Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: muckmaw on June 28, 2004, 08:32:38 AM
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I found Crumpps post to be very interesting.
I wonder how much more the media has outright lied about the events in Iraq.
It reminds me of the yellow journalism we learned about in the war of 1812 and other earlier conflicts.
It's sad to realize we have not come a far as a society as we thought.
Who else has served in Iraq?
I'd be interested to hear more stories from guys who have been there.
And how does it make you feel when people on the left accuse you of intentionally targeting civilians and calling you Nazi's etcc?
I think I already know the answer to that one, but has anyone ever had the balls to say that to your face?
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Originally posted by muckmaw
And how does it make you feel when people on the left accuse you of intentionally targeting civilians and calling you Nazi's etcc?
I think I already know the answer to that one, but has anyone ever had the balls to say that to your face?
Show me 1 post by an American member of this board calling the troops Nazis.
I think it's pretty safe to say everyone here supports the troops while we don't nessessarily support their CIC. You should be ashamed.
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You have to be American to be on the left?
Since when?
Who said anything about Americans?
From the thread "Slaughtering Prisoners in Iraqi Jails"
Courtesy of _Schadenfreude
"Nazi's would have been proud of you..."
Read the context for yourself.
And this was just from this morning. I did not bother to go back and do a more intensive search.
Who should be ashamed of themselves?
Me or him?
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I bet they feel a lot like the majority of Muslims who are trying to live a normal life, and are described as a cancer that needs to be wiped from the face of the earth.... by the right.
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Muslims who fit into that category spend their days planning ways to kill innocent people.
If that's a normal life, than your right.
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FREE IRAQ
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Originally posted by GScholz
You will have to excuse muckmaw's comprehension problems. First Crumpp served in Afghanistan, so far I've not seen him post anything that suggests he's served in Iraq. Secondly, Shaden did not call Crumpp or the troops Nazis ... he called YOU a Nazi muckmaw.
Oh, no!
Some guy halfway around the world called me a Nazi!
Oh whatever will I do!!!!
What is it with the left? When tthey've got nothing else, the toss in the Nazi/Hitler comment....come on guys...get something new. This is getting boring.
hehe....
Crummp-
Excuse my mistake. I thought from reading your posts that you were in Iraq.
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I actually know a number of guys in Iraq right now, and some who recently returned. One guy's beenin for 19 years 4 months, and is willing to forego his pension if it means he has to go back for a second tour.
He won't say much, but what he does say is that it's a mess. He was talking to an Iraqi, and while the man said he is happy saddam is gone, it was much more stable when he was in power. With Saddam, we have power, on 4 days, off 4 days, all the time...now, we have power 2 days, off 4, on 2, off six, and it's much more dangerous now. Oh they do like American soldiers, but do not like Bush, they are happy we're here, but they want their own country back (or somethig like that)
This is what was reported to me. You decide.
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disregard, I should have followed the other thread
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Originally posted by Red Tail 444
I actually know a number of guys in Iraq right now, and some who recently returned. One guy's beenin for 19 years 4 months, and is willing to forego his pension if it means he has to go back for a second tour.
He won't say much, but what he does say is that it's a mess. He was talking to an Iraqi, and while the man said he is happy saddam is gone, it was much more stable when he was in power. With Saddam, we have power, on 4 days, off 4 days, all the time...now, we have power 2 days, off 4, on 2, off six, and it's much more dangerous now. Oh they do like American soldiers, but do not like Bush, they are happy we're here, but they want their own country back (or somethig like that)
This is what was reported to me. You decide.
Redtail reports...you decide...
I was under the impression the power grid was back to pre-Saddam levels.
I wonder if this guy lives in the sticks or if there is a power problem nationwide.
AS for stability, change be definition means instability. Look at the US when we fought for independance. There was a time of great difficulty and instability, but it was worth the effort.
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Iraq
the birthplace of freedom for the entire Middle East
to those who sacrificed to make it a reality
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The prophet eaglet has spoken!
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Been in and out a couple times now.
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Originally posted by Monk
Been in and out a couple times now.
So whats the real story on the ground from your point of view?
Hey, maybe we should make a documentary.
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Originally posted by muckmaw
Who else has served in Iraq?
I've talked about it to people now and then and made a post or two on this BBS. Never had anyone go into the hippie mode and call me a Nazi or anything like that. Had a guy in Atlanta Int'l stop in front of me and stare me down for about 5 secs, then he shook his head and walked away. Didn't know what to make of that one, but I was more concerned with my R&R than finding out what was on his mind anyhow.
If the only information you get is from the mass media, it's easy to understand why you'd think the world is about to implode any minute now. I can't point to any specific cases of downright lies, but a general vibe of sensationalism and doomsday prophesy seems to be standard issue these days.
Like Red Tail dutifully reported from the front lines, there is indeed a problem with basic security and electrical services. On the security issue, Iraqis seem to miss the Saddam regime's ability to enforce order, but don't miss the heavy handed techniques he used to maintain it. As for electrical services, I don't really know what's going on since it's not my lane. One of our locals (in Mosul) told me the system was old and damaged and couldn't be run continuousy for fear of permanently breaking it.
