Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: IK3 on May 13, 2005, 08:42:53 PM
-
If TOD is released...
Is it gonna replace MA as most played arena?
or
Is it gonna end up barren like CT?
Discuss
-
If TOD has apparent awards that definitely outweigh the MA, then it'll be successfull.
-
Originally posted by IK3
If TOD is released...
Is it gonna replace MA as most played arena?
or
Is it gonna end up barren like CT?
Discuss
For the very short time -- may be. People will try it out, so it will be crowded for a week or so.
In a long run -- no, it won't. Structured environment is boring for those people, who look for instant action.
Still TOD do not need so many people. If there will have 40-80 people playing there at a regular base, it will be a great experience.
-
Is it gonna replace MA as most played arena?
Never in a million years.
Not for me. Not ever.
-
i sure hope it does, if its half as historical as it sounds ill fire up my account again.
-
I'll try out TOD but will remain a MA player for the most part. I will have to see what it is all about. Obviously it is going to require alot of research to see what it is all about.
For the most part, the better sticks will reign in TOD. The guys like me who are mediocre will struggle. Struggling will lead to quitting TOD or keep struggling. Will have to see when it is released. It may be the best thing since sliced bread or it may be a dormant arena.
-
I hope it is a great success with all the effort that HTC is putting into it.
-
Overall, peeking into what Pyro hinted us so far, it seems it would require certain discipline and devotion to team play, so I think indeed in some parts, the general quality of the pilots would be better than the MA.
Also, structured environment requires a certain 'role-playing' mentality. So it definately won't be as popular as the MA - at least, in terms of player numbers.
However, I don't think it would mean the player quality is different, or one arena would be more fun than the other. If ToD is everything we expect it to be, I think there will be a lot of people who fly in both arenas at a given time. Run 2~3 intense missions in the ToD, and then come to the MA for non-stop action fun.. and etc.
Like Fariz said,
If there's constantly 50~80 people online in the ToD, that's enough to offer a very convincing and fun fight. The rest of the gaps can be filled by AIs and some imagination :)
Imagine a 12~20 man USAAF squadron, flying with 20~30 bombers in escort duties, meeting 10~15 Luftwaffe fighters..
The fights won't be "to the death" as in the MA. A lot of people will fly to survive.. but they also have duties and missions to fulfill, so they can't just run away at first sight of bad odds. The leaders of each of the 4~5 man rottes or wings would be hard pressed to keep track of where their wingmen are, give orders... and all in all, large numbers of people will collide in a single area in a much more orderly fashion than the MA furball.
The fight won't be non-stop as in the MA, but even 20~30 minutes of such missions can provide deep immersion and great satisfaction. About 30~40 people with AI support can bring that about.
-
I'm hoping what Kweassa just described is true.
Just flying a snapshot the other night was far more satisfying then the MA hamster wheel. Something about a flight of the same birds out on a mission that sucks me right in, whether it be Spits like on the first run or the 38Gs we had for our second run. Out over the Channel, waiting for the high 109s and 190s and then the brawl when they finally arrived.
Great fun and worth the flying time to let the immersion build.
Dan/CorkyJr
-
I agree with Fariz. The hoopla will last about a week. Then it will be back to the MA. The lack of teamwork I saw, and the "I fly for me, not for you" attitude that was so prevalent in my gameplay days provides an insight into how it will be.
Get ready to see bucketloads of posts on here from TnB MA diehards along the lines of "our playing style is better than yours" and how the "real men" are in the MA, while TOD is for the pink underwear crowd.
My question is - why would HTC go to such lengths to build TOD, if only around 50 guys are going to use it?
Grave doubts (http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=94174)
-
This is what I'm worried about, some of the 'arm-chair generals' in the MA currently are the biggest, most whine filled, pathetic, vulgar, disrespectful people we have in the game right now.
If ToD was designed to force me to listen to them, I would be gone in less than a breath.
Originally posted by Kweassa
The leaders... give orders.
-
Some of you just can't see the world outside of your small goldfish bowl! ;)
Even with what little has been told to us about TOD by HTC I'm still perplexed as to why some still put this into the context that this being aimed at the MA player type or that it will be like the CT where hardly anyone is to be found.
