Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: cav58d on February 24, 2005, 12:29:18 AM
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Prolly the most famous fighter pilot of all time was knocked out of the sky by a HO by a 109 during WWII..... WHO was he????
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Originally posted by cav58d
Prolly the most famous fighter pilot of all time was knocked out of the sky by a HO by a 109 during WWII..... WHO was he????
I'd have to say Erich Hartmann or Richtofen are the most famous of "All-Time".
Karaya
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Let me be more specific.....The most famous and well known American fighter pilot
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Yeager?
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correct....Yeager was downed from a Head On pass by a 109...so dont say HOing never happened
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And he didnt blew up ????
:eek:
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Dont komplain about HO'ers !
Just turn your tail to them and they get confuced.
"Real cowboys do not shoot in the back"
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Originally posted by cav58d
correct....Yeager was downed from a Head On pass by a 109...so dont say HOing never happened
Who said it never happened? And it was a 190 that went nose to nose with Yeager. March 5, 1944, he was shot down by a Fw-190-A4, piloted by Unteroffizier Irmfried Klotz
But if you are going to use actual WW2 combat as your reason to HO, then you'd also better press for actual death to go with it, since there was some inherent risk in the real deal :)
Dan/Slack
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Originally posted by cav58d
correct....Yeager was downed from a Head On pass by a 109...so dont say HOing never happened
You were weatching the Mil channel tonight, I saw that too.
He also shot down a 262 that was about to land, saying "It wasn't very sportsmen like, but oh well"
As a side note: He was a 21 year old "fighter ace" after downing 3 German planes in one fight.
After being shot down over France he spent 6 weeks dodging Nazis before he finally made it to Spain with the help of the French underground.
Upon returning to his unit he was told he would never fly in combat again, his knowledge of the underground made it too risky for him to be captured.
He refused to go home and appealed directly to the commanding general and was eventually sent back into combat.
After all his missions, in total, he encounterd German planes five times.
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Originally posted by x0847Marine
After all his missions, in total, he encounterd German planes five times.
This constitutes an ace?! I don't think this man belongs in the same category as Hartmann or Richthofen :P
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"I don't think this man belongs in the same category as Hartmann or Richthofen"
Like hell he doesn't. He ended WWII with something like 12-1/2 downed aircraft to his credit. He was one of the best that we ever had. Amazing Man.
Woof
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just saw that episode and it was a 190 that Ho'ed him
Also he got 5 kills in one engagement not 3
After all his missions, in total, he encounterd German planes five times.
I thought he meant "after" he returned to duty he only encountered german planes 5 times. because before he was shot down he encountered them alot more frequently before big week. But I could be wrong ill have to watch it again
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Originally posted by SkyWolf
Like hell he doesn't. He ended WWII with something like 12-1/2 downed aircraft to his credit. He was one of the best that we ever had. Amazing Man.
Woof
I tend to think otherwise. By the time Yeager went to war it was a turkey shoot when it came to fighting the germans. I tend to think if Yeager had entered the war, say in 1942-43'' He wouldnt have done so well.
-Keg.
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"Prolly the most famous fighter pilot of all time"
Who is it then? This is exciting...
-C+
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After all his missions, in total, he encounterd German planes five times.
That was AFTER he was re-instated to fly combat missions again.
If you remember ... he shot down 5 in his first sortie, and during that engagement there sure as hell were more than 5 LW flying around.
As was mentioned above, after Big Week, the LW was decimated and there weren't many targets after that. If there was any LW flying around, they were quickly dispatched due to the fact that the pilots were only trained up to the point of getting the aircraft into the air.
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I think he also shot down a chute. I think he said, "why'd ya wanna go face that guy again and give him a second chance to shoot you down".
Was it Patton the said,"Don't you be the poor bastage that died for his country, let the enemy bastage be the one who died for his country".
War is hell.
Ren
:D
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Originally posted by SkyWolf
"I don't think this man belongs in the same category as Hartmann or Richthofen"
Like hell he doesn't. He ended WWII with something like 12-1/2 downed aircraft to his credit. He was one of the best that we ever had. Amazing Man.
Woof
11.5 vs. 352 or 80? Gimme a f***ing break SkyWolf! If you said said Bong, McCampbell, Foss, McGuire or Gabreski, I wouldn't be so harsh.
Karaya
PS - Heinz Rudel, Adolf Galland, are not to be forgotten.
