Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Hangtime on January 07, 2001, 01:51:00 PM
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Seems we have a poor showing for goony bird pilots.. poor bastids seem to get slaughtered for no material gain. Seems like we oughta come up with some kind of incentive for flying one.. lord knows we can get to and destroy bases with buffs but we can't seem to get anybody to bring a goon along on a mission for the capture. Kinda makes a big buff raid pointless. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
How about giving the Goony pilots the same points for dying they they'd get for a capture?? Or maybe gine 'em the same points the fighter gets for shooting them down when they die? Maybe double the points for succesful capture??
I dunno.. but we gotta do somethin I think. These guys are tryin like hell; but get dick for it, win or lose. In any case; the ones that do fly 'em; my hat's off to yah. Damn good show.. without you guys missions are a bust every time. <S!>
Hang
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I agree, something has to be done. These guys get shot down all the time, and get nothing for it. Without them, the little purpose there is in the game would be gone. I flew a goon for the first time this tour the other day. After Rtb'ing I had to look twice when I saw that you only get 1 frekkin point for an airfield capture. 1 point? Come on now, give a dog a bone.
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LJK_Raubvogel
LuftJägerKorps (http://www.luftjagerkorps.com)
(http://www.luftjagerkorps.com/images/logo.gif)
[This message has been edited by LJK Raubvogel (edited 01-07-2001).]
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I am a gooney pilot as well. I do like flying C47's a lot. If there is a call then most of the time I will try and go out of my way to get there.
I do believe that there does need to be some sort of incentive.
Can I just get one thing clear to the whole community.
Gooney Drivers are totally mad (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
No but really we do deserve some sort of incentive or "Reward" Don't we (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/confused.gif)
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Sounds good to me. Goons are great planes, if you put aside the fact that they simply aren't any good in a hostile situation. Give the drivers a reward of some sort.
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Hi all,
Couldn't agree more. I used to fly goons probably about 50% of the time back in Beta. Now I'll only up in a goon if people shout that a field is flat (and sometimes they lie) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif) or I will always grab a goon for one of Rips missions mainly because they are so well organised. As far as incentives go the best one I have heard so far was by Duma in another thread. Give the Goon driver points for each drunk into the maproom regardless of capture. That would promote multiple goons to a field. Also I've been responsible for the death of the odd fighter when flying a goon and never yet got any points for it.
Just my 2 cents
TTFN
snafu
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snafus Homepage (http://www.snafu.theantcolony.com)
(http://www.snafu.theantcolony.com/Images/goondrops.gif)
[This message has been edited by snafu (edited 01-07-2001).]
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Hey, if points would get more pilots to fly goons, then I am all for it.
I fly goons and buffs. Flying a goon is a very thankless and tedious task. I can't count how many times I have parked away from the field to cap for 20 to 30 minutes waiting for the call.
Of course, I amuse myself, and some of my country mates with various rituals while waiting.
I am not a point watcher myself. I fly the goons because they are needed and not many others will fly em.
Yesterday we had a shining example of the problem. Several of us bish, in lancs went to take 38 back from the nits.
We leveled the field, even had bombs left. No ground forces left, no nothing left at the field.
We practically begged for a goon, but to no avail. We had to RTB as we were low on fuel and finally one of our gusy says I'll bring a goon. But it was way to late. The field had completely repaired and we lost a very strategic field.
Of course, goon pilots are burned often when calls for goons go out, when the reality is, the field will not be captured and is not anywhere near ready for a goon (ie 30 enema fighters swarming the field = no cap).
I am all for whatever would entice pilots to fly a goon.
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Roy "Skuzzy" Neese
President, AppLink Corp.
http://www.applink.net
skuzzy@applink.net
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How about a radio msg:
"So-in-SO has captured field x."
Fighters get kill msgs. Yeah I know, lots of people contribute to a capture but the goon drivers but often there are lots of people who contribute to a fighters kill.
Let the goons have a little glory too.
Regards,
Wab
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If successful, free perk points to use as they choose. If you just lost your perk plane, you might just jump into a C-47 or M-3 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
IC
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Excellent thread from someone who has vowed not to fly goonies anymore.
We've all been begged to go to various fields, only to discover a FLOCK of fighters defending it, or that the ACK ISNT down after all.
But what can you do for them? Sadly, nothing. Its a sportmanship issue. Some in the arena genuinely appreciate the work of the goons, while many just forget em or take them for granted.
Paul
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Yes give em it all:
Glory in the chatbuffer - " field xx has been captured by JohnDoe of Bus Drivers Union
More points, maybe some kind of reduction of the damage on the pilots kill/death ratio.
