Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: midnight Target on May 18, 2004, 05:19:25 PM
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It isn't alway blatant hatred. Sometimes it is manifested by well meaning, even kind people who just don't see the other side of the coin.
http://www.asante.net/articles/racist-language.html
Read it if you're interested.
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As a white guy Im a victim of racism every day, I know what it feels like.
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Originally posted by Yeager
As a white guy Im a victim of racism every day, I know what it feels like.
You shouldn't attribute all the insulting remarks to your skin colour but rather to your unpleasant personality, gives you something to work on to boot...
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As a white guy Im a victim of racism every day, I know what it feels like.
Poor you.
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that racist thud :D
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His concepts may be OK, but I couldn't get through more than a couple of paragraphs. He needs an editor, a thesaurus and data to back up some of his historical data, for instance the statement that slave owners did not know or care the tribe of their slaves.
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here's a better way to understand racism. Its OK If librals and minoritys do but unacceptable for conservatives and/or white people.
http://www.cnn.com/2003/EDUCATION/09/25/smu.bake.sale.ap/
DALLAS, Texas (AP) -- Southern Methodist University shut down a bake sale Wednesday in which cookies were offered for sale at different prices, depending on the buyer's race or gender.
The sale was organized by the Young Conservatives of Texas, who said it was intended as a protest of affirmative action.
A sign said white males had to pay $1 for a cookie. The price was 75 cents for white women, 50 cents for Hispanics and 25 cents for blacks.
Members of the conservative group said they meant no offense and were only trying to protest the use of race or gender as a factor in college admissions.
Similar sales have been held by College Republican chapters at colleges in at least five other states since February.
A black student filed a complaint with SMU, saying the sale was offensive. SMU officials said they halted the event after 45 minutes because it created a potentially unsafe situation.
"This was not an issue about free speech," Tim Moore, director of the SMU student center, said in a story for Thursday's edition of The Dallas Morning News. "It was really an issue where we had a hostile environment being created."
The sale drew a crowd outside the student center and several students engaged in a shouting match, Moore said.
David C. Rushing, 23, a law student and chairman of Young Conservatives of Texas at SMU and for the state, said the event didn't get out of hand. At most, a dozen students gathered around the table of cookies and Rice Krispies treats, he said.
"We copied what's been done at multiple campuses around the country to illustrate our opinion of affirmative action and how we think it's unfair," he said.
Matt Houston, a 19-year-old sophomore, called the group's price list offensive.
"My reaction was disgust because of the ignorance of some SMU students," said Houston, who is black. "They were arguing that affirmative action was solely based on race. It's not based on race. It's based on bringing a diverse community to a certain organization."
The group sold three cookies during its protest, raising $1.50.
In June, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled universities could use race as a factor in admissions under limited conditions. In Texas, universities had been banned from using race as a factor under a 1996 decision by a lower court.
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<---- This liberal thinks it's funny as hell, Gun.
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And in the grand scheme of things who gives a chit?
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I'm patiently waiting for the Michael Moore movie.
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Guns dont kill people, dangerous minorities do!
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TIME FOR A LYNCHIN!!!
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JERK EM TO JEZUS!!!
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Chuck have you been ransacking the sacramental wine again?
Jesus loved cannabis oil, dig it baby.:D
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Actually he had a thing for headier stuff and the crucifix is the international symbol for the mushroom.
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I see my work here is done.
Now go and sin no more my children.
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Dang, thot this was a thread about Nascar.
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Originally posted by Gunslinger
here's a better way to understand racism. Its OK If librals and minoritys do but unacceptable for conservatives and/or white people.
You rightwingers love to victimize yourself don't you...
Everybody's against you, the media, the educational system, the minorities, the Europeans. Poor you!
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there is something wrong with this thread... it has no amerika vs europe vs amerika hatred in it so far.
this thread sucks!!!
(http://www.spymac.com/gallery/pics/smilies/arrow_left.gif) i have my flame retardant hat on too
:D
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Originally posted by Nilsen
there is something wrong with this thread... it has no amerika vs europe vs amerika hatred in it so far.
this thread sucks!!!
:D
Well I cant let this state of affairs go on, can I?
I think that you Europeans should stop being lazy and get a job!
:p
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why?
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Originally posted by Nilsen
why?
Read the article....
But I cant blame you if you don't...
For such a well educated and experienced man the author of that article cant write worth a damn, extremely dry and boring for wahat could be and is an intresting subject...
His CV...
http://www.asante.net/profileandvita.pdf
Plus he's a thurougly afro-centric biased racist quack himself, so I'd say that reduces his credibility...
His website:
http://www.asante.net/index2.html
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Stay on the topic please Grunherz... I asked why we europeeans shold get jobs. You respond by hijacking this fine thread and putting those links in here. I think ther are to many hijackings going on here and amerikans are usually to blame.
:p
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WTG Nilsen ! you set the hook and 10 minute later you have your 1st fish ;)
Btw GRUN I did not see you in AHII are you still flying ?
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You hijacaked the thread....
My links are directly related to this thread, I'm arguing the author of the artivcle in question is a quack...
And yea, did you say anything you stupid frenchman?
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I don't know I've put myself on my ignore list.
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no no no. grun.
I made this thread into what it is today. You just had to hijack it back on a track it was no longer on. :p
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Originally posted by straffo
WTG Nilsen ! you set the hook and 10 minute later you have your 1st fish ;)
Do i look like somekind of amateur to you? I use a net, not a hook. Anyway, grunherz is too small to be taken onboard, he has to go back in because the EU has imposed some minimum size. :D
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Originally posted by straffo
I don't know I've put myself on my ignore list.
Typical french....
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Nilsen do you happend know any of the 3 or 4 non-white people in Norway?
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Nilsen do you happend know any of the 3 or 4 non-white people in Norway?
There are white people in Norway??!!!?
Tronsky
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Nilsen do you happend know any of the 3 or 4 non-white people in Norway?
I know of only one white person actually, but she has some sort of pigment disorder and red eyes. The also has big glasses, so as you may guess......she is no treat.
what was your question again?
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the guy seems to be talking out his bellybutton and contradicting himself from one paragraph to the next.
for example in his 11th paragraph he states that white refused to distinguish between different tribes and cultures for the purpose of dehumanizing them.
