Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: Waffle on March 21, 2005, 12:56:13 PM
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I was out this week and ran across a few books that I liked and decided to pick them up.....
Years ago - I would consider a book if it was around $25-35 or under....
Then that moved to $45-55.....
Well now I'm I'm not batting an eye at the $70-90 price range on books....
I need help....lol
Any of you history junkies / Aviation buffs have this problem?
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You really don't wanna know Waffle :)
Dropping $60-$70 on a Group History has gotten fairly regular for me. Probably the most expensive was an original 447th BG history I spent well over $100 for while researching a 447th BG crew.
I've been pretty much buying a book a paycheck since I was 16, and that was in 1976. I used to just head for the libraries but the selection was never good enough, and I do use the stuff over and over again.
The advantage now, is my home library is stocked with all the good stuff, so I've become much more selective with Group Histories having become the priority.
That doesn't stop the impulse buy now and then though :)
Dan/CorkyJr
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Originally posted by Guppy35
The advantage now, is my home library is stocked with all the good stuff, so I've become much more selective with Group Histories having become the priority.
What's your address?
Also, do you have a dog?
-Sik
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Yeah. Went to Pearl to visit the Missouri and the Bowfin this past weekend, ended up buying books on battleships and one on the efforts to find the carriers lost in the battle of Midway........then bought videos................spent damn near 300 bucks in one trip. It was worth it though (for me lol). Wife is a little sore from all the ladder climbing on the Missouri though.
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I have budget for books which makes me trade off price against time. The books I really want I get sooner, but typically pay more for.
I buy most of my books used. I set up a want list at abe and it regularly sends me emails of books I am interested in with prices requested by book sellers from all over. When I see a bargain, I buy it.
Average purchase price, probably $30. The most expensive are the original engine manuals, which can run into 3 digits.
-Blogs
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$15 Fighters of WW2 If anyone has picked this up you have probably noticed a few mistakes that looks like the book never made it to the editor or something got messed up in the printing process, what the heck though I was sick, I was at the mall with my mum, and it was only $15! I thought it was a good deal I usually look at aircraft info not read the paragraphs anyways.
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383 reference books.
Over 7168 bucks spent so far.
How do I know?
I put them all in Excell!
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Joe
Were do you get these engine manuals?
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Star
How big is the tour of the mighty Mo?
DO you get inside a 16 Inch turret? What about a 5 inch mount?
DO they take you to the engine rooms etc?
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Originally posted by GtoRA2
Star
How big is the tour of the mighty Mo?
DO you get inside a 16 Inch turret? What about a 5 inch mount?
DO they take you to the engine rooms etc?
Right now about 10% of the ship is "open". By this I do not mean open to the public, I mean open if you buy a tour. The ship is kept up by private funds (Friends of the Missouri) and sometimes by volunteer labor from the sub base (noobs waiting for their ship to come in and have free time). Some of the ship IS open to the general public for ................ 15 bucks I think ..............
They have the #3 16" gun turret partially done, you can stick your head in but thats it. They are working on restoring #1 turret for people to actually go inside and see how the loading operations worked.
If you go on the "Explorers Tour", #4 Engine room is open and #4 boiler room. Fire control is also open. They show you the Mk8 Fire Control Computer and the targeting switches for which targeting data you accept. They take you briefly through Officers Country and some of the mess rooms. They have bunk areas from both 1940s (steel poles with canvas "bunks" lashed on with ropes) and the 1980s (wood frames with a thin mattress). You also get to go into the Brig. The people in the operation are almost all former or retired navy folks and know their stuff pretty good. They hope to eventually have 70% of the ship open for tours. For anybody that loves ships, you cant beat walking on the deck of an Iowa class Battleship.
They also have a "flight simulator" (more like a movie in a moving capsule) with footage from Iwo Jima. Wasnt as much fun as I expected, but it was still cool.
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Awsome!
I wonder if they bay area will eventualy get the Iowa? You can see her from the freeway up in the north bay.
I am sure the navy will keep trying to strike her from the books.
I love these ships.
Did you take any pics?
Can you volenteer time aboard to help restore her?
Thanks for the info!
