Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: elc7367b on July 28, 2004, 01:39:02 PM
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Just curious, does anyone out there have any opinions on illegal immigration? Does anybody care? More information to follow depending on responses.
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Well I will bite.
illegal immigration is illegal and i think anyone who tries to immagrate illegaly should be barred from ever becoming a citizin
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All immigrants, legal or not, should stop by my office, and pay my boss a hundred bucks to sort it all out.
-Sik
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Thanks for responding Trell. I am a Border Patrol Agent and have been dealing with this problem for some time. There are a lot of fine men and women busting their tails to put a dent in this problem all along our border. I am just interested in an informal discussion with those interested concerning the problem and should be able to give some insight to those unfamiliar or unconcerned about what is going on.
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It's a major problem and one that affects the "jobs" situation far up the chain.
Note that both parties really don't want to talk about it or actually do anyting about it.
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The way we allow illegal immigrants to roam free is insane. It would be so easy to stem the flow: just start prosecuting those who hire illegal immigrants, nail them with hefty fines. Pretty soon no one would hire them and they would stay on their side of the border. We have poor people of our own who need jobs, we don't need to import even poorer people.
ra
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It may be the biggest issue in California today. Some estimate 2 million illegals are in CA as we speak.
The border patrol (12 guys) made sweeps out of the Temecula office recently that netted over 400 illegals. These sweeps were stopped by the Bush administration and the DHS.
I think the Dept. of Homeland Security should help keep our homeland secure.. instead thinking up cool color schemes.
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Put the National Guard on the boarders. And deport those we catch already here. No appeals.
The last number I heard was that 13000 a day cross the boarder.
Hospitals all long the boarders are going bankrupt dealing with the free medical they have to hand out. Soon there will no longer be hospitals for the citizens in these areas.
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It goes beyond that stuff.
Remember the flap about allowing in IT folks because "no qualified US IT people were available"? All the while there were thousands of US IT people getting laid off, unable to find jobs. That's "illegal immigration" the way I see it.
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http://english.pravda.ru/mailbox/22/101/399/13516_Threat.html
A sobering and scary development is allegedly taking place along the southwest border of the United States.
In Arizona, in the area the many refer to as the Naco Strip, our international border with Mexico has become a primary route of illegal entry by significant numbers of Arab-speaking males. The porous frontier, harried U.S. government officials say, is beginning to look a lot like the left lane on a European Autobahn. It doesn"t take a master spy to conclude that we may be seeing a large-scale influx of al Qaeda terrorists into the country.
http://www.tombstonetumbleweed.com/tombstone/Sections/thisweek/00TWO%20GROUPS%20OF%20MIDDLE-EASTERN%20INVADERS%20CAUGHT%20IN%20COCHISE%20COUNTY%20IN%20PAST%20SIX%20WEEKS.htm
TWO GROUPS OF MIDDLE-EASTERN INVADERS CAUGHT IN COCHISE COUNTY IN PAST SIX WEEKS
Information officer Andy Adame, from the Border Patrol Tucson sector says, I guarantee its not true.
However, seasoned Border Patrol field agents have shared some disturbing information with the Tumbleweed as well as other civilian sources with the hope the information will make it to the general public.
The Tumbleweed has verified information that a flood of middle-eastern males have been caught entering the country illegally east of Douglas, Arizona. The increased patrols in the Huachuca Mountains area of Cochise County, seems to have diverted the flow of OTMs, other than Mexicans east to the Chiricahua Mountains.
Adame, who says many of the agents in the area are green, questions why they would have shared the information with the Tumbleweed or any other source. Our policy is to turn any OTMs over to the FBI and the Department of Homeland Security, Adame said in a phone call made to the Tumbleweed Wednesday morning.
For reasons of National security, Adame said his agency cannot talk about the origin of nationaity, however Adame says that since October 1, 2003, the beginning of the fiscal year for Border Patrol, agents in the Tucson sector have apprehended 5,510 illegals from countries other than Mexico or other central or South American countries. Adame described them as people from all over the world.
In the last month, the Tumbleweed has confirmed at least two documented accounts of Border Patrol agents encountering large groups of non-Spanish speaking males in the Chiricahua foothills and on trails along the high mountain areas.
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every illegal should be sent back across the border with a custom collar fitted around their neck. This collar like the one from the Running Man will explode if they ever come across the US border again...
that and increasing the budget to send the existing illegals packing would solve all problems! :D
Vote for BODHI 2004
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You mean the ilegal mexicans or the ilegal canadians?
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I think immigrants are what make this country strong.
Illegal immigrants are essentially cutting in line in front of the people who have made various sacrifices to immigrate legally, and it's just not right.
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Originally posted by ra
... Pretty soon no one would hire them and they would stay on their side of the border.
Of course not. They'll still stay here but instead of working for low wages they'll furher drain out welfare system.
You have to punish both the employer and the illegal dude, but first and foremost control the border and deny all and any services to illegals already here.