I'll be the first to say that HTC has has fallen WAY behind on keeping people informed as to what TOD is. That's evident from the wild bellybutton guesses and assumptions that always sprout in these topics about TOD over the past TWO years.
Still... Enough has been said about it for people to have a firm idea of what it is and who it would appeal to.
Curious as to see how many people this TOD would appeal to? Go to hyperlobby and check out the numbers playing IL2.
There are more playing that game than AH on it's best night. Look at how many love the Dynamix ACES series, EAW, Janes WWII Fighters etc. Add in those who pay to play WWIIO for it's "historical" flavour and you may begin to see that the audience for TOD is much larger than that for the MA by far.
-
westy - interesting post! :aok I hope you're right.
I have tried IL2 - about 3 years ago I think. The flight model and weather effects were interesting - to say the least! What is this "hyperlobby" business? When I was there, it was just a beta. As for numbers, I thought any IL2 arena had a 32 player limit. (?)
-
Hey Beetle. I hope it's a success too.
As for hyperlobby? there's 395 on right now in different hosts playing IL2: Pacific Fighters and/or Forgotten Battles. A lot of whom used to play AH.
http://hyperfighter.sk/
And IL2 now has the ability for 128 player hosts. Even if it was just 32 or 64 it's still not MA farcical/fantasy gameplay and that is what is so appealing about it.
As for FM and other features? A lot of people seem to prefer the immersion, eyecandy and quasi-historical settings over FM and gunnery fidelity. Still. It's at least in the ballpark and it's not as bad as the arcade like FA/AW FM and gunnery models.
-
Originally posted by IK3
If TOD is released...
Is it gonna replace MA as most played arena?
or
Is it gonna end up barren like CT?
Discuss
It doesn't have to be one or the other.
HTC is hoping to add to the custumer base not divide the current one.
Of course that won't deter the BBS reactionaries.
-
Originally posted by beet1e
My question is - why would HTC go to such lengths to build TOD, if only around 50 guys are going to use it?
I think I can answer that. Emphasis on think. :)
If I understand it correctly I do not beleive the majority diehard MA player will find TOD to their liking. I also don`t beleive that TOD is being designed for this.
By what I have read, TOD is being designed to cater to and interest the box gamer. I believe it will build a whole new player base. Ones that have never had a chance or a place to play online in a way that interests them will now have that place and opportunity.
Sort of a pioneering effort if you will.
I think you are basing your numbers on the current player base and not considering other options and goals.
-
Jacka1 - what you say tallies with westy's observations about IL2. I hope you're both right.
-
Originally posted by Jackal1
I think I can answer that. Emphasis on think. :)
If I understand it correctly I do not beleive the majority diehard MA player will find TOD to their liking. I also don`t beleive that TOD is being designed for this.
By what I have read, TOD is being designed to cater to and interest the box gamer. I believe it will build a whole new player base. Ones that have never had a chance or a place to play online in a way that interests them will now have that place and opportunity.
Sort of a pioneering effort if you will.
I think you are basing your numbers on the current player base and not considering other options and goals.
This is exactly as I see it as well. I’ve spoken with many people that I’ve met in RL about flight sims, I always try to sell Aces High for what it is. When I bump into these folks later, almost all of them who have gotten into flight sims ended up buying a boxed sim. If you look at how many boxed prop sims are sold everywhere and compare that to the AH player base something is amiss. There is something about the format of online air combat that turns most air war enthusiast off. I don’t know if it sounds too intimidating, competitive, complex, hard-core, nerdy, or whatever. The vast majority of potential prop flight sim enthusiasts would just rather buy a box game and go about playing it as they have played every other boxed game that they have played.
AH TOD is not for us; it is for them.
The real question is how well will it work. I can’t imagine that it will appeal to a big chunk of the boxed sim buyers, but if it intrigues a small percentage it will be much bigger than the AH MA. Hopefully TOD won’t come with the same perception as AH-MA; hopefully it will fill a niche. Hopefully it will draw big numbers and revenue and HTC will be able to hire more folks and I will finally get my POS P-39 and Buffalo.
eskimo
-
I don't know how well TOD will do nor what it will look like. But Here's my hope.
