Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Swoop on November 25, 2000, 04:28:00 PM
-
....how people moan and complain about this game.
"It's the man, not the machine"
Someone famous said that, dunno who but he was right. What I'm getting at is this fixation with whining about certain aircraft, the Hog C, the N1k, the Spit IX, etc.....
It's amazing the things you see newbies do in this sim when you've been around for a while.......spits turning straight up and firing at ya from D1.5........B26s going head on with F4Us.....109s attacking B17s from dead 6 and wondering why they get shot down.....all kinds. 90% of A-A engagements are about who makes the 1st mistake......well I tell ya, I see plenty of mistakes in here.....
Now I don't really see what the fuss is all about.......when I see a F4U I think "Woo hoo, a big blue target" when I see a N1k I think "yippee, a slow bastard" when I see a Spit I think "ahha, a newbie" (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) But the point is there's no reason to fear one aircraft more than another.....it's all down to the pilot.
Now in a furball most people get shot down while chasing someone else. Bad SA, that's all (and lack of 6 calls). It's like being in a rugby scrum.....get stuck in and you'll be alright, hang about on the edges and you'll get hurt.
If you know the capabilities of your aircraft and the vulnerabilities of your enemy you'll do well. Monkeys who jump in an xxxxx and go spray and pray are not to be feared......
Yeah ok, there are some exceptions to this theory (like the 202....and those damn Ostwinds) but I still believe it's all down to the pilot. And in that damn main arena.....you easily tell if the pilot you're against is an expert or a newbie.....
Swoop
[This message has been edited by Swoop (edited 11-25-2000).]
-
That who has said that, has flown in real war with real planes... then it's up to man, but not that much in a game.
It might be the man also, but the plane sure does help alot.
-
Swoop, ok, I take your glove.
Take a Fw190A5 and I will take a n1K2.Same fuel loads. Your choice in weapons.Cold merge, co E. The best of 5 fights wins.
If I win you delete your message and instead you put there "niks are overmodelled,its the plane, not the dweeb on board" (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
If you win I delete this post and I put here what you want.
Wanna do it?.
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 11-25-2000).]
-
Please post your HTH challenges in Free Multiplayer Forum ram.
-
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
-
Originally posted by RAM:
Swoop, ok, I take your glove.
Take a Fw190A5 and I will take a n1K2.Same fuel loads. Your choice in weapons.Cold merge, co E. The best of 5 fights wins.
If I win you delete your message and instead you put there "niks are overmodelled,its the plane, not the dweeb on board" (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
If you win I delete this post and I put here what you want.
Wanna do it?.
B]
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/rolleyes.gif)
-
Originally posted by rosco-:
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/rolleyes.gif)
And your point is?...he states that the pilot is the difference...I am a lousy stick, and he is the one stating that the pilot is who makes the difference.
And I want to show him how wrong he is.
-
Well i still have no problem flying against N1K2 or F4u-C1.
Some people refuse to change there style of flying and instead, consistantly whine for HT to change the game around there needs.
Thats just the most rediculous thing ive ever heard of. Go stomp your feet and cry like a baby, the other 300 of us will enjoy this sim because we are enthusiasts, not whiners.
Please stop the whining about these AC and just change your flying style.
For 11 years i have been flying online now and i have adjusted to every single patch and upgrade in AW-DOS, WB and AH without the need to whine and cry like a baby.
Adjust, overcome , adapt.
Dog out.....
-
Swoop, i have to agree with you... it's the Man.
I would bet theres less than 5 people who play AH that accually flew any ww2 fighters, and know for sure.
Besides IRL it was way different, you had wingman tactics that won the fights NOT individualism. I would also bet IRL during ww2 you would seldom get a 1 vs. 1 co alt same E state, and if you did I would also bet BOTH ran.
I don't think the N1k2 is "UBER" in fact, I think it's nutered.
If this "game" (which it is) had a hypathetic 1 life per day, i bet Gameplay would be Completely different. People WOULD rely on wingmen,tactics and good SA, the way it should be. I'm also tired of the whines, at least during gameplay. IMO, the whines should be confined to the BBS, and let the people PLAY the game.
