Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Jackal1 on December 16, 2004, 06:26:52 AM
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For or against the fog thingy?
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Is there fog? It seems so in the latest release of Trinity.
Guess I am for it, IF, It occurs at random times. (Not a Cycle like the Sun.)
and IF it isn’t limited to the Main Lands like the clouds over the main land and center islands of NDILS.
Other wise it just looks like a cheezy effort to hamper attacks in certain areas. If we have any weather at all, it needs to be more unpredictable.
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It's not so much Fog as it is a kind of Haze.
It makes the horizon less visible and useful at altitude, and reduces visual detection range. This makes it easier to get in close before detection or identification.
Look outside some warm summer afternoon...especially in a high-humidity or dusty climate: HAZE
Personally I like it and the other little reality touches in this SIM.
I don't notice any kind of frame-rate hit or other problems, so why complain.
Of coarse I miss the big puffy clouds we used to have, and the short nighttime periods of darkness as well...
CptA
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The haze is alright. I guess it's as close as we are going to get to anything other than sunshine and blue skys at the moment.
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The "Haze" is worse than California smog. You can't see land over 5 miles. That's WAY too much haze.
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Actualy it's 10 miles.
HiTech
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I think the effect is good. Be neat to turn it up in the morning, burn it off by lunch kind of thing. Make it thick in river valleys.
I think it looks good and takes the edge off the game. Distances might have to be tuned.
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it would be ok if it came in the morning then went away to give some variety. I have no idea why its here now other than to make it more difficult to do anything. It just seems like a pointless inhibition since it does nothing for framerates and adds little to combat other than restricting visual range across the boards.
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‚h saw more hazy sky/terrain in the Summer of Hokkaido Japan.
I love it.
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you guys need better pollution controls...
The way this is implemented , what does it really add to the game? Perhaps setting it to normal visual range to help fade in the jagged edges would be the best visual effect. As to adding weather I'm all for it, just with some variety or purpose other than adding that infamous "fog of war" of video game cheesiness past. I would love to see weather fronts, fog in valleys or morning fog fading out etc.. right now its just smog that takes away from some of the visual enjoyments of flying.
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The fog seems like a framerate-saving device more than a gameplay feature. In any event, I like it just fine.
-- Todd/Leviathn
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I like it as well.
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is anyone seeing better framerates with it ? My ati 9800 pro card is still walking wounded either way. I don't notice any significant improvement with the fog on.
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Originally posted by Midnight
The "Haze" is worse than California smog. You can't see land over 5 miles. That's WAY too much haze.
was in cruiser yesterday, couldnt even see the city to shell it
until we were within 15k .
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only played an hour or so last night but what I saw of the fog effect I liked.
Cheers,
asw
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Fog/Haze not a big fan, just another way for people to hide or sneak up rather than fight. Ho Hum.
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JUST ADD TOTAL WEATHER RAIN,WIND,SNOW ALL OF IT
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Fog is pure garbage. How realistic is fog everywhere all the time?!? I don't know what I like better the drop in frame rate and connection probs since the last patch, or the fog everywhere all the time, ground details are hard enough to make out as it is. It's hosed.
Just to give you an idea, I lost somewhere around 30 FPS over it, and for the first time in 5 years am having connection issues since patch this morning. I cut off horizons which got my FPS back up but it looks rough. ALOT of guys having connection issues this morning in MA.
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I like it ok for now. I hope it's not the same on every map. Would look silly on AK Desert/Pizza.
I'd like it better if it were varying degrees of thickness and would come and go. Such as a fog bank on the ocean that rolls in and is then gone.
In other words, if it was more like clouds, than a general haze.
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I really like the haze effect. The horizon looks a lot more natural now with the gradual blending of the ground to the sky. Reminds me a lot of real flying in the summertime.
MiG
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I like it, and would love to see it even thicker on the ground for some even better gv battles And to help keep down the vulching.
Keep up the good work HT.
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I just wonder how frequently haze like this occurred in the 40s? I know it's common now, but we've pumped out a lot of pollution since the 40s. I would be really surprised if haze were common in the middle of the pacific back then.
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Originally posted by hitech
Actualy it's 10 miles.
HiTech
Welp, all I know is that I couldn't see enemy dots until they were almost with in icon range. Needless to say...I don't really care for it.
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Real fog lays like a carpet more or less evenly on the ground. When you climb over, and that doesnt take long at all, it is really kinda pretty. Tall trees buildings stick out of it typically with a quite clear sky above.
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Twitchy, the connection issues are not related to the haze in the arena. And it is not us causing those issues. However, we are working on it with various ISP's.
