Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Midnight on September 10, 2004, 11:43:43 AM
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Airbumba's post about simmer / gamer gave me this idea. Maybe it's been talked about before...
Let's ad a new arena that is the same basic setup as the MA, only with a few changes incorporated from several other player's ideas and prevoius posts.
1. Life limiter - A player gets only X lives per hour.
2. Perk everything and adjust ENY values so you can actually earn more perks while flying high performance planes.
3. Disable level bomber dive bombing ability
4. Enable the Night that lasts for more than 30 minutes - with short range icons in nighttime conditions.
5. Make field capture require 15 troops instead of 10
These are some items that I *think* can be done by area settings and not require a lot of code changes to accomplish.
To me, this would at least make for a good experiment in the CT area to be tried out for a week or two.
If you don't like it - don't worry, it wouldn't effect your MA as you know it.
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Set it up Axis vs Allies.
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Not adressing your specific rule-set but if you see the MA is a 'relaxed realism' arena then the CT might be more to your tastes.
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Some of these ideas have been tried in the CT over the years it's been around. I admire the idea but I am skeptical if such an arena actually attracted enough players to make it a viable option.
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I always see the CT (The way it is now) as less attractive because it's always a 2 country thing "axis -vs- allies" with a limited plane set.
What I am suggesting is that we get ALL aircraft and vehicles just like the MA, only with more "player controls" that make it more "sim" than "game"
1. say 4 lives per hour - don't waste them in 5 minute Jabo suicide attacks or getting vultched 10 times in 2 minutes like in the MA now.
2. perk values like CT settings - I remember a time when I flew there, P-51B was free, but you could afford a P-51D after shooting down 3 or 4 enemy fighters.
3. Speaks for itself
4. I think the "simmers" like the night and it would be more useful if icons went to short range at night. Then nightfighter skins would be so cool.
5. If field capture required 15 troops, a slightly more coordinated attack would be needed to capture a field.
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4 an hour?! I don't die that many times in a night! If you want it to be closer to real, I'd say no more than 2 lives every 24 hours. That's right, you get 1 mulligan... after that your a bonehead that belongs in the MA!
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Originally posted by VWE
4 an hour?! I don't die that many times in a night! If you want it to be closer to real, I'd say no more than 2 lives every 24 hours. That's right, you get 1 mulligan... after that your a bonehead that belongs in the MA!
I guess that would include me, then:(
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Originally posted by VWE
4 an hour?! I don't die that many times in a night! If you want it to be closer to real, I'd say no more than 2 lives every 24 hours. That's right, you get 1 mulligan... after that your a bonehead that belongs in the MA!
Not to sound like a flame, but looking at your stats from last tour, it looks like you were killed, on average
- once every 13.57 minutes in a fighter
- once every 15 minutes in a bomber
- once every 20 minutes in an attack aircraft
- once every 6.6 minutes in a GV
So are you saying you only played about 30 minutes each time you logged in? Judging from your total time last tour, I guess that's possible if you played every night for about 39 minutes.
Anyway, I think 4 deaths per hour is enough to keep the suicide tactics down to a minimum yet still let players have fun and fight a war.
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So what are my CT stats...
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Originally posted by VWE
So what are my CT stats...
Almost 21 minutes between deaths as a fighter in the CT last month....why?
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Because I don't usually fly more than an hour a night and I just came back here last month. If you will note my primary time is in the CT and this month I bet I have no more than an hour or two in the MA. So when I sain 4 deaths a night I was right... its easy to flame just about anyone if you don't take the time to look at all the stats. This is a discussion about making a more realistic areana and giving someone 4 lives an hour is no different than what we have now.
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I predict that this arena will be a miserable failure. Just saying.
-- Todd/Leviathn
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I think its not a bad idea. The MA is getting pretty monotonous these days. :o
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Originally posted by VWE
Because I don't usually fly more than an hour a night and I just came back here last month. If you will note my primary time is in the CT and this month I bet I have no more than an hour or two in the MA. So when I sain 4 deaths a night I was right... its easy to flame just about anyone if you don't take the time to look at all the stats. This is a discussion about making a more realistic areana and giving someone 4 lives an hour is no different than what we have now.
I wasn't trying to flame anyone. I noticed about 21 hours in the CT last month for you. I only wish I could fly that much!
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VWE - It's not really important what your stats are right now.
I think limiting someone to 2 deaths per 24 hours is too restrictive and will really keep people away. Just think how Teed people get if they die within the first 15 minutes of Squad Ops or Scenarios.....
In a 4 death per hour arena, the some of the things that will disappear the quickest will be...
- CV suiciders
- people who get vultched 20 times before finally getting their La7 off the ground and kill a single troop at the last possible second.
- having to shoot down the same guys over and over until you run out of ammo / E and then they kill you as your trying to RTB (when you won the fight already)
- Suicide JaBo mission to kill ground targets and then come back to vultch in fresh plane.
I would really love for HTC to give this a try. It might be a good way to let the "simmers" play the sim they want and the "gamers" to play the game they want.... all without bothering each other.
