Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Muckmaw1 on November 16, 2004, 08:39:38 AM
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Backing Bush has won you nothing, Chirac tells Britain
By Charles Bremner in Paris and Philip Webster, Political Editor
JACQUES CHIRAC dealt a blow to Tony Blair’s attempt to heal the wounds between the US and Europe last night by saying that the Prime Minister had won nothing for supporting the war against Iraq.
As Mr Blair used a keynote speech to present Britain as a “bridge across the Atlantic”, President Chirac doubted whether anyone could play the “honest broker”. Speaking before he visits London on Thursday, he said that it was not in the nature of this Administration to return favours.
Mr Blair suffered another setback when Colin Powell, the US Secretary of State and the administration figure most trusted by Europe, resigned. There were doubts over whether his successor, possibly Condoleezza Rice, the National Security Adviser, would be as accommodating.
M Chirac, speaking to British journalists, including The Times, soon after General Powell’s announcement, revealed that he had urged Mr Blair to demand the relaunch of the Middle East peace process in return for backing the war.
“Well, Britain gave its support but I did not see anything in return. I’m not sure it is in the nature of our American friends at the moment to return favours systematically.”
In other remarks that will sting the Bush Administration, he again outlined his vision of a “multipolar” world in which a united Europe would be equal with the US, and mocked Donald Rumsfeld, the US Defence Secretary, for his division of Europe into old and new.
M Chirac said that there would be no division between Britain and France.
“It is like that nice guy in America — what’s his name again? — who spoke about ‘old Europe’. It has no sense. It’s a lack of culture to imagine that. Imagining that there can be division between the British and French vision of Europe is as absurd as imagining that we are building Europe against the United States.”
The comments underline the scale of the task facing Mr Blair as he tries to be a bridge between Europe and America, a job to which he devoted last night’s foreign policy speech at Guildhall in London.
The Prime Minister, aware that Mr Powell’s departure would be received with apprehension by European governments, bluntly told the US Administration to reach out to Europe and enlist its support in the war against terrorism.
“Multilateralism that works should be its aim. I have no sympathy for unilateralism for its own sake,” he said.
Mr Blair also said that Europe had a big opportunity because the US realised that lasting security against terrorism could not be provided by conventional military force but required a commitment to democracy and freedom.
Democracy was the meeting point for Europe and America. He was not advocating military solutions to achieve it but Europe and America should work together to bring democracy to places denied it.
He balanced his warning to the Americans by telling Europe that it was not sensible to ridicule US arguments or parody their political leaders.
Mr Blair hinted that he understood the difficulties, even before M Chirac’s intervention. He said that Britain’s role could be a bridge, a pivot or even a “damn high wire”.
M Chirac, whose visit to Britain concludes the Entente Cordiale anniversary celebrations, said: “I am not sure, with America as it is these days, that it would be easy for someone, even the British, to be an honest broker.”
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Hooray! It's time to bash the French again...
-SW
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Just read this in the Guardian, his main point was about Israel.
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Originally posted by AKS\/\/ulfe
Hooray! It's time to bash the French again...
-SW
didnt know there ever wasnt a time.
Has been country with a wannabe leader.
we are not impressed
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we don't hate the french people we just hate the despotic and anti semetic leader who murders people for his insatiable desire for chocolate....
No blood for chocolate! the french consume 30% of the worlds chocolate and produce nothing.... They should pay a tax to the U.N. to bring troufles and cakes to third world countries.
lazs
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30% of the world chocolate ?
And I guess it cause global warming ?
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Originally posted by lazs2
we don't hate the french people we just hate the despotic and anti semetic leader who murders people for his insatiable desire for chocolate....
No blood for chocolate! the french consume 30% of the worlds chocolate and produce nothing.... They should pay a tax to the U.N. to bring troufles and cakes to third world countries.
lazs
:rofl :rofl :rofl
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Originally posted by straffo
And I guess it cause global warming ?
global warming should be blamed on cassoulet I think ! (google is your friend if you don't know what cassoulet is !)
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global warming should be blamed on cassoulet I think !
Ho god Spooky, i'll give everything for a Cassoulet right now.
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Haven’t we already established that the French don't matter an more.
Who the F*&k cares what that anti-Semite, criminal. Thinks. F him
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Oh... so its safe for me to start french bashing again without fear of this thread being closed? :cool:
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Originally posted by lazs2
the french consume 30% of the worlds chocolate
lazs
That explains a lot. :aok
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I don't think Chirac realizes how there is now a growing hate against France in the US that will probably only get deeper with time.
It has never been like this before. Average people on the street when asked about France will say very negative things. It is not just against the leaders but against all things French.
You can only be a weasle for so long before it catches up to you.
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Yeah, but most of the negative things about France are typically just regurgitations of things they heard.
Some of the things I hear remind me of that whole Freedom Fries crapolla. I went to a Fuddruckers, and they actually taped "Freedom Fries" over French Fries. I laughed about it at the counter with my friends, the manager was standing behind the counter. I'm sure I wasn't the only one. Two days later, the "Freedom Fries" tape was gone.
Then there was the whole "Boycott everything French", seriously - the **** does anyone buy that's French? Besides wine, and occasionally cheese. Or those jerk tulips that bought expensive French wine and poored it out on the street. That was an amazing public display of absolute stupidity.
The public disdain for the French is nothing more than the sheep following the shepherd.
