Aces High Bulletin Board
Help and Support Forums => Help and Training => Topic started by: grizz on January 09, 2002, 05:48:00 PM
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I've been having some moderate success in the yak this tour....but could use some info on how to fly it properly.
What speeds do you like to keep it at when engaging? Tactics for the merge? Strictly verticle or do you like to turn with it. Stuff like that.
Any help would be appreciated. :)
Thanks. :D
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You might want to ask Shamus...he's been kicking some serious buttocks in the YAK lately.
xBAT
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Start here:
http://www.hitechcreations.com/models/yak9u.html (http://www.hitechcreations.com/models/yak9u.html)
I'm not a Yak specialist, but I can tell you that as a Jug pilot I fear the Yak more than any plane in the game. It's more dangerous to me than an La7 or even an N1k2. I fly my Jug as an E fighter, and versus the Yak I can't maintain an E advantage for very long, it's just so good at gaining and maintaining energy. It is a fast plane, it accellerates very well, and it turns pretty good too. It is one of the best close-in E fighters in the game. Use the vertical, use lag pursuit, and other E fighting techniques and you will do very well in the Yak. It fits in the planeset very well, in that it can out-run, out accellerate, and out climb the planes that it can't out-turn. The ones it can't beat with speed, power, and energy it can beat with angles generally speaking. A very good "jack of all trades" in the A 2 A sense.
It's weaknesses? Um, there aren't a lot. It's range is pretty limited if I remember correctly, and it has a mediocre gunset with limited ammo. Don't miss. Take your shots in close and make them count. It can't capitalize very well on snapshots, so you need to work for a tracking shot.
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I started flying yak after Fariz waxed me twice in a row in my jug.
The Yak is an absolute monster, but the guns really could be better. I find myself going to 200 yards before I shoot just because the ammo load limits any spraying. I consider a 4 kill sortie in Yak to be satisfying - then the ammo is spent and time to rtb.
It's quite a culture shock after being used to the jug and its huge ammo load.
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"It's quite a culture shock after being used to the jug and its huge ammo load."
Works the other way, too. I fly the Yak a lot, and when I get into American Iron, I have to remind myself to spray away. :)
Since 9U ammo load is small, I use separate triggers for the MG/cannon, and set the MG gun convergence at 600. Then I can use the MG to tickle the runner, and get him to turn, so I can get close for the cannon.
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personally I think the yak is the best all around plane in the game (outside of ammo load). I dont fly it much anymore but I usually fly it at 16k or so. Ideally fly it as an E fighter and then use its good turn rate to saddle up....biggest key is learning to get tracking shots inside 300 or so...lots of high yoyo's and ropes. It also has exceptional acc and climb down low...I've found that you can work the throttle hard to force overshoots and then crawl up cons rear...only la7/5 and 109G10 seem to be able to outdo em down low.
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dont fly the yak much myself (though i was impressed with it the few times i did).
i did a vertical zoom test a few months back, and the yak was the winner for low alt 300mph conditions. not only it reached higher then the others (200 feet more than G10/p38 300 more than p51/f4u 400 more than spit9) it also handled best at the top - it just slide backwards, drops nose gently and regain level flight at a loss of no more that 200-300 feet.
I had it on my flight tests page but it not working now (will be fixed soon).
Bozon
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What Lephturn said.
The only weakness I can think of is that it not a 'stable' gun platform, meaning it's a bit wiggly when your maneuvering (especially on rudder control) and trying to aim your shot. The other thing is that it doesn't carry much ammo, hence you need to be very careful using it which is not easy with the first weakness I mentioned.
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Originally posted by popeye:
Since 9U ammo load is small, I use separate triggers for the MG/cannon, and set the MG gun convergence at 600. Then I can use the MG to tickle the runner, and get him to turn, so I can get close for the cannon.
Just better hope the sucker falls for it harder than you did last week. I was ticklin', but you weren't turnin!