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God, I don't even want to think about it.
This month alone I have spent over 700 US dollars. Most of it in acquiring original documentation on the original paper.
Books? I spent about 200 on books this month which is what I have been averaging with a spike like this month every 2-3 months.
That does not include gas, food, hotels, etc.. when traveling to archives/museums for research either.
Expensive to research a book. When you see guys post documentation, like Henning, Guppy, F4UDOA, and others, be sure to thank them. They are niether free nor cheap.
All the best,
Crumpp
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Crump.
Guys like you and F4UDOA, should write a how to get research info FAQ lol.
I would love to know the ins and outs of it.
I find many books on WW2 aviation are filled with the same general information over and over, and finding a jewel like Bodies P-38 and P-47 books or a book like Americas Hundred thoasand that has new info or good technical info rare.
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Gentlemen, save yourself a lot of money. Go to Alibris.com (http://www.alibris.com) and buy used. I bought one of the original 1000 copies of Pete Bowers' Fortress in The Sky for $70 thru Alibris. Six months later, I saw one go for $370 on Ebay. Alibris is a great place to find out of print material.
My regards,
Widewing
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Thanks Widewing,
I try and buy used anytime I can.
Usualy through the used book dealers at amazon.
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Waffle
I have all my books in excell, if you want me to send you the sheet, it has auther and price, along with a short review.
Just let me know
GTORA2@gmail.com
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3 places - abe.com, alibris, and ebay.
The trick is to use general keywords. Most people selling this stuff don't know what they have. But they are also greedy and ask a lot. So it takes patience, unless you have an unlimited budget.
All my luck so far has been with the American companies. I'd like to start collecting foreign manuals, but I'd need a translator.
-blogs
Originally posted by GtoRA2
Joe
Were do you get these engine manuals?
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DO you just search for say
R2800 manual on ebay?
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To really be good at this requires time and experience with the official archives.
Crump I think you are already well down that road. For a lot of us, we can't get the librarians to call us back or a week off of work to figure out the indices.
-blogs
Originally posted by Crumpp
God, I don't even want to think about it.
This month alone I have spent over 700 US dollars. Most of it in acquiring original documentation on the original paper.
Books? I spent about 200 on books this month which is what I have been averaging with a spike like this month every 2-3 months.
That does not include gas, food, hotels, etc.. when traveling to archives/museums for research either.
Expensive to research a book. When you see guys post documentation, like Henning, Guppy, F4UDOA, and others, be sure to thank them. They are niether free nor cheap.
All the best,
Crumpp
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Start with the name of the manufacturer. Then limit to engine model, but possibly not. If you have an exact title from a reference, try it but don't be surprised if you draw blanks.
It took me several months to find an affordable manual on the R2800 model with a 2 stage supercharger. Try for example "Operators Handbook Double Wasp A & B Series Engine," Pratt & Whtiney Aircraft.
If you have a lot of cash to spend, it goes much faster, but I can't do that.
-blogs
Originally posted by GtoRA2
DO you just search for say
R2800 manual on ebay?
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Can't get to Hawaii? Consider Camden, NJ home of the New Jersey. They are opening up more and more of the ship as they get more funds.
Most impressive place I saw were the combat centers - how they directed the big guns. Literally many feet of armor which everyone knew wasn't enough, so they built duplicates...
-blogs
Originally posted by GtoRA2
Star
How big is the tour of the mighty Mo?
DO you get inside a 16 Inch turret? What about a 5 inch mount?
DO they take you to the engine rooms etc?
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Originally posted by Widewing
Gentlemen, save yourself a lot of money. Go to Alibris.com (http://www.alibris.com) and buy used. I bought one of the original 1000 copies of Pete Bowers' Fortress in The Sky for $70 thru Alibris. Six months later, I saw one go for $370 on Ebay. Alibris is a great place to find out of print material.
My regards,
Widewing
That or http://www.abebooks.com
I've found lots of out of print stuff there as well.
Dan/CorkyJr
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Joe
Jersey or Hawaii are just about out of reach, both would be "vacations"
The GF will do Hawaii, and I can drag her to the Mo, lol. Wont be this year.
