasn't at the field, I formed my opinion on the basis of what you all wrote, my former observations on a similar incident, and the previous time this stunt was pulled (by the same person).
2. Sanctimonious? Perhaps. But I don't believe this game should boil down to "who can cheat the best".
3. No way this "feature" will be left in.
4. I wouldn't take off from a field where you or anyone else was performing with such "skill".
5. This is an air combat simulator, not a Quake "camper" simulator (for those who don't know what that is, a "camper" is a Quaker that hides by a weapon spawn point, killing anyone who appears").
6. Warp on command is very real, and someone with your "vast online experience" should know that.
7. Please explain how this opinion is in any way self-serving.
8. You purposely exploited an unintended feature of the game that gave you a totally unrealistic and unfair advantage, and don't have the brain cells to decipher why anyone has the right to be upset?
9. Why do I even respond to your sophomoric and self-congratulatory postings on the topic? What if everyone starts playing your way... boy, won't that be fun! I don't ordinarily put it as point blank as this, but you are cheating if you continue as you have done. Cabby said it best... Cheaters suck!
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point # 1 the arty work for the pilot after bail out has a rifle !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(wonder where this is going to lead (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) )
point # 2 in real life pilots carried guns!! (think this was just to make them feel more manly (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) )
point # 3 IT'S A GAME(and a beta at that)what "WE" don't need is whining,snivelling,know it all's,genuine arnoldh#l!s who have nothing better to do then rant about anything,people who whine about being vulched,people who whine about being killed,people who whine about this and that being over/under modeled with out ever having flown if even seen one of these things in "real life".please get a grip!
post disclaimer:
this rant is not actualy aimed at any (one person/company/thing/species)it's merely a rant (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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LOL you lame $#@$# make me lauph.
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Dogsta-
I have no beef with you, and sorry if this has offended you, or anyone else other than to whom it was directed. This was brought out in the open by others, and I felt it was therefore put forth for debate.
Some have sided one way, some on the other. No biggie. But it seems that anyone who complains about anything is a whiner. Well, if whining helps identify and stop cheating, so be it.
Maybe we're splitting hairs here. These guys don't want to see it as cheating (though I cannot fathom their justification). I do. Worse, they seem to take glee from upsetting others in the process. I don't care how anyone has fun, until that fun comes at my expense. Then I would like to have some control over how I get the shaft applied. If I had been there and I knew they were conducting one of their "tests" I would steer clear of the base. The originator of this thread obviously wasn't afforded that luxury, and now he's the whiner. You have it backwards. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
Within the rebuttal one of these guys comments that they had been fighting for the base for some time... that sounds pretty intense to me. Imagine how the defenders felt when they were getting whacked by a basically invisible foe (and remember, no tracer fire comes from the gunner!). Suspension of disbelief destroyed, adolescent chuckling on the open channel.
What do you think this sim needs? I think it needs people, and if you run the people out because it becomes painfully obvious there is no way to get a fair shake, it isn't going to be much fun. For now I plan to shell out the money to play... OTOH if I have to wade through the aforementioned behaviors it won't be for long.
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about his number of kills... this is a bug himself and I encountered a while back. Over the course of 16 or so sorties with me flying and himself gunning, himself racked up 43 or 44 kills. It's a bug w/ the sortie count not being reset at the end of a sortie, even if you land it normally.
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Dolomite-
You make a valid point about "whining". People have a right to express their views and shouldn't be flamed for a valid post (although the tone of a post can invite a rather pyrotechnic reply). In this particular case, I believe both parties deserve some of the blame for heating this post up.
As long as we're getting technical about the vocabulary, though, you should know that I disagree with your use of the phrase "a cheat". If a Buf gunner realizes that he has a powerful gun once he gets on the ground, it is inevitable that he's going to try to use it. This is not a cheat. This is using available tools in a war game. It is now time to discuss whether this is a good idea to give a ground troop such a bad-assed weapon. My personal view is that this is too much firepower for a ground pounder, but that's just my opinion. What we should be doing here is discussing whether such a gun should be allowed in future versions of the game, when it originates from a bailed gunner.
Happy flying-
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The folks at HTC have been dealing with cheating in every form there is for years. By the time AH comes out of beta im confident that none of this will come up. And they have given us a great tool with the recorder. If a few people film a guy doing the same thing. Ive no doubt the HTC crew will know what he,s up to in a glance. Lets let them build it first, then you can ware that finger out pointing at the other guy.
