Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Ripsnort on March 31, 2004, 10:45:33 AM
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U.S.: Get ready for $3--3.50 a gallon by August.
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Who cares? My car runs 35miles/gall. :)
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Opec is going to determine the election...
Goodbye GWB
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Time to go take all there oil it would seem.
when will the rags ever learn.
Dont mess with the big dogs food.
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Voting for Kerry to get lower gas????
That would be like voting for him thinking he will lower taxes for anyone.... lol
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Originally posted by GtoRA2
Voting for Kerry to get lower gas????
That would be like voting for him thinking he will lower taxes for anyone.... lol
You dont think he will lower middle class taxes just because he is a democrat? You really think the world is that black and white?
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Originally posted by LAWCobra
Time to go take all there oil it would seem.
when will the rags ever learn.
Dont mess with the big dogs food.
What? Producing oil is a business and in capitalism the producer is free to determine the price he wants to get from his product.
Consumer has several choices: Pay the price, search for alternative product, cut down your usage, quit using the product or try to negotiate a price cut.
Producing oil is not a welfare project;If you can't afford to buy gas buy a bicycle.
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Originally posted by Staga
Who cares? My car runs 35miles/gall. :)
While gasoline is certainly part of the equation, its only a percentage of it. You see, any consumer goods that use plastic, from your computer, to the sexual toys on your dresser, require oil. Food requires shipment from the field, to the grocery store. The price of fuel goes up, so does your grocery bill. Just about every item in front of you right now required oil to make, whether it be glass (To fire the furnace to make the glass) to paper (if your generators use fuel instead of coal or nuclear power)
So, in conclusion, think outside of "MPG", as it affects all aspects of our lives.
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The overall prices on goods wont go up that much. It will affect people who drive poor mpg cars more then anything. BTW kerry is calling for opening up the oil reserves for the summer while bush is sitting on it. So yes, if kerry was in charge oil prices would go that high.
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Frog
I do not think John Kerry will lower middle class taxes, I do not think it is imposible that another democrat might.
I know the world is not black and white, but I dont think their is much of a gray area for Kerry on this one.
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Originally posted by GtoRA2
Frog
I do not think John Kerry will lower middle class taxes, I do not think it is imposible that another democrat might.
I know the world is not black and white, but I dont think their is much of a gray area for Kerry on this one.
So you think his tax plan that he has been running on is just a lie?
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Of course he'll lower middle class taxes.
But then to a Democrat, anyone making over $35K is "rich upper class".
;)
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Originally posted by Toad
Of course he'll lower middle class taxes.
But then to a Democrat, anyone making over $35K is "rich upper class".
;)
Wrong anyone over 200k is in the upper class tax bracket.
Lets be realistic here.
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Frog
Has he come out and clearly said he would lower middle class taxes?
If he did I missed it. But with Kerry, I am prone to think just about anything he says can change.
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(http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/116_1080757884_argue2.jpg)
OK, I guess they think over $77K is rich. That's where the plans seem to start coming together.
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Originally posted by Frogm4n
The overall prices on goods wont go up that much. It will affect people who drive poor mpg cars more then anything. BTW kerry is calling for opening up the oil reserves for the summer while bush is sitting on it. So yes, if kerry was in charge oil prices would go that high.
The poor people are affected drastically. They can't usually afford the latest and greatest in MPG, so what happens? Gas and Run's go up, like they have been here.
Would you really want your reserves drained to reduce your price of gas, during the time of war? I would not. I would probably not add anymore to it until prices adjust, but I wouldn't take all the reserve out. That makes us a very vulnerable nation.
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Originally posted by Toad
OK, I guess they think over $77K is rich. That's where the plans seem to start coming together.
Wait til ol' Froggy isn't living off Mom and Dad's college money, and needs to go out and buy a house, pay a mortgage. He'll find out fast (if he has a family to support) that $77,000 doesn't go very far. ;)
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LOL are you saying OPEC should not cut the production 'cause poor americans will suffer mostly?
Again; it's busines, not a welfare project.
If you can't afford then don't buy it.
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Originally posted by Staga
LOL are you saying OPEC should not cut the production 'cause poor americans will suffer mostly?
Again; it's busines, not a welfare project.
If you can't afford then don't buy it.
No , I was answering to Frog. Most american's pay the extra, but don't change lifestyles. The poor cannot have that luxury.
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No pain, no gain.
Raise gas prices to $10 a gallon. Major serious pain.
Do you think that would turn our best, brightest and most hungry capitalists towards alternative energy research/production in a big way?
When cars run on the "Back to the Future" converter and we can throw orange peels in there, would that be a major gain?
It's going to happen someday. The planet will eventually run out of oil. Why not do it now?
The OPEC folks are having another one of their innings. However they may finally push the switch on alternative energy.
Then, he who laughs last may well laugh best.
It is capitalism. Let's get off the bench and into the game.
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Originally posted by Staga
What? Producing oil is a business and in capitalism the producer is free to determine the price he wants to get from his product.
Consumer has several choices: Pay the price, search for alternative product, cut down your usage, quit using the product or try to negotiate a price cut.
