Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Estes on June 18, 2004, 12:08:50 AM
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http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=615&e=9&u=/nm/20040617/pl_nm/iraq_usa_prisoner_dc
Looks like Rumsfeld and the German SS have some things in common.
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Someone will be by shortly to dismiss or downplay this.
Don't get in their way though, a jackboot to the nuts hurts.
-SW
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ZEIG HEIL!
JA!
HEIL HITLER!
JA!
VOSS IS LOS HEIR WEINERSCHNITZAL!
JA!
ZIEG RUMZFELD JA!
HEIL BUSCH! JA!
CRYSTALNATE VER DAS BUSCH JEWD! DAS!
JA! JA!
DAS BROWNENSCHIRTZEN DER BUSCH WEIR RUMSFELDEN SUCKEN ZEE BALLS JA!
zzzzzzzzz.......
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LOL, a comparison to the German SS, that's fantastically retarded.
As for that prisoner, is there any reasonable explanation as to why they wouldn't inform the Red Cross?
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FINALLY!!! Proof that bush is Hitler!!!!!!!
And really before this post I thought it was all paranoid liberal BS... :rofl
And yopu leftists are the ones saying it's the Bush team who is trying to scare everyone by spreading around lies designed to incite mass hysteria!!!
THE PENTAGON IS HEADED BY AN SS GUY!!!!!!!!!! OH MOHAMMED! AMREEKA IS LIKE NAZI GERMANY!!!!
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More proof...not only is he a nazi, he's an IMMORTAL NAZI!!!!! RUN FOR THE HILLS!!!!!!!!!!11
(http://www.matthoffman.us/dl/naziboosh.jpg)
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Originally posted by SOB
More proof...not only is he a nazi, he's an IMMORTAL NAZI!!!!! RUN FOR THE HILLS!!!!!!!!!!11
(http://www.matthoffman.us/dl/naziboosh.jpg)
More undeniable proof! Thanks SOB..
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I wouldn't go so far as to call Bush Hitler, but it's looking like it might be safe to say Rumsfeld is a war criminal.
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(http://www.kolumbus.fi/fishu/trash/bushh.jpg)
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I can think a of a few very good reasons not to notify anyone of his capture.
But the lefties here are just blind morons and full of carp.
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I'm pretty concerned about this. Definitely alot of questions here. It does doesn't make sense (to me) to request a prisoner not be registered.
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I can thinkof several reasons for holding a terrorist POS and not registering him.
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Are you going to share, or just talk stupid?
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Originally posted by Fishu
(http://www.kolumbus.fi/fishu/trash/bushh.jpg)
More evidence!!!
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Originally posted by SOB
Are you going to share, or just talk stupid?
what did I say so far that you would consider to be stupid? I'm waiting for people to use a little common sense and think for themselves first.
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Uh huh.
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so you can't think of any reasons to hold a terrorist and not notify anyone? I can think of at least 3 good reasons off the top of my head.
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Originally posted by NUKE
But the lefties here are just blind morons and full of carp.
Stop fishing :D
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I'll guess.
1. so you there is no record that you have him, making it harder to link any illegal treatment he recieves to you.
2. because you have no respect for the law or think you are above it.
I'm sure I could think of more but those came fairly easy.
lets make the quiz a little harder. how many LEGAL reasons can you think of.
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So out of all the thousands of bad guys we have in custody we just hid this one guy so we could abuse him in secret?
Why?
I'm faaar more inclined to think his capture was kept secret for operational reasons. Maybe he was a good source of actinable real time intelligence maybe we used him to mislead other terrorists.
Though not a perfect analogy, it isnt like the allies in ww2 told everyone when they captured and converted a nazi spy to work for them. I guess they were war criminals too... Can we try churchil or maybe eisenhower for these crimes?
But yea thats all far too rational and logical. No way. Couldnt be..
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If theres hidden prisoners in several prisons/camps whatever, how can it be limited to one person only :rolleyes:
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IIRC, spy's don't receive that protection.
maybe they had their reasons for doing it, likely they had some sort of reason.
most criminals have a reason why they broke the law too.
obviously there can be certain advantages to keeping someones capture secret, and likely these types of advantages where know at the time these laws were made.
laws are made to clarify your acceptable course of action, and establish lits as to what is acceptable and how far you are allowed to go in an effort to accomplish your goals.
yes, war is an extreme situation which often requires extreme action.
but since these laws are directly concerning which actions are legal or forbidden in times of war, it's reasonable to assume that you would be expected to obey them even if you were at war.
a law that you ignore when it becomes inconvenient isn't a law, it's a guideline or a suggestion.
