Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Axis vs Allies => Topic started by: jamusta on October 07, 2004, 08:36:11 PM
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The CT is no different than the MA. There I was surrounded at a9. There were multiple bogeys around me. Im getting shot down left and right. The action is hot. Im engaging 3 and 4 bandits. Then it happens. THEY BEGIN TO VULCH!!!!! This continues on for what seems an eternity. Mind you the next friendly base is almost 2 sectors away. N1k's 110's cannon rounds blowing me to bits along with my p38 buddy. So since certain folks ruin gameplay in the CT I will bid you all a farewell. You can have this sucky arena. With that going on no wonder your numbers stay so low.
Those of you who fly in the CT knows the group I am talking about. You should police your community. Get rid of the bad seeds.
Have fun!
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Still far fewer "bad seeds" in the CT than in the MA anyday.
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Yea, I'm consistantly amused at how the "CT regulars" tout themselves as being better than the average "MAer".. it simply isnt true.
More timid maybe, better no.
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http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=128380 (http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=128380)
This seems to fall under #2
Being vulched sucks... (at some point it's happens to everyone)
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How has Aces High survived so long without Playground Monitors?
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Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
Still far fewer "bad seeds" in the CT than in the MA anyday.
True, very true.
The CT maybe has 5 of the 30 as bad guys,,,
The MA is more like 100 out of 600...
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I actually happened to be in the CT around the same time - first time I'd tried to fly there.
2/3 of the players (or more at times) were on the Japanese side, mostly in N1K's - big shock, everyone switching to use the most uber plane. So gang-bangs and vultched fields was the entre for the US who couldn't get CHogs without a 3-sector transit flight from CV's.
I saw a couple of requests for people to switch sides to make it even and those requests were ignored at best, and ragged on at worst.
When lone P38's and P47's decided to run from multiple N1K's they were ridiculed on the open channel.
I did see more salutes, and obviously some folks are playing with the right spirit. But overall I didn't see anything that diffrent from the MA, just less volume of it.
Oh well.
-DoK
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
True, very true.
The CT maybe has 5 of the 30 as bad guys,,,
The MA is more like 100 out of 600...
:lol
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Yea, I'm consistantly amused at how the "CT regulars" tout themselves as being better than the average "MAer".. it simply isnt true.
I think it stems from CT "regulars" having no problems racking up kills in the MA vs the CT. Obviously because there is more targets to choose from there. When the MAs best sticks come to the CT the have no problems beating up CT regulars. I dont really think the majority of CT regulars think they are better then all the MA sticks, they feel the arena is better. Better suited to what they find fun. CT has some antagonizers that (whether they mean to or not) give some a bad impression of all CTers. That has been the case for a while now. Same can be said of trash talkers in the MA. I wonder why some of you get insulted that MAers come to the CT, or why some of you get insulted because some like the CT better. Either place is what you make of it. Shut up and fly, try and have some damn fun.
You should police your community. Get rid of the bad seeds. /B]
What do you suggest? Banning of players? What defines a bad seed? What arena do you not get vulched in? Not popping off Jamusta, Id like to know what your answers are.
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Originally posted by DoKGonZo
I actually happened to be in the CT around the same time - first time I'd tried to fly there.
2/3 of the players (or more at times) were on the Japanese side, mostly in N1K's - big shock, everyone switching to use the most uber plane. So gang-bangs and vultched fields was the entre for the US who couldn't get CHogs without a 3-sector transit flight from CV's.
I saw a couple of requests for people to switch sides to make it even and those requests were ignored at best, and ragged on at worst.
When lone P38's and P47's decided to run from multiple N1K's they were ridiculed on the open channel.
I did see more salutes, and obviously some folks are playing with the right spirit. But overall I didn't see anything that diffrent from the MA, just less volume of it.
Oh well.
-DoK
When I was on, there was many more Allied. I think the 68 guys made the allied numbers high - , then when they logged it must have swung the other way.
Jamusta , I find the CT is basically the same as the MA . Every MA type is represented there in roughly equivalent proportions , the good the bad and ugly. I guess that represents human nature doesn't it. I did expect it to be a little different at first also , but it's not really, so no biggie.
The gang fighting is sometimes worse than the MA , not because of evil intent , it's just that when the numbers are low , when a con eventually turns up , everyone is in there trying to get a kill.
It is still possible to have some fun fights though , due to the smaller numbers. Try to have a fun fight 1-1, 2-2 in the MA with 400 up.
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1: Everyone has their preferences. Mine is the cockpit of a Corsair in a Pac setting in the CT. For others it may be a Zeke or Tony or George in the same setting. Or a Hellcat or Thunderbolt or Pony. Or a Euro setting in an Axis or Allied ride .... etc. But if we place the needs of the arena ahead of our own (and face it, in a low population arena - we really HAVE to) then we need to broaden our horizons. It's not a mandatory thang. It's a voluntary thang. And it's even kinda a fun thang. I encourage everyone to try it. You don't know what you're missing if you don't.
I pity tha foo!
2. Vulching, swarming, playing RISK .... we've all done it from time to time. It can be fun and funny ... for awhile. But when it becomes the norm for an individual or group to do it and keep doing it .... just to:
a: get kills
b: piss off the other guy
c: address one's own boredom
... then perhaps some reflection is in order? Dontcha get bored boring others? I do. I haven't seen anyone impressed with anyone else's points or rank in the CT for a long time. Ya figure it'd sink in.
"But ARLOOOOO! The name of the game in AH is capture the flag!"
Well ... could be .... could be not. It's not a mandatory thang. It's a voluntary thang. Try something else for a change. You don't know what you're missing if you don't.
I pity the foo!