-SW
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I love Car and Driver magazine but I dumped my subscription about 2 months ago because they are owned by a french company. Me, myself and I choose not to knowingly support the french in any way.
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people just don't realize how important chocolate is.
The chocolate must flow.
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ATENTION LE CASSOULET FAIT PETER !
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people just don't realize how important chocolate is.
Is that a rip from Dune? And didn't that movie have a french overtone to it? The book was good, the movie sucked. ;)
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Originally posted by VWE
Oh... so its safe for me to start french bashing again without fear of this thread being closed? :cool:
here we go again.....
:rofl
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French wine sales are hurting in both Canada and the US. There is a big promotion at a fine food show going on right now. The French wine companys are even giving away hundreds of free tickets and 25 coupons to get people to come and try free wine.
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Well, the loss is on you.
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In other remarks that will sting the Bush Administration, he again outlined his vision of a “multipolar” world in which a united Europe would be equal with the US, and mocked Donald Rumsfeld, the US Defence Secretary, for his division of Europe into old and new.
A united Europe might well be. Just exactly when a solidly united Europe will exist (particularly one united under French leadership) is a bit up in the air though. Any real rush from the rest of Europe to unite under French leadership? How about German leadership? Kinda makes the division between "libs" and "conservatives" in the US seem pale by comparison.
Charon
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france leading anything other than a retreat? Go ahead and wish for world peace too!
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rib-it rib-it rib-it <------------( sound of frog croaking)
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Originally posted by VWE
france leading anything other than a retreat? Go ahead and wish for world peace too!
And you personnaly what have you done ?
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Originally posted by VWE
france leading anything other than a retreat? Go ahead and wish for world peace too!
:rofl
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Chirac said:
I’m not sure it is in the nature of our American friends.....
Lol, who's he calling "friends"?
Chirac is in hurry to establish a Palestinian State because then France will have another country to surrender to.
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France hasn't been right since Emporeror Napoleon was in charge....and we all know about his atrocities.
It is sad in a way, how quick we forget it has been a long time since France was a real world player. Pres. Chirac is not helping them whatsoever.
But then again, I could care less who their Pres is, unlike how much they care about who we elect. Guess I will have to stop buying BIC products (lighters, razors, pens...etc.) as well now.
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3 moron in a row.
Isn't this the tittle of a song ?
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Boycotting French made items... sounds an awful like the Women's Revolution.
What's next? Going to stop shaving your legs?
-SW
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Chirac is spot on in alot of his comments here.
Blair has achieved little in Iraq (especially if you consider the proportion of rebuilding contracts awarded to UK contractors), and the much vaunted 'special relationship' is only special because it is singularly one way on every issue. Maybe once upon a time it existed, but certainly not anymore.
The recent one-sided ammendments to extradition treaties are a prime example of this, and another example of Blair's unconstitutional nanny-state meddling.
Blair out in 2005.
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Guess I will have to stop buying BIC products
Damn didn't know BIC lighters were from france. They are the best lighters for pipes. :D
68Parker
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I listened to Chirac yesterday and he talks funny. Like in riddles...some sort of french Yoda is he.
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If dowding thinks he is right "spot on" about something then there is about a 98% chance that he is not only wrong but bad for the world.
lazs
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Originally posted by straffo
3 moron in a row.
Isn't this the tittle of a song ?
No, but a more appropriate song should be Frere Jacque. Time to wake up france.
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Man, you guys in Europe like to say Bush is the problem.
I've got news for you, Chirac is not winning any popularity contests over here, every time he opens his mouth.
He is not helping the situation, and that's bad for both Europe and the US.
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Chirac is a clown who was deep in Hussein's pocket and is now forced to play the hand.
The French helped us win our independence...thank you!
It's been a downhill slide ever since.
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3 morons in a row again ?
W0000TT SPECIAL COMBO !!!! JACKPOT !!!!
I'M L333333TTTTTTTTTTTTTT !!!
The 1st time I make a double , I'm so proud ... but first I would like to thank my mother and my coach without their help and their support it won't have been possible ...
Hey Saw it's a new challenge :D
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Originally posted by AKS\/\/ulfe
Boycotting French made items... sounds an awful like the Women's Revolution.
What's next? Going to stop shaving your legs?
-SW
:lol
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We're morons because we disagree w/ the actions of the French Govt?
Since you often disagree w/ our govt... that must make you a farging idiot.
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Nope your moron because instead of arguing it's allways the same posts and moronic jokes
I've seen hundred of time
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Here's 3 in a row!
(http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/graphics/chirac_putin_schroeder_stooges.jpg)
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I just wonder why the bashing is directed just against the French?
It's starting to sound like a broken record(this happens both ways).
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you heard him , bash the finns.
breaking news:::
latest french polls show Chirac's popularty down to 41%, time to vote in new govt?
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HEY! We bashing the French again???
Why didnt someone call me?? :D
Did you hear the French dont wear body armor to cover their chest? Dont need it when the only place they ever get shot is in the bellybutton running away! :rofl :rofl :rofl
dago
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Ca y est on a les derniers couillons.
Fermez le ban !
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Nice to see that most of us in here all agree on this one thing.
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Originally posted by lazs2
No blood for chocolate! the french consume 30% of the worlds chocolate and produce nothing.
lazs
Wouldnt say they produce nothing.
they do make some pretty crappy tasting wine.
