Aces High Bulletin Board

General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Karnak on July 30, 2004, 04:56:21 PM

Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Karnak on July 30, 2004, 04:56:21 PM
Lots of good stuff:

Quote
Originally posted by Pyro:

Added native TrackIR support. The default keys are CTRL F1, CTRL F2, CTRL F3, CTRL F4, and CTRL F5 corresponding to Tracker Pan, Tracker Snap, Tracker Move, Tracker Center, and Tracker OFF. If you have remapped keys in the past, you will need to manually map these functions. They are located in the Views portion of the keymapper.
NOTE: To get full head movement, you will need to download the next version of the TrackIR driver from NaturalPoint when available.

AH2 should now minimize when a firewall blocks it in the background.

Fixed a CTD bug that was caused by flying near the edge of large terrains.

Preloaded system memory texture caches are no purged when you alt tab.

Fixed a bug in the plane selection menu that could cause your sortie type to display incorrectly.

Changed the ditching model so that it should no longer be impossible for certain planes to successfully ditch.

Clipboard no longer falls behind the plane when it is being minimized.

Airshow smoke should now come from the proper points on all planes.

Added a checkbox in the video options to disable the display of custom skins. This can be used to cut down on memory usage if that's an issue on your system.

Ordnance now displays correctly on other player's planes.

Hitting dead objects with ordnance no longer scores hits.

External sounds are now unmuffled when your engine is killed.

You can now access the hangar on CV groups with a destroyed CV.

The clipboard now remembers separate positions for both an open and closed swingout page.

Machine guns cause vibration when fired.

Clipboard can no longer be seen through planes in external view.

Redid the combat trim settings on the Me 262.

F6F no longer is prone to losing its tail on landings.

Il2 is no longer prone to prop strikes.

Removed the texture load per frame slider from the video options.


Looks like HTC has been very busy.
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Mak333 on July 30, 2004, 04:58:53 PM
Yep, nice improvements.

tsk tsk, still waiting on the rato's for my zeke....
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Wotan on July 30, 2004, 05:06:03 PM
http://forums.naturalpoint.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi

Track IR forums for those who have issues that go beyond AH.

.
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Jasta on July 30, 2004, 05:33:37 PM
thanks for the F6F tail fix HTC... much improvement
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: GRUNHERZ on July 30, 2004, 05:36:31 PM
Thanks for the IL2 propstrike fix.
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Wotan on July 30, 2004, 05:49:57 PM
Some one give a write up on Track IR in AH. Some of us arent able to test it out yet...
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: RTSigma on July 30, 2004, 06:38:44 PM
I like that the machine guns cause vibrations. Maybe it will put an end to those, "Hold down the fire button till its x-mas" pilots.
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: bockko on July 30, 2004, 06:50:52 PM
Thanks for fixing the zone alarm lockup after patches! Big help!
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: FBRaptor on July 30, 2004, 09:55:24 PM
I wouldn't know. Since the new patch, I cant log on as well as other who can't. I just sit and wait for the connection while the counter ticks away but never log on. I have my firewall off and tried other stuff. This thing worked great for me before the patch. Anyone got any ideas?
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: bockko on July 30, 2004, 10:03:58 PM
when I went to go online, i too was paused, but I alt tab'd out and found zone alarm waiting. Before the patch I would have been locked up and forced to manually fix z/a after reboot; but if your fire wall off, not sure.....
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Hades55 on July 30, 2004, 10:19:54 PM
Quote
Originally posted by FBRaptor
I wouldn't know. Since the new patch, I cant log on as well as other who can't. I just sit and wait for the connection while the counter ticks away but never log on. I have my firewall off and tried other stuff. This thing worked great for me before the patch. Anyone got any ideas?


After every new patch install again DX9b, strange, but always work for me .
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: RDSaustinTX on July 30, 2004, 10:39:50 PM
THANK YOU for fixin sturmi (I guess, havent tried it yet)
 
Mullah
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: wklink on July 31, 2004, 02:10:50 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Wotan
Some one give a write up on Track IR in AH. Some of us arent able to test it out yet...


Tried it out in the SEA tonight.  I knew it was coming but didn't expect it quite this quickly.  It caught me off guard.  I had the TIR on but had it in enhanced mode.   I was quite suprised when the thing started panning

It works very well.  It essentially tracks at the same speed as the mouse view (which we with TIRs did in non enhanced mode).  It tracked smoothly and effortlessly.  I was able to pan the cockpit with little effort and the thing maintained control at all times.  The only real thing I don't like is the inability for me to move around in the cockpit while in enhanced mode.  Moving worked with just the mouse pan but doesn't seem to in enhanced mode.  It's a minor gripe though, something I can easily live with.