3. Smacking. Well hell ... smacktalk is a game all itself. Some insist on doing it when they're not really good at it. But hey ... that's ok too ... if they can handle taking what they're despirately trying to dish out. But again .... what's the motivation? Are we "taunting" the other side to get them to fight? Are we frustrated with the other side for being gamey (or even seeming gamey)? Or maybe for shooting us down when we know deep down in our heart that we coulda beat that bastidge if he didn't have alt/numbers/speed/cannons/a better turner/a lousy connection/a better joysick/favoritism from HT/a bigger noodle/etc. Or ... are we just having fun?
Key: Patience .... maturity .... sense of humor .... ability to either participate in a joking (non-serious) manner. Or maybe just the ability to ignore it all and have fun.
Can't stand losing an argument? Don't argue. Because, man ... you're certainly not gonna win one. Not here in AH. Feel obligated to beech and moan constantly? Well hell ... if you think you're accomplishing anything more than amusement for the masses, you got another thang coming. Just say no. It's not a mandatory thang. It's a voluntary thang. I encourage everyone to try it. You're not really missing anything by stopping.
I pity tha foo!
4. "Making friends and influencing others"
Why is this so hard? Can't most of us do this in real life? Maybe not all ... but most? Why can't I be friends with players that belong to JG54 and the Checkers? Is it a gang thang? I'll be friends with whoever I want. Unless they don't wanna be. Then it's their problem ... not mine.
On the flip side ... I make it clear what I expect from friends. It's not alot. It's basically ... to act friendly. Act friendly to me. Act friendly to my friends. Believe it or not ... we can play a game that involves us virtually shooting each other down and blowing each other up and be friends.
That DOESN'T mean we can't pretend to hate.
HATE ... is a game. It's virtual. Hate the enemy. Hate the bad guy. Hate the oppressor. Hell .. hate your wingman. Hate yourself! Play the role
But don't take it too seriously or you'll end up hating the game. Don't hate the game. It's a GAME! It's a ROLE! Hell ... we got players in the MA that think Rooklandia, Bishoptopia and the Kingdom of Knight are REAL FUGGIN COUNTRIES!
So yeah .... play Jack Nicholson or John Wayne or whoever. Fight the bad guy for God and country. But keep it a game. The guy in the other pixilated virtual airplane (or tank or ship or gun) is another stupid hick with a connection to the internet ... just .. like ... you. You have WAY more in common than you think.
Play nice. It's not a mandatory thang. It's a voluntary thang. And it's even kinda a fun thang. I encourage everyone to try it. You don't know what you're missing if you don't.
I pity tha foo!
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its the jap planes
happens everytime :)
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Jamusta was upping repeatedly from a capped field A9 that we were about to capture to prevent the allies from using it as a forward base in the upcoming mission. I was one of two players capping the field on rotation. I let him up a few times and he became a nuisance, other players shot him down. Finally I vultched him 4 times til he apparantly got the idea and left. The same thing goes for skratt only the other guy kept vultching him.
My suggestion would be not to up from a capped field. It's pretty obvious what was going on.
BTW I knew I would see this thread today.
Also, We had a flood of mostly MA players in the Arena last night when I was on. The numbers were 26 Allied to 15 Axis when I logged. One could hardly be surprised by MA players playing MA and other MA players finding the game play to be like the MA :D I'm sure the niuance escapes you.
As a very regular CT player who occasionally goes into the MA I can say that the differences are blaring, except when we have many MA players in the arena.
Still I hope that squads like the 68th "Lightning Lancers" would participate more often in the CT. They put up stiff fights and fought well together. They also put up a very credible bombing mission that would have succeeded had the arena been running realistic radar not that gamey crap the CT staff insists on using. They tried to come in NOE, sadly NOE seems to be a thing of the past in the CT. Irrespectively a hearty congrats to the 68th on a great effort. You are a fine group of players.
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Originally posted by storch
Jamusta was upping repeatedly from a capped field A9 that we were about to capture to prevent the allies from using it as a forward base in the upcoming mission. I was one of two players capping the field on rotation. I let him up a few times and he became a nuisance, other players shot him down. Finally I vultched him 4 times til he apparantly got the idea and left. The same thing goes for skratt only the other guy kept vultching him.
My suggestion would be not to up from a capped field. It's pretty obvious what was going on.
BTW I knew I would see this thread today.
Also, We had a flood of mostly MA players in the Arena last night when I was on. The numbers were 26 Allied to 15 Axis when I logged. One could hardly be surprised by MA players playing MA and other MA players finding the game play to be like the MA :D I'm sure the niuance escapes you.
As a very regular CT player who occasionally goes into the MA I can say that the differences are blaring, except when we have many MA players in the arena.
Still I hope that squads like the 68th "Lightning Lancers" would participate more often in the CT. They put up stiff fights and fought well together. They also put up a very credible bombing mission that would have succeeded had the arena been running realistic radar not that gamey crap the CT staff insists on using. They tried to come in NOE, sadly NOE seems to be a thing of the past in the CT. Irrespectively a hearty congrats to the 68th on a great effort. You are a fine group of players.
I'm curious , how did the flood of MA players (assume you're talking about the 68 guys) make the CT like the MA ?
They were running some fun missions/flights from what I could see
Not sure what you mean by this - more like the MA, because of a few extra players.
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Storch.
I come into the CT to find a good fight. If you dont want to fight let me know. I find it difficult to take that you guys are capturing fields with 12 people online. My whole take on the situation is this, a few JB's came into the arena the other night and did exactly what you guys were doing last night. They made the #'s advantage go for the allies. The axis got pushed back to their field then they started vulching. You switched sides and start blasting the MA players calling them Mprettythangholes and telling them to go back to the MA with the gaminess. After that it seems most JG-54 guys logged. Yet you justify you doing it because you were capturing a base?
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I don't know what the CT is like most nights, I only know what I saw last night. The base captures didn't bother me. The over-use of the Ki-84 didn't bother me.
