Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Overlag on June 23, 2004, 09:28:45 PM
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HTC dont you think you've gone a BIT too far on increasing field strength?
there is NO options to take a base now, i just run a FH killing mission, and we killed ALL the FH's
within 2 minutes they had REUPPED again
theres just something messed up right now and i just cant see what
for one, i love the gunnery now, i love the fights we have in the air, but HOW THE HELL DO WE CAPTURE BASES?
bish have been trying on A17 for the past 2 hours, theres still 50 knits in there nikis there, even after porking fuel down to the stupid 75% level, porking FH's only to have them pop up before you even land
i, and MANY bish are really F***ED off with this now
how do you base suppress if there is UNLIMITED reupps at bases?
i cant think what more to say but, apart from bombing GVS there sno fun here, bombing HQ's just doesnt work, 2000lbs just damages acks, no buildings go down
the rook-knight alliance sure is having fun at bish expense, as its imposible to take a base without having MASSIVE number advantage.
think maybe its time to just give up and wait for TOD or something
:mad: :mad: :mad:
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just feeling alittle frustrated....
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I absolutely HATE the land grab in AH and I don't care if my side loses its HQ, so long as I can find good fights. I suppose I'm the polar opposite of the arm-chair generals we have that type often in caps over channel 2.
However I agree (VERY reluctantly) with Overlag. It does seems difficult to capture bases, although the fights in AH2 have been superb I'd just hate to see AH2 lose a customer base that likes the boring landgrab.
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Try shooting them down. If you want a base, it's better to be a good pilot than a good suicide porker. Kill em and then keep them from upping.
I keep reading the initial post over and over again because I can't believe it. "The enemy is still flying, even after I destroyed all their buildings! What should I do?!"
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Trouble is Engine, sure I'll knock five of them down ;), but now, low on fuel and ammo, I must rtb and con numbers are still the same because they just re-up.
In effect, all this sortie will accomplish is a fun fight but has absolutely no effect on base capture at all.
Something like a minute's delay before getting another plane after losing your last ride might help though.
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Originally posted by Engine
"The enemy is still flying, even after I destroyed all their buildings! What should I do?!"
ROFLMAO LOLOLOL
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I am an old AW vet, and one thing AW did which I think may solve this problem without hauling us back into the Dark Ages of Sir Pork-a-lot is limiting the number of planes that can up from a given field per unit time and/or per operational Fighter Hangers. I believe this was done in AW more to curtail server resource load but the unintended effect was actually realistic. There were only so many planes allowed to up at a given airbase at a time. Allowing unlimited planes to up instantly is very unrealsitic.
If you limited small fields to 20 planes every 5 minutes (or whatever), medium fields to 30 planes, and large fields to 50 planes, it would pretty accurately simulate a one, two, or three squadron strength force. Or, perhaps, limiting the number of fighters able to up to 5 or 10 for every fighter hanger that is not destroyed in the same 5 minute sortie cycle woud be viable. If more than the allocated number wanted to participate in that base's defense or stage an attack from that base within that finite time frame, they would have to do so, at least in part, from a nearby field. The same system could be used with regard to bombers and Bomber Hangers.This would have the effect of limiting vulching, keep hordes to a reasonable level, spread the fighting out over more of the map and make base suppression and capture more a function of gaining local air superiority than trying to cripple the field's infrastructure which is largely impractical with anything other than overwhelming numerical superiority as noted in the previous posts.
As it is now, there is no difference between a field with only 1 FH up and one with all its FH's up.Unless you are able to keep all FH's down simultaneously there is zero net effect, this is not very realistic. Hangers were the numero uno target when attacking airfields (they housed the aircraft for maintainence/re-arming/re-fueling/refitting), actual ready aircraft on the ground were also high priority but AH does not model parked aircraft. In a way, doing what I mentioned above will give the building battlers a purpose that won't require a massive numerical advantage for a prolonged time period as each hanger destroyed will restrict the enemies ability to amass a perma-horde incrementally, at the same time there will be a premium put on the prudent application of defensive fighter forces, making death more meaningfull and costly to ones' team in the local strategic sense.
Just thinking out loud here...
Zazen
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That sounds like a good idea Zazen.
It will cause a bit of an frustration at first i guess, but people will adapt and overcome...
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Where is it written that base captures are supposed to be easy ?
Its too bad that a handfull of pilots can no longer ...
Take down all the ack !!!
Take down all the fuel !!!
Take down the VH !!!