For the time being the only known cheaters are P51 pilots (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
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Gentleman,
It was 4 am in the morning when this occured and I stayed up all night playing Aces High. I also had consumed a bit of wine and my decision making may have been hampered. I remember having a great time and we were all tauning and talkin trash. I admited getting shot down by you, bailing and walking to the end of the runway with Joemud as my gunner. At the time it was very, very funny and as I recall we were taunting and you were taunting back. There were only about 28 or 30 of us on at the time and you had us outnumbered. I guess we should never push the limits, have fun and goof off! This is serious business at 4 am in the morning! Call it what you want and from your point of view I am guilty as charged! I have a lighter slant and saw it as having fun the day after christmas. I have it all on tape and reviewed it too. I won't do it any more.. I am sorry we had so much fun at your expense! I will try and restain myself in the future.
Thunder
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Thunder: 4am? hmm.. lets see.. I suppose thats ETA time, which is -7 hours from GMT+2, so it would be 11am here (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Have you forgot that we all don't live in US or time differs in different countries?
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Thunder-
I don't have a problem with you personally, only the behavior. I apologize for taking this thread anywhere near a personal level, I was trying a bit too hard to make a point.
Sorry for the sanctimonious part too; guess I do take this too seriously. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) Saw you on last night, even helped clear your 6 a few times. No hard feelings!
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Dolomite,
Thanks for your post. I had fun last night and thanks for covering my six (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) No hard feelings on my part either. The more we all fly with each other the more we will know we fly and see what we are really about. I look forward to flying with you in the future. Again, you won't see me walking to the end of a runway again.
Salute,
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Cheaters should get latrine duty!!!!
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LOL noooooo
<5 minutes later>
Thunder what have we gotten our selfs into.
<scrub>
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Gijoey,Joetwo,JoeMud=me
DHBG!!
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JoeMud.....
Judging from my limited contact with you, you are not the type of person with sympathy, empathy, nor consideration for the other guy. Of course, I said that in flight. Now, all these posts confirm that feeling. I feel sorry for you.
I am an Air Warrior dweeb, from the classic days, 1996-a newbie. I was fortunate to be selected as a "closed" beta tester for Air Warrior III. I flew AW3 and AW2 and Classic until my eyes were tired. I guess that you have never flown a beta, or ever thought to help someone-if asked. Of course, I can be wrong, but your attitude to the new folks is less than zero. You won't give folks a chance! This flight SIM has real potential. Please HELP make it work. Don't run off the people who will generate the income to make it a success. I hope that I am not stomping on your toes-to badly, but consider your "first" flight. Your first question.....
Just because you now have the ability to kill 43 pilots with a cheat, how about finding a "NEW" one. The old one is lame-like you. If you want to contribute, spend 3 hours flying in a circle, thru clouds and press every button.....then you can have a claim to fame. Folks that can't invite new folks without ridicule and shame, aren't worthy-IMO. But then, I only flew AW. I am not a pilot or even a trainer for our squad. I just like the competition and the friendships formed. If you have a problem with this, so be it. There are other folks who rile me too. Especially the dweeb who keeps checklists on the SIM to see how real it is......he needs to chill or leave too. Constructive criticism should be welcomed, but what you and he are doing is destructive. Get a life!
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
KKEN
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yeah yeah yeah
K-Ken you get a life its a game go insult someone else.
[This message has been edited by JoeMud (edited 12-29-1999).]
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I'm not feeling the love here.
Ronni
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Veronica "Ronni" Newman
Sr. Programmer/Webmaster
HiTech Creations, Inc.
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Hey Ronni how about ya delete this all it is is a big flame fest of guys that take the game a little to serios.
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Gijoey,Joetwo,JoeMud=me
DHBG!!
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JoeMud. Seems maybe a sim like Fighter Ace II would be right up your ally. Alot of kids who do assinine things like you do and who also think like you (in that rules and etiquette are for "other people") permeat that sim.
Cod forbid people should try and enjoy thier hobby and passion while people like you turn it into a jeuvinile circus. And then you have the gall even try to justify it later by claiming it's the other people's problem because they're too serious.
Bite the bullet and shape up. Folks online memory is long lasting. Perhaps this is your legacy and 15 minutes of shame that you were seeking. If not then quit while your so far behind and just contibute to the community and testing. Stop being a jerk.
Curly
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*yawn*
// -nr-1-
P.S They really should disable the scoring system during the beta period.
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Curly dont even go there you lil turd you dont even know me.
