Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Vaulcan1 on March 22, 2005, 06:31:42 PM
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Just a quick note to say me and two other spit IX's droped 2000lb's of bombs each on a tiger and it still stodd with its engine running, :confused:
Anyone else ever done this?
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Maybe it had good valve springs?
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Or maybe the bomb missed?
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I have often wondered about the survivability of tigers from air attacks. But it doesn't really matter what the vehicle goes through:
I'm guessing that a 1000 lb bomb dropping within a 20 ft radius of a GV would turn the crew's brains into pudding. Just the shockwave, no shrapnel damage, etc.
Not sure if there's been any testing in RL on this, LOL.
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This may not be the same type of bomb used in WW2, but if I remember correctly it was only a 500lb explosion. Bombs make big holes!
BOOM (http://media.ebaumsworld.com/desertblast.wmv )
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I think thats from a GBU-15 on a Mk84 2000lb bomb.
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they were in spit 9's. so 2 250 2 500lbs egg. they 500lbs can take out a tiger, but the 250's gota hit RIGHT on.
lot easier w/ 2k. just get real close.
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Originally posted by XrightyX
I'm guessing that a 1000 lb bomb dropping within a 20 ft radius of a GV would turn the crew's brains into pudding. Just the shockwave, no shrapnel damage, etc.
Shockwave dont affect crew inside armor, afaik. It can to turn tank upside-down if bomb will blows really close.
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A GBU-15 only carries 900+ pounds of explosives. Even on 1000lbs Mk83s the amount of explosive is still under half the weight of the munition. Yet they still make extremely large holes in the ground.
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Maybe you should check out Ian Gooderson's book
"Air power at the Battlefield" London, 1998
At the battle of La Baleine, RAF pilots claimed to have destroyed 17 outof 50 tanks. ORS teams went in and to investigate the claims. They found no destroyed armor from air attack. If fact they found 500 lb craters in a orchard 50 yards from 2 panthers, neither of which had any damage.
At Falaise Pocket, The RAF claimed 124 tanks and the US claimed nearly 400 vehicles destroyed. When the ORS teams investigated they found only 33 had fallen victom to air attack.
At Shambles Area, 1411 tanks were claimed as destroyed. ORS teams inspected 82 and only 2 had damage from air attack.
At Seine, RAF pilots claim 222 tanks destroyed upon investigation only 10 reflected air attack damage.
At the Ardennes, 9th AF and RAF 2nd TAF claimed 324 tanks destroyed. ORS teams investigated and found 1 tank to be knocked out by a bomb and 4 by rockets. The report shows bomb craters within 15 yards of tanks with no additional damage.
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Operation GoodWood, Captain Freimarch Von Rosen, had 12 tiger tanks of the 503. During a 2 hour bombardment by 2100 allied bombers. Tank losses were Unteroffizer Westerhousen's tank suffers a direct hit and catches fire. Oberfeldwebel Sach's tiger gets overturned and another tiger drives into a bomb crater and cant be recovered.
I guess be thankful you can kill tigers and panzers in Aces High with bombs and rockets because it doesn't seem like they were very successful at it during WW2.
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I remember past discussions about this subkect with Pyro.
I distinctly remember Pyro commenting that people overestimate the power of 'nearby blasts' of bomb drops. IIRC, Pyro mentioned that most of the blast effect dissipates into the air vertically, and does not spread out horizontally.
I hope someone's got good searching skills, because I'm terrible at digging old stuff up.
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Chockwaves giving "pilot wounds" to GV driver would be really nice... ;)
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haha rhino, cool film.
althought that was in what looked like mud, or wet sand, so a hole would not be that big on hard land.
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I'd be curious how many of those listed above were knocked out of action until ground crews saw to them. Shermans were often fixed up, hosed out, and re-issued to new tank crews.
In fact, I recently had a patient who was a Tank Commander in the 3rd Armored Div, from what he told me 2 of his Purple Hearts were from tanks shot out from under him. Both of those tanks were returned to service later, minus a few men...
Its not that I question your sources, I'm just naturally inquisitive. :)
Originally posted by BALSUR
I guess be thankful you can kill tigers and panzers in Aces High with bombs and rockets because it doesn't seem like they were very successful at it during WW2.
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Originally posted by XrightyX
I have often wondered about the survivability of tigers from air attacks. But it doesn't really matter what the vehicle goes through:
I'm guessing that a 1000 lb bomb dropping within a 20 ft radius of a GV would turn the crew's brains into pudding. Just the shockwave, no shrapnel damage, etc.
Not sure if there's been any testing in RL on this, LOL.
Well ya sure as hell werent bombing my tank.
Tanks Im in seem to get knocked out by 100 lbers under tree cover and 50 yards away
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""Maybe you should check out Ian Gooderson's book
"Air power at the Battlefield" London, 1998""
that report has always confused me , why would they find undamaged tanks? where were the crews?
did the crews abandon the tanks during the bombing, if so the bombing did it's job and took the tanks out of action.
then there was the interview(history chann) with a tiger tank comander who opened his hatch after a bombing and said the tiger next to him was split open like a eggshell.
maybe gooderson did not like them new fangled airoplanes?
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I'm calling BS on 3 spits being able to put 2k each directly on a tiger. If you didn't pop a tiger with 1k of ord, the answer's simple....