Take down the town and capture it.
In AH I, the above could be accomplished, with ease, with 4-6 pilots. Now it takes a concerted and coordinated effort to accomplish the above.
Here is what I think Overlag ...
If FHs came back up within 2 minutes of your mission taking out said fighter hangers, I would believe that a fighter hanger was taken out previously to your run, and regenerated at the proper time.
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Zazen it should also have the affect of spreading out combat more through the arena. If a small base has maxed out the planes it can field in a set period of time other pilots have two choices:
[list=1]
- Up from a nearby base and have to fly a few additional sectors to the hot spot (combat).
- Or look for another interesting area to fight, which has a base that can field planes, instead of pig piling in on just one or two hot spot areas.
There will still be hordes but it would change things from 2-3 super horde / hotspot fighting areas to quite a few smaller horde fighting areas as people up in other areas since they would not have the patience to wait to up at the maxed out field. Or the patience to fly several additional sectors to the fight. And of course flying a couple more sectors would make them try to survive more since to die means they have to spend x many minutes in the air traveling to the fight (unless they switch to an area with a base not maxed out).
Interesting idea that could change the flavor of combat and operations in the MA.
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Originally posted by ghostdancer
Zazen it should also have the affect of spreading out combat more through the arena. If a small base has maxed out the planes it can field in a set period of time other pilots have two choices:
[list=1]
- Up from a nearby base and have to fly a few additional sectors to the hot spot (combat).
- Or look for another interesting area to fight, which has a base that can field planes, instead of pig piling in on just one or two hot spot areas.
There will still be hordes but it would change things from 2-3 super horde / hotspot fighting areas to quite a few smaller horde fighting areas as people up in other areas since they would not have the patience to wait to up at the maxed out field. Or the patience to fly several additional sectors to the fight. And of course flying a couple more sectors would make them try to survive more since to die means they have to spend x many minutes in the air traveling to the fight (unless they switch to an area with a base not maxed out).
Interesting idea that could change the flavor of combat and operations in the MA.
Exactly, instead of a base to base, perma-horde fight, the fight will be more of a 'front-line affair, where the fight extends not only to the hotly contested base but also to other adjacent 'support' fields around the perimeter of the principle battle.
Zazen
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Is it me or does the Ah2 cater to the horde? It definitely is harder to take a base...which means rooks can hold a cap and vulch for 2 hours until the troops get there without dying (which they are happy to do), in addition they cant be stopped due to fuel situation. Great game I love it but the unbalanced numbers starting to get real old. Yea its the bishes "turn" to be with low numbers...does that make it right? Espeacially with new game version.
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Last night, between 7 and 9 pm EST knights had the lowest numbers. There were a LOT of rooks on. I remeber the numbers once were 190 rooks 140 bish and 115 Knights. Someone was selling a 262 mission on radio saying they only cost about 115 perks but, with CTD's pretty much standard fare, practically no one wanted to risk it.
Majority of Knights were not interested in capturing bases, we were just fighting fighters much to the consternation of our little general types . They were screaming like mad - I think a couple probably had strokes from the strain.
The problems people are having I blame the map for. (Why are we using the antique maps anyway?) The Bish are in the "bad" corner.
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i agree with overlag with the amount of people that it takes to take a base now it takes away frm the game a little bit.
you dont see small fights all hordes flying in to a base......
last night was a great example........ two fights on the entire map one at 41 rooks flying in at 20k and one between 14 and 17 bishop flying in at 20k. knights trying to defend both..
really made for a boring night so I logged
I rather fly with five buddies to try and take base and fight five defending then fly with the hordes but know you cant do that
you need five just to take a v-base now with three hangers on them now
just my opion and it could be wrong
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This map (last nights - if rooks didnt reset it) has darn few decent GV fighting areas. The normal alternative to the hoards wasn't an option for most.
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Why are we using the antique maps anyway?
Probably because they were the easiest to convert to the new terrain.
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HTC is in the process of converting MAPs. So hopefully some of the larger MAPs or MAPs with better GV areas will be released very soon.
I like the Baltic but I think we have outgrown some of the others currently in play in AH2.
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Zazen, I kind of like your idea.
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I was beat to the use of Mathman's post as sig file material. But I think I have found a qualified alternate...
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The "capture" thing needs to go......