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Originally posted by Fishu
If theres hidden prisoners in several prisons/camps whatever, how can it be limited to one person only :rolleyes:
Maybe we should have you investigate first hand..
Really arent you guys taking an awful big risk coming out like this in criticizm of Bush? I mean if he is even 1/10 as bad as you say shouldnt you be worried for the safety of you and your families?
You never know when they will come knocking on your door in the middle of the night to take you away to secret police prison camps..
Be careful now... Be very careful.. They are coming for you. You dont have much time, say goodbye to your families. Its all over!
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Originally posted by capt. apathy
IIRC, spy's don't receive that protection.
Why not?
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Originally posted by NUKE
I can thinkof several reasons for holding a terrorist POS and not registering him.
If he's terrorist, I don't care if they take him behind the tent and shoot him in the back of his head.
However, how do we know he's a terrorist? They just released hundreds of innocent guys, guys who had been terrorized by us while we attempted to extract confessions.
Frankly, I wouldn't trust anyone Bush has in authority over control of POWs. So yeah, registration of all prisoners must be done --- otherwise, they're going to be painting me and you (John Q. Public) with the same paintbrush that was just applied to Rumsfeld and the Gen in charge of the prison.
curly
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Originally posted by SOB
LOL, a comparison to the German SS, that's fantastically retarded.
As for that prisoner, is there any reasonable explanation as to why they wouldn't inform the Red Cross?
They didnt say that they wouldnt inform red cross...
"Director George Tenet asked him last November to take custody of an Iraqi national "
.. Tenet went away as hero and now it time to throw few bones on somebody.
I expect to hear a lot more bad thinks about him, w/o any proof.
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Originally posted by AKcurly
If he's terrorist, I don't care if they take him behind the tent and shoot him in the back of his head.
chmm what a nice result of anti terrorist propaganda
Since most of people thing like you, the only one thing that must be done is to mark some as terrorist and problem is over.
Its nice to see that you didnt ate that crap at all.
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WOW more sympothy for terrorists
I petter go get my SS uniform to the cleaners now.
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TERRORISTS HAVE RIGHTS TOO ya know.
and the red cross wants the us to release Hussein if he is not charged with any crime.
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Originally posted by Fishu
(http://www.kolumbus.fi/fishu/trash/bushh.jpg)
hehe its wrong hand isnt it :D
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Gunslinger, I don't *think* anyone here is sympathizing with terrorists as much as expressing concern about doing things the right way. I'm just as (if not more) PO'd about terrorism as anyone else, but I see the need for caution and control in the fight against it.
Now, about this particular Rummy case, there could very well be a reason for not immediately disclosing this prisoner's info that we're still unaware of since we don't have the big picture. Hopefully, now that it's public knowledge, an explanation will be soon to follow. I just jope it's a good one.
PS: The Bush/Hitler pics are so incredibly clever and thought provoking I didn't know whether to watermelon or go blind. :rolleyes:
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some won't be happy until we lose a few more skyscrapers...
I like the fact they error on the side of caution when it comes to our security
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I have no problem with a terrorist being shot, tortured, or vanishing from the face of the earth with no explanation.
I do have a problem with a guy who works for and represents me being in on it.
gov't office is not a license to break the law, as a matter of fact I would expect gov't officials to hold themselves to a higher standard as the whole legal structure loses credibility when the gov't is made of criminals.
it's Ironic that we expect a ballplayer to be a roll-model for todays youth but many Americans seem OK with the secretary of defense being thug.
Rumsfeld admitted that this law was broken, he admitted knowledge of it from the beginning, he admits it was deliberate, he's a criminal.
if Rumsfeld doesn't face charges for this I can see only 2 possible ways to take it. either this administration feels they are somehow above the law. or they don't really believe in the law as 'a big deal'. more of a guide-line than a rule. something it's nice to try for but nobody's expected to completely obey. you don't actually have to follow it if it gets in the way of your plans.
it seems like only yesterday there was a thread where many said that republicans where very anti-crime and "tough on criminals".
here's a criminal that the President likely sees daily, I wonder how tough on him Bush will be? anybody really think there will be any other legal reaction other than no charges, or a pardon?
