Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: lazs2 on January 31, 2005, 02:48:46 PM
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LS7... all aluminum motor... 500hp @ 7000 rpm...427 cubic inch.. 11/1 compression... This motor might jar me out of my retro shell long enough to see what this light, powerful motor will do in a 2000 lb Healey backed by a Richmond gear 6 speed. probly too pricey right now but I bet in a couple of years....
lazs
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Or just spray a cheaper LT-1
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Originally posted by lazs2
LS7... all aluminum motor... 500hp @ 7000 rpm...427 cubic inch.. 11/1 compression... This motor might jar me out of my retro shell long enough to see what this light, powerful motor will do in a 2000 lb Healey backed by a Richmond gear 6 speed. probly too pricey right now but I bet in a couple of years....
lazs
Earliest release date for the LS-7 crate engine is late Fall 2005. Price not yet determined. The block is a version of the C5R block, it sells for about $5500 by itself. The thing has titanium rods (aftermarket titanium rods, cheap ones, sell for over $2K a set). Also equipped with titanium valves (the ones I sell are almost $50 a piece X 16). I'm betting the price will exceed $17K. GM is going to have a hard time selling them because there may not be any. Seems the hand fit assembly plant is not going to be able to keep up with production car demands, let alone build crate engines.
The guys at Katech, who do some development work for GM, say that the LS series is scheduled to cease in about 2-3 years. I went to their seminar in December.
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ummmm LS-7 yummy.. And to think that a car that that only weighs less than 1500lbs..
How would you get traction? I mean even the 5.0L Monster Miata conversion have issues with just putting 300 so hp down..Frankly, I would be nervous to drive that monster with a LS-7 motor in it.
Theres a guy who just finished a motor swap in his Miata for a LS-1
(http://www.sammichael.net/ftp/enginebay/ebay2.jpg)
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Originally posted by nuchpatrick
ummmm LS-7 yummy.. And to think that a car that that only weighs less than 1500lbs..
How would you get traction? I mean even the 5.0L Monster Miata conversion have issues with just putting 300 so hp down..Frankly, I would be nervous to drive that monster with a LS-7 motor in it.
Theres a guy who just finished a motor swap in his Miata for a LS-1
(http://www.sammichael.net/ftp/enginebay/ebay2.jpg)
Hummm how bout 1000hp per cyl in a funny car? key is hooking up.....the rest is pure, raw ,unadulterated terror
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No wings = zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
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1500 lbs? what car weighs 1500 lbs with a V8? You can never have too much HP. I am running about 450 right now in the Healey and hve no trouble getting it to the ground.
I can make LS7 hp in a conventional smallblock without the obnoxious nos, but not with that kind of weight and not at 7,000 reliable RPM's.
lazs
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NOS Rules.....It allows me to spend half what I would have to to make the same horsepower. I re-built my first motor at 12 (VW) and worked at a speed shop all through high school. I put many $20,000 motors together and just put a 400hp SBC together for the kid for under 3 grand......spray it and I get another 150 hp for 600 bucks.....Cheap hp and fun too! To each his own I guess
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Originally posted by lazs2
1500 lbs? what car weighs 1500 lbs with a V8? You can never have too much HP. I am running about 450 right now in the Healey and hve no trouble getting it to the ground.
I can make LS7 hp in a conventional smallblock without the obnoxious nos, but not with that kind of weight and not at 7,000 reliable RPM's.
lazs
Saw an LS1 powered Corvair with fiberglass panels and a chrome moly frame. About 1500#.
Oh, you can build a 427 all aluminum small block with 12 or 14 degree heads, or better yet SB 2.2 heads, and get a LOT more than 500HP. And the Brodix block is cheaper than the C5R, as is the Dart. You can get Nextel Cup SB2.2 intermediate top ends for less than $4K. Add a nice Crower or Oliver crank and rods with JE pistons and you can have 700HP on pump gas. I just built three 600HP plus pump gas engines, two 427 Windsor Fords and a 416 small block Chevy. None of them was anywhere near maximum potential.