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There is a huge negative to the AW zone system and limiting defense options. Imagine that you are in an area where you have 1 air-base that is defending a concerted attack from 2 nearby enemy bases. Let’s say your airbase is a small one allowing 10 guys up--while the enemy bases are a small and large one. They in turn can up a combined force of 30 planes without zone issues vs. your 10 zone limit.
Thus, what you have is, that even if you want to defend, the vast majority of your forces are stuck in the tower because they can not up to defend due to zone restrictions of the small airbase.
As you have less and less bases to come up from the zones become a huge constraint for a country that is trying to fight its way out of the gutter or counter attack.
The best game play that I have seen is where you have neutral-capturable front line bases supported by hardened-uncappturable 2nd line bases. The land-grab folk can work on trying to take the neutrals while the furballers are guaranteed some good fights near the neutrals that are supported from the hardened rear bases.
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I would like an uncapturable area too, then the milkrunning "gotta wins" can do their thing and the fly till you die "furballers" can both be doing their theirs.
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Originally posted by Engine
Try shooting them down. If you want a base, it's better to be a good pilot than a good suicide porker. Kill em and then keep them from upping.
I keep reading the initial post over and over again because I can't believe it. "The enemy is still flying, even after I destroyed all their buildings! What should I do?!"
shoot them down, and they are back up in 5seconds, since your within a mile of there base....hence my point on UNLIMITED supply of planes, Fuel, ammo now..........
Originally posted by Zazen13
Allowing unlimited planes to up instantly is very unrealsitic.
If you limited small fields to 20 planes every 5 minutes (or whatever), medium fields to 30 planes, and large fields to 50 planes, it would pretty accurately simulate a one, two, or three squadron strength force. Or, perhaps, limiting the number of fighters able to up to 5 or 10 for every fighter hanger that is not destroyed in the same 5 minute sortie cycle woud be viable. If more than the allocated number wanted to participate in that base's defense or stage an attack from that base within that finite time frame, they would have to do so, at least in part, from a nearby field. The same system could be used with regard to bombers and Bomber Hangers.This would have the effect of limiting vulching, keep hordes to a reasonable level, spread the fighting out over more of the map and make base suppression and capture more a function of gaining local air superiority than trying to cripple the field's infrastructure which is largely impractical with anything other than overwhelming numerical superiority as noted in the previous posts.
As it is now, there is no difference between a field with only 1 FH up and one with all its FH's up.Unless you are able to keep all FH's down simultaneously there is zero net effect, this is not very realistic. Hangers were the numero uno target when attacking airfields (they housed the aircraft for maintainence/re-arming/re-fueling/refitting), actual ready aircraft on the ground were also high priority but AH does not model parked aircraft. In a way, doing what I mentioned above will give the building battlers a purpose that won't require a massive numerical advantage for a prolonged time period as each hanger destroyed will restrict the enemies ability to amass a perma-horde incrementally, at the same time there will be a premium put on the prudent application of defensive fighter forces, making death more meaningfull and costly to ones' team in the local strategic sense.
Just thinking out loud here...
Zazen
Originally posted by Zazen13
Exactly, instead of a base to base, perma-horde fight, the fight will be more of a 'front-line affair, where the fight extends not only to the hotly contested base but also to other adjacent 'support' fields around the perimeter of the principle battle.
Zazen
Zazen I really like your idea...but it seems AH has turned into non land grab, and "moved the arguement to the other side of the fence" again :mad:
Originally posted by mojo55
The "capture" thing needs to go......
WHAT? if it goes what would be the idea of the game?!?!? :confused:
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Shoot them down, and then keep them down. They'll stop upping once they realize it's futile.
Even ff you get 5 kills and have to turn for home, you've done your job. You've made it that much easier for your countrymates to hold the area and push towards the field.
Get my point now? Try winning the base through superior combat skills, not through porking.
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Originally posted by Engine
Shoot them down, and then keep them down. They'll stop upping once they realize it's futile.
Even ff you get 5 kills and have to turn for home, you've done your job. You've made it that much easier for your countrymates to hold the area and push towards the field.
Get my point now? Try winning the base through superior combat skills, not through porking.
hmmm
20 vs 50 at this base, i think we was doing rather well last night....but how are you suppose to stop them from upping? seems most people have learned Taki's and co's tactics of upping constantly untill the vulcher has run out of ammo..............since they get no penaulty for dying which is part of my point.
The only way seems to be having 10-20 more players, not skill, its stilless to vulch anyone can do it.....