HTC, are you there?
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Come to the CT... people atually you after a good 1 on 1. I came to the CT to get away from the gamers.
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Originally posted by VWE
Because I don't usually fly more than an hour a night and I just came back here last month. If you will note my primary time is in the CT and this month I bet I have no more than an hour or two in the MA. So when I sain 4 deaths a night I was right... its easy to flame just about anyone if you don't take the time to look at all the stats. This is a discussion about making a more realistic areana and giving someone 4 lives an hour is no different than what we have now.
Heck, when I was flying I could easily die 4 or more times an hour, and I anticipate when I come back it won't change much for the better. like I say, don't underneath me when I'm dogfightin cause I'l prolly fall on ya, or pieces of me will.:lol
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Originally posted by VWE
Come to the CT... people atually you after a good 1 on 1. I came to the CT to get away from the gamers.
I've tried the CT a few times. I just don't have a lot of fun there because the planeset isn't always what I like (P-51D has to be available either as free or perk)
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Originally posted by Midnight
(P-51D has to be available either as free or perk)
:rofl
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"1. Life limiter - A player gets only X lives per hour."
and you think people were p.o'd at ENY?
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Originally posted by kj714
"1. Life limiter - A player gets only X lives per hour."
and you think people were p.o'd at ENY?
Typical - read the post again. This would be another anrea. The MA would be left alone!
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Originally posted by VWE
4 an hour?! I don't die that many times in a night! If you want it to be closer to real, I'd say no more than 2 lives every 24 hours. That's right, you get 1 mulligan... after that your a bonehead that belongs in the MA!
Somebody must get killed if you're going to get a kill. The arena would be filled with nothing but runners, and after not very long ... very few players.
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Deleted for flame
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Originally posted by Midnight
And trust me, I don't think either crowd will miss the other
I disagree. While I doubt that furballers would miss the "realism" junkies very much, I think a week in the new arena will have the realists pining for the good old days.
Once you put a price on dying, even if it's just a few perk points on some limit per hour, you've greatly increase the incentive for staying alive. An arena without death costs, where some people fly solely to live and land kills and where a bunch of others don't care, leads to a nice relationship for those who fly to live. It gives them a chance to fly conservatively and prey on those who do not. Fair enough.
But now you're looking at an arena where dying carries substantially greater costs without some other objective (like missions) providing an incentive to engage enemies. As a result, the arena hinges on players avoiding one another as much as possible.
-- Todd/Leviathn
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Deleted for flame
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Deleted for flame response
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Personaly I like the idea, I suggested to HTC a while ago many many times, Make it as "realistic" as possable.
Whenever there is no consequence's to ones actions the outcome is obvious, granted, IRL if you were shot down or blown up you'd more than likely DIE. So being this is a "sim" having limited "lives" you could use within a given amount of time sounds ok.
The dive bombing Lanc pilots might think twice about it!
Who knows.
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-- Todd/Leviathn
For whatever reason you are trying to turn this into a flame fest, take it somewhere else. If you don't like the idea, then so be it. I don't care in the least right now. I am asking for HTC to set this up as an experiment in an existing arena (the CT) for a week or two. If people don't like it, they don't have to try it. If people try it and don't like it, then they can go back the the MA that they like. If enough people try it and like it, then maybe it could be used for a while longer.
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Originally posted by Midnight
For whatever reason you are trying to turn this into a flame fest, take it somewhere else.
[/b]
Wrong. I didn't flame you at all until after you introduced such zingers as "Once again, you show how unimaginative you (and players like you) can be" and "You say that and sound like an arse." Don't even go off acting like some haplessly smeared defender of truth and justice.
Look, I'm not against HTC setting up an arena for the realists to go. Like I said, the furballers will miss them far less than they'll miss the furballers. But you're kidding yourself if you think my criticism somehow lacks imagination or originality. This idea was tried in AW at one point (albeit with harsher penalties), and it failed miserably. Best of luck to you, but I don't see how it can do anything but fail all the same. I'd be happy to have you prove me wrong.
-- Todd/Leviathn
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First, stop picking on Leviathon...he is my hero and mentor since Air Warrior. Don't make me put a bounty on yer sorry arse! (Midnight)
Here is a refreshing idea......why not turn off the AW and dweeb settings that HT set in AH to allow them to take off and fly in the MA? In the beginning, it was harder to fly than it is now. AH2 is getting back to those settings and IMHO it can weed out the rif-raf. But do not take my word for it.
A new arena may require a complete rewrite of the code, another server to host it and the financial impact might just raise the price to my comfort level. ($30.00 a month) Would you like that?? I paid it and it was good for me. Then you can have it your way-like at Burger King! Put up or Shut up! My credit card can handle it and so can I..........sheesh! In your defense, I like the night, and I want it back NOW!
K-KEN
http://www.cutthroats.com/
(http://www.webdesignbyken.com/images/CMCsmall.gif)
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I dunno, i went awhole month awhile back, with only 1 death the whole camp and that was to manned ack! My id then was JB4, but shhh:rolleyes:
I also know Moot went a whole camp with no deaths using a TA152.
