Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: rpm on May 29, 2005, 03:17:02 AM
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Link (http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/nation/3202420)
NASHVILLE, Tenn. — A mother faces criminal charges after she hired a stripper to dance at her 16-year-old son's birthday party.
Anette Pharris, 34, has been indicted by a grand jury on charges of contributing to the delinquency of a minor and involving a minor in obscene acts. The boy's father, the stripper and two others also face charges.
"I tried to do something special for my son," Pharris said. "It didn't harm him."
About 10 people under the age of 18 were at the birthday party in September, including minors who were not related to the family, authorities said.
Police spokesman Don Aaron said minors are not permitted in adult establishments.
"A person shouldn't be allowed to circumvent that law by hiring a stripper, a lady who took all her clothes off and spent a good amount of time dancing around minors," he said.
Anette Pharris took photos at the party and tried to have them developed at a nearby drug store. Drug store employees notified authorities, police said.
"Who are they to tell me what I can and can't show to my own children?" the mother said.
Cool Mom, too bad the anal rententive yokels had to spoil the party.
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That has to be the coolest mom ever... or atleast the boys friends must think so :D
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Originally posted by Nilsen
That has to be the coolest mom ever... or atleast the boys friends must think so :D
And one of the dumbest...
"Anette Pharris took photos at the party and tried to have them developed at a nearby drug store. Drug store employees notified authorities, police said. "
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Yet another reason to buy a digital camera.
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Originally posted by rpm
Yet another reason to buy a digital camera.
Or a cell phone with a camera. Easier to send little Timmy's birthday party pics to grandma. :D
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Originally posted by Heiliger
Easier to send little Timmy's birthday party pics to grandma. :D
:rofl
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"Who are they to tell me what I can and can't show to my own children?" the mother said.
Although i would of loved something like this for my 16th birthday, I would like to know who she thinks she is to be able to decide what other peoples kids can and can't do. Did she not think that other parents might find out as well once these kids started talking at school.
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I suspect at the heart of this is a woman who still wants to be part of the "gang", one of the cool types, and in this sad event she was trying to be one of the "cool moms".
She needs to learn to accept her age, accept that she isn't a teenager any longer, and accept that she is a Mother now and should act like it, not like a foolish teenager.
If she can't provide maturity and judgement, setting a decent example, they will never learn it.
dago
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Originally posted by Dago
I suspect at the heart of this is a woman who still wants to be part of the "gang", one of the cool types, and in this sad event she was trying to be one of the "cool moms".
She needs to learn to accept her age, accept that she isn't a teenager any longer, and accept that she is a Mother now and should act like it, not like a foolish teenager.
If she can't provide maturity and judgement, setting a decent example, they will never learn it.
dago
34-16=18. Smells like a Prom baby to me lol. I'm guessing this isn't the only thing she's done to be one of the cool kids.
:p
-Sik
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Originally posted by rpm
Link (http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/nation/3202420)
Cool Mom, too bad the anal rententive yokels had to spoil the party.
What she did was ILLEGAL, regardless of how "cool" you think it was. Besides the fact she is pretty stupid, considering the fact that they are not all HER children. She's lucky one of the other boys mothers didn't whip her prettythang. The "yokels", as you call them, are tasked with enforcing the LAW, perhaps you've heard of the LAW. I suppose it would have been okay if she'd bought them a keg as well.
And people wonder what's wrong with this country, and why the children end up screwed up half the time. It's really obvious to those with common sense.
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Jeez, lighten up Francis :)
culero (16 year old boys seeing some titties ain't gonna ruin civilization)
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Originally posted by culero
Jeez, lighten up Francis :)
culero (16 year old boys seeing some titties ain't gonna ruin civilization)
At 16 i think they have seen far "worse" on their computers :D
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Originally posted by culero
Jeez, lighten up Francis :)
culero (16 year old boys seeing some titties ain't gonna ruin civilization)
The fact that they saw a stripper is not the point. It's the circumstances. If "mom' is buying a stripper for a 16 year old's birthday party, you have to wonder (at least if you have any common sense) what ELSE she's buying, or allowing him to have or do.
You see, or perhaps only want to see, a single isolated incident. Having recently seen a "mom" who took her daughter and daughter's friend out to get pierced and get some crack, I see something else down the road.
