Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Pongo on December 07, 2004, 11:33:49 AM
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Apperently it will track the absolute location of your head not just up down left right. So you can look arround canopy struts etc...
Is HTC going to be supporting this in AH?
vector (http://www.naturalpoint.com/trackir/products/vector.html)
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Works in enhanced mode.
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IL-2 isn't going to support that. To bad to, I'd be all up in there if it did.
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Yes..AH works in enhanced mode. But this thing is alot different then current enhanced mode.
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So you can map the 'xyz coordinates' of your head in the cockpit of AH? Moving my head physical head forward would position the gunsight closer, shifting right and turning right would allow me to clear the headrest for a good six view [instead of being stuck 'on a stick'] ?
I'll be buying one of these now :)
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It depends on what is implemtented in AH. Right now AH has as good an implementation of Track IR as anyone I think. If they make use of this fully moving your head forward could zoom you in for example. Obviosly you could peer arround the canopy braces.
Im hoping that the new sensor rig makes it more steady in the gunsight. Thats the only issue I have in AH right now.
the G forces in the game move your eye view like they always have and your have a tendacy with track IR to try to correct that. But its a bad idea and you end up with shakey gunsight view.
Mostly a training issue but it is anoying.
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Is there a deadband you can mess with?
Maybe additional coad could be thrown together that would slowly center your view after a few moments of relatively little motion.
Would a button or a key that disables head tracking work? Your view is skewed, only way to center is if you contort into a funky position (i read this happened to you Pongo). Hit that key, center your head (and ingame view), release key, and trackIR now detects this as your recalibrated dead center view... ?
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Will it work for WW2OL? Those views would really benefit from this.
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Tir 3 works excelent with all the games that support it, il2 aces high and targetware in particular, i dont have any problem hitting things you just have to use it for a while and figure out some tricks, pan mode for deflection gunnery is a start. Tir vets know what im talking about. With this new enhancement aces high will become one step closer to being even more Hitech!
Ps now aces high can really step ahead of il2 because in il2 you cant actually move around in your cockpit, you can only pan. AH will have complete head tracking!! and we tir3 users wont have to buy a new rig since it merges with the origional set up!
:eek: :aok :eek:
vector enhancement is in the mail.
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http://www.naturalpoint.com/trackir/products/video.html
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Oct, that is what I am working on. Setting up a button on my CH throttle to disable the track IR so I can shoot in boresight mode then enable it again for tracking.
But I think it might be better just to learn to use it. I have allready made some increable deflection shots in IL2 offline that I would rarely have made with a top hat. you are watching exaclty where the enemy is and where he is going, you have a good sense of where your gunsight is. With a short calibration range and a little practice you can get killer snap shots.
Even as it is and with my only wrestleing with it for a week it is far more imersive then a top hat or anything else. But you have to practice for sure.
and yes you can adjust dead zone, tracking speed, sensitivitey etc etc etc.
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the biggest improvement with the Vector system has to be the capability to not "read" translation (moving of head side to side) or leaning in the game. That was the worst part of trying TIR, was I found I leaned myself out of the site picture. Here you can set it to ignore translation.
cool.
Ordered Tir3pro, and vector. Merry Xmas to me.
"
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For us to use the Vector system Hitech will have to add COAD to the game to support it? If so is this an easy update for Hitech "I Hope:) " it looks great at the TrackIR web site.:D
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Well , he spent a lot of time coading the first truly 3d cockpit in any simulator. You gotta believe he will coad to use all that work to the best of its ability.
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Looks cool, BUT you need THREE reflectors on a baseball cap for it to work.
It looks like for those of us who simply have a single dot on our headset microphones, or who mount the TIR in locations other than on top of the monitor, this feature will be problematic or unused.
-Llama
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Originally posted by Pongo
Oct, that is what I am working on. Setting up a button on my CH throttle to disable the track IR so I can shoot in boresight mode then enable it again for tracking.
Thats what I do. Works perfectly. In AH I'm using TR for spotting gvs more than ea.
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Originally posted by llama
Looks cool, BUT you need THREE reflectors on a baseball cap for it to work.
It looks like for those of us who simply have a single dot on our headset microphones, or who mount the TIR in locations other than on top of the monitor, this feature will be problematic or unused.