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The thing is the Bish if a field is capped we wont up. But the rooks our knights. If the field is capped they will keep upping i guess there trying to get us to wast our ammo. I just come with a 110 and put 1 30mm bullet in them. Its really fun;)
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Originally posted by mojo55
The "capture" thing needs to go......
Originally posted by Overlag
WHAT? if it goes what would be the idea of the game?!?!? :confused:
Overlag, are you seriously asking that question?
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:lol :lol Rook - Knit allience :lol :lol now thats funny.
I do like your Idea Zazen. Maybe if a FH goes down planes launch with a delay of some sort. Maybe a 15 sec countdown until you hit the tarmac or something. More of a delay until all FH are down. You could wait for the delay or you could up from another field.
As for whoever said you couldnt defend the field is such a limited amount of planes were allowed up... you can defend the field... just not from THAT field.
lol maybe we could fly in spare parts on C47s to allow more planes up. I think I would like the idea to build front line fields that really dont show up on the map. You want to see where the enemy is fly around a little bit. Lot of good ideas guys keep it up.
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Boy what a shame,
If you don't have a cap you can't capture the base. That is horrible.
Basically HTC has removed the ability to take three guys and capture a base.
The harder strat has made it fun to try and capture a field again. The strat was way too easy in AHI and got boring very fast. Now it is a challenge again and fun. Fights actually have a chance to flourish rather than crap out.
I like the harder strat makes it a better game. The fun is in the challenge and the process of taking the base, not in the end result of, "Goody I just stole the base", rather "Wow what a fight to take that base."
Base Capture should be very difficult and take a consorted effort, not a 3 guys and a goon.
I think this is a step in the right direction, now all they need to do is move the bases closer together so you don't need to fly a sector plus to get there.
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Originally posted by Overlag
hmmm
20 vs 50 at this base, i think we was doing rather well last night....but how are you suppose to stop them from upping? seems most people have learned Taki's and co's tactics of upping constantly untill the vulcher has run out of ammo..............since they get no penaulty for dying which is part of my point.
The only way seems to be having 10-20 more players, not skill, its stilless to vulch anyone can do it.....
When the fight gets that close (capping/vulching a base) the amount of fuel is not a factor and never was as far as I am concerned, and still isn't
In AH I, if the field was capped and fuel was down to %25, I would still up if the situation presented itself ... fuel was not a concern at that point.
All your targets were well within the range of %25 usage and at the same time, your plane was that much lighter for better manuvering.
The new "non-porking fuel" notion prevents the initial 2 to 3 suicide/porkin wave of the horde from knocking down all fuel so that a defensive front could not fly out and intercept the incoming hordelets. That is not the case anymore.
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Originally posted by mars01
Boy what a shame,
If you don't have a cap you can't capture the base. That is horrible.
Basically HTC has removed the ability to take three guys and capture a base.
The harder strat has made it fun to try and capture a field again. The strat was way too easy in AHI and got boring very fast. Now it is a challenge again and fun. Fights actually have a chance to flourish rather than crap out.
I like the harder strat makes it a better game. The fun is in the challenge and the process of taking the base, not in the end result of, "Goody I just stole the base", rather "Wow what a fight to take that base."
Base Capture should be very difficult and take a consorted effort, not a 3 guys and a goon.
I think this is a step in the right direction, now all they need to do is move the bases closer together so you don't need to fly a sector plus to get there.
ok ok come to bish with your whole squad and say that k?
sure, it WAS fun for 30minutes, but when it turned into a 2 hour death wall, without dar still (3 days and counting now) it got alittle boring.
Sure, knights and rooks have and endless supply of people to throw into a field....guess you dont see a problem with that.........
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Originally posted by SlapShot
When the fight gets that close (capping/vulching a base) the amount of fuel is not a factor and never was as far as I am concerned, and still isn't
In AH I, if the field was capped and fuel was down to %25, I would still up if the situation presented itself ... fuel was not a concern at that point.
All your targets were well within the range of %25 usage and at the same time, your plane was that much lighter for better manuvering.
The new "non-porking fuel" notion prevents the initial 2 to 3 suicide/porkin wave of the horde from knocking down all fuel so that a defensive front could not fly out and intercept the incoming hordelets. That is not the case anymore.
i like the non fuel porking system in some ways, but how can you limit the planes upping from the base right now? Numbers? well thats the only option Bish doesnt have...........
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going to go one step further to make you laugh.........:lol
why does the side, with the number advantage, the base advantage, the ground cover advantage, turn to uppping nikis? lol :p
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Ya know Overlag ...