After all a goon pilots death is most often caused by the teams lack of support or a guy who calls Goon in at a bad time.
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GrinBird
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Good suggestion wabbit. Throw in some glory for the gooney drivers and it ups the pride factor for those players. Toss in a score or perk point bonus and bringing troops to the fight might become a little more popular.
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eagl <squealing Pigs> BYA
Oink Oink To War!!!
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(http://cwm.ragesofsanity.com/s/big/eek3.gif)
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===>Frosty
====>Exposure2k.com
=====>Frosty@exposure2k.com
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I agree, either give goon pilots lots of points when capturing a field or/and relegate the c47 driving duties to AI.
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I, for one, enjoy hopping in a goonie if there's call for one, and I'm not already in the air. I'm not sure I like the idea of an AI controlled setup...it's the country's responsibility to find some way to get the troops there.
SOB
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Give 10-15 Perk Points if the field is captured, fighter or bomber (driver's choice). But dont give a single point if they don't. Why? easy, because then people would spawn with C47s with no motive at all, just to get points.
with 15 Perk points per succesfull field capture, be sure that not only will be goons available...
there will be GOON RACES (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Perk the Goon!!! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
<GDR>
Mav
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What Ram said. I'd balance the value against what is considered a good score for a typical fighter/bomber/vehicle mission then divide up the points between all categories.
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Goon drivers need alot more than just 1 point for a field capture. I like the idea of a point or two for each drunk to make the map room. Maybe .5 point for each drunk kicked out of the kite and .5 point for each one to make it into the map room (when it's held by another country of course).
The reason so many gooney birds run into problems of enemy fighters/ground vehicles or live ack is because they wait so long to launch. If the goon launches within 5min of the strike package it's usually a done deal.
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last time i gooned field i got 1.25 perk points.. i chit, i lost it. we have a hard enough time getting goons in the first place, im not gonna fly one if i get a tootsie roll for a present after i capture a field. but it goes further than this, all bomber are underscored.... i have 5 -6 kill b17 sorties where i end up with 3 perk points...hurray, i think its time htc pulled there head outta you know what and realize that bombers, not fighter won the war
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"see the soldier with his gun, who must be dead to be admired."
-gordon lightfoot "Don Quixote"
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How about adding a new mission type (we now have FIGHTER, BOMBER...add CAPTURE)....
If you have your mission set as CAPTURE, and are within a certain Minimum Distance from the BASE (at the moment of capture) each player would receive points determined by the relative worth of the base divided by the number of players qualified to receive them (this would encourage captures in general and more support acft/vehicles)...
players would also receive individual points for target distruction (within the base area) and M3/C47 drivers would get points per each troop delivered...
all "capture" points would be received, regardless of player survival...but survival multipliers (sucessful landing) could "boost" these points even higher...Would require some tracking by program to determine if player is within capture minimum distance for point awards though...
my 2 an 1/2 cents worth... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Sounds another one of those 'lack of cooperation and planning' issues. If folks would meet the C47 pilots half way and give them a couple spits or Niks for escort and stay with the mission there would be fewer complaints.
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Maybe BBgun.. maybe not. I can't think of a single instance where I've spotted well and competently escorted c47's and have been unable to get thru the screen and kill him. Escorts can slow me down a bit; force me to dodge a mite while I close in, but very rarely indeed can an escort stop a determined attack on a goon or buff.
Seems to me that a 'spotted' goon is soon to be a dead one; escorted or not. On that note.. anybody else notice it's real easy in this terrain to pick out a goon against the water from even 20k and and d10?
Great ideas guys.. keep 'em commin. Hope HTC is listening...
Hang
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I fly C47s and the only incentive I need is enough notice to get there and a capped field when I do.
Screw all this point stuff!
Flying into the smoke at a wrecked field and having a couple cons and lotsa good guys is the rush and if I make it, which is seldom, it is even better.
All this PERK and POINT stuff is driving me nuts....er
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When did they put this thing in here and WTF is it for?
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Hmm. Incentives for flying Goons or driving M3's? Every time I've been online (so far not once this tour) and someone hollered for a goon I'd grab one and run. Do the same thing with M3's; if someone needs one I'll grab either one and go. Score I care nothing about; since BETA I've checked my score all of 5 times. Been shot down plenty of times driving a Goon. I don't care. I'm far from a score-monkey, get annoyed when I'm shot down (delays capture), and I fly one whenever I can.