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I don't agree with you... the number of kills isn't the only factor here. Many times you'll see Western Allied aces scoring competitively with their Axis counter-parts until they are pulled off the flight roster to train units back home. There was an interesting read comparing Johnson vs the early Galland. for example.
Besides, its ALOT easier to fight a defensive battle over your own territory than it is to fly to the enemy, you have more time to loiter/fight and if you get shot down you are quickly picked up by friendly forces. Alot of German aces were shot down several times fighting defensively, heck Galland was shot down twice in a single day.
Originally posted by Masherbrum
11.5 vs. 352 or 80? Gimme a f***ing break SkyWolf!
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Imagine the kill counts the US aces would have had if the US had surpise attacked Mexico in 39, battled Canada in 40-41 and then invaded the whole of South America.
After that they spend the next few years intercepting unescorted bombers flow byy undertrained, green pilots attacking US cities and facilities. Whereupon if they should find themselves shot they are over friendly territory so they just grab a fresh plane and have at it again!
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Originally posted by Masherbrum
11.5 vs. 352 or 80? Gimme a f***ing break SkyWolf! If you said said Bong, McCampbell, Foss, McGuire or Gabreski, I wouldn't be so harsh.
Karaya
PS - Heinz Rudel, Adolf Galland, are not to be forgotten.
You gotta remember that he did it in less than 50 missions. ALL the American pilots that flew in Eurrope were mission-limited, usually 50 per tour.
That doesn't take anything away from any of the others--they were all great fighter pilots. Yeager was more famous after the war, for his test pilot experiences and skills. And the argument could be made that he is the "Most famous pilot of all time". but that would set him against Lindburgh, Earhart, and others.
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Originally posted by rshubert
You gotta remember that he did it in less than 50 missions. ALL the American pilots that flew in Eurrope were mission-limited, usually 50 per tour.
That doesn't take anything away from any of the others--they were all great fighter pilots. Yeager was more famous after the war, for his test pilot experiences and skills. And the argument could be made that he is the "Most famous pilot of all time". but that would set him against Lindburgh, Earhart, and others.
I thought he was famous for the AC DELCO battery commercials?:D
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I missed the Yeager documentary, but I've read his book and met him in person.
Yeager is an incredible pilot! He is (not was, but is) able to make a plane do exactly what he wants it to.
During some flight testing which was monitored by onboard equipment, Yeager was the only pilot able to fly sawtooth patterns repeatedly. In NATO gunnery competitions Yeager won first place. This was after half his gunns jammed.
Think about the skill involved. All the NATO countries had their best pilots and Yeager beat them all. With half the guns he was still able to put more bullets on target then the other countries best pilots.
To prove it was the pilot and not the plane, Yeager and his CO or Commanding Officer (it's been a while since I read the book, I forgot who) took up a captured MIG-15 and Sabre and fought. Yeager won. They switched planes. Again Yeager won. Yeager proved that the MIG-15 wasn't unbeatable in Korea.
Yeager attributes his life to skill, luck, and good engineers. Not bad for a barefoot kid from the hills.
By the way, when he was with the French Underground, he was living in a cat house and wiring demolitions for them since he had experience with explosives growing up on a farm.
When he escaped to Spain, his partner had a leg nearly shot off by a German patrol that almost caught them. Yeager carried the guy over the Pyrranees Mountains.
And he's still doing it. Last summer I was out at a local airfield just looking at the planes. There is an Albatross that was stretched to add an additional row of seats that never seems to move. This time there were people milling about and I stopped to chat.
Seems that Yeager (annually?) flies the perimiter of Alaska. Might be (sketchy memory here) part of a tribute to Wiley Post and Will Rogers. Some of the flight was in military craft (which he wouldn't be flying if flight surgeons didn't check him out) some was in private craft such as this stretched Albatross. The owner was pulling lilly pads out of the landing gear as he was telling me how good Yeager did flying his plane.
Alaska pilots, especially old Alaska pilots, are a forthright bunch who will call a spade a spade. Routinely they are reminded that everytime you get in a plane, you are risking your life. They pull no punches. The plane owner was impressed how well the General flew his plane. I doubt that he gives undeserving compliments.
Now, if a guy can sit in a plane he's never flown before, especially a one of a kind plane and fly it to the owners satisfaction, I'd say he's got some good piloting skills.