So maybe 2 an hour :D
I think its cool Midnight is thinking outside the "Box". I dont know if im gonna pull out my Pom Poms for this idea, but atleast he is trying to come up with something new. I guess its easier to be a critic then an artist :p
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K-Ken put your Pom Poms away M8. Levi can handle himself. Maybe find some new heroes, get out more? :D
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The DA is used that little it could be done away with and a more stategic MA put in place. Turn current MA into a furballers one.
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Midnight 1 thing to consider. You basicly have just put a cap on number of kills per hour also, Because for every kill there is a death. You have just basicly set a max of 4 kills an hour in your setup.
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Originally posted by hitech
Midnight 1 thing to consider. You basicly have just put a cap on number of kills per hour also, Because for every kill there is a death. You have just basicly set a max of 4 kills an hour in your setup.
??? What? If there is a fight going on between two countries, each with 50 or so players on... how could someone be limited to only killing 4 of them an hour? each of them has 4 lives per hour. So, 50 enemy fighting against a country.. times 4 lives per hour each, that's 200 lives to be killed each hour. Yes, those 200 lives will be killed by several players, but I think the average k/t isn't going to go down that much.
And you can't count the k/t of the "furballing" crowd in the average - They probably wouldn't be playing in the SIM-Mode arena.
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i wouldnt like only having so many deaths an hour/ so many kills an hour limited. if someone were limited to the amount of times they could die they would go play another game definately or there would be fights at like 50k because people dont want to die/fight!
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oops delete that last post i didnt know that you were talking about a whole new Arena sorry
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50K fights!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
WoooWHOOOO the TA152 will become a Legit fighter!!!!!!
It will be the next LA7:lol :rofl
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Originally posted by 2shad4u
oops delete that last post i didnt know that you were talking about a whole new Arena sorry
You just wanna show off your new batvatar. ;)
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Originally posted by Dead Man Flying
But now you're looking at an arena where dying carries substantially greater costs without some other objective (like missions) providing an incentive to engage enemies. As a result, the arena hinges on players avoiding one another as much as possible.
-- Todd/Leviathn
I am not for against this arena idea. However I will echo LEVI in one respect. In AW when we would have a lose two and barbecue WAR NIGHT.... suddenly everyone was in a speed plane... and running was in vogue. Oh sure we had a few die hard turn and burn types.... and they left the WAR NIGHT early. After that... it was amusing to see all the SPIT guys suddenly flying Ponies.
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Originally posted by Dead Man Flying
Deleted for flame response
FLAME ON!
(Don't want to miss my chance)
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Originally posted by hitech
Midnight 1 thing to consider. You basicly have just put a cap on number of kills per hour also, Because for every kill there is a death. You have just basicly set a max of 4 kills an hour in your setup.
Ah you limit the number of kills available in an hour true.. but certainly not who gets them...
(Pictures the pigs that race at the county fairs for the Oreo Cookies)
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This idea should be tried, if only to allow some of us to run book on it and make a little money.
I think Levi and Scholz have it correctly and I'm giving 2 to 1 odds.
Takers?
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Originally posted by Midnight
Not to sound like a flame, but looking at your stats from last tour, it looks like you were killed, on average
- once every 13.57 minutes in a fighter
- once every 15 minutes in a bomber
- once every 20 minutes in an attack aircraft
- once every 6.6 minutes in a GV
So are you saying you only played about 30 minutes each time you logged in? Judging from your total time last tour, I guess that's possible if you played every night for about 39 minutes.
Anyway, I think 4 deaths per hour is enough to keep the suicide tactics down to a minimum yet still let players have fun and fight a war.
Here Here. Im for the new look of the CT.
As we all can agree the CT isnt going to suffer low numbers anymore than it does already.
Enough of that.
Midnight....FIX that WEBSITE!!!!
I miss going to yous guys website! ;)
Thanks and g/l
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Originally posted by Midnight
Typical - read the post again. This would be another anrea. The MA would be left alone!
No, I got that. Ahh, nevermind, have fun with your arena.
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make a relaxed realism arena like AW to attract more players in general and a place to go if you dislike something in the regular arenas.
maybe then people wouldn't whine as much about changes to the game.
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Originally posted by hitech
Midnight 1 thing to consider. You basicly have just put a cap on number of kills per hour also, Because for every kill there is a death. You have just basicly set a max of 4 kills an hour in your setup.
On avg per player yes. Though one single player could teoreticly get 4x kills per hour.
Tex
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Originally posted by TexMurphy
On avg per player yes. Though one single player could teoreticly get 4x kills per hour.
Tex
Yeah.. like I said earlier.....
(Pictures the pigs that race at the county fairs for the Oreo Cookies)
:lol
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You could call it the "no action arena". If you tuned it and tweaked it enough you could get really realistic results... maybe you might not see an enemy plane for a year.
did you plan on flyinbg only under orders and only in finger four formations? Why night? you would be grounded at night.
lazs