Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: Panman on July 02, 2004, 07:58:58 AM
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This is the 1 plane I would like to see flying in AH2. Heck even perk it
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why?
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if i am not mistaken P61 was a night fighter ?
we dont have night in ah and turning up gamma stop s night.
if it staye dark and we didnt have dot dar then night fighters with radar would be good. we dont have large bomber missions in the dark , so no point really.
thats my thoughts
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P-61 was also armed to the teeth, maneuverable for its size, and fast. Even without radar it would make a nice twin heavy fighter/destroyer. Like an American Bf-110.
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366mph is fast? That is news to me.
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P61 performance always dissapointed me... Heck even late Ju88 based nightfighters had much better performance...
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p 61
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Its pretty when wearing black ..........but its a night fighter....it was very late war.......infact the US were to use Mossies in the Med because the P61 was late............
We do not do night well enough to add night fighters, we have no air borne radar modelled, our icons are not night ops freindly.
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why?
Why not? It was just an idea.
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Brits have mossie , germans the 110, why not the p-61 for us yanks?
Panman
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Originally posted by Panman
Brits have mossie , germans the 110, why not the p-61 for us yanks?
The US has the best heavy fighter of the lot, the P-38L Lightning.
AH needs more Russian and Japanese aircraft.
BTW, the Bf110G-2 and Mosquito Mk VI are not nightfighters. Neither had onboard radar and both entered service far earlier than did the P-61.
The German equivilent of the P-61 would be the Ju88G-7 or He219 and the British equivilent would be the Mosquito NF.30.
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The P-61b had a top speed over 370mph , Armed with 4- 50cals mounted in a dorsal turret and could be rotated 360 degrees & elevated to 90 degrees, plus 4-20mms in the ventral position. Along with the mossies it was used in the ETO to hunt V-1s.
Panman
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Panman states his reasons very well.
Originally posted by Panman
This is the 1 plane I would like to see flying in AH2. Heck even perk it
Originally posted by Panman
Brits have mossie , germans the 110, why not the p-61 for us yanks?
Panman
Originally posted by Panman
The P-61b had a top speed over 370mph , Armed with 4- 50cals mounted in a dorsal turret and could be rotated 360 degrees & elevated to 90 degrees, plus 4-20mms in the ventral position. Along with the mossies it was used in the ETO to hunt V-1s.
Panman
I am not sure why we always tend to jump at the chance to challenge someone when they make a request for a particular Airplane?
I done some research on the BF 110g 2 and found out something interesting.
The BF 110 was or had a version of a night fighter. Cool :)
Unfortunately I can’t find any tech data specifically on the 110g-2
The data I found showed that the different versions had max speeds from 342 to 354 mph.
The Aces High BF 110-G2 has a max speed of about. 370 mph. According to the AH web chart graph.
PS it would be nice if the tec Data in AH2 web charts (Speed and Climb) were in digital form ;)
The research i did would indicate the BF 110g 2 speed performance would fall roughly in the 350 mph range.
It seems that the P61 had similar speed performance.
What makes a Night Fighter a Night Fighter?
That Rig on the nose?
(http://home.earthlink.net/~mugz/images/BF110_nightfighter.jpg)
The P61 was Black. Is it the color that makes it a night fighter?
The Bf 110G-4/R7. was the "Night Fighter" version of the BF 110.
From time to time Bf 110G night fighters were used on day operations. They fought American day-bomber formations whenever the Americans flew unescorted. In the Day configuration it was known as the Messerschmitt Bf 110G-4.
Anyways... it was an interesting read.
And a nice request panman. I hope someday you will see your "Black Widow" in AH2
http://www.xs4all.nl/~fbonne/warbirds/ww2htmls/messbf110.html
http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/bf110g.html
http://www.russian.ee/~star/air/germany/me-110.html
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Mugzeee,
I'd like to see the P-61. I'd fly the P-61 now and then, though it is a bit slow. I think the P-61 would end up being the premier jabo aircraft in AH. The P-61 is one of the neatest looking aircraft from WWII.
What I object to, and it doesn't matter which aircraft it is about, is people misstating capabilities and making something out to be something it is not.
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I am not sure why we always tend to jump at the chance to challenge someone when they make a request for a particular Airplane?
People like to talk to hear their head rattle I guess. Like Panman would object if they added the Ki-43, Pe-2,and P-61 at one time. Like anyone would object, then again...........
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Originally posted by Karnak
Mugzeee,
I'd like to see the P-61. I'd fly the P-61 now and then, though it is a bit slow. I think the P-61 would end up being the premier jabo aircraft in AH. The P-61 is one of the neatest looking aircraft from WWII.
What I object to, and it doesn't matter which aircraft it is about, is people misstating capabilities and making something out to be something it is not.
I assume you are refering to this quote?