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Originally posted by Chairboy
I think immigrants are what make this country strong.
Illegal immigrants are essentially cutting in line in front of the people who have made various sacrifices to immigrate legally, and it's just not right.
Agreed. No one is arguing against the immigration per se, but it has to be a controlled process.
1. legal
2. controlled pace of it so we can absorb the influx
3. required assimilation (no services in other languages)
4. dump this idiotic diversity/bilingual education crap and bending over to accommodate groups that want to balkanize this country. You wanna came and live here? Ok, but you have to become an American. If you want to remain Mexican/Cuban/Polish or French stay where you are.
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easiest way to get rid of the illegal immigrants is to make them all legal
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Originally posted by vorticon
easiest way to get rid of the illegal immigrants is to make them all legal
now, that's an idea. While we're at it we can also eliminate all crime. Wouldn't we all want that?
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Originally posted by type_char
You mean the ilegal mexicans or the ilegal canadians?
Or the illegal Americans....:D
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Originally posted by Bodhi
every illegal should be sent back across the border with a custom collar fitted around their neck. This collar like the one from the Running Man will explode if they ever come across the US border again...
that and increasing the budget to send the existing illegals packing would solve all problems! :D
Vote for BODHI 2004
I agree. My original post was going to be to set up machine gun posts on the borders, but your idea is much better.
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Well to say the least it's a complex problem , in my point of view anyway . So instead of offering an uninformed opinion of what should be done <----cuz i have no idea at what the options are , i'll offer up insight on who they are. And this pertains to mexican's , not terriorist's .
They are people just like us , workers , family men , drug dealers , gang bangers , ect. Many come up just to break front line laws , killing , theiving , ect. domestic terrorizim is what i call it . Many come up just to feed thier family across the border and these are the one's i'll focus on here . I put myself in thier shoe's cuz i can .
What If i were busting my arse fighting for jobs that arnt there , for money worth less than dirt to feed a family i love and hoplessly failing at evey turn .
What if my buddy joe-bob came and said we could sneak across the border to work for say 110k a year . Ya know , bout 10 ta 15 times what i can make here IF i could land a job .
Would i not try ? What's the worst that can happen ? I get busted , sent back and try again ? No the worst that can happen is that I'd have ta scape up a years local wages to pay someone to sneek me across , have 30 people cramed into a space fit for five , no food , no water and eventualy no air , or burn in a firey crash .
And then when or if i get there I'm treated like shat, forced to live in a spider hole , get screwd out of half my wages and am on the local hit list by some redneck who's insight can't see past the bottom of a beer bottle .
And then ( and this is the thing i like best ) come back and do it again next year .
Would we not do the same if positions were revesed ?
Please don't missunderstand me , I AM NOT DEFENDING illegal imagration .
But who can fault those who come with honest intentions . I can,t becuz i would do the same thing .
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Originally posted by mietla
now, that's an idea. While we're at it we can also eliminate all crime. Wouldn't we all want that?
sure is ;)
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Originally posted by tony barnes
But who can fault those who come with honest intentions . I can,t becuz i would do the same thing .
Stealing bread is still a theft.
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Al-Qaida Suspect Arrested in Texas
(http://www.wtopnews.com/index.php?nid=104&sid=236719)
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Originally posted by Toad
It's a major problem and one that affects the "jobs" situation far up the chain.
Note that both parties really don't want to talk about it or actually do anyting about it.
i lost my high paying melon picking job to illegals. that why i was forced into construction work. i miss the 14 hour days in the sun and rain. the $2.00 per hour wages. ahhh the good ole days. i think we should stop it by building a iron curtain type wall across the U.S.- Mexican border. i would hire mexican contractors to build it, they would definately compleat it on time and under budget.
:aok
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Oh, how sarcastic of you. And how witty.
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If there were no illegals to take the melon picking job, do you think the farmers would totally get out of the melon business or do you think perhaps they'd be willing to pay more?
And if melon picking jobs started paying as much or more than construction jobs, what do you think would happen to construction wages when folks left construction jobs to pick melons?
What do you think of the idea of legislatively raising the minimum wage? Good or bad?
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Originally posted by elc7367b
Just curious, does anyone out there have any opinions on illegal immigration? Does anybody care? More information to follow depending on responses.
I feel sorry for them.
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Originally posted by mietla
Stealing bread is still a theft.
by the look's of your pic you could use some theft lol (j/k)
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Originally posted by bigsky
i lost my high paying melon picking job to illegals. that why i was forced into construction work. i miss the 14 hour days in the sun and rain. the $2.00 per hour wages. ahhh the good ole days. i think we should stop it by building a iron curtain type wall across the U.S.- Mexican border. i would hire mexican contractors to build it, they would definately compleat it on time and under budget.
:aok
But if we hire them to build the wall, that is construction work, and that is what you do! So you advocate people replacing you in your job... how benevolent of you. You may be intrested in how many drywall hangers are illegals now.