On the detainee issue: There were alot of them within our local compound. I used to snicker when I would see them out being led in morning exercise by an MP. It just cracked my up seeing a bunch of local thugs doing a military calhistenic routine for some reason. Oh yeah, one more thing..they got air conditioning, beds, a solid roof and good food months before any of us did. (We stopped eating out of the field kitchen in NOV I think and my hooch got an A/C unit in FEB.) So, if prisoner abuse is "widespread" in Iraq, it must have been happening everywhere BUT where I was.
Yeah, Iraq sucked. Hope we don't go back, Battalion CDR even *told* us we won't be going back, but in the rank and file we've heard this kind of thing before and take it with a grain of salt.
PS: Camel spiders aren't really spiders at all, and they don't eat people in their sleep! ;)
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Got a couple of friends in an Engineering Company of the 1st Cavlary Division.
Acording to them, much of Iraq's water and power infrastructure, especially in the southern part of Iraq, was destroyed by Saddam's forces as part of a "scorched earth" policy.
That doesn't surprise anyone, does it? Saddam's hatred of the Shi'ites knew no bounds. He didn't give a dam about nearly 70% of the population of his own country. The current power shortages are the result.
Their current task is blowing up damaged structures and building bases for the new Iraqi security forces. Or maybe "rebuilding" would be a better term. My friends stated that the old Iraqi bases were a mess...horribly designed from the standpoint of security or normal utility.
One of these men is my "third son." A young gent who is a close friend of my college age sons who has adopted my wife and I as secondary parents and refers to us as "mom" and "dad." He came home from Iraq unexpectedly this weekend. The celebration is still in full roar.
He told us about their rules of engagement. The Iraqi citizens are permitted to own Ak-47s and pistols, and evidently are allowed to carry them in the streets, as long as they have a permit. If U.S. forces see them with any other type of weapon, they are permitted to open fire on them immediately. He's referring mainly to RPGs, grenades, or other military type weapons.
He's got to go back in two weeks, and will be there until December.
Keep him in your prayers.
Regards, Shuckins/Leggern
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Originally posted by muckmaw
Redtail reports...you decide...
No, these were his words not mine, in the thread, you may have read that his unit was around Fallujah.
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Originally posted by muckmaw
...I was under the impression the power grid was back to pre-Saddam levels....
You may be right. What was the power grid like in the 60's?
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Originally posted by muckmaw
You have to be American to be on the left?
Since when?
Who said anything about Americans?
From the thread "Slaughtering Prisoners in Iraqi Jails"
Courtesy of _Schadenfreude
"Nazi's would have been proud of you..."
Read the context for yourself.
And this was just from this morning. I did not bother to go back and do a more intensive search.
Who should be ashamed of themselves?
Me or him?
I was referring to YOU you idiot not the American troops!!!
Give me strength - what there is there..an IQ deficit or something?
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Originally posted by _Schadenfreude_
I was referring to YOU you idiot not the American troops!!!
Give me strength - what there is there..an IQ deficit or something?
Don't worry, I'll go back to school and earn my GED so I can be as smert as joo.
Pleeze don't give up on me yet. I can get there there with sum hard werk and study.
:rolleyes:
Maybe you want to quote whoever you respond to in a thread like that, Brainiac.
Now if you'll excuse me, I need to go practive drawing my Swastikas.
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Hey Schadenfreude man, why are you calling our troops Nazis?
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Originally posted by Engine
Hey Schadenfreude man, why are you calling our troops Nazis?
Yes he is. I made a post in the thread and right after he made a post saying Nazis would be proud of us.
Gunslinger
Senior Member
Registered: Sep 2003
Location: Mojave Desert, Left Coast
Posts: 1526
Here's the Gunslinger's $0.02,
If they are holding a Marine and kill him you can be assured it will energize his fellow Marines.
In Faluja ALOT of Marines became casualties in order to protect civilians. They faught valiently like their title dictates they should. I imagine every Marine in country would still do their job but I think they would be a little less sympathetic to Insurgents pointing weapons weapons at them.
The truth is I feel their pain because they are and will allways be my brothers. I wish I was their with them and at the same time very glad I am not. Semper Fi brothers.
Yup terrorism sucks because it works. People have a reaction to the killing so they keep doing it.
I'm not sure if what I'd do if I was ever a hostage, I do hope I'd have the courage to spit in their faces and go down fighting even if my hands are tied.
__________________
Gnslngr
"Untutored courage is useless in the face of educated bullets."
-Patton 1942
"Remember, whatever you write, this was no retreat. All that happened was that we found more Chinese behind us than in front of us, so we about-faced and attacked."
- Chesty Puller, USMC, speaking to reporters after the battle out of the Chosin Reservoir, Korean War
IP: Logged
06-27-2004 11:27 PM
_Schadenfreude_
Senior Member
Registered: May 2003
Location: London
Posts: 1864
Nazi's would have been proud of you...