Producing oil is not a welfare project;If you can't afford to buy gas buy a bicycle.
Im talking bout being held hostage by these opec arse clowns like we were back in the 70s.
you remeber that chit?
If they are doing this to try and infuince the election in nov.
Then yeah I say butter em open up our reserves and really go after hydrogen
powerd cars.
But in the mean time we should kick there butts just on principles.
Where do you think they got all the pipelines?
All that ifrastructure all the technology for pulling that crude out of the earth?
LOL watermelon untill we built it for them they where ingnorant goat hearders for the most part.
So they aint got no buisness biting the hand that feeds them.
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Fool Me Once, Shame On You, Fool Me Twice...
Like LAWCobra said we got our first lessons in this game already in seventies.
Didn't you learn anything?
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Wait til ol' Froggy isn't living off Mom and Dad's college money, and needs to go out and buy a house, pay a mortgage. He'll find out fast (if he has a family to support) that $77,000 doesn't go very far. ;)
not to hijack your post but thats $37 per hour 40 hours a week. i dont see how you couldn't live well on that kinda money. rough estimate of what i pay in taxes to govt. is @ 30% and i make a lot less than that. i dont see why anybody that makes 77k a year and paying @30% tax, same as me, should get a tax cut at all.
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screw it..... I think its time the Iraqis payed for their own freedom with their oil. Sure, it was bogus how we got there, but now that we are... LET"S TAKE IT!!!!!! BWAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
Seriously, I think it was BS what GWB said to get us to take Iraq.. but the reality is... we're there now .... and while the poor iraqis need there oil to rebuild their country now.... wtf does the U.S. have to spring for the bill... as usual. If not Oil.... we should get permanant military bases to scare the bejesus out of Iran with.
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Wait til ol' Froggy isn't living off Mom and Dad's college money, and needs to go out and buy a house, pay a mortgage. He'll find out fast (if he has a family to support) that $77,000 doesn't go very far.
I would not buy a house unless i saved the money for it. I do not believe in 'credit'. Either you have the cash or you do not.
77k goes pretty far if your not an ignorant spend monkey that cannot wear a condom, but like i said john kerry has stated that only the people makeing over 200k would have a tax increase.
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Originally posted by Frogm4n
I would not buy a house unless i saved the money for it. I do not believe in 'credit'. Either you have the cash or you do not.
77k goes pretty far if your not an ignorant spend monkey that cannot wear a condom, but like i said john kerry has stated that only the people makeing over 200k would have a tax increase.
so mom and dad are gonna house and feed you until you save $150,000 to $200,000 for your home or are they gonna pay you that to move the hell out :)
that scale is crap - $36k combined income is middle class? maybe in bodunk not in any major city - including the southern ones
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There are alternatives (http://www.biodiesel.org/)
But people just find excuses not to use them. The first diesel engine actually used biodiesel, but oil was cheaper and more abundant. Now I don't expect everyone to give up gas cars right away, but if we got the nation's diesel trucks to use it, it would cut our oil consumption.
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Can someone explain why we let Iraq rejoin OPEC?
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"I would not buy a house unless i saved the money for it. I do not believe in 'credit'. Either you have the cash or you do not. "...sorry this was a quote form brainiac strk
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLLOLOLOLOLO LOLOL
I take it he shares an apartment or lives at home..LMFAOOAOAOAOAO
morons at there best...lol what price house you saving for?..lolol
btw..FUQ MIDDLE EAST OIL!!..DONT BUY IT>>BUY NON MIDDLE EAST OIL!!!!!
and DRILL through the SKULLS of the godam reindeers if needed in ALAska....
Starve the middle east....let them DIE..unless they change there ways..
seems so easy...but the more i read..what the hell?!!..where can I not support Middle east oil?
http://www.ballew.org/madeusa/buyUSoil.htm
i have seen this many times but have read the opposite too..any ideas??
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Heh this is better than a friggin' zoo :D
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Originally posted by BGBMAW
I would not buy a house unless i saved the money for it. I do not believe in 'credit'. Either you have the cash or you do not.
Lol, the avg price of a single family home in my state is over 300k, good luck. Your credit is everything, if you have no credit you will find it very hard to purchase a home, or anything else for that matter. If you are young, start building your credit now.
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Originally posted by -MZ-
Can someone explain why we let Iraq rejoin OPEC?
hmmmm....
Heartbreak Cartel
Ten billion reasons why Iraq shouldn't rejoin OPEC.
By Michael Kinsley
Posted Thursday, Sept. 25, 2003, at 12:23 PM PT
From the way it gets covered in the press, you would think that OPEC was one of those mystifying but harmless international something-or-others like the IMF or the World Economic Forum. It holds meetings periodically, men in foreign-looking garb (Arab robes or European suits) bustle about and make gnomic remarks to reporters about demand in the third quarter of next year, decisions are announced and cautions are issued and everybody seems to be having a jolly time feeling global and important. But no harm done.