What we need to do is a guest worker program. You show up at the US Guest Worker Office in Mexicali, put down your name and skill on the list, then those on the US side of the border come down abnd hire so many farm workers or dry wall hangers. Like getting workers from th union hall.
Employers must meet a minimum standard for working conditions, employment periods are controlled, those who give birth under the guest worker program do not have citizenship automatically granted to children, and guest workers could earn points toward eventual citizenship.
A modicum of control could be achieved, coyotes could be run out of business, no more people cooked in a box truck in the Sonoran summer heat, win - win.
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Originally posted by JBA
The last number I heard was that 13000 a day cross the boarder.
damn...
13000 potential terrorists every day? and you worried about some nutjob in a galaxy far far away called saddam?
jesus....that would double our population in 346 days and afew hours (unless the first once made some babies)
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Originally posted by tony barnes
I put myself in thier shoe's cuz i can .
What If i were busting my arse fighting for jobs that arnt there , for money worth less than dirt to feed a family i love and hoplessly failing at evey turn.
What if you're an American in that exact situation who got laid off and can't find work because they hired three aformentioned illegals for old your job?
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Originally posted by Nilsen
damn...
13000 potential terrorists every day? and you worried about some nutjob in a galaxy far far away called saddam?
Prevention is sometimes the best medicine, especially considering how long he ignored UN resolutions, and sought yellow cake, and committed genocide on his own people.
Funny how the Democrats/Socialists in this country critisized GB1 for not "going all the way to Bagdad" and removing Saddam in GW1. Now that we have, they critisize GWB for doing so.
Can't have it both ways.
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Prevention is sometimes the best medicine, especially considering how long he ignored UN resolutions, and sought yellow cake, and committed genocide on his own people.
Funny how the Democrats/Socialists in this country critisized GB1 for not "going all the way to Bagdad" and removing Saddam in GW1. Now that we have, they critisize GWB for doing so.
Can't have it both ways.
prevent you can sicknes if you wash your hands before you eat, or take vitamines.
Prevent strike is BS, Hitler and Stalin did prevent war against Poland and whats happend later?
How about prevent lock in jail all drivers over 21, beucose they can drive and buy alkochol? and can cose drunk drivers accident
How about eliminate all childrens who ever hold any gun to prevent secound Colimbine?
How about close all aircraft factories and ground all planes , beucose somone can use it as weapont to attck our citties?
a hell
how about prevent people from killing each others and and lock all of them?
how about doing prevent brain surgery for som AHBB users? to bright his mindes?
you guys have no idea whats mean to be illegal
you dont knkow how paintful can be **** up by smart american employee who still money for your work. And foull you beucose you are illegal.
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all the reasons to craclk down on illegal aliens are good ones.
The only reason given to allow illegals (pick our melons) is silly. We used to have 40 mexicans on a tomato sorter when things were more lax and there were no wage laws. Now we have 2 on the same pece of equipment... lasers do the job and do it better.
get rid of the illegals and we will get better mellon picking equipment.
I think that most people rfeel this way about the illegals but are afraid.
The threat of terrorism is a good excuse for some brave politician to take a stand and tighten up the borders. He will win by a landslide.
lazs
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Originally posted by jigsaw
What if you're an American in that exact situation who got laid off and can't find work because they hired three aformentioned illegals for old your job?
Get out of the janitorial industry?
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Originally posted by JBA
Put the National Guard on the boarders. And deport those we catch already here. No appeals.
The last number I heard was that 13000 a day cross the boarder.
Hospitals all long the boarders are going bankrupt dealing with the free medical they have to hand out. Soon there will no longer be hospitals for the citizens in these areas.
Send them back to come back again? Nah, have to come up with something better. They will keep trying. It is a tough job.
Karaya
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Originally posted by lazs2
get rid of the illegals and we will get better mellon picking equipment.
take another loan and pay from this equipment by the next 5 years, rise prices and cannot sell his product due high prices.
meanwhile somone in china will establish plantation with lots of cheap chineese workers picking up melons. Send that product to US and sell for much lower price.
And everybody will be happy to buy cheap product made by china beucose is cheap (like everything else here)
So gov will earn money from custom, som folks who trade with china. And american empoye will left with expencive equipment on the field and loan and bills to pay.
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If farmers can't survive against foreign competition without illegal labor, let them go bankrupt. Dozens of countries would love to sell us farm products.
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Nope... ramzey and mz are both incorrect... probly don't live in farming country.
In the case of the laser sorters... the equipment is no more expensive than the old equipment... the savings are immense. Most farm equipment is obsolete anyway in a short time as new and more efficient equipment comes on board.
less and less migrant (much less illegals) are seen in farm country every year. Farming will not even want them in a few years.
farming is not a good excuse for allowing people to break the law anymore.
Point is... it is illegal now. it needs to be stopped or... made legal. There is no reason that makes sense to allow it to go on as an illegal activity that is enforced sporadicly and unevenly.
lazs
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Lose the illegals, crack down on welfare and let the welfare losers pick the tomatoes.