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Twitchy, the connection issues are not related to the haze in the arena. And it is not us causing those issues. However, we are working on it with varisou ISP's.
Would these issues have anything to do with the snap roll problem?
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I find the fog kinda "Romantic"....sitting in my LaLa....
Skuzzy any idea when we get the sheep back?
:D
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We had dispatched a posse to JOC's lair with the goal of retrieving the lost wool, but they failed to return.
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Originally posted by whels
was in cruiser yesterday, couldnt even see the city to shell it
until we were within 15k .
Isn’t that like 8.5 miles?
Originally posted by twitchy
Fog is pure garbage. How realistic is fog everywhere all the time?!? I don't know what I like better the drop in frame rate and connection probs since the last patch, or the fog everywhere all the time, ground details are hard enough to make out as it is. It's hosed.
Just to give you an idea, I lost somewhere around 30 FPS over it, and for the first time in 5 years am having connection issues since patch this morning. I cut off horizons which got my FPS back up but it looks rough. ALOT of guys having connection issues this morning in MA.
I hear yas twitchy. I have to keep all graphic detail sliders to Far right. (Performance) setting just to keep the game smooth enough to play. When i attack an airbase ground targets i temporarily move the sliders to default so i can see hangers and ack ect. and then back again after i dive and drop ord. The haze has thrown a wrinkle in my makeshift performance patch! I need detail up more to see nme Dots and so forth. I suppose I could live with it if it were random.
Originally posted by Zanth
Real fog lays like a carpet more or less evenly on the ground. When you climb over, and that doesnt take long at all, it is really kinda pretty. Tall trees buildings stick out of it typically with a quite clear sky above.
Bingo
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wow...nothing makes some of you guys happy.
Haze doubled my FRs off and on. (Running a lower end CPU)
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I like it.
No more spotting goons from 20k, or "EZ-Viz"(TM) black dots a sector away.
Better for NOE, gvss, 1v1s at alt.
I like it.
Cheers,
Scherf
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Originally posted by Skuzzy
We had dispatched a posse to JOC's lair with the goal of retrieving the lost wool, but they failed to return.
Skuzz we were just discussing JOC`s career this morning.
I made the official announcement online.
A spinoff of the TV show The Beastmaster is about to be released.
It will star JOC and will be known as The Lanolin Master. :D
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Is the fog/haze keeping the Battle group 5 inch gunners from knocking you down at extreme (only see a dot) range?
If it makes extreme long range visibility hard for you, then it also presents the same problem to them.
Now add some driving rain/snow or other inclement weather and things may get very interesting.
Imagine playing hide and go seek with a bomber formation or enemy fighter or attacking a ground target in a snow or rain storm.
It would add another dimension to the game.
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Originally posted by Leayme
Is the fog/haze keeping the Battle group 5 inch gunners from knocking you down at extreme (only see a dot) range?
If it makes extreme long range visibility hard for you, then it also presents the same problem to them.
Now add some driving rain/snow or other inclement weather and things may get very interesting.
Imagine playing hide and go seek with a bomber formation or enemy fighter or attacking a ground target in a snow or rain storm.
It would add another dimension to the game.
Yea it`s cool to think about, but just imagine the load it would put on the system.
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I don't like it.
It makes flying around quite boring.
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Whats the point of it? Does it hide jagged edges on the horizon now or increase fps like fog in first person shooters?
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I like it, both for fps and immersion. Will be nice if it will be time dependant, in the morning it is usually more haze, than in the daytime. So 10 miles for the morning, and 15 after 12 oc?
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i think its a massive improvement to the visual pleasure of flying.
looks far more real than unlimited vis for 40 miles
wtg HTC.
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Was going to say, it'd prolly please more people if it progressively thinned till the next morning.
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Originally posted by hitech
Actualy it's 10 miles.
HiTech
There you go again. Always cluttering up things with them facts. :D
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So is ten miles purer garbage or what?? :confused:
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Well the Fog in the CT made fighting the P47's very challenging last night.
Added to overall immersion, and certainly didn't seem to bother my frame rate. (almost 2 yr old pc with cheap video card)
Yes it is changing things, and yes thats always a challenge. Overall I think I like it.
The same way the girls at the bar all start looking prettier at closing time when the lights are low. AH looks better with the haze. Softens some of the rough edges.
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i love it and i didnt effect my FPS at all!