Good for cooking with but but little else
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and here I was thinking I was being a little original. Didn't mention freedom fries, instead mentioned BIC. I blamed French leaders, not french people themselves.
Don't speak french but I have an idea of what a couillon is, and I don't think of myself as an arse or a moron.
I don't blame you for defending your leader straffo, don't blame me for defending mine.
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Goth "Couillon" is less derogatory than arse and moron :)
It mean more something like naïve (and that why I used it)
Concerning blaming my leader you are free to critic as you like so but not using words like "clown" for example
Also I'm tired of the endless posts adding nothing to the debate especially when it come from special people like VWE who post in the O'club once a monht just to bash my country.
I give you the benefice of doubt as I've not yet an opinion about you but it's clearly not the case for lot of people who have posted in this thread.
I could have wrote their posts and was expecting their "clever" contribution.
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Nope your moron
I didn't read past this.
plow you.
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Seems to me that Chirac's opinion of anything Iraq or middle east related is a bit jaded, especially as more comes out regarding the involvement of the French, German, and Russian governments concerning the oil for food program... maybe it would have been better to call it the money / military hardware for oil program.
IMHO, I think that France is a nice place to visit, most of the people seem fairly decent, but, their leadership is just not headed in a direction I would consider to be honest and productive.
Either way, like a few have already said, Chirac is definitely not making friends over here very easily, but, that shouldn't matter too much because the idiot that could have been influenced by his opinions never made it to the white house! :lol
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Well that's my point, really. My issue certainly isn't w/ the French as a people, although I find their sympathy for Hussein and the Palestinian rather inexplicable, but rahter w/ the French govt.
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Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Wouldnt say they produce nothing.
they do make some pretty crappy tasting wine.
Good for cooking with but but little else
If you mix it with 7Up, it's almost palatable. Of course, that is if they havent mixed in anti-freeze for the profit.
dago
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I hear that on the History channel tonight they did a segment on The Alamo. Did ya'll know that before the fighting started 1 person did leave... any guesses on what nationality that person was? Hmmm? Go ahead Dago... tell em!
:rofl
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Originally posted by straffo
Concerning blaming my leader you are free to critic as you like so but not using words like "clown" for example
Ok He's not a clown.
He's a Harlequin
:D
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What do you get when you throw a grenade into a French kitchen?
Linoleum Blownapart
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
What do you get when you throw a grenade into a French kitchen?
Linoleum Blownapart
:lol
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During last year certain members of the US Administration were accused of being un-diplomatic and unconstructive by many including Chirac. Now it seems the shoe is on the other foot.
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There was a Frenchman, an Englishman and Claudia Schiffer sitting together travelling in a carriage on a train. The train went through a tunnel and as it was an old style train, there were no lights in the carriages and it went completely dark.
Then there was a kissing noise and the sound of a really loud slap.
When the train came out of the tunnel, Claudia Schiffer and the Englishman were sitting as if nothing had happened and the Frenchman had his hand against his face as if he had been slapped there.
The Frenchman was thinking: 'The English fella must have kissed Claudia Schiffer and she missed him and slapped me instead.'
Claudia Schiffer was thinking: 'The French fella must have tried to kiss me and actually kissed the Englishman and got slapped for it.'
The Englishman was thinking: 'This is great. The next time the train goes through a tunnel I'll make another kissing noise and slap that French bastard again.'
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Originally posted by Pei
During last year certain members of the US Administration were accused of being un-diplomatic and unconstructive by many including Chirac. Now it seems the shoe is on the other foot.
Certainly but don't use this the 1st post in thei thread as a reference as it's nothing but 3 out of context sentences with Bremner interpretation.
Nice ones Holden :).
Steve : dohhh, like I care of the opinion of someone more than 5000km from me.
VWE : nice to see you learn your country history each day :rolleyes: ,I'm not American but I heard of Louis Rose
I guess that if I say 1515 you don't know what I will refer to.
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France bashing is rather Childish Gentleman, The USA is set upon world domination, the only antidote is a Strong and United Europe. Let's be fair, the UK have received not a jot in return for supporting the USA in Iraq.
Only weeks ago the UK were stopped from Purchasing military equipment from the USA because it was deemed to sensitive and we might share it with our European allies. What does that say ....
wipass
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Originally posted by wipass
France bashing is rather Childish Gentleman, The USA is set upon world domination, the only antidote is a Strong and United Europe. Let's be fair, the UK have received not a jot in return for supporting the USA in Iraq.
Only weeks ago the UK were stopped from Purchasing military equipment from the USA because it was deemed to sensitive and we might share it with our European allies. What does that say ....
wipass
Well apparently when we finish conquering the world, we'll
need alot of butlers
From the media it seems like Blair is the one supporting the
US, while 60% of our UK "pals" are protesting against the USA.
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Originally posted by wipass
The USA is set upon world domination, the only antidote...
The only antidote to your perception is a dose of reality.
The USA had a nuclear monopoly from '45 to '49 and did nothing with it other than the single event of ending the bloodiest war in history.
Since WW2, the USA has given up a possibility of dominion over the Trust Territory of the Pacific, the Phillipines, Japan, the American zone of Germany, the Panama Canal zone, and many more. The USA could have taken over much of western Europe, and instead undertook a program rebuilding political and economic sovereignty of those nations.
Cuba was given up before WW2, with a lease arrangement of Guantanamo Bay.
