Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: GRUNHERZ on November 20, 2000, 06:16:00 PM
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Hi
Feel free to interpret that statement to any degree you want. But basically, who thinks if the current chog and niki "issues" driving people away from AH and reducing the realism of AH? Or generally reducing your like of the AH MA environment.
thanks GRUNHERZ
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Nibble nibble, arghh... hook sunk! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
About three months or so I took a leave of absence because of time issues. This same argument was being tossed around back then. I find now that I'm back, that there are indeed more people online than when I left, so I think the answer is no. Some will leave, more will sign up. That is the nature of these things. I used to eat cannon shells all the time from the Chog. (I have always loved the F4u, and I fly the D model often. I have to admit, that I would probably fly the C model but for all the people that would whine about it, so I just use it for jabo.)
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Greg 'wmutt' Cook
332nd Flying Mongrels
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While I think their may be an anomoly or two in a few aircraft FM's I do not believe any aircraft are ruining anything. ALL these aircraft have a human behind them pushing the buttons and throwing the stick to and fro. There isn't some "AI" algore-rythm at work here. So if the MA is no fun, blame the players, not the smoking gun. Although I do believe every fighter should include a child proof lock.
Let's be honest. If it was not the Niki and the F4U-1C it would be the Spit IX and the 190-A5, the 205 and the Typhoon or the 109-G10 and the P-51. Simply put, what you see is the character of many of the people, not the plane.
-Westy
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I agree with Westy. If you think about it, the only way to get a totally "fair" arena is to have everyone fly the exact same plane. So if "fairness" is what you are looking for, then it sounds like we are moving in that direction. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) he he he
And besides like I always say.......
If life were fair we'd all be fairys! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
<NOTE: This opinion was paid for by the "Save the CHOG Foundation">
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Well flown Typhoons scare me a helluva lot more than hawgs and nikkis do.
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Hey, if it ain't the Hog or Niki, next in line would be it...for every 'action', there is an opposite and equal 'reaction'...Chog? get one and kill it...Niki? same applies.
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P-47 Thunderbolt !!!!
Kills CHOGS DEAD
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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well, I believe the answer is definately a Big Fat NO. The F4u-c and the N1K are exceptional AC but they are not invincable.
-- ammo has 20 kills and has been killed 10 times against the F4U-1C--
I had a guy got bent at me the other night. That particular night I decided to fly the F4U-c, very rare for me. we met and had a good fight which I ended up with the victory. HE called me a "HO DWEEB" (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) Actually he made a mistake and I capitalized on it. I invited him to the TA to teach me a few things and we had a few good matches but I think i proved that I wasn't a HO dweeb (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) We flew the pony and the zeke.
Its all about peoples perceptions. If these guys that are leaving arent enjoying themselves, then I think they are right to leave, no reason to spend $30.00 of their hard earned money and not enjoy the product. I read something Ripsnort had posted some where else which i agree with completely. "'I've been that position'...thus, I learned, carried on with life, took the sims much less seriously." Good advice if ya ask me.
JMO
ammo
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No issues with the Chogs ... just those damn UFO n1kis that piss me off. Turn on a dime, lose no E, accelerate from an E-less start like its got quad JATOs strapped to it.
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Don't let the Chogs and N1ks get you down. Have fun and fly whatever you want in the Main Arena. For historical matches, see: http://events.hitechcreations.com (http://events.hitechcreations.com)
Fly scenarios!
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ:
But basically, who thinks if the current chog and niki "issues" driving people away from AH and reducing the realism of AH?
Grun,
IMHO there are too many who are too quick to get upset about being shot down by hog or niki drivers. Why not jump in one and shoot them down? Heard heaps of people say "I can't bring myself to fly spit/niki/hog"... This is stupid. If the other plane is good enough (in RL or AH) that a dweeb can kill you with it, imagine what a good stick can do in one. I've seen some really good pilots in hogs and nikis along side the dweebs. If the weapon is effective use it, don't whine that your 109/190/yak/p51/p47 cant turn with it...
Anyway, that's just my opinion. (Please note that no personal attacks are intended here (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif))
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All other issues aside, I wish the cannon armed Corsair had not been added.
However, I still enjoy this sim.
