Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: weaselsan on April 08, 2005, 07:36:21 PM
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Today, coal appears more and more to be a formidable capital for the world of tomorrow. First of all, because of its huge resources, estimated to be over 1000 billion tonnes, it represents over 80% of fossil energy resources, against less than 20% for petrol and natural gas. Close to 500 billion tonnes are exploitable in current technical and economic conditions.
And secondly, and not least of all, this capital can be happily divided across almost 80 countries. Leading the countries particularly rich in coal are the USA, China and Russia. Behind their enormous reserves other countries appear, such as Australia, Canada and India as well as some Latin American countries such as Colombia. The geographical split combined with this abundance guarantees a sureness of supply and encourages stability or even a lowering of prices.
(http://www.palmpaints.com/coal%20map.gif)
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Coal is evil!
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Coal is evil!
It sure is...but it burns beautifully:rofl
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Our power plant in Colorado Springs is a coal plant.
We have a huge plume of white vapor coming out of the evaporators and heat exchangers all the time...
but thats the only plume we see. State of the art scrubbers, and a hard core attempt to stay clean makes it very viable for us.
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No, no, no... coal IS evil.
We must not use it, ever.
Nor should we use nuclear power. That is a disaster beyond all proportion.
Why just look at what happened to France. In 2002, France consumed 414.92 BILLION kilowatt hours produced by nuclear power. So, get that out of your heads.
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Where did they put their waste? You might not want to use France as an example. But, I agree nuclear power is a great resource.
Coal's problem is it's high sulfur content. It can wreak havoc on the environment, long term if emissions are not controlled.
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too bad you cant turn coal into Oil...
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No, but you can grind it up and mix it with just about anything including water and it will burn.
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Originally posted by mars01
too bad you cant turn coal into Oil...
Yes you can, much of the German military's fuel in WW2 was syntetically derived from coal. I told you coal was evil...
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Well if we decide to invade West Virginia then I'm running to Canada!
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Originally posted by rpm
Where did they put their waste? You might not want to use France as an example.
I think they just dumped it in the streets of their major cities.
They're all dead now because they use nuke power. Surely you must have heard?
That's why we can't try it... it's killed all the French.
In June 1999, Japan had 52 nuclear reactors in operation with a total electric power generation capacity of 45.08 million ~ kilowatts. That's what killed all of them; it was in the news.
Lithuania produced 80% of their electricity using nuclear power... that's what killed all of them too.
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Ukraine gets 51% of it's electricity out of nuclear plants too Toad.
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It killed all the French, but we acted just in time - coal was banned!
Well, not really. In the 1950s, air pollution was a major concern - the old pea souper fogs/smogs in London...
So new regulations came into force, and for solid fuel we had to burn a coal based product called Rexco, which was a smokeless fuel.
I'm glad those days are behind us. Apart from the hassle of lighting the fire each morning, there was the disposal of ashes, having a chimney sweep come to clean the chimneys. There would be lots of dust. :(
But then we got natural gas and central heating. :cool: An automatic timer controls everything - heat, hot water - no work, no dust! I love lying in bed on a winter's morning, and at 6am hearing the circulation pump start up, followed shortly thereafter by the "whump" as the gas boiler fires up.
Coal? bah... miners' strike, 3-day week, power cuts, Arthur Scargill.... there - I've done my best to rope Dowding into this thread. :D
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Arthur Scargill and his lot of commie coal miners are just another reason why coal is evil....
Go Maggie!
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Scargill fought Maggie! Scargill lost. :)
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And now we have a huge reserve of coal that has suddenly become a very valuable commodity and no bloody mines left! Yeah way to go Maggie!:rolleyes:
Thanks for the destruction of community, ruin of peoples lives and now we can't re open many of the pits because they have shopping centres dry ski slopes and other realy great stuff built on top of them.
A resource we could make mega money from is now sitting under the ground totaly useless to us.
nevermind we can all go work in call centres (until they move to India) and shopping malls.
I despair. whatever happened to politicians taking a longterm strategic view.
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Originally posted by Skydancer
And now we have a huge reserve of coal that has suddenly become a very valuable commodity and no bloody mines left! Yeah way to go Maggie!:rolleyes:
Thanks for the destruction of community, ruin of peoples lives and now we can't re open many of the pits because they have shopping centres dry ski slopes and other realy great stuff built on top of them.