African cultural and ethnic differences were neither recorded nor considered important in making distinctions, any African was black, and any black was a Negro, and Negroes had no cultural heritage. To recognize Africans as Asante, Yoruba, Ibo, Ibibio, Hausa, Mandingo, Fulani, Wolof, Serere, Kikongo, Fante, and so forth would have meant ascribing history, cosmologies, indeed, humanity to those who were enslaved. Without humanity, Africans could be called the worst epithets thinkable by white Americans.
but in his 12th paragraph he says that slave owners treated slaves differently based on perceived differences from one tribe to another, and that there is an abundance of stories of slave owners who had a preference for slaves of one tribe or another based on these perceived differences.
Thus, Mandingo people were treated one way and Asante another based upon what was perceived to be temperamental differences. The literature of slavery is abundant with stories of slave-owners indicating preference for certain Africans because of perceived value based on difference traits, real or imagined
so how is it that you could have a preference for one ethnic or cultural group, or value one group over another if you neither recorded nor considered important their ethnic or cultural heritage, and any African was black, and any black was a Negro, and Negroes had no cultural heritage.
the man doesn't even agree with himself, so maybe he can try and figure out what he thinks happened and give it another try.
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Why are the smelly eurotrash culture snobs allowed in this thread?
I discriminate all the time. I base my discrimination on a lot of factors.
I don't think we should punish one or another class or race tho to "even things up".
lazs
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Originally posted by Thud
You rightwingers love to victimize yourself don't you...
Everybody's against you, the media, the educational system, the minorities, the Europeans. Poor you!
Not as much as you left wingers like to create them. Oh the poor opressed people....they need govt hand outs or no ones gonna take care of them. Lets make them so dependent on hand outs (cause they dont know anybetter) so they will never be truly independent person and allways need us.
Why are the smelly eurotrash culture snobs allowed in this thread?
I discriminate all the time. I base my discrimination on a lot of factors.
I don't think we should punish one or another class or race tho to "even things up".
lazs
A guy I work with just got back from being stationed in europe. He's from alabama and said he saw more racism there than he ever did back in the states.
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yes... everyone who lives here (U.S.) would see more racism if they were dumped back into their native land than they do here.
hell.. even our indians discriminated against each other.
lazs
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Originally posted by Nilsen
I know of only one white person actually, but she has some sort of pigment disorder and red eyes. The also has big glasses, so as you may guess......she is no treat.
what was your question again?
I'll take that as a no!
:D
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you could Grun, but one of my best friends is from Colombia. 2 of my neighbours are from Spain and 2 houses down there are 4 people from Iran. :)
There is an asian community not too far away and also several individuals from Somalia.
I'm prolly one of the least racist people you can find on ths BBS.
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So... did anyone see Colin Powell on "Meet the Press" the other day?
-- Todd/Leviathn
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Originally posted by Dead Man Flying
So... did anyone see Colin Powell on "Meet the Press" the other day?
-- Todd/Leviathn
Bout freakin time!
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Racism - just a word now used by people who won't accept responsiblity for their own actions and want to place blame or fault on others.
Pretty much how it works now isn't it?
dago
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Originally posted by Gunslinger
Not as much as you left wingers like to create them. Oh the poor opressed people....they need govt hand outs or no ones gonna take care of them. Lets make them so dependent on hand outs (cause they dont know anybetter) so they will never be truly independent person and allways need us.
Sure. And helping some people just so much that they are able to make ends meet and move on with life is horrible. Just let them slide and fade out of society. If I was an unbiased bystander I'd say you were an egocentric without an eye for the long-term perspective...
A guy I work with just got back from being stationed in europe. He's from alabama and said he saw more racism there than he ever did back in the states.
A girl I know did her internship in the States, said that she got the impression that all Americans were shallow superficial bigots except for a few and far between exceptions.
I know for a fact she is wrong. You on the other hand will surely be convinced that your buddy's impression was objective and representative. Says more about the both of you than about Europe.
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Originally posted by Thud
A girl I know did her internship in the States, said that she got the impression that all Americans were shallow superficial bigots except for a few and far between exceptions.
She is only bitter because she was so ugly she didn't get any...
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Originally posted by Thud
Sure. And helping some people just so much that they are able to make ends meet and move on with life is horrible. Just let them slide and fade out of society. If I was an unbiased bystander I'd say you were an egocentric without an eye for the long-term perspective...
Nope I just grew up seeing people become so dependent on welfare that it was better for them to stay on it than get a job and become a productive member of society. I do not need a libral to tell me how to live....tell me I need him to get by....tell me how to raise my children. I provide for my family and wince at those who do not
A girl I know did her internship in the States, said that she got the impression that all Americans were shallow superficial bigots except for a few and far between exceptions.
I know for a fact she is wrong. You on the other hand will surely be convinced that your buddy's impression was objective and representative. Says more about the both of you than about Europe.
Well I'm sorry she got that opinion of us. We are alot of things including what you described. Maybe I shouldnt have used the word EUROPE instead I would say England France Germany and Italy. Those are the countrys some of my coworkers have lived in and they all say the same thing. I'm not saying they are bad people just that there's alot of people in europe that live in glass houses.....especially on this board.
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Originally posted by straffo
I don't know I've put myself on my ignore list.
LMAO, thats sig matterial, smart's thing I think you have said.
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Originally posted by Nilsen
you could Grun, but one of my best friends is from Colombia. 2 of my neighbours are from Spain and 2 houses down there are 4 people from Iran. :)
There is an asian community not too far away and also several individuals from Somalia.
I'm prolly one of the least racist people you can find on ths BBS.
Ahh yes, the traditional bigot's "but look at my colored friends" exuse. You're not fooling anyone....
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Ahh yes, the traditional bigot's "but look at my colored friends" exuse. You're not fooling anyone....
who are you calling biggot....you biggot :D
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What a biggot!
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Originally posted by straffo
I don't know I've put myself on my ignore list.
LOL
it is so funny to watch how some ppl arent able to tolerate diferent opinions....
muhehe
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If I want to help someone or if you do then there is nothing wrong with that .... once in a while it is even admirable or .... sometimes even.... helpful.
when you want to steal from me in order to give what you consider to be help to someone else based on skin color or gender or whatever then... there is something wrong.
nilsen... in California white males are a minority. Unless you are around more than a token amount of minorities like in your country then really.... you don't know anything about it. It is simple to pretend you are enlightened when it costs you nothing.
lazs
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Originally posted by Nilsen
and 2 houses down there are 4 people from Iran. :)
hush hushu you lucky bastard
any decent girl overthere ? :D
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It's completely impossible to discuss issues of race and ethnicity with all the anger on this board. Nevertheless, I'll jump in.