The parent has a responsibility to the child to teach the child to respect laws, even those they disagree with, not to encourage the child to break the law, or to break it for them. The parent also has a responsibility to respect the other children, AND their parents.
The fact that some 16 year olds saw some live T&A is not the problem here. The problem here is that "mom" wants to be one of the kids, and not "mom". That's a bad thing, regardless of how fun and harmless you may think the live T&A show was.
I like T&A and sex as much or more than anyone, I'm no prude. I'm just also a parent, with a 17 year old girl and a 10 year old boy. When it comes to being a parent, I am an adult, and I accept the responsibility and be the parent. It might be the ONLY time I'm an adult about anything, but it's the time that counts the most.
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Geez the Victorian age is over, don't you know that people?
Or maybe it's just starting here. :rolleyes:
oh and I bet the boy's mom had been a stripper too. After all, she ahd him pretty young, had to work hard to support him...bla bla bla.
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oh no, not a neked women, AAHHHEEEE( runs screeming from room)
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Yet another example of "while there is no law against stupidity, it gets factored in". Bringing in a stripper for your son's sixteenth birthday is a really bad idea. Photoing it and going to the 1-hour developer is an even worse one.
Regards,
Malta
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Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
The fact that they saw a stripper is not the point. It's the circumstances.
snip
The point is (well, the point I'm talking about anyway) is that people are making too big a friggin' deal about it.
I agree with you it shows very poor judgment on this woman's part, and that the other parents involved have every right to be pissed at her if she drug their kids into this without their prior knowledge.
But, IMO that's about as bad as it gets, it ain't something that merits wasting public law enforcement/judicial resources on. I'd rather have 'em focus on the people who are stealing $140 televisions and getting THEIR butts in jail.
And I think all the people expressing all the righteous indignation are over the top. It just ain't that big a damn deal. Its just titties, man, it ain't the end of western civilization :)
culero
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Originally posted by culero
The point is (well, the point I'm talking about anyway) is that people are making too big a friggin' deal about it.
I agree with you it shows very poor judgment on this woman's part, and that the other parents involved have every right to be pissed at her if she drug their kids into this without their prior knowledge.
But, IMO that's about as bad as it gets, it ain't something that merits wasting public law enforcement/judicial resources on. I'd rather have 'em focus on the people who are stealing $140 televisions and getting THEIR butts in jail.
And I think all the people expressing all the righteous indignation are over the top. It just ain't that big a damn deal. Its just titties, man, it ain't the end of western civilization :)
culero
Would you feel the same way if it was a room full of girls that some father ordered a male stripper for? I think people would think he was some type of pervert or something. Would you be willing to say "it's just some guys junk their looking at, what's the big deal"
Edit: You ever seen a stripper at someone's house? It's always more than just titties.
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Originally posted by parker00
Would you feel the same way if it was a room full of girls that some father ordered a male stripper for? I think people would think he was some type of pervert or something. Would you be willing to say "it's just some guys junk their looking at, what's the big deal"
Edit: You ever seen a stripper at someone's house? It's always more than just titties.
Not to mention ILLEGAL! It's against the law. If it was just her son and in the privacy of their home I would see no big deal with this. The fact that pictures were taken AND it involves other peoples kids means this isnt just "no big deadl"
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Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
The fact that they saw a stripper is not the point. It's the circumstances. If "mom' is buying a stripper for a 16 year old's birthday party, you have to wonder (at least if you have any common sense) what ELSE she's buying, or allowing him to have or do.
Hmmm my dad bought me a bottle of wine every now and then; I wonder why he didn't bring me any dope like your common sense says.
btw how old do you have to be in US to face charges in court as adult ?
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Originally posted by Staga
Hmmm my dad bought me a bottle of wine every now and then; I wonder why he didn't bring me any dope like your common sense says.
btw how old do you have to be in US to face charges in court as adult ?
It depends on the charge, if it's murder then i don't think there is an age limit. Most things are anywhere from 16-18.