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JoeMud? I did go there. What are you going to do about it? I called it right on too as your response shows.
As for 'knowing' you? Well here's a clue-by- four for you JoeDud, no one gives a rats bellybutton who you are in real life when you are online - you useless guppy. You're judged on how you act and conduct yourself and I can say without a doubt now you are one snot nosed poodle pumping loser.
Curly
[This message has been edited by Curly (edited 12-29-1999).]
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<PUNT> Ronni please kill this trash fast !
I have never seen such drivel on all accounts even way back in ver.84 in CK/WB ?
Guns out.
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I'm holding out hope that peace and harmony will prevail. Don't let me down, guys.
Ronni
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Veronica "Ronni" Newman
Sr. Programmer/Webmaster
HiTech Creations, Inc.
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Ronni, Have i told you and the rest of the AH crew how much i love you, lately? This is an awesome sim and you folks are doing an outstanding job with it. Thanks for all you're doing.
kjb
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Just a simple suggestion: A few people will "act out", probably to get attention. It might be better to ignore them to a certain extent and report bugs/violations to staff. Sometimes the lack of attention quiets them down better than direct criticism. It's a kind of 'if you know who is doing it then don't play their game thing'.
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Amen Brother BBGUN
Guns out.
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Feel the love...btw where is Larry and Moe?
And I thought Curly was the more....mature one of the bunch. And as for what im going to do about it normally I would say rip off your head and spit down your neck,but like I said its a game and plus from the way you sound it wouldnt be much fun with that small of a head. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Oh and guys thanks for letting loose all those feelings we needed to stir things up around here I was getting bored and the volcano got old after an hour or so (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
And to all you guys that have just chilled and waited I salute you all!
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Ya know, posting about cheaters here may not be the smart thing to do. Instead why not just contact HTC and let them deal with it. Being beta I truely expect this kind of stuff and dont let it get to me, Report bugs and let them fix em. Even if I were to get banned for cheating, I could just sign up again with another name untill I got caught yet again. I would rather they squash the bugs and continue to work on the sim then chase after people who game the game. When it goes pay, then Ill complain if this kind of stuff continues to happen. I bet when it does most of these dweebs will dissapear anyway. Posts like this are not accomplishing anything, anyone who plays the game will get to know who these people are, and no sence in starting a flame war over it. OTOH, a good flame war can be entertaining (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
I say relax and do you jobs as a beta testers.
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Those where the good ol days. LOL!!!!!!
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Speak for yourself Joe! Wish we had never done it. And by the way... Thanks for bringing it up again!
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Yea I loved it when 10 of you couldn't take an airfield because of my Spitzeke.
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was sorta a clasic...
only the crater kills where better.
who did that again...
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My 2 cents:
1) Taking advantage of a bug is a dweeb thing to do. Complete loss of respect follows.
2) It stopped being a Beta to alot of people when they started paying, and scores are kept.
3) Asking HTC to delete the thread so nobody else hears about your actions confirms that you know it was dweeb.
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GRAB some maturity and be accountable!!!
To say "I did it for this reason, or I did it for that reason", or "I just wanted to see what would happen"....is the most lame arnold thing Ive ever heard. We all know whats right, we all know whats wrong. If you want to CHEAT OR EXPLOIT BUGS, PLEASE PLAY NINTENDO or such other passtimes.Or one of the thousands of CD-ROM-on line games that have been ruined with web-pages full of cheats. Anyone who honestly derives pleasure from a misbegotten victory, has ,not only my sympothy, but my condolances as well.
AKelfy (Doug)
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Guyz...............
For those of you that neglect to look at the date of the original posting, this event happened last December in the first BETA release.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Yeager
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If I could do it again I would just to piss you off even more. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Dates? who looks at dates? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Ooooch, just realised how old it was.... Beta? What Beta, me missing out on something... doh!
'Nexx' (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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I'm getting a feeling of AGW dejavu here. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Lt. Col. Aaron "txace-" Giles of the 457th BG
"Fait Accompli"
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You're all PAYING to play a BETA? Suckers!
Does this mean the price will go up when the game goes live?
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Rascal, in December, when this happened, there was no pay.
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Hummm and people say I cant read :/
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"..he shoots fire out of his eyes and lightning bolts out of his arse..."
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Ahhh (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) I feel at home in this community already.
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One word, bilge.
(if you think I'm referring to you, you're right)
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pzvg- "5 years and I still can't shoot"