On one hand, I feel sorry for the Bish ... and on the other hand, I don't.
I am going on 3 years here in AH and the majority of that was spent as a Knight until we recently moved to the Rooks for a change of scenery and to wing with some other players.
While flying for the Knights, we experienced what you are now feeling for quite some time. This is where I feel sorry for the Bish.
Some Knights came on the board and complained in the exact same manner you are now and were told to STFU by both Rooks and Bish ... "cause everybody gets their turn in the barrel". This is where I don't feel sorry for the Bish.
If its your turn in "the barrel" then suck it up.
ok ok come to bish with your whole squad and say that k?
Maybe we will, but we won't have to to know what you are going thru at the moment ... we were Knights as I said above, so we know all too well what it feels like "in the barrel" and so do the Rooks.
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Honestly Overlag,
I didn't like moving to the rooks only for the reason that we were not outnumbered anymore.
I hate fighting my own team for kills, with a passion. There is nothing worse than flying around working a guy to the point where you finally have him, only to have one of your own guys come in and steal the kill. I would rather be outnumbered 8 to 1 and never get a shot off because I am constantly dodging one attacker after another than have 8 friendlies around and 2 enemies.
When we were knights this past year, thats all it was. Outnumbered all the time. My advice to you is, give up on the gotta win the war BS when you don't have the numbers, because the reality is you never will. Start enjoying the fights rather than the base captures.
You see two hour death wall I see tons of opportunity for non stop fights.
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why does the side, with the number advantage, the base advantage, the ground cover advantage, turn to uppping nikis? lol
HAHHAHAHAA LOL Because they are ultimate weeeeeeeenieeeeessssss and on top of it they HO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:lol
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Originally posted by HUN
There is a huge negative to the AW zone system and limiting defense options. Imagine that you are in an area where you have 1 air-base that is defending a concerted attack from 2 nearby enemy bases. Let’s say your airbase is a small one allowing 10 guys up--while the enemy bases are a small and large one. They in turn can up a combined force of 30 planes without zone issues vs. your 10 zone limit.
Thus, what you have is, that even if you want to defend, the vast majority of your forces are stuck in the tower because they can not up to defend due to zone restrictions of the small airbase.
As you have less and less bases to come up from the zones become a huge constraint for a country that is trying to fight its way out of the gutter or counter attack.
The best game play that I have seen is where you have neutral-capturable front line bases supported by hardened-uncappturable 2nd line bases. The land-grab folk can work on trying to take the neutrals while the furballers are guaranteed some good fights near the neutrals that are supported from the hardened rear bases.
Hun,
That is exactly the point, from a realism point of view, a single runway dirt strip should not have the capacity to launch 50 fighters in 30 seconds or less, especially with all but one of it's fighter hangers destroyed. As it is now, there is little distinction in terms of capturability and capacity between small/medium/large fields, while there is more to strat on a large field, stratting fields has little effect overall unless it's completely decimated and kept that way. Adding the Hanger restriction dimension to the fields will make the small, medium, large fields less to more valuable respectively.
What will happen in my guesstimation is small fields will change hands rather frequently, while medium and espeically large fields will become the focal point of major pitched battles. Small fields will serve an important role as 'back-up' support fields for the larger fields. If this idea were to be implimented there would likely have to be some rethinking of the small/medium/large field distribution on the maps to have them make sense and play out properly.
Zazen
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Originally posted by SlapShot
In AH I, the above could be accomplished, with ease, with 4-6 pilots. Now it takes a concerted and coordinated effort to accomplish the above.
coordinated effort = horde?
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inhale, kill, exhale.
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Bigger Maps thins out the hoards i think,
and quiets the "Race for the Reset" gameplay a bit
Though its not the answer to the bigger problem...
How to balance #'s, and how to figure out a way to make the strategic side of the gameplay more intresting, while still allowing for land grab
One idea that may help,
Adjust rebuild times for bases depending on how far they are away from your homeland...
for instance, Rook bases deep in Bish or Nit territory (outside thier Homland zone) would have FH down times of 20 or 30 min, ack and town stay down longer etc. as maybe they have extended thier supply lines too far. ??
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Originally posted by vorticon
coordinated effort = horde?
Possibly Vort ... it all has to do with the number of pilots participating.
I don't think that a hard number has be defined that defines a "horde". I would hazard a guess as to 20 and above constitutes a "horde".
