Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: hogenbor on June 21, 2004, 10:30:50 AM
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Tried to land on a CV with an FM-2 yesterday but when I got to a standstill I got the famous 'get catapulted off backwards at high speed and die' syndrome.
I have seen this discussed before but is this bug or a 'logical' result of my crappy CV landings? In AHI I got so annoyed by this happening occasionally that I usually just ditched near the CV.
Regards,
Ronald
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When you catch close to the end of the boat, go full power and release the hook. This will keep you from getting thrown off the back of the boat.
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... or just aim to catch the arrester cords closer to the front of the ship. Sounds like you're coming in too low.
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Grab the "3 wire".
RTR
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LOL you guys act like he doesn't know how to land. His problem is not landing differently it's what to do when he catches the first or second wire.
Land with Full power, like your supposed to then release the hook. Works every time regardless what wire you catch.
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IS this a bug with the CV? or with the FM-2? It's happened to me once or twice in the past but as least as far as memory serves only when I've been flying the FM-2.
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I always thought that was from coming in too fast
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No happens with spit, hog too.
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Strange, I've never had this happen to me. Here's what I do, I try to come in fairly steep so my throttle is close to idle or at idle and I usually catch the 1st to middle(more often the middle) part of the cables. If I was using throttle, I cut it right after catching the cables.
Might not be proper procedure but it works fine for me.
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catch the 1st to middle(more often the middle) part of the cables
Your not catching the first cable or else you would get shot off the back off the carrier.
This happens when you come in and catch the first cable maybe the second cable, definately the first. It has nothing to do with how steep you are or anyhting else only what cable you snatched.
If you catch the first cable and do not hold yourself on the deck with the engine it will throw you off the back of the carrier. If you have never gotten thrown off the back of the carrier then either you land full throttle or you have never caught the first wire.
I always thought that was from coming in too fast
Nope I always try to land the begining part of runway. Just habit, so when I got to the carrier I would stall right over the back, catch the first wire and get pulled right off the deck. Then it occured to me to counter the force with my engine, to hopfully get enough time to release the cable and stay on the boat.
Worked for me the first time and ever since.
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I've had it happen several times with the Seafire, even landing at about 100mph. It kinda happens in slow motion - you land then about a second or two later you get thrown off the back! I even had it on spawn the other day (CV wasn't turning).
I now try and aim for the last wire or even ahead of it; safer!
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All you have to do is cut your throttle ALL the way to zero before you touch the deck, it doesn't matter which wire or which plane. The only thing thats changed is if you come in at too much of an angle now it will whip your tail around.
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Full throttle landings are used with jets today. Throttle was chopped, canopy locked open and feet off the rudder pedals and on the floor during a carrier trap during WWII.
If you're getting thrown off the back, then you're not landing correctly.
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Originally posted by mars01
. Your not catching the first cable or else you would get shot off the back off the carrier.
This happens when you come in and catch the first cable maybe the second cable, definately the first. It has nothing to do with how steep you are or anyhting else only what cable you snatched.
If you catch the first cable and do not hold yourself on the deck with the engine it will throw you off the back of the carrier. If you have never gotten thrown off the back of the carrier then either you land full throttle or you have never caught the first wire.
Nope I always try to land the begining part of runway. Just habit, so when I got to the carrier I would stall right over the back, catch the first wire and get pulled right off the deck. Then it occured to me to counter the force with my engine, to hopfully get enough time to release the cable and stay on the boat.
Worked for me the first time and ever since.
Makes sense, only happened to me once. I was coming in hot, so I put 2 & 2 together and came up with 5 on the speed thing. I think I tend to overshoot anyway so normally get the last couple of wires.
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Full throttle landings are used with jets today. Throttle was chopped, canopy locked open and feet off the rudder pedals and on the floor during a carrier trap during WWII.
If you're getting thrown off the back, then you're not landing correctly.
Yeah thats a good point Rolex. None the less tho, in AH if you catch the first wire you are going to get thrown off the deck if your not johnny on the spot with the Throttle and unhook.