Jersey is not going to happen, I mention east coast and she gives me a dirty look. (she lived over there and didnt like it)
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Thanks for the info guys.
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To really be good at this requires time and experience with the official archives.
Yes it does. Some of the archives I am on first name basis with most of the staff.
Be glad to help with any specific questions on research.
All the best,
Crumpp
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I'm mostly look for the technical side as well as pictures / and good qaulity drawings. I was eyebaling "German Aircraft Interiors", but ended up picking up "Focke-Wulf 190A - Illustrated History of the Luftwaffes Legendary Fighter Aircraft" by Hermann, Leverenz, & Weber. So far a good read and lot of details.
Anything that has details and pictures of aircraft - I'm looking for it...lol
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Originally posted by Waffle BAS
I'm mostly look for the technical side as well as pictures / and good qaulity drawings. I was eyebaling "German Aircraft Interiors", but ended up picking up "Focke-Wulf 190A - Illustrated History of the Luftwaffes Legendary Fighter Aircraft" by Hermann, Leverenz, & Weber. So far a good read and lot of details.
Anything that has details and pictures of aircraft - I'm looking for it...lol
I end up on the opposite side of the spectrum. The aircraft becomes the guide to the guys who flew it.
100 Spit XIIs built, two squadrons flying it. Perfect little framework for a project that kept me going tracking pilots, ground crew and info from 1980 on, with about a 6 year window of everyday something new stuff. England twice, RAF Museum, Duxford, Colitshall, Tangmere, IWM and a reunion of 41 Squadron
The 90s was bomber crews, 454th out of Italy, 447th out of England.
AW shows up and I get 38 happy, now the shelves are stocked with all the 38 group histories and anything I could find on em.
It's a disease I tell ya! :)
Dan/CorkyJr
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Originally posted by GtoRA2
Awsome!
I wonder if they bay area will eventualy get the Iowa? You can see her from the freeway up in the north bay.
I am sure the navy will keep trying to strike her from the books.
I love these ships.
Did you take any pics?
Can you volenteer time aboard to help restore her?
Thanks for the info!
Sort of. The wife took the pics, so she didnt direct the camera to the places I wanted her to always, but there are a few good ones. Problem is, I opened a photo album on Yahoo but all I can get to show here are the links. I'm uploading them now to the album, and I'll try again. I may just end up posting a link to the album and say browse away lol.
Also (to stay on topic) I have used Abe.com several times. Great used book service.
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Here's a hit from ABE that came today, and pretty cheap too:
Operation and Service Manual Wright Cyclone 9 Paterson, NJ.: Wright Aeronautical Corporation, 1943 Near Fine. (Keywords: AVIATION, CURTISS-WRIGHT CORP.)
That was generated by a want with a keyword "Cyclone" and Publisher "Wright"
-blogs
Originally posted by GtoRA2
Joe
Were do you get these engine manuals?
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Started new thread late last night with the link for pics if anyone is interested. I didnt want to keep dragging this thread off topic.
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Originally posted by Waffle BAS
Any of you history junkies / Aviation buffs have this problem?
I am the proud owner of a library at home containing more than 2000 books, some of them on air combat, its history, its participants and its aircraft. But mostly (with the exception of about 50 math books) they are aerodynamics texts dating from the dawn of aviation to modern day, not much worth reading slips through the net, but I am very conscious of a few worthy omissions, but I'll add them to the list eventually.
Have I read them all? Nope, I've read parts of all of them and all of some of them, but I use them mostly for reference, and most of them are stuffed with book marks with notes and comments. I almost never read for less than two hours a day, often much more.
How much do they cost? The most expensive book was about $140, but average cost of around $40 for new books, but most of mine were acquired as used books. I spend almost as much on papers archive material and other documents.
There are some drawbacks though... I don't have any of them catalogued or listed, so I have sometimes purchased a book only to get home and find I've already got it on my shelves. Also, when I remember a fact but can't remember where I read it, and need a reference, it can take a long time to find. But the search can be fun if you as easily distracted as I am :)
Badboy
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I need to visit your library...