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Originally posted by mosgood
Lose the illegals, crack down on welfare and let the welfare losers pick the tomatoes.
come one thay are to lazzzy to get swet, better is watch TV, drink beer, and complain about illegals ;)
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Originally posted by lazs2
Point is... it is illegal now. it needs to be stopped or... made legal. There is no reason that makes sense to allow it to go on as an illegal activity that is enforced sporadicly and unevenly.
lazs
do you ever read immigration conditions to US?
its allow to bring somone by your family connections , highest educated persons who have good invention
or "politics" refuges from war zones
what with those who not have family here and are not polliticall refuges. Not everyone can be Einstein but can felt in love to U.S.
what with those who are just regular peoples who like to live here as everybody else. We like to fix the world but we not like to have this people here. We are "big brother " who tell them what to do but thats is no rule for us?
Is that still land of the free? sure but not for everyone, only for this who have luck and familly connections ?
I bet , 99% of illegall alliens will defence this country with full sucrifice, 100% like to be here legall even without full benefits from gov. They like to pay taxes, pay for medical coverage etc , etc
but better for citizens is to have illegal nanny with PHD, then pay her as for citizen worker.
Allways employer who hire illegal can show him for friends or customers , as monkey mopping floor and laugh from person who know 3 languages and have fine skills.
Better is for gov to spend money for law enforcment, hire clerks let groove institution like INS, then naturalise thos peoples and let them live and pay taxes. ( btw even if somone is illegal, he still pay taxes when go to shop or take gas)
anyway, you guys afraid people who like to work hard, harder then you, you not afraid mexicans who mostly take low skills jobs
I bet NOONE who read this forum, EVER will take 5/h $ job in full sun, or go to cut grass around houses and apartments.
Just to have work, welfer is much better ;)
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any nation that doesnt understand that its borders need to be controlled stands in defiance of logic. if other nation had same problem us had with neighboring nation where several thousand people a day entering undocumented and unscreened you can bet the response would be more effective in terms of fixing the problem.
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Tough problem.
Land of Opportunity vs Secure jobs
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Elc7367 just a reply
I want to thank you for the difficult job you do.I realize you are getting kicked in the teeth by the democrates,and slugged in the stomach by republicans. I think you are from texas so you may not know that in so.ca.at 3;00 pm on kfi radio there are 2 guys ken and bob [not sure of name] that are really trying to help you guys.They are getting national coverage now,most of it not good but they have a very large following. They have a movement going to try to get a republican congressman defeated in a safe seat area to send the word out on the border problem.So far it is scaring most of them as we are republicans also.They had the senior senator and attorn.gen of texas on last week I probaly heard most of what you are going to say.I posted what they said and got lambasted by the normal suspects here.
If you can dont stop, some of us are trying ,besides most of these left wing goofs in here dont believe the terriost are crossing over much less infiltrating our small cities. You may be our first line of defence,again thank you for your service.
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It's John and Ken.
http://www.johnandkenshow.com/
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Ramzey tell us all, mexicos solution to people trying to cross their southern border.Maybe, what is good for the goose is good for the gander....would you like that?
Midnight is right,and he is not 1 of the normal suspects so see elc. you have help from boths sides of isle.
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Originally posted by Martlet
I agree. My original post was going to be to set up machine gun posts on the borders, but your idea is much better.
Heck, just put up a mine field. Works 24/7. Of course we'll have warning signs in different languages. anyone that's lucky enough to get through gets registered for citizenship. This way we can collect taxes on them.
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Originally posted by demaw1
Ramzey tell us all, mexicos solution to people trying to cross their southern border.Maybe, what is good for the goose is good for the gander....would you like that?
Midnight is right,and he is not 1 of the normal suspects so see elc. you have help from boths sides of isle.
sure, all countries do that
but noone have so great ideas to kill people crossing borders or build concentrations camps for them. Noone propose death penality for "recidivists" as som peoples on this forum did (som time ago)
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Originally posted by elc7367b
Just curious, does anyone out there have any opinions on illegal immigration? Does anybody care? More information to follow depending on responses.
This story was aired on KFI am radio three days ago.
TWO GROUPS OF MIDDLE-EASTERN INVADERS CAUGHT IN COCHISE COUNTY IN PAST SIX WEEKS
Information officer Andy Adame, from the Border Patrol Tucson sector says, “I guarantee it’s not true.”
However, seasoned Border Patrol field agents have shared some disturbing information with the Tumbleweed as well as other civilian sources with the hope the information will make it to the general public.
The Tumbleweed has verified information that a flood of middle-eastern males have been caught entering the country illegally east of Douglas, Arizona. The increased patrols in the Huachuca Mountains area of Cochise County, seems to have diverted the flow of OTM’s, “other than Mexicans” east to the Chiricahua Mountains.
Adame, who says many of the agents in the area are “green”, questions why they would have shared the information with the Tumbleweed or any other source. “Our policy is to turn any OTM’s over to the FBI and the Department of Homeland Security,” Adame said in a phone call made to the Tumbleweed Wednesday morning.