Excerpt taken from this link:
http://www.aaanet.org/stmts/racepp.htm
physical variations in the human species have no meaning except the social ones that humans put on them. "race" as it is understood in the United States of America was a social mechanism invented during the 18th century to refer to those populations brought together in colonial America: the English and other European settlers, the conquered Indian peoples, and those peoples of Africa brought in to provide slave labor.
Evidence from the analysis of genetics (e.g., DNA) indicates that most physical variation, about 94%, lies within so-called racial groups. Conventional geographic "racial" groupings differ from one another only in about 6% of their genes. This means that there is greater variation within "racial" groups than between them.
http://occawlonline.pearsoned.com/bookbind/pubbooks/nashbrief_awl/chapter11/medialib/nash-visual20.html
Funked1 and Yeager. Thank you for making my point. Actually, Blacks are very conservative when it comes to religion, so that whole "jerk em to jezus" comment just illustrates your complete lack of knowledge for what you're talking about.
Gunslinger - your point in assuming that all minorities need welfare and hand outs is an example of racial stereotyping, and that in itself is 100% inaccurate. Your comment only suggests that whites aren't on welfare and dont need "handouts." is this your belief?
Lazs2. I'll gladly pay your ticket back to YOUR native land. I agree with your idea of not placing one group at a disadvantage. If you left the planet, your absence would significantly raise the average intelligence of the human gene pool. Please, exit quietly now...
Dago, don't dangerous whites kill people, too? Maybe it's only my imagination...but I doubt it.
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redtail... is there something I have said that is incorrect? Thank you for the offer to move me back to Scotland but I like it here. I ask for no special privliges based on my background but....
say you are black... then your theory about variation in each race being high is very correct. If you go to africa say you will find great amounts of prejudice and bigotry based on skin color... the darker the more discriminated against.
I find this wrong but it is none of my bussiness... over here it is. I do not wish anyone to be given special treatment UNDER THE LAW here. bigotry on a personal level, while abhorent, is none of my bussiness so long as the bigot is not breaking the law.
lazs
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Originally posted by lazs2
nilsen... in California white males are a minority. Unless you are around more than a token amount of minorities like in your country then really.... you don't know anything about it. It is simple to pretend you are enlightened when it costs you nothing.
lazs
and what did i say to get that one again?
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Originally posted by lada
any decent girl overthere ? :D
not anymore...the only one worth mentioning is now feeding my kid so....sorry :p
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Originally posted by Nilsen
not anymore...the only one worth mentioning is now feeding my kid so....sorry :p
YEAH!! PROVE IT!!!;):D
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I could post a pic Scootter, but i bet it would be all over the web before nightfall so i better not :D
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nielson... claiming that having a few miorities in you neigborhood makes you enlightened or "the least prejudiced guy on the BBS" is what got that comment from me. I believe that those of us who live in much more diverse racial and economic areas like some of us in the U.S. would argue that you really don't know anything about it based on your limited experiance in a socialist and immigrant regulated country...
lazs
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This is scary...
I understand your point Lasz.
But look at the way society is set up in America. Times are better now so its not easy to see why affirmative action was needed. Only in some instances is it still necessary. The truth is white males run this country. They hold the highest positions in the job arena and in the education system. Not long ago many off these men in charge who grew up in the 50's were racist. It was hard for a person of color with equal qualification to get into schools or hold high ranking positions. So they made a quota that didnt even the playing field but gave women and people of color some help.
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Originally posted by lazs2
nielson... claiming that having a few miorities in you neigborhood makes you enlightened or "the least prejudiced guy on the BBS" is what got that comment from me. I believe that those of us who live in much more diverse racial and economic areas like some of us in the U.S. would argue that you really don't know anything about it based on your limited experiance in a socialist and immigrant regulated country...
lazs
Just because there are more "white" people living around me that other ethnic groups does not automaticly make me more racist than others. I do see your point if you mean that there may be others on this bb that is as little racist as i am tho. Your surroundings does not have to dictate your emotions mr.
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Originally posted by Gunslinger
here's a better way to understand racism. Its OK If librals and minoritys do but unacceptable for conservatives and/or white people.
http://www.cnn.com/2003/EDUCATION/09/25/smu.bake.sale.ap/
"(Affirmative Action)- It's not based on race. It's based on bringing a diverse community to a certain organization."
What a crock of F****** S***!
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jamusta... I was around when there were "colored" drinking fountains... they were on the way out without any affiramative action... most people ignored them long before that.
It could be argued that affirmative action caused more problems than it solved if it solved any... I believe that letting things naturally evolve is better than forcing it especially in a blatantly unfair way like affirmatve action... it could be argued that affirmative action created more tension than it ever solved.
if white people control more of the wealth then... that is how it should be. If people with ability are around they will rise... there is no stopping it and it would be foolish to do so. for instance... it would be foolish to keep blacks out of basketball with legal but biggoted buiseness practices... some honky somewhere will realize that he can capitalize on the black ability and he will cause a killing in the game... soon... everyone will clamor for blacks on their team..
money matters are no different. For certain cases you want a black lawyeer for instance but me personally...
for lawyers doctors and comedians I allways insist on jewish folk.
you chose who you want.
lazs
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So you people didn't hear about Colin Powell on "Meet the Press" then? It's really interesting... some white chick deputy Press Secretary tried to put him under her oppressive thumb, but he kindly told the Man to BACK OFF.
I'm sure there's a thread about it around here somewhere.
-- Todd/Leviathn
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Originally posted by Tumor
"(Affirmative Action)- It's not based on race. It's based on bringing a diverse community to a certain organization."
What a crock of F****** S***!
Affirmative Action is not only about race, but race is how some wish to re-define it. Fact: White women are the greatest benefactors from AA, not racial minorities.
How many of your sporting teams are in the playoffs? The ones that are not are in the lottery - yet another form of AA.
The Michigan graduate students who filed a case regarding the six black students who were admitted ahead of them, made NO mention of the scores of white students whose scores were lower who also gained admittance. Take those six black students out of the mix, there's no gurantee they would have gotten in anyway.
Do you people really believe that every white student that competes in sports, in the orchestra, or other XC activity gets admitted to college solely based on test scores? Get real. To deny racism exists is about as stupid as believing that race comes into play in every situation.
