Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: wrongwayric on July 11, 2004, 01:26:50 PM
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Well ya did it, after years of waiting,ya produced a game that has gone from semi-realism to the opposite! Guess the whiners won again!
Let's start with the fact that field fuel stays up, ooohhh way to stay real! If bombers cann't knock out the fields to limit the enemies ability to attack what's the point?!
Then you modeled the fighters to the point were nothing in the game really seems to kill them other than another fighter or a direct hit from a cv's aa gun.!
Maps are old and worn out, if your going to trash the realism aspect in the plane modeling the least ya could have done is gotten new maps up!
Then i hear your adding some new fighters but new bombers (B29's specifically) are not being added! Guess all the screaming for the b26 and others to be added just couldn't add up to all the vultch fest whiners.!
Personally i do not think the wait was worth it, of course all the vultch guys will reply with negative comments so once again the realism will go out of any argument that may happen.
Disgust,Dismay, and total dissatisfaction here!!!
Maybe i'll go play pong on the atari, least it stays within the boundaries it set.
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Come and try Il2 online - then you'll really get upset....
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Originally posted by wrongwayric
Let's start with the fact that field fuel stays up, ooohhh way to stay real! If bombers cann't knock out the fields to limit the enemies ability to attack what's the point?!
Fuel was never historically limited by destroying the fuel at the field. The point at which it was limited was always by limiting the supply of oil and, to a lesser degree, by damaging production capabilities.
I would like to see a good and functional strategic system added to AH2.
Originally posted by wrongwayric
Then you modeled the fighters to the point were nothing in the game really seems to kill them other than another fighter or a direct hit from a cv's aa gun.!
Yeah, it is soooo much less realistic to have to actually hit the aircraft you're shooting at in order to damage it. Lets go back to AH1 where near misses often counted as hits.
What? You were complaining about a lack of realism?
In WWII, fighters were, by far, the best way to destroy enemy aircraft. Bombers could not succeed unescorted.
Originally posted by wrongwayric
Maps are old and worn out, if your going to trash the realism aspect in the plane modeling the least ya could have done is gotten new maps up!
The maps are updated versions of the old maps ture. I too am looking forward to new maps done using the AH2 engine. Once they get the Terrain Editor out we should see some nice new maps.
The aircraft are more realistically modeled, not less. There are some issues, but you seem to have some odd ideas about realism.
Originally posted by wrongwayric
Then i hear your adding some new fighters but new bombers (B29's specifically) are not being added! Guess all the screaming for the b26 and others to be added just couldn't add up to all the vultch fest whiners.!
Where the heck did you hear this and why did you give it any credence? HTC never says what is coming until they have artwork for it, and sometimes (P-47D-30, P-47D-25 and Spitfire Mk XIV) not even then. The closest thing to a hint we've had was Pyro's "A fighter, a bomber and a tank" post in the "What four aircraft do you want to see next" thread. Note that Pyro included the word "bomber".
Originally posted by wrongwayric
Personally i do not think the wait was worth it, of course all the vultch guys will reply with negative comments so once again the realism will go out of any argument that may happen.
Disgust,Dismay, and total dissatisfaction here!!!
Maybe i'll go play pong on the atari, least it stays within the boundaries it set.
That is, of course, your perogitive. There are frusterating bugs remaining. However much of your angst seems to be based on faulty data.
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That's about what i expected first reply tells the tale, number 1 was not talking about oil, was talking about blowing up the availabel fuel at the airfield, obviously u must believe there is an endless supply line into the field!
Fuel had to be trucked in it didn't just magically reappear to launch the next wave of fighters, therefore you should be able to kill the fuel at an airbase! It takes time for supplies in every other aspect of this game why not fuel!
Then again u missed the point were, if you are actually playing the game in anything other than a fighter which from the way u replied i doubt, the modeling is total B.S..
Guess your one of the vultch masters who believes fighters are the only thing that belongs in the game. Sad, i actually thought this game was going to be fun with the new version, but they have take n 2 steps back and 5 to the side in my opinion.