Lastly, I don't get the Bong/Yeager war that some people have. Both are exceptional pilots.
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Another funny Yeager thing, was he never had much interest in flying, being from a farm in the heartland.
He said he replaced an engine in a trainer and the pilot said, you fixed it lets go and that was his first flight. The rest is history.
This story and the others were told by Yeager in the show on the Military Channel last night Wings at War, Target Berlin.
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Originally posted by Westy
Imagine the kill counts the US aces would have had if the US had surpise attacked Mexico in 39, battled Canada in 40-41 and then invaded the whole of South America.
After that they spend the next few years intercepting unescorted bombers flow byy undertrained, green pilots attacking US cities and facilities. Whereupon if they should find themselves shot they are over friendly territory so they just grab a fresh plane and have at it again!
Lol. WTG Westy.
- oldman
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Great Point.
To try to belittle the man's accomplishments by comparing him to a select Few German Pilots that had been killing people for years is ridiculous. I too met the man at the Fun & Sun in Lakeland FL..... so admittedly I may be a bit biased. But study his life and if you aren't impressed then you ain't paying attention. The thing that worries me is that he is now in his 80's. We've lost so many of the great Men of WWII...It's a awful thought.
Woof
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Originally posted by Charge
"Prolly the most famous fighter pilot of all time"
Who is it then? This is exciting...
-C+
Famous? Galland
Best? Marseilles :D
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Originally posted by SkyWolf
Great Point.
To try to belittle the man's accomplishments by comparing him to a select Few German Pilots that had been killing people for years is ridiculous. I too met the man at the Fun & Sun in Lakeland FL..... so admittedly I may be a bit biased. But study his life and if you aren't impressed then you ain't paying attention. The thing that worries me is that he is now in his 80's. We've lost so many of the great Men of WWII...It's a awful thought.
Woof
Read what I posted again. Bong was German? Bottom line. Yeager is NOT the "most famous fighter pilot of all-time". Never has, never will be.
You guys can post all of the watermelon you want. But, the first post is full of watermelon and you all know it.
Karaya
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He who wins writes the history.
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"Read what I posted again. Bong was German? Bottom line. Yeager is NOT the "most famous fighter pilot of all-time". Never has, never will be.
You guys can post all of the watermelon you want. But, the first post is full of watermelon and you all know it.
Karaya"
No Dude... YOU read what you posted. You said he didn't belong in the same Category as Richtofen or Hartmann. You said Jack poop about the Americans initially. I also never said he was the most famous fighter pilot of all time. I said he DOES belong in the same Category as the other two. Dispute that if you like, but quit molding reality to fit what you are complaining about.
Woof ;)
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Originally posted by cav58d
Prolly the most famous fighter pilot of all time was knocked out of the sky by a HO by a 109 during WWII..... WHO was he????
I wasn't talking about YOU Sky. Who's name is attached to the Quote? Sit down.
Karaya
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Originally posted by Guppy35
Who said it never happened? And it was a 190 that went nose to nose with Yeager. March 5, 1944, he was shot down by a Fw-190-A4, piloted by Unteroffizier Irmfried Klotz
But if you are going to use actual WW2 combat as your reason to HO, then you'd also better press for actual death to go with it, since there was some inherent risk in the real deal :)
Dan/Slack
Unteroffizier Irmfried Klotz... WOW. His name alone could kill a dozen airplanes. Say that name 3 times fast....
Wonder if his parents called him "Unti" for short... "Unti Klotz" That has kind of a neat ring to it...
Ok, continue your old/dead guy argument :D
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"Who's name appears on the quote?"
Hmm.... seems like mine (see Below). I have a difficult time figuring you out man. You bounce around more than my gunsights.
Woof
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quote:
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Originally posted by SkyWolf
Great Point.
To try to belittle the man's accomplishments by comparing him to a select Few German Pilots that had been killing people for years is ridiculous. I too met the man at the Fun & Sun in Lakeland FL..... so admittedly I may be a bit biased. But study his life and if you aren't impressed then you ain't paying attention. The thing that worries me is that he is now in his 80's. We've lost so many of the great Men of WWII...It's a awful thought.
Woof
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Read what I posted again. Bong was German? Bottom line. Yeager is NOT the "most famous fighter pilot of all-time". Never has, never will be.
You guys can post all of the watermelon you want. But, the first post is full of watermelon and you all know it.
Karaya"