But since it is the easiest thing to bring attention to, and it helps to create the false perception that race is more used as a predictor of socialstatus and class, it's what the detractors want to bring attention to the most.
had to delete the rest out, most of you wouldn't have wanted to read it anyway ...
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redtail... if scores are the admitting factor then to give entrance to people with lower scores is wrong. It is unfair and unwise.
How do you know that one of those white guys with a high score wouldn't have been the inventor of a serum for say scycle cell anemia? I do not see (white) women being given any special scoring preference in admissions so in this case it is indeed a racial only issue.
I believe that in this case that schools are saying that black people are not smart enough to compete on an even keel. I don't know if that is true but the AA people seem to think so.
lazs
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Originally posted by lazs2
redtail... if scores are the admitting factor then to give entrance to people with lower scores is wrong. It is unfair and unwise.
How do you know that one of those white guys with a high score wouldn't have been the inventor of a serum for say scycle cell anemia? I do not see (white) women being given any special scoring preference in admissions so in this case it is indeed a racial only issue.
I believe that in this case that schools are saying that black people are not smart enough to compete on an even keel. I don't know if that is true but the AA people seem to think so.
lazs
So, you are admissions director ad Ole Miss, and you would admit a kid with a 4.0, ahead of a siimilar kid with a 3.9 but who throws like ELi Manning of course the kid with the arm's getting in, no doubt about it. In fact, that kid might have a 2.3 and he's getting in, don't doubt it for a minute.
your 4.0 kid or the son of a government high roller, or who comes from a billionaire family? The son of the rich and powerful's getting in first, w/o question, and your son loses out. another winner is the son from a family who's gone to the same college for generations. has nothing to do with race, but in these cases, AA is never brought up.
Hell, here goes...our president you can be damn certain didn't get into Yale because of his grades, but for other reasons (see above)but a black student with a 4.0, would certainly be asked to justify his legitimacy for getting anything he's earned.
AA ensures equality and parity, without compromising standards. Those who claim that it does, are either only documenting AA policy abuses, or just use it as a tool to support white supremacist and male supremacist views. Given the opportunity, almost everyone can compete insimilar situations, and when used properly, AA proves that. Bush didnt have the best grades, but he got into yale, and he graduated.
Proof is in the pudding!
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Lazs... The majority will always win. The majority say affirmitave action is needed. Do I agree? Like I said depends on the situation. Times have changed. America is now ruled by money not beliefs. Racism is just as bad as it was just not as open. No doubt that there is reverse racism. People just look for it in the wrong places. Take for instance having all black colleges. That is not reverse racism. Its just a school where minorities have a better chance. Anyone can attend. But why would a white student want too. Would you go to Georgetown, Maryland or Howard?
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Originally posted by Red Tail 444
So, you are admissions director ad Ole Miss, and you would admit a kid with a 4.0, ahead of a similar kid with a 3.9 but who throws like ELi Manning of course the kid with the arm's getting in, no doubt about it. In fact, that kid might have a 2.3 and he's getting in, don't doubt it for a minute.
your 4.0 kid or the son of a government high roller, or who comes from a billionaire family? The son of the rich and powerful getting in first, w/o question, and your son loses out. another winner is the son from a family who's gone to the same college for generations. has nothing to do with race, but in these cases, AA is never brought up.
Hell, here goes...our president you can be damn certain didn't get into Yale because of his grades, but for other reasons (see above)but a black student with a 4.0, would certainly be asked to justify his legitimacy for getting anything he's earned.
AA ensures equality and parity, without compromising standards. Those who claim that it does, are either only documenting AA policy abuses, or just use it as a tool to support white supremacist and male supremacist views. Given the opportunity, almost everyone can compete in similar situations, and when used properly, AA proves that. Bush didn't have the best grades, but he got into Yale, and he graduated.
Proof is in the pudding!
your examples are all correct, but here's the problem, those privileged kids aren't the ones who's spots are going to get bumped to make room for the AA kid who gets special consideration, it will be the white kid who doesn't have the advantages of wealthy families or political connection, the guy who had to bust his bellybutton all through school and who's family had to mortgage everything they owned to even have him considered.
it will be at the expense of the white kids who face the same hardships as the black students, not leveling the playing field between blacks and privileged whites, but giving blacks special consideration over whites in their same situation while not effecting the privileged whites at all. sometimes these advantages will even be given to a minority from a privileged family, just a little icing on the cake for the kid who already has an advantage over a white kid from a struggling family.
these advantages (or penalties, depending on which side of the issue you are on) are being distributed solely on the bassis of race, thats racism, try and justify it however you want, it doesn't change what it is.
unfortunately racism does still exist, but you're not going to do much twards doing away with it, when those who complain loudest about it are all for it when it benefits them.
if racism is wrong and immoral (I think it is, but from other subjects I understand that some of you don't really believe in set morals, just whatever the courts are willing to allow), then it's wrong and immoral no matter what race the victim and offender are.
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Originally posted by lazs2
jamusta... I was around when there were "colored" drinking fountains... they were on the way out without any affiramative action... most people ignored them long before that.
It could be argued that affirmative action caused more problems than it solved if it solved any... I believe that letting things naturally evolve is better than forcing it especially in a blatantly unfair way like affirmatve action... it could be argued that affirmative action created more tension than it ever solved.
if white people control more of the wealth then... that is how it should be. If people with ability are around they will rise... there is no stopping it and it would be foolish to do so. for instance... it would be foolish to keep blacks out of basketball with legal but biggoted buiseness practices... some honky somewhere will realize that he can capitalize on the black ability and he will cause a killing in the game... soon... everyone will clamor for blacks on their team..
money matters are no different. For certain cases you want a black lawyeer for instance but me personally...
for lawyers doctors and comedians I allways insist on jewish folk.
you chose who you want.
lazs
Perfect, the subtleties of racist ideology, put the blacks to work in the NBA / NFL plantation but block their initiative to own a team...have Bill Cosby star in a televesion show but don't allow him to own a network...
historically...run an experiment that proves blacks are too unintlligent to flying advanced (or any type) of aircraft, or hold them in reserves and allow them to train in tanks, but insist they are incapable of suceeding in combat...