Also did your dad supply it to the other kids in the neighborhood or just you? For the 4 other countries i've been to, drinking wasn't high on the illegal list or at least not inforced so how does that really relate to sex or sexual acts? Don't know about the strippers where you're from but the ones i've seen will do anything from useing a dildo to the candles on your wall. It is not normal or OK for a mother (who would even want their mom to buy them a stripper) of a 16 year old to buy him and HIS FRIENDS a stripper. Is there anyone here who would not have a problem if their 16 year old daughter came home and said "hey jo bob from down the street bought us a male stripper last night". Just because this is a guy doesn't make it ok.
Just like gunslinger said it would not of been that bad if they didn't include other peoples kids but they did and she should be punished in some way.
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So 16 year old is old enough to get a death sentence in the court but not old enough to see a stripper?
He's also old enough to drive a car but not old enough to make a decision if he/she should watch s stripper performing or not?
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Originally posted by Staga
So 16 year old is old enough to get a death sentence in the court but not old enough to see a stripper?
He's also old enough to drive a car but not old enough to make a decision if he/she should watch s stripper performing or not?
yeah maybe if you killed someone you could get the death penalty but even that would take another 10-15 yrs before they actually did it.
You seem to be getting two things mixed up, you can be charged under 18 as an adult but technically your not considered an adult until 18. Sounds a little confusing but that's the way it is over here. So to answer your question above, no he is not old enough to decide if he watches a stripper or not. you are also missing the point that this mother took it upon herself to decide not only what's good for her child but teenagers of other parents as well. that is why she should get in trouble. if she wants to get her son drunk, high or get him a stripper i guess that is up to her, but she took it upon herself to decide what was best for someone else's children as well. I am just as responsible for what my son does as he is in the courts eye until he is age 18. So that means I (not some twisted lady) get to decide what is best for my son/daughter. If this is hopeful thinking on my part so be it but I will not condone him doing things i don't like or approve of.
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Originally posted by Staga
So 16 year old is old enough to get a death sentence in the court but not old enough to see a stripper?
He's also old enough to drive a car but not old enough to make a decision if he/she should watch s stripper performing or not?
no the legal age of adulthood in the US is 18. At 18 you can go to strip clubs/juice bars depending on the states liqure laws.
If she wants to get her son drunk or get her son a stripper most people don't see a problem with it. but the fact that she had OTHER PEOPLES KIDS involved is what makes this bad for me.
Comparing the laws that trys juviniles as adults is apples and oranges. Juviniles get charges as adults when they commit adult crimes. In this case it is an ADULT commiting a crime against other peoples kids in exposing them to something that by law is deemed inappropriate for minors.
She broke the law plain and simple. This isn't about purtanical virtues its about age limits and appropriatness.
In some states I can give my kids beer/liqure in my home or in a bar if I deem it OK. Most states to not allow me to give it to OTHER peoples kids.
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nanny state.
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Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
Having recently seen a "mom" who took her daughter and daughter's friend out to get their cracks pierced...
ouch!!:eek:
Or did I read that wrong??:confused:
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Originally posted by parker00
Would you feel the same way if it was a room full of girls that some father ordered a male stripper for? I think people would think he was some type of pervert or something. Would you be willing to say "it's just some guys junk their looking at, what's the big deal"
Edit: You ever seen a stripper at someone's house? It's always more than just titties.
Yes, actually I'd have the same reaction if the sexes were reversed. Let's keep it in perspective:
1) Nobody is saying any sexual abuse occured, even in your sex-reversal scenario (my attitude would be different if that were the case).
2) I didn't say it was OK, I said the other parents have every right to be pissed.
3) I'm saying we don't need to have law enforcement resources involved, IMO its a waste of their valuable time, when much more important and urgent matters are at hand.
This is IMO something the parents should settle amongst themselves. I think people are too uptight about this, but that's me. I respect your right to decide for yourself, and YOUR children. That's what I am talking about here.
culero
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Wow! Cool mom!
But she could of used better judgement. Should of used a digital camera.
:D
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If I was rich like Bill Gates I would have my lawyers defend people in cases like this. That would create precedents for future similar cases. I would change America!
erm I am a bit drunk
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Originally posted by Nilsen
At 16 i think they have seen far "worse" on their computers :D
Lmao for that matter they have probably seen fr worse on network TV
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Originally posted by Gunslinger
If she wants to get her son drunk or get her son a stripper most people don't see a problem with it. but the fact that she had OTHER PEOPLES KIDS involved is what makes this bad for me.
Agreed.