What bothered me was that when people asked for players to switch sides to balance things they were flipped the bird on the open channel. And when players declined to enter obviously suicidal engagements they were also cat-called on the open channel.
I'll see what the next plane rotation is - if it's early war I'll give it another try.
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That was the first experience I had in the CT DoKGonZo.
I engage 4 enemies was quickly dispatched then was told how much I sucked.
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Originally posted by DoKGonZo
I don't know what the CT is like most nights, I only know what I saw last night. The base captures didn't bother me. The over-use of the Ki-84 didn't bother me.
Heh. Looking forward to the Ki-84 so much that you already ascribe overuse to it, DoKGonZo?
As to that particular whine. The Allied flying can keep on bleating, but until I see them all flying P-40s and F4Fs I see no reason why the Japanese, almost always outnumbered, should also fly their least capable aircraft. That particular whine has also struck me as sour grapes from Allied flyiers who merely want a Marianas Turkey Shoot.
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lol, I was told by AWC, I was an ack hugger, scared to fly, and did not know how to fly the F4U, all because I would not turn with his zeke, when he had a substantial alt advantage over me, when I tryed to bleed his e, he accused me of BnZing and he was the one with superior alt and E........
I admit it, I am SKEERED of you all in the great CT.............pfffh :D
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why not everyone that is not a CT regular just give the arena to the select few, heck let them rename it to "so& so squad Arena" hehe
that way they can have it their way , like it was Burger King LOL!
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Originally posted by jamusta
Storch.
I come into the CT to find a good fight. If you dont want to fight let me know. I find it difficult to take that you guys are capturing fields with 12 people online. My whole take on the situation is this, a few JB's came into the arena the other night and did exactly what you guys were doing last night. They made the #'s advantage go for the allies. The axis got pushed back to their field then they started vulching. You switched sides and start blasting the MA players calling them Mprettythangholes and telling them to go back to the MA with the gaminess. After that it seems most JG-54 guys logged. Yet you justify you doing it because you were capturing a base?
I guess you understand why I have not been back. Tired of high speed HOs from 190s and people like Storch
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Originally posted by Karnak
Heh. Looking forward to the Ki-84 so much that you already ascribe overuse to it, DoKGonZo?
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My bad ... I'm just used to the Ki from "other games." And I was in a P47. I only wish it was all Zekes and P40's and FM2's and early war crap like that.
That you can accuse me of whining about things that went on in the CT before when I clearly said this was the first time I ever tried to fly there does little to raise your credability. And that you'd accuse me of whining at all when I clearly said I was bothered by the attitude much more than the gameplay is strike 2.
My desire to try CT again is decreasing with every post I see. Well done.
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DoKGonZo,
Well, what you were harping on is a long standing position held by a few loud Allied fliers. It has been stated and restated over and over and over. Allied players have advocated F4U/F6F/F4F/P-51/P-47/P-38 vs A6M5/Ki-61 setups as fair and when the N1K2 is added it tends to produce negative posts regarding the chances of the Allied fliers against the vaunted N1K2-J.
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Well, I'd venture a guess that most "allied flyers" don't like the Niki because it is a tad bit harder to bore n zoom than the zeke, and it has the firepower to make a stupid allied flyer pay for a mistake, unlike the Ki61.
Honestly, the niki isn't all that much more capable than the Ki-61, it just has twice the firepower.
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Originally posted by DoKGonZo
My desire to try CT again is decreasing with every post I see. Well done.
RL kept me away last night. Judging from these posts, it was probably a bad evening to test the waters, DoK. The informal Thursday night missions are a relatively recent phenomenon. Mostly they're a lot of fun. Perhaps there were a few people who took them just a bit too seriously. That probably also explains the numbers imbalance - it was one of the rare times there is a "goal" in the CT.
This plane set also suffers because, for most people, there is a serious gap in the quality of the three main Japanese rides. If you pick the Zeke because you're not an experienced Tony flyer, the Corsairs and Lightnings and 47s b&z you, and walk away if they can't. Many people get frustrated by that and, not wanting to spend more time on the Tony (like my boss, the impatient Grits), move to the only other available ride. This dissuades Allied players from flying P40s and Wildcats, which are actually a pretty nice match against the Zeke and Tony.
Try the CT a few more times before you finalize your opinion, is my suggestion.
- oldman
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Originally posted by Karnak
... Allied players have advocated F4U/F6F/F4F/P-51/P-47/P-38 vs A6M5/Ki-61 setups as fair ...
Gag.
Maybe the F4U-1 (to keep the Ki-61 honest) ... but otherwise F4F, FM2, and P40's only.
... "bore n zoom" ... well I guess I have no place in the CT as I am a pure energy fighter ... enjoy ...
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I dont understand the complaint about the N1k. They can be handled with relative easy if you fly to the strength on the allied planes. That on the other hand can get boring. I choose to turn fight them in a p47 cus that is fun to me. Also f6f is more than a hand full for the n1k.
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Originally posted by Urchin
Well, I'd venture a guess that most "allied flyers" don't like the Niki because it is a tad bit harder to bore n zoom than the zeke, and it has the firepower to make a stupid allied flyer pay for a mistake, unlike the Ki61.
Honestly, the niki isn't all that much more capable than the Ki-61, it just has twice the firepower.
Rather fight an average player in a George than an average player in a Zeke anyday. :D
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Guys ... I'm tellin' ya ... we need more players like DoK and jamusta. We need MORE players in the CT ... period!
And the overall feedback I got from the 68th (they requested VF-17 tag along with them as top cover for a run or two) was positive. A couple members seemed to have gotten a little frustrated and left for the MA but I think they just wasn't used to the fact that most of the "regular" CT folk know the map well and can anticipate where threats will appear.
One of the challenges of the CT (especially the slot map) is it's relatively small scale in comparison to some of the huge MA maps. And we've played them enough to have beaten down paths between the same 4-5 bases on most of `em.