I remember a mission Zig put up from a tour or three ago in the BETA map. Flying from A2 as a Knight, mostly Russian A/C, and he was hollering for fighter pilots. I calmly jumped in as the goon driver, told him I had it covered, and waited for him to give me the all clear. Someone else got that capture that was closer in an M3. I arrived over the field about 3 minutes after he got the place. Was nailed by an Ostwind, but I didn't care; he just saved me 5 minutes by not having to land.
Zig was very appreciative for me just jumping in a goon. Kinda shocked me to be honest. I expected the usual "Thanx" and nothing more. When someone needs a Goon or M3, I usually grab one and get down to business. If I get killed it makes me take more time getting to the destination field. Oh well. I agree there should be more points awarded to Bus drivers. We risk our butts to get drunks there and take the joint. Field capture messages for the driver? Nice touch, but I honestly don't care either way. If they're put in, it's window dressing to let people know who did it. If not, oh well; no great terrible catastrophie happened.
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Flakbait
Delta 6's Flight School (http://www.worldaccessnet.com/~delta6)
"For yay did the sky darken, and split open and spew forth fire, and
through the smoke rode the Four Wurgers of the Apocalypse.
And on their canopies was tattooed the number of the Beast, and the
number was 190." Jedi, Verse Five, Capter Two, The Book of Dweeb
(http://www.worldaccessnet.com/~delta6/htbin/custom1.jpg)
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Or at the end of every tour, the guy with the most base captures gets something? Like instead of perk points, a guaranteed perk ride of his choice? For the rest of the guys, they get perk points per capture?
Just another idea.
-SW
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Give the Goon driver (it's my fav. ride) the kill credit for anyone crashing or ditching within 5 miles.
Note: I'm 2-0 against hangtime and his *$#@ P51 but I was the only one around - this is the most satisfying score for me. If I could have more kills I'd fly the C47 more.
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A small parade would be nice! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Seriously, a pat on the back goes a long way!
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The Pac terrain is really harse on goon drivers.
Before, I usually left before the strike and found a good hill to land behind, waiting for the clear call from 5-10k away, and rarely did not make the capture.
Now with all this blue water, C-47's are just dead meat. They outta get some compenstation, like a C-46 as a cheap perk transport (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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LOL Oosik.. A big <S!> fer you! I remember one of those.. had yah spotted over water.. u were headed to our port. I dropped down; and while descending was in the process of typing "goon N P14 spill yer troops now and go home alive.."
And augered right next to yah.
Never sent the message.. it was still sittin in the text box with me sittin inna tower 50 miles away. So; furous and determined, I 'quick' hopped in another bird; headed out towards you, trimmed out and started to type "GOON N P14" and augered. System hangs up. Reboot/disco... wailing, I log back on... P14 has ben captured...
ARRRRRGH!!
You got me; P14 and my cats bellybutton with a massive dent in it. Heluva show. <S!> (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Yah win some.. some just go FUBAR. War is fun; dontcha think?? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Hang
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Goon drivin' Nap of the Earth is very fun !
I'm in as well for the personalised message in the Text Buffer... don't need more stinkin' perkies ! Ya all want perkies for this and for that... It'll end up with a DWEEB like me being able to fly the ME262 all the time !
PS: We need differen coloured Goons, that green stands out too much on water!
Saw
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agreed,
perk it high per drunk in the map room ...
personalize capture message ...
and once you're @ it ;-)
put 24 50mms into the goon
make it 50 knots faster
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My typical Goon mission
Someone: we need a goon to 1
Mayhem: Ok Iam on my way is it preped
Someone: yes it's ready get a goon here
Mayhem: OK Iam on my be there in 5
4 minutes later
Mayhem: Iam one minute out, is it still ready
Someone: ya everything is ready get your goon in
Mayhem: Ok inbound
30 seconds later
Mayhem: What the hell the VH is up theres two spits over the field and the AAA is shooting at me and theres a flack next to the map room.
system: victory 3 by dork of the 1st Flackpanzer AH devision
Host: you have been shot down by dork
Mayhem: what the hell I thought you said the field was preped.
Someone: I thought it was but Iam in a 20k buff
This is a typical AH goon mission for since 105. I havne't sucessfully gooned a single base not one single capture after god knows how many tries. you add this into initial bugs and my kill ratio has gone to crap think iam 1 for 1 now.
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Mayhem 33rd S.G.
"Destination anywhere, so far gone, I'm already there!"
[This message has been edited by Mayhem (edited 01-08-2001).]
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I gotta agree with Sunchaser here. I enjoy flying the goon and most always will answer the call. To be successful it takes teamwork.
I don't care about incentives or extra points...all I want is solid capping, cover my bellybutton and frequent reliable communications, all of which can be rare.