First and most, like Westy said, it should offer something new in online air combat sims.
Instead of the anarchy of the MA where everyone is on their own to do what they will, TOD will offer the structured experience and immersion of a scenario without the commitment. Probably the most difficult part of a scenario is getting players to try it. But once they do, and they learn the ropes, many lose their desire for MA play. I know of many former AW and WB players who would fly for scenarios only.
Role playing games are very popular. They offer something no other game provides. Players have a focused and personal objective to build their character that is nearly nonexistant in the MA now, except for the phony rank system. I say phony because it's based only upon kills with no regard to player contributions to an objective. After all. of what value are kills if the player can return in a few minutes. In TOD kills, or simply chasing away an opponent, can determine the success of a mission. The average player has a greater opportunity to be rewarded for his contributions, while many "aces" are from the "old school" and prefer scenario play.
How many players has HTC attracted with their advertising campaigns, and how many of these stayed? We've seen the MA fill up at times with surges of new players, but soon dwindle to the same numbers as before. Obviously AH didn't provide what many of these new players were looking for. TOD can provide another dimension of game play to satisfy more players for a longer time.
But then, if players some times prefer a quick flight to the nearest furball, the MA will still be there.
-
beetle..go stab yourself..
Im a MA furballer..I hate flying more then 5 miels for a fight..
But when we have over 200 on Squad ops..Im sure TOD will work..
I am truly looking forward to seeing large formations
the rest of you should die
-
ToD is aimed towards two groups....
*WW2OL Players
*Il-2 Players
Not MA players
Its a way to expand buisiness not relocate customers.
Tex
-
I will definately be rellocating to TOD if its a good as we hope....If you have zero interest in TOD fine...stay in the MA...But please dont completely destroy it over the bbs and to HTC because there is a large # of people who have been anticipating for years....If you dont like it, you dont have to play it, so please dont ruin it for us...
on another note...I think #'s will be very high...well...#'s will be high at hot spot times....9am-3pm Eastern averages 100-200 MA players, so im sure we will only see half of that in the TOD...but i still think we will get great turn outs 7+ on eastern PM...
Another thing to think about...We are averaging 100+ in the SEA per event...What percentage of players do you actually think have known about the event and actually signed up? i have personally walked on everytime, and I think if more people knew, or if it was at a more "prime time" SEA's would fill to capacity...
i dunno
Viva la TOD
-
This is interesting.
The ToD isn't even out yet, and we alreay seem to be experiencing antagonism between the MA enthusiasts and ToD enthusiasts.
That certainly tells a lot.
-
It's certainly hinting me to get used to a mass-locking of threads as soon as possible!
Board up the windows!! Put on the gas masks!! PROTECT THE WIFE AND KIDS!!
LONG LIVE THE ACES HIGH LEGACY!
I LOVE YOU MOM!!!!
:eek:
-
MA will be dweeb arena when TOD getts up and runnin...
In fact...make a furball map..a big fighter town map with 3 bases and let the rest of us fly TOD.
-
So long since we heard any "official" news about TOD, I'd almost completely forgotten about it.
...-Gixer
-
If yah like box sims....you just might love TOD.
-
i have always considered the MA as a training arena for scenarios, a place where you can try out different planes and tactics.
-
<---- still has no idea what TOD is. oh and i know what it stands for but what will TOD be?
-
Originally posted by Kweassa
Overall, peeking into what Pyro hinted us so far, it seems it would require certain discipline and devotion to team play, so I think indeed in some parts, the general quality of the pilots would be better than the MA.
Such a stupid statement it is laughable. The more boring / timid "pilots" maybe but "better quality of pilots". :lol
-
Originally posted by TrueKill
<---- still has no idea what TOD is. oh and i know what it stands for but what will TOD be?
In short, it will be more of a roll player game where players are assigned to missions and rated based upon their performance. The player character will be promoted or demoted based upon this performance. Missions will be designed by HTC or ranking players based upon a general strategic goal. Teams will be historic with accurate vehicles and plane types. Performance will have less emphasis on kills and more on mission success, so if you finish the mission as ordered, you will be rewarded. Dig around in this web site to see if you can find more information from HTC on Tour Of Duty, like press releases.