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A horde is only a horde when the country being attacked can not produce equal numbers to fend off the attackers.
If a large mission is comming in say 20 planes and 20 planes up to defend, then I would call this a good fight.
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Originally posted by mars01
HAHHAHAHAA LOL Because they are ultimate weeeeeeeenieeeeessssss and on top of it they HO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:lol
:lol :rofl
i ok now....just got it off my chest....
gimme 3 hours to get P****D off again ;)
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Hate to hijack but I never understood why you gents joined the team which has the most players, the vast majority of the time.
Was it something someone did to you gents?
Originally posted by mars01
I didn't like moving to the rooks only for the reason that we were not outnumbered anymore.
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Originally posted by mars01
A horde is only a horde when the country being attacked can not produce equal numbers to fend off the attackers.
If a large mission is comming in say 20 planes and 20 planes up to defend, then I would call this a good fight.
exactly, my arguement is not that i dont want to fight evenly to get to a field, and capture it, its that its very hard to get there.
A17 was a classic example last night. a great even battle, but, every plane we shot down, was back in less than 2 minutes
it was fun for 2 hours, but after 3 it was a tad annoying, as 90% of bish was there and still no result (due to equal ammount of defenders)
the big maps will most likely stop most of my issues, since it will take longer for bish to get SO far behind, and we wont lose our HQ since it wont be in the middle of our lands...but at the end.....
i cant wait to see how festama and trinity turn out......
Originally posted by Zazen13
Hun,
That is exactly the point, from a realism point of view, a single runway dirt strip should not have the capacity to launch 50 fighters in 30 seconds or less, especially with all but one of it's fighter hangers destroyed. As it is now, there is little distinction in terms of capturability and capacity between small/medium/large fields, while there is more to strat on a large field, stratting fields has little effect overall unless it's completely decimated and kept that way. Adding the Hanger restriction dimension to the fields will make the small, medium, large fields less to more valuable respectively.
What will happen in my guesstimation is small fields will change hands rather frequently, while medium and espeically large fields will become the focal point of major pitched battles. Small fields will serve an important role as 'back-up' support fields for the larger fields. If this idea were to be implimented there would likely have to be some rethinking of the small/medium/large field distribution on the maps to have them make sense and play out properly.
Zazen
hmm something does need to be done about the hanger thing... i mean you get 7 our of 8 hangers down, yet the field has 100% fighters still? its just not right. at least i think so....
maybe 10 planes upable PER hanger? that sounds fairer....it still allows large fights to happen, even with only one hanger, but it MEANS something when hangers are down...
oh and Mars and the rest of the 13tas i do unstand, as i was a knight for about 9 months as well, i changed to bish just as knights came out of there hole....and bish went back into it LOL :lol :mad:
hope maybe you choose to do a tour with Bish soon....we dont smell THAT much you know :lol
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Hate to hijack but I never understood why you gents joined the team which has the most players, the vast majority of the time.
Was it something someone did to you gents?
Nothing like that, we were just looking for a change of scenery, get to know some new folks etc.
I am glad that we changed, it gives you a better perspective of the game and the people that play it.
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Lots of effort without any reward is what happend at 17 last night. I ran several squad missions in there dropping hangars each time with no net effect. The planes still came up and a cap couldnt be established because of the HO Kill enemy and up again mentality. The numbers were so upside down was the reason.
On improvements I suggest with each hangar destroyed to limit the planeset of the field. Incrementally of course until they(FH)are all down and then no fighters allowed up. Would make FH a more jucy target, and still allow some good fights and even knock the cobwebs off some of the early war planes.
I love the new AH2 bugs and all. We live with them until they are fixed and try to make it a better game for all. You just cant please everyone all the time.
Kev....AKA "RHINO"
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Sounds like fun on both sides to me.
So what were the numbers like? If you guys had such a small amount of people why didn't you get more or change targets?
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Mars01 it wasnt a small amout. Bish were down to 5 bases almost the entire Bish team was at that base. Missions were sent to the back bases to try and take pressure off of 17 and to no avail. There are no GV spawns to 17 from any of the bases we had. 17 was the only logical target.
I did have fun and lots of it. After tireing of the onslaught at 17 I went over HQ to kill some of the milk runners. Got into a nice tangle with a couple of ponys. There was still fun to be had, just next to no way we could get our HQ back wich i think was the main goal. Not just wanting to be toolshed killers we were trying to take back bases so we could get some dar relief.
