Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: JBA on September 13, 2004, 12:48:32 PM
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Will it mean 4 more years for Bush, and the Democrats will relinquished to the roles of na Sayers for years to come.
Will this be the "international coalition" that Kerry claims to be able to get?
If other European nations are hit as hard will they also join, or will they be appeasers?
http://asia.search.news.yahoo.com/search/news_asia_pf?p=ukey%3A2805778&img=http://sg.yimg.com/xp/ap/20040913/1104086205.jpg
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(http://mrgrumman.home.comcast.net/KerryOnTerrorism.JPG)
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Who does OsamaBinLaden and AQ want for President?
ANYBODY BUT BUSH
sounds familiar doesn't it.......
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I'll re-phrase the topic title: If US and other "democratic" Western nations join Russia in a fight on terror instead of hosting terrorists and aiding terrorist-supporting regimes?...
:rolleyes:
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Boroda, do you see the potential for a political/military alliance with the US in your country?
I think it would be well recieved here, quite frankly.
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Originally posted by Boroda
I'll re-phrase the topic title: If US and other "democratic" Western nations join Russia in a fight on terror instead of hosting terrorists and aiding terrorist-supporting regimes?...
:rolleyes:
You mean cut our aide to your country?
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
over moronic don't you think ?
and far below poor taste.
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Boroda, I hope our countries join together in this fight on terrorism. It would be a welcome change after the decades long Cold War imo.
Imo the attack in Beslan is far worse than 9/11 simply because in Beslan terrorists made CHILDREN their targets. What kind of a coward targets innocent CHILDREN??? I sincerely hope you guys get those perpetraters Boroda, and I hope we help you get them.
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just a little bit of cultural arrogance here. russia has been fighting in their corner of the globe against terror since well before sept 11 2001. and russia and us military have worked together on things regularly from 1992 or so. if they need us military forces in area they control their govt and military guys know how and when to ask. i dont think they need us or anyone else though.
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i dont think they need us or anyone else though.
It's not about need, it's about showing terrorists the world is united against them.
just a little bit of cultural arrogance here.
eh? what did you mean by that?
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Originally posted by Elfie
Boroda, I hope our countries join together in this fight on terrorism. It would be a welcome change after the decades long Cold War imo.
Imo the attack in Beslan is far worse than 9/11 simply because in Beslan terrorists made CHILDREN their targets. What kind of a coward targets innocent CHILDREN??? I sincerely hope you guys get those perpetraters Boroda, and I hope we help you get them.
Yup so the Russians can keep on surpressin the Chechens, hey they've been doin it now for what, 100 years.
agree, Children should NOT be involved in this, but hey, WAR SUCKS. And you Lunatics keep talking about MORE war, then cry like little girls when the action hits close to home.
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If Russia invades Italy and Egypt in pursuit of terrorists will Bush support them?
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Originally posted by SLO
Yup so the Russians can keep on surpressin the Chechens, hey they've been doin it now for what, 100 years.
agree, Children should NOT be involved in this, but hey, WAR SUCKS. And you Lunatics keep talking about MORE war, then cry like little girls when the action hits close to home.
supressing chechens huh? hey genius why dont you tell me what % of the "republic" that the chechens want to rule is composed of chechen people? i love it when people cram at least a hundred pages of background and analysis into one ill infmored paragraph. its like jerry springer show on the internet.
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Originally posted by Yeager
Who does OsamaBinLaden and AQ want for President?
ANYBODY BUT BUSH
Why do you say that?