As far as not playing nice is concerned. We reap what we sow. It's as true here in Ace's High as it is in real life. Of course, nice is relative. As long as I have options, I generally don't care. But I'll continue to be a side balancer and I'll continue to prefer air engagements over land-grabbing. That's me.
You guys do and say what you feel ya gotta. If you're actually having fun doing some of the things you do online ... who am I to say otherwise?
Personally, I feel that there's room for more players of any mindset. Hell, if the CT got an influx of non-land-grabbing, side-balancing, polite and professional on channel one types ... then perhaps the two groups could just ignore each other and have fun. :D
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Arlo you talk alot of trash, yet I enjoy flying with you. I can tell your trash talking isnt serious. But just like any other noobie, which I am to your arena, I dont wish to try out something new just to get bashed by the regulars. Doing that will just turn the any new guy away. Now if I was a regular to the arena then I wouldnt mind the bashing I receive. But I am still trying to figure out the personality of your community. So far I have the impression that some dont want the CT to grow because they will soon find themselves at the bottom of the food chain.
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Originally posted by Arlo
We need MORE players in the CT ... period!
I would like to see more organized squads in the CT....
But when we see more and more "lone wolf" types flying in the CT when the arena number gets around 30 it leads to a game style play that pisses off CT regulars.
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If storch was involved u would have got the following advisery...
Dear Allies, your base has been marked for Tactical Suppresion. Please leave the runway at wour own risk. Thank you However I do not remeber learning of the nme giveing the other a chance too get off the ground, but it is just a game and far be it for me to break anyone else's rules of conduct. I for one am not one to vulch, but being in IJN plane with Storch and fellow JG's I had an unstopable voice in my head and fell into the requests of LwDwn's evil axis brother. That and iI had too keep upstageing Allmetal and land more kills than him, which i did, so guess i was scorepotatoin. DAM THOSE JG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad:
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Originally posted by Gary26
If storch was involved u would have got the following advisery...
Dear Allies, your base has been marked for Tactical Suppresion. Please leave the runway at wour own risk. Thank you However I do not remeber learning of the nme giveing the other a chance too get off the ground, but it is just a game and far be it for me to break anyone else's rules of conduct. I for one am not one to vulch, but being in IJN plane with Storch and fellow JG's I had an unstopable voice in my head and fell into the requests of LwDwn's evil axis brother. That and iI had too keep upstageing Allmetal and land more kills than him, which i did, so guess i was scorepotatoin. DAM THOSE JG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad:
heheh we bring out the worst in people sometimes :)
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Originally posted by soda72
I would like to see more organized squads in the CT....
But when we see more and more "lone wolf" types flying in the CT when the arena number gets around 30 it leads to a game style play that pisses off CT regulars.
That being what? Vultching? BnZ? Trying to take bases? Flying US planes? All these seem to be frowned on by someone or other.
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DoK,
I know you fly under a different ID so I have no idea what time you came in last night. While I was there, the Nippon side was usually 4-5 guys less than the U.S. side. I asked if a few would change over to even it up. So what if I got heckled. I winged with storch and almetal for a few and we dumped 47's and 38's in the drink. Urchin dumped me. Jamusta sorry for what happened to you. Still on the previous map you seemed to have a great deal of fun along with the rest of us.
CT has some bad nights with MA folks playing MA style. It's ok. Most of the time I've flown in the CT the CT regulars make it worth the momentary inconvieniences. Last night was unusual in that the channel 1 conversations were not as fun as I have come to expect.
But I have faith, I'll be back to the CT I fly for the regulars anyway...GUYS
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I'm LwDwn Bustr :aok
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Originally posted by DoKGonZo
That being what? Vultching? BnZ? Trying to take bases? Flying US planes? All these seem to be frowned on by someone or other.
hehehe... there is a list of CT unwritten rules that makes "all the above ok"...
I'm still trying to figure them all out... :)
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yeah, sux sometimes in CT, earlier this week we had a great fight raging. I usually just switch to the team that has least players, I was japanese then went allied, and found VWE and other tardlings just vulching the crap outta the only decent allied base worth fighting from, its not as if its a contest furballing A6M's and N1K's with 38's and 47's.
It really disappoints me, when will people realise the value of a good fight over the amount of kills you land? Still, when i was new landing kills was all that mattered to me, seems some people 'mature' over their AH career. Respect is hard to win, easy to lose.
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Originally posted by jamusta
Arlo you talk alot of trash, yet I enjoy flying with you. I can tell your trash talking isnt serious. But just like any other noobie, which I am to your arena, I dont wish to try out something new just to get bashed by the regulars. Doing that will just turn the any new guy away. Now if I was a regular to the arena then I wouldnt mind the bashing I receive. But I am still trying to figure out the personality of your community. So far I have the impression that some dont want the CT to grow because they will soon find themselves at the bottom of the food chain.
You hit the nail on the head
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People say the CT has a higher quality than the MA, i am beginning to disagree with this. The MA is a gangfest, whereas the CT seems to be more 1 vs 1.
I have to say, my favourite opponent in the CT is Eagler - he really is a class act. The (unfortunately its not more) few fights i have had with him are always fun. And i am sure many will agree with me.
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Originally posted by jamusta
So far I have the impression that some dont want the CT to grow because they will soon find themselves at the bottom of the food chain.
Well ... you could be right there. But I hope that's not the majority.
The CT suffers from it's low population. It's a vicious circle when players won't fly there because the numbers are low and when they do venture in they see the worst of it .... yet the only way to help things improve is for the numbers to grow.
I've heard people say that there's always a percentage of bad apples in every group. I dunno if the percentage stays equal across the board, though. Maybe smaller groups can have a larger percentage. Or a smaller one ... I dunno. But whatever players are in a smaller arena/group, anyone who's acting like an idiot probably stands out more.