A resource we could make mega money from is now sitting under the ground totaly useless to us.
Oh sure. Just think, last winter we could have sat in cold houses, reading by candle light, unable to watch the news on TV of miners pushing for a new wage deal of £2000/wk. We could have read the newspapers (assuming any were published) and read about the 30% inflation caused by wage settlements led by the miners. These days, we're even more dependent on electricity than ever before. So hey - let's trust our entire livelihoods to a powerful group of trade union militants. It worked sooooo well in the 1970s.
I remember the day when Heseltine had to tell the NCB that there was no market for their overpriced coal - it was simply cheaper to import from France. But oh! Scargill wanted the coal industry to be run as a charity organisation. Surely no-one could object to paying 83% income tax when the money was going to worthy causes such as multi-billion pound bail outs of loss making nationalised industries with quaint 19th century working practices, with no commitment to productivity?
Ah the 1970s - such nostalgia. Crap cars produced by disgruntled workers, strikes, train cancellations, power cuts, Christmas shopping by candle light, empty supermarket shelves, no fuel at the pumps, untreated roads in winter, the dead left unburied. Yeah! Take me back! The 70s were way cool. :cool:
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Instead we'll trust our energy to foreign suppliers put ourselves at the whim of their price fixing, risk poisoning our small island for practical eternity with radioactive waste?
Oh yeah great policy!
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Beetle, surely zulu here ment the long term strategic directives moscow had to have been sending scargill and his bunch during that period about how to run the NUM and do the most possible damage to the UK economy. Really, what other explainanition is there?
:rofl
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Originally posted by Skydancer
Instead we'll trust our energy to foreign suppliers put ourselves at the whim of their price fixing, risk poisoning our small island for practical eternity with radioactive waste?
Oh yeah great policy!
You do undersant wht why 20% inflation, monopolistic nationalized and subsidized industries, momopolistic trade unions and the sort of strikes, labor practicves, wage demands etc the miners demanded are bad? No?
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Oh boy.
Wouldn't it be more sensible to bail out and keep the industry in the short term rather than to destroy any self sufficiency we have and put ourselves at the mercy of energy supply from other nations? The destruction of the miners had nothing to do with some idiotic obsession with the evil communists! It succedded in putting thousands out of work ruining our communities, breeding crime drugs and despair, and to cap it all the redundancies that resulted ate up billions of our oil revenue in unemployment benefit payments. So we destroyed our chance to utilise our coal reserves and wasted our oil revenue in one go. Realy fugging clever that one!
Beetle wouldn't know as he lives in the "sod you jack I'm OK" tory southeast! ;)
:rolleyes:
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Bail out the UK coal industry? As in throw more governent money down down the mineshafts?
Those communities deserved to be destroyed just as any community built on criminal extortion deserves to be destroyed. THey used their central position in the UK power generation system to exhtort billons from the governent and bloat their employment numbers needlessly by refusing to adapt new tecnologoes, working practices, higher efficency or embrace cost lowering. They just asked for more and more and when they didnt get it they went onm strike, disrupted the economy and brought down governents just so they get more.
Well Maggie put an end to that and broght them and their whole criminal enterprise down. She saved yoir country by doing it.
Yet you still come here 20 years hence and ask for a bail out, you ask for more...
Maybe this is offensive to you becausde your family was involved, but step outside of that and just see the macro picture of what those guys were doing to the economy.
I know you prolly cant do that, but I'm just telling its not personal its econimics.
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Originally posted by Skydancer
Instead we'll trust our energy to foreign suppliers put ourselves at the whim of their price fixing, risk poisoning our small island for practical eternity with radioactive waste?
Oh yeah great policy!
You're overlooking a few things. We're not committed to a single energy source. If the fuel from one source is too expensive, we can shop elsewhere. Market economy. What we won't have is representatives from those energy supply sources coming over here to picket our power stations if we don't buy from them. In the 70s, we were held over a barrel - pay up or else we'll put your lights out. Those days are long gone. We have Maggie to thank for that, Cod bless her.
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Originally posted by beet1e
Christmas shopping by candle light,
Actually sounds kind of nice...as long as I had a choice to do it or not. ;)
Zulu: Hater of Freedom.
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Originally posted by Skydancer
Wouldn't it be more sensible to bail out and keep the industry in the short term rather than to destroy any self sufficiency we have and put ourselves at the mercy of energy supply from other nations?