Yeager
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Honestly, it isn't the aircraft, (or shouldn't be for Gods sake) because a Tiffie is the beast of the MA, or even a P47 with the right guy in it. The "no E bleeding 1.04 vers. 109G10" stomps a Niki all over in case you haven't flown against that little toejam Nath and his twin brother Hblair.- (lol to myself)- And if that doesn't convince you, fly a Niki vs. a Spit9. Its suicide. I hate seeing them Spits, and there was one guy I never ever did beat who flew a Spit...ever. (DMF maybe I think)
Come to think of it, unless its a long staight shot at my 6 shot as your hauling bellybutton outta dodge or a HO from a F4UC, most often the Hogs suck brown round. I will admit CHOGS in the new 1.04 FM are MUCH better angle fighters. Still, no reason at all to fear, or worse yet piss moan or quit about them.
Only thing that makes sense is Mitsu departing until they get MORE a/c ala JPN. Saving $30 a month till they get your ride that you think rocks in there like WBS seems reasonable.
What your seeing in regard to people fleeing is a constantly updated product in a lull period, and people getting frustrated. They are just posting, and 90 days later (oh the annals of time!) it will be just a long lost post and they will be bombing your carrier talkin smak with the rest of the community. Well, actually, a few of the departures were whiny little tards stomping their feet, but still...
Same toejam happened in the long wait for 1.04, it took forever, and people expected a Xanadu of WWII flight sims. Didn't happen. I bought a Voodoo5, upgraded my processor, learned the new FM as best I could, and have wasted alot of my free time since!
I hope anyone that quits comes back, and says "hey, Im a tard, got bent, sorry."I sure hope so, cuz I like Zigrat announcing that he killed me on open channel like it's a victory of a lifetime. It pisses me off to no end, and I have a mission for the rest of the night. Plus, Im a better pilot and will win.:P
Time for Monday Night Football
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I tell you what makes me want to quit.
It's the idiots who constantly flood the chat channels and message boards with unfounded uneducated whining about flight models and weapon models. It gets REAL old. I rejoice every time one of those guys quits. Good riddance.
[This message has been edited by funked (edited 11-20-2000).]
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I've no problem with the F4UC or the N1K2, although I've not been logging on as much anymore either, I am seriously considering deleting my account, but I haven't taken that step yet.
For me it's a lack of diversity, AH has alot of late war American iron and little late war AXIS tin.
I'm a dweeb, I admit it, I want a 190d to match the P-51d, I want, a Me410 to match the P-47......as it stands now the AXIS has little in the way of JABO planes, or high preformance A/C. I suppose ya could count the 109g10 as late war, but only because of it's engine............ (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
Just my personal feelings on the topic.
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"Find your enemy and shoot him down - everything else is unimportant"
-WW1 German ACE Manfred Freiherr von Richthofen
<< MILENKO >> (http://pages.hotbot.com/games/davekirk/milenko.html)
ACES HIGH ASSASSINS Website (http://www.cybrtyme.com/personal/hblair/mainpage.htm)
WB/AH ASSASSINS Website (http://members.xoom.com/rowgue/assassins.html)
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Jeez Funked, you'll get coals in your stocking for being a cynical bastard!
Go borrow Hblair PomPoms and repost...
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I tell you what makes me want to quit.
It's the idiots who constantly flood the chat channels and message boards with unfounded uneducated whining about flight models and weapon models. It gets REAL old. I rejoice every time one of those guys quits. Good riddance.
Does this mean you wouldn't be sad if I left?
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Don't worry Grunny...the Niki's being fixed.
From Pyro's post in Aircraft & Vehicles:
N1K2-J ammo load- Increased ammo for one of the pairs of cannon.
Aside from that, what's wrong with it?...or the Chog for that matter?
SOB
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Wait till the Hell Cat gets here!!!
hey guys, I fly a Chog all the time! Its not the plane, its the pilot!!! I've shot down many different craft and been killed in the same fashion. Depends on the pilots.Unless its h/h and I will do that with a tiffie all the time.
CCCCHHHOOOGGGSSSS Rockkkkkkkkkkkkk
[This message has been edited by NHFoxtro (edited 11-20-2000).]
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109s scare me more than anything else.
eskimo
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AH will not be killed by C Hog or nikki or future monsters.
I think that people know how this game will develop in the future and we see that HTC is strongly determined to not modify the damage/ammo model in a short time.