1.1 GHz Celeron Processor (load of crap)
512 MB pc100 RAM
40.0GB hard drive
ATI 9200 video card,
stayed a consistant 25-30 FPS in level flight then a normal 15 in big furballs or at basses on fire :aok
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Any questions about moderation. Email to support@hitechcreations.com
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Originally posted by Skuzzy
We had dispatched a posse to JOC's lair with the goal of retrieving the lost wool, but they failed to return.
LOL.
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Originally posted by mars01
Fog/Haze not a big fan, just another way for people to hide or sneak up rather than fight. Ho Hum.
hiding & sneaking up IS part of the fight.
you're SUCH a furballer. :p :)
we need another arena for mars. 2 corners - the planes come out & duke it out in the middle of the ring. ding! ding! winner takes home a gold belt.
p.s.: i like fog, but prefer clouds. i hope we'll see other weather too, like snow and icy runways. :D freezing rain. or, at least just rain.
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I don't like the fog/haze and I want it removed.
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I Like the fog, mostly as it seems to help my frame rate.
To add a constructive comment, it would be nice to break out of the fog at some given flight level (with the fog still present and obscuring the ground of course).
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"How realistic is fog everywhere all the time?!? "
Well Twitchy how realistic is Blue sky and sun all the time???? huh?????
Cmon mate! :rolleyes:
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what fog looks like from the sky
(http://www.lastrefuge.co.uk/images/html/aerials/UK_aerials/mist_clouds_sunset/images/fog_somerset_level9.jpg)
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what air pollution looks like from sky This is Los Angeles
(http://www.colinryder.com/aerial/LosAngeles_s.jpg)
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Doesn't bother me at all and it helps with my frame rate. Up 15 or so on average.
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I think that most of the folks who are not fond of the fog as it is now would like it better with a different implementation. In my case, if you want perpetual "Haze" like we have now, how about pushing it out to the jagged edge of the visual range to soften the edge of the normal visual range . That way you get the benefits of immersion without the limits of that cheesy "haze of war" thats so common in video games. Variable true fog, clouds, weather fronts are all great too if possible in a realistic manner.
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Im for all kinds of weather clouds, fog, snow, rain, wind everything. While its not the most beautiful fog/clouds Ive seen its a step in the right direction.
Tex
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lol that's a pretty nice day for LA, you can see the mountains.
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Remember in AW3 the sheep screamed as you ran them over?
:rofl :D :aok
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Originally posted by AWMac
Remember in AW3 the sheep screamed as you ran them over?
:rofl :D :aok
Also remember on the intro screen, when you right clicked on that certain window and the voice came thru "I'm so hor......" ?
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Originally posted by fuze
Also remember on the intro screen, when you right clicked on that certain window and the voice came thru "I'm so hor......" ?
:lol Aw, damn...all those years, and I never knew that one. :( :)
(...now where's that Gamestorm CD at?)
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like it
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I think it looks great.
Much more realistic than the unending blue sky.
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Don't like it much personally.. seems like I can only see dots about 2-3k yards past icon range.
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I feel the same. He needs to test out different distances. 10 miles seems to short for the game, irl maybe.
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The haze would be good if it dissipated at a certain altitude. Even the summer haze and smog disappears when you reach FL15 to 20. Usually, there's quite an obvious transition altitude where you can see where the haze stops. At FL40 you are over just about everything except ice cirrus. But, at 30,000 feet you can usually see clear to the horizon or about 100-150 miles. So, our 15 to 20k mountains should pop through the haze like islands. Aircraft that are 10 miles away look like they're just a few feet away, it's so clear up there.
Offline, I took a 163 almost ballistic to 45,000 feet. The haze never seems to go away. It really takes away a lot of the beauty of the scenery that the map makers painstakingly put together. What good is it to have beautifully rendered mountainous terrain, that you can't see.
I'd say, take out the haze until you get it right.
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I like it makes my bomber runs so much more enjoyable.
I havent had so many of those pesky Lgay7's go... Look high formation of bombers... When I'm at 20k and there at 2k. They seem to be at my alt in well alot less time then seems possible. now if they are that low they can't see me quite so good. :D
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My frame rate went up quite a bit when the haze was introduced. This iis this first time anything has had a noticible improvement for FR for me.
I can live with it!
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i think its a massive improvement to the visual pleasure of flying.
looks far more real than unlimited vis for 40 miles
wtg HTC.
origionaly posted by mechanic
dito
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Originally posted by Flayed1
I like it makes my bomber runs so much more enjoyable.
I havent had so many of those pesky Lgay7's go... Look high formation of bombers... When I'm at 20k and there at 2k. They seem to be at my alt in well alot less time then seems possible. now if they are that low they can't see me quite so good. :D
If ya had trouble with Lalas in a bomber at 20K, the fog is not gonna change things for you one way or the other.