Good thing Patton had the wisdom to look beyond race when it came to winning the war (which was wrongly represented as white tankers in the film...wonder how that little tidbit of information got overlooked), or the bomber pilots that "requested" the 332nd to escort them to and from Berlin (admittedly, I wonder if they would have requested them had they known their escorts were of "inferior quality")
fact is blacks will have to prove and continue to prove we are just as capable as the anyone else, although when there's one person in a room, that one person has to be damn near perfect just to be considered good. White people largely don't have that burden. Most don't even consider this.
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Originally posted by Red Tail 444
Perfect, the subtleties of racist ideology, put the blacks to work in the NBA / NFL plantation but block their initiative to own a team...have Bill Cosby star in a televesion show but don't allow him to own a network...
historically...run an experiment that proves blacks are too unintlligent to flying advanced (or any type) of aircraft, or hold them in reserves and allow them to train in tanks, but insist they are incapable of suceeding in combat...
Good thing Patton had the wisdom to look beyond race when it came to winning the war (which was wrongly represented as white tankers in the film...wonder how that little tidbit of information got overlooked), or the bomber pilots that "requested" the 332nd to escort them to and from Berlin (admittedly, I wonder if they would have requested them had they known their escorts were of "inferior quality")
fact is blacks will have to prove and continue to prove we are just as capable as the anyone else, although when there's one person in a room, that one person has to be damn near perfect just to be considered good. White people largely don't have that burden. Most don't even consider this.
What BS.......If white guy applied to a black scholorship he could be denied because of his race. That's discrimination......try and have a white scholarship fund and you get branded a skinhead.
Same thing with a white pride parade. Minorities would protest it and violence would errupt because of wanting to celebrate your race and nothing else......Isnt feburary black history month?????
Afirmative action is discrimination. You can bring up Yale class of 67 or sports scholorships and what not but students applying for regular enrollment get sorted out by RACE FIRST TEST SCORES SECOND to promote "diversity". Now if diversaty is not one of my goals and I Hire more white guys than black guys or males to woman for that matter I could get sued for discrimintaion even though I'm doing nothing different than the colleges.
LOOK AT BET.....Black Entertainment Television....Do you really think the NAACP would TOLERATE the WPN....White Pride Network? Same kind of programing based race and culture....but because it didnt deal with minority issues its DISCRIMINATION.
Here's another. I, as a white guy, get bundled into one group...white....when in actuality I am "German American" were's my group....were's my separation from the French Americans or the Italian Americans?
This whole deal of white people=rich evil people is crap
OH AND NO in my earlier comment I wasnt talking about minorities and welfare I was talking about Librals and welfare.
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RedTail,
Your points are well made. I certainly couldn't improve on them, so I don't intend to try. I do agree with you on all points. Consider me your tired wingman on this one. I will say however, that there are a lot of guys on this board who are feeling the pinch of equality. They whine about the unfairness of AA, yet would never in a million years volunteer to change races with a black man. They will fight tooth and nail to maintain the status quo. Minds will not be changed on this BBS, regardless of your eloquence.
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Would your black sons swap places with a white man?
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I've never asked them. There have been times in their lives when they were frustrated by discriminatory treatment. Maybe at those times they would have made that choice. I'll ask them someday.
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Originally posted by midnight Target
I've never asked them. There have been times in their lives when they were frustrated by discriminatory treatment. Maybe at those times they would have made that choice. I'll ask them someday.
Ask them today.
Because if you want to make some sort of point by saying whites would "never in a million years volunteer to change races with a black man" then you better make sure that blacks would be eager to change races with a white man...
Beacuse that assumption, that blacks would want to switch races, is inherently racisit in and of itself.
And, no MT I'm not trolling and I'm not accusing you but I do feel what you said was troubling if thats the way you seem to think..
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As a white guy, I have a hard time understanding why the proponderance of narcotics users (at least in NYC) are white, but the preponderance of folks in jail for narcotics related crimes are black?
Ya think that might be an example of racism?
curly
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Perhaps many dealers are black and it's easier to arrest them than the users...
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Perhaps many dealers are black and it's easier to arrest them than the users...
Too many in prison to assume they are all dealers. OTOH, the following is true: Suppose 2 oz is the plateau amount (user versus dealer.) Now, look at 100 white guys picked up with 2 oz. of a controlled substance versus 100 black guys picked up with 2 oz. A large number of the white guys will be charged with simple possession; the black guys will be more frequently charged with "intent to distribute."
Source: "Blue Blood" by Edward Conlon. Conlon is a police officer in NYC.
curly
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Originally posted by AKcurly
As a white guy, I have a hard time understanding why the proponderance of narcotics users (at least in NYC) are white, but the preponderance of folks in jail for narcotics related crimes are black?
Ya think that might be an example of racism?
curly
And as a guy from Oklahoma you know this how?
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People people get over it!
Treat a man like a man.
No matter his tone of skin nor his country of origine.
This reminds me of kids all whinning that they what a bigger piece of the pie than little jonny.
What a load of crap.
And as far as AA goes ?
Get rid of it because in my opinion it does more harm than good by driving a wedge between the "races"
It in its makeup is a disaster .
Set up to help one group of people by making another group feel guilty and in turn discriminating against them!
So AA is a clusterfuk and well never work.
Someday somehow If we survive as a people we will have matured I hope to the point that we will not judge others.
When I see someone judge another simply based on his skin color I cant help but think what a FOOL.
Because he is judging someone he never even took the time to get to know.
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Originally posted by midnight Target
I've never asked them. There have been times in their lives when they were frustrated by discriminatory treatment. Maybe at those times they would have made that choice. I'll ask them someday.
This is the point I'm not not making very well. Minorities seem to find it impossible that racism against white people exist. I'm against all sorts of racism.
Everyone has expeirenced it in one form or another not just blacks.....but it seems to me blacks have a hard time understanding this.
If you want to see what I'm talking about head up to the bay area some time. I worked up there for a while and got treated like watermelon from all the asians that live there. There WHITE people seemed to be the minority so yes the shoes have been on the other foot. That's not saying that all asians are bad people that's saying that it exists in all forms.
Affirmative action IS RACE/GENDER discrimination.
Black history month is RACE discrimination
National Negro College Fund is RACE discrimination
These programs and "LABLES" we put on ourselves is what causses racism in my book....these groups/programs are no different than the arian nation in my book.
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Originally posted by Gunslinger
These programs and "LABLES" we put on ourselves is what causses racism in my book....these groups/programs are no different than the arian nation in my book.
I can agree with that.
But you must admitt that MT's sons are far more likely to be called a "racist" name than maybe your son? dunno just throwin it out there.