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Originally posted by Elfie
It's not about need, it's about showing terrorists the world is united against them.
eh? what did you mean by that?
by cultural arrogance i mean that while the "global war on terror" for the us "officially" started on sept 11 2001 plenty of other countrys had been in knock down drag out fights against cross border and intercontinental terrorist groups well before that time. how would a russian ct operator whos been neck deep in chechens for ten years feel if someone told him "good news america wants you to join the global war on terror"? by need our help i meant actual troops on the ground in combat. weve been helping the russians and the russians have been helping us in many ways for over ten years. just not with combat troops on ground. probably better that way. our guys cant hold liquor like theirs theyd just get our young Marines and soldiers drunk and steal all their gear in poker games. :)
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Originally posted by anonymous
supressing chechens huh? hey genius why dont you tell me what % of the "republic" that the chechens want to rule is composed of chechen people? i love it when people cram at least a hundred pages of background and analysis into one ill infmored paragraph. its like jerry springer show on the internet.
why don't you go and research it, might be surprised, mostly the bit about STALIN and what he did to them.
and please refrain from calling me a genius, it might actually go to my head.
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Originally posted by anonymous
supressing chechens huh? hey genius why dont you tell me what % of the "republic" that the chechens want to rule is composed of chechen people? i love it when people cram at least a hundred pages of background and analysis into one ill infmored paragraph. its like jerry springer show on the internet.
read Tolstoi.
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damn other thread is locked, next time skuzz, gimme time to post back at them funny people.
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Ah ok Anon, I understand what you meant now. I meant no arrogance and I understand others have had problems with terrorists long before 9/11. 9/11 just made the terrorist threat all to real for America. Call it a wake up call if you will.
That said, all countries need to band together to fight this threat. Terrorism needs to be stamped out. A *new global war on terrorism* shouldnt be taken as an insult by anyone. In my view each country trying to deal with terrorists on their own is far less effective than everyone joining forces to combat this together.
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hey Mr. Ano,
thx for posting that nice SIG, makes me fell all chummy inside. As for the other thread I posted and 2 minutes later I added(edited) something to make it more intelligible, but since you're one of those wise prettythang clowns who thinks he knows everything and can dictacte to others when to be compassionate or sympathetic....
I got news for you clown....
Circus is that way------------------------------------------------->>>>>
now why don't you hold a vigil for ALL THEM FUGGIN IRAQIS YOU KILLED.
then maybe you can come over here and dictacte to me, but until then, kiss my ***
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since other thread got locked...
this is for you Grun.....
I DON'T SEE YOU SHOWING COMPASSION OR SYMPATHY FOR THE IRAQIS YOU KILLED. Since you don't share the same opinion as them.
spare me your stupid Nazi remark would ya, try and use at least 1 fuggin brain cell.
they have a different Opinion then yours(Muslims).....SO DON'T EXPECT ANY FUGGIN SYMPATHY from them clown.
now maybe you understand that nice SIG Mr. Nobody is using
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won't happen. Russia will take their own action but will not join the US.
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Originally posted by B17Skull12
won't happen. Russia will take their own action but will not join the US.
WHY....
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Originally posted by SLO
WHY....
it was called the cold war and there still a sense of bitter rivalery there.
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Originally posted by SLO
hey Mr. Ano,
thx for posting that nice SIG, makes me fell all chummy inside. As for the other thread I posted and 2 minutes later I added(edited) something to make it more intelligible, but since you're one of those wise prettythang clowns who thinks he knows everything and can dictacte to others when to be compassionate or sympathetic....
I got news for you clown....
Circus is that way------------------------------------------------->>>>>
now why don't you hold a vigil for ALL THEM FUGGIN IRAQIS YOU KILLED.
then maybe you can come over here and dictacte to me, but until then, kiss my ***
sorry. im now a member of your cult. because i have a differing opinion than those iraqis they get neither sympathy or compassion. got a spare brown shirt and some jackboot polish that i could borrow? :)
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Originally posted by Yeager
Who does OsamaBinLaden and AQ want for President?
ANYBODY BUT BUSH
sounds familiar doesn't it.......
Actually Bush's invasion of Iraq was the best xmas pressent OBL and his followers could of ever wished for. I'm sure they would love to see Bush get another 4 years stir up more hatered in the middle east in the process.