-
Originally posted by Grizzly
In short, it will be more of a roll player game where players are assigned to missions and rated based upon their performance. The player character will be promoted or demoted based upon this performance. Missions will be designed by HTC or ranking players based upon a general strategic goal. Teams will be historic with accurate vehicles and plane types. Performance will have less emphasis on kills and more on mission success, so if you finish the mission as ordered, you will be rewarded.
Yes. The combat (whether air sea or land) will have some purpose - other than being a contest to see who best understands the AH flight model code, and who has the most finely tuned stick settings.
;)
-
Is TOD going to replace the "when in doubt, grab an LA-7" mentality?
W~
-
Originally posted by Wind
Is TOD going to replace the "when in doubt, grab an LA-7" mentality?
W~
Generally, you will fly what the mission requires. At least that is my understanding.
-
Originally posted by NoBaddy
Generally, you will fly what the mission requires. At least that is my understanding.
Sure hope so! Halle-freaking-ulah!
W~
-
Originally posted by beet1e
Yes. The combat (whether air sea or land) will have some purpose - other than being a contest to see who best understands the AH flight model code, and who has the most finely tuned stick settings.
_____________________________ __________________
I coulda sworn the purpose was to get up and have fun. Hopefully that's why everyone is flying? :D
________________
Ren
The Damned
-
Originally posted by eskimo2
There is something about the format of online air combat that turns most air war enthusiast off. I don’t know if it sounds too intimidating, competitive, complex, hard-core, nerdy, or whatever. The vast majority of potential prop flight sim enthusiasts would just rather buy a box game and go about playing it as they have played every other boxed game that they have played.
AH TOD is not for us; it is for them.
from all the people I have plugged AH to, they mostly say it is "too intimidating, competitive, complex, hard"
and TOD is for them, it is being geared up and aimed toward the new customer / player base, not the current. Some will leave the MA and stay in TOD some will go try it out and return and others will quit all together, and so we have it, life rolls on, the world keeps turning.....another day another dollar
TC
-
Such a stupid statement it is laughable. The more boring / timid "pilots" maybe but "better quality of pilots".
That's how you'd measure pilot skill in the MA - by how many he kills without being killed.
But alas, the ToD is expected to be a bit closer to organized environment - and if 'timidity' or 'boringness' is gonna get fullfil the mission without risking unnecessary lives of wingmen under my command, I'd gladly do it.
Surely, people can prefer the 'not timid' and 'not boring' way of fighting in the ToD too, but seeing how many people in the MA usually never return to land their planes, you'd probably never become leader material.
You see, in the MA, being average and n00b and dweebey is something to be laughed at. Except in the ToD, we're gonna have those guys flying with us. And the better pilots have a duty to keep them alive, and do the job needs to be done at the same time, instead of use the lesser pilots as bait to become fodder so you can cherrypick 12 kills and rtb alone, like you guys do in the MA.
So laugh it up! See you in ToD :D
-
Its really shame that TOD did not hitt the nett, It should have been finish for over a 1 year I think :(.
Some like furball and just love to have Kills as there goal, but I think even more pilots that fly this games like real missions and historicals events more;)
Flights sim is not a Arcade game like AH have become, the only mission is to capture a base? What fun is it in that, maybee some times but not evereu SN/mission you fly with your squad.
Like many in here also play IL2, so Do I and have gone totaly over to it. You have and exelent mission with new mission who generates new mission and historicals txt with mission and info with it. You fly with real people and AI. Great fun :aok .
Ok I have played AH about 5 years intil now, but Awaiting for TOD to return to the game. Ofcourse things like TOD is verry complex but I hope HTC can master it;)
-
I think the more successful pilots in ToD will be the guys with a good aim.
-
"ToD is aimed towards two groups....
*WW2OL Players
*Il-2 Players
Not MA players
Its a way to expand buisiness not relocate customers.
Tex"
3 groups - *Warbirds players
In WarBirds ww2arena has exacly what HTC wants to accomplish.