All you have to do is cut your throttle ALL the way to zero before you touch the deck, it doesn't matter which wire or which plane. The only thing thats changed is if you come in at too much of an angle now it will whip your tail around.
Film it and prove it. I know no matter how you land if you catch that first wire you are going into the drink. I tried every way I could till it dawned on me, to hold myself on the deck with engine.
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Whether or not this behavior is a bug is not important. Why? Because it is simply inaccurate, regardless.
Having logged 332 traps as a member of an aircrew, I can tell you with absolute certainty that whether you trap a one-wire or a four-wire, you will still come to a stop without undue drama.
The backwards "catapult" off the round-down is rediculous, and should be corrected.
If the goal was to simulate an off-center trap, or a off-angle trap, the way you do that is to model the result.
Since we are dicussing the odd behaviors on a carrier deck, HTC should model on-deck handling better. It's not an ice rink, aircraft moving on deck will not slip-slide around when the ship turns. Tires still generate friction.... In fact, the most common thing noticed was weather-vaning into the changing apparent wind, and even that was easily controlled. Has anyone ever noticed that on real CVs, no catapults are directly along the center axis of the vessel?
My regards,
Widewing
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A short ah2 cv landing film: Here >> (http://flightsims.info/cvlanding.ahf) Right click to save.
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I agree Wide definately a stupid bug, all I am sharing is the work around.
Having logged 332 traps as a member of an aircrew,
Nice PIC or REO?
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Originally posted by mars01
I agree Wide definately a stupid bug, all I am sharing is the work around. Nice PIC or REO?
Crew Chief/Flight Engineer. Mostly flying Grumman C-1A and US-2B, with a few in C-2s.
Was assigned to last amphibian (HU-16 Albatross) on active duty with Navy. Flew last operational flight too. Also qualified as Flight Engineer on C-118 and C-131. Logged about 200 hours in right seat (C-1A required only one pilot when hauling cargo) and considerable backseat time in TA-4J Scooters (Skyhawks). Even wangled a few rides in Phantoms.
My regards,
Widewing
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Widewing, I envy you.
Anyway, good write-ups, I think it will make a difference. I could just not figure out how to land on a CV correctly without fail.
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It'll do the same thing on a land runway if you turn up the wind.
With the throttle in full idle, your plane becomes a bit "sticky" on the ground. If you bump the throttle even a tiny bit above idle, the wind will have it's way with your plane.
It sounds like hogenbor's throttle is miscalibrated and he can't get the throttle all the way to idle to trigger the sticky ground handling.
Another way to see if this is really a bug is to either land without using the cable, or launching from the carrier. Instead of powering up rapidly, just barely move the throttle up out of idle, taxi around a bit, set it back to idle, then bump it back up to just above idle. If the plane starts rolling backwards, then it's the ground handling model. If not, then it's something else.
Another fun thing to do on the ground is to put a plane on the runway facing into the wind with max wind speed set (127). With the throttle in idle, the plane will just sit there. If you bump the throttle up above idle, one of two things will happen. Either the plane will jump into the air (will happen if you apply any back-stick input), or if you're careful not to touch the controls, the plane will rapidly accelerate backwards until it's rolling across the ground just barely below the wind speed. At this point, you can move the controls without leaping off the ground.
Fun :)
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Originally posted by mars01
Yeah thats a good point Rolex. None the less tho, in AH if you catch the first wire you are going to get thrown off the deck if your not johnny on the spot with the Throttle and unhook.
Wires and Hooks are for wussies....
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Explain to me how I can take off with a fully loaded F4U WITHOUT a calibrated throttle... :D
Btw, I also think that good and slow landing without hook is safer (due to the 'catapult' issue') but the CV was turning hard and my fuel was low. I guessed correctly that I could plunk it down but you can imagine my frustration when I was thrown off, especially considering I had my first three FM-2 kills in AH2 under my belt.
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Who said programmers had no sense of humor?
HTC switched the arresting wires with bungee ropes!
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Who said programmers had no sense of humor?
HTC switched the arresting wires with bungee ropes!
HAHAHA LOLH Exactly:D
Sounds Like Fun Wide lucky bastig!!!!:D