...-Gixer
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Originally posted by anonymous
sorry. im now a member of your cult. because i have a differing opinion than those iraqis they get neither sympathy or compassion. got a spare brown shirt and some jackboot polish that i could borrow? :)
DING!!!! a winner
see what happens when I play devils advocate, some of you get all worked up and post nonsense. RedNeck philosophy.
now ask me my personel opinion and you just might get something different then what you'd expect.
2 sides to every coin...
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Originally posted by Gixer
Actually Bush's invasion of Iraq was the best xmas pressent OBL and his followers could of ever wished for. I'm sure they would love to see Bush get another 4 years stir up more hatered in the middle east in the process.
...-Gixer
what I find even more funny is them goin in there with a HUGE baseball bat....
just to kill a fly.
anyone ever tell you funny Americans that killing flies is alot easier with a fly swapper and not a baseball bat.
I think Bush is just protecting US interest, why else go in with a huge Bat, but to protect HUGE interest :aok
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Originally posted by Elfie
That said, all countries need to band together to fight this threat. Terrorism needs to be stamped out. A *new global war on terrorism* shouldnt be taken as an insult by anyone. In my view each country trying to deal with terrorists on their own is far less effective than everyone joining forces to combat this together.
Originally posted by someone else
If other European nations are hit as hard will they also join, or will they be appeasers?
Sigh...................Elfie where have you been? Many, many countries have banded together in the 'global war on terror' since 911 and before. Look at all the countries involved in Afghanistan. Even countries like Germany who were against the war in Iraq. The message has been received and understood some time ago. Almost every country in Europe has been 'hit as hard' with a terrorism problem, ditto for South America and Asia. America had the worst terrorist attack in history but none since. The war on terror is being fought outside America by everyone.
'Terrorism needs to be stamped out' but it won't be. Terrorism has been around since the sixties in one form or other and it won't be stamped out. It can only be minimised. You can't win against terrorists. It's an endless war that cannot be won militarily only politically.
Russia's problem is Chechnya. Remove the reason for terrorism and it fades. Repression begats terror and terror begats repression. It's a vicious circle.
America and everybody else's problem is Al Qaeda. They see freedom and liberal democracy as a threat to their fundamentalism. That's because it is a threat to their version of Islam. The only way to beat them is to maintain our freedom and spread it around while trying to keep a lid on the extremists. You can't kill an idea with precision munitions. In the end Al Qaeda will only be defeated when other Muslims no longer support them and no new recruits join up. As it happens Al Qaeda have probably killed more Muslims than Christians and others. That will tell against them eventually. Suicide bombing is particularly self defeating as it uses up the most devout followers. Give it ten years or so, maybe there will be progress by then.
But of course a new cause will come along which justifies murdering children and dismembering bus or airline passengers.
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cpxxx that 2nd quote isnt from my posts :)
Also, I am talking about a global unity to fight terrorism, not just some of the worlds countries, each doing what it can to fight terrorists attacks against itself. Get as many countries as possible into an anti terrorism coalition. The more countries involved in the coalition, the fewer places for terrorists to hide.
Terrorism has been with us for far to long, it's time for THE WORLD to do something about it.
*added* Afghanistan was a prime example of a coalition working together against terror. It worked beautifully, let's keep it going.....whatever it takes.
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Originally posted by Gixer
Actually Bush's invasion of Iraq was the best xmas pressent OBL and his followers could of ever wished for. I'm sure they would love to see Bush get another 4 years stir up more hatered in the middle east in the process.
...-Gixer
Absolutely right, because 9/11 was the result of Bush stirring up trouble in the ME, right?
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Originally posted by Saurdaukar
Absolutely right, because 9/11 was the result of Bush stirring up trouble in the ME, right?
:rolleyes:
in reality it is because we are backing the Islreali's.
We talked about this exact thing in world history today (which btw is also current events)
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Originally posted by Saurdaukar
Absolutely right, because 9/11 was the result of Bush stirring up trouble in the ME, right?