-blogs
Originally posted by Badboy
I am the proud owner of a library at home containing more than 2000 books, some of them on air combat, its history, its participants and its aircraft. But mostly (with the exception of about 50 math books) they are aerodynamics texts dating from the dawn of aviation to modern day, not much worth reading slips through the net, but I am very conscious of a few worthy omissions, but I'll add them to the list eventually.
Have I read them all? Nope, I've read parts of all of them and all of some of them, but I use them mostly for reference, and most of them are stuffed with book marks with notes and comments. I almost never read for less than two hours a day, often much more.
How much do they cost? The most expensive book was about $140, but average cost of around $40 for new books, but most of mine were acquired as used books. I spend almost as much on papers archive material and other documents.
There are some drawbacks though... I don't have any of them catalogued or listed, so I have sometimes purchased a book only to get home and find I've already got it on my shelves. Also, when I remember a fact but can't remember where I read it, and need a reference, it can take a long time to find. But the search can be fun if you as easily distracted as I am :)
Badboy
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Badboy
Buying the same book over is the whole reason I bit the bullet and put them in excell
LOL still I forget the damn list when I go to bookstores all the time.
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Originally posted by Badboy
I am the proud owner of a library at home containing more than 2000 books, some of them on air combat, its history, its participants and its aircraft. But mostly (with the exception of about 50 math books) they are aerodynamics texts dating from the dawn of aviation to modern day, not much worth reading slips through the net, but I am very conscious of a few worthy omissions, but I'll add them to the list eventually.
Have I read them all? Nope, I've read parts of all of them and all of some of them, but I use them mostly for reference, and most of them are stuffed with book marks with notes and comments. I almost never read for less than two hours a day, often much more.
How much do they cost? The most expensive book was about $140, but average cost of around $40 for new books, but most of mine were acquired as used books. I spend almost as much on papers archive material and other documents.
There are some drawbacks though... I don't have any of them catalogued or listed, so I have sometimes purchased a book only to get home and find I've already got it on my shelves. Also, when I remember a fact but can't remember where I read it, and need a reference, it can take a long time to find. But the search can be fun if you as easily distracted as I am :)
Badboy
Mine's about the same size. What scares me is someone will ask a question and I can see the page and the book its in and find it quick.
I most definately agree about the search being fun too :)
Dan/CorkyJr
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Hehe,
I could write a book on this subject.
I have gotten very lucky in my searches.
Francis Dean author of "Americas Hundred Thousand" and editor of the "Joint Fighter Conferance" lived 1/2 hour away from me so I was able to email him and then visit him on a couple of occassions. Talk about a national treasure, that was one guy who knew everything and had every document. He passed away a couple years ago and my best source went to the after life.
I have corresponded with Barret Tillman, Corkey Meyer, the Vought Museam and the SETP (Socioty of Experamental Test pilots. The only place that has every taken money from me was the British PROCAT document service. They have a few of my pennies.
Hell, Eric Bergerud Author of "Fire in the Sky" is an active member of my Squad the BK's right here in AH. Talk about convenient!!
My biggest disappointment now is that I have no interest in books anymore. I find it is all reprinted information from some document that I already have or heard about.
I need to plan a trip to Wright Patterson, Elgin, Patuxant, Vought and the PROCAT. THE TRUTH IS OUT THERE!!
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My biggest disappointment now is that I have no interest in books anymore. I find it is all reprinted information from some document that I already have or heard about.
OMG! Tell me about it. I was frothing at the mouth to get a copy of Rodeikes "Focke Wulf Jagdflugzeugen 190". It was a shock and disappointment to see I have all the documents he referenced and then some.
Great pics though and a very well done work on the FW-190.
If I am lacking material it is original pictures. Then again, I always hated the "picture books" with no substance.
All the best,
Crumpp
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Originally posted by Crumpp
OMG! Tell me about it. I was frothing at the mouth to get a copy of Rodeikes "Focke Wulf Jagdflugzeugen 190". It was a shock and disappointment to see I have all the documents he referenced and then some.
Great pics though and a very well done work on the FW-190.
If I am lacking material it is original pictures. Then again, I always hated the "picture books" with no substance.