So ... (and I think you probably see where I'm going here) ... my answer to the problem is to recruit more non-idiots until the idiots end up having to stay in the corner more. I say whip them with that food chain until they either grow or become even more tenderized. (Old sharks need them more tender). *ShruG*
But then ... I've always had way too simplistic an outlook on things. :)
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Ok, where to start. How about this one?
Allied players have advocated F4U/F6F/F4F/P-51/P-47/P-38 vs A6M5/Ki-61 setups as fair and when the N1K2 is added it tends to produce negative posts regarding the chances of the Allied fliers against the vaunted N1K2-J.
Why dont you try and produce some evidence of this? When was there a set up ran like this? This does nothing but add fuel to the fire Karnak and is poor form.
My desire to try CT again is decreasing with every post I see. Well done.
Dont let the vocal minority run you off. You'll get to know who the windbags are and find some of them really arent that bad. They have just failed to realize textbuffer bs does no good for the CT. Dont write us off just yet.
But I am still trying to figure out the personality of your community. So far I have the impression that some dont want the CT to grow because they will soon find themselves at the bottom of the food chain.
Plenty of personality here. Stick around, the CT can be a blast.
when will people realise the value of a good fight over the amount of kills you land?
Hopefully sooner than later.
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Slash27,
Nowhere did I say it ever ran. The fact is though, that it has been claimed as "fair" and advocated as a setup.
OK, maybe not all the Army aircraft. But close, close enough to make no difference.
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The fact is though, that it has been claimed as "fair" and advocated as a setup.
Silly claim.As an "Allied" flyer me and my squad dont support and never have supported lopsided Axis bashing. The Ki-84 cant get soon enough for me.
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Originally posted by soda72
I would like to see more organized squads in the CT....
But when we see more and more "lone wolf" types flying in the CT when the arena number gets around 30 it leads to a game style play that pisses off CT regulars.
I don't think it's a case of the lone wolfs being the problem, actually. Organized squads are cool but large squads can also lead to "gang" mentality, it seems. I wouldn't have realized that if my squad hadn't become so inactive over time.
The mere presense of a large squad in a small arena can lead to bad things without another large squad opposing it ... at all times. Squad members develop the mentality of flying with their squad no matter what. It doesn't matter if there's 14 squadies on and 3 opponents. The feel the MUST fly as a coherent unit 24/7.
Not many squads encourage their members to split up and oppose each other. It's certainly not a common thing in the MA. There are a few in the CT. But those squads aren't the largest.
I've seen squads log on in the CT during dead hours and 6 guys go on a milk spree until the map resets (which we all know porks the CT arena). Why do they do that? Well ... they're bored. And that squad has the mindset that that's a fun thing to do. Or maybe just one or two of the bossy ones do and the rest just wanna do whatever those guys want as long as the squad flies together.
I'm not knocking you or your squad, Soda (nor am I singling any one squad out). I've flown with you and I like ya. You're a nice fella and you're fun to fly with ... as are many in your squad. But ... I don't think organized squadrons ... strictly speaking ... is the answer.
Perhaps an organized arena is more along the lines of what would help things in the CT. A scenario-like atmosphere that regularly permeates the arena.
Thursday night missions was going to help that along but it's kinda fallen apart. I think that's because it hasn't ever really been approached as a scenario.
As much as I'm an advocate for multiple styles of play ... I heartily recommend scenario ground rules to be put into place. Let's say we start organizing scenario-style mission match-ups right here in the forum?
Set up the forces. Players sign up in threads. Sure ... walk-ons always welcome but when you have a balanced core already set up before they log on, that'll contribute to more balance.
Determine equal goals for both sides but give the battle more depth. Sure .... for the assault/bomber types you can select a base or number of bases that need capturing on both sides. Not the whole map, mind you .... or even a significant chunk of it. Two or three, tops.
For the air to air types add in kill attrition. A certain number of kills on one side or the other and the battle stops right there ... .due to attrition.
Throw in other ground rules such as forfeiture due to side disparity. If one side or the other surpasses their oppoent by a certain percentage ... battle's considered over and the side that breached the limit loses. That's right .... if your side is getting close to 2v1 (just an example) and the next three guys that log on all gravitate to your side and pushes it over the mark ... boom .... battle lost.
Before anyone says that seems unfair ... look at what it promotes. It's pretty much a self-imposed balancer in the CT. If my side is fighting hard to win the battle and I see the roster start to tilt the odds in favor of the side I'm flying for I'm going to make requests of balance known. Whether that involves new log-ons to be given the suggestion to fly on the other side or for players to switch. I'll even switch .... just to keep the battle going - but that's a personal thing. Like I said, it'll promote the larger side advocating arena balance to log-ons.
Of course, there's the chance that players would try to abuse the rule and mass migrate to the opposing side to cause them to lose when they are, in fact, winning. But with such a small population that would be kinda obvious and we could just as easily throw in a clause that that represents actual capitulation of the migratory birds.
There could be more things we think of, as a group, I'm sure. But I think you see where I'm going with this. The key isn't organization on the individual squad level. It's organization on an entire arena level.
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Originally posted by bustr
DoK,
I know you fly under a different ID so I have no idea what time you came in last night. While I was there, the Nippon side was usually 4-5 guys less than the U.S. side. I asked if a few would change over to even it up. So what if I got heckled. I winged with storch and almetal for a few and we dumped 47's and 38's in the drink. Urchin dumped me. Jamusta sorry for what happened to you. Still on the previous map you seemed to have a great deal of fun along with the rest of us.
CT has some bad nights with MA folks playing MA style. It's ok. Most of the time I've flown in the CT the CT regulars make it worth the momentary inconvieniences. Last night was unusual in that the channel 1 conversations were not as fun as I have come to expect.