No, but every US president for years has stirred up trouble and hatred in the middle east. They've all thought at one time or another they have the answers which never turns out to be so. This one has just created a bigger mess then the others is all.
...-Gixer
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Originally posted by Gixer
No, but every US president for years has stirred up trouble and hatred in the middle east. They've all thought at one time or another they have the answers which never turns out to be so. This one has just created a bigger mess then the others is all.
...-Gixer
What mess have we "created" in the middle east?
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Originally posted by NUKE
What mess have we "created" in the middle east?
Shall we start on the most recent and work our way back?
...-Gixer
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in reality it is because we are backing the Islreali's.
Skull OMG you fool! Don't believe this crap holy cow young man! Open your eyes... How many conflicts in the world are raging right now that are muslims against someone else...take Kashmir or Chechneya for example... can these be blamed on our support of Israel? No way in hell. Neither can 9/11. If there was any legitimate "reason" we were attacked it would have A LOT more to do with our "occupation" of the land of the two holy cities (Mecca and Medina) than it would about Israel.
And I quote directly from OBL's declaration of war against the US;
"The latest and greatest of these aggressions, incurred by the Muslims since the death of the Prophet (Allah's blessings and salutaions on him) is the occupation of the land of the two Holy Places the foundation of the house of Islam, the place of the revelation the source of the message and the place of the noble Ka'ba, the Qiblah of all Muslims by the armies of the American Crusaders and their allies."
He does go on to mention Isreal, but not more than as a collaboration of Zionism and the West to hold the Muslim world in the dark, but he does not differentiate between the two. Israel and the US are seen as one and the same, not as separate entities. The last straw for Bin Laden was the Saudi's allowing our troops to be stationed in the Arabian Peninsula during the first Gulf War. If it was our support of Isreal that triggered 9/11, don't you think Bin Laden and Al Quaeda would have had it out for us before that? They didn't. This statement was written in 1996. Take that back to your ignorant history teacher that just takes his/her lessons straight from the textbook without doing and real research.
I was a history major in college Skull, and I have frequently gone back to look at textbooks used in junior high and high school and have been absolutely SHOCKED at how far off the truth they are. Revisionist and appologist history is unfortuantely alive and well in this counrty. I actually read what you were told in a textbook I picked up about 6 months after 9/11. At a time when our government still wasn't clear on what happened, do you think some egghead writing this text right after the fact with probably little other expertise than his contempt for America knew what the hell he was talking about? Gimme a break!!! WAKE UP! :mad:
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Originally posted by SLO
DING!!!! a winner
see what happens when I play devils advocate, some of you get all worked up and post nonsense. RedNeck philosophy.
now ask me my personel opinion and you just might get something different then what you'd expect.
2 sides to every coin...
right i get it now. it was all some master reverse psychology plan using your superior brain to teach little ol me a lesson. it wasnt you showing what a true close minded jerk you really are and getting caught before you could edit. pardon me if i go with option number two based on everything else youve ever typed. i do find it funny that youd errantly accuse someone ELSE of "getting all worked up and posting nonsense". heres a clue for as you like to put it "your little mind". i was quoting you because you said something so stupid i could not resist giving you a gag attack with it. "redneck philosophy"? what in the world does that mean? i couldnt ride a horse to save my life. :)
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Yet another American believing they are the original terrorist victim. It seems the lack of knowledge about history is becoming a norm in the Western world.
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Originally posted by Thrawn
Why do you say that?
Perhaps hes trying to say that OBL wants a worthy opponent in the whitehouse.. lmao :rofl
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Originally posted by NUKE
What mess have we "created" in the middle east?
We let the problem fester.
Now were correcting that error.