Units in the Balkans and Europe are there via Nato obligations.
A lease of Diego Garcia and agreements with sovereign countries like Kyrgystan, Uzbekistan, Pakistan, and Tajikistan help with the UN mandated multinational operation in Afganistan.
Saudi and Yemeni operations with agreements of those governments allow for the hunt of Al Queda operatives.
Units in Qatar, Saudi Arabia, and Kuwait are there via agreements with the host countries and support not only the present Iraq conflict, but the previous UN mandated action against Iraq.
You will note that with the exception of Iraq, forces are in each country with the treaty obligations of NATO, the UN, or by bilateral agreements with host countries.
With Iraq, the announced intent to withdraw after the Iraqi government is stabilized, while somwhat nebulous, should be comforting to you.
Agreements and negotiations with host countries is an interesting tactic for world domination. Or did I get your intent wrong... are you referring to the almighty Big Mac or Mickey Mouse?
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Excellent points Holden. I truely hope the Euro's don't think America wants to dominate the world, but that may just be the general view of us over there.
Straffo, I hear what you are saying about the bashing. Now, here's your chance, give us your honest views and feelings on Chirac's comments and enlighten us on the alleged deal the French had with Hussein.
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There are two groups on this board. Those with some intelligent contributions and those who just bash anything un american! I'll leave you to decide who you are.
By the way the French make some fantastic wines.
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Originally posted by Tinpot
There are two groups on this board. Those with some intelligent contributions and those who just bash anything un american! I'll leave you to decide who you are.
By the way the French make some fantastic wines.
So does South Africa, Napa valley, Ontario, Chile and a number of other places. No need to buy French at all even if they are good.
Wines from all of those places consistantly take first prize in international wine competitions.
If you buy French you are only supporting the French economy.
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"A lease of Diego Garcia and agreements with sovereign countries like Kyrgystan, Uzbekistan, Pakistan, and Tajikistan help with the UN mandated multinational operation in Afganistan.
Saudi and Yemeni operations with agreements of those governments allow for the hunt of Al Queda operatives.
Units in Qatar, Saudi Arabia, and Kuwait are there via agreements with the host countries and support not only the present Iraq conflict, but the previous UN mandated action against Iraq."
Do you really believe all of the above Countries invited you without any arm twisting or threats made to/against them ?
Come on ........
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Straffo, I hear what you are saying about the bashing. Now, here's your chance, give us your honest views and feelings on Chirac's comments and enlighten us on the alleged deal the French had with Hussein.
Ok, I consider chirac played a stupid game with Bush administration about Iraq. The USA is a super power we're not anymore but we have a place on this game.
I think sadly that the current administration don't look to want to play a fair game and need a sort of counter power ,the US have a leading role on this planet currently (super power again) that's right ,but the US can make mistakes we have in the past made lot of error some pretty tragic one indeed.
Invading Iraq fueled hatred to the US in lot of country I think there will be a sort of payback for the US in the future (note that I'm not asking for it).
It look like that the actual administration forgot how vulnerable is a democratie especially when dealing with people who don't have our culture and are ready to die.
In Bremner article there is an important part IMO :
Mr Blair also said that Europe had a big opportunity because the US realised that lasting security against terrorism could not be provided by conventional military force but required a commitment to democracy and freedom.
I think helping democraty in Iraq would have been more efficient than an military invasion (albeit very slower) and would had a better outcome.
I'll try to make later a more structured post as this one is not very clear and I've not really enought time now to make a better post.
Concerning the alleged deal if prooved and judged I expect to see some head rolling ,the guys prooved guilty should pay.
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Is that their is only one nation with the kind of military power to attempt to enforce its world view on the other nations of this world. That is not a healthy situation.
I'm no great supporter of many things our neighbours over the channel do, but I'm not such a bigot that I write off a nation because of what one individual says. Thats just plain stupid.
For the record I am concerned that America is taking a very unilateral and self righteous direction, backed by huge military might. Be carefull because at some point America will find it has more enemies than freinds. Currently our nation is counted as a freind but freindship goes two ways. Some of the earlier posts were correct in saying that so far that freindship has resulted in a very one sided relationship. People here are not very happy about that.
When those enemies wake up and realise that together they are stronger, the USA is in deep trouble.
We all live on this planet and diversity is important.
(a bit rambling but thats what I think how about a reasoned response rather than some of the c**p that I read? )
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Originally posted by wipass
France bashing is rather Childish Gentleman, The USA is set upon world domination, the only antidote is a Strong and United Europe. Let's be fair, the UK have received not a jot in return for supporting the USA in Iraq.
Only weeks ago the UK were stopped from Purchasing military equipment from the USA because it was deemed to sensitive and we might share it with our European allies. What does that say ....
wipass
The way I hear it is Blair supported the US in this endeavor because Blair beleivedIraq was the same threat Bush did. and that after 9/11 a policy of preemption over reaction was the best coarse to take.
Not bcause he was looking for something from the US in return.
Of coarse that was before agents from France,Germany, and Russia helped Saddam hide or get rid of the WMDs so as to embarrass the US and UK when none were found.
The most immediate thing Blair was looking for from Bush is action in the Isreali/Palastinian situation.