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Estes,
If you don't like President Bush, why do you have your picture along with his in your avitar? It seems like a contradiction...
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Originally posted by Otto
Estes,
If you don't like President Bush, why do you have your picture along with his in your avitar? It seems like a contradiction...
LOL
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Originally posted by lada
I expect to hear a lot more bad thinks about him, w/o any proof.
We don't need proof, of anything, to justify our actions, it's called being preemptive. Kind of sucks when you're on the receiving end of it , however. If someone is a suspect, we go after him, period.
You reap what you sow.
This is what you get when you have the real life equivalent of Ray Krebbs, Frank Burns,and Colonel Flagg running the country.
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Welcome to the American Gulag, land of the dissapeared.....
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Of course they are grabbing people that they think have knowledge of terrorist operations, holding them in secret to try to get that information. and then acting on it to try and get others before the first arrest is known. Of course they are doing that.
That guy they got early last year in pakistan who was a Kuwaiti way up in Al quida. He looked all dazed at the time the "pakistani" police forces closed in on him. Subjection at the time was that he had been taken several months befor by US operatives, held and then put in place to be captured by the pakistanis for propoganda purposes once his intelligence use had been used up.
Im ok with all that. Its a war on terror.
The war on the insurgency in Iraq is different of course. There they have been rounding up anyone. And torturing them to see if they are insurgents.(terrorists)
That is terrorism. That is totalitrialism.
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Welcome to the American Gulag, land of the dissapeared.....
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well said schadenandthenfreude
oh yeah, be nice :aok
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and anyone that thinks this has a strong equivilency to the SS doenst know much about the SS and gestapo.
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Originally posted by Pongo
Of course they are grabbing people that they think have knowledge of terrorist operations, holding them in secret to try to get that information. and then acting on it to try and get others before the first arrest is known. Of course they are doing that.
That guy they got early last year in pakistan who was a Kuwaiti way up in Al quida. He looked all dazed at the time the "pakistani" police forces closed in on him. Subjection at the time was that he had been taken several months befor by US operatives, held and then put in place to be captured by the pakistanis for propoganda purposes once his intelligence use had been used up.
Im ok with all that. Its a war on terror.
OK, I want to make sure I'm understanding you correctly.
are you saying that you acknowledge that these illegal things are being done, and are OK with it?
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Originally posted by _Schadenfreude_
Welcome to the American Gulag, land of the dissapeared.....
Oh ya? Well, you better go guard the middle of that island your on before on of those terrorists dig a hole in it and sink it.
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
FINALLY!!! Proof that bush is Hitler!!!!!!!
How can Bush be Hitler?..He died in May 1945...But u could be right..He might have got lyposuction treatment.
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Yes. I am ok with it in regards the global war on terror. In fact I dont see how the global war on terror can be fought with any chance of success without acknoledging that it isnt a 18th century von clasuswitz kind of war. Think of the alternative.
2am Rihad time. US advisors and Saudi security personel raid prince abdulas residence and find evidence that he is actually the man that gives osama bin ladin his marching orders.
2:15 AM Rihad time. CNN reporters show inspired but confusing images of the prince being carted away.
2:16 am 80% of resources that have been compromised by that arrest have started excercsing contingencies plans to isolate the princes value.
Or
2:15 rihad time. The prince disapears for 2 months and maybe some of that 80% doenst get the warning. And 10% of them are also scooped up somewhere in the world. Leading to other arrests.
I dont see how you can do this any other way. We are talking about an orginisation that would likely comit any act of violence that was within thier capabilty to carry out. It is secretive and world wide in scope. The CIA trained them how to be secretive. The gloves have to come off.
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Rumsfeld admitted that this law was broken, he admitted knowledge of it from the beginning, he admits it was deliberate, he's a criminal.
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Wow....rummy admitted he was a criminal? Not very politically correct of him. I doubt this is correct but could someone, anyone paste in something from a reputable source saying rummy admitted breaking a law of the united states?
Sounds like more liberal guttersniping to me but hey, im open to the possibility.
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I thought that "Terrorists" were not considered POW's and therefore are excluded from the protections of the Geneva Covention.
and how come noone *****es about the arabs that capture and murder non-combatant westerners?