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Originally posted by anonymous
right i get it now. it was all some master reverse psychology plan using your superior brain to teach little ol me a lesson. it wasnt you showing what a true close minded jerk you really are and getting caught before you could edit. pardon me if i go with option number two based on everything else youve ever typed. i do find it funny that youd errantly accuse someone ELSE of "getting all worked up and posting nonsense". heres a clue for as you like to put it "your little mind". i was quoting you because you said something so stupid i could not resist giving you a gag attack with it. "redneck philosophy"? what in the world does that mean? i couldnt ride a horse to save my life. :)
woow, I mean closed minded jerk, now that was a good one, especially coming from an American.(insert sarcastic roll eyes cartoon)
And please put some spaces in between your sentences, I don't care about mistakes, but I do care about hurtin my eyes:D
Red Neck Philosophy 101, just for you
Chicks, Cars and 3rd World War.
and I did say the Circus was that way--------------->>>>>>>>>>
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Originally posted by Dowding
It seems the lack of knowledge about history is becoming a norm in the Western world.
Well, heck. Who needs that dusty old history stuff anyway?
After all,
You have to deal with the current situation, not historical injustice.
So why bother? Just learn the current situation and solve away.
:p
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Next stop, the Co-Dominium!
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Stang for that reason they just hate us even more. That is why we out of all people who back isreal got attack. 1+1=2 reasons. butr the big one is backing isreal.
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Skull, absolutely not. And i want to knwo who told you and WHY they think so... in their ignorant bliss...
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And, Skull, I want to know if your teacher also said we shouldn't support Israel because of this "cause." I'm dying to hear the lies being fed to America's youth.
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And, Skull, I want to know if your teacher also said we shouldn't support Israel because of this "cause." I'm dying to hear the lies being fed to America's youth.
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no she didn't say the isreali cause was not justified, just the fact that 2 people think they should own the same land. would you sue someone if you found he built something on your properity?
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Skull, I'll have to respond to this tomorrow... The land that was Israel from 1947 was not land that was taken.... yet another huge fallacy.
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Selective out of context cross-thread quoting - when you don't have anything to say, it at least allows you to keep your post rate up, what what?
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I don't see Russia sending troops into Iraq, I don't see them stoping their arming of Iran, and pre-war Iraq. The complained about Serbia.
When will the join the "global War on terror?
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Yeah, wouldn't it be lovely if you could say one thing in one thread and then say something contradictory in another thread and have no one notice?
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Contradictory on the surface, but only if you misunderstand what I meant and then take it out of context. Don't let that stop you, however.
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History is history, chum. It's either important to know it or (apparently) it's not important to know it and take it into account .
You decide.
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Knock it off. My point in the other thread had nothing to do with ignoring history. It was about using past injustice to justify new injustices, citing both slave reparations and forced unification of NI as examples.
If anything history teaches us that two wrongs don't make a right. Your deliberately obtuse responses won't wash.
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Yet another American believing they are the original terrorist victim. It seems the lack of knowledge about history is becoming a norm in the Western world.
Tell me, how did you use "Western world" in this quote? Do you include Jolly Olde in that generalization?
As for your intent in the other thread, what you believe you expressed may not be how it was received by the audience.
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Originally posted by JBA
I don't see Russia sending troops into Iraq,
Joining an agression while we still have problems inside the country that deserve military countermeasures? What for? To die for foreign interests again? We have Chechnya, it's more then enough.
Originally posted by JBA
I don't see them stoping their arming of Iran, and pre-war Iraq.
US armed both Iran and Iraq. So what? If they want to buy our weapons - it means that if we don't sell them - someone else will. And I am sure it will be US companies.
Originally posted by JBA
The complained about Serbia.
Agression against Yugoslavia was an open and clear operation of supporting terrorists. Wrong argument here.
Originally posted by JBA
When will the join the "global War on terror?
It's not a war on terror, it's a usual newspeak slogan hiding usual hypocritical policy of double standards. "Fighting" terrorists and at the same time giving them political support.
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Western world generally means Western Europe as well as Yank-Land. I'm guessing you're choosing to be obtuse again, as I'm told schooling in the 1920s was of a better standard than the late 20th century education I received.