Not for everyone but good diversity.
-
Originally posted by thrila
I think the more successful pilots in ToD will be the guys with a good aim.
By "aim", do you mean objective/purpose? If so, I agree. :aok
-
It sure would be nice if we had ever gotten any concrete information on the game we've been waiting for for years.
*HINT*
If I'm still alive when ToD comes out, I'm sure I'll check it out. The thing I'm most curious about is whether it will look/fly just like AH2. I guess I'd also like to hear something more than 'we're working on it'.
-
Originally posted by Kweassa
Imagine a 12~20 man USAAF squadron, flying with 20~30 bombers in escort duties, meeting 10~15 Luftwaffe fighters..
And if the buffs continue to have the ability to hit a target moving at 400mph from 1.5K out, these fights will last about 5 to 10 seconds. The time it takes to make a single pass and RTB for a new engine.
-
"And if the buffs continue to have the ability to hit a target moving at 400mph from 1.5K out, these fights will last about 5 to 10 seconds. "
That's hogwash IMO. In the MA if you're coming in at 400 and at 1.5K out the "easy target " pilot nails you then to be quite blunt... you must REALLY sukk. IMO it would be embarrassing to admit getting shot down by a buff in AH under just about any circumstance.
(*being vulched taking off or climbing up to a bombers "6" should earn the player an AH "Stupid Player" award).
As for bombers and the TOD? Even though I've not participated in an AH scenario in about 3 years I still follow the forums and read the AAR's posted by the participant. And in each scenario when the bombers were detected and then intercepted they were decimated. IMO the TOD bombers would need to be tougher to maintain player interest in using them over the long run.
(HIYA GRIZZLY! Nice to "see" you and hope all is well.)
-
Originally posted by Westy
[B That's hogwash IMO. In the MA if you're coming in at 400 and at 1.5K out the "easy target " pilot nails you then to be quite blunt... you must REAL sukk. IMO it would be embarrassing to admit getting shot down by a buff in AH under just about any circumstance.
[/B]
Nah, getting shot down is not embarashing. Responding like you did is.
I really don't undertand why you had to respond in this way :rolleyes: .
I guess you never had a buff hit your oil?
Edit: What is your in game id? I'd like to know who I am talking to.
-
Originally posted by Westy
"And if the buffs continue to have the ability to hit a target moving at 400mph from 1.5K out, these fights will last about 5 to 10 seconds. "
That's hogwash IMO. In the MA if you're coming in at 400 and at 1.5K out the "easy target " pilot nails you then to be quite blunt... you must REALLY sukk. IMO it would be embarrassing to admit getting shot down by a buff in AH under just about any circumstance.
(*being vulched taking off or climbing up to a bombers "6" should earn the player an AH "Stupid Player" award).
As for bombers and the TOD? Even though I've not participated in an AH scenario in about 3 years I still follow the forums and read the AAR's posted by the participant. And in each scenario when the bombers were detected and then intercepted they were decimated. IMO the TOD bombers would need to be tougher to maintain player interest in using them over the long run.
(HIYA GRIZZLY! Nice to "see" you and hope all is well.)
As with all planes learning to really push the heavy bomber's defensive abilities takes time and effort. The "average" set of buffs is piloted by someone who can't do well in a fighter, and takes up bombers because they don't require skillful maneuvers in order to fight back. Attacking buffs piloted by someone like 999000 or rod007 is a different matter entierly, and requires precise angles of attack to minimize risk. Even then luck is still required to survive the encounter.
-
"I really don't undertand why you had to respond in this way."
Because you exagerated and invoked the "AH buff guns are uber BFG200 laser beams" whine.
As for my game Id? Other than a few sessions in the AH-II beta test I haven't logged onto the AH MA in almost two years. Other than new graphics and some refinements not much has essentially changed. Especially the MA. So if they were easy meat back then they're easy meat now..
-
Originally posted by pellik
As with all planes learning to really push the heavy bomber's defensive abilities takes time and effort. The "average" set of buffs is piloted by someone who can't do well in a fighter, and takes up bombers because they don't require skillful maneuvers in order to fight back. Attacking buffs piloted by someone like 999000 or rod007 is a different matter entierly, and requires precise angles of attack to minimize risk. Even then luck is still required to survive the encounter.