__________________
SchadenAH@hotmail.com
IP: Logged
not sure if he's talking to me but he's not American so I guess that doesnt count.
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oh...I see some sensitive types on these here boards....
write the word NAZI.....and the little female types come out with the big words.
treating prisoners like dogs DOES make you sound like a (NAZI).....
don't get all high and mighty now.....
see thats the difference between a MODERN society...and a BACKWARDS one
treating prisoners like dogs makes you look like a bunch of retards who have lowered there standards to the level of the NAZI's used in WW2.....
question is.....
are you Modern......or Backwards
P.S......thx for the inside info VOR
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Originally posted by SLO
treating prisoners like dogs makes you look like a bunch of retards who have lowered there standards to the level of the NAZI's used in WW2.....
question is.....
are you Modern......or Backwards
P.S......thx for the inside info VOR
Have you even picked up a history book EVER? Murdering people because of their race creed or religion sounds more like somthing the nazis did not abusing a handfull of prisoners.
HMMMM LETS SEE HERE.....WHO MURDERS PEOPLE BECAUSE OF THEIR RELIGION???????? Americans????? NO......Muslim Terrorists?
DING DING DING we have a winner....Hmmmm and they both want to kill jews.....wow what a coincidence.
PS I've never been called a Nazi in person but I have been called a "fascist" and a "baby killer" Both times I was in my Dress Blues at a shopping mall collecting toys for the Marine Corp's "toys for tots" progrom. Its ironic that idiots like these call us fascist when we do the exact oppisite of what a fascists does....we defend freedoms rather than repress them.
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LOL
A Canuck asking if Americans are a Modern or Backwards society....
*hands SLO a Mirror* What do you see?
:rolleyes:
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In many ways modern... in many other ways backward,
but it depends on which American you talk to.
Ravs
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Originally posted by ravells
In many ways modern... in many other ways backward,
but it depends on which American you talk to.
Ravs
I suppose that's a reasonable assessment. At any rate, it's home! :)
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I'm not trying to push this Nazi thing on any US soldier....
being a soldier by itself is a tough job....doing it in Iraq is even harder.....I have only respect for them....as a Sargent Major(Finrod) in my squad can attest too.
but abusing prisoners.....never mind creed, religion or political affiliation....just plain old beating the watermelon outta of em....
It does make your army look real bad too us who are outside of the U.S....and we perceive it as a backwards step...not a forward one.
by doing that, your giving ammunition to the lefties....
and Gunslinger...I told you not to get all high and mighty.
AWmac.....the actions against them prisoners spoke for itself....you do not need me too answer that question
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Originally posted by SLO
P.S......thx for the inside info VOR
You betcha.
It does make your army look real bad too us who are outside of the U.S....and we perceive it as a backwards step...not a forward one.
Understandable all things considered. Simply bear in mind that scandal and shock effect sell alot more commercial slots on the evening news than the humdrum day-to-day reality of things.
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Originally posted by VOR
Understandable all things considered. Simply bear in mind that scandal and shock effect sell alot more commercial slots on the evening news than the humdrum reality of things.
the old saying...if its not news worthy...its not news
thats why I asked my squaddie when he came back...the famous question
how was it over there....
sorry if it looked like I tried to pin that nazi thing on US soldiers....it really was not my intention.
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Originally posted by SLO
sorry if it looked like I tried to pin that nazi thing on US soldiers....it really was not my intention.
No worries, I didn't take it as such.
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Originally posted by SLO
and Gunslinger...I told you not to get all high and mighty.
well this post certainly had a smidge of intellegence to it compared to:
treating prisoners like dogs makes you look like a bunch of retards who have lowered there standards to the level of the NAZI's used in WW2.....
sorry but I will get high and mighty when you referr to the uniform I were to s Nazi's. I serve and still do....that gives me the right to correct an injustice.
Out of 300,000+ serviceman that served in Iraq less than .005%
centering yourself on this subject is also a step backwords.....the horse is dead....burry it and put it in the ground.
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Actually most damage to Iraq's electrical infrastucture was done during the Gulf War by the US strategic bombing campaign.
"The strategic air campaign included attacks on two traditional strategic targets, electric power and oil production facilities. On these targets planners sought only specific, limited damage, and the use of precision weapons brought rapid, decisive results. Within the first few days of the campaign, electric power was lost throughout the country, with only roughly 12 percent capacity remaining in remote areas. Similarly, oil-refining capacity was diminished to roughly ten percent capacity through the employment of only a few PGMs on the petroleum distillation towers. Such results dwarfed the accomplishments of any past bombing campaign against a like set of targets and demonstrated how precision weapons had changed the calculus of what bombing could accomplish against a country's infrastructure."
http://www.umanitoba.ca/centres/defence/aerospace%20power%20forum/keaney%20outline.htm
More info can also be found here.
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/gulf.war/unfinished/war/index1.html