For reasons of National security, Adame said his agency cannot talk about the origin of nationaity, however Adame says that since October 1, 2003, the beginning of the fiscal year for Border Patrol, agents in the Tucson sector have apprehended 5,510 illegals from countries other than Mexico or other central or South American countries. Adame described them as “people from all over the world”.
In the last month, the Tumbleweed has confirmed at least two documented accounts of Border Patrol agents encountering large groups of non-Spanish speaking males in the Chiricahua foothills and on trails along the high mountain areas.
On or about the early morning hours of June 13, 2004 Border patrol agents from the Willcox station encountered a large group of suspected illegal border crossers, estimated to be around 158, just east of the Sanders Ranch near the foothills of the Chiricauha Mountains. 71 suspected illegal aliens were apprehended; among them were 53 males of middle-eastern descent.
According to a Border Patrol field agent, the men were suspected to be Iranian or possibly Syrian nationals. “One thing’s for sure: these guys didn’t speak Spanish and after we questioned them harder we discovered they spoke poor English with a middle-eastern accent; then we caught them speaking to each other in Arabic…this is ridiculous that we don't take this more seriously, and we’re told not to say a thing to the media, but I have to,” said the agent, who spoke to the Tumbleweed with the promise of anonymity.
Adame confirms the groups of illegals were apprehended on those dates in the same area but stated, “There were no middle easterners in the group. Every single one of them was Mexican.”
The field agent stated the men were wearing the traditional uniform of migrants - baseball caps, tennis shoes, some had work boots, denim jeans and many had t-shirts with patriotic American flags and slogans. The agent added the following description “A curious thing I noticed was that they all had brand new clothing and they looked as if they had just been to the barber shop--you know--new haircuts. They were clean cut and they all had almost the exact same cut of mustaches.”
The information was corroborated by a local rancher in the area who reports that sightings of groups similar to these are on the rise. The rancher reports that groups of heavily armed paramilitary drug smugglers have also been seen in the same area.
“We’ve had groups in the hundreds coming through again. They were gone for awhile but now they're back. And of course we have the drug mules again and many are carrying automatic weapons. Many other ranchers in the area have been frustrated with the lack of response from Border Patrol. After calling over and over again to the Willcox headquarters, we might get a response a few hours later. We call them in to the Border Patrol, we only have the Willcox station, and they’re so darned far away. By the time they send in the helicopters these groups are long gone. I don’t know how many they catch but they’re coming through here heavy right now.”
On or about the evening of June 21, 2004, agents from the Willcox Border Patrol station apprehended 24 members of a larger group of Arabic speaking males located just east of the Pierce/Sunsites area of Cochise County. At least half of the males escaped capture and disappeared into the United States.
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Originally posted by ra
It would be so easy to stem the flow: just start prosecuting those who hire illegal immigrants, nail them with hefty fines. Pretty soon no one would hire them and they would stay on their side of the border. We have poor people of our own who need jobs, we don't need to import even poorer people.
ra
So if in US someone hires a illegal border-crosser he/she won't be sued? What does IRS say? Are they paying taxes from their income?
IMHO illegal immigrants are quite big problem: their employer pays them less (no taxes I presume?) so the company can also offer its services with cheaper price than one which pays all taxes and pays reasonable wage.
This puts law obeying companies in quite bad situation; either hire your own illegal workers or let the business die cause you can't compete with companies using cheap labour.
Also why would anyone pay a cleaning lady 10$/h if you can hire a alien with 5$/h so they also push the wages down...
I'd say you do have a problem you need to solve.
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Illegal immigrants...
How funny this is comming from a population who massacred the locals and are ALL immigrants.
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It wasn't this population that massacred the locals.
It was a bunch of Yuropeans who landed in a place where the locals had no immigration laws that massacred said locals.
See the danger? ;)
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lol :D
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Originally posted by elc7367b
Just curious, does anyone out there have any opinions on illegal immigration? Does anybody care? More information to follow depending on responses.
hmm i got some yard work needs done
j/k:lol
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Originally posted by Saintaw
Illegal immigrants...
How funny this is comming from a population who massacred the locals and are ALL immigrants.
We just wanna make sure that it does not happen to us now:aok we are plannaing ahead! :D
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Land Mine the borders....problem solved!
RHIN0
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Originally posted by kevykev56
Land Mine the borders....problem solved!
RHIN0
if a guy is hungry enough he'll find a way through.
the only way to control illegal immigration is if they have no reason to come here.
make the fines for hiring an illegal about the same cost as hiring 2 legal workers, full-time for a year. add a bit of jail time on that, and enforce it rabidly.
if there are no jobs waiting for them they will have no reason to invade our country.
the argument could be made that we need immigrants to do the low paying jobs (personally I don't agree, raise the wages enough and you will find Americans willing to do them), but you sure don't need illegals immigrants. as it, is it's very difficult to immigrate here legally, a lot of the reason for that is we have no need for more immigrants because the illegal (and undocumented) immigrants already have the jobs.
if we cracked down on illegal immigration, this would not only benefit the American workers but also those who are willing to immigrate properly not to mention the huge increase in national security by putting a huge dent in the number of people who live in our country and for whom we have no record of until they get arrested or need welfare.