Thank you HTC.  I am having my review of the TIR3 I just put up altered to state that you guys implemented TIR support.  I am glad it was done before the review I am writing goes up as well.  I really do think this thing is essential in all new simulations.
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Dennis on July 31, 2004, 04:03:54 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Wotan
Some one give a write up on Track IR in AH. Some of us arent able to test it out yet...


Tried it a bit offline.  No time yet to try it online.
As wklink says, it seems to work quite well.

Re: the moving around in cockpit, it appears that the CTL F3 (Move) function allows you to lean left, right, up & down with head movements.  But it doesn't do it simultaniously with the pan; it's either/or.

But one excellent feature is that the system retains your set views from your hatswitch setup ... so as you pan around with your TrackIR, your head position automatically adjusts around the cockpit!  Great for looking around the headrest on your six view.
If only IL2-FB:AEP had that!

One gripe:  Even though I get a full 180 view to my six o'clock -- (it stops at 180, which I like; I think 360-degree Linda Blair panning is arcadish) -- I can't seem to get a full view straight up.  There seems to be a dead spot -- in which I'm sure to lose a bandit in some tight scissors fight.  I don't have this blind spot when using the trackir2joy config I've had since AH2 debuted.

Splash1
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: 68DevilM on July 31, 2004, 06:28:56 AM
question? do you guys ever delete the old patches in your ah2 fils or just let em bulit up
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: eilif on July 31, 2004, 06:40:15 AM
But one excellent feature is that the system retains your set views from your hatswitch setup ... so as you pan around with your TrackIR, your head position automatically adjusts around the cockpit! Great for looking around the headrest on your six view.


Im sold! this is exactly what i was wondering, i wasnt sure what it was going to do with the head positions, looks like im going to lay down some cash and get this sucker.
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: eilif on July 31, 2004, 06:50:16 AM
is aces high the only sim that alllows you to move around in your cockpit? I am impressed with il2, and ww2ol, but i feel too restrained by the view system, too static. I dont see why these games have 3d cockpits and you cant even move your head around, did hiteck copyright this feature so other developers cant use it?
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Kweassa on July 31, 2004, 08:38:03 AM
eilif, the secret is, IL2/FB cockpits aren't 3D. It's semi-3D, or "2.5D" as Japanese may refer to it.

 Think of a movie setup facade.
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Edbert on July 31, 2004, 09:40:35 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Wotan
Some one give a write up on Track IR in AH. Some of us arent able to test it out yet...

I's premature for this to be called a "write-up" since I've only mesed with it for about 15 minutes and it was offline but here are some observations:

The full functionality as HTC has implemented it is not yet possible, waiting on a new relase from NaturalPoint for that.

I have version 3-pro of the device and version 3.11 of the software.

I did not remap the TIR hot keys, I tried but their keymapper does not support key combos (like ctrl-1) for the basic functions so I'm stuck with the F9-F12 defaults.

Probably because of the above statement some of the AH default keys don't seem to work (probably what will be addressed by the new software from NAturalPoint.

Most views seem to work best in the snap mode, it is a fluid move until you have the built-in view "centered" then it sort "snaps" into the head position you had saved with the F10. This works WONDERFULLY well for the left-rear right-rear views as the pan moves towards that direction the pilots head moves to the side with the snap.

I had trouble looking up and back when I did it by looking up then back. I was able to do it by looking to the side then back then up though.

The dead 6 view is kinda broken with just the TIR (it reminds me of how IL2/FB/AEP works)  right now. I was ble to use my hat switch for the linda-blair view but the pilots head position returned to default (up against the headrest where you cannot see anything but the armor).

I'd like a bigger dead zone than I could get with my limited amount of messing with it could obtain. Perhaps a solid snap when centered would help. But as it stands right now (for me) my gunnery is going to suffer drastically since it seems to jump around quite a bit.

---I am being critical here as I am trying to mention all the things I found. Overall I am VERY pleased. This is SO much better than the mouse emulation views I had before this patch. Most of the things I mentioned are probably my fault, or the result of only playing with it for a few minutes, or will be addressed with the new software patch from NaturalPoint. This is major step forward for Aces High in my opinion. I think TIR now has native support in just about every prop-sim there is, at least all of those that still have developers looking at them :D
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Edbert on July 31, 2004, 09:47:28 AM
Quote
Originally posted by wklink

Thank you HTC.  I am having my review of the TIR3 I just put up altered to state that you guys implemented TIR support.  I am glad it was done before the review I am writing goes up as well.  I really do think this thing is essential in all new simulations.

I just read the TIR3 write-up at SimHQ, followed a link from the NaturalPoint website. It is a great review but it dings HTC somewhat for not having support. In fact it says any flight sim that does not have native TIR support will get dinged appropriately (I agree). I don't know if this is the one you are talking about but as of 8:30AM central time it was still negative.