Think about it there are still alot of people out there that still use the "N" word with out even blinking.
And they will use that word directed at kids!
Now say you are that little boy that just got called the "N" word I dont think think you will ever forget that day!
I for one cant ever remember being called whitety by someone walking down the street.
And I have never had to hear stories from my grand father on how he had to enter the cafe in the back or how he had to use a different water foutain.
It has not been that many generations since blacks where owned!
Now please do now get me wrong I am way against AA and lables.
But just try to put yourself in a black persons shoes for a little while and see how it might feel to walk down there path.
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Originally posted by txmx
And as a guy from Oklahoma you know this how?
You have trouble reading the material with cited source? Read it again.
curly
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Originally posted by AKcurly
As a white guy, I have a hard time understanding why the proponderance of narcotics users (at least in NYC) are white, but the preponderance of folks in jail for narcotics related crimes are black?
Ya think that might be an example of racism?
curly
Damn racist yankees.
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I know this might be hard for an Okie But lets try again and I will keep it simple for you this time.
Do you have proof to back up your quote?
Or is it just more hot gas escaping from north of the boarder?
:aok
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I blame it on New York's government, especially New York's senators. How can they allow this to exist?
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Originally posted by AKcurly
As a white guy, I have a hard time understanding why the proponderance of narcotics users (at least in NYC) are white, but the preponderance of folks in jail for narcotics related crimes are black?
Ya think that might be an example of racism?
curly
if your statements are true (I don't know one way or the other, NYC is a long way from here), but if they are then that is discrimination and every effort needs to be made to put a stop to it.
racism and discrimination are wrong and shouldn't be tolerated. I think very few people here are naive enough to believe that racial discrimination is a thing of the past,
but AA is also racial discrimination and needs to be stopped too.
we've had this discussion quite a few times and I hear over and over why those in support think we need AA.
but I don't ever hear then address the issue of whether or not they are willing to admit that is discrimination. if you admit that it is, what makes your justification for racist policy's more valid then then the justifications the average KKK member spews out.
if you think it isn't than why, what makes it different? isn't it giving preferential treatment to people based on their race? thats racism, right?
so whats the answer, is it racism to you or not?
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Originally posted by txmx
I know this might be hard for an Okie But lets try again and I will keep it simple for you this time.
Do you have proof to back up your quote?
Or is it just more hot gas escaping from north of the boarder?
:aok
Are you blind as well as stupid? I gave the source. Read the thread.
curly
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Originally posted by lazs2
I find this wrong but it is none of my bussiness... over here it is. I do not wish anyone to be given special treatment UNDER THE LAW here. bigotry on a personal level, while abhorent, is none of my bussiness so long as the bigot is not breaking the law.
lazs
Maybe what you define as special treatment is actually equal treatment? Would you attempt to block the sale of a house in your neighbirhood to a mionority family? Just a question, since everyone should have erqual treatment UNDER THE LAW, but in many cases, great efforts are used to block even legal transactions from taking place.
maybe it's only my bias, so I may be dead wrong, but based on several posts I've read from you on other posts that you might consider denying fellow Americans of equal rights...but thats only my opinion...
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Originally posted by capt. apathy
if your statements are true (I don't know one way or the other, NYC is a long way from here), but if they are then that is discrimination.
NYC was a 365 snow festival. Generally, the guys that could afford to pay for it didn't really need to make an extra buck by actually dealing it.
And the guys who needed that buck were generally black, and a whole lot more sober than us.
And it sure as hell wasn't us who were gettin' arrested.
They were giving us what we wanted, and going to jail over it.
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Originally posted by AKcurly
Are you blind as well as stupid? I gave the source. Read the thread.
curly
Really where is this source you speak of?
You bowlegged inbread:aok
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Originally posted by txmx
Really where is this source you speak of?
You bowlegged inbread:aok
This thread, second page. If you want the source, read the second page of this thread. It's clearly stated.
curly
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Originally posted by AKcurly
This thread, second page. If you want the source, read the second page of this thread. It's clearly stated.
curly
Well thank you and you did It with out calling me Stupid LOL.
You know I am just messin with ya .
Gotta keep up the Texas OU rivalry ya know.
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Originally posted by Gunslinger
What BS.......If white guy applied to a black scholorship he could be denied because of his race. That's discrimination......try and have a white scholarship fund and you get branded a skinhead.
And if a man applied to a scholarship for women, he would be denied also. There are scholarships for blacks, franco-Americans, italian Americans...you get the point. WHite was construsted by Whites to continue their dominance over non-whites. It was when the minorities worked within the system, created by whites, to work towards their advantage that most whites got upset with the system. Similar parallels exist with the Indian casinos...(for another thread)
Originally posted by Gunslinger
Same thing with a white pride parade. Minorities would protest it and violence would errupt because of wanting to celebrate your race and nothing else......Isnt feburary black history month?????
Are minorities the only ones who protest White pride Parades? I would, but I support all cultures. As I earlier stated, White is not a culture, it's a manufactured construct, so White Power carries no credibility with me.
Originally posted by Gunslinger
Afirmative action is discrimination. You can bring up Yale class of 67 or sports scholorships and what not but students applying for regular enrollment get sorted out by RACE FIRST TEST SCORES SECOND to promote "diversity". Now if diversaty is not one of my goals and I Hire more white guys than black guys or males to woman for that matter I could get sued for discrimintaion even though I'm doing nothing different than the colleges.
Where are you getting that data? I have worked in Admissions, and NOT ONCE did I or my colleagues look at race First or ONLY. Period. Our first, and recurring question is, with all ethical issues related to AA aside is, "can the applicant survive here academically?" And we move on from there. Furthermore, all admissions counselors have an equal say in who does and does not get admitted. Unless you have been on the inside of these conversations, most people don't have the same insight into how challenging the admissions procedure truly is.
Originally posted by Gunslinger
LOOK AT BET.....Black Entertainment Television....Do you really think the NAACP would TOLERATE the WPN....White Pride Network? Same kind of programing based race and culture....but because it didnt deal with minority issues its DISCRIMINATION.