Awful grand of you to speak on the behalf of the 'audience', by the way. Your misconception and unwillingness to understand after the fact is your problem. I have tried to explain it after all.
Have a nice day now! :aok
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Well, I was one of the audience.
Interesting you use the American then as your example of the "Western world".
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Not really, if anything it illuminates your need to find anti-American agenda everywhere.
He's an American with an ignorant view of global terrorism - I stated that. But to say that Americans only are getting stupider would be unfair, hence the Western world comment. I'd readily include the UK as a country who's people are in the race for the dumb and dumberer prize for History. And many other prizes besides.
No need to call in Mulder or Scully just yet.
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Thank you for clarifying that. I'll note it for history's sake.
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Heh. Very funny.
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Originally posted by Boroda
Agression against Yugoslavia was an open and clear operation of supporting terrorists. Wrong argument here.
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lol Boroda, actually it was GENOCIDE or if you prefer.....ETHNIC CLEANSING that got Yugo. in trouble.
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Originally posted by SLO
lol Boroda, actually it was GENOCIDE or if you prefer.....ETHNIC CLEANSING that got Yugo. in trouble.
Genocide accusations against Miloshevich were abandoned by international tribunal in Hague.
The number of victims before NATO bandits "interfered" was approximately 300 people on both sides.
And now, drumroll: in Autumn, 1998, Kosovo Liberation Army was declared a terrorist organisation by US Congress. So, you spent billions of dollars supporting terrorists and fighting Serbian police forces against international drug-dealers and slave-traders. It's hard to list all the violations of international laws that NATO agressors violated, including 1975 Helsinki declaration.
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From Boroda:
"US armed both Iran and Iraq. So what? If they want to buy our weapons - it means that if we don't sell them - someone else will. And I am sure it will be US companies. "
Yep they sold a heck of arms to both, and still do sell arms to many many bad-arse nations of the world.
In the Iran-Iraq war, one of the Nations had primarily U.S. weapons, while the other had USSR made stuff.
Old USSR was always on top as the worlds biggest arms seller, followed by the US, then the French, then the UK, and then Sweden actually.
I don't know how it is today.
But todays terrorists are mostly armed with russian hardware. Seems to be a lot of it about, and it's usually good stuff.....
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Originally posted by Angus
Old USSR was always on top as the worlds biggest arms seller, followed by the US, then the French, then the UK, and then Sweden actually.
I don't know how it is today.
IIRC now we are at the third place after US and France, with US selling several times more weapons then Russia.
Originally posted by Angus
But todays terrorists are mostly armed with russian hardware. Seems to be a lot of it about, and it's usually good stuff.....
Soviet small arms are very simple, reliable and cheap to produce. And many weapons that you can call "Russian" are made in China, Romania and other former Socialist countries. You don't see modern Soviet/Russian weapons used by terrorists outside Chechnya. There are very few (if any) exported AK-74s or RPG-18s "Muha" ("Fly"), mostly Chinese 7.62mm AKs and RPG-7s.
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Originally posted by Boroda
US armed both Iran and Iraq. So what? If they want to buy our weapons - it means that if we don't sell them - someone else will. And I am sure it will be US companies.
Would this be pre or post 1991 sanctions?
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Originally posted by Dowding
Contradictory on the surface, but only if you misunderstand what I meant and then take it out of context.
Now we know why you are a sKerry supporter at least.
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Originally posted by JBA
Would this be pre or post 1991 sanctions?
Unlike some "democratic" countries, Russian Federation respects international law. There were no weapon sales to Iraq since 1990, or, IIRC, even earlier.
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
(http://mrgrumman.home.comcast.net/KerryOnTerrorism.JPG)
That chin is OBSCENE!
Karaya
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Now we know why you are a sKerry supporter at least.
You idiot. What makes you think I'm even American?
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I've got a russian gun myself.
It's ok,but I have to use tape to hold it together :D
I have a Czech gun as well. It's quite ok.
Guns in the old USSR period were very cheap indeed, and widely available.