:lol , attacking 999 or tater will make you atlist go get a new plane. These guys will aim for the left or right wing tips depending on the type of aircraft you are in, and they will get it too. So, even if you did manage to kill all three of the buffs, in TOD you would have to RTB cause your plane will be full of holes.
-
Originally posted by Westy
"I really don't undertand why you had to respond in this way."
Because you exagerated and invoked the "AH buff guns are uber BFG200 laser beams" whine.
As for my game Id? Other than a few sessions in the AH-II beta test I haven't logged onto the AH MA in almost two years. Other than new graphics and some refinements not much has essentially changed. Especially the MA. So if they were easy meat back then they're easy meat now..
:lol Dude, get a life. Is this what you do? Read BBS posts about a game you don't play and pretend to be an expert in it while you are rude and abnoxius to the people that do play the game? It was not a whine you idiot. These guys will hit you if not at 1.5K for sure at 1K. In a game where staying alive is importand, you would have to RTP after your plane got damaged. :rolleyes:
What was your ID 2 years ago? I'd like to see how easy buffs were for you back then.
-
Sorry can't say I've heard of these players. Regardless of that, I've read this same kind of bragging from, or about the skillZ of others, since AH's beginning.
IMO very! few could come even close to backing it up. CavemanJ was one player that does come to mind.
Anyways. We'll see come TOD :) I look forward to buff interception very much. Hopefully it arrives before I have to suffer from wearing bifocals or cateracts set in.
-
Originally posted by Grizzly
In short, it will be more of a roll player game where players are assigned to missions and rated based upon their performance. The player character will be promoted or demoted based upon this performance. Missions will be designed by HTC or ranking players based upon a general strategic goal. Teams will be historic with accurate vehicles and plane types. Performance will have less emphasis on kills and more on mission success, so if you finish the mission as ordered, you will be rewarded. Dig around in this web site to see if you can find more information from HTC on Tour Of Duty, like press releases.
Grizzly,
I think there might be a lil more to it. If I'm not mistaken if you "die" while fighting you may be demoted and can be demoted all the way back to cadet :).
So:
you gain rank by your performance in doing whatever it was you set out to do.
You maintain whacha got by not achieving your target goals.
But die and demotion is what I read from the write ups.
__________________
Ren
The Damned
-
ToD will bring me back to AH. It's what I've been waiting for.
MA gameplay became boring to the point I couldn't be bothered to load the game up anymore. Nothing wrong with the game, but I'd been there done that.
And I still sucked.
-
"Grizzly,
I think there might be a lil more to it. If I'm not mistaken if you "die" while fighting you may be demoted and can be demoted all the way back to cadet ."
Could be, I don't know. And HTC might not know all the details yet. We'll have to wait and see. But if someone gets demoted back to grunt if he gets killed, it will likely get a bit frustrating. I'm hoping for a more long term career setup.
-
If it's ever released .. it'll be the thing that brings me back to AH.
But I've been waiting for over a year.. and I was rather dissapointed to see it's still not done.
-
My opinion is that ToD will save AH and HTC. Dale and Doug know what they are doing here. AH2 has the framework to support up to 750 players in a single arena. While IL2 is fun and a good fight can be had with 64 players, they cannot do a MMOL with it, in fact they have shown no interest in even trying. All of their coding resources are aimed at BoB (the PF replacement). Besides, if they had 500 folks in one arena with IL2/AEP/FB/PF the framerates would plummet.
Originally posted by Westy
Even if it was just 32 or 64 it's still not MA farcical/fantasy gameplay and that is what is so appealing about it.
I think it is the farcical gameyness of the MA (that has been degrading slowly for the last 18 months) that poses a greater threat to HTC, that is why they need ToD. There will always be those who want air-quake or couterstrike with planes, and I'll probably always jump into the MA for a quick fix, but the current state of gameplay in the MA is not going to attract long term customers (4+ years) anymore like it did back in the 1996-2001 days. Of the flood of new players that we've seen over the last two years I wonder how many of the are planning to keep their subscriptions indefinitely, compared to the players that started AH in 1999/2000.