PS>in that same article it is said that there has not been anything new in joystick designs in 3 years...

  -cough- -ahem- COUGAR -cough-


:D
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: wklink on July 31, 2004, 09:57:49 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Edbert MOL
I just read the TIR3 write-up at SimHQ, followed a link from the NaturalPoint website. It is a great review but it dings HTC somewhat for not having support. In fact it says any flight sim that does not have native TIR support will get dinged appropriately (I agree). I don't know if this is the one you are talking about but as of 8:30AM central time it was still negative.

PS>in that same article it is said that there has not been anything new in joystick designs in 3 years...

  -cough- -ahem- COUGAR -cough-


:D


I've written to our web publisher asking him to put a blurb in there stating support is now in place.  

I was disappointed that TIR support wasn't out with the first version.  I don't know whether my whining helped get support for the game or not.  Some folks at Naturalpoint seem to think it did but that isn't important.  What is important is we have support for TIR Enhanced mode, and it works pretty darned well.

As for the Cougar.  Yes, I know all about it.  I got one of the first ones released.  I consider the Cougar, the CH USB stuff and the sort evolutionary, not revolutionary.  The TIR is a brand new piece of hardware that revolutionizes the flight sim market.  Considering how soft the market is this really is amazing.
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: eilif on July 31, 2004, 10:00:27 AM
eilif, the secret is, IL2/FB cockpits aren't 3D. It's semi-3D, or "2.5D" as Japanese may refer to it.

Think of a movie setup facade.

ah i thought they stopped doing that with warbirds 3, guess they have just integrated it better. 3d shapes super imosed on 2d mat i c.

i notice that when i use mouse look its a rather jumpy transition for the subtle movements, is the scroling smoother with track ir?  I wonder if we could get the track ir software set up for the mouse, i have so many buttons on my mouse that i can use it as a throttle like the x45 but also for looking around, that seems like the next step for the independant throttle users, since the main reason there are independant throttles is for more buttons. i wonder if you put the throttle on rollers and taped the mouse to it if it would work well. or just took the infared eye and mounted it on the x45.  tho pushing the throttle back and forth and moving it all around would not work to well so a slider is probably the best way to go.
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Overlag on July 31, 2004, 11:53:42 PM
finaly the 262 is good!!!!!!!!

oh and PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD MAKE SOME MAPS :mad:
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: jodgi on August 01, 2004, 07:24:59 AM
Dam u HTC!

for releasing TIR support just as I started my 3 week vacation 1,991.7 km away from my AH computer.

Dam u...

Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: TheBeeg on August 01, 2004, 09:04:28 PM
Take it from me as I fly ww2ol as well as AH.  WW2OL has full enhanced TrackIR support.  You can change your views totally in every direction with TrackIR.   It does take a hell of a lot of tweaking to feel comfortable with it.  In my case I've been using the hat views for 2.5 years and haven't yet totally abandoned them but many of my squaddies over there swear by it.
TheBeeg

P.S. I'd like to read some specifics on just how it's supposed to work in AH and what HT meant by the statement about needing the latest driver "when it comes out"

Quote
Originally posted by eilif
is aces high the only sim that alllows you to move around in your cockpit? I am impressed with il2, and ww2ol, but i feel too restrained by the view system, too static. I dont see why these games have 3d cockpits and you cant even move your head around, did hiteck copyright this feature so other developers cant use it?
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: eilif on August 02, 2004, 05:35:28 AM
Take it from me as I fly ww2ol as well as AH. WW2OL has full enhanced TrackIR support. You can change your views totally in every direction with TrackIR. It does take a hell of a lot of tweaking to feel comfortable with it

posted by the beeg.


what i was griping about is not the abuility to look in every direction, but to actually move your head around so you can set up custom head positions like ya can in ah(xyz axis).  ww2ol and il2 give you a default head position, that feels like the pilots head is nailed to the back of the seat, heck i dont even think your head moves around with the effects of pulling Gs in these games. For me looking around should be where a developer really stresses for realism. movement is one of those things i consider very real.

sorry i just woke up havent had breakfast yet. :eek:
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Edbert on August 02, 2004, 01:02:13 PM
Quote
Originally posted by wklink

I was disappointed that TIR support wasn't out with the first version.  I don't know whether my whining helped get support for the game or not.  Some folks at Naturalpoint seem to think it did but that isn't important.  What is important is we have support for TIR Enhanced mode, and it works pretty darned well.

I think it helped, there were dozens of us "helping" (whining/b1tching) too :D

I think what ultimately escalated it was the fact that WW2OL and WB2004 both came out with it. HTC was not concerned that a boxed sim had it, but when those two did...