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Laz I can't believe your Healey weights that much. :eek:
I would have figured them to be far lighter. Considering I'm trying to get the weight down on my Miata the goal being 1900lbs..:rolleyes: I still have some work to do.. 2100 and counting!
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yep... pretty easy to get a blown or turboed small block to put out 700 hp. pricey tho.
No big Healey I know of (and I know of a bunch of em) is much less than 2000 lbs with a v8... they weight from 2100-2300 stock. Just the drivetrains for a 500 hp car are gonna weigh close to 1000 lbs.... don't leave much for body, suspension, steering, seats, plumbing, etc.
Not a fan of nitrous ... Don't like the idea of a car that the hp can vary 150-250 depending on if the bottle still has nitrous in it and the HP only comes on while the bottle is turned on.
rather just have a supercharger and have the hp on tap all the time.
lazs
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No need for supercharging, all three mild engines topped 600HP with ease on the dyno, normally aspirated, with carbs and pump gas. All three had relatively small heads, and streetable cams. The two Fords were for Superformance Cobras. The Chevy is for a 72 Nova. With better heads and some other touches, 700 is not a problem.
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Originally posted by lazs2
Not a fan of nitrous ... Don't like the idea of a car that the hp can vary 150-250 depending on if the bottle still has nitrous in it and the HP only comes on while the bottle is turned on.
rather just have a supercharger and have the hp on tap all the time.
lazs
Hummm I have 178,000 on my 4.8 w/nos and tap the HP at will
I do have a small turbo motor w/ 205,000 on it but have never got 20,000 out of a huffer motor...last one I had was a 6-71 on a pontiac 455 stuffed in a tube frame 79 pontiac sunbird.
Like I said to each his own I guess....I like the $$$ vs HP I can get with NOS.......in the mid 70's we also had a "tap" for a hit or two....then they figured that out and poisoned the NOS......Wheeeeeeeeeeeeel Stand
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Originally posted by bunch
No wings = zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
I would guess you have never driven a Vette before....they are ANYTHING but "zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz"
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Yeah, I guess it was an unpleasant thing to say...I've driven some Mazerattis & they were fun, but even a C-150 is much more so.
My appologies
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captn... I know you have built a lot more modern motors than me but 700 real hp, streetable and in the car is a stretch for a naturlally aspirated small block... it is doeable I will admit but it is much easier for me to put a 700 hp motor together in the garage using a huffer. I am not sure even if I have ever done so. I have helped to build some stout motors but they were never dynoed. I will take your word and infinietely more experiance on this. Heck... it is hard to find a radiator that will reliably cool even 550 hp.
A friend of mine is Kieth Turk.. he just put the editor of Hot Rod (january issue) into the 200 mph club at the salt and Texas event... good read, bout seven pages in the mag. He knows a lot more about motors than I ever will, as do you probably. I am a shade tree guy.
koda... you put over 200,000 k on a motor that was running on nitrous all the time? that must be like 20 gazillion of those itty bitty little bottles plus..... about 5 years of your life spent filling em up... If you can't get 20k out of a huffed motor then just buy one. Tjhey even have em for sale right off the showroom floor these days.. no problem with em... Old GN buicks had turbos and ran forever.
lazs
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LOL...no laz only "at will" which is 5-6 seconds at a time and less than 1% of the time based on .....get this 179,000 miles (as of this am.)
I drive it 150 miles a day and only spray it for short bursts...just to play with cars...(I have a sierra pickup 2wd) I also have an exhaust cut-out wired to an electric solenoid so when I punch it, I hit the cut-out switch and it sounds like an explosion.....and away we go.....There is a twin turbo 4wd truck from Iowa that comes down to KC every now and then.....he runs 10's and it's a daily driver also. The Vortec motors are stout so watch that pickup, he could leave you in the dust.
When I was talking about huffers I was referring to a race motor not one of the little huffers they put on stock motors.....but I need to try one, they seem to work on Lightning’s.......
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A streetable 4 x 4 pickup truck that runs 10's and is reliable enough to be a daily driver?
I'm sure you'll understand if some of us are a little skeptical.