A flood of new subscribers is undoubtedly good for business and we/they need to keep up the excellent work of attracting them. But it is long-term customers that will keep the lights on indefinitely.
-
Edbert, I know it doesn't happen that often, but for once I completely agree with you. ^
-
Originally posted by beet1e
Edbert, I know it doesn't happen that often, but for once I completely agree with you. ^
hmmmmm....guess I'd better re-evaluate what I said eh?
JK <>
-
Edbert while I agree with you I would like to point at one thing you say.
You say that ToD will save HTCs business.
For any company it HAS TO evolve its product and constantly keep evolving them. Once the product one company has stops evolving the company is dead. Its not directly ToD that will increase the profitability of HTC, its constant evolution to their product, a online flight sim. ToD is just a piece of the puzzle.
Vets whine their hats of due to the increased eye candy. They can whine all they want to because the day HTC stops updating graphics, gameplay and everything else the product is dead and since HTC is a one product company it will die as well.
Part of evolving a product is that you dont know if it will be a success or a flop. Ofcourse no one wants a product to flop. Ofcouse HTC will do all in their powers to make it a success. But they dont know if it will be a success, neither do we.
Exact same thing with say a car manufacturer a new models with improved technology have to constantly be developed. Everyone always strives to make each and every new model a success but still no one knows if it will become one.
Hopefully there will be a HTC created flight sim in 2010. Most likely in that year the product wount be ToD as there will most likely be a new product out by then, even if ToD becomes a success business and products have to evolve. Only thing that is for sure is that it WOUNT be what AH was 3 years ago.
Tex
-
MA will be dweeb arena when TOD getts up and runnin...
In fact...make a furball map..a big fighter town map with 3 bases and let the rest of us fly TOD.
Whooo Hooo lets hope so!!!
I think TOD will be a big hit if it pits players against each other and the mission AI is good.
If TOD is anything like the snap shots etc, alot of flying around for a few seconds of fighting then things aren't going to change much.
I have to agree with Edbert
My opinion is that ToD will save AH and HTC. Dale and Doug know what they are doing here. AH2 has the framework to support up to 750 players in a single arena.
I think HTC are pretty keen about what it takes to make this game work. All the trees and ground detail have been added for a reason and it isn't planes. I will eagerly await TOD to see what they do with it and to finally get an MA where there are more people fighting each other than fighting hangers. VH.
-
The part I cant figure out is why its taken 15+ years? to get an online flight sim past the:
AW: A land vs B land vs C land
Warbirds: Reds vs Greens vs Purps vs Golds
AH: Rook vs Knights vs Bishs
I mean cripes, we have been playing the same thing now for over a decade. Its loooooooooooooooooooooong overdue to get something different, anything.
Im just waiting for a new online flight sim to come out and announce "it will be featuring 4 countries, Diamond, Hearts, Spades and Clubs, with the ability to capture bases! wohoo!
TOD yesterday already!
-
Guys, evidently a lot of people like the A-vs-B-vs-C format, or it wouldn't still be around... I do, for one, and I've been playing off-and-on since around 1990, when AW only supported Macs and Amigas.
That being said, if the TOD venue appeals to additional players, then that's fine by me too. If TOD brings in more $$, then the common 75% between MA and TOD can be further developed by HTC to benefit both styles of play, and make it more likely that AH will be still be around in 5 years.
-
I totally agree though I have only a vague idea of what TOD will be other than historical in flavor. That historical and realistic aspect will be sufficient to keep me interested.
One thing I've noticed in 6+ years of online flight simming is that it has an addictive component which keeps people in place and unwilling to take a look elsewhere for fear of losing their place or something like that. You'll have to consult psychiatric textbooks to find the exact particulars. However, we need to remember that while this is a game to us, it's business to HTC. Nobody ('cept nitwits) makes a long term high cost investment without doing market research to see what kind of "additional" business they can bring in to re-coup their investment. You don't invest money in real life to move people from the MA to TOD. There must be a reason for their madness. Here's a hint.