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Originally posted by wrongwayric
That's about what i expected first reply tells the tale, number 1 was not talking about oil, was talking about blowing up the availabel fuel at the airfield, obviously u must believe there is an endless supply line into the field!
Fuel had to be trucked in it didn't just magically reappear to launch the next wave of fighters, therefore you should be able to kill the fuel at an airbase! It takes time for supplies in every other aspect of this game why not fuel!
Then again u missed the point were, if you are actually playing the game in anything other than a fighter which from the way u replied i doubt, the modeling is total B.S..
Guess your one of the vultch masters who believes fighters are the only thing that belongs in the game. Sad, i actually thought this game was going to be fun with the new version, but they have take n 2 steps back and 5 to the side in my opinion.
Apparently you are incapable of reading history or comprehending what I wrote.
Also, what is the connection between fuel and vultching? You seem fixated on that. 25% fuel was always plently to take off to defend a capped field, so there is no change in vultching except that the fuel multiplier has made many aircraft less able to remain on station to vultch.
You seem to hold the asinine opinion that the inability to pork the fuel at the field down to the point that offensive operations may not be run from said field in some way helps people who vultch.
Your positions are based not on and facts but entirely on your opinions and your opinions and capability to reason both appear to be garbage. I evidently wasted time replying to you in a reasonable fashion with the intention of giving you some information. However, it seem that you, like all idealogues, will not accept facts if they do not agree with your opinions and will then attempt to defame the bearer of said facts.
Quit. In my opinion, now, the game would be better off for it.
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Don't let the door hit you...Just be quiet as you leave please.
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Well Wrongway your whine, while completely over done by now and completely rebutted to death more times than I can read, still has some entertaining value.
Wrongway your name says it all. Fuel pork vs resupply was totally wrong in AHI. It stopped people from fighting and no matter what your forte' in the game is that is the main point. It should be hard to bomb things. It should be hard to capture fields and cities and it should create and environment where people are constantly engaging.
Could you imagine pong if the other player scored two points you didn't get to use your paddle for three turns. Pretty stupid huh.
What is your basis and expieriance for your rantings about the flight model? Are you a pilot do you have any real life expieriance?
God how people hate change lol.
Karnak your first post says it all but your second post, particulary at the end gets :aok :aok :aok from me LMFAO.
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Originally posted by wrongwayric
Well ya did it, after years of waiting,ya produced a game that has gone from semi-realism to the opposite! Guess the whiners won again!
Let's start with the fact that field fuel stays up, ooohhh way to stay real! If bombers cann't knock out the fields to limit the enemies ability to attack what's the point?!
Then you modeled the fighters to the point were nothing in the game really seems to kill them other than another fighter or a direct hit from a cv's aa gun.!
Maps are old and worn out, if your going to trash the realism aspect in the plane modeling the least ya could have done is gotten new maps up!
Then i hear your adding some new fighters but new bombers (B29's specifically) are not being added! Guess all the screaming for the b26 and others to be added just couldn't add up to all the vultch fest whiners.!
Personally i do not think the wait was worth it, of course all the vultch guys will reply with negative comments so once again the realism will go out of any argument that may happen.
Disgust,Dismay, and total dissatisfaction here!!!
Maybe i'll go play pong on the atari, least it stays within the boundaries it set.
[/COLOR]
Holy crap! :lol :aok
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Originally posted by wrongwayric
Guess your one of the vultch masters who believes fighters are the only thing that belongs in the game.
I agree vultching is boring...but I see less vultching now in AH2 than before. Partly that's because fuel can't be porked.
BTW, I hope you were not thinking that AH1 was realistic strat or something. IMO, and I think I speak for many here, AH is a flight simulation, but a strategy game. Not a strat simulation. So strat parameters can and should be adjusted to make a better game. Less fuel porkage is a good example of such an improvement, one reason being it REDUCES vultching.
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(http://www.swifttechsoftware.com/uh_oh.jpg)
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pretty funny stuff here, losts of guys taking blood pressure medicine. By the way, in one day after playing pong i had figured out the proper way to hit the ball then position the paddle to keep the ball in play with no player input requierd. Left game on for 2 days! Mom was pissed! LOL
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Originally posted by wrongwayric
Well ya did it, after years of waiting,ya produced a game that has gone from semi-realism to the opposite! Guess the whiners won again!