But thats kinda hard to do untill you know who is in charge And the USA doesnt want ot come off as supporting one guy over the next too early as it would certainly be the kiss of death for whoever that person might be because he would be seen by the locals as a puppet to or too friendly with the USA
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Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Of coarse that was before agents from France,Germany, and Russia helped Saddam hide or get rid of the WMDs so as to embarrass the US and UK when none were found.
Hilarious, you really believe that don't you? And you guys wonder why we laugh at how dumbed down and credulous your society has become.
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Originally posted by straffo
Ok, I consider chirac played a stupid game with Bush administration about Iraq. The USA is a super power we're not anymore but we have a place on this game.
I think sadly that the current administration don't look to want to play a fair game and need a sort of counter power ,the US have a leading role on this planet currently (super power again) that's right ,but the US can make mistakes we have in the past made lot of error some pretty tragic one indeed.
Invading Iraq fueled hatred to the US in lot of country I think there will be a sort of payback for the US in the future (note that I'm not asking for it).
It look like that the actual administration forgot how vulnerable is a democratie especially when dealing with people who don't have our culture and are ready to die.
In Bremner article there is an important part IMO :
I think helping democraty in Iraq would have been more efficient than an military invasion (albeit very slower) and would had a better outcome.
I'll try to make later a more structured post as this one is not very clear and I've not really enought time now to make a better post.
Concerning the alleged deal if prooved and judged I expect to see some head rolling ,the guys prooved guilty should pay.
What Chirac is trying to do is position himself to be the ultimate undisputed leader of the EU.
His talk Im sure is carfully calculated to make him look tough (for lack of a better word) in the eyes of and gain the support of the European people.
Helping Democracy in Iraq would have been a great choice but for 3 problems. Namely Saddam and his two sons. So long as Saddam was in power there would be no Democracy. And his heirs apparent his sons looked to be just as psychopathic if not more so then their father.
Containment was not really an option or we would most certainly end up with another North Korea situation, only faster because Iraq had plenty of something the North Koreans could only hope for. Oil which is just as good as gold. Which ment they had the means to buy off enough people n the right places to acheive its goals.
Which in the end would have put us in a far more dangerous situation then we had been because Saddam not only had the desire and means to posess WMDs.
But the willingness to use them
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Originally posted by Momus--
Hilarious, you really believe that don't you? And you guys wonder why we laugh at how dumbed down and credulous your society has become.
Yes I do really beleive that.
Just a pet theory of mine that I have a funny feeling will bear fruit and prove to be true sometime in the future.
Certainly would make alot of peices to the puzzle fall into place
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Originally posted by wipass
Do you really believe all of the above Countries invited you without any arm twisting or threats made to/against them ?
Come on ........
When you sell a car, you make a deal. Or do you claim that the party who bought it from you stole it?
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Originally posted by Momus--
Hilarious, you really believe that don't you? And you guys wonder why we laugh at how dumbed down and credulous your society has become.
Oh and you REALLY beleive your governments would be beyond that?
Talk about dumbed down
Oh and BTW a nice large chunck of the evidence we had was provided by other countries. Including france,Gremany, Russia as well as a host of others.
Odd all of a sudden that when we were gonna go in these same countries were against it.
So either the WMDs were there and someone helped em get rid of it.
Orrrr they werent ever there and these same countries just wanted everyone to beleive they were so they could still have an excuse to rape the oil for food program. Something which is becommng more and more undenyable by the day
Unlike the OJ case. In this instance the glove fits
I cant wait for the Trials of Saddamn and his henchmen.
As well as the completion of the investigations into the Oil for food program
I have a funny feeling all sorts of interesting info is going to come to light
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oh noooooo... momus laughs at how dumb we are! It just isn't fair that we have so much being so dumb and all..
chirac is a violent dishonest anti semite who would destroy the world if he could by giving his fellow terrorists nukes. We don't hate the french people just your satanic leader.
tinpot.... I don't think the rest of the world is ready to take on the U.S. just yet over something like improving the situation in the middle east. No matter how you look at it... firs t afghan and now iraq... once if we do what you would like we never would have even been in afghanistan and if we pull out of iraq and put the sadman back on his gold toilet seat... the torture and genocide will continue and afganistan will go back to what it has historicaly been.
face it... most of you realize that we were right and are making the most impoortant progress in the regions in history... somethiong that you never even tried because you were too busy sucking the life out of the areas with your imperialism.
you look at our power as a threat because when you had it you WERE a threat to the world.
lazs
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Don't worry Lazs; with EU-Army (mainly a French-German-British army now) Nato will lose its power and soon you can pack your gears and move out from Europe.
Of course it's even more harder for you to find friends but who cares :)
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Originally posted by Steve
Well that's my point, really. My issue certainly isn't w/ the French as a people, although I find their sympathy for Hussein and the Palestinian rather inexplicable, but rahter w/ the French govt.
France has a rather large Muslim population (and a large number of those are Palestinian, IIRC), the majority of whom support the destruction of Israel. If I were Jewish, France would be way down on my list of places to visit, considering the recent rise of attacks on Jews.
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"you look at our power as a threat because when you had it you WERE a threat to the world"
^
Are you real ? This is probably worth a thread on its own, The UK a threat to the world ? When ?
wipass
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Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Of coarse that was before agents from France,Germany, and Russia helped Saddam hide or get rid of the WMDs so as to embarrass the US and UK when none were found.
Beware of the french, german and russian black helicopters!