Can we say Meat children?
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Originally posted by Midnight
The "Haze" is worse than California smog. You can't see land over 5 miles. That's WAY too much haze.
Actually, as an authentic So. California pilot, I can tell you that other than a gusty Santa Ana day... California air is rarely better than this.
Except maybe in Palmdale.
Anyhow, I find it a pretty realistic haze... I just wish we had more clouds and I wish we had night back... oh, and wind.
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Originally posted by Zanth
what air pollution looks like from sky This is Los Angeles
(http://www.colinryder.com/aerial/LosAngeles_s.jpg)
Thats an unusually clear day Zanth.. Thats about 35 miles visability...
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Originally posted by Zanth
what fog looks like from the sky
(http://www.lastrefuge.co.uk/images/html/aerials/UK_aerials/mist_clouds_sunset/images/fog_somerset_level9.jpg)
Yep, thats fog alright... Haze is completely different... Haze is more like what you see in the L.A. picture above... Fog is dense... low clouds... Haze is... well... Hazy.
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I love the new haze. Its great for the framerates, its more realistic (10 miles visibility is quite normal for most theaters of operation of WW2), and its great from a gameplay point of view. I havent tried hunting vehicles with the new visibility, but I always hated the unrealistic "give-away-at-distance-black-dot" that was showing the presence of GVs at 10+miles, even if they were sitting motionless in the middle of a forest.
Litjan
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Only thing I do have against it is that 10k vis range is to short.
That is just 4k past icon range.
What I would like to see is the vis range of the haze beeing moved to say 15-16k.
Tex
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Originally posted by JCLerch
To add a constructive comment, it would be nice to break out of the fog at some given flight level (with the fog still present and obscuring the ground of course).
Hey Lerch, if that's what I think it is in your avatar, I don't think you'll be breakin outta the fog anytime soon bud.
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I like it...runnin steady 75 in all views instead of 54 to 65 over terrain and a big map to boot
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Now all we need is when guys firewall it on takeoff them ending up on their backs. Oh yes - wake turbulence, maybe surface winds, mountain waves for those peskys rises.
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I think the haze is very realistic. I am for it.
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.. double post..
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Against... and strongly!
It completely ruined my first free night for flying for the past few weeks. What is the point of making new (better looking?) maps if one cannot see them further than 10 miles in this haze?
It ruins my SA, I want to see where I am going. Just bring back the old terrains if this is the option for better frame rates!
Various clouds were interesting and added different kind of situations. Homogenous haze everywhere is just stupid.
I can even live with low frame rates at certain areas, at low or at dense furballs. In those cases I always have en option to go there or not. But with this haze I have no options.. it is everywhere :(
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Did I see Hazed in that haze?
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ruined the game
how comes fog can be used but night is a big no no?
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Originally posted by Overlag
how comes fog can be used but night is a big no no?
i'd love to see night return, but only if HT makes the airstrips darker & enables the landing lights on all of the aircraft. i know the lights are there; HT just refuses to turn them on. ;)
seriously...i want landing lights.
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overall, for all of the modelling that has been done, there is still much missing... i think that in order for this game to remain competative in the long haul it needs to really get into immersion for those who might be interested in that part of MMOGS.
in most cases large corporations with vast sums of cash are sponsoring these ventures and they have been beta tested to death before they even think of going to market.
all of the best programmers and all of the best graphic artists on board.
finished product. cheap, efficient, complete. BAM.
what is strange here is that we are essentially the beta testers...and we pay for the priveledge i guess.
one must appreciate the difference, but i might also add that the process that evolves from HTC's method is rather slooooow.
by working real time, HTC has essentially created a bottomless staff meeting in which everyone and thier mother make thier opinions heard.
had it all been worked out it would all be daises and courtesies...
but,
i have noticed that since "sudz" has been on board that there has been a rapid fire of fixtures and additions. it seems that he is a good fixture here. suds. keep up the good work.
that said. i think that we need to see an expansion of immersion in the AH universe in order for it to be competative and continue to grow. Its only a matter of time before some other game has VOX the way that we do and developes a dedicated following and culture like ours. in most ways they already have. HTC relies alot on its vets and it shows. loyalty. i admire that.
but as we have seen, older players begin to go the wayside...younger players want more. hell, i was happy to get my first Atari...anything impresses me. lol. but that isnt the way that it is going anymore. not that i am even argueing that it should. though i am.
i like the sheer possibility of what can be. i have no fear of it.