BET is owned by White owned and governed Viacom, and it has been since 2001. http://www.hoovers.com/bet/--ID__10916--/free-co-factsheet.xhtml
As for the WPN, take a look at just about every other network, and find a character of color that isint a bufoon, a criminal, or some asexual entity written into the fabric of the series or episode to give viewers the solace that the hero is not bigoted. F
I worked in show business, so I have some insight into what the process is prior to what gets funded and what does not. I've had investors, executive producers, tell me to "dummy down" my characters, or to be "more bufoonish." when we didnt rewrite to their liking, our scripts got denied, or I would walk off the set. I'm not in the biz anymore, thankfully.
(I always thought the WPN was actually Fox. The only Black person who ever made an appearance was Alan Keyes, and even the white neocons didnt support his show, and he's the most eloquent speaker ithe Republicans have...go figure...) Juan Williams has his token Sunday show, but get real...
(as for the fox crack, lighten up, it's only a joke...sort of...)
All operations from hiring to programming decisions are governed primarily by the white board members (which begs the question regarding the overwhelming negative stereotyping and New Age Minstrel shows we see on that cable POS)
Originally posted by Gunslinger
Here's another. I, as a white guy, get bundled into one group...white....when in actuality I am "German American" were's my group....were's my separation from the French Americans or the Italian Americans?
Look no further:
http://www.german-world.com/English/culture/Clubs/Clubs_organizations.htm
In Minnesota every weekend there's a 24-hour German station that the BBC has with our cable carrier. I never knew it until my (ex) girlfriend who was from Berlin showed it to me.
Celebrate your German heritage, trace your ancestors back to your original Germanic tribe, if you can, and share that knowledge with as many people as you can, (or just keep it for yourself) and you will find no stronger ally in me. Turn that love of your ethnicity into a White Pride rally, and it falls on deaf ears.
Regarding race, seeing as how the whole concept of racial classification originated in earnest in the 1700s by a German scholar (can't remember his name, sorry) the following link may be an excellent place for you to start, IMO.
http://www.ascendinglight.com/astrology/chronology_1700.htm
Originally posted by Gunslinger
This whole deal of white people=rich evil people is crap
I agree, while the facts are there. There are 135 separate classifications of race in Brazil and the lighter one gets, the more they are perceieved to be more educated, smarter, and more wealthy. Similar parallels are here, and yes, it IS a load of crap. take it from someone who has to navigate these two worlds...it's very much alive, too.
Originally posted by Gunslinger
OH AND NO in my earlier comment I wasnt talking about minorities and welfare I was talking about Librals and welfare.
I stand corrected, however, you can't challenge the argument that the belief of most is that only liberals are on welfare and all liberals are minority. How can one fairly assume that all of those on welfare, or on hard times, are liberal? I heard, back in 1995 from an investor associate that professional tennis players and golfers also were awarded welfare and unemployment benefits in the off-season. I don't have the data since it's 0120 Thursday, and it's heresay since I didn't learn the information first-hand, so treasure of trash this comment.
Sorry for the typos..I am doing touch and go's on the keyboard. Gotta two mares in the barn about to foal.
Signing off
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Originally posted by Red Tail 444
Are minorities the only ones who protest White pride Parades? I would, but I support all cultures. White is not a culture, it's a manufactured construct, so White Power carries no credibility with me.
Then we would have to agree that black is not a culture as well?
And LOL you can rest assured that Black power carries no credibility with me either.
But Human power does .
Gods love for all man does.
If we stop building walls well guess what ? we might just learn about each other what do ya think?
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Originally posted by txmx
If we stop building walls well guess what ? we might just learn about each other what do ya think?
But we can't seem to stop building these walls, despite our best intentions and noblest ideas.
The walls seem to build themselves, and we look on dumbfounded.
And then, given the choice between arguing with a wall or not, we go with it... and make up excuses to cover for our laziness in not walking across the street and tellin' the masons how that wall isn't really a good idea.
So we go to a BBS instead and try to fashion the argument that the idea actually has merit.
Lazy, self-serving verbal-gymnastic bs.
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I can think of only one group of people who deserve to be shunned and discriminated against: The multi-thousand post people who argue about everything with the same tedious agendas. :p
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Originally posted by Red Tail 444 White is not a culture, it's a manufactured construct
Then why are there those who have shunned 'Dead European Males" as historical role models? Aren't they objecting to the culture shared by those DEMs?
White = of European ethnic origin
European is a culture as much as African or Asian (maybe better said a grouping of cultures)
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this is beyond silly... Whites have no culture so they can't have white pride parades? Only blacks have culture?
It is ok for blacks to have black schools but not the other way around?
There are laws that prohibit sellers from descriminating based on religion gender or race for homes but... the rules are layed out quite clearly and should be obeyed.
LOL... all these stupid white guys getting into schools because they are such good athletes while the poor clumsy black kids have no chance due to their poor physical talents? I would say that the "athletic scholorship" helps a lot more blacks per capita than whites. But... the vast majority of admissions are based on scores... as it should be except... for RACIAL AA. It appears that blacks are indeed less smart but despite the harm that lllowing stupid people to take up space in schools.... despite that... we do it out of??? of fairness? fairness to who? the black race? yeah... that makes me admire blacks allright.
I was an extreme biggot at one time... still have an SS tattoo as a matter of fact... reminds me of where I been. I seen a lot of stuff.... I'm not biggoted in my opinion now but I won't be conned into feeling guilty... save that for the libereral white boys and girls. People are people and everyone will succeed in America if they try.
You want to blame someone for your problems black folks? Blame the white liberals and blame yourself for falling for it and for playing the guilt game.
As for more blacks being arrested thatn whites for cocaine... just the drug bell curve at work... deal smart use smart lawyer up smart stay out of prison. drive a ****mobile in a high crime area with expired plates and bags of crack....
lazs
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I blame the white senators from New York, I've forgotten who they are, anyone remind me? :p
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Originally posted by lazs2
You want to blame someone for your problems black folks? Blame the white liberals and blame yourself for falling for it and for playing the guilt game.
As for more blacks being arrested thatn whites for cocaine... just the drug bell curve at work... deal smart use smart lawyer up smart stay out of prison. drive a ****mobile in a high crime area with expired plates and bags of crack....
lazs
I don't think anyone who's bright wants to blame anyone. Surely an intelligent person would simply want to solve the problem.
And no, it's not a 'bell curve' at work, rather it's systematic.
I have no ideas concerning the solution to these problems, but to suggest they don't exist is lunacy.
curly
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What do you suggest Curly? Put more white people in jail or decriminalize drug abuse? I still say run those senators out on a rail. ;)
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I actually went to a Nascar race. Well, I was invited to a private box with free booze, so I went. I watched it. I have to admit, I still don't understand the attraction of racism.