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There's huge change coming.
I talked with a John Deere guy that told me JD has put up 3 big GPS towers. Why? With satellites and "known location" ground GPS they've developed what amounts to an "autopilot" for steering farm equipment. How good? It'll track within 3 inches over a mile. At present, they can farm a field with the operator only needing to turn the machine around at the end of the field. The machine itself steers back to the correct row from there.
The result is that they think they'll be able to plant and harvest strawberries, a notoriously delicate crop, using mechanical equipment alone.
Farming is going to require far less manpower in the not too distant future.
This is just one example. I think we're at the opening stages of a second Industrial Revolution or perhaps the Electronic Industrial Revolution.
Like the first one, a lot of jobs are going to disappear and the challenge will be finding entirely new jobs to replace them.
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Mining companies and tunnel builders are already using lasers; 30ton (metric) vehicle can follow the beam with accuracy of few millimeters.
Differential-GPS is pretty good and with computerized "autopilot" I don't think there needs to be anyone turning the vehicle around at the end of the field.
Paper manufacturers and large warehouses are already using robotic transport vehicles which can operate independently without humans anywhere near.
I've worked in a storage which had space for 10000 pallets and daily traffic was 1500-2000 pallets and that all needed 2-3 guys to run the systems per shift + couple mechanics to take care of conveyor rails and belts.
Bad thing with systems like that is that they're not too fault tolerant; one lightning strike anywhere inside few kilometers from warehouse usually shut down all systems and it took hours to get them back online IF there weren't any burnt electronic equipments.
You can use as good power regulators you like but somehow lightning ALWAYS brokes something which drives systems down.
When we had forklifts&all people just put lights on and continued driving if we lost electricity...
Found a pic (http://www.kolumbus.fi/staga/P3150050.JPG)... already over 10 years old technology; in new plant the pallets are moving in a "ski-lifts"; they are in a "hook" hanging from a "monorail" at the ceiling... Nice technology; if computer thinks one of the "ski-lifts" behave strangely it steers it to the side rail away from main-line... then a mechanic (still human!) can fix it.
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Originally posted by Staga
Differential-GPS is pretty good and with computerized "autopilot" I don't think there needs to be anyone turning the vehicle around at the end of the field.
For whatever reason, the "turnaround" part is still manual. I'm sure it will be there eventually though.
GreenStar™ AutoTrac Assisted Steering System (http://www.deere.com/en_US/ag/servicesupport/ams/feature-article-autotrac-assisted-steering-system.html)
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So if in US someone hires a illegal border-crosser he/she won't be sued? What does IRS say? Are they paying taxes from their income?
There is almost no enforcement of immigration laws here. Once an alien sneaks in, he has almost the entire country to pick from for work, if work is what he wants.
They can even send their kids to public schools. If an illegal immigrant gives birth here, she and her child are automatic citizens. Local police are often not allowed to report the presence of illegal aliens in their juridictions because it may cause illegal immigrants to fear the police and thus become easy targets for thugs.
Illegal immigrants often work in construction, landscaping, housekeeping, farming, and even some factory jobs. And yes that depresses the wages for those jobs. There is no interest at the Washington level to do anything about this, and at the state level there is no power to do anything about it.
ra
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Boy you're in deep...
What's geek ?
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What's geek ?
I have no idea what you're talking about.
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Neither do I; dunno where that came from.
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ramzey... sorry, I don't6 undertstand you r point.
Are you saying that we should allow everyone to come to America to work so long as they are willing to do it in the hot sun for 5 bucks an hour? or... are you saying that I have no right to stop people from coming here if I have never worked in the hot sun for 5 bucks an hour?
I worked construction in the hot sun when I was a kid for a buck fifty an hour and it was harder than picking veggies. so... I say no to illegal immigration.
Now... my point remains... you must have some standards... do you want know criminals to be able to cross the border? child molesters? People with no chance of making the average income?
What would you propose the standards be?
It doesn't really matter. We have standards now and we need to enforce them... killing illegals should be done only in defense.
lazs
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Originally posted by lazs2
I worked construction in the hot sun when I was a kid for a buck fifty an hour and it was harder than picking veggies. so... I say no to illegal immigration.
My summer job, when I wasn't working in my fathers garage, was hauling hay for about .25 per bale. You also had to split the money at least three ways at the end of the day. No idea what that works out to per hour, but I can testify that when you're 15 it's not easy tossing bales of hay over your head all day long. It was a lot of fun at times though.
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Bonilla demands review of OTM release policy
By Karen Gleason
The News-Herald
Published July 31, 2004
Releasing undocumented immigrants to roam freely in the U.S. is "a terrible policy," U.S. Rep. Henry Bonilla told Del Rio and Eagle Pass leaders during a press conference in Del Rio Friday, and announced he is asking the Department of Homeland Security to take a hard look at the issue.