we live in an age of digital revolutions and i think that we have to welcome it because what it offers us is possibility.
and though it is always easy to rest on laurels.
how hard would it be to add snow covered ground instead of the same dingy green dead grass muck that we see on every map?
how hard would it be to make the clouds variable?
to add realism in the form of an occassional night time rather than these murky endless antarctic summer days...
i have seen what programmers can do. i have seen what great graphics developers can do. i have seen, we have all seen what is possible. some we want, some we dont...
so, again we come to the crux of the problem.
so long as we are paying. HTC really doesnt have to go that extra mile.
that is the genius of the op really.
so long as the additions are real time, we have the pleasure of seeing a work in progress...an artwork in its creation.
i love that. in some ways its like xmas.
but we also have the unfortunate burden of coping with that freedom in the form of a pure beuracracy that often finds itself dead in its tracks by the wind of the old school that wont turn new again.
HTC. i like this game. i like my friends....but hey man...turn it on. blow our minds. show us what your staff can do rather than make us beg. get ahead of the ball man....
perhaps investors...
oh, thats right. we are the investors.
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Nothing else to say after that post. Can't wait for the next update.
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Originally posted by JB88
in most cases large corporations with vast sums of cash are sponsoring these ventures and they have been beta tested to death before they even think of going to market.
all of the best programmers and all of the best graphic artists on board.
finished product. cheap, efficient, complete. BAM.
OMG, I almost split a gut!! this is the best comedic material in the 21st century!
We're you there on Day one at WWIIOL? Were you there for World of WarCraft?
Big companies and their money are no better than HTC. They just screw it up with better graphics and marketing.
You don't think that the players of StarWars are Beta Testers? You don't think that the players at DAOC are beta testers?
Have another strong shot my brutha, cause I'm looking forward to your answer.
Every online game is in a state of constant evolution.. And all the players consider themselves betatesters who pay for the priviledge...
If you've got a better game, tell me where it is! Otherwise, don't imply that there is some better game out there - Because thats fantasy.
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JB88: Can't even begin to think of a response that describes how far off base you are.
HiTech
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LOL you wanna be a beta tester ?
Go play Novalogics joint operations games LOL.
You wanna talk about a game released way before it was completed .
Well it's the one.
You cant say HTC is the only company that is not perfect in YOUR mind my friend.
Hell none of them are.
But good luck finding one and when you do please let us know ok.
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I just went back through some vacation pictures and stumbled on some takin from a helicopter ride through the smokey mountains. Guess what they looked amazingly like the hazey terrain.
Did not post picture but I can.
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Haze is too thick, in my opinion; suggest it be toned down. If it is set at 10 miles, try 20. Issues include:
1) It is ugly (looks like smog).
2) It makes it too hard to see other aircraft, which in turn makes the game's "radar" more important. "Radar" was already too much of an advantage, in my opinion.
3) Even if (2) above is more realistic (no idea if it is), it detracts from gameplay for me, as it is harder to find fights. Since this was introduced, I spend more time flying around looking for people. (Please don't flame me for this; I play for enjoyment, not necessarily for "realism").
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I have to side with the guys that hate it. You can't see any aircraft beyond 6-7K out. Sorry if this differs with what your settings say HiTech, but it's what I'm getting. Several times I've mistaken stars for nme. I find myself almost pressing my nose against the monitor trying to see. I'm getting a lot more eye strain than I used to as well.
I liked the weather patterns we used to have with cloudbanks and rain. It did'nt cover the entire map and if it bothered me I could simply go to a different section of map.
While I'm at it, the sun effects are overmodeled. You can barely read the map at times because the sun whites it out. Can we get some perked Foster Grants?
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yes. i do have a grasp of ground up production. i owned my own digitech company in atlanta for several years before moving on to other things.
during that time i built it from the ground up (10k initial investment) and brought it up to be a successful and highly profitable venture before finally deciding to change my life's
course.
please understand, my criticism is not meant to destroy the effort. thus far, it is good, though i believe that it is lacking the structure and the innovation that will carry it up another notch from its well constructed plateau.
understand, i am speaking on a theoretical level here...proposing what i see as primary difficulties in the model and attempting to bring them to bear through discussion.
that we might disagree is actually a better result. it keeps the discussion from meeting its own entropic demise too quickly...the fate of all things.
many years of crits in art school taught me how to handle criticism of my work. i learned when to take it, when to let it go...what i found was that it was usually in the intent that you found the worth of the message. i learned that you must stay true to your voice.