Too bad it doesnt mention what the other parents had to say.
I guess it is possible she contacted them and cleared it with them first but it doesnt say one way or the other.
Pretty safe bet they wouldnt admit it if they were though
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I never realised Virgil was one of "THOSE". (THOSE being an anal retentive yokel in this case.) Teenagers saw boobies. Oh, the horror...THE HORROR!
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Originally posted by rpm
I never realised Virgil was one of "THOSE". (THOSE being an anal retentive yokel in this case.) Teenagers saw boobies. Oh, the horror...THE HORROR!
You REALLY have no idea who or what you're talking about. You don't get it, and you likely never will. There are a FEW here who know me, and know well enough that I'm no prude, far from it. You on the other hand, do not know me at all. If you did, you'd know better.
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I guess i like being one of "THOSE" guys that at least TRY to keep sex away from my kids as long as possible. Hell my 4 yr old has probably already seen boobs on tv but that doesn't mean I am going to encourage it. What is wrong with wanting (even if they don't listen) your children to stay away from sex as long as possible? You guys have not seen a real stripper apparently because you would all know they do a lot more than show their boobs while at your house. I would almost rather the lady take my kid to an actual tittie bar (juice bar) where i know they at least have rules about what can happen. Most times they don't get completely naked at a bar but at your house i've seen some that would probably use the table leg if you let them. And it still all boils down to the fact that this lady decided what would be best for someone else's kids. No big deal if it was just her kids but it wasn't. Just like she asked who the government was to tell her what she could do with her kids, then i would like to know who she thought she was to include other people's kids. If all the other parents said it was ok, then fine no problem here but i doubt that any of them were included on what was going to be happening.
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Originally posted by straffo
nanny state.
touche, as you french would say, lol
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sounds like the parents are pervs
hope they throw the book at them
the dad would have my boot up his arse if my son was at the party, then the lawyer would pay them a visit ...
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Originally posted by Gunslinger
no the legal age of adulthood in the US is 18. At 18 you can go to strip clubs/juice bars depending on the states liqure laws.
Key words there "depending on the state's liquor laws". And the "legal age of adulthood in the US" is 21. At 18 you cannot enter into a binding contract. You gain some adult privileges, more in some states depending on state laws. But full adult status is not recognized until 21. Yes some states allow entry into "juice bars" and you can go into exotic dance places. In most states, real strippers (meaning they go beyond pasties and a G-string) require you to be 21 to enter. And of course you MUST be 21 to drink alcohol, in almost every state of the US (I think there might still be 2 states that have the drinking age set at 18).
Originally posted by Staga
So 16 year old is old enough to get a death sentence in the court but not old enough to see a stripper?
He's also old enough to drive a car but not old enough to make a decision if he/she should watch s stripper performing or not?
Decisions on whether or not a child can be tried as an adult vary from state to state. Some are as low as 13 for capital offenses. Hawaii for example, has NO law regarding this, and ANY child of ANY age can be charged as an adult if the courts deem it necessary. As for your example of "old enough to get the death sentence, but not old enough to see a stripper", thats been a long running argument for guys who serve in the armed forces. They can sign up at 18 on their own, but cant drink, or even buy a car or a house on their own (unless they are legally emancipated, but that opens up a whole new can of worms). I believe there is a legislator trying to change that drinking age thing, but I doubt he will have much success.
Regardless, the issue here is the actions of an adult (the boy's mother), and not the boy. Also the actions of other adults, and how they affected or influenced minors. It's something that must be considered. But just for those of you quoting LAW (and I hate to bust your chops on this one Cap'n but you are wrong), all they can legally be charged with at this point is "contributing to the delinquency of a minor" which is a deliberately broad and vague charge, open to interpretation. The states laws regarding minors and strippers only apply to minors getting in to establishments to view the acts, not to acts that occur in a private home. The prosecution sees it as "skirting the law" and may try to interpret the law to include such a thing, thus bringing more charges. I doubt they will stick without changing the wording of the law.
I seriously doubt any lasting harm was done to the boy or his friends, and I havent heard any "outraged parent" quotes on the net over this. It's been a story for days. It also says that besides the mother, father, and stripper, "two others" are facing charges. Other parents perhaps? I'm just sayin, usually in a deal like this there would be interviews everywhere with upset parents talking about the moral decline of our country and blah blah blah...........none of that here. There's more to the story.