I think that most players hare not interested on a F4UC, Niki, Spit IX (till Spit XXX come) only arena (just my opinion).
AH is the best product in the market at the moment, in the future we will se more products and that can give us an answer about that argument.
Till that moment (wo hate C hog and nikki) have to live whit that or leave, cause HTC will not do changes in a short time (this argument is too old.
PS: # in MA there are more players just for the pricing test HTC did, 10$/months let numbers of players grow (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) .
about scenarios:
last frame in Afrika i see a single spit IX that killed and damaged 3 Ju88 in one pass. Sure, is a very skilled pilot, but hispano give at that pilot a big help or Ju88 armor is too weak.
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Hi
I like SOB's answer! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) At least you flew the niki before v1.04.
thanks GRUNHERZ
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I like Westy;s answer,
if the f4c was gone the next most "uber" plane would fill its shoes, and so on and so on, the only way this can be avoided is to have just one plane (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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You misunderstand me creamo. I'm not a cheerleader. Honest.
(http://www.aaa-buttons.com/clipart/anim2/girl/an1.gif)
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I have never understood why guys dislike the f4 1c.
Its one of the easiest kills in the game.
The niki is a little tougher but it is terrible at alt. Thus its always got to fight from below.
I think some have problems not with the planes but the pilots and the tactics they use.
Could it be some rivalry issues? Who wants to say xxx pilot kicks my butt.
Its easier to say its the plane.
EYE
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"I think people just want to save money!"
-Little Arab Dude in Progressive Insurance commercial.
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Grunz..
I flew a 12 kill sortie today at a34 against Rooks in me Typhoon. F4U-c1, N1K2s Spits p51s and p47.. Sorry but i dont have a real big problem with N1K2s or F4U-c1.. Im not really sure why you have a problem?
Adapt your flying style accordingly.
Dog out.........
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May I step in from my leave? Probably the C-Hog and the N1K2 are well modeled. They are both fine fighters. The problem is that those two aircraft are unbalancing. They exploit some features of the simulation I dont like: high E-retention (after 1.03), net-lag, head-on attacks, randomness, cannon power. In other words this is like: "I choose the best UFO of the arena cuz I want to win". Besides, you can win a lot even in the weakiest a/c like the 109F-4, like some real aces do.
Have fun.
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GATT
4° Stormo Caccia - Knights - (ret) (http://www.4stormo.it)
Macchi C.202's sting (1,9MByte film) (http://web.tiscalinet.it/gatt/breda.avi)
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Heheh, generally, chogs are easy kills.
Unless torque is in one of them. Then I can't rush the kill, because that guy can flip on a dime and sudenly 4*20mm are poiting straight at you.
N1K's are like Spits, annoying becase they break turn all the time.
Tiffies and P-51's bug me because of their damned speed.
Any plane above me is an alt dweeb.
Anyone who shoots me down an inferior pilot who got lucky.
Look; I have to tell myself this to keep any little piece of self confidence in AH up - Nath spanked me 1-4 in g10, and I'm still rebuilding myself (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
So, all you non knits; you're all inferior dweebs, and you know it. Your sheep are ugly, and your mommas have more wool than them.
Mine wears combat boots and kick the crap outta yer dad.
Now, stay still, pigdogs.
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StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
while(!bishRookQueue.isEmpty() && loggedOn()){
30mmDeathDIEDIEDIE(bishRookQueue.removeFront());
System.out.println("LW pilots are superior");
myPlane.performVictoryRoll();
}
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well i got no problem with the fu4c actually i this sortie has changed between the fu4c and the spit9 + some very fun tiffie flying.
havnt been much in the nik this tour, but the nik still cant turnfite a spit (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
I guess if ah changed the scorepoints for lets say if u fly a 109 or a p47 and get more score to kill a fu4c than the fu4c will if oposit we might see a diffrense ? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/eek.gif)
this might be a stupid thing to do i dont really know just thinking high.
basicly meaning the more difficult plane u fly the more score u get.
airguard
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I flew a 12 kill sortie today at a34 against Rooks in me Typhoon.
And you know, there's STILL people who say gunnery is not ridiculously easy in Aces High!