Let's start with the fact that field fuel stays up, ooohhh way to stay real! If bombers cann't knock out the fields to limit the enemies ability to attack what's the point?!
Then you modeled the fighters to the point were nothing in the game really seems to kill them other than another fighter or a direct hit from a cv's aa gun.!
Maps are old and worn out, if your going to trash the realism aspect in the plane modeling the least ya could have done is gotten new maps up!
Then i hear your adding some new fighters but new bombers (B29's specifically) are not being added! Guess all the screaming for the b26 and others to be added just couldn't add up to all the vultch fest whiners.!
Personally i do not think the wait was worth it, of course all the vultch guys will reply with negative comments so once again the realism will go out of any argument that may happen.
Disgust,Dismay, and total dissatisfaction here!!!
Maybe i'll go play pong on the atari, least it stays within the boundaries it set.
Sounds like a Vossism:D
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wrongwayric :
(http://www.matthewmodine.com/pictures/ermy_yelling.jpg)
Shut your disgusting pie hole, whiner!
:rofl
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But let's not turn this into a flamefest
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Sorry, just tired of everyone whining about how "bad" AH is now.
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NP, we know it ain't so
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:)
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Originally posted by Karnak
Fuel was never historically limited by destroying the fuel at the field. The point at which it was limited was always by limiting the supply of oil and, to a lesser degree, by damaging production capabilities.
I would like to see a good and functional strategic system added to AH2.
That is kinda true but not entirely. overall for an extended period yes it did not limit the fuel
The fuel if destroyed at a base would limit it yes but only long enough for the next shipment to arrive the time of which could be almost negligable
HOWEVER the bombing of fuel storage and production Facilities did have an impact as fuel can only be produced so fast and is not infinate
But
We dont have that kind of strat now.
But if we did the bombing of such facilities woud not be limited to frontline bases alone but rather the entire country.
What I think we should do is go back to the old fuel porking abilities. BUT
Let its rebuilding/resupply times be directly tied to how damaged the storage and supply facilities are.
Have fuel, no matter how porked it is stay down for only say 5 minutes if neither of the storage and suppliy facilities are damaged.
Have its down time directly related to how damaged these facilities are
Say if fuel is porked
Undamaged facilities = 5 min rebuild time
10% damage=6 min
20% damage=7 Min
and so on with a max time down of say 20 min under the worst of circumstances which would be both Storage and Production facilities 100% destroyed.
and/ORRR have front line bases be the first to be ressuplied so that no front line base remains porked for more then 10- 15 min
This would simulate the supplies going to where they are most needed
this should also apply to ammo and barracks
5 min rebuild time is almost negligable
This would also give the facilities some meaningful purpose to both attack and defend which they currently do not have
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Originally posted by phookat
I agree vultching is boring...but I see less vultching now in AH2 than before. Partly that's because fuel can't be porked.
. Less fuel porkage is a good example of such an improvement, one reason being it REDUCES vultching.
It can be argued what kind of game Flight Sim/ WWII combat/Strat AH is for eternity and I dont think its going to change anyones mind. It certainly started as a "flight sim" But it has since evolved to be much more then just that IMO. For different people its different things.
For some, and yea maybe most. Its as flight Sim or to be more to the point a Dogfighting Sim.
For others its overall combat, land sea and air. For others the strat is the game. Without strat there is no use for bombers other then to fly around and get shot at.
But none of this is really my point here.
What I really would like to know is How less fuel porkage reduces vulching?
I just dont see it. Even with only 25% fuel you could up in a YAK and defend a feild from being vulched.
Fuel porking may hurt the furballers somewhat and that point I wont argue. But
Fuel porking has ZERO to do with stopping vulching.
Even a base with 125% fuel can be vulched if overwhelmed by numbers or caught by surprise.
I see it all the time.
Feild ack and VH has far more to do with reducing vulching then Fuel ever did.
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I have yet to be vultched in AHII...