After having left AH for WarBirds and for the last two years WW2OL. These two sims are substantially grounded on historical game play. I'll tell you that WW2OL has at minimum hundreds if not thousands of people playing every day. Since my experience there was as a member of the LW, I'll tell you that AH's flight models are 1000% better but the only drawback to someone who enjoys re-enactment vs. gaming is that there isn't any organization or command structure in AH as there supposedly is in WW2OL. Unfortunately for those I left behind, the command structure is a big sham which some compare to a good 'ol boys club.
I suspect that TOD will be structured along the same principle as a real life military. At least I hope so and more than anything I hope that HTC looks upon those who command somewhat as employees giving them strict guidelines to adhere to and perhaps some payment for their services in the form of free subs etc.. My feeling is that squads at least as we know them in the MA shouldn't even be permitted in a TOD arena. Hate to say this but my experience during the last two years tells me that too many Napoleons by night who during the day are at the lowest rung in their chosen profession screw things up royal as they all vie to be the latest Alexander. Any military simulation (that's us) without structure is unrealistic and doomed to failure. As I said and can't stress enough, I'm hopeful that HTC would strongly control who the leaders are or create a system which would award rank without bias only to those who earned it through proven combat. Whatever fair method is used, we need people with true leadership credentials to be in charge and the rest should take orders and execute. ***** and moan amongst yourselves but click your heels and do the job when told to.
And before anyone pipes in with "I'm here to have fun", "It's only a game etc. etc. etc." I suggest you go find a game that doesn't kill people. May I suggest Disney's Toontown?
ElCondor
Originally posted by Westy
Some of you just can't see the world outside of your small goldfish bowl! ;)
Even with what little has been told to us about TOD by HTC I'm still perplexed as to why some still put this into the context that this being aimed at the MA player type or that it will be like the CT where hardly anyone is to be found.
I'll be the first to say that HTC has has fallen WAY behind on keeping people informed as to what TOD is. That's evident from the wild bellybutton guesses and assumptions that always sprout in these topics about TOD over the past TWO years.
Still... Enough has been said about it for people to have a firm idea of what it is and who it would appeal to.
Curious as to see how many people this TOD would appeal to? Go to hyperlobby and check out the numbers playing IL2.
There are more playing that game than AH on it's best night. Look at how many love the Dynamix ACES series, EAW, Janes WWII Fighters etc. Add in those who pay to play WWIIO for it's "historical" flavour and you may begin to see that the audience for TOD is much larger than that for the MA by far.
-
FYI, WW2OL has an Axis vs. Allies scenario with a 1/2 scale European map. I strongly suspect that our ingrained inability to learn anything about geography beyond our borders might be perpetuating the ABC's Imagine having to remember which way to turn to get to Eindhoven or Breda (both in Holland) after taking off from Antwerp in Belgium :D
ElCondor
Originally posted by Squire
The part I cant figure out is why its taken 15+ years? to get an online flight sim past the:
AW: A land vs B land vs C land
Warbirds: Reds vs Greens vs Purps vs Golds
AH: Rook vs Knights vs Bishs
I mean cripes, we have been playing the same thing now for over a decade. Its loooooooooooooooooooooong overdue to get something different, anything.
Im just waiting for a new online flight sim to come out and announce "it will be featuring 4 countries, Diamond, Hearts, Spades and Clubs, with the ability to capture bases! wohoo!
TOD yesterday already!
-
Yes WW2OL is the only one I can think of that is really different, unfortunately, you can only fight in France 1940 for so long before it gets tedious. I do salute them for trying though, I think it is an important transitionary sim.
...the other aspect of the A-B-C land type sims is the "go through 100 a/c an hour who cares if you make it back it doesnt matter" aspect to it that renders much of the gameplay as no better than an arcade game (just watch the legions of robo-fighters on suicide jabo runs for a base capture). That too, is getting kinda stale.
Im not trying to slam anybodys game...its just I for one am in the mood for something more substantive after playing a lot of these sims. I wish the "MA" all the best, but an alternative is overdue for the rest of us.
-
Make it $2/hr again. Funked was right - that kept all the tardz out.