Originally posted by Lazs2
chirac is a violent dishonest anti semite who would destroy the world if he could by giving his fellow terrorists nukes. We don't hate the french people just your satanic leader.
tinpot.... I don't think the rest of the world is ready to take on the U.S. just yet over something like improving the situation in the middle east. No matter how you look at it... firs t afghan and now iraq... once if we do what you would like we never would have even been in afghanistan and if we pull out of iraq and put the sadman back on his gold toilet seat... the torture and genocide will continue and afganistan will go back to what it has historicaly been.
face it... most of you realize that we were right and are making the most impoortant progress in the regions in history... somethiong that you never even tried because you were too busy sucking the life out of the areas with your imperialism.
you look at our power as a threat because when you had it you WERE a threat to the world.
Your hook is far too big, Lazs. You won't catch much with this.
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Originally posted by Engine
France has a rather large Muslim population (and a large number of those are Palestinian, IIRC), the majority of whom support the destruction of Israel. If I were Jewish, France would be way down on my list of places to visit, considering the recent rise of attacks on Jews.
France also has the biggest jewish community in Europe. They both coexist rather pacifically given the circumstances.
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man... I would love to hear the media in finland for about a week (if it wasn't in gibberish) ... I bet it is even more fun than listening to the lefty hippie stations here in the States. To have produced so many Amerihaters.... must be pretty one sided and pitiful.
lazs
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Originally posted by deSelys
Beware of the french, german and russian black helicopters!
I am.
Though not so much the french as they seem only to know how to fly to the rear
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Originally posted by DREDIOCK
I am.
Though not so much the french as they seem only to know how to fly to the rear
Gunship Gazelles (20mm guns) and paratroopers made mincemeat of every airworthy aircraft in the Ivory Coast air force recently.
Guess they were flying straight this time!
(http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/graphics/2004/11/08/wcote08b.jpg)
and kudos to the French Unicorn taskforce, they controlled angry mobs by throwing stun grenades from helicopters, instead of lobbing 500 pounders on them...
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Originally posted by lazs2
man... I would love to hear the media in finland for about a week (if it wasn't in gibberish) ... I bet it is even more fun than listening to the lefty hippie stations here in the States. To have produced so many Amerihaters.... must be pretty one sided and pitiful.
lazs
Go right ahead, use the archive so you don't need to spend a week:
http://www.helsinginsanomat.fi/english/
Please share all the intersting stuff you'll find!
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Originally posted by straffo
Steve : dohhh, like I care of the opinion of someone more than 5000km from me.
No offense, straffo, but why do you keep responding then?
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From the department of Homeland Security
What to do if terror strikes and you are French
1. Get in a fetal position and start crying. Thats all.
(http://courreges.freeservers.com/franceready.png)
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These boards are full of biggoted stupid crap!
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Afghanistan was backed by Russia, France and Germany and just about every country in the world, except maybe Yemen. France and Germany deployed troops.
But I guess the facts don't quite fit your world view, Lazs.
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Originally posted by Neubob
No offense, straffo, but why do you keep responding then?
I still don't have a definite answer to this question ... certainly because I'm a bit stupid and agressive.
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Originally posted by straffo
I still don't have a definite answer to this question ... certainly because I'm a bit stupid and agressive.
All the french bashing aside, Straffo.
Chirac is not helping heal any wounds here.
If anything, he is making it worse.
When does he come up for re-election?
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Right IMO chirac should put some "water in his wine" (in fact I think both of our representant should do that)
If you look at the average French citizen (I can't speak for the average American) we all new we have a debt to the USA and all the young guys that have lost their lives for us.
and lot of didn't hate the American or the USA (a contrario to some media say)
But we are a lot thinking that the US gone astray concerning Iraq.
For the élections I think it's in 2007 I only voted for him only be cause the alternative was pretty horrible.
Look at the score for the elections :
Élection 1965 : Charles de Gaulle avec 55,2%
Élection 1969 : Georges Pompidou avec 58,2%
Élection 1974 : Valéry Giscard d'Estaing avec 50,8%
Élection 1981 : François Mitterrand avec 51,8%
Élection 1988 : François Mitterrand avec 54,0%
Élection 1995 : Jacques Chirac avec 52,6%
Élection 2002 : Jacques Chirac avec 82,1%
Chirac didn't get 30 point more because he was a good president he got this points because the French didn't wanted to have a Hitler wanabe as president.
IMO he will loose the 2007 elections (if he is candidate)
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so dowding... you agreed with what was done in afganistan and feel that the world all put in an equal effort in obtaining the goal there?
You feel that we should just walk away from the region now and all will be well? It is your world view that I find..... convienient.... to say the least.
if everythiong turns out well in iraq then you will be all for the efforst of blair and Bush and all the other countries fighting there? maybe you will point out that france and russia and germany didn't join because of all the food for oil and weapons scams they had going?
lazs
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Steve : dohhh, like I care of the opinion of someone more than 5000km from me.
If you didn't care about my opinion, you wouldn't scream and stomp your feet every time someone bashes your POS, worthless, corrupt Government. Psssst Chirac is a clown... and that's his good side.
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The crime is not that Chirac is causing the US to hate all things French.
The crime is that everyday French people are not speaking up and saying they like the US and they disagree with Chirac.
And their silence is speaking loudly.
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Originally posted by Habu
If you buy French you are only supporting the French economy.