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Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
Key words there "depending on the state's liquor laws". And the "legal age of adulthood in the US" is 21. At 18 you cannot enter into a binding contract. You gain some adult privileges, more in some states depending on state laws. But full adult status is not recognized until 21. Yes some states allow entry into "juice bars" and you can go into exotic dance places. In most states, real strippers (meaning they go beyond pasties and a G-string) require you to be 21 to enter. And of course you MUST be 21 to drink alcohol, in almost every state of the US (I think there might still be 2 states that have the drinking age set at 18).
Decisions on whether or not a child can be tried as an adult vary from state to state. Some are as low as 13 for capital offenses. Hawaii for example, has NO law regarding this, and ANY child of ANY age can be charged as an adult if the courts deem it necessary. As for your example of "old enough to get the death sentence, but not old enough to see a stripper", thats been a long running argument for guys who serve in the armed forces. They can sign up at 18 on their own, but cant drink, or even buy a car or a house on their own (unless they are legally emancipated, but that opens up a whole new can of worms). I believe there is a legislator trying to change that drinking age thing, but I doubt he will have much success.
Regardless, the issue here is the actions of an adult (the boy's mother), and not the boy. Also the actions of other adults, and how they affected or influenced minors. It's something that must be considered. But just for those of you quoting LAW (and I hate to bust your chops on this one Cap'n but you are wrong), all they can legally be charged with at this point is "contributing to the delinquency of a minor" which is a deliberately broad and vague charge, open to interpretation. The states laws regarding minors and strippers only apply to minors getting in to establishments to view the acts, not to acts that occur in a private home. The prosecution sees it as "skirting the law" and may try to interpret the law to include such a thing, thus bringing more charges. I doubt they will stick without changing the wording of the law.
I seriously doubt any lasting harm was done to the boy or his friends, and I havent heard any "outraged parent" quotes on the net over this. It's been a story for days. It also says that besides the mother, father, and stripper, "two others" are facing charges. Other parents perhaps? I'm just sayin, usually in a deal like this there would be interviews everywhere with upset parents talking about the moral decline of our country and blah blah blah...........none of that here. There's more to the story.
In most states you can enter a legal binding contract at 18 years of age. There are NO states that have less than 21 drinking age however, there are some that allow an adult/parent/guardien to serve you. at 18 you are responsible for your own actions no ifs ands or buts. Your parents are no longer LEGALLY required to care for you. 18 is the legal age of adult hood.
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i will agree with you that there has to be more to this story but i believe you are mistaken about the part of not an adult until 21. The only thing i think you can't do is drink before 21. You can buy a car, home, get credit cards and get married at 18.
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I stand corrected. I've only lived in 5 states, and none of them allow 18 year olds to sign contracts. I wasnt sure about the drinking age, one always hears rumors. :)
Still curious though, if 18 is the legal age of "adulthood" how can the federal govt. push the states to require 21 as the drinking age, and how can any state refuse to allow an 18 year old to sign a contract?
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Well they technically can't force it upon any state but what they will do is withhold federal money from them until they comply. I see it as forcing but technically not. This is how they get states to conform to their new rules and regulations. It works the same as what they are doing now with the "no child left behind act". Either meet our standards or receive less money from us. And as far as the legal binding of a contract i thought it was 18 across the country so i can't answer that one.
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I understand how the feds get the states to pass the laws they want. I'm very familiar with the process. My question is where the age "21" comes from, and why there is any conflict between what age a person becomes an "adult" legally. It was stated that 18 is the "legal age of adulthood." If that is so, and an 18 year old is legally considered an "adult" then how can you deny him the right to drink, or any state deny him the right to sign a contract, enter a bar, or see nekkid wimmen. I'm just asking.
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Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
I understand how the feds get the states to pass the laws they want. I'm very familiar with the process. My question is where the age "21" comes from, and why there is any conflict between what age a person becomes an "adult" legally. It was stated that 18 is the "legal age of adulthood." If that is so, and an 18 year old is legally considered an "adult" then how can you deny him the right to drink, or any state deny him the right to sign a contract, enter a bar, or see nekkid wimmen. I'm just asking.
well there you go....drinking is not a "right" so to speak. I've never been in a state in the last five years that an 18 y/o could not sign a legal contract. I don't know were the magic number "21" comes from but that's the drinking age. At 18 there is no chance of you being tried as a juvinal in court, your parents are no longer responsible for you, you now have the right to vote, you can enlist in the military w/o parental consent. That's why 18 is the legal age of adulthood.