If They don't wanna "go by the rules", then why should we?
y'all better wake up, this is WW3, and most of the world does'nt know it yet.
Some of you ignorants should get educated on the Arab culture
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Children, it is recess time. Run along and play like nothing ever happened... :rolleyes:
Thorns
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If They don't wanna "go by the rules", then why should we?
because if we don't, whats the difference between us and them?
you don't do the right thing or respect our laws because the other guy is a good guy and deserves it.
you do the right thing inspite of the fact that he doesn't deserve it, because thats who you are, and it's the right thing to do.
how you treat other people says a lot more about you than it does about them.
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I don't actually buy that argument that we can not pursue a War in a way in which we refuse to conduct our civil affairs. At the bottom, the sheer simplicity of War: Kill the other MF'er, is not who we as a nation are.
We will have to do things that are unthinkable in the context of our civil liberites as citizens to win this war. Not only that, but it does not mean that we are worse than them; it means that we can be just as ruthless as them, IF THEY FORCE US TOO.
There can only be rules in war if it is a war-game. In War, there are no rules, and if you think there are or should be, then you do not understand what War is.
We killed prisoners, firebombed civilians and launched WMD in WWII, as Americans, and I do not feel one iota of shame for it. We did not start that war and we did not start this one. Caveat emptor, bi-otch.
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Originally posted by Flit
I thought that "Terrorists" were not considered POW's and therefore are excluded from the protections of the Geneva Covention.
and how come noone *****es about the arabs that capture and murder non-combatant westerners?
If They don't wanna "go by the rules", then why should we?
y'all better wake up, this is WW3, and most of the world does'nt know it yet.
Some of you ignorants should get educated on the Arab culture
Many folks don't realize this... but the U.S. only honors the Geneva Convention if the nation they are fighting honor the Geneva Convention. Iraq clearly did not..... so F'it, make'em disappear painfully :aok
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Originally posted by Flit
Some of you ignorants should get educated on the Arab culture
Well ... did you speak about it with your doctor ?
he may help you.
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Originally posted by Pongo
and anyone that thinks this has a strong equivilency to the SS doenst know much about the SS and gestapo.
actualy SS were military police.. nothing else
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Mmmm'kay.
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Originally posted by Lizking
We did not start that war and we did not start this one. Caveat emptor, bi-otch.
well you're half right. your long-term memory is doing much better than the short term.
we didn't start WWII, but we definately started the Iraq war.
you where aware that we invaded Iraq, right?
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Originally posted by VOR
PS: The Bush/Hitler pics are so incredibly clever and thought provoking I didn't know whether to watermelon or go blind. :rolleyes:
You see, that's what's called sarcasm. The blatant use of caps lock and the exclamations kinda give it away.
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Originally posted by SOB
You see, that's what's called sarcasm. The blatant use of caps lock and the exclamations kinda give it away.
I read the zombie thread too, you know. You'll have to excuse my paranoia. I've not been myself lately since I've been stewing over how many of the people I know are actually undead minions of Hades. This kind of worry can make certain social situations awkward.
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LOL
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Zombie Thread was great! Like a breath of fresh morbid air.
Need more threads like that.
:D
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I don't see how a bunch of illegal combatants should be granted rights under the Geneva Convention. If a medical soldier picks up a gun and uses it in combat they are no longer protected under LOAC so why should an extremist in civilian clothing carrying and using weapons?
The "extremists" that are being faced in Iraq are not lawful combatants and therefore have no rights to an extent. They wear civilian clothing and they attack and kill anything without regard to civilians and innocent bystanders.
As far as I'm concerned if they want to fight dirty, then dirty is what they will and should get back in return. And I'm sorry but if they (extremists)took prisoners even before they knew anything about the prison scandal they would still have tortured and mutilated those they captured or kidnapped. To sit here and say we should be following the laws down to the t against a group like this is bs.
The US has always had this label that we won't do what it takes to get the job done no matter what the cost. Somalia was a perfect example. The fighters there knew we wouldn't shoot when women and children were around and took advantage of that. The women and children would purposely get in the way of gun fights and act as a human shield.
If they wanna fight dirty like they do in Iraq so be it, we should do the same. Eye for an eye no matter how it's done.