And here I though it was to enjoy fine wine and delicious food...
question is "What do the Brits think"...its a Europian problem man, nothing to do with us...
here's my problem...
I agree that Saddam had to go, I don't agree in the path that Pres. Bush took to achieve that goal...so did alot of other folks, nevermind national colors
I wanted to see Saddam with a bullet hole tween the eye's man, not see you invade that country...
I feel ashamed in a fashion that we as neighbors and friends choose not to help you in this venture, but at the same time our value's differ somewhat...lets just say Bush's idea's are a little too radical for some of us
Chirac and Bush and all others are playing into Political agenda's
people create for them, I for one will not base my perceptions on the French by what its POLITICAL leaders say...
I trust Straffo more then I do his Pres.
so mon cousin, comment ca va?:D
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
There was a Frenchman, an Englishman and Claudia Schiffer sitting together travelling in a carriage on a train. The train went through a tunnel and as it was an old style train, there were no lights in the carriages and it went completely dark.
Then there was a kissing noise and the sound of a really loud slap.
When the train came out of the tunnel, Claudia Schiffer and the Englishman were sitting as if nothing had happened and the Frenchman had his hand against his face as if he had been slapped there.
The Frenchman was thinking: 'The English fella must have kissed Claudia Schiffer and she missed him and slapped me instead.'
Claudia Schiffer was thinking: 'The French fella must have tried to kiss me and actually kissed the Englishman and got slapped for it.'
The Englishman was thinking: 'This is great. The next time the train goes through a tunnel I'll make another kissing noise and slap that French bastard again.'
:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
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Originally posted by Staga
Don't worry Lazs; with EU-Army (mainly a French-German-British army now) Nato will lose its power and soon you can pack your gears and move out from Europe.
Of course it's even more harder for you to find friends but who cares :)
and inside 10 years you will probably all be at war with one another...again
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Originally posted by Spooky
Gunship Gazelles (20mm guns) and paratroopers made mincemeat of every airworthy aircraft in the Ivory Coast air force recently.
Guess they were flying straight this time!
(http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/graphics/2004/11/08/wcote08b.jpg)
and kudos to the French Unicorn taskforce, they controlled angry mobs by throwing stun grenades from helicopters, instead of lobbing 500 pounders on them...
Oh real topnotch force they were going up against too Im sure.
They probably could have done an equally good job had they used WWI biplanes.
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Originally posted by Blue2
These boards are full of biggoted stupid crap!
Yea.
and your point is?
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Originally posted by straffo
I only voted for him only be cause the alternative was pretty horrible.
Ahhh Now possibly you can understand why so many of us decided to vote for Bush over Kerry.
Granted Bush is no gem either we just didnt see kerry as a better choice.
fact of the matter is neither are really loved by many cept the party loyalists
I just the other day saw a recent report on a poll that showed that 70% of the people that voted for kerry didnt do so because they liked Kerry but because they were making a vote against Bush
While that certainly is ALOT of votes against Bush
If thats true that means only 30% of the people that voted for Kerry either liked him beleived in his policies or were party loyalists.
Speaking only for myself I Wanted someone to come along that was better then Bush But Kerry in my view didnt stack up and meet the requirements on a single issue that was important to me that might have made me vote for him.
There were also charactor flaws I saw that left me less then impressed and often annoyed.
Sadly Unless the Reps come up with a wayyy to the middle candidate in 08
By default I will probably vote Democrat
Unless Hillary runs in which case I may abstain out of disgust
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Originally posted by SLO
And here I though it was to enjoy fine wine and delicious food...
question is "What do the Brits think"...its a Europian problem man, nothing to do with us...
here's my problem...
I agree that Saddam had to go, I don't agree in the path that Pres. Bush took to achieve that goal...so did alot of other folks, nevermind national colors
I wanted to see Saddam with a bullet hole tween the eye's man, not see you invade that country...
I feel ashamed in a fashion that we as neighbors and friends choose not to help you in this venture, but at the same time our value's differ somewhat...lets just say Bush's idea's are a little too radical for some of us
Chirac and Bush and all others are playing into Political agenda's
people create for them, I for one will not base my perceptions on the French by what its POLITICAL leaders say...
I trust Straffo more then I do his Pres.
so mon cousin, comment ca va?:D
See now I can respect that arguement and line of reasoning.
Certainly beats any of the arguements I've seen so far.
The only poroblem with putting a bullet in Saddams head was the people that would have succeeded him(either of his sons) wouldnt have been any better
It sure would have been easier but Im not sure it would have had the desired effect
May have been a radicle idea but I honestly didnt see any other way.
My view was and is Iraq was a situation that was going to have to be dealt with definitively sooner or later.
Later made it potentially a far far far more dangerous situation IMO. for everyone, including France Germany Russia and the region as a whole
I cant blame any nation that doesnt want to send her men to war.
But I think that not just that but the way we were stonewalled along the way did far more harm to international relations then anything.
We would have loved to have the support of the countries in question in this indeavor.
Had we gotten even the smallest support, without sending troops, logistics,transport or even just a nod or an abstention as Russia did in GWI there wouldnt be this animosity now.
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Actually there are three types of people in this thread. Those who can count, and those who can't.
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quote:
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Originally posted by Blue2
These boards are full of biggoted stupid crap!
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Yea.
and your point is?
<<
I agree 100%
There is a very vocal minority of thuggish bigots that post here.