IMHO I think the 21 thing needs to be scrapped. Most countrys in Europe don't have a drinking age and they don't have a problem with teenage alcoholism that we do here in the states.
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She broke the law, used poor judgement and should be punished.
I look at it the way, I am 38yrs old and when I was that age incidents like that just didn't happen {I'm sure somewhere someone did something similar} but you get the point.
I'm not going to say this is what's wrong with todays youth nor try'n place blame, but when I was that age parents took a stronger role in childrens lives, there wasn't guns being toted to schools, there was no metal detectors at high schools and you sure as hell didn't tell some old guy to go **** himself.
I NEVER once read in the local paper about a drive-by at our school dance or someone gettin' knifed. They usually TP'd your house or put shaving cream all over your car.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to say there wasn't any rough guys or problem causers. It was usually a fight over a girl or something stupid then ended up becoming friends by the next weekend anyways.
Just my 2 cents
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People should be more concerned about the drug store violating the confideliality of the plaintiffs private property (photographs) let alone turning them in to the authorities.
What does that tell about the society? The US starts to look more and more like DDR lately.
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Originally posted by Siaf__csf
People should be more concerned about the drug store violating the confideliality of the plaintiffs private property (photographs) let alone turning them in to the authorities.
What does that tell about the society? The US starts to look more and more like DDR lately.
Well here in the USA we have laws that say you can't print porn without a license. Photoshops will usually just throw them away but if it looked like a crime was happening (which it was) then it's their duty to report it.
You would also think people should be more concerned with their own country instead of someones elses but we can't get that through to some people.
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Private photographs are not porn. It is also not the business of the developer to rate or judge the photographs taken by a private person for his/her private use.
Is sexuality really worse than murder down there? It sure starts to look like that.
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Originally posted by Siaf__csf
People should be more concerned about the drug store violating the confideliality of the plaintiffs private property (photographs) let alone turning them in to the authorities.
What does that tell about the society? The US starts to look more and more like DDR lately.
I believe they could be held liable if they did not report the alleged crime.
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Originally posted by Siaf__csf
Private photographs are not porn. It is also not the business of the developer to rate or judge the photographs taken by a private person for his/her private use.
Is sexuality really worse than murder down there? It sure starts to look like that.
Siaf,
Frankly you don't have a clue about laws here in the states. Porn is porn whether they are private photos or not. The developer has a legal obligation to turn over evidence of an illegal act. The stripper for minors fits that situation, period. If they do not they are liable for criminal action themselves.
Local entities like towns, cities, counties and states can and do enact laws regaarding conduct that a minor may engage in or be exposed to. The terms lewd and lascivious are likely to be the core of the charges related to the photos. If the jurisdiction has laws prohibiting the processing of photos showing nudity the developer has no choice again.
No, sexuality is not worse than murder here. Your perceptions are very clouded if you think so. If the laws on this side of the ocean bother you, just don't bother to read anything about them. I'm sure no one here will be concerned if that happens.
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Originally posted by Siaf__csf
Private photographs are not porn. It is also not the business of the developer to rate or judge the photographs taken by a private person for his/her private use.
Is sexuality really worse than murder down there? It sure starts to look like that.
Just look at the reaction 1 nipple did in this country during the superbowl.
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Next birthday...a gun party for some good CLEAN fun!:aok
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Originally posted by parker00
Just look at the reaction 1 nipple did in this country during the superbowl.
To our everlasting shame.
culero (nudity isn't porn, folks)
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The big brother is watching you. Do not use film cameras if you don't develop the pictures yourself.
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any one else seen the inbred mom on the tele?
all animals produce offspring, but not all can raise them properly
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Originally posted by rpm
I never realised Virgil was one of "THOSE". (THOSE being an anal retentive yokel in this case.) Teenagers saw boobies. Oh, the horror...THE HORROR!
Well, count me as one of "those" too then, but I agree with Virgil's take and thought it was well stated.
(shrug)