For those that don't like it and want a change, Post the problems on the BBS. I'm sure theres things that are wrong with AH, and HTC Always strived to fix things wrong, with speed that is unique for an Online sym, And let the People who plunk down their monies every month to enjoy it, without the constant personal rants about How the game Sucks for them. For every 1 person that thinks this is wrong or that is wrong there are 20 people who think this game is GREAT and enjoy playing it.
Now FLAME AWAY!
NUTTZ
-
RAM; a smart pilot would NEVER go co-E with a N1K2-J in the Fw 190A-5 in the first place. That's the difference Swoop is talking about - and you must know it. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
-
I'm also tired of the whines, at least during gameplay. IMO, the whines should be confined to the BBS, and let the people PLAY the game.
I totally agree with you Nuttz. I really wish people wouldent whine and use namecalling in the arena.
I dont like whining on the BBS either, but what to do if you actually think that there is something wrong?
------------------
GrinBird
-
Ok, smart guys... so you have nothing against if we Luftwobbles get the ME262 or the Ta152? Alrighty then... it's the pilot, yeah! That's why all WW2 participants pushed aircraft developement to the limit... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Ah yes, I have not problems with killing N1K2s... still I think there is something very wrong with its FM.
-
Originally posted by GrinBird:
...but what to do if you actually think that there is something wrong?
Here's an original idea:
1. State your hypothesis (what you think is wrong)
2. Post a reason why you think it is wrong and SUPPORT it with reliable performance data or testing and state your sources.
3. Leave out the namecalling and whining. Be polite, respect the effort that has gone into the game so far.
Guess that's what I would try. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
[This message has been edited by Toad (edited 11-25-2000).]
-
Exactly juzz (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Originally posted by RAM:
And your point is?...he states that the pilot is the difference...I am a lousy stick, and he is the one stating that the pilot is who makes the difference.
And I want to show him how wrong he is.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/rolleyes.gif)
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
-
I usually dont get into these posts but this time im gonna defend my squadmate
RAM You say ur a lousy pilot. Thats bull.
U and everyone else knows u are a very good pilot. There arent that many people to match u. I dont say this to swell ur head cause to tell u the truth its big enuf.
The only reason people have a problem with u RAM is cause u whine all the time. Not cause of ur flying. What does this have to do with this post?
Pit most persons against Swoop one on one and I guarentee u Swoop wins. If he doesnt he will have given them a fight they will tell their grandchildren about.
I have been in many fights against the "uber"
planes, and I've found that its not the plane its the person who flies them. Im no longer afraid of engaging an F4Uc because i know i can go faster or turn better vertically than him, depending on the plane im flying. Same thing with the NIK2, cept it's always that i know i can get away from it if i mess up. Again, its not the plane that makes mistakes......
its the pilot.
------------------
Kronos
CO No. 272 Squadron "Whispering Death"
http://members.home.net/wchiasson/no272/
-
oops ghost post second time (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
[This message has been edited by Kronos (edited 11-25-2000).]
-
Everyone gets their late war planes and prototype planes which never saw action adn we LW fans don't get the Dora or the TA152 or even the Me262,while we see niks that almost go supersonic .
I tested the N1k off-line and I did, get this, 550MPH on dive without the plane showing any signs of compression I have a film of it although I don't have a site to put it up since I don't know how to (if anyone kindly would take it I'll send it to you so everyone can see it ).
I also did a test on E bleed, did a 6+ turn on the horizontal plane without the nose diving and I didn't lose E at all in ANY case a plane at that sppeed pulling 6+ Gs should either brake up or stall from excesive strees on the aircraft airframe and induced drag!
On the guns lethality range fron I have not tested it but I can and will prove to everyone including HT the N1k FM is really messed up. For the simple fact even though your not a pilot or have never flown a plane if you know the basics of flight you can get that Gs plus stress =stall and reduced performance.
------------------
Glasses---I may have 4 eyes ,but you only have one wing.