:D
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First of all, thanks for the replies. :)
The general consensus seems to be get in close and keep it fast. I'll shorten my convergence and have another go at it.
Lephturn, that's the first place I went to , but thanks for the link. :)
Humble, I concur...i've found the best alt to be between 12k and 20k, though it can mix it up lower with the best of them.
I'll also work on those tracking shots :)
Thanks again. :D
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Zdrastvuj ta tavaris :D
Yakov 9U is excelent fighter
main difrent btw Yak and LA`s is that Yak do not snap roll in low speed.
one of the best maneuver, how to get advantige in dogfight is immelman about 180 MPH. When 190 or 109 will try to follow it have big chance that he will end in spin.
Do not turn with spitfires. You can loop,turn with spit IX when you are low on fuel. You are much faster then both spits.,niki and rest of US crap.
Be ware to make stall fight versus P38. If you will meet experienced pilot you are dead.
in yak you have excelent combination of speed and climb rate.
1 of the best way how to start fight in co level is go as fast as possible, go lower then enmy and pass under, behind him as fast as you can. Then watch him. If he will do looping, you will have good fun, because he seems to be experienced pilot... extend and do immelman you can lvl when you are about 100 MPH, yak accelerate well from 100 to 200... then do exactly same thing. Make your pass under enmy as fast as you can. Most of then get piss about it and they will turn=lose E
Yak gunnery. Dont worry you have plenty ammo to do 3-4 kills in 1 sortie. If you will fly yak for few months, you will learn how to shoot 190 while he doing his chaotic movements at D350.
Altitude.
You have no reason to fly higher then 11k.. why ?
because all airplanes over 11k will mostly run from you, they scared about Yaks (still dont know why :D )
And Yak had no oxygen so they couldnt fly so high.
If you wanna learn how to fly, no matter whitch airplane, learn how to fight in disadvantige. You will die many times, but you will have chance to became as good pilot as every famous asces around. i.e. FARIZ
Orel
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btw. my personal record is 6 kills (no manuever) in Yak :D
and 6 bullet kill of F4U at D100 :p
most funny kill was when i dive on looping P51D and i shot his wing off at D400 and i spent 40 MG rounds ONLY
(well i admit that i didnt note that i didnt finish refuel until i hit him :D )
so when you refueling make sure that you are realy rearmed :D
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test
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Lephturn explains very well what Yak9U is. IMO, in overal, far superior to the La7. Add an importan point, your engine power is not limited by WEP, you have the 100% forever without any overheating. Ammo is limited, but gun is very accurate and 4 - 5 kills per sortie is more than enough for any fighter.
I find Yak9U the hardest to fight with my 190D9. No way to defeat it by E, no way to deteat it by turning.
My suggestion is to fight anyother fighter in the vertical except La7, this one in the horizontal.
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"It can't capitalize very well on snapshots"
Unless you put the time in to learn how (of course) :)
Overall, the Yak sux. Fly something else! (tongue in cheek)
Westy
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I have been flying the Yak9-U for a few weeks now and so far I am very happy with it. My biggest problem is gunnery, I just can't seem to get on target well. I have gotten more kills in it that the Spit-V. Any help with gunnery out there?
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Yak-9U has always been my favorite for the sheer joy of flying. Its responsivenes and view from the cockpit make it feel like a Miata with the top down, or vice versa.
The limited ammo load refines aim and demands knife work , endurance is average, bombload is minimal, and no sense flying it above 15k. But under 15k for Captain Marveling around, it rules!
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You guys have pretty much said it all, except for one thing.
Yak mixes it up very well with spits as long as you stay easy on the stick. Get in on his 6, make him burn his E.
If after a couple of times around he's still flying you need to pick your exit point get out, extend, reverse high & come back at him with some E again.
Its not the sustained turner that the spit is.
But it is perfectly capable of giving one fits.