But I have faith, I'll be back to the CT I fly for the regulars anyway...GUYS
Seeing guys like Buster in the game makes it all worthwhile to me. I consider him one of my new best CT friends. :D
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Arlo,
Right now I keep coming back for the banter and the fact that most of the players will give you a or indulge my rediculous humor. I'm incredibly impressed with the high level of impromptu vox communications between pilots to fly in support of each other. Storch flew pickup with me last night. We were in Nik1J. with no planning we called the cons and knocked them down as though we had been flying squaddees for a long time. All of the CT regulars have this quality.
Since I have been in the CT, more players have been willing to talk on vox and help each other then I have ever seen outside of squads in the MA. I've also noticed even the yahoos or grouchies will talk to you if you are persistant. They even tone it down a little if you just talk to them. It can be a tad discouraging or demeaning talking with them, but again if you stay positive most of the CT responds that way.
This game is between our ears. It's not the responsibility of anyone here to make you feel good. Thats your job. Its their job to shoot holes in your crate and send you a because you were willing to come to the CT and play.
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Originally posted by dedalos
I guess you understand why I have not been back. Tired of high speed HOs from 190s and people like Storch
You are very wrong and I will ask other CT regulars to please answer these questions.
Does storch regularly:
1. attack head on
2. fly the 190
3. vultch
What happened? did I pop a 20mm cap into your weenie arse and anger you?
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Originally posted by Arlo
Seeing guys like Buster in the game makes it all worthwhile to me. I consider him one of my new best CT friends. :D
I like bustr a lot too
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Storch,
When you are not stomping on the ducklings that follow you around the field, you are a very principled and considerate CT regular. What do you want, a case of scotch and 2 days in a bordelo???????????????????:)
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Funny.........
The only one I ever see flying a N1K2 is Storch.............
:D
Any rumors that I've been in one are vicious lies! Sorta.
Actually I'd love having more early planeset stuff. Much more challenging for the other guy to kill me if he's only got MGs lol. I'll take a P40 or a F4F over the Juginator anyday, heck even the SBD is fun (although it climbs worse than a fat man tryin to climb a greased pole.
:D
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Originally posted by Arlo
The key isn't organization on the individual squad level. It's organization on an entire arena level.
I agree with you completely, but this organization will lack a foundation with out a CT staffer dedicated to the cause.
Would be more than willing to help attempt build a scenario-like atmosphere for those that would be interested in it( I do think the open feeling of the arena should be maintainied). But can't help feel that it would all be a wasted effort to plan an operational level mission for each Thursday and find out that 1/2 the time there will be no staffer there to help make adjustments and help score it.
Would be nice to believe that it could be done without strong admin leadership, but I don't believe it can.
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Goood lord you can type :)
Originally posted by Arlo
Perhaps an organized arena is more along the lines of what would help things in the CT. A scenario-like atmosphere that regularly permeates the arena.
Wouldn't this make it more like the special events arena?
Originally posted by Arlo
Thursday night missions was going to help that along but it's kinda fallen apart. I think that's because it hasn't ever really been approached as a scenario.
This is what I ment by organized squads.....
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But can't help feel that it would all be a wasted effort to plan an operational level mission for each Thursday and find out that 1/2 the time there will be no staffer there to help make adjustments and help score it.
The new staffers will be operating soon. The sky isnt falling.
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Originally posted by soda72
I would like to see more organized squads in the CT....
But when we see more and more "lone wolf" types flying in the CT when the arena number gets around 30 it leads to a game style play that pisses off CT regulars.
this seems to be a common theme that I don't understand . Storch also talks about how how the MA'ers ruin the game play.
As primarily an MA'er that spends some time in the CT also , what exactly is it that we do that ruins gameplay for the regulars ?
As far as i can remember , I fly both sides to even numbers, don't vulch , fly a mix of planes....
If there's a list of unwritten rules that we are supposed to be breaking , can you point me to them .
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Heck there is not even a staffer around to change the scenario or the MOTD. No wonder we can't get folks in the arena. It should be the TT arena not the CT. It takes a few days for the thing to settle down for the new week!
T hrown T ogether....
I'm not talkin a lack of maps either.
The new staffers will be operating soon. The sky isnt falling.
You check outside in the last few minutes?
;)
Crumpp
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Heck there is not even a staffer around to change the scenario or the MOTD
There isnt? Could have fooled me:rolleyes:
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At about 30+ players the conversations on channel 1 change from good natured razzing to something a littel more akin to the MA channel 200. I think the increase in numbers reduces the feelings of being a group of freinds enjoying a common activity and the communication that engenders it. As the numbers go up the vox conversations become more localised between small groups while the emotional results of failed duels starts to increase on channel1.
The UNWRITTEN RULE is - Care more about everyones experience in the CT than just your OWN.
We become isolated from the fun when the numbers of players increase.
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Heck there is not even a staffer around to change the scenario or the MOTD
MMMMMMM
There isnt? Could have fooled me
Well Get BUSY!
:)
Crumpp
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Just checked the CT. That was an amazing transformation.
I am speechless.
:lol
Seriously, I am begging you. Down on my knees and fully aware of your godlike CT powers....
NOT ANOTHER WEEK OF THE PACWAR!!
If you must have another painful PACWAR week, then at least make it something with the Corsair in it. The way at least part of the CT (The VF-17 guys) will enjoy it.
You can see by my avatar I am not and allied frequent flyer.
Thanks
:aok
Crumpp
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Originally posted by TheBug
Would be more than willing to help attempt build a scenario-like atmosphere for those that would be interested in it( I do think the open feeling of the arena should be maintainied).
I will throw my hat into the ring on this too... but just can't have one side or the other planing stuff... burn out will happen and things will fall through. It has to be a conservative effort on both sides.
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JG54 will help out.
Crumpp
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Originally posted by Slash27
The new staffers will be operating soon. The sky isnt falling.
Thanks for your support.