-
We ever get a late war KI. You boys gonna forget all about them nik,s (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
-
Originally posted by Swoop:
[B
"It's the man, not the machine"
[/B]
Yup..I agree. As Nuttz did I too will post my stats (and my ride of choice is the 51):
P51
31 kills vs 16 by F4U-1C
24 kills vs 6 by Niki
Niki
1 kills vs 1 by P-51
0 kills vs 1 by Niki
0 kills vs 3 by F4U-1C
See? If it is the plane rather than the pilot, wouldnt my Niki automatically make me a better pilot? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Nope. Guess not.
-Ding
------------------
-Ding
33rd Strike Group
www.33rd.org
(http://home.cox.rr.com/mfritzlen/images/33rd2.gif)
-
....how people moan and complain about this game.
"It's the man, not the machine" (Big snip)
Are these posts a new marketing strategy? Ahahahahaah, LOL, sorry couldnt resist (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) Phewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww .....
------------------
GATT
4° Stormo Caccia - Knights (http://www.4stormo.it)
Macchi C.202's sting (1,9MByte film) (http://web.tiscalinet.it/gatt/breda.avi)
[This message has been edited by gatt (edited 11-26-2000).]
-
Originally posted by Swoop:
"It's the man, not the machine"
I'm not positive, but I think it was Chuck Yeager talking about the difference between the Mig 15 and the F 86 during the Korean conflict. Therefore your statement is overmodeled for this timeframe. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
(He backed it up too, in a captured mig.)
------------------
Greg 'wmutt' Cook
332nd Flying Mongrels
-
Glasses drooled:
Everyone gets their late war planes and prototype planes which never saw action adn we LW fans don't get the Dora or the TA152 or even the Me262
Bull toejam
I also did a test on E bleed, did a 6+ turn on the horizontal plane without the nose diving and I didn't lose E at all
Double Bull toejam
-
New strategy in AH's community to avoid people asking to fix a porked FM:
"its the man, not the machine".
Oh, of course. If the N1K2 is an UFO who cares?. As long as the pilot doesnt know to handle his UFO...
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/rolleyes.gif)
-
Blimey....loadsa responses.
Well firstly lemme say welcome back Ram. I quit reading the other thread cos it was getting silly but I didnt think you'd sod off completely.
Secondly, Ram's challenge........how can I put this, er, no. Reason being I've flown the 190A5 exactly once, never again. I'm British and damn proud of it, you'll hardly ever see me flying a Luftwobble plane......maybe the occasional 109. Besides, I never claimed to be the best (grrrr, my ego's complaining at that statement)........why dont you take on Mitsu? Oh yeah you cant, he's gone.
Thirdly, Glasses: Bollocks. I've compressed and died in N1Ks........did it only yesterday in fact. You're not going fast enough.
Swoop
-
Originally posted by Swoop:
Secondly, Ram's challenge........how can I put this, er, no. Reason being I've flown the 190A5 exactly once, never again. I'm British and damn proud of it, you'll hardly ever see me flying a Luftwobble plane......maybe the occasional 109. Besides, I never claimed to be the best (grrrr, my ego's complaining at that statement)........why dont you take on Mitsu? Oh yeah you cant, he's gone.
Its all right. Get a SpitIX or a tiffie or a SpitV. whatever.
And BTW Mitsu didnt say that "it was the pilot, not the plane", you said it. So I dont have to challenge him, but you, to show that you are wrong.
-
Originally posted by Glasses:
... a plane at that sppeed pulling 6+ Gs should either brake up or stall from excesive strees on the aircraft airframe and induced drag!....
Break up at 6 g's?
I think this little scientific tidbit is going to come as news to an awful lot of
ex-WW2 pilots.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Hey, Ram, what are you going to call your WW2 Flight Sim and when is it due out?
Maybe..."The World's Most Perfect WW2 Flight Sim" ?
Got any reliable N1K data that you can send Pyro to show him the error of his ways? While we wait for your sim I mean?
I missed your whining when you quit...but at least I didn't have to miss it for long, did I?
(http://smilecwm.tripod.com/net6/moon.gif)
[This message has been edited by Toad (edited 11-26-2000).]
[This message has been edited by Toad (edited 11-26-2000).]
-
Swoop, it's a proven fact that in today's society, people don't want to take personal responsibility. It's simply easier and less painfull to blame the game itself.