-Llama
Yea...just like HOTAS joysticks are problematic for those that play games from their couch. You work WITH the technology, not against it. Where is the big problem with wearing a ball cap? I know...you can wear one reflector on your nose and the other two go on your ears......Yea....TIR Glasses...thats it...thats the ticket
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Originally posted by llama
Looks cool, BUT you need THREE reflectors on a baseball cap for it to work.
It looks like for those of us who simply have a single dot on our headset microphones, or who mount the TIR in locations other than on top of the monitor, this feature will be problematic or unused.
-Llama
not just any three dots. Those three dots. It will only work with the clip on rig they sell and with track IR3 and with the software key to unlock the feature in the software.
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Yea,
I map on and off tir, find tir is great till actual combat time,, maybe me, too much body english, but if he's in front of me, don't need tir, just the pipper on target :D
But I luv the tir,, SA is best w/ it on.
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for you guys turning it off when using the gun.... dont just engage strafe mode, then you can look over the nose for high speed high angle deflection shots.
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Originally posted by blackfalcon4
Yea,
I map on and off tir, find tir is great till actual combat time,, maybe me, too much body english, but if he's in front of me, don't need tir, just the pipper on target :D
But I luv the tir,, SA is best w/ it on.
Thats the great thing about the new setup....the body english wont cause your view to 'turn' but shift....just like you are in your chair!
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Ordered mine today. Can't wait!
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Oh my god. Those videos are frickin incredible! I need this.. now.
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Until AH supports the new mode, there is little point to paying for something you cant use. Hopefully HT will be able to code it in a reasonably short time....which unfortunately would be 3-6 months IMHO, if not much longer, considering the limited number of players that use TIR.
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Great video's at that site. Some of the professional addon aircraft with their virtual cockpits would be awsome with that. Though not as necessary as for combat sims.
Days of moving your view around with a hat switch are numbered looking forward to what this has to offer.
...-Gixer
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I also wish they had more reasonable pricing. RIght now the TIR3pro+Vector software is over $200 when you include shipping....thats a little over the top....especially since for your $49, vector supports exactly TWO titles:
Microsoft's FlightSim 2004 and Combat Flight Sim 3
Not exactly a huge reason to pay $50 for an upgrade. I would think they would offer an early adopter discount of at least 50% off, since there is so little reason for anyone to buy one right now.
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Originally posted by eilif
for you guys turning it off when using the gun.... dont just engage strafe mode, then you can look over the nose for high speed high angle deflection shots.
what is strafe mode?
and the add on should help make the device work better even without the full vector support.
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strafe mode allows you to slide side ways and up and down while having your view locked forward. What i do is slowly zoom in on the enemy as they get closer to my gunsite, then i engage the strafe mode and i sit up in seat slightly and fire, the higher the deflection under your nose the more you sit up to see over. Note this only works with planes that have an over the nose view, so corsairs spits and such are out of the question, great planes for this are the hellcat, p38 and p51.
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with the vector set up an over the nose view will be way better! unfortunately with the set up we have now we cant engage a move forward option since tir 3 just emulats the mouse movements for the most part. Imagine the crazy deflection shots we will be able to pull!
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Seems like a great expansion... price is 49$ and the only available international shipping is 64$ on top of that.... :( Dont they know how to simply put it in air mail??? That is not very customer friendly.
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WOW! That is what I always dreamed of! Didn't think it come true so quickly! Vector expansion really puts AH views system ahead! At last those braces are no (unrealistic) obstacle anymore!!!
Now it's your move, HTC... :D
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Ahhh :) It is available in Europe as well:
http://www.edimensional.com/index.php?currency=EUR&cPath=24&sort=2a
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Geez, this means as soon as AH2 supports this, i gotta replace my old Trackir2 :p
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maik,
I got 20 dollars off by some old email from them,with my TIR2, all you do is put in the serial number of your tir2 when you purchase Tir3
supposed to be only good till end of october...but I guess they missed that :).
Balsy
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THx for the info Balsy.
Btw. Hows the difference between TIR2 and 3 in game?
greets
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Ill let you know when it shows up ;)
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On the video page, in the 1st video. What is that WW2 shooter he is playing? CF3?
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ya i think so.
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http://www.microsoft.com/games/combatfs3/
thats the main site and
http://www.microsoft.com/games/pc/combatfs3.aspx
a good link for sellers, you can find it pretty cheep around 19 bucks, i bought a copy, works great, will take few weeks till i can play with the tir vector tho. :(
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Any comments from HTC yet???? Does this vector expansion work already in AH?