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Thanks for your support The CT has my full support and Ive yet to refuse to help out with whatever people have asked of me. I hope when the new staffers come on board there will better working relationship with you.
NOT ANOTHER WEEK OF THE PACWAR!!
Lack of maps is wearing us all out Crummp. Sorry man.
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Originally posted by Crumpp
...
NOT ANOTHER WEEK OF THE PACWAR!!
If you must have another painful PACWAR week, then at least make it something with the Corsair in it. The way at least part of the CT (The VF-17 guys) will enjoy it.
...
[SHAMELESS PLUG]
Or a CBI set up along the lines we'll be using in Rangoon so folks can start to get a feel for the early-war iron.
[/SHAMELESS PLUG]
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Or a CBI set up along the lines we'll be using in Rangoon so folks can start to get a feel for the early-war iron.
We dont have a real CBI map, but Ill kick around adding the Hurri I and maybe take out the F4F.
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F4F is in the Rangoon scenario, Slash. But thanks. And thanks for taking that staffer slot. I'm staff light. Good news is staffers can fly their pick of aircarft each frame. So there ya go, ya P40 freak. :D
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What you have is fine. I didn't see the "this weeks setup" topic before posting here. Adding a Hurri (RNZAF) could help as the .303's are kinda different to shoot than .50's.
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)F4F is in the Rangoon scenario, Slash. But thanks. And thanks for taking that staffer slot. I'm staff light. Good news is staffers can fly their pick of aircarft each frame. So there ya go, ya P40 freak.
oh yeah:eek: (keep the P-40 fetish on the down low please:D )
Adding a Hurri (RNZAF) could help as the .303's are kinda different to shoot than .50's. rgr that.
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In the CT as with the MA, certain virtual pilot will insult you if you do not give them the fight they want.
I will run to ack, HO, and run from a unfair fight.
I very seldom vulch unless the field is about to be captured. I normally will let the enemy AC take off and get some alt. Unless of course there are about 3 or more taking off.
The main thing is, dont let people ruffle your feathers. People who talk smack usually aren't worth listening to anyways.
Favorite word I use to describe a "smack" talker,
DRONE!
:)
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Originally posted by storch
You are very wrong and I will ask other CT regulars to please answer these questions.
Does storch regularly:
1. attack head on
2. fly the 190
3. vultch
What happened? did I pop a 20mm cap into your weenie arse and anger you?
Ahh, nop, it was not you. You died later stick stiring, runing for the ack, and shooting your mouth off. You were in a G10 I think. You have to switch to the 190. 109s don't stick stir as good.
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Originally posted by dedalos
Ahh, nop, it was not you. You died later stick stiring, runing for the ack, and shooting your mouth off. You were in a G10 I think. You have to switch to the 190. 109s don't stick stir as good.
Please allow me to re-educate you because you are easily dumber than a rock collection. I don't run....much, the only things I stir are my martinis and the ***** in the skulls of imbeciles like you. SOO000000oooooo, Brrrrrrrrap! wrong answer! please try again. :D
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i love it when storch speaks in the super-secret-squirrel code. :rolleyes:
"dumber than a rock collection" = a better player.
"run..." = extend until otehrs come to help, at which point he reverses for a hopeful cherrypick.
"much" = when accompanied by 4 buddies.
"please try again" = as if you'll ever find me without buddies/acks nearby.
:aok
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Originally posted by Shane
i love it when storch speaks in the super-secret-squirrel code. :rolleyes:
"dumber than a rock collection" = a better player.
"run..." = extend until otehrs come to help, at which point he reverses for a hopeful cherrypick.
"much" = when accompanied by 4 buddies.
"please try again" = as if you'll ever find me without buddies/acks nearby.
:aok
still looking for you there cupcake, or is that also too cryptic for you? :D
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you'll have to wait til i drive the yankee devils out of virginia.
playing civil war generals II campaign lately.
*you* however, are welcome to find *me* here
http://www.flightladder.com//ladder.php?ladderid=3
:D
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playing civil war generals II campaign lately.
What a homo....
:D
Crumpp
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Originally posted by Shane
you'll have to wait til i drive the yankee devils out of virginia.
playing civil war generals II campaign lately.
*you* however, are welcome to find *me* here
http://www.flightladder.com//ladder.php?ladderid=3
:D
don't shoot yourself in the foot while playing with cap and ball firearms. Do you get to play Jefferson Davis evacuating the Captial? He was dressed as a woman. :D
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Originally posted by storch
Please allow me to re-educate you because you are easily dumber than a rock collection. I don't run....much, the only things I stir are my martinis and the ***** in the skulls of imbeciles like you. SOO000000oooooo, Brrrrrrrrap! wrong answer! please try again. :D
Would you like to host the film that shows how wrong I am? I am sure it will support all your arguments.
Shane :rofl
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Originally posted by dedalos
Would you like to host the film that shows how wrong I am? I am sure it will support all your arguments.
Shane :rofl
Who is this guy? For someone I've never seen in the CT he sure takes a lot of interest in it.
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Originally posted by Bear76
Who is this guy? For someone I've never seen in the CT he sure takes a lot of interest in it.
He's some guy that pops in from time to Bore n Zoom. He's fairly skilled......at Bore'n N Zoom'n I saw little else of him except nice vertical drops. Seems like a typical MA type, comes into the CT and gets spanked then leaves with unfulfilled expectations.
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Originally posted by storch
He's some guy that pops in from time to Bore n Zoom. He's fairly skilled......at Bore'n N Zoom'n I saw little else of him except nice vertical drops. Seems like a typical MA type, comes into the CT and gets spanked then leaves with unfulfilled expectations.