J_A_B
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I quit being impressed by Vette's when I smoked one in my '83 Shelby Charger with a 2.2 .:lol
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GM is killing the entire LS engine series or just the exotic blends?
The LS1 in my car is damn reliable. 96k+ on it and it still pulls very strongly. No major leaks or anything except for a noisy accessory or pulley that's been squeaking loudly for 50000 miles, or "ready to go any day now" according to the dealer :) I've read reliable reports of over 200k miles without any major work on some early vette LS1 engines. It's quiet, reliable, and has great power to weight. Plus matched to the right gears it doesn't even need to shut down half the cylinders to get decent fuel efficiency like the hemi. Or maybe that's why they need to kill it, because they *need* to go to a diff system to meet newer economy and emissions standards... Bah.
I sure hope they don't kill it. It's a great engine, much better than that POS 6 banger 3800 they put in everything else. I read somewhere that the generic GM V6 has more counterweights than big ben :)
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"I sure hope they don't kill it. It's a great engine, much better than that POS 6 banger 3800 they put in everything else. I read somewhere that the generic GM V6 has more counterweights than big ben "
While I'm not exactly a fan of the 3800 V-6, calling it a POS is a little off the mark. That engine is virtually indestructable. Now if you said it had probably the most distinctive (and annoying) sound of any V-6 on the market today, I'd be more inclined to agree. That guttoral "thu-thu-thump" sound makes me ill every time I hear it.
As for whether or not GM might stop making LS/LT series V-8's. Well, lets just say GM has a long and famous tradition of discontinuing their best products just as they get them perfected.
J_A_B
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Originally posted by J_A_B
A streetable 4 x 4 pickup truck that runs 10's and is reliable enough to be a daily driver?
I'm sure you'll understand if some of us are a little skeptical.
J_A_B
Sure thing....all you have to do is get the article from Hot Rod Magazine or car craft (I don't remember which one).......the guy is an electrician from Iowa the company that installed the turbos is based out of Lenexa Ks.
I don't remember for sure which month it is but it was within the past 3 issues.
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Originally posted by koda76
Hummm I have 178,000 on my 4.8 w/nos and tap the HP at will
I do have a small turbo motor w/ 205,000 on it but have never got 20,000 out of a huffer motor...last one I had was a 6-71 on a pontiac 455 stuffed in a tube frame 79 pontiac sunbird.
Like I said to each his own I guess....I like the $$$ vs HP I can get with NOS.......in the mid 70's we also had a "tap" for a hit or two....then they figured that out and poisoned the NOS......Wheeeeeeeeeeeeel Stand
Where did you get the blower intake for the pontiac ?? or did you use the small pos b&m on top of a 4bbl manifold ?
(Im just curious who made it )
theres only a few of those MT blower manifolds around .(for the 10 bolt apps) I still know were one of the few crossrams are that Mickey made for pontiacs also .
Also a 4x4 in the 10's ? thats alot of weight and alot of motor to get it there .its hard enough shaving the weight off the 2 wheel drives to get them there (fullsize trucks )
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Originally posted by Roscoroo
Where did you get the blower intake for the pontiac ?? or did you use the small pos b&m on top of a 4bbl manifold ?
(Im just curious who made it )
Wow your asking alot of my brain cells......I got it from a salvage yard in Salem mo....(blower and all) if I remember right it was a BDS manifold I also had a edlebrock tunnel ram for it That was a TR-1P....I think....... BDS is still in business.
I ran over 200 in the sunbird....I think the et was 6.33...but in 1980 there was no class for a blown street stock, so it was just a fun run....2 weeks later I sold it to 2 guys from Cuba Mo for 15k.
The guy I worked for at the speed shop (Nile Castle) put the bottom end together for me.
theres only a few of those MT blower manifolds around .(for the 10 bolt apps) I still know were one of the few crossrams are that Mickey made for pontiacs also .