so, let me state here that my intentions are good and my goal is nothing other than to aid in the developement of a better model through my interactions within the community.
i say these things because i care. i would assume that those who defend the status quo do so because they care as well.
the fact that i am recieving the responses that i have
thus far is, IMHO, an indicator of a good point or a fairly close shave. experience tells me so.
one does not accuse ones credentials if one is has not taken the message seriously....and i hardly expect hitech to take on a debate the true merits of my arguements in this venue. that would be ludicrous.
but let me add...
i have worked with and employed multiple programmers. i have met in boardrooms with fortune 500 companies and i have broght concepts from seed to tree
in ways that had never been done before. all with incredible deadlines, many headaches and many many sleepless nights all for that one brief glimmer of creation.
i too have built it with mine own hands.
and.
i have found that it is the fear of the creation that takes the bite out of progress. the trembling that occurs at the edge of our comforts zones...
but, those are the places where things are really happening. where the doubters lose the roll of the dice and those who can look at it from all of its sides can play it out further.
some fall on the other side of the arguement. i respect that. some are successful that way too.
some dont like the fog. i do. i see it as progress. i see every whine as proof positive that things are going in the right direction. there are always those who will hinder progress. a neccessary part of the equasion? yes, but stopping it entirely? not so good. its a security blanket. in the end, change is innevitable.
HT claims that i am off base. i dont.
i think he misunderstands my statements because he views them as an attack rather than potential wisdom.
alas,
it is his company. its my pastime.
his perogative. my dime.
hopefully, others will offer me the same courtesy of an educated an thoughtful opinion and trust that i wouldnt be speaking if i didnt know a thing or two about it before i spoke as i often have for others.
and, i would certainly love for you to explain it to me sometime Mr. Addink. or vice versa perhaps... i am always open to new learning.
(bow)
happy holidays to all,
i return again to silence.
88
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JB88, Was this a response or a cover letter for your resume?
I assume it was a cover letter for your resume because you hit every possible buzz word at least twice and used big words where smaller ones would have done just fine, a nice condescending touch.
Did you know that 'And.' by its self is not a sentence?
It was particularly fun to see all the big words strung in there, but no effort put into capitalization or punctuation.
Anyhow, the rule is, never use a big word when a diminutive one will do... :D
Seriously though, I once made a post in here and got called pretentious... But I think you've out done me.
Just adding more big words doesn't make your argument more compelling.
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Jackal1 if there are any children here it is you who can't seem to grasp the concept of a bomb sight.
The fog dosn't let those pesky little fighters see me at 25k in whatever direction anymore.
If you didn't have any problem with this befor it's because you were one of those that couldn't handle the bombsight and always had to go noe so they couldn't see you on dar and straif down your target with the bombs. And I know you were one of these pilots from personal experiance.
I say unless you are flying a JU88 or a KI67 leave the lvl bombing to the bombers.
Sorry didn't want to take this off subject to far, I still think the fog is graeat. :)
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jb,
You will learn that HT takes anything that could be construed <-- big word just for KurtVW as criticism as being destructive rather than constructive. Do yourself a favor and avoid the frustration of banging your head against the wall.
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I like the idea down low, but its disorienting flying at 15-20k+ and looking at a grey wall.
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JB88,
I have seen HTC debate many things and he will get into it if the argument has merit.
I think his response was accurate.
For starters, I was glad we were able to shake down AHII before HTC cut it over to production. It made for a much smoother transition. The fact that it went as smooth as it did says a lot. Also I think he is wise trying things out in the MA to get a feel for them. For Gods sake man it's only 14.95 a month, it's not like you are dropping thousands of dollars or are losing sales/money because things aren't exactly like you want or need them.
think that in order for this game to remain competitive in the long haul it needs to really get into immersion for those who might be interested in that part of MMOGS.
What other games are you comparing AH to or are you just talking about pie in the sky? Who do you see as HTC competitors?
in most cases large corporations with vast sums of cash are sponsoring these ventures and they have been beta tested to death before they even think of going to market.
all of the best programmers and all of the best graphic artists on board.
finished product. cheap, efficient, complete. BAM.
"In most cases!" Name one. Again who are these large corps or is this pie in the sky too? What finished product are you speaking of? Please due tell. You spent a lot of time posting your "Resume" but no time with supporting facts of your first remarks.
one must appreciate the difference, but i might also add that the process that evolves from HTC's method is rather slooooow.
What difference? You have not mentioned one company that has delivered anything close to what HTC has produced. As to HTC process, sounds like they are ramping up quite quickly, go check out the latest announcements. Updates have come relatively quickly as well.
by working real time, HTC has essentially created a bottomless staff meeting in which everyone and their mother make their opinions heard.