I must be doing something wrong.
:confused:
-Sik
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Originally posted by Karnak
Fuel was never historically limited by destroying the fuel at the field. The point at which it was limited was always by limiting the supply of oil and, to a lesser degree, by damaging production capabilities.
Very well put.
Originally posted by Karnak
I would like to see a good and functional strategic system added to AH2..
Here Here. Couldnt agree more. Im thinking the Down Times of factories, Convoy spawn intervals and other elements in the strat rebuild system need tweaked a bit.
Originally posted by Karnak
Yeah, it is soooo much less realistic to have to actually hit the aircraft you're shooting at in order to damage it. Lets go back to AH1 where near misses often counted as hits...
Near Misses were not counted as hits as far as i can determine. The targets were just more of a bloob making them larger.
the bullets still hit the target.
wrongwayric... The thread Link below might give you more insight on this subject.
Originally posted by Pyro
AH has never used a "hit bubble". AFAIK, that's only ever existed in AW. What has changed between AH1 and AH2 is the hit resolution. AH1 had finite hit resolution and AH2 doesn't(for all practical purposes, I really don't know if it works down at the micron level).
And later Pyro posted this to the same thread.
Originally posted by Pyro
Hit resolution is not quite the right term. I guess target resolution would be a more accurate description. In AH1, there was a granularity to it which you don't have in AH2.
http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=119802&referrerid=7566
Salute.
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I heard that AH2 had become the dream game for Vultches and got all excited!!!!
Then I found out it was all a scam - AGAIN. the Ammo load still isn't unlimited, my 109 still doesn't have the 10x20mm Cannon loadout I'm looking for, I STILL can't see through the darned dashboard or tail of the aircraft and the bouncy rubber runways that I have asked for again and again still haven't been installed.
Will Hightech never listen???
- SEAGOON :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by DJ111
Sorry, just tired of everyone whining about how "bad" AH is now.
So stop coming to the message boards whining about whiners. Weener...err Whiner :D
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It's rare that I find a vulch anymore. Bombers can take out fighters just as easily as other fighters. The fuel aspect is odd to me, but it was really a tad to easy to kill, 1 fighter could pork fuel to 25%. I don't necessarily agree with the 75% fuel limit, but thats not my call. IMO Hitting hangars is just as good as hitting fuel. Hell mind as well just hit the hangars and prevent ANY fighters from getting off the ground. Acks take out fighters easily as well, I do however see that planes can stick in ack a bit longer, but lingering around in there just leads to your death. Ya know AAA was not always 100% accurate with their shots. ;) Bombers still play their critical roll in inhibiting fighters/bombers from flying by destroying hangars, and are deffenetly great town killers. I can't really respond to your vulch theory, maybe we fly for different countries, but I hardly ever find a vulch. Also I've heard on numerous occasions that HT is designing new fighters AND bombers, who are we to judge what they come out with first? It's their job to make us happy, but if the mass of people want fighters, thats probably the first thing to come out, its simple business 101. HT will model bombers as well, be patient.
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Originally posted by wrongwayric
Left game on for 2 days! Mom was pissed! LOL
ROFL y'as arguin' with a child.
Pretty sure you won't get an intelligent debate out of someone who was learning to ride their Huffy while I was learning to fly in Air Warrior.
Just an opinion.
p.s. wrongwayric i'm in the Training Arena lot's now, and would be happy to help show you how to kill those pesky planes in the air.
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Sound to me like sombody's a little tiffed cause everything isn't going his way to me.
wrongwayric, I hope you don't ever fly a real A/C, cause you just might find that your enemy doesn't typs after a good fight, he's out to kill you for real,
And believe it or not in real life you MUST HIT THE AIRCRAFT, SEVERAL TIMES TO DESTROY IT. unless you use a sidewinder. Hitting around the aircraft is great if your in an flak cannon, but kinda suks for you if your dogfighting a mig, cause trust me I speak from experience, if he's behind you, he's aiming at YOU, not a little bubble around you.
Let me tell you something about HTC, they're doing a dam good job at what they do, and if you don't like it, may I suggest that you delete your account and go play pong