I know a guy in Baldwin City Ks that has a SBC Cross Ram on a street rod....(he wouldn't part with it)
Also a 4x4 in the 10's ? thats alot of weight and alot of motor to get it there .its hard enough shaving the weight off the 2 wheel drives to get them there (fullsize trucks )
The guy had a 6.0 built w/ software (maybe Ed Wright software)and put in an L480e....he launchs in 4-hi then pushs the button for 2-hi....now thats shift on the fly.....like I said this guy WILL take your money......
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ok.. so koda.. you basicly drive around in a gutless pickup 99% of the time... every time you accelerate (99% of the time) you are doing it on gutless power. When you want to show off on the freeway you turn on a little bottle and hit the exhaust cutouts..
I like to feel the torque of the motor every single time I take off and go througth the gears... I may not use all the power but I can feel it all the time not 1% of the time (if I remmebered to fill the bottle or there is enough left that is).
Lots of guys I know are running weiand superchargers and a few with poxtopns... the power is there all the time and they are not hard on motors.
RPM.... if you think you can beatr any but the worst smog era vette in lousy tune with that shelby then it is something else that you are smoking.
lazs
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If you want to call 270 hp 325 ftlbs torque (stock) gutless....lol go ahead.....I had a 74 GTO that was 270 hp stock...It was far from gutless....I have hooked other fullsize pick-up's on a trailer and on a dolly and towed it with out knowing it's there.....Hey I commute in this and get a solid 20mpg @ 80-85 ....so yes I drive a gutless wonder.
And yes when I want to show off I hit the bottle openers, arm the nos, then punch it and hit the cutout......I Likkkkke It I Likkke it Aaallott.
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Originally posted by lazs2
RPM.... if you think you can beatr any but the worst smog era vette in lousy tune with that shelby then it is something else that you are smoking.
lazs
No, I just remember the look on his face when I popped the hood. :rofl
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There are several of the diesel trucks in the tens. Twin turbos are not uncommon, nor is propane injection. I know of more than a couple of the Duramax powered trucks that are making right at 1000 foot pounds of torque at the fly wheel.
Here's a short video of a Duramax running 11's. Click on the link to the video that suits your connection.
Fast Duramax (http://www.nolimitdieselperformance.com/)
A programmer, a new airbox, and some exhaust work will put most Duramax trucks in the 13's without too much trouble, and wuithout hurting the trucks utility as a truck. I sell the Bully Dog stuff, with K&N air boxes and Flowmaster exhaust, the stuff goes on just about every tow vehicle my customers buy. All report dramatic mileage increases, and driveability improvement as well.
Regarding the 3800 Series II V6, it's a great engine, I own one myself, in a Firebird, and I love it. i've seen the give the best service of any V6 on the market.
As to questions about 700HP on pump gas from a small block, well, it's pretty easy to build a 427 small block with off the shelf parts. With the current crop of killer heads on the market, 1.65HP per cubic inch with 10.7: compression is not a problem. And yes, with the right cam and proper tuning, you can run 10.7 on pump gas. Granted, it'll have a solid roller in it so you'll have to run the valves every so often, but that's no big deal.
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I've got the Ls6 in my '86. Mine rates at about 400 but I've read where some have gotten it to 455. I've got a 125 HP NOS shot on it but have never used it.
This ls7 sounds interesting and I'm beginning to toy with the idea of picking one up when it becomes available, depending on how much of a pain any required mods to my '86 would be.
Oh and RPM, I still say you're a liar.
get this 179,000 miles (as of this am.)
Unless you've rebuilt this motor, your rings can't really handle the boost from your NOS.
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I predict a rash of thrashed out low milage used diesel's on the market. Just like turning up a big rig... lots of power, lot shorter lifespan. There are only so many revolutions in a bearing's lifespan.
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Hey Laz, that's what u need in your primer coconut :
(http://www.jbp-pontiac.com/new_products_files/ubb[2].jpg)
Those are the guys that will do my 455, as far as runing below 10 on pump gas, cmoplete, I don't think that it's far from being uncomon :
Some cars they worked on (http://www.jbp-pontiac.com/cars.html)
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6.33 in a sunbird in '80 ... whats that 1/8th mile ??? or 1/4 mile on nitro ?
Street class ??? .....
national record was 6.14 /5.95 Ihra/nhra
in 1980 for funnycars ...