I am guessing your are talking with regards to the BBs. What is the detriment? HTC gets feed back from his clientele and can see his assumptions either confirmed or can readjust if he see something he missed. It's not like the HTC staff is just sitting on their hands watching the BBS.
HTC relies a lot on its vets and it shows. loyalty. i admire that.
No he doesn't. His statements are that Old players get bored and go away, this is the natural progression as he sees it and to a large degree he is right.
As for the second half of your first post, again this reads like more pie in the sky crap. "I have seen this", "digital revolution that". lol. Name one company that comes close to AH.
You want max realism, well what about the people that want max combat? HTC aims to please both communities, the MA marginally appeases them now. Hopefully with TOD he will make the split between the two and the Max realism people can go to TOD and fly around for 30 mins to only fight for 2 mins and get all the realism they can. While the MA can become more fight centric, where combat is the rule and flying around aimlessly looking for a decent fight is rare.
I am not trying to flame you, but I do think these are honest questions to your original post.
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Originally posted by JB88
that we might disagree is actually a better result. it keeps the discussion from meeting its own entropic demise too quickly...the fate of all things.
Yes but in the same breath one might add that since all closed systems tend toward entropy, entropy is , by nature of it's own existance, the only true measure of time, time meaning a measurable progression of events unfolding in a closed set. Throw in the theory of probabilities and you'll see that the above statement is untrue.
The duration of the closed set is already concluded by the makeup of the original set values and modification of these values are already accounted for, through the invocation of various theories having direct affects on the active set.
So you see, the fate of the discussion was already decided by the original values you started the post with, and it's entropic demise was decided then, and not by subsequant inputs from various posters.
...my head hurts, i need a nap.
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you can still come and drink my beer bumba, but on one condition...
you dont say ANYTHING.
:)
S!
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So you see, the fate of the discussion was already decided by the original values you started the post with, and it's entropic demise was decided then, and not by subsequant inputs from various posters.
Best definition of flame bait I have ever seen.
HiTech
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Originally posted by rabbidrabbit
jb,
You will learn that HT takes anything that could be construed <-- big word just for KurtVW as criticism as being destructive rather than constructive. Do yourself a favor and avoid the frustration of banging your head against the wall.
In the immortal words of Sherman T. Potter..."BULLPUCKY!".
He is fine with criticism. What he has a problem with is the pissin' and moanin' that some believe passes for criticism. You really wanna see him get pist?? Question his ethics...good for one quick ride to Oblivion. :D
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I have no issue with his ethics. Reading his responses to other peoples statements leads me to believe that he has difficulty taking things as they were intended rather than interpeted. Hence , a response that is not productive but counter productive.
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I thought this thread was about fog/haze... what on earth are you other guys talking about???
Take it to some other thread!
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Haze is making an already very dark game even darker. I would like to see very sunny and bright days, not just the darkest winter hazy days.
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im not to fond of this haze/fog idea myself
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rabbidrabbit: I suggest you stop throwing those barbs, because they have a strange way of sticking the person you didn't intend.
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do not look behind the curtain.
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Ok, I'll chime in.
As one of the playing populations biggest "whiners" here is my take on it.
HT listens to everything everyone says. I honestly don't think he discounts out of hand the stuff coming from the people he doesn't like.
However, he sees things from a slightly different perspective than most people.. we see something and go "Ya know, I[/i] would enjoy this game so much more if it was different".
HT has to think about not only what you want, but what everyone wants.
Some stuff takes time, but I firmly believe that if it is in the best interests of the community as a whole, it will get changed if it needs it.
And if you really have a question regarding anything... call them up and ask them. I called Pyro today about the T-34, and we had a very civil conversation about what ammunition was modelled for the T-34. I made a suggestion for a change that would make my game more enjoyable, he said they were already thinking about doing it but they werent sure if they were going to.
I've talked to HT on the phone and in person and game issues, he is not some troll looking to bite your head off. I think a lot of the percieved hostility is that the internet doesn't really convey any kind of emotion like a face to face or phone conversation does. You are just staring at a bunch of letters marching across a screen, there isn't any kind of physical or audial cues.
Anyway, I really suggest those who think HT & company cherry-pick who they listen to give them a call and talk to one of them in person. I think you'll be pleasently surprised at the kind of conversation you get.
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Originally posted by MANDO
Haze is making an already very dark game even darker. I would like to see very sunny and bright days, not just the darkest winter hazy days.