This week it's a sort of stuffy gentlemen's club or honorific academy of nations, which confers respectability along with membership. You imagine the delegates conversing from deep leather arm chairs. "I see that this new governmental thingy they're trying to put together in Iraq is up for admission. Uncle Sam says it's very sound. What say we give the young rascal a shot?"
Meeting in Vienna, the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries made two bits of news. First, it welcomed the new Governing Council of Iraq to reoccupy the seat once held by such distinguished predecessors as Saddam Hussein. The Bush administration takes paternal pride in this development, as a father might on The Sopranos when his son becomes a "made man" of organized crime. Imagine: not even 6 months old, and already a member of OPEC!
Second, the members of OPEC agreed to reduce the amount of oil they offer for sale by 900,000 barrels a day. Oil prices immediately shot up by 4 percent, or $1.11 a barrel. The stock market showed its appreciation by taking a dive.
Many opponents of Gulf War II have thought all along that President Bush's motives must involve oil in some way. It would be silly to suggest that the war has been a secret plot to get Iraq back into OPEC. But it is so insane for the U.S. government to regard this development as an American triumph that paranoid speculation is hard to resist. At the very least, the Bush administration has succumbed to the widespread impression that OPEC is just another acronym on the high-minded diplomatic circuit.
As Timothy Noah reminds us, OPEC is a conspiracy to fix prices. It is a textbook example of how to violate the Sherman Antitrust Act. As sovereign nations meeting in far-away luxury hotels, rather than American business executives exchanging furtive messages across state lines, OPEC's members probably can't be prosecuted. But we shouldn't forget the true nature of the organization. And we certainly shouldn't be legitimizing and strengthening it by nominating members.
This is not just a matter of respecting the principles behind our laws even when the laws can't be enforced. There's a reason we've made it illegal for competitors to conspire: It costs the rest of us money. And we can do a back-of-the-envelope calculation of how much money this American diplomatic triumph is going to cost.
OPEC controls only about a third of the world oil market. But because a barrel of oil is a barrel of oil, OPEC's machinations affect the price of all the world's oil. The United States imports over 9 billion barrels of oil a year. That $1.11 price-per-barrel increase that followed this week's announcement of tighter OPEC supply restrictions equals $10 billion a year added to America's oil-import bill.
When the oil fields and pipelines are restored, Iraq could be pumping as much as 5 million barrels a day. But Iraq's OPEC quota is traditionally the same as Iran's, which is currently under 4 million barrels a day. So, it is not unreasonable to suppose that Iraq's rejoining OPEC could reduce oil supply and raise oil prices at least as much as the OPEC supply restrictions announced this week.
And $10 billion a year is just the beginning. Oil is oil: When import prices go up, the price of domestic oil goes up too. America imports about 60 percent of its oil. Consumers would pay American oil producers another $7 billion or so for oil it won't cost a penny more to pull out of the ground. And when oil goes up, other energy sources follow. Oil is less than 40 percent of our total energy consumption. So, add another $25 billion or so in higher prices for natural gas, coal, and so on. We're up to over $40 billion a year. And that's ignoring the effects on the rest of the world—as we usually do. Despite our best efforts, Americans can't manage to consume more than a quarter of the world's energy.
Put it all together, discount heavily for safety, add a dab of tendentiousness, and you can easily come up with a figure like, oh, say $87 billion a year as a modest estimate of what Iraq's restoration to OPEC could cost. Eighty-seven billion? Why, isn't that the amount Bush wants for Operation Iraq Et Cetera? Why, yes, it is.
Now, it's true that America's interest is not necessarily in the lowest-possible short-term energy prices. Higher prices encourage conservation and new sources, which may keep energy costs lower in the long run. It's a complex and uncertain calculation. But however you figure, America's interest as a net energy importer and OPEC's interest as a collection of exporters are diametrically opposed. There is no formula for stability or middle ground that serves both.
What we pay for oil, a dead resource, is like a tax on the productive elements of the economy—human labor and ingenuity, and financial capital. Only this tax goes into the treasury in Riyadh and bank accounts in Houston, instead of the treasury in Washington. To the Bush folks that makes it better, I guess.
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Originally posted by bigsky
not to hijack your post but thats $37 per hour 40 hours a week. i dont see how you couldn't live well on that kinda money. rough estimate of what i pay in taxes to govt. is @ 30% and i make a lot less than that. i dont see why anybody that makes 77k a year and paying @30% tax, same as me, should get a tax cut at all.
Depends on location. In Billings, I'd be a "Billingsinaire" ;) In Seattle, the avg. cost of a 3 bdrm/2 bth 1800 sq.ft. house is $260,000. At a 15 year loan, that'd be roughly 1/2 your take home pay.
Hence, the main reason I'm retiring in Ennis, Montana in 13 years is cost of living!
According to the Homefair COL calculator
$77,000 in Billings is equal to $117,450 in Seattle.
http://www.homefair.com/homefair/calc/salcalc.html
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With that money you could buy your own village from Iraq and your own oil-well :)
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lol Sixpence..im sorry my quote did not show properly..i sure in hell didnt say that..
Hell im lookn for a 400K loan right now:)
if you can edit your quote ..and put strks name..that woudl eb much better:) thnk u