No. The militant miners had their chances and blew them all. Productivity was non-negotiable issue. Those bail outs were not cheap, and were the reason for punitive taxation, which resulted in loss of investment from overseas. You can't run an industry like a charity organisation, no matter what Scargill says. Originally posted by Skydancer
Beetle wouldn't know as he lives in the "sod you jack I'm OK" tory southeast!
LOL the irony! Whose interests do you think the miners had at heart in their strikes of 1972, 1973, 1974, 1984, 1985? Ah don't tell me - they were doing it for the good of the people and the wellbeing of Britain. :lol
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Solidarity wasn't on Thatchers agenda only personal greed, nicely demonstrated by the riot police waving their overtime money at the miners.
Those communities deserved to be destroyed just as any community built on criminal extortion deserves to be destroyed.
Since when has organised labour been criminal? Your not related to Goebbels by any chance?
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Originally posted by Chortle
Since when has organised labour been criminal?
Since 1971, and the passage of the Industrial Relations Act, which outlawed secondary picketing, eg. miners picketing power stations and blockading rail routes (with "NUM official picket" signs which train drivers were reluctant to cross).
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Originally posted by beet1e
No. The militant miners had their chances and blew them all. Productivity was non-negotiable issue. Those bail outs were not cheap, and were the reason for punitive taxation, which resulted in loss of investment from overseas. You can't run an industry like a charity organisation, no matter what Scargill says. LOL the irony! Whose interests do you think the miners had at heart in their strikes of 1972, 1973, 1974, 1984, 1985? Ah don't tell me - they were doing it for the good of the people and the wellbeing of Britain. :lol
You're missing one small point; Beetle.
Maggy sold us a reduction of the coal industry; not an anihilation. Scargill's rallying cry was "she's lying! She means a total shut down!"
Now; I'll give you that the Tories swept to power on the back of overwhelming dissatisfaction with Labour's mismanagement of the Unions; and I'll grant you that Maggie was indeed given a popular mandate to diminish the role of the TUC in running the country.
However; instead of trimming the unions she demolished them.
Instead of reasserting a balance of power between the politicians and the prolitariat; she went so far the other way that Maggie herself bears responsibility for the 12 years hard labour you claim to suffer from.
Of all the things I expected from Thatcher; proving Scargill right wasn't one of them.
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Seeker - good post, but I actually blame John Major for 12 years Hard Labour.
As for Maggie demolishing the unions instead of just taming them, I guess she didn't know her own strength!
As for her "destroying" the mining industry, my recollection is rather different. MT's govt. created the circumstances under which the country could best survive a miners' strike - that much I concede. They made sure that the power stations were well stocked with coal so that there wouldn't be a rerun of power cuts as there had been in THREE winters (1970/71, 1971/72 & 1973/74). The last of these resulted in the three day week and the toppling of the Heath govt., so I don't blame Maggie at all for stocking up the power stations. Thus, the conditions were set for the mining industry to commit suicide, which it did in the 1984/85 strike. Because the pits were unattended, many deteriorated and were lost, and had to be closed permanently. Was the govt. to blame for this? The UK miners had priced their product out of the market, which is why it was cheaper to import coal from France. That's a situation the NUM miners created, not the govt.
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I'll agree that John Major and his cabinet of sleaze were the direct causation of Labours lanslide; but how come Major and his corrupt cronies were all the tories had to offer?
Because Thatchers almost Stalin like meglomania ensured that there was no viable competition in the Tory rank and file; and by inference no successors.
Maggies first incumbancy was exactly what the country needed to exorcise the idiocy of Foot, Callahan and Benn et al. I fully support the Tory line of no dole for buisinesses; and look to Benn's fiasco of Triumph Meridian to prove the point.
However; the subsequent terms she strayed further and further towards totalitarianism.
"The Lady's not for turning" became "the Lady's not for listening"; which is not an optimal charecteristic for a democratic leader.
She didn't just destroy the TUC as a force in politics; she destroyed the Conservative party too.
There's a few things I covet about the USA. A written constitution is one of them; a fixed term of service for the national leader is another.
It forces preparation for succesion.
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nuclear waste:
Japan has found a way to recycle spent nuclear fuel into new fuel rods.