As i remember it, when AH2 first was released. There were some request for HTC to lighten up some terrain color/brightness because it was to Dark and dreary. HTC did just that. Now we add "Fog" that isnt a fog looking effect at all. Its kind of a very light brown haze. Much like the haze we would have in Arizona on some days. Cant figure why?
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HAze looks authentic in game if compared to this photo taken while on vacation in the Smokey Mountains.
(http://www.eastex.net/moto/Hazy%20Smokey%20Mountains%20(Small).JPG)
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I don't disagree with you Urchin. My point has to do with communication techniques and controlling expectations. I have no doubt that Ht reads most all of the posts here which is a good thing. Nor do I doubt he cares very much about his product. My point to JB88 was to not bother banging his head against the wall and to watch what he says since the replies seem to focus on the possible negative connotations to the post rather than the point as a whole. This is my ongoing impression for whatever its worth. It's not my problem and I don't take it personally. What I say is meant in the best possible intent to help improve the situation not inflame it.
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(http://www.eastex.net/moto/Hazy%20Smokey%20Mountains%20(Small).JPG)
Why can't I get pictures to show in here?
Prolly not the right place to ask but I have a picture for this discussion I cant seem to get to show : (
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I think the major thing is JB88 is trying to tell him he is running his business wrong. I know nothing about business, but I've seen the population in the MA literally triple in the 3 years I've been here.
So maybe the my point is it is ok to point out things that you would like change, but criticism on that level isn't even really criticism of the game any more, at least it seems that way to me.
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Originally posted by Flayed1
Jackal1 if there are any children here it is you who can't seem to grasp the concept of a bomb sight.
The fog dosn't let those pesky little fighters see me at 25k in whatever direction anymore.
If you didn't have any problem with this befor it's because you were one of those that couldn't handle the bombsight and always had to go noe so they couldn't see you on dar and straif down your target with the bombs. And I know you were one of these pilots from personal experiance.
I say unless you are flying a JU88 or a KI67 leave the lvl bombing to the bombers.
Sorry didn't want to take this off subject to far, I still think the fog is graeat. :)
OK uncle HT I demand a rebate because I didn`t get the e-mail notice that this .........errrrrr ummmmm sigghhh genius had replied in this topic. I`m mortified...... no wait, I`m petrified.................... really at this particualr moment I`m just FRIED. About four hours of CM and coke on the pontoon boat topped of with an 18 pack gets me all sentimeNTAL like this.
OK where do I start?
OK Played1 ...errr Fragged one...whatever..... yes I`m a child . I can`t deny that. If you want this verified you can ask anyone of my four daughters or one of my nine grandkids.
As a matter of fact Deth1`s youngest daughter refers to me as " her little Popaw".
Now let`s see....... Oh yea, I drifted off there for a bit..... The concept of the "bomb sight" as you put it. What friggen ------> bomb sight? I had no idea bombs had sight.
Now let`s go to the 25K thingie and your hiding in it. Naw.... let`s don`t . It would get completely off the topic of you stating the probs you were having with Lalas at 20K, Once again..... If you were having problems with Lalas at 20K fog, wind, snow, sleet , hail , chitstorms, acts of God, mildew, mold, allergies, insane postal workers or JOC`s sheep is not gonna help ya.
Can you say "meat" children?
Now we can go on. #1 it`s spelled strafe. Experience is spelled like this <---------->>>>>>>> experience.
Now let`s see....... let`s discuss me and NOE. As far as I`m concerned it stands for No One Escapes. I have never been nor will I ever be a fan of NOE. NOE? Yes. No!
Strafing down targets in a bomber ....I`m not even gonna touch. It speaks for itself.
I would go to far to say sir, when it comes to me and your "personal experiance"..... ( that is how you speeeeeeelled it , isn`t it?)....... I have never been and will never be affiliated with Poki Mon. (pun intended)
Merry Christmas and so on and so on.
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And furthermore... gosh this seems like old times. Brings a tear to my eye.... the good one. Skuzz leave it up in the holiday spirit. :D
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I expect everyone sees the haze and the entire game differently since there are so many hardware, software and settings combinations. I'm glad I'm not on the other side of this BBS trying to please everyone and make all those systems and settings make the game look great.
I can accept and adapt to the haze in the current map if it helps framerates of others. I guess you never know how all these people with all these systems will react to a graphical change until you try it and get some feedback...
I do get some 'blocky' and checkerboard haze textures when the sun is low on the horizon. If requested, I can get a screenshot and post it.
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I like the haze. Reminds me of WBs.
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Wb's sucks :D