You missed.
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hubsonfire we hit the tiger head-on! :mad: its not B.S!
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Got Film?
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no, but i have two other pilots to stand by it. Anyway i dont have to prove s##t! why would i post it if its a lie? :p
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Originally posted by Vaulcan1
no, but i have two other pilots to stand by it. Anyway i dont have to prove s##t! why would i post it if its a lie? :p
i dont think he's calling you a liar.
technically speaking, the film would show exactly where the bomb hit. :aok
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he called it B.S, so he means in a lier. all bombs hit the tiger right on em, he was just sitting there with engines running.
we were a 2k, heading to him from the rear, and droped.
no kill, thats it.
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I'm not calling you a liar, per se, I'm just saying that your bombs did not directly strike the tiger, or you would have killed him cold.
Having lost 9 tigers this month, I'm pretty sure they're not invincible. Also, film would be, as mason stated, very informative.
cheers
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:rofl ok hub' keep flying man, you got to much time on your hands :lol i dont have time for proving silly things, peace out! :lol
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BS whine proven.
Carry on gents.
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just one more whine.. i shot a tiger 8 times in his side.. i know that the armor is thick for a 76mm AP so i placed 5 of my shots at his track.. he just backed up (quite a bit) and shot me right out of my boots.. super duper armored treads too.
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I guess I agree that bombs must not have hit the tank or he was in trees. I kill them all the time, tigers are the first thing I look for when Im jaboing GVs instead of toolsheds. A pair of thousand pounders pretty much put the spank on a tiger real quick, IF you hit them.
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Originally posted by BALSUR
Maybe you should check out Ian Gooderson's book
"Air power at the Battlefield" London, 1998
At the battle of La Baleine, RAF pilots claimed to have destroyed 17 outof 50 tanks. ORS teams went in and to investigate the claims. They found no destroyed armor from air attack. If fact they found 500 lb craters in a orchard 50 yards from 2 panthers, neither of which had any damage.
At Falaise Pocket, The RAF claimed 124 tanks and the US claimed nearly 400 vehicles destroyed. When the ORS teams investigated they found only 33 had fallen victom to air attack.
At Shambles Area, 1411 tanks were claimed as destroyed. ORS teams inspected 82 and only 2 had damage from air attack.
At Seine, RAF pilots claim 222 tanks destroyed upon investigation only 10 reflected air attack damage.
At the Ardennes, 9th AF and RAF 2nd TAF claimed 324 tanks destroyed. ORS teams investigated and found 1 tank to be knocked out by a bomb and 4 by rockets. The report shows bomb craters within 15 yards of tanks with no additional damage.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Operation GoodWood, Captain Freimarch Von Rosen, had 12 tiger tanks of the 503. During a 2 hour bombardment by 2100 allied bombers. Tank losses were Unteroffizer Westerhousen's tank suffers a direct hit and catches fire. Oberfeldwebel Sach's tiger gets overturned and another tiger drives into a bomb crater and cant be recovered.
I guess be thankful you can kill tigers and panzers in Aces High with bombs and rockets because it doesn't seem like they were very successful at it during WW2.
But, the fact that they were finding tanks abandoned suggests one of the following scenarios 1) Crew was out for pizza and beer, 2) Crew died 3) Tank was trapped by crater, collapsed building, rubble whatever 4) Anything else? Don't know why Germans would leave a perfectly good tank sitting around.
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But, the fact that they were finding tanks abandoned suggests one of the following scenarios 1) Crew was out for pizza and beer, 2) Crew died 3) Tank was trapped by crater, collapsed building, rubble whatever 4) Anything else? Don't know why Germans would leave a perfectly good tank sitting around.
Because it wasn't a perfectly good tank.
Those tanks were already engaged with the Allied ground forces when the close-support air strike commenced, and those pilots claimed huge amount of false kills. Tanks were destroyed by either other tanks, or specialized AT guns, not by aircraft.
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Originally posted by Kweassa
Because it wasn't a perfectly good tank.
Those tanks were already engaged with the Allied ground forces when the close-support air strike commenced, and those pilots claimed huge amount of false kills. Tanks were destroyed by either other tanks, or specialized AT guns, not by aircraft.
Other times they abandoned tanks for other reasons.
Often when a German tank malfuntioned the germans would abandon it as unlike the american tanks thy were so complex they werent easily repaired so they just left them
Also such as in the Falaise gap many germans would abandoned their tanks and other equipment because it was faster and easierto retreat without them. Plus they were trying to avoid being obvious targets.
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The Tiger commander Von Rosen also stated that it was near impossible to keep inexperienced, poorly trained new tank crews in their tanks. The experienced crews would just button up and wait it out.
I also read that about a tiger commander coming out of his tiger and the one next to him was split open. The crew had bailed and ran leaving the hatches open.
I have also read that even though they were thinner skinned on top there wasnt much shooting down through them. Rockets fired over 200 yards away bounced or exploded and HE bombs would just go boom.
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Occasionally though sometimes things like this would happen
From the Falaise Gap
(http://www.150th.com/work/5.jpg)
(http://www.150th.com/work/13.jpg)
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BBQ?
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Originally posted by Drunky
BBQ?
Yup