There are already 5DOF in AH, right? But they are controlled with hat and 6 key buttons... 4 arrow buttons and zoom in / out.
Will we get the roll (the 6th DOF) as well? I think this might enhance immersion quite nicely :)
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I preface this with "Im not a programmer", but from a functionality point of view (pardon the pun), we are talking about adding the capability of Tir3 to provide input to the z access (zoom) and for AHII to be able to read "head tilt".
Right now the tir enhanced with AHII only reads a single point in x, y access and translates that into your view.
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here is the answere to weather or not ah2 will be vector enhanced.
http://forums.naturalpoint.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=27;t=000009
even gives us some posetive insight on the time it will take. :)
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It's completed and ready for next patch, With luck it will be tommorow.
HiTech
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wow!! :eek:
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! and i thought i was going to have to get friends to bump this thread! Thank you HTC you are truely the most hitech of the lot!:aok :aok :aok
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I am so sorely tempted to get this....
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Originally posted by hitech
It's completed and ready for next patch, With luck it will be tommorow.
HiTech
lol wtg HT.
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Hitech,
Bless you, that is UN-FUGGING believable. I have to imagine you are jacked about this as I am
Balsy
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... vector expansion ordered... darn - says I have to wait till 17th...
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you think you got it bad, i got to go to the west coast for the christmass get together, and as soon as i get back i will be moving to a new pad!
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Originally posted by hitech
It's completed and ready for next patch, With luck it will be tommorow.
HiTech
AHHHHHHHHHHHHH NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOO!
My wifes gona kill me
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Originally posted by hitech
It's completed and ready for next patch, With luck it will be tommorow.
HiTech
Thanks! :)
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Ok..Im stupid:p Is the only place to get this at the makers web site?
Do you guys that have it already in AH like it.
Is there lag time?
Just give me some info before I go buy it please:eek:
Thanks
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Keep in mind I have TIR2, the newer TIR 3 is very similar only slightly more resolution and the new VECTOR thingy changes the way head movement works to a more natural way of converting your movement.,
That said,
There is no lag
The FR hit is so small, you'll never notice it on anything that plays AH2 reasonably already.
With the current system (the new one will likely be a little easier to learn)......It takes a good week with 2 hours a day to become reasonably proficient at using it. It takes about a month to become unconciously comfortable with it. When you first start using it, it feels hard to control, and you WILL get all kinds of unwanted movement as you unconiously move your head. THis is easpecially true when you zoom in.
You MUST MUST MUST allow yourself to work through the hard times or you'll never get used to it. Once you get over the hump its a whole new world...and its hard to play without it!
With the new vector system, leaning your head will no longer turn your virtual head...and this may cut down on the learning curve considerably.
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track ir 3 rocks any previouse view system, but its limited and can be compared to having a mouse mapped to your head, so you dont get any deapth tracking and such, with tir3 vector, it will simply track every movement 3 dimensionaly, its done with 3 dots instead of one. you want to lean in and check out the instruments? no prob,{with track ir vector or any track ir for that matter we dont need the generic instrument lay out, would be nice if there was a toggle} you got a bogey behind a canopy frame? no prob just move your head around it. you want to check out how much more quisky you got, no prob. Oh and there is the god awful question of "what if you check your 6 you cant see your screen" well its not a one to one ratio of movement, you can adjust it to what ever you like, and creating a custom set up is necasary, tho with track ir 3 the aggressive preset worked fine.
again the link to the movie explains all.
http://www.naturalpoint.com/trackir/products/video.html
now all i need is a good HMD gonna have to wait a few years till thats affordable tho.
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It is instantaneos and deadly accurate. But it does take some getting used too.
I am getting it in IL2 but still shakey after 2 weeks in AH2. But to be honest. It improves IL2 so much that I have been playing that 90% of the time since I got Track IR3 pro
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Super response HiTech!! S! and Thanks! :)
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Thanks for the Help and Info guys.:aok
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Just got the email: they are shipping my Vector Expansion today!
yeeeeeeeeeeeeeHAH!
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Originally posted by Bino
Just got the email: they are shipping my Vector Expansion today!
yeeeeeeeeeeeeeHAH!
Oh Sure...and mine is still aparently on a pallet at Natural point :(
tap
tap
tap
tap
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anyone know if targetware will support vector? i know it supports basic enhancement for the tir3, probably just a matter of time for the upgrade.