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Originally posted by lazs2
I was an extreme biggot at one time... still have an SS tattoo as a matter of fact... reminds me of where I been. I seen a lot of stuff.... I'm not biggoted in my opinion now but I won't be conned into feeling guilty... save that for the libereral white boys and girls. People are people and everyone will succeed in America if they try.
You want to blame someone for your problems black folks? Blame the white liberals and blame yourself for falling for it and for playing the guilt game.
lazs
Atleast you can admit it. This explains why you are so blind about racial equality. Actually talking to you about any subject concerning race is a waste of time. You refuse to open your eyes and see things from a minorities perspective. You have no desire too. You could care less about racial equality. I myself get tired of black people always trying to play the race card. It hurts our call for equality more than it helps. People like you just see it as whining. But somethings are just to blatant to ignore.
You're saying athletic scholorships help black people more? You dont read between the lines. Is that not the only scholorship we we can get? Who does that really help? It helps the program not the athlete. Very few schools could care less about their athletes education. Once again its all about money. How many student actually get an athletic scholorship? Very small percent.
For all of you who think AA is racism, looking from your point of view, you are right. It is. In my opinion your point of view is wrong. I worked for a company which had 750 employees 5% were black. None where in management positions. In my area we had around 100 of which 4 of us were black. I honestly believe if it were not for AA that 5% would have been 0%.
A comedian said:
There will never be wealthy black people. We have lots of rich ones but no wealthy ones. Shaq is rich, but the man who writes Shaqs check is wealthy.
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Originally posted by jamusta
Shaq is rich, but the man who writes Shaqs check is wealthy.
Please define wealthy for me?
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Originally posted by AKIron
Please define wealthy for me?
Depends on how you see things Iron. To me wealthy people own corporations like Microsoft, Cisco and such. Singers actors athletes are rich.
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Originally posted by jamusta
Depends on how you see things Iron. To me wealthy people own corporations like Microsoft, Cisco and such. Singers actors athletes are rich.
So what's to prevent a singer/actor/athlete from buying one of those corporations? Provided they have the money of course. I always thought it was money that determined if someone was rich/wealthy. They don't give those things away you know.
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Originally posted by AKIron
What do you suggest Curly? Put more white people in jail or decriminalize drug abuse? I still say run those senators out on a rail. ;)
We have some problems in our society. Until those problems are solved, race issues will not go away. And, we're not unique ... many of the same issues exist in other countries. Hell, it may just be pure human cussedness.
We aren't going to find solutions until we manage to change attitudes. Public school desegration was a gigantic step. It sensitized a nation of white youngsters. Was it 100% effective? Nah, but it was a good first step. We need step two now and unfortunately, I don't have a clue.
curly
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I think this will make a good campaign banner for Hillary in '08.
Senator of state tough on crime! If your black that is. ;)
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Originally posted by AKIron
So what's to prevent a singer/actor/athlete from buying one of those corporations?
Bill Cosby tried to become partial owner of NBC. He has the money. His power grab was blocked.
Michael Jordan and other retired black athletes tried to start an NBA team in Charlotte. They have the money. Their petition was denied.
Michael Jackson wanted to becomr partial owner of Epic Records in the 80's. His mothion was denied, so he left.
(He lost his mind as well, but that's beside the point...)
Singers and songwriteres often have to start their own label since it's impossible to become part owners of the labels that they've operated under.
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Corporate takeovers are often met with resistance. Affirmative Action need not apply in the world of high finance.
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Originally posted by AKIron
Corporate takeovers are often met with resistance. Affirmative Action need not apply in the world of high finance.
Who was talking about AA at that level? Not me. You asked a question about what prevents a singer or athlete to buy a corporation and he answered. Jordan wants majority ownership. The new charlotte team is owned by the man who sold BET to viacom. So black people can no longer say there are no black team owners. There is 1 owner out of how many sports teams?
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How many teams should be owned by blacks?
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I'd be willing to bet ya that for every black American you can name that has attempted a buy out and failed I can come up with at least 3 white Americans that have also failed in a similar endeavor.
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Despite what you all may try to believe, racism is still omnipresent, I'm afraid it will always be (has something to do with the urge to look down on someone to affirm ones superiority and negate any insecurities)...
The game has changed alot, personally I've gotten turned off since gang members were allowed on NBA teams.
Unless he was talking about Scalabrine of course... :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by Red Tail 444
Bill Cosby tried to become partial owner of NBC. He has the money. His power grab was blocked.
Michael Jordan and other retired black athletes tried to start an NBA team in Charlotte. They have the money. Their petition was denied.
Michael Jackson wanted to becomr partial owner of Epic Records in the 80's. His mothion was denied, so he left.
(He lost his mind as well, but that's beside the point...)
Singers and songwriteres often have to start their own label since it's impossible to become part owners of the labels that they've operated under.
who blocked all these deals and how?
Was it a government intervention?
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As long as there are different racial groups in this world there will be racism. The trick it to make it healthy and competative rather than hateful and destructive but you know humans....always one sore loser on the team.
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jamusta.. I am more than willing to discuss race issues with you or any black green red or white. I have no guilt and think guilt just gets in the way of logic.
There is nothing stopping rich blacks from buying any corporation they wish... Quit making excuses.
You are right tho... I don't care about your problems. I don't care to read between the lines. I don't think it's a good idea in any case. Things are allways just as they appear... black only is no better than white only. extra protection or extra benifiets under the law based on race is racism. plain and simple.
you are right... it is a waste of your time to try to convince me that you need me to get less protection under the law than you get... you should save those arguements for women you are trying to lay or for guilt ridden white liberals.
I don't think people that have never beem biggoted can understand biggotry as well as those that have been in their past and have seen how silly biggotry is .... no matter what color the biggot.
If you want to be treated like a man then come at me like a man and we can talk or deal.
lazs
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Lazs I dont think its correct for you to say those things in the PRC....
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Originally posted by Yeager
As long as there are different racial groups in this world there will be racism.
There it is in the nutt shell.
If you keep looking at it as different "races" you will never find peace with one another.
Once again write it down if you need to.
THERE IS ONLY ONE RACE!!
THE HUMAN RACE.
It's all about mindset guys.
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and curly... I have been around a lot of drug dealers and believe me.... there is a drug dealer bell curve.
lazs