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C.O. Phoenix Squadron
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/phoenix
Aces High Training Corps
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Originally posted by SOB:
Don't worry Grunny...the Niki's being fixed.
Aside from that, what's wrong with it?...or the Chog for that matter?
SOB
The F4U-1C is missing 4 HVARs, that's what! Give it its 8 rockets, HTC!!!
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Hehe, I love StSanta's attitude (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif). Makes me proud to be a Knight (even on leave).
Anyway, Spitfires and NIKIs are not dweeb machines. It is dweebish the possible use you do. You can E-fight very well with them, seldom break-turning. Keep a Spitfire fast, use the vertical, use it like a late 109G, turn hard only when you are on the deck (very low and slow) ... and you'll have a real killer-machine. IMHO, Bf109 dedicated pilots are the best Spitfire aces around (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Dont fight, have fun.
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GATT
4° Stormo Caccia - Knights - (ret) (http://www.4stormo.it)
Macchi C.202's sting (1,9MByte film) (http://web.tiscalinet.it/gatt/breda.avi)
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Al Gore invented the F4U-1C and N1K2.
// fats
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I have no probs with any AC. I think the problem is that most ppl haven't flown all AC so they do not know the Ac's weak points. That being the case how are you gonna beat an AC if you really don't what it can do?
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funked... I see there are still plenty of idiots on 1 showing how little they know about any ac.
Face it grun... PAC war planes are just too good to fight against euro trash... They haven't even gotten to some of the monsters yet.
As I see it, real pilots didn't think the cannon equipped planes were much of an advantage over those equipped with 4, 6 or 8 fifty caliber guns. In AH there is a huge difference for me at least. It could be my connect, it could be the way things are modeled I don't really care what the reason is but... So long as that difference exists, I am gonna take the cannon version.
The nik is a monster but I don't like flying it. The C is mediocre and anyone who actually fly's it for a tour finds that out. I come online around the peak and find that there is a pretty good mix of ac up. I see more Spits than anything else.
Ooops forgot.. What exactly is the "bull" in the Chog and the nik? Is there something wrong with the FM? I know the Hog turns too poorly but I don't imagine that is what grun meant... Is it a secret?
lazs
[This message has been edited by -lazs- (edited 11-21-2000).]
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Its the pilot, not the ride.
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Milo
3./JG2
"Horrido"
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Short answer: no.
Fury
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NO we have seen some people leave lately yes, but I think the people leaving would have an issue no matter what.
Just curious though.. Has anyone done a direct comparison between the Typhoon and F4uC as far as lethality goes?
AKSKurj
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I think each release of AH has seen a very popular plane. I can remember everyone flying the P38, the 190a5, Yak, Zeke, when they first came out or when they were something special. I still see a lot of 205s, 109s, La5s, P51s flying about and the only planes I don't see that often are the 202 and buffs in general!
No doubt with 1.05 it will be the Hellcat or PT Boats or whatever... I've always flown Spitfire's so I'll continue to whether it's uber or not.
Nexx
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I can kill in anything. I can die in anything. I don't listen to anyone complaining about what I paid my $30 to fly, why should anyone else?
Selective realism is a flawed concept. The MA will always be an environment of chaos, by nature. Historical match-ups and goals are served best in the scenarios and snapshots. Relative discrepancies of fm will always be with us, no matter what sim we fly. I think what is important to consider is whether you feel the sim gets more right than wrong.
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What Creamo said.
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MASS/SAW
Click here for VMF-323 Death Rattlers info (http://home.earthlink.net/~bkapache/)
(http://saintaw.tripod.com/sawbw.gif)
"It's supposed to be hard; that's what makes it great!"
Tom Hanks, A League of Their Own
"hey, Im a tard, got bent, sorry."(Creamo, out of context)
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for me...
chog = jabo = target for hblair
niki = shoot fatty
205 = hog killer
typhoon = chase fatty = stall = ground
all this chog niki chog niki....
3 words....
SHUT UP 'n FLY
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Mason22 Fat Drunk (chute shooting) Bastards (http://fdb.50megs.com) -- "shut up and FLY"
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Originally posted by Jekyll:
quote:
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I flew a 12 kill sortie today at a34 against Rooks in me Typhoon.
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And you know, there's STILL people who say gunnery is not ridiculously easy in Aces High!
What does this have to do with gunnery?