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Originally posted by Bodhi
Our power plant in Colorado Springs is a coal plant.
We have a huge plume of white vapor coming out of the evaporators and heat exchangers all the time...
but thats the only plume we see. State of the art scrubbers, and a hard core attempt to stay clean makes it very viable for us.
You can "see" the absence of CO²,CO,SO² ?
Are you are a relative of Clark Kent ?
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Originally posted by Siaf__csf
Ukraine gets 51% of it's electricity out of nuclear plants too Toad.
Oh, man. Didn't know that. The sorrow continues to worsen. So they're all dead now too... when will it end?
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Well it kinda worries me that Chernobyl 1 is still running. :(
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Seeker -
Well, I agree with you, and perhaps a two term limit or 8 years (whichever came last) would be no bad thing.
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Japan gets 40% from nuclear power. There's nobody left, everyone died last year. Except those who have stayed indoors playing Aces High. Let me open the curtains and take a look... Arrrrgghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh h.......zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzz
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OMG! There goes ROLEX!!!!!!
We're doooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ooomed.
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Originally posted by Siaf__csf
Well it kinda worries me that Chernobyl 1 is still running. :(
i agree that russian nuke power plants are crap , but maybe they won't try to run any "take it to the red zone" tests with that one.
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No... not radiation.
"Zulus! Thousands of them... on little motorbikes!"
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He goes by Skydancer now. It only seems like there's thousands of him.
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Originally posted by straffo
You can "see" the absence of CO²,CO,SO² ?
Are you are a relative of Clark Kent ?
Arretes d'etre con!
I know you're french and it is second nature to you, but I said it meaning ONLY what we could see.
C'est pas le temps pour toi de capituler??
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Burying nookyular waste a mile or two underground will NEVAR work!!!!
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Originally posted by FUNKED1
Burying nookyular waste a mile or two underground will NEVAR work!!!!
Yes but the nasty froggies keep dumping it in our South Pacific... don't you know how bad that is? Didn't you watch Godzilla?
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but maybe they won't try to run any "take it to the red zone" tests with that one.
History has proved that it takes tests like that to qualify as a russian. Unfortunately.
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Originally posted by Bodhi
Arretes d'etre con!
I know you're french and it is second nature to you, but I said it meaning ONLY what we could see.
C'est pas le temps pour toi de capituler??
Quel est l'intérêt de cette réaction balourde et lourdaude ?
Après vous allez vous plaindre d'être jugé par rapport à des clichés
Encore faudrait-il ne pas être une preuve vivante de l’existence de ces clichés …
Une dernière chose , quand on choisi de s'exprimer dans un langue étrangère il est mieux de savoir un minimum la portée des mots que l'on utilise.
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Originally posted by straffo
Une dernière chose , quand on choisi de s'exprimer dans un langue étrangère il est mieux de savoir un minimum la portée des mots que l'on utilise.
:lol
:aok
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Originally posted by straffo
Une dernière chose , quand on choisi de s'exprimer dans un langue étrangère il est mieux de savoir un minimum la portée des mots que l'on utilise.
Well if you do not like my French, then try this, you can stuff those cliches up your arse.
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Non c'est pas ton français que j'aime pas c'est toi que je n'aime pas raclure.
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Originally posted by straffo
Non c'est pas ton français que j'aime pas c'est toi que je n'aime pas raclure.
Hou là, je suis si la blessure, Straffo pas comme moi. Que je fera-t-il jamais fait. Deviner je devrai me capituler à quelqu'un.
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In London, on my way to Paris, I once purchased a handy traveler's phase book.
To ask for directions to the hotel you say, "J'aime me baigner en anguilles. Pourriez-vous me diriger vers le commissariat de police? Je voudrais acheter une tenir compte de sexe avec des animaux."
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
In London, on my way to Paris, I once purchased a handy traveler's phase book.
To ask for directions to the hotel you say, "J'aime me baigner en anguilles. Pourriez-vous me diriger vers le commissariat de police? Je voudrais acheter une tenir compte de sexe avec des animaux."
Actually I think it is more like this Holden:
Vous pouvoir me dirige s'il vous plaît à la base militaire la plus proche. Je serai obligé à assister ici une conférence sur les techniques de capituler correctes.
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Anyone seen any info on the membraneless fuel cell? Oh wait that is not what this thread is about is it? lol
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