It went from a "drop the topic already jodgi" to "on the list but not near the top" to full native implementation in only 3 months.

WOOT, WTG, HTC!
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: hitech on August 02, 2004, 01:34:30 PM
Nothing prompted the timing.We said long ago that we would implement it.

The list finaly got short enough where I had the time.


HiTech
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: SunKing on August 02, 2004, 01:42:06 PM
thanks for doing it.
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Dennis on August 02, 2004, 04:27:15 PM
Thanks for finding the time, HiTech.
Quick clarification, please ....

Is the 90-degree up view the "full head movement" you mention coming with the next NaturalPoint driver update?

Splash1
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: 214thCavalier on August 02, 2004, 04:44:27 PM
Have to say without the up view i find it pointless as its a view i use a lot.
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Dennis on August 02, 2004, 05:15:32 PM
Quote
Originally posted by 214thCavalier
Have to say without the up view i find it pointless as its a view i use a lot.


Roger that.
I've temporarily mapped an up view to my stick since key/hat views will override TrackIR.  But momentarily losing a bandit in a turnfight has proven to be a handicap which has gotten me shot down already.

It works great in all other respects, and that full-up block doesn't exist in IL-2, for example ... so I'm wondering if that's an AH-only fix coming with new NaturalPoint drivers.

...and if there's a timetable?

Splash1
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Wotan on August 02, 2004, 06:42:03 PM
Full up works fine in il2. However since AEP 2.01 there's no linda blair view which means no back up look or direct 6 look.

Here's a registry fix to get the same range of view using track ir as you get with the mouse in FB

Quote
Hi whurst1 , try this fix that Hotdognz worked out:

"here is a promblem with the new rear view in Il2 FB Aces and the new patch, if you dont have the original Linda Blair view enabled in the registry you wont get the futher back six view.

There is a eay fix for this now I just tested it.

Shut down the TIR program and go into your registry, look for

TrackIR root key location will be found under :
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\NaturalPoint\NaturalPoint

The key name will be the version of the trackir
software, for instance "V3.10 GX" for 3.10

Then scroll down and change the 1 to 2 like it says below

* TrackIR Enhanced View Range Limiting override
Added : 2.11
registry key name : "ViewLimiting"
registry key values : "1" = normal (restricted to "realistic" ranges)
"2" = open (larger range of motion)

This was what we had to do to enable the Linda blair view that a lot of people complained about but now it gives you as much view as the mouse users get.

I dont know why its like this and im not sure how Oleg has done it this way, but it works as I just tested it"

BTW whurst1 , if you don't know how to get into your registry, go Start/Run and type in "regedit" and hit the ok button.

S!ap


Also they have set up an Aces High 2 forum over at Natural Point:

http://forums.naturalpoint.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum;f=27

You guys might pop in over there and say hi, it might hurry things along if they know theres interest. :p
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Dennis on August 02, 2004, 07:57:04 PM
Indeed, it does work fine in il2-fb:aep.

I'm guessing the inability to look straight up in AH2 with TrackIR is a concession to allowing the retention of up/down/side head movement? ... but that's just a wild-ass-guess until HTC weighs in and expands on his statement about "full head movement."  

I'm assuming everyone using TrackIR  (1,2,3 and 3pro) has the same limitation in AH2?

I'm using the 3.11 driver.

Just for clarification, the regedit fix you mention for fb won't give you a full 'up' view in AH2 ... but it does give you a full six view.
The full 'up' view is more crucial, imho.

Will make a post over at NP just to hurry things along.  :)

Splash1
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Edbert on August 02, 2004, 08:39:17 PM
I dunno whats the deal with KP5 (up) view but I think the new software from NP is for the the 5 keys that HTC has added and the NP software has obly 3 or 4.

edit: and the fact that we cannot map keycombos using the NP software, only single keys work.
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: Dennis on August 03, 2004, 05:25:18 AM
For anyone else interested ...

NaturalPoint forum administrator "Wayne" confirms that the straight-up view will be uncapped in the driver update.

The software has been tested with the restrictions removed and works fine, he says ... so hopefully the fix won't be long in coming.

I think it will, indeed, be very nifty once ready.

In the meantime, I'm pondering returning to the tir2joy utility in the interim, if I can figure out how to get back where I was.

Splash1
Title: Patch 7, lots of fixes and TrackIR support
Post by: hitech on August 03, 2004, 09:22:09 AM
Natraul Point has a vender ID that must be put in there drivers to enable full view.  They are putting this in there next version, which should be released in a few days.

HiTech
Title: 3D Glasses
Post by: shoppe on August 03, 2004, 11:29:06 AM
Has anyone tried the 3d glasses that the Trakir people sell? If so, any good?