P-61 was also armed to the teeth, maneuverable for its size, and fast. Even without radar it would make a nice twin heavy fighter/destroyer. Like an American Bf-110. [/B]
I guees i read into the statement a little differently.
The part where it was said "maneuverable for its size"
lead me to belive the writer just jumbled the sentence a little...Like the "Fast" part was also taking into consideration the size of tha AC. I figured he meant to write it something like this. ( P-61 was also armed to the teeth, maneuverable and fast for its size.
But as far as Twin engine Heavy Attacker/Fighters go of this size and weight? The P61 could be considered fast.
:)
Originally posted by Panman
The P-61b had a top speed over 370mph ,
Panman
Awesome!! With the AH2 BF 110g-2 having a speed very close to the same...(370) This could make for some very fun fights between the two. :)
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P-61C had nice performance, but I don't believe it saw action.
PERFORMANCE
Maximum speed: 425 mph
Cruising speed: 275 mph
Range: 1,200 miles
Service Ceiling: 46,200 ft.
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The part where it was said "maneuverable for its size" Ive read that a few places.
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Originally posted by SunTracker
P-61C had nice performance, but I don't believe it saw action.
PERFORMANCE
Maximum speed: 425 mph
Cruising speed: 275 mph
Range: 1,200 miles
Service Ceiling: 46,200 ft.
WOW i just found the data
That is Fast indeed.
But i found coflicting info
P61 Tec Dat (http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/air_power/ap25.htm)
P61 Slower Data (http://www.military.cz/usa/air/war/fighter/p61/p61_en.htm)
On second look it appears that one of the P61s (The faster one)is showing 2,100 HP per engine. Where the slower one is showing 2x2000 Hp
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Panman,
I support the P-61 and have made the same suggestion a while ago. One important fact left out was the fact the the P-61B and P-61C had underwing racks that could carry 4 250gal drop tanks or 6,400lbs of bombs. Do we need a night fighter? No. Could the P-61 be used effectively as a heavy fighter bomber in AH2? Definately YES!
Regards,
Roman1
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I guess my 'fast' comment on the '61 came from me looking at the C-model data. Though the B model, as mentioned, is fairly nice for a large twin. And the portable M-16 turret on the roof is a nice feature :D
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P-61 could make a nice addition along with other night fighters, but have to cringe a bit at using it for jabo. Far as I know, was not used for that in real life. Kinda hate to see unrealistic uses in Aces High (like dive bombing B-17s).
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I stayed out of the fray here thinking my sig would be enough but I would like the P61 just because it's one of the koolest looking planes ever produced.
Add the bomb load to it and it will be one of my favorite rides.
Yeah, yeah I know it's useless as a night fighter in AH but so what. I don't care and I think that sums it up for most of it's fans.
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" I think the P-61 would end up being the premier jabo aircraft in AH."
Especially if it were modeled with the 4-gun turret.
Speaking of which, that reminds me about the missing gun on the A-20
J_A_B
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Jabo as such it wasn't,but one of the aims of night-time Intruder sorties was to cause enemy airfields to close, forcing inbound aircraft, possibly already low on fuel, to divert elsewhere.
Holes in runways and blazes in hangars helped the closing process along, also a clear indication that there was an Allied aircraft lurking about, so a bomb load is perfectly legit.
A real night war would be even more legit, but I reckon that's CT stuff.
Cheers,
Scherf
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No offence to anyone but the arguement against the P61 because it was a "night Fighter and we dont have night" is outright silly. And really an invalid arguement
Since when has a planes designed intent or even standard use count for much here?
B-17 was a High alt heavy bomber and I Saw first hand one of those dogfighting last night for crissakes. And being pretty dern effective at it I might add.
Something I HIGHLY doubt an empty one let alone fully loaded heavy bomber was capable of during the war. And even if it was technically capable of it. When was it ever done?
Since it was inbound I can only assume it had eggs
We also have 17's and Lancasters divebombing, and comming in at low and sometimes even under dar alts to make runs on bases. Something else that I highly doubt it did much of.
110's were traditionally bombers not fighters Yet I see people using them as a fighter all the time
The P61 would have alot of uses. And while it was designed ad primarily used as a night fighter it was also occasionaly used on strike and ground support missions during the daytime.
I could easily see it being used for air support against GVs.
Also it should have some sort of onboard dar that would be immune to HQ dar being knocked out. (local dar with a range of what the feild dar is)
True we may not have night But having no dar is basically the same thing in limiting your ability to know where enemy AC are
Make it a perked plane and almost that alone would give us reason to actually use it. Very few perked anything do we actually have a real need or reason to use other then simply for the novely of it.
To Balance out the planeset make the 110 version also.
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I stumbled across this page with links to several P61s.
Link to P-61s (http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/registry/p61registry/p61registry.html?p61-4239445.html&2)
(http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/registry/p61registry/images/p61-438353-1.jpg)