You, and I, do not know how many times Wardog landed and rearmed. He is a good pilot and could easily survive long enough to rearm 4 or 5 times, although I'm guessing he did 3 rearms.
You are making a mistake in assuming that WB has a realistic level of gunnery and damage. Because it takes less ammunition to kill another aircraft in AH it is possible to get more kills per sortie. This does not mean that the gunnery is porked.
Sisu
-Karnak
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Wardog was vulching too (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
-Westy
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LOL Westy..
last night a34 was under heavy JABO attack by Rooks. I was defending the field, no vultching (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
And Karnak is right, after 9 kills i had 1 hot rearm under fire, i rupped a34 under a cap and got 3 more kills. By this time the Rooks where getting a little pissed at me and i am sure that they all where hunting my Typhoon (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
None the less, this was a fun sortie. Even though i had very few parts left on her and i tore my gear off trying to land before being kilt, but i was still to fast for the belly landing.
It made for an interesting film..
Dog out..
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Good cod, in a Typhoon? I would have switched sides or flew there just to have watched that. Most impressive sir <S> (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
-Westy
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Wow. 9 kills on 1 ammo load.
Most impressive, Wardog.
Do you use all 4 cannon at once, or 1 pair at a time to extend ammo duration?
Sisu
-Karnak
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Karnak..
I use all 4 at same time, my convergence is set to 400 but i hold off on trigger usually well under 300. 1 or 2 short burts and if i dont think ill get the hit ill just pass on the shot and try to line up next time around.
Keep in mind the guns on the Typhoon are spread out quit a distance unlike the F4U-C1 so spray & pray just dont work. Also long distance shots will not work,unless the con is on auto & on the terlet (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Mostly its a challenge to fly & a con magnet, as anyone who see a Tiffy dives right for it. This alone makes it an interesting ride.
Dog out...
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Fly a JUG and be a real man. I eat Chogs and Niki for lunch in my P47-25.......... Low Hi it dont matter and a well flown Tiff scares me ALOT more than a damn Niki or Chog. Its a damn popularity issue. A few A__holes start talking crap about a plane and the rest of em just jump on the bandwagon. Then you start hearing crap like " you only kilt me cuase you flew an UBER plane" yadda yadda yadda...... You got your but into a situation you couldnt pull it out of and you typed before you cooled down. I know this cuase I am very guilty of it most of the time. I dont like to die anymore than anybody else. Face it....there will always be planes the morale minority dont like. I dont let it stop me from flying them if I feel like it.
LLB OUT!!!!!!!!!
[This message has been edited by llbm_MOL (edited 11-21-2000).]
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LLB, I fly the Jug also, and Now the Jug is the 'NEW" uber plane in the MA ( according to some) I couldn't believe the talk last night how 'Uber" the Jug is. Niki's and spit's I fear not, strapped in my Jug, but there are a few great 109, 190 and tiffy pilots i fear.
I abandoned the Chog,and Niki because of all the smack talk ( never flew the spit) and so i picked the Worse ride in the arena. NOW this has become the latest "Uberplane rideofdweebsonlybecausetheyca n'tgetakillanyotherway". Eventually there will be no planes other than UBER. So i popped in a c-47 .... and got 2 kills,,LOL now what do i fly?????
NUTTZ
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Funny, i just checked my stats for tour 10 in the P-47 30d Seams i am doing FREAKIN GREAT!!!! the only thing that i have more deaths against than kills is Ground vehicles.. Now thats funny wasn't the jug used primarily as ground pounders?
I am tearing up lanc's and 26's, but the b-17 gets me good, whats a good way to attack them?
NUTTZ
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No
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Beam attacks on the 17. If I can I come at them from the direction of thier wingtips. If I can I'll even HO the base porking bastidge from a low 12 position: Coming in fast, go low and come up suddenly at the last minute and give em an eight fifty cal round house in the chin.
-Westy
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I make slicing attacks from 10/2 o clock, get really close at really hi speed, open up, do a climbing turn and repeat.
Not fail safe though.
On lancs my favourite is the head on attack from a slightly lower position to avoid being fired on by the top turret.