RHIN0
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Originally posted by Engine
Shoot them down, and then keep them down. Try winning the base through superior combat skills, not through porking.
Skills? lol They wont be won through skills but through numbers just like they always are.
Only now its gonna be worse.
Because now there is no effective way to slow down the hordes let alone stop them
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Ahhh the ole, we have few bases left and it's either fight with our eyes closed and deal or log.
I can appreciate that, been there.
Still, the base capture doesn't have to made easier does it. I guess if it were easier, maybe the map would have been reset sooner????
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Originally posted by mars01
A horde is only a horde when the country being attacked can not produce equal numbers to fend off the attackers.
If a large mission is comming in say 20 planes and 20 planes up to defend, then I would call this a good fight.
heh, you must be a rook
LOL
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Only now its gonna be worse.
Because now there is no effective way to slow down the hordes let alone stop them
Do you mean by fuel porking. Fuels porking almost always fked the ones trying to defend.
So you kill the fuel where the horde was comming from, they are just going to horde another field from you somewere else.
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Still, the base capture doesn't have to made easier does it. I guess if it were easier, maybe the map would have been reset sooner????
Map should have been reset with 5 bases left. But thats another thread.
Not sure base capture ever was easy, its just alot harder now. In some instances almost impossible. Im up for a challenge, just not an insurmountable one.
Limit planeset with each FH destroyed.
RHIN0
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Here's my input on it. What would be nice is in a way force coordinated attacks.
Here's what I mean. This is based on dealing with major strategic targets and how they directly affect the local area. Now say if you just want to pork an areas fuel, troops or ord. What you'd have to do is coordinate an attack at their sister strat. Say if you wanna hit and pork fuel only, you have to hit the fuel refinery in the same area to really affect how quickly it comes up. I know currently thats how it's suppose to be setup. I guess it just doesn't seem to affect the areas enough.
Same should go with certain targets like fighter hangars and bomber hangars. Have a sister strat for them so if you wanna take down hangars and make them stay down for awhile then you have to hit say the bomber factory and the fighter factory. What it comes down to is if folks wanna take a base and pork it to nothing they have to make a real effort and plan attacks on the sister strat in the area or else when they take down certain strat at the base itself it won't affect the base that much and probability of capturing it will be in the low teens.
Right now the only thing that seems to affect game play alot is hitting HQ. Granted that should be a hard target to get to but how often do we go without any dar? Opposed to making it affect dar bars and dots it should only affect a series of inputs to the whole game. Now I think HQ should have a different series of things it affects when it goes down. For starters major dar bars outside of friendly territory (not covered by local small radars)shouldn't be able to be seen. If we implemented local and strategical radars then this could be an option. Have many local strategic radars tha cover a large area and smaller local radars that cover x amount around bases themselves. Basically model radars that cover x amount of distance and height. That way cons at high alts aren't just showing a dar bar but relative alt and distance. It could also affect how quickly the initial dispatch of supplies go but not to an extreme extent. There are other ways of reporting attacks other than through HQ the only difference is how quickly the get disiminated to all of the bases. Local bases around the attack would have supplies dispatched fairly quickly so long as HQ is the only thing hit.
Heck I could go on and on about this but it's just a suggestion. One thing I'd prefer to see which would help use resources in a better way is teaching folks that it doesn't take 5 folks to chase one bird around for 10 minutes. Especially when there are alot of enemy cons inb.
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Knights have numbers?
Darn, I have to start paying attention;) ;)
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leave the fuel, leave the ammo, but limit the planes. I think it could do nothing but good.
And to take away the capture element of the game would remove a lot of the fun and realism of the game.
but I really like zazen's idea. It would really open the entire map up.
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Just a thought. If a counrty has many more players then the others their hangers, fuel, troops and such should stay down longer. Or is this already part of the game?
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Originally posted by Xargos
Just a thought. If a counrty has many more players then the others their hangers, fuel, troops and such should stay down longer. Or is this already part of the game?
that sounds like a good idea!
the more things HTC do to make people NOT want to be on the side with most numbers, the better
so far we only have perks and the modifiers, but that generaly doesnt mean anything
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Originally posted by mars01
Do you mean by fuel porking. Fuels porking almost always fked the ones trying to defend.
So you kill the fuel where the horde was comming from, they are just going to horde another field from you somewere else.
Sometimes yes. And then you do it all over again.