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I don't thinik there is anything more fun than cruisin around in a goon with a 2 fighter escort and siccin them on inbound baddies... just watchin em go off to the races makes it a blast for me.Gooning is probably my favorite mission in AH. Maybe havin one small MG would be nice but I know we can't alter history. Also... I landed nearby a base that was soon to be ready for capture and I watched a buddy of mine get shot down. He hit the silk and landed right next to me. Damn I wish I coulda picked him up and taken him home. Same thing happened to me when I bailed over water near some pt boats. Has anyone addressed the idea of multi-crewed planes, tanks and boats? I think it's be nice to fill the seats in a bomber with real players. Maybe even have a copilot who can manage engines or just plain help with flyin the thing. Just an idea and all. I know AH still has a lot of room to evolve but I'm just sendin out some of these ideas. such as giving the guy who bails a 9mm maybe a rifle. He couldn't do much with it but it could be fun. could also lead to folks actually being the drunks that drop from the goon. We implement this.. WWIIOL will be obsolete. Oh... hehehe of course.. I wonder if anyone has proposed subs yet? :-)
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I too feel that the goon driver needs some serious incentive. 30-50 Perk points would not be excessive IMHO. After all, it takes only a few hours of fighter flying to get that many if your decent, and gooning a field is at lease 1/100 as common as shooting down a plane...SO MAKE THE POINTS REFLECT IT!
(http://home.tampabay.rr.com/strategy/2late.jpg)
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The main problem with gooning these days is the failure to realize the need in time. "The base is down.. we need a goon" are some of the most dreaded words any experienced goon driver will see. Sure duty call.. but rest assured that the VH will be back up by the time you get there.. and all the fighters will have left becuase there aren't any bandits there anymore.
My only goon mission came as a result of guessing what was going on. I saw we had a CV about 45 minutes north of an enemy field steaming towards it. I knew that once it got close the usual cv/base engagement would begin. I decided to take up a B-17 and bomb the VH and fuel/ammo bunkers at the base BEFORE the CV arrived. I got on target about the same time the CV was getting close. I took out the VH and various bunkers then RTB'd, got a Goon and headed back. I was 2 mins out when "base is down, we need a goon" was sounded.
Base capture was easy.
AKDejaVu
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10 points for the capture...plus 10 points for each enemy plane or vehicle in the sector.
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Some more points would be nice. But, I'd prefer a solid cap and an escort. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Completing a capture at a base with a gooney, when enemy is near or hangars are about to regen is second only to a 10 minute sortie with another pilot and I come away with the scalp. Points added would be nice, no record damage (ie kill/die) would be good, definitely announcement on text buffer would be be cool. Thanks to all those who prep fields and cap...without that, the C47 is just a big hot air balloon waiting to be deflated.
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Here's some perk transports.
http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/me323.html (http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/me323.html)
http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/bv222.html (http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/bv222.html)
http://www.russian.ee/~star/air/germany/gotha-244.html (http://www.russian.ee/~star/air/germany/gotha-244.html)
[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 01-10-2001).]
[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 01-10-2001).]
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The reality is with this map you need to bring goons along with your missions instead of calling for them when the base is down because in many cases the distances are too great for a goon to get there quickly. I think the distances also make gooning even more boring that it was on the smaller maps.
I gave up gooning because of the following.... someone would call for a goon. I'd respond with a 'goon otw a9->a11' or whatever... spend 15 minutes flying there with updates on where I was... only to find another gooner who didn't mention he was otw... takes the field first. Horray for the home team and all but... it gets old real fast.
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THis is a little long, but please read...
I think Hangtime and a couple others have it right on the first point. A goon should be next to invisible to high fighters when on the deck.
The AH view of long range cons makes the whole idea of camoflauge useless. If there is a green plane flying over a jungle at treetop level, and you are at 15-20k altitiude, it would not be a big black dot. It would be a little green speck that you would have to struggle to see, not just make a passing glance and see everything.
Stealing the thread a little... Someone had posted and I seconded that dots at long range should show up in the main color of the plane instead of always black. Also, the further it is, the more it should just blend into the haze, instead of just appearing all the sudden. It would make seeing long range cons much more realistic.
Back to the incentives.
For 1, the goon pilot should get automatic 6 calls in the text buffer, as should every buff and plane with rearward facing guns that would normally be manned. One of the most frustraing things in goon or buff flying is being shot up while looking at the map or while trying to fly NOE. I think in a C-47 filled with troopers, everyone would be looking out the windows for threats.
I like the idea of more points also, I have 5 captures this camp and only 1.25 per capture is a little on the cheap side.
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"Wing up, Get kills, Be happy"
Midnight
13th TAS