Last, try setting your convergience to 250 for the mgs, 300 for the cannon. Then get into at least 250 before shooting.
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dont fly the yakU, fly the yakT.
that big gun is enough for 10 kills if you can shoot it and have enough fuel.
one ping = boom almost everytime.
and the ballistics are great, you'll find you have no trouble with D400 lead shots and deflections after a bit of practice.
when you get really good, you can literally squeeze off one round for one kill.
32 kills worth of ammo when you master it :D
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Most of the things people have been saying are true enough if you meet an average pilot. However, for all the praise heeped upon the Yak here, no one has bother to detail its weaknesses, which will be exploited by the better pilots.
Low speed handling: Below 200 mph the Yak is an average fighter. Turn rate is good, but nothing to brag about. Get it much below 200 mph and its handling begins to degrade, wanting to fall out of sustained turns. At these speeds P-38s and F4Us will eat it alive, and Spitfires and similar turners will do the same. P-38s and F4Us do it via flap usage. Both are rock steady at 150 mph, while the Yak is fighting you every inch of the way. Pay attention to Ghosth's rule about going easy on the stick. At low speeds, ham-fisted flying of the Yak will quickly get ugly.
My suggestion is this: Manage your E carefully. Avoid prolonged turning fights with aircraft that have superior low speed characteristics. Be extra careful in vertical fights with Co-E P-38s (the J and L), La-7s, Ki-84s and most 109s. All of those will out-climb the Yak. Both the Ki-84 and La-7 accelerate considerably faster than the Yak. So, you had better make sure you have an initial E advantage. At speeds around 200 mph, both will chase you down quickly from distances less than 1.5k. If you can maintain 800 yards separation from the Ki-84, you will eventually be able to pull away. Just remember that while the Yak is about 10 mph faster than the Ki-84 on the deck, the Hayate will accelerate from 200 to 300 mph a lot faster.
Don't get over-confident against perk planes such as the F4U-4, SpitXIV and Tempest. These are genuine monsters and in the hands of a good pilot, extremely capable.
The Yak-9U is one of those aircraft that can bring you much success if you are well versed in the capabilities and weakneses of the enemy aircraft you are fighting. However, if you get it slow you substantially increase the odds of getting it dead too. Indeed, most Yaks get clobbered because circumstances or errors in judgement resulting in it losing E to the point that it became vulnerable.
My regards,
Widewing
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I used to fly the yak a LOT... I loved the way it seemed almost uber :)
But I only flew the Yak9T. 37mm gun. Anyways, zoom climb is good but auto climb from takeoff is rather low. It accelerates like a dream.
But I don't know why y'all are dissing the low speed handling. At least in the T, I know it can out turn spitVs and has. And I'm talking low slow stall horn riding stall fights. It wins. it flies great in all aspects, but don't try taking it up over 10k. Was chasing some B17s recently at 16k and it was struggling big time.
Plus I have a soft spot for planes with no WEP (T has none). Which is why I miss the original Ki84 we had (before it got wep).
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U seems to be a better performer than the T according to the
Aces High charts.
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The U has much more horsepower, just from the feel of it. That includes a nice WEP boost as well. This also translates into better higher alt performace (better than the 9T, that is) and speed.
However, just because it's "better" than the 9T doesn't make the 9T any worse. I like the T because I find I can get more kills with the 37mm (the 20mm I find gets wasted)
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Originally posted by Krusty
But I only flew the Yak9T. 37mm gun. Anyways, zoom climb is good but auto climb from takeoff is rather low. It accelerates like a dream.
But I don't know why y'all are dissing the low speed handling. At least in the T, I know it can out turn spitVs and has.
not sure what spits you were fighting.. :D
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Originally posted by mechanic
not sure what spits you were fighting.. :D
I believe it must have been Triumph Spitfire Mk.II, with the Herald's swing axle.....