"If these people were being released in your neighborhood I am sure you would be outraged. This is happening in the communities I represent and I am outraged," Bonilla said in a letter Thursday to Department of Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge. Bonilla released copies of the letter during his press conference Friday.
More than 5,200 illegal immigrants from countries other than Mexico (often referred to as OTMs) have been processed in the Del Rio Sector of the U.S. Border Patrol since January 2004, Bonilla said. Of that number more than 4,400 - about 85 percent - have been subsequently released in the Del Rio Sector.
Bonilla said a total of 15,000 such undocumented immigrants have been released in Texas since the beginning of the year.
Both Del Rio and Eagle Pass are in the Del Rio Sector, as are Abilene, Brackettville, Carrizo Springs, Comstock, Rocksprings, San Angelo and Uvalde.
During the press conference, Bonilla also released a series of photographs, some of them taken in Eagle Pass, he had titled "Free Ticket to America." The series of five photographs depict undocumented immigrants crossing the border and being arrested by Border Patrol agents, then receiving their "walking papers," leaving the detention center and "entering a community near you."
Bonilla said cities like Del Rio and Eagle Pass are at the forefront of the Department of Homeland Security's "Capture and Release" program. Once undocumented OTM immigrants are detained and processed, each is given what Bonilla called "Own Recognizance" or "OR" papers, which give the immigrant the right to stay in the United States until their immigration court hearing.
"It is estimated that more than 85 percent of illegal immigrants released do not return for the scheduled court date," Bonilla said.
The congressman charged that "many illegal immigrants are freely giving themselves up to the Border Patrol and in some cases, seeking out agents so they can receive the OR papers to legally enter the United States."
Bonilla also charged that the OTM release program represents a threat to U.S. security. "Terrorists can take advantage of this policy by posing as a person of South American descent and easily enter the United States," he said.
Bonilla also invited several Del Rio and Eagle Pass community leaders to address the media about the release of OTMs. Those leaders included Del Rio Mayor Dora G. Alcal‡, Eagle Pass Mayor Chad Foster and Val Verde County Sheriff A. D'Wayne Jernigan.
Alcal‡ praised Bonilla's efforts last year to end the "lateral repatriation" of Mexican immigrants caught along the Arizona-Mexico border through Del Rio and into Ciudad Acu–a, Coah., Mexico.
Alcal‡ also called attention to the humanitarian aspect of the OTM releases. She said a group of Brazilian immigrants released in Del Rio several weeks ago could not speak English or Spanish "and none of us could speak Portuguese."
Jernigan, who originally raised the hue and cry about the releases of the immigrants in September 2003, said the issue is one of both national and community security. He recounted to Bonilla the fear several downtown merchants expressed to him when groups of the Brazilian immigrant tried to cash checks without identification in their places of business. "One business actually closed out of fear," Jernigan said.
The sheriff also introduced Val Verde County Judge Mike L. Fernandez, who read a resolution passed by Val Verde County Commissioners Court earlier this year, calling on the Department of Homeland Security to end the OTM releases.
I started this thread, was trying to figure out just where I wanted to go with this. I have been a little frustrated with this issure lately. I am at the Eagle Pass, Border Patrol Station. I did a quick check on our numbers for July and we had 1006 OTMs apprehended here, almost all of them released into the community. I interviewed one today during processing. He stated he travelled north through Mexico by train. I asked if there were others from Central America coming north on the train with him. He said "one thousand, maybe more".
WE ARE BEING INVADED. Wake up!
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and you have job catching them and send back, is better for you be lay off from work when they stop crossing border?
then you will go to pick up melons for 5$ /h?:-)
)
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Is that a lame attempt to slam me there Ramzey? I couldnt tell. To be honest with you, I love my job. I would not want to do anything else. Does frustration raise its ugly head now and then? I say yes.
The truth is there are a lot of people coming here to try and better themselves and their families. I dont fault them on that. I do fault them by trying to do so in an illegal manner while others patiently wait while going through the proper immigration process. I enjoy catching those that came here to better themselves who got caught up in the criminal element while here. The wife beaters, murderers, drunk drivers and thieves...most of all the sex offenders...especially the child molesters. Talk about making my day. Yeah and dont forget about the "mara salvatrucha" gang members from El Salvador. They make it so easy to be identified with all their tatoos.
Now one might say that I am cold and cruel hearted to those poor people. That same person was not their when I shared my lunch and last taste of water on the hot California desert floor. Or, he wasnt there when I held the hand of an injured illegal alien woman thrown from the overpacked vehicle wrecklessly driven by an illegal alien smuggler driving lights out on back roads. Or, reuniting the 4 year old with her parents several hours after their group of 30 is jumped in the desert night. The parents fled as fast as they could, leaving their child behind. ( I would never leave my child behind like that). I could go on.