We were still runnin mid 6's in the fuel altered at that time ..
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koda.. yes I consider 270 hp in a 5,000 lb vehicle to be gutless. I also consider a 74 gto to be pretty gutless.
virgil... I agree with everything you say. I have no problem with your numbers but... streetable is the term that is flexible here... 500 hp and a six speed with airconditionion on in 104 degree heat and stop and go parking lot of a freeway for an hour is stretching the limits of "streetable" I run a big block with about 450 hp and it will idle all day in the heat with the air on.
My Healey is very old school... 331, old ported "double hump" iron fuelie heads... flat tappet solid lifter with big numbers.... 11.5 to one compression... single plane and 750 double pumper... it is "streetable" in a sense... I drive it on the street. I could get a lot more HP out of it with a 427 small block with aluminum heads and roller cam... this I know. The motor looks, sounds and feels like old times tho so...
frenchy... no room for all the turbo plumbing and heat in the Healey.. I have considered a paxton type supercharger tho. They look very "60's" to me if done right.
lazs
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OOOppss good catch....It was a 9.33 (inverted 6)...and it was just a blown 455....on sunoco 114.
If I had it long enough I feel I could have hit the 8's in it. It weighed 2150.
I actually backed out a hair early as I was white knuckeled after a hard shake....
Back to the origional comment by laz, I totally agree the new SBC is an awesome engine and will more than likely be way out of my price range also. I'm sure hotrod or or another mag will post some builds on these in the near future.
My current dust collector project is a 61 falcon that is tubbed and has 30" of MT's stuffed under it...I have a pinto front end I need to get put under it as the shock towers suc.
I have yet to decide what motor trans will end up in it. I have a 302 but those LT1's keep getting cheaper.
If I took the one out of the ole ladys Impala SS she might give me a smart knot.....
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Originally posted by lazs2
koda.. yes I consider 270 hp in a 5,000 lb vehicle to be gutless. I also consider a 74 gto to be pretty gutless.
lazs
Like I said to each his own....I can produce HP for a fraction of the cost you do so That's what works for me.
I also put cash up head to head....except when a certian Blue 5000lb pickup pulls up.....
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Oh Roscoroo.....I rememberd on the way home Im almost sure that was a Wieand intake for the 6-71 not a BDS I had a BDS on a silverado.
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ive been doing alot of short strut style chassis .this is really compact and ties into the upper front cage ext . (hell i'll dig a pic out for ya ) 63 vette 540 cu in .. 1300hp lenco 4 , 4.56 , 36 inch steamrollers . 7.30's right now (but it doesnt have enough gear ) and its back using the iron merlin block again .. the alum one got rod whipped and windowed.
(http://s90945482.onlinehome.us/roosite/Secret%20link%20folder/Dcp_0002a.jpg)
yea we have a few of the 10 sec deisels running around here .. but most of them are down for tranny's or are too much of a fuel pig to see street driven very much.
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It's 2,800 HP ... as much as a P47N engine:D
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I have a few pics that survived 2 divorces...1 house fire, and 1 storage break-in....but i'm not sure how to post them here...I lost a bunch I had of Gene Snow, Big Daddy, Tommy Ivo, etc...etc....
Nice....whats that in the corner? a GS?
So the thread stays on track.....nice vette
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Originally posted by koda76
whats that in the corner? a GS?
A 67 firebird 400?
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I started to guess a formula 400
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I think pontiac started the Formula in 1970 only. Only the pontiac 67-68 have the chrome all around bumper.
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68 firebird 400 ... 67's have vent windows ... it not a real one ... Fuel line was on the wrong side .. and the eng date code is '72 with 4x heads. (something i did a 4 wheel disc swap too )
Formula's came out in '70
ok ill let the cat outta the bag .. hang on to your socks ...
Here's the car I play with over the years (http://www.draglist.com/stories/SOD%20May%202000/SOD-053100.htm)
the 5.61 was AAFA world record for 7+ years .
Oh well what the hell ... (here comes to 2000+ questions LOL)
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>....bet we crossed paths in texas