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StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
while(!bishRookQueue.isEmpty() && loggedOn()){
30mmDeathDIEDIEDIE(bishRookQueue.removeFront());
System.out.println("LW pilots are superior");
myPlane.performVictoryRoll();
}
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Like StSanta said. 10-2 hi to low attacks. It makes the pilot have to jump from gun position to gun position to find you. Come in hi straffing and go low come back up and over. he has to jump to 3 diffrent positions to get a shot at you. I attack if I have plenty alt on them from almost on top them comming straight down and I aim for the cockpit. I will do a direct stright up attack after that. NEVER attack a buff from his 6! If you can help it....but sometime ya gotta doit (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
LLB OUT!!!!!!!!!
[This message has been edited by llbm_MOL (edited 11-22-2000).]
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I might have whined about the Chog and Niki in the past, but since I started checking 6 now and they I haven't been killed by one of those at all this tour. Now a well flown Yak is _really_ dangerous, and ManedeW can do some damage in his Typhoon too (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
(http://hem.bredband.net/rickenbacker/images/ricksig.jpg)
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This controvery is never ending. It isn't about the chog nd niki guys. A couple versions ago it was the 190's and the 109's. This situation will NEVER go away as long as there in a mix of a/c in the arena with differing perormance and guns. You want a level playing field? Then we have to all fly the same plane or modify the FM so all planes fly the same. That kinda negates any pretense to historical accuracy though.
If ya don't like the MA there are a few things you can do.
1. Quit, either temporarliy or permanently.
2. Drop out of the MA entirely and fly the scenarios or TA.
3. Just forget the whole thing and fly what ya want and pick your fights with care to avoid those "other" planes.
Either way, this subject is over modeled and perpetual.
Mav
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Count me with the folks that feel too much energy is retained in 1.04.
Its a typical situation: 1.03 didnt provide nearly enough enregy retention and 1.04 allows too much energy retention.
Its a typical "somewhere in between" type fix as far as I can hazard to judge.
In any event, I prefer too much E to too little...gives more room to maneover.
Yeager
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Well, after last night I sure won't be engaging any Nik's again (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Situation: we're down low, maybe 1000 feet. I'm in a P51 closing on the tail of a Nik. I'm going 350, he's doing 300 or so.
At 600yds, he goes into a break turn to the left, slightly nose low. I drive to the corner then pull into a 2g vertical zoom climb. Check 6 only to find that the Nik has completed his circle, gone vertical in the zoom and is GAINING ON ME!
I hold the vertical zoom climb and watch him. At 600yds on my FE he opens up with his 4*20mm and neatly removes my wings.
I mean, how much of an E advantage do you need against these guys?????
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Ehehe Jekyll,
watch out, or you'll be eaten by our FM gurus (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) LOL
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yes, Jekyll I think it's BS
I just stay away from Niki's
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I think the ACM gurus should have more to say. Vertical zoom climb? Duh, of course he gains to within gun range if you are hanging in mid air...
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Firstly, no, a 50 Mph speed advantage WILL NOT give you enough vertical separation to survive a zoom versus a great accellerating plane like the N1k2. IMHO. I would expect to get killed trying that against a G10 or a Spit IX as well.
Second, I doubt the N1k in question really "completed his turn". More likely he was watching you and guessed what you would do. (Not tough, what else would you do?) When you went vertical I'd bet he simply pulled up and rolled onto your flight path. A great accellerator like the N1k could do this and still have enough power to hang on it's prop and gun you from the sky. As it seems he did. I'd want about 100 mph advantage to try that versus a N1k or a G10. Better to use your speed to extend a bit for horizontal separation, THEN reverse high and try another pass. You didn't have enough E advantage to get the vertical separation you need to stay out of guns range. IMHO of course. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
BTW, remember that on his FE that D 600 shot was likely more like 450. Not a particularly tough shot versus a nearly stopped target.
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Lephturn - Chief Trainer
A member of The Flying Pigs http://www.flyingpigs.com (http://www.flyingpigs.com)
(http://tuweb.ucis.dal.ca/~dconrad/ahf/lepht.gif)
"My P-47 is a pretty good ship, she took a round coming 'cross the Channel last trip.
Just thinking 'bout my baby and lettin' her rip, always got me through so far."
- Steve Earl
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well i guess we proved one thing... GOING TO ALL CAPS DOESN'T MAKE WORDS TRUE OR...... EVEN IMPORTANT.
lazs