And one parting thought, I did pick my share of melons when I was younger, I know what it is like.
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elc is correct... if it is illegal then it is... illegal and should be stopped. It should not be enforced in an unfair, sproadic and uneven way like deporting a widow in oregon and letting fellonous illegals go in Texas.
ramzey... Have you ever worked in the hot sun for any amount of money? Or did id just sound like a good thing to say to you? It would seem that most of us who abhor illegal aliens have worked hard in the sun at one time or another.
lazs
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Originally posted by elc7367b
Is that a lame attempt to slam me there Ramzey? I couldnt tell. To be honest with you, I love my job. I would not want to do anything else. Does frustration raise its ugly head now and then? I say yes.
The truth is there are a lot of people coming here to try and better themselves and their families. I dont fault them on that. I do fault them by trying to do so in an illegal manner while others patiently wait while going through the proper immigration process. I enjoy catching those that came here to better themselves who got caught up in the criminal element while here. The wife beaters, murderers, drunk drivers and thieves...most of all the sex offenders...especially the child molesters. Talk about making my day. Yeah and dont forget about the "mara salvatrucha" gang members from El Salvador. They make it so easy to be identified with all their tatoos.
Now one might say that I am cold and cruel hearted to those poor people. That same person was not their when I shared my lunch and last taste of water on the hot California desert floor. Or, he wasnt there when I held the hand of an injured illegal alien woman thrown from the overpacked vehicle wrecklessly driven by an illegal alien smuggler driving lights out on back roads. Or, reuniting the 4 year old with her parents several hours after their group of 30 is jumped in the desert night. The parents fled as fast as they could, leaving their child behind. ( I would never leave my child behind like that). I could go on.
And one parting thought, I did pick my share of melons when I was younger, I know what it is like.
im glad you enjoy your work and do your duty with sucrifice
im glad you stop real criminals
but remember as you wrote most of those people come here for food and better future. U.S gov not give them chances for legal way, so dont balme them for walking other way.
If you dont have for food, dont expect them to spend 1000$ for legal way wichone is a blinde corner for them anyway.
If you will live in same situation , you will try to do something with your life, legal or not. Is that not american spirit?
Im sure this one who pick up melons are good people not criminals. Criminals can earn money in other way and not get swet on sun. If thos peoples work hard, they stay away from troubles with police beucose noone of them like to go back. And broke any low rules wil not help them to stay here. So i can say except work and sleep they have not much from life.
All thos examples you wrote here can be quoted from any other country, border patrol report.
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Originally posted by lazs2
elc is correct... if it is illegal then it is... illegal and should be stopped. It should not be enforced in an unfair, sproadic and uneven way like deporting a widow in oregon and letting fellonous illegals go in Texas.
but minefield, concentration camps, death penality is not best way to show humanity
Originally posted by lazs2
ramzey... Have you ever worked in the hot sun for any amount of money? Or did id just sound like a good thing to say to you? It would seem that most of us who abhor illegal aliens have worked hard in the sun at one time or another.
lazs
Lazs my first work in CA was diging trench using showel, during indian summer.
is that sweat enough?
When my ouncle die i was care about his farm (i was 15 or 16).
I drive tractor, work in full sun on the field, load and unload seeds, wegetables, ............ alone, by my own hands couple times a day by 2 months. I did not work for money, but to help my family.
My first real job( for regural payrol) in age 19, during vacations.
I was one of workers maintain roads, building bus station ( they are looks diferent in europe , on country side, its not just plate with B ;-) ). Building bridges, paint bridges, making bricks ....
Payrol was about 50$ per month, for first money i brough denim jeans pants, shirt and was piss off aboyt spending all my money in 10 min. Is that small amounth enough?
ramzey
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Originally posted by Chairboy
I think immigrants are what make this country strong.
Illegal immigrants are essentially cutting in line in front of the people who have made various sacrifices to immigrate legally, and it's just not right.
Perfectly said. I agree completely. Legal immigrants, like my maternal grandparents from Spain, busted their butts to become citizens. My mother doesn't even speak Spanish because my grandfather wouldn't allow it to be spoken in the house, he was so proud of becoming a U.S. citizen.
Having said that, the current immigration laws, particlarly the quotas, are the product of early 20th century fears and racism. Each new group arriving faced the racism of the group which preceeded them. The Irish, then the eastern European Jews, then the Puerto Ricans, etc. The racism and irrational fears culminated in the draconian immigration quotas passed in the 1920's and 1930's, mostly fueled by fears of European anarchists and communists. I think they probably went a little too far, making the statue of liberty a bit of a hollow icon for later immigrants.
I definitely support a loosening of the immigration restrictions, to more reasonable levels than the current ones. But illegal immigrants shouldn't just be given blanket amnesty. Illegal is still illegal.
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ram... I met you. you seem white enough to me so am I.. We both worked in the sun. It's not that kids "won't" its that they don't have to.
None of it matters in any case. The days of intense labor for farming are about at an end.
lazs