Lol storch. At list you are funny. Bore and Zoom is what I have found in the CT. Now, this may not be true in the curent set up but it has been the case the few times I logged on. Now with the exception of being repeatedly vulched, I don't have more than 1 or 2 deaths in there. Mostly to the luck of fighting, one high speed pass and the bad guy is gone. As far as me BnZing, well what can I say. You wont find me over 6K in the MA and I am usually in a slow plane. Unless you confuse E-Fighting with BnZing.
BEAR, sure I have a lot of interest in the CT. I hear all those good things about it and if nothing else, I pay for it. I figured I will try it. I thought it mayl be different. What I have found however, is that it is very simular to the MA with less people. Only the people think they are special. For example, check the comments from Storch: "Typical MA type". What I have seen are gungbangs and trash talking on the text buffer. Maybe it was just a bad day.
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I hear all those good things about it
I wonder why you hear those things?
I figured I will try it.
Good I hope you stick with it. It is much harder than the MA and not nearly as "Gamey".
What I have found however, is that it is very simular to the MA with less people. Only the people think they are special.
And this is from your wealth of experience in the CT. See second quote.
What I have seen are gungbangs and trash talking on the text buffer. Maybe it was just a bad day.
It does happen in the CT. Not nearly on the same frequency or basis as the MA.
We would love to have fly in the CT. It does require a completely different set of skills from the MA and you will have to learn to fly something besides the late war uber fighters.
I will say your post's smack of whinning to this point. Some Advice for ANY arena:
1. Don't take off at a base that is being capped. Take off at another base, come in with altitude and remove the cap. It will save you the frustration of being "vulched".
2. Don't follow them into the ack. Running to the ack is smart when your disadvantaged. Recognize that and don't fall for it. Break off, retain your energy advantage, and reenter the fight on your terms again.
3. "Bore and Snore" fighting is usually heard from guys who don't know how to not only conserve their energy but build it while depleteing the attackers. Ask some guys in the arena or check with NetAces. There are some good articles available and lots of willing folks to help out.
Big Boy rules. If you enter the fight with a disadvantage don't be surprised, defensive, angry, or blame others when you die. Your the dummy that entered the fight.
If the CT is not your cup of tea, fine. ! Take Care, and don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya!
Crumpp
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Originally posted by dedalos
Lol storch. At list you are funny. Bore and Zoom is what I have found in the CT. Now, this may not be true in the curent set up but it has been the case the few times I logged on. Now with the exception of being repeatedly vulched, I don't have more than 1 or 2 deaths in there. Mostly to the luck of fighting, one high speed pass and the bad guy is gone. As far as me BnZing, well what can I say. You wont find me over 6K in the MA and I am usually in a slow plane. Unless you confuse E-Fighting with BnZing.
BEAR, sure I have a lot of interest in the CT. I hear all those good things about it and if nothing else, I pay for it. I figured I will try it. I thought it mayl be different. What I have found however, is that it is very simular to the MA with less people. Only the people think they are special. For example, check the comments from Storch: "Typical MA type". What I have seen are gungbangs and trash talking on the text buffer. Maybe it was just a bad day.
Did you mean:
Least?
Current?
vultched?
won't?
may?
gangbangs?
F for spelling C- minus on fighting skills. Go to the third grade for remedial school work and come back to the CT and Bore N Zoom me some more, you do have a way with it. :D lighten up a bit you haven't known me long enough to hate me yet. Give it another week.
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Some of you wear blindfolds!!!!
The complaints about BnZ are the funniest thing about the CT. Very few turn fight in that arena. Unless its a PAC setup.
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Originally posted by jamusta
Some of you wear blindfolds!!!!
The complaints about BnZ are the funniest thing about the CT. Very few turn fight in that arena. Unless its a PAC setup.
didn't you quit?
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I quit trying to make something of the CT. I will just fly on Thursdays. I tell you what though, if anyone needs to quit its you.
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The Val is a pretty good turnfighter eh Jamusta? :)
Seriously, I had fun fighting you, and I dont think you should let people get to you, just ignore them. Maybe its because I fly in the CT so often I dont notice the loudmouths, I dont know, but I can tell you for sure, I have NEVER been personally attacked in the CT. Just the other night in the MA I had a guy from my OWN country harangue me for 15 minutes. I dove in to save his arse (he was 1 against 4 with all 4 saddled up shooting at him), I killed 3 but I got there too late to save him. All he could do for 15 minutes was beech about me stealing his kills when he shoulda been thanking me fore even bothering to try to save him at all.
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Hi grits. Yeah it was a fun fight. I kept getting hit by friendly puffy ack though. Thats why I had lost you twice in that fight. Kept thinking someone was on my 6. I demand a rematch!!!!
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Originally posted by jamusta
I quit trying to make something of the CT. I will just fly on Thursdays. I tell you what though, if anyone needs to quit its you.
When I'm ready to I will. You said you were through and yet here you are again :D No matter I'll be looking for you.
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Originally posted by Grits
The Val is a pretty good turnfighter eh Jamusta? :)
Seriously, I had fun fighting you, and I dont think you should let people get to you, just ignore them. Maybe its because I fly in the CT so often I dont notice the loudmouths, I dont know, but I can tell you for sure, I have NEVER been personally attacked in the CT. Just the other night in the MA I had a guy from my OWN country harangue me for 15 minutes. I dove in to save his arse (he was 1 against 4 with all 4 saddled up shooting at him), I killed 3 but I got there too late to save him. All he could do for 15 minutes was beech about me stealing his kills when he shoulda been thanking me fore even bothering to try to save him at all.
I woulda told him that I left him one and he couldn't even kill it. ;)
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Originally posted by storch
When I'm ready to I will. You said you were through and yet here you are again :D No matter I'll be looking for you.
Shouldnt be hard to find me just look for the low lonely one.
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:D everyone likes you jam, you won't be lonely.
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Originally posted by jamusta
Shouldnt be hard to find me just look for the low lonely one.
I'm almost always low too, I'm sure we'll run into each other. :)