Doesnt always completely stop em but sure does slow em down someties long enough for a proper defence ot be mounted of if it can be maintained long enough till they start going to bed
but just as often I've seen the horde forced to attack the numbers. Thus playing into the furballers hands.
And also just as often I've seen the hord eturn its attention to the other country
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Originally posted by CPR
:lol :lol Rook - Knit allience :lol :lol now thats funny.
I do like your Idea Zazen. Maybe if a FH goes down planes launch with a delay of some sort. Maybe a 15 sec countdown until you hit the tarmac or something. More of a delay until all FH are down. You could wait for the delay or you could up from another field.
As for whoever said you couldnt defend the field is such a limited amount of planes were allowed up... you can defend the field... just not from THAT field.
lol maybe we could fly in spare parts on C47s to allow more planes up. I think I would like the idea to build front line fields that really dont show up on the map. You want to see where the enemy is fly around a little bit. Lot of good ideas guys keep it up.
I like that idea alot. While not creating some kind of upper limit it does decrease launch frequency as a penalty for losing hangers incrementally.
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Originally posted by Xargos
Just a thought. If a counrty has many more players then the others their hangers, fuel, troops and such should stay down longer. Or is this already part of the game?
Hangers, like VH's are on a straight 15 minute timer. I don't there is any strategic target associated with their regeneration rate. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
Zazen
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Give it time. AHII has only been here a short while. Let it grow on you a little.
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AHII has grown on me....
the strat "model" has turned into Quake though, its just a FPS game now with no strat.......maybe HTC should make a map with 3 untakeable fields and get it over and done with
(ok thats a bit TOO far but.....)
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Hmm I see it differently then some.
I like the new strat. Rooks were rollin over the Knights in the south and the Knights rallied and the rooks were brought to a halt for awhile.
Of course then the Bishops were hittin Knights in the north and takin bases.
Knights did not have the numbers most of today when I was on.
I got tired of 25% fuel, no ordanance, VH down, FH down everywhere within a 30 mile radius, and even though you're tryin to defend the porkers still come in doin power dives that they know will kill em and sucidin into fuel and ammo bunkers and NOT having any harm done to their score or restriction on the planes they could fly. That IMHO is NOT REAL!
I'm for if you lose a good plane while on a jabo run you gotta fly a crappy one until you have flown for 10 or 20 minutes and then you must RTB to get a good jabo plane again. Ya you could chose a fighter and fly around but until you up as ATTACK you can't get a good jabo plane :) Hey how about if you select fighter you get NO bombs or ROCKETS! If you pick ATTACK and die while flying ATTACK in a good ordanance plane then you gotta fly a crappy one with poor ordanance!!! Or it cost you many many perk points to get another!!!!! :aok :)
HEY maybe I've found a use for all those ATTACK POINTS!!! Use em for LOADOUT!!!!! :aok :D
AND if you hit the ground during ATTACK runs you lose ATTACK points :) That might make the strat types a little more cautious about high speed no chance of recovery power divin right into the VH, or fuel, or ammo, or what ever.
Maybe that will stop the sucide porkers or at least slow em down for awhile!
Cause to me that's just unreal tournement/quake type flyin the way the porkers come in knowing the whole time they are going to die just fly to kill everything strat they can. That was not done by very many pilots during WWII and those that did only did it once!
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Over the past 4 years of playing AH I have usually been on the outnumbered or mid-numbered team. When I suggested the squad I am a member of move to Rooks (back when they were in the bucket) most were perfectly fine with the move. I wanted to join the outnumbered team to help balance things out. I am not sure why as I have a temper like everyone else... +)
Anyways, as it turned out... several squaddies didn't like the change at all, and left the squad rather than fly for the outnumbered.
So we are still Rook, and there is no way in hell I will support another side change if it means squaddies will leave to fly on a different team so they can have fun.
To some the flying for the outnumbered is fun, and believe me it will help your skills, but some can't hack it, and I can understand why.
BUT all I have left to say is:
Deal with it or get out...
SKurj
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Originally posted by Zazen13
Hangers, like VH's are on a straight 15 minute timer. I don't there is any strategic target associated with their regeneration rate. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
Zazen
Fighter hangar
Bomber hangar
Vehicle hangar
Shore battery
Town building
The above are not reliant upon any "factory", so they are regenerated strickly on timers.
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Originally posted by SlapShot
Fighter hangar
Bomber hangar
Vehicle hangar
Shore battery
Town building
The above are not reliant upon any "factory", so they are regenerated strickly on timers.
which sucks........