All the best,
Crumpp
Do you notice how much more often you find mis identified captions, or just downright incorrect information in books?
Spitfire the History, by EB Morgan is a perfect example. It's the Spit bible, but there are so many misidentifed photos, it's scary.
Dan/CorkyJr
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Do you notice how much more often you find mis identified captions, or just downright incorrect information in books?
Yes I have noticed many more mistakes than I used too. Not sure if they are geniune mistake of fact, translation error, or editing error.
What amazes me is the often repeated continous mistakes. The mistake itself just takes on a life of it's own and becomes fact.
Good example is the 801 series engines. Every text you see says 1700 - 1800 hp from day one it was installed in the FW-190A. Just simply not true.
All the best,
Crumpp
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Of all the engines you see statistics on, this is the one that never seems to change. The R2800 gains 500 HP over time and the 801 nothing? Please.
-blogs
Originally posted by Crumpp
Yes I have noticed many more mistakes than I used too. Not sure if they are geniune mistake of fact, translation error, or editing error.
What amazes me is the often repeated continous mistakes. The mistake itself just takes on a life of it's own and becomes fact.
Good example is the 801 series engines. Every text you see says 1700 - 1800 hp from day one it was installed in the FW-190A. Just simply not true.
All the best,
Crumpp
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Of all the engines you see statistics on, this is the one that never seems to change. The R2800 gains 500 HP over time and the 801 nothing? Please.
Exactly. If you trace the 801's power development it goes from around 1630PS all the way to 2050PS at 1st Gear Supercharger FTH during it's lifetime. The late war models of the 801 go as high as 2200PS.
This is one of the big questions I am attempting to answer. Just how prevelant were these late war engines. So far I have collected enough documentation, eyewitness accounts, and physical evidence to conclude the program was much more advanced in the frontline geschwaders than commonly known.
When I go to Norway, I will be examining the wrecks of several hundred late war FW-190A's.
All the best,
Crumpp
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Well, I tend to spend money substantially when I have been too long without new book purchases :) What I buy tends to vary. Either I'm collecting books about one subject, or then just any interesting WW2 aviation literature.
My latest purchases are a bit biased:
(http://www.byterapers.com/~grendel/scan/mysources2.jpg)
In order to learn more about the Bf 109 I ordered bunch of books about it and about pilots flying it. And I can never resist Luftwaffe 1946 stuff from Ted Nomura, either ;-)
The low row, middle book, Enemy inthe Dark, is by Peter Spoden, he was Me 110 / Ju-88 night fighter pilot. I will interview him in May, so I got to dig into his persona a bit more.
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Here is a book that one should put on their 'want' list.
(http://members.aol.com/falkeeins/Sturmgruppen/reschkeJG301.jpg)
Should be published soon.
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Milo,
Is that one different from this book?
http://www.schifferbooks.com/newschiffer/book_template.php?isbn=0764321307
If it is then I will certainly add it to my list of must have reference.
All the best,
Crumpp
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Originally posted by Grendel
Well, I tend to spend money substantially when I have been too long without new book purchases :) What I buy tends to vary. Either I'm collecting books about one subject, or then just any interesting WW2 aviation literature.
My latest purchases are a bit biased:
(http://www.byterapers.com/~grendel/scan/mysources2.jpg)
In order to learn more about the Bf 109 I ordered bunch of books about it and about pilots flying it. And I can never resist Luftwaffe 1946 stuff from Ted Nomura, either ;-)
The low row, middle book, Enemy inthe Dark, is by Peter Spoden, he was Me 110 / Ju-88 night fighter pilot. I will interview him in May, so I got to dig into his persona a bit more.
Grendel, I have some interesting books for sale. If interested, mail me at paso.leati@reppu.net!
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Originally posted by Crumpp
Milo,
Is that one different from this book?
http://www.schifferbooks.com/newschiffer/book_template.php?isbn=0764321307
If it is then I will certainly add it to my list of must have reference.
All the best,
Crumpp
Sorry Crumpp, it should be this book, Moskito-Jagd; Fritz Gniffke, JG 302 & NJG 11
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Thanks Milo,
I'll check it out when it gets published.
All the best,
Crumpp