Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: oboe on May 10, 2005, 09:04:56 AM
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Bankrupt United Air Lines payed CEO Glenn Tilton over $1.1 million last year, including a bonus of $366,000.
Of course this generosity comes at at a cost - it had to abandon its already severely underfunded employee pension program to US taxpayers. The pension is underfunded by almost 10 billion dollars; the move to PBGC means United pensioners will lose 25% of their total pension.
United defends pension ending deal (http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/050509/united_airlines.html?.v=3)
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You are gonna wind up Toad something fierce with this post.;)
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Thats nothing, HP gave Carly Fiorina a nice 20 million dollar going away gift.
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Nah, I was in the biz 23 years. This is old news; it's always been that way.
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Hmmmm....maybe a better "bait" would have been something like:
"Airline Unions are the sole reason for the financial predicament of the US airline companies"
;) :p
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I don't think its a just a union or airline issue. This kind of occurrence is common throughout the US business world - exorbitant pay for do-nothing (or worse!) CEOs and reduced pay and benefits for common workers.
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Forbes had a recent issue showing the best and worst CEOs. Some of those guys make a lot less than I thought they did...and brought in some amazing results.
Good and Bad in every batch
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I don't think its a just a union or airline issue. This kind of occurrence is common throughout the US business world - exorbitant pay for do-nothing (or worse!) CEOs and reduced pay and benefits for common workers.
IMO, they and the rest of the senior management and those picked to be directors, are bribed to make short term decisions that look impressive to short-sighted shareholders but ultimately cause long-term harm. Outsource service jobs, outsource manufacturing, outsource intellectual capital to make the spreadsheet for this quarter look better by a decimal point or two in the right places. Hope the countries we partner with today will always play that support role and not take advantage of our "support" to get up to speed go head to head with us in the future...
What do they care? They can ruin great companies, cost jobs, destroy the future of employees and damage the lesser shareholder, and still retire to gated communities with no fears for their family dynasties.
BTW, I get to hear the "Great Jack Welch" talk this friday -- can hardly wait.
Charon
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Originally posted by oboe
Bankrupt United Air Lines payed CEO Glenn Tilton over $1.1 million last year, including a bonus of $366,000.
Of course this generosity comes at at a cost - it had to abandon its already severely underfunded employee pension program to US taxpayers. The pension is underfunded by almost 10 billion dollars; the move to PBGC means United pensioners will lose 25% of their total pension.
United defends pension ending deal (http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/050509/united_airlines.html?.v=3)
I'm not sure how $1.1M salary "comes at a cost" so much that the pension is underfunded by $10B. Or did he sign a 10,000 year contract?
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My belief is they should've been funding the pension plan rather than paying top management millions per year in salary and bonuses.
Charon hit it right on.
And I think Jack Welch is a huge hypocrite. He says he looks for integrity in people. Ask him about his new wife, who is 20 or 30 years younger than he. Wonder where his integrity regarding his marriage vows to his first wife were?
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CEOing is great work if you can get it.
This being the case, one can assume that the only most intelligent & abitious will get it, thus they are worthy of good pay.
If I could choose my job working for UAL, I'd take the pay cut & be a captain
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You may be right, bunch.
But consider that your million-dollar baby Tilton is shoving more than 5 billion of pension OBLIGATIONS off on the PBGC - which is already in debt by more than 23 billion. So when the PBGC fails it'll be a taxpayer problem. It is a huge disaster, and the guy at the helm is making more than a million a year and all he's doing is turing over the company's problem to someone else to worry about.
Intelligent and ambitious -- or shrewd and greedy?
Just curious, I wonder of the judge that approved this travesty is a Bush appointee?
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Read today that Delta is facing a liquidity crises and may end of having to skip bankruptcy and go straight to liquidation.
Sad to see a once top airline dissolve. Hope for the employees sake they can find a way through it all.
dago
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I am not absolving upper management from any blame, but the bottom line is that unless you know you can do their job better than they can, you can not complain about what they make. If you can do it better, then why aren't you?
Is it a worldwide conspiracy to to keep you (royal you, since I hear this about evey industry, every management type) down, or is it just that you, well, CAN'T do a better job?
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There is no doubt in my mind I could do a better job. I don't say that as a braggart, I just think there are many, many people that could do a better job than the current crop of superstar, superexpensive CEOs. I could save United more than 90% on CEO compensation alone starting tomorrow. And if I fell flat on my face, well at least you could say 'you get what you pay for' and be right.
Far too many CEOs are just about ego and greed, they are with companies for a short time and move on, getting paid extravagantly whether they succeed or fail.
I imagine Delta's pensions will likewise end up being the responsibility of the PBGC.
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Well, Oboe, the obvious question is why aren't you?
Do you blame that failure on your part upon someone else, or do you take the cop-out that you just don't "want to". Either way, you should do it or STFU about it.
edit-and just to be clear, I think most CEO's are about as smart as the guys emptying the trashcans, but they are willing to take a decsion, which is what seperates the men from the boys. Why shouldn't they be paid for that?
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You're right Liz. I should do it. I officially announce my willingness to replace Tilton and serve as United's CEO for a salary of $100,000/yr, with no options, perks, or benefits. They can contact me through this website. I suspect its more complicated than simply making a decision to become a CEO though. How do you think one becomes a CEO? Do you have to be part of an old boys network, have family connections, or be a fast, smooth talker?
I think most CEOs are smarter than you give them credit for, but they seem to be ruled by their outsize egos and greed, and act only for the short term. Any intelligent person who is willing to try to balance competing issues within a company, who is not ruled by selfish desires would make a better CEO than Tilton, for example. And I bet that would include alot of garbage men.
But isn't your 'put your money where your mouth is' challenge unfair, really? If we all had to live by that, would there be any whistle blowers? It sounds like you are suggesting that no one should voice their opinion, not unless they could do a better job, but only if they already ARE doing a better job.
Would you have told Christ to STFU about the money changers in the temple unless he was willing to become one?