Fury
-
I am absolutely dumbfounded by all these replies. All I can say is that 90% of the time it IS the pilot, NOT the plane that has the skill... you know, the skill that you use to kill other planes with? I think most people use 'skill' every now and again... well I at least hope so! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
e.g. I've seen Citabria go up in all sorts of planes and I remember in particular him taking a 202 up.... and still getting a load of kills.... so don't tell me it isn't the pilot! I'm sure some will get exceptionally lucky against a very good pilot but mostly you'll lose out to their superior skill.
Anyway, I just hope HTC brings that Ta152 out or whatever, at least we won't be getting Luftwaffe whines all the time... but then perhaps we will... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/confused.gif)
'Nexx'
-
Replicant, when the Dora or TA-152 comes out, you can bet your bellybutton I'll whine.
I'll whine about the hundreds of InstantConverts to LW.
I'll whineabout that now, whenever someone sees a 190, they'll think "it's a dweeb d9".
The main advantage to being LW is that you get to fly planes that not so many dweebs fly - or rather, that doesn't award dweeby behaviour to a large extent.
I just hope they model the D9 historically - like a fast decent climbing A8.
------------------
StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
while(!bishRookQueue.isEmpty() && loggedOn()){
30mmDeathDIEDIEDIE(bishRookQueue.removeFront());
System.out.println("LW pilots are superior");
myPlane.performVictoryRoll();
}
-
never mind.
[This message has been edited by bowser (edited 11-26-2000).]
-
toad... i think that his game will be called "secret weapons of the luftwobble" or, subtitled... "how germany won the war". Bet he get's a lot of players to sign up and no one complains.
I don't get it. The Corsair is mediocre in AH and I can't see where the nik does anything that I wouldn't expect given it's wingloading and power. It is a very easy plane to kill cause it gets slow and tangled up with other planes. If you keep your speed up it can't catch you. Wait till the Hellcat, Frank, -4 Hog, and Ki61 show up. Face it.... Pacific planes were superior for arena type play if.... you play their game.
lazs
-
Nowadays I seldom see much point in giving an artificial edge to my opponent in a fight. (ie. fly an inferior plane just for the fun of it)
Maybe you people should just let it loosen a bit and stop being so fanatic about a single plane or a group of planes. Try out some new stuff once in a while, you might like it (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
In the past was a luftwobble of sorts but I've discovered that flying a niki,a chog or a 109G10 or whatever doesn't somehow bring a terrible change into dweebishness upon you (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif).
------------------
---
SageFIN
"The wolves are gathering, the stars are shifting...
come, join us in the hunt!"
---
-
1. State your hypothesis (what you think is wrong)
2. Post a reason why you think it is wrong and SUPPORT it with reliable performance data or testing and state your sources.
3. Leave out the namecalling and whining. Be polite, respect the effort that has gone into the game so far.
Excactly Toad good thinking! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Too bad its not enuf sometimes, because even if you follow the rules above people are free to call you a whiner and flame you badly. Well I guess thats the way it is, no reason to whine about that (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
It also happens that someone hijack your thread and make a whine&squeak thread out of it.
I made a very quiet and gentle post about the N1K in the Gameplay/feedback forum a couple of days after1.04 release. I just couldent understand why nobody had commented the "new" N1K yet, so I had to ask some questions. We had a good sound discussion about it in the thread for a couple of days, when suddenly a guy called memorychip or something like that started a N1K thread in the General forum and used an incredible whining and squeaking tone. He got over a 50 replies in a couple of hours when I had gotten 10-15 replies during 2-3 days by posting a question about the same topic in the correct forum (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) Later he also went into my thread and hijacked it.
My point? Sometimes its hard to follow your rules, because there allways will be someone who ignores the rules and takes all the attention. Thats the way it is also in real life allthough I think its a bit overmodelled in Aces High (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
------------------
GrinBird
-
The Spit IX is uber?
In the 3 Online games I've played I've heard this in each one of them. But I'll always remember this line from a really good Spity driver...
"The Spit is an easy plane to fly, but a difficult plane to fly well".
Lars
-
Grin,
In all these "discussions" I rarely see any posting of reliable information, test data or links to sources.
I see a lot of "I have a comic book about the Supershooter 33B and it says..."
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
I love a good discussion with source material!