But thats all over the internet. You'll find that some of the biggest bullies on the internet are just acting out (some because of infirmities).
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and soon you can pack your gears and move out from Europe.
That would be nice. About time you big talkers took care of yourselves.
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Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Ahhh Now possibly you can understand why so many of us decided to vote for Bush over Kerry.
Granted Bush is no gem either we just didnt see kerry as a better choice.
fact of the matter is neither are really loved by many cept the party loyalists
I just the other day saw a recent report on a poll that showed that 70% of the people that voted for kerry didnt do so because they liked Kerry but because they were making a vote against Bush
While that certainly is ALOT of votes against Bush
If thats true that means only 30% of the people that voted for Kerry either liked him beleived in his policies or were party loyalists.
Speaking only for myself I Wanted someone to come along that was better then Bush But Kerry in my view didnt stack up and meet the requirements on a single issue that was important to me that might have made me vote for him.
There were also charactor flaws I saw that left me less then impressed and often annoyed.
Sadly Unless the Reps come up with a wayyy to the middle candidate in 08
By default I will probably vote Democrat
Unless Hillary runs in which case I may abstain out of disgust
Don't really compare ,or your election would have been GWB vs some Nazi Party of America dude.
And I don't think Kerry was a Nazi :)
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Just to refresh my memory, was it Le Pen who advocated telling little girls they couldn't wear scarves?
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
Just to refresh my memory, was it Le Pen who advocated telling little girls they couldn't wear scarves?
He said a lot of things : like the shoah was nothing but a event during WWII (like the industrial death of million of people can be ansomething perfectly natural ...)
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But the scarves thing... was that Le Pen?
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Don't know , perhaps he did say so but as there was a concensus about this question he was not alone.
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Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Wouldnt say they produce nothing.
they do make some pretty crappy tasting wine.
Good for cooking with but but little else
lol!
I wonder what your "Coq au Dr Pepper" tastes like :D
Ignorance is bliss.
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Whats all this French Bashing!?
You chaps might still be British if they hadn't helped in the War of Independance! ( My history is sketchy but I think I'm right )
Lol:lol
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Straffo, I was elbowing you in the ribs a bit for the anti muslim dress code in French schools.
The government in power now, not Le Pen, decided no scarves is a good idea.
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This a law I disagree completly with ,in my opinion in the public school no religious symbol (or political btw) should be wear,it should not be directed to one or another religion.
It's simply not the place for displaying his opinion.
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Originally posted by Saintaw
lol!
I wonder what your "Coq au Dr Pepper" tastes like :D
Ignorance is bliss.
We have plenty of award winning American produced fine wines that easily rival French wine
Talk about ingnorance
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blue is correct... very few things could be worse than being under british imperialist rule in the 17 and 18 hundreds.
lazs
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Tell Chirac to pound salt...I get disgusted when this french moron thinks he has his thumb on the pulse of the world...Hey Frenchie...If it wasn't for the US you'd be driving a Mercedes
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Martha's wineyards? l.o.l.(tm)
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Originally posted by DREDIOCK
We have plenty of award winning American produced fine wines that easily rival French wine
Talk about ingnorance
Californian wines are fine but I find them too sweet. Too much sun IMO. Not a true rival, a different wine suiting different tastes.
OTOH France shouldn't be snotty about american wines. After all, the californian grapevine which resisted better against the phylloxera (sp?) saved the devastated french vines around 1860. to US for this! ;)
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Originally posted by deSelys
Californian wines are fine but I find them too sweet. Too much sun IMO. Not a true rival, a different wine suiting different tastes.
OTOH France shouldn't be snotty about american wines. After all, the californian grapevine which resisted better against the phylloxera (sp?) saved the devastated french vines around 1860. to US for this! ;)
Most all wine grape vines have european tops grafted to american rootstock.
American wines, (from several states, not just California) are all varieties. Some are sweet, some are dry.
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Originally posted by CAVY
.Hey Frenchie...If it wasn't for the US you'd be driving a Mercedes
And you think that's bad? Hell I'd be happy if I could afford to drive a Mercedes :D
btw more serious: Withour US Frenchies would drive Volgas, Zhigulis and Trabants. If you think it was because of the US the war was won by Allies you might think again.
Russia with it's enormous resources was just getting its warmachine running when the war in Europe did end.
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What you talking bout Willis...our wines kick ass
(http://www.thalia.org/kender/Pics/Pennsic/Pennsic02/penn31-200.jpg)
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My monitor just imploded.
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LOL Goth, That't the first "wine" I ever got drunk on. Must have been 13 or so.
Charon
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What is this wine ?
Wine is not supposed to be green :)
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Looks like it's been prepared with other "plants". Not that I have anything against that.
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It's fruit flavored "wine". It's actually bellybutton in a bottle specifically designed to destroy your liver and give you the worst possible hangover ever.
-SW
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Originally posted by Staga
And you think that's bad? Hell I'd be happy if I could afford to drive a Mercedes :D
btw more serious: Withour US Frenchies would drive Volgas, Zhigulis and Trabants. If you think it was because of the US the war was won by Allies you might think again.
Russia with it's enormous resources was just getting its warmachine running when the war in Europe did end.
You bring up a good point, if it weren't for the US you would be speaking commie... oh wait.
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You chaps might still be British if they hadn't helped in the War of Independance!
this was mentioned ealier in the thread...although spelled correctly. try to keep up.