My regards,
Widewing
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Originally posted by Krusty
I used to fly the yak a LOT... I loved the way it seemed almost uber :)
But I only flew the Yak9T. 37mm gun. Anyways, zoom climb is good but auto climb from takeoff is rather low. It accelerates like a dream.
But I don't know why y'all are dissing the low speed handling. At least in the T, I know it can out turn spitVs and has. And I'm talking low slow stall horn riding stall fights. It wins. it flies great in all aspects, but don't try taking it up over 10k. Was chasing some B17s recently at 16k and it was struggling big time.
Plus I have a soft spot for planes with no WEP (T has none). Which is why I miss the original Ki84 we had (before it got wep).
Hmm... If we compare the Yak-9T to the Yak-9U we see many differences. First and foremost is the 55 mph speed advantage offered by the 9-U. Add to that a 25% increase in climb rate. Currently neither of the two have WEP power, although at one time the 9-T did (back in AH1). Acceleration of the 9-T is leisurely at best.
Low speed handling of the 9-T is no better than the 9-U. Furthermore, any Spitfire will turn circles around either Yak at low speed, as will the Wildcats, Hurricanes and the like. It can be a fun fighter to fly, but then I have fun furballing with an IL-2.
A simple test will convince anyone as to the poor low speed handling of Yaks. Take one up in the TA. Take off with full flaps and fly around the base a while, then land it. Now do the same with the P-38 and F4U (any model of either). If this does not convince you that the Yak has no business stall fighting, then ask me to join you and I'll provide you with the required epiphany.
My regards,
Widewing
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Well if you're using flaps in a yak you're not flying it right.
BTW, 9U has wep. 9T does not. Just flew a 9U the other day and hit WEP, was greeted by a small man pres. boost and an increase in sound pitch.
Widewing, standard SpitV, flown by standard spitV dweebs. They mostly knew what they were doing, but this is not a single occasion incident. Many times, over a long period of time, I have out turned a spitfire in a low/slow sustained turn fight. Against FM2 might be tough.. Against a zero I'd not do it. Against a spitV you got a good chance.
Now if we didn't have the super rare super uber SpitV, it'd own it. But as itis you have a decent chance of out turning it.
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Originally posted by Krusty
Well if you're using flaps in a yak you're not flying it right.
BTW, 9U has wep. 9T does not. Just flew a 9U the other day and hit WEP, was greeted by a small man pres. boost and an increase in sound pitch.
Widewing, standard SpitV, flown by standard spitV dweebs. They mostly knew what they were doing, but this is not a single occasion incident. Many times, over a long period of time, I have out turned a spitfire in a low/slow sustained turn fight. Against FM2 might be tough.. Against a zero I'd not do it. Against a spitV you got a good chance.
Now if we didn't have the super rare super uber SpitV, it'd own it. But as itis you have a decent chance of out turning it.
Neither Yak has WEP in the current game. That's not an opinion, that's a fact. I flew the Yak-9U in the TA today. It is the most nervous fighter in the plane set below 150 mph... Compare that to the American iron, which are rock steady at low speeds, especially the P-38s and the F4Us.
You are right, if you are flying a Yak with flaps out you are not using it correctly. However, without flaps it will snap spin easier than if if they were used. To say the Yak can turn with a Spit V is rediculous. It's no contest, the Spit will eat the Yak for breakfast and do so with ease.
At 300 mph, G effects on the pilot is the limiting factor. But once you get slowed down to speeds that generate 3g or less, the Yak will rapidly fall behind the curve when paired up against any Spitfire.
Trust me, the Yak can't stall fight with the F4U or P-38, much less Spits, Wildcats and so on. I can out-turn most SpitV pilots with a P-38. Nonetheless, that does not mean that the P-38 can actually out-turn a SpitV, it means that I can fly the P-38 closer to the edge than the average SpitV pilot can push his fighter. The better SpitV pilots won't let that happen as they know that they can fly slower than the P-38, not much, but enough. Yaks, on the other hand, can't hope to compete with the P-38, much less the SpitV. There are plenty of guys who have no real ACM skills, who are easy marks no matter what they fly. Don't base your opinion of the Yaks performance on them or assume that the SpitV can be out-turned based upon fighting guys with little experience.
The worst trait of the Yaks is their poor low speed handling. Therefore, to be successful, a Yak pilot needs to avoid that weakness and fly to the plane's strengths. Especially with the 9-T, which lacks the power to regain speed once it's lost.
Effective stall fighting is something that needs to be learned. Here's a little exercise that some will find difficult, but is a great teaching tool. You and a partner take off from the same field (fly in the DA or TA for this). You take the same aircraft or mix them as you choose. You take off from opposite ends of the runway. When you pass each other, the fight is on. There's only one rule: You must never fly outside of the base perimeter. To verify this, both should have film running. There are no altitude restrictions. At the speeds associated with this type of duel, flying skills are as important as ACM skills. It's a knife fight in a phone booth. There will be as many deaths due to augers as from gunfire. In the TA, the only way to win is to force an auger. Practice this enough and you will have the edge in any stall fight. The next time some obnoxious player demands a duel, offer him this and enjoy their frustration.... Just don't pick a Yak as your ride.
My regards,
Widewing
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Great thread!
I've been flying the Yak9-T a bit here lately and really enjoy it. Your right Mechanic, there is something deeply satisfying about pinching off a single round of that 37MM cannon (AKA flaming coconut of death - or FCD) into someones cockpit. You count off one-Mississippi to account for the net lag and such and before you can get to the ippi..BOOM. I find that my gunnery improves when I make a point to take up a yak9-T each session. I don't remember who said it but yes the ballistics are very good on that 37MM. Unfortunately, as WideWing points out, your SA also gets a workout as the -T is a very mediocre fighter plane. But that gun:
FOOMP-FOOMP-FOOMP
On the Yak9-U, yea Krusty, I've keeled a few Spits in a stall fight, but it's always through superior ACM (they made more mistakes). GhostH, like you said, the key to fighting Spits in this thing is lag pursuit to stay saddled up and KNOWING WHEN TO GET OUT. Then again that goes for most planes doesn't it?
I don't believe the -U is a very good accelerator, however this is just a seat of the pants judgement. It will however hold it's E very well. As a matter of fact, it is purt near as fast a a Pony at 18K and is an excellent Pony killer.
As far as the guns, I happen to like the gun package but not the load. All the guns are on the fuselage so convergence is not an issue (for distance yes, but the effective range of the guns is under 400yds so it is a non-issue). Within range they aim well and hit very, very hard, due to the concentrated fire (think bullet hose like on the A20). Once again, I said within range. Typically if you really want the kill you must get in close regardless of the ride- if for nothing but aiming purposes. Great views as Halo said. I personally find a good view a most important trait when I warm up to a ride. As the quote goes " a bandit at your six is better than no bandit at all" and in the MA you certainly need to see what's chasin' ya! I'll also 2nd the motion that it is a VERY nervous plane when it's slow...don't do that:p
Magoo
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I'd like to expand on widewing's "DA rule" about the merge.
For all intent's and purposes, AH2's duel ladder rules state, "an agreed upon alt-cap not to be exceeded prior to obtaining icon (plane type/name/range) data on the opponent. Once icon is acquired, *anything* goes except a HO on the initial merge."
but then you're free to set up DA engagements in any mutually agreeable manner.
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LMAO Shane...in the Author box to the left of your comment:
Location - in your head
You pompous dweeb (I mean that in a good way)
Magoo
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I love the yak. Got to be a good shot though. Everything above is right. Can black out very easily after a dive. Great for forcing an opponent to crash and for forcing overshoots.
It is so smalll and light and manouverable and fast. Lovely plane (In real life too I believe)
I cant hit squat with the cannon version. :rolleyes: