Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Jackal1 on May 29, 2005, 11:28:49 PM
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Like it or not history was made at the Brickyard today.
Danica just plain friggen rocks.
1st female to ever lead a lap on lap 56 and that was just the beginning.
The stall in the pits and time down for a restart. Back from 4th place to 16th. Then the working out of the mire up to 8th. 3 times there was wheel brushing twice it was wrecks. She was the only one that pulled out of it without wrecking and continued on.
Then the wreck at restart when she lost the front wing and the downtime for the replacement thanks to Allison.
Then on to lead at Indy again to make history.
Wheldon took 1st and deservedly so, but Danica made history and also showed what determination and guts will do.
The most awesome race in Indy history without a doubt.
I have only witnessed this much determination and sheer willpower in racing once before. That was way back in the early sprint car days before the WoO at OKC fairgrounds by Aaron Madden. I used to leave Tx every Friday evening and haul balls to OKC fairgrounds to watch the MARCAR circuit. Danica reminded me so much of Aaron with the "never give up" attitude it is unreal.
As Larry The Cable Guy so eloqently would put it.... That`s talent , I don`t care who you are.
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If she raced nekkid, i bet she'd win.
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Did'nt get to see the race, but I was rooting for her. She is the real deal.
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Another 5 - 10 gallons of gas & she coulda won it.
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Originally posted by indy007
Another 5 - 10 gallons of gas & she coulda won it.
Yea, it would have been great if she had the fuel onboard to where she didn`t have to run lean those last few. I would have liked to seen her mix it up running with full horsepower.
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where did she place?
and... has anyone ever seen a woman racer in any kind of race that didn't have at least 1 st place material for a car? seems that they allways get the very best of the best equipment to start their rookie attempts with.
lazs
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I dont think she could have kept Wheldon behind her regardless of her fuel situation. Even on the last restart when Wheldon started first and she passed him in the first lap (lap 190 or so) she was running wide open on fuel setting number 1 which is the richest setting in the car and Wheldon still ran her down in less than 3 laps. Wheldon's car was a rocket all day long and I dont really think that Danica running lean really affected her finish position all that much other than the fact that if she hadnt run it lean and there hadnt been all those caution laps at the end, she probably would have run out of fuel and never finished anywhere near the top. Her fuel strategy helped her finish the race in the top 4 but I dont think there was any way for her to hold Wheldon off.
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She ended in 4th after leading a lot of the final laps. She was having to run on lean due to fuel. A yellow flag near the end made a big difference by a couple of seconds one way or the other.
As far as her equipment goes , she ran the first half of the race with her car handling like pure crap. She had to have the front wing replaced after a restart crash , where she lost a good amount of time in the pits. The last part of the race the car was loose as a goose. It was her driving that put her back up front.
Rahal made a very wise decision when he retrieved her back home from England.
where did she place?
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well... my point is that if you have equipment that is the best or at least second best... if you place less than second then you are holding back the car.
if you slid out of control in a wreck and get lucky.... you are lucky.
If you run out of gas because you are running the wrong mixture in order to get a short term gain... you, or your crew, mad a bad decision.
my guess is that she won't do so well next year. I hope she doesn't get killed or kill someone else. but...I hope that for all rookie drivers.
you seem to be emphasizing the things that kept her from winning without looking at the things that got here into fourth instead of what shoulda happened... DNF or finish at the middle of the pack. she (or her crew) took a lot of chances and they got lucky.
lazs
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Nah, she's the real deal. She's extremely consistent. She'll be on top once she gets more experience. The wing tearing off shoulda sent most people into the wall, but she saved it. The stall in the pit they said was a clutch problem. She probably has the most good highlight film moments from the race too (running down the pack on the straights).
Originally posted by lazs2
well... my point is that if you have equipment that is the best or at least second best... if you place less than second then you are holding back the car.
if you slid out of control in a wreck and get lucky.... you are lucky.
If you run out of gas because you are running the wrong mixture in order to get a short term gain... you, or your crew, mad a bad decision.
my guess is that she won't do so well next year. I hope she doesn't get killed or kill someone else. but...I hope that for all rookie drivers.
you seem to be emphasizing the things that kept her from winning without looking at the things that got here into fourth instead of what shoulda happened... DNF or finish at the middle of the pack. she (or her crew) took a lot of chances and they got lucky.
lazs
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Oh I gotta disagree on that. Her fuel situation was dictated by the way the cards fell. They had a choice to roll the dice and they did. That`s just racing and good teamwork.
What I am emphasizes is that she was a rookie, a minnow in a school of seasoned sharks. She still overcame all the obstacles and trouble, came back up through the pack to the front. Just old fashion talent and determination.
Rahal has got to be tickled pink at her performance. I`m sure the big check doesn`t hurt none either. :)
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ok... role the dice and make it to fourth or play it safe and finish in the middle of the pack..
rolling the dice makes better press tho.
lazs
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And also looks pretty nice points wise and check wise.
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Did that whiner race car driver actually boycot the race or did he even qualify?
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lol "holding the car back"
4th place as a rookie at Indy ain't no BS. That was a deep field, her teammate the Brazilian who finished 2nd can drive a little bit too.
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Originally posted by lazs2
where did she place?
and... has anyone ever seen a woman racer in any kind of race that didn't have at least 1 st place material for a car? seems that they allways get the very best of the best equipment to start their rookie attempts with.
lazs
You don't have to follow Indycar racing very closely to know that every woman prior to Danica has had inferior rides. Name one woman prior to Danica that has had a very competitive machine.
Danica is lucky that she does work for a great team owner who has the resources to give her the best equipment (unlike previous women in IRL), and Danica has the skills to use those tools.
Rookie mistakes happen...she'll be even better gentlemen. :)
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Wot, bloody NASCAR? ... or something....
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Originally posted by lazs2
ok... role the dice and make it to fourth or play it safe and finish in the middle of the pack..
rolling the dice makes better press tho.
lazs
Way Rahal explained the thinking was if they came in for fuel, they figured they'd drop to 11th, if they didn't and ran out, they probably finish 12th, so he gambled.
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Originally posted by Maverick
Did that whiner race car driver actually boycot the race or did he even qualify?
I don't think Robbie Gordon even tried to make Indy this year. He is running his own race team this year and did'nt have the time. He has pulled the Indy/600 double several times. He's a also a very good off-road racer.
I see his point in weighing the cars with driver onboard. If you want an equalising rule, then make it work most effectively.
Danica was asked if she thought her size and weight were an advantage on Letterman last week. She said absolutely. Her arms and legs are shorter so she can react quicker. The girl has the eye and the moves of a great racer.
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Doesn't she drive for David Letterman's team?
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Yep. Rahal/Letterman.
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Originally posted by rpm
I see his point in weighing the cars with driver onboard.
They do it a Churchill Downs.
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Her arms and legs are shorter so she can react quicker.
LOL. That's just so wrong.. on so many levels.
BTW.. I wonder if the driver of that car didn't look like she was finger-lickin good ta eat if anybody woulda given the 'performance' more than 10 seconds of fame for the 4th place finish?
T&A in a 'mans game' sure goes a long way...
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Impossible!!!
:D
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Originally posted by beet1e
Wot, bloody NASCAR? ... or something....
:D IRL..........Indy.
You would like the track Beet. It used to be made of bricks. Ya know....masonary type stuff. lmao
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Originally posted by Enduro
You don't have to follow Indycar racing very closely to know that every woman prior to Danica has had inferior rides. Name one woman prior to Danica that has had a very competitive machine.
INDIANAPOLIS (2002) -- Sarah Fisher spent her post-qualifying news conference Saturday at the Indianapolis Motor Speedway smiling, laughing, joking and savoring every moment.
Fisher qualified ninth for the Indianapolis 500 with a four-lap average of 229.439 mph -- easily the fastest by a woman in Indy history.
"Today, we accomplished exactly what we were aiming for," she said, grinning. "There was still a little left that we could have taken out with the trim but that wasn't the point. We just wanted a steady consistent car, and it was perfect."
Fisher did much better than expected after posting a 226.970 on Friday, her fastest lap since she got the ride with the Dreyer & Reinbold team on Wednesday.
She will start on the outside of the third row after outqualifying former Indy champs Helio Castroneves, Kenny Brack, Buddy Lazier and Al Unser Jr.
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Originally posted by Hangtime
LOL. That's just so wrong.. on so many levels.
BTW.. I wonder if the driver of that car didn't look like she was finger-lickin good ta eat if anybody woulda given the 'performance' more than 10 seconds of fame for the 4th place finish?
T&A in a 'mans game' sure goes a long way...
They have to have her to boost their ratings. Can't blame them. Gotta have some kind of edge against NASCAR... now if NASCAR gets a hot chick...
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enduro... what woman had an inferior car? inferior to what? to the number one car that some guy paid a lot of dues to get into?
Take a walk in the pits of any drag race or road race.. you don't see any low budget women drivers teams or cars.. they allways have the very best. No women doing any of the wrenching or worrying about how much it all costs.
lazs
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I think what Enduro is saying is that Guthrie, St. James and Fisher. All had budget race cars.. with no real major backing.
The Rehal-Letterman cars have tons of man hours in car testings..designs.. Given that..if those three above mentioned ladies had a race car of that quality they would have finished well too.
Now, to say that you also have to back a good car with a driver. Yeah, I think's she's good. And I hope she makes it better then the rest of those ladies.
Now, I have a good car track car, but I'm no professional just a weekend track warrior. I've the pleasure to run with & against the 2005 Forumla Dodge current points leader Gerardo Bonilla. Even let him drive my car..what he did with it I can say I wish I could only drive as well as he can. :D
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Originally posted by rpm
He's a also a very good off-road racer.
In addition to what? Cause he sure as hell cant drive a stock car worth a ****.
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http://www.indymotorspeedway.com/danica.htm (http://www.indymotorspeedway.com/danica.htm)
I'd hit it!
Terror
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muchpatric... I understand that but... lots of the cars were every bit as "budget" and those women didn't do any better than their peers.
race car drivers, as you know, have varrying degrees of natural and learned ability. I just don't hink that she is showing anything that is stellar. The money spent on her would have been better spent on one of the guys (so far as chance to win). you have a car that is equal to or better than any car on the track and it finnish's...... it better finnish in the top 2 or three.
Having said that... I will say that it is a smart move to get publicity for the race and may attract viewers.
lazs
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Originally posted by sling322
In addition to what? Cause he sure as hell cant drive a stock car worth a ****.
ROFL
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He's a mediocre stock car driver at best.
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"In addition to what? Cause he sure as hell cant drive a stock car worth a ****. "
In separate news, why do they still call them "stock cars"?
Granted I think cars with fenders and bumpers make for better racing than cars with wings and open wheels, but "stock" they are not. Take a car off the showroom floor and stick a rollbar in it and race it, that's how it should be done.
J_A_B
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Originally posted by J_A_B
Granted I think cars with fenders and bumpers make for better racing than cars with wings and open wheels
J_A_B
:D Ever been to a WoO race?
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Originally posted by lazs2
The money spent on her would have been better spent on one of the guys (so far as chance to win).
Sorry, been away at work...
Lazs, apparently, people with a lot more money and racing experience than you disagree with you.
Danica Patrick has the talent to win races in IRL. That's a fact. No, she's not having a spectacular rookie season, like Wheldon, but the woman deserves respect. When Patrick gains more experience & starts winning, we all know which old-school men here will whine. :D
you have a car that is equal to or better than any car on the track and it finnish's...... it better finnish in the top 2 or three.
Patrick would have won if she didn't have to run the car lean during those last few laps. And, I'm sure if Danica had finished in 3rd instead of 4th, your statement would've been, "...it better finnish in the top 2."
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I won't whine... couldn't care less.. I have watched women do well in drag racing when they have never earned any of it... they simply were brought on board and taught by the best and given the best equipment.
I don't think women have paid enough dues as a gender in racing to be handed things on a silver platter. I never wrenched with any of em or seen em working on into the night on some barely holding together wreck on the worlds tightest budget.
They never really bled and sweated and died enough for the sports and now they want front row top shelf..
They are given it because it is good for racing I suppose... they draw crowds and that is about 50% of it. but they never earned the spot imo.
lazs
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Enduro she was running lean because she was out of pit sequence, which is how she got up front in the first place. Her repeated mistakes (stall and spin under yellow) turned a 1st place car into a 4th place car. Just like in quals when she botched her first lap. She's quick for sure, but mistake prone. She might mature out of the mistakes if she keeps getting lucky enough to not get injured by her screwups.
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Originally posted by FUNKED1
Enduro she was running lean because she was out of pit sequence, which is how she got up front in the first place. Her repeated mistakes (stall and spin under yellow) turned a 1st place car into a 4th place car. Just like in quals when she botched her first lap. She's quick for sure, but mistake prone. She might mature out of the mistakes if she keeps getting lucky enough to not get injured by her screwups.
Like I said, she's a rookie. And, yes, she's making rookie mistakes. But, at least you own up to the fact that she's quick. She belongs on the track.
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a lot of people belong on the track... most of em have paid their dues driving mediocre cars too.
She may "belong" on the track but does she belong in the best car money can buy? And if she wins... did she win or did the car?
lazs
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Lazs that's just how it is in racing. You can get a ride by being the best driver. Or you can get a ride by being "good enough" and bringing a lot of sponsor's (or personal) money to the table.
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Originally posted by lazs2
a lot of people belong on the track... most of em have paid their dues driving mediocre cars too.
She may "belong" on the track but does she belong in the best car money can buy? And if she wins... did she win or did the car?
lazs
Danica has raced since she was a little kid in carts. She has worked hard for the opportunity that she has right now. She deserves the ride as much as anyone else. I'm sure that she's "paid her dues"...maybe not as hard as others have, but life - in every aspect - isn't always fair. You can't hang Danica Patrick for the unfortune of others. That attitude just stinks of jealousy.
Even you will have to admit that the car and the driver both win races. Neither succeeds without the other.
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Talent can`t be bought or faked.
It wouldn`t make much of a difference where she placed. The point was made through sheer talent in driving. Anyone that watched the race and witnessed the conditions and obstacles she overcame and repeatedly kept coming back to the front also had to recognize the driving talent and determination that it took.
First half of the race her car was too tight....she still kept working up through the pack. Stall in the pits......she overcame it with sheer driving talent and steadily worked back up through the pack.
Restart contact and broken front wing that took quite a bit of time to replace.......She still came back.
Last part of the race her car was loose as a goose. ..... Didn`t matter, she still came to the front and drove her butt off.
Like I said at the beginning...like it or not, history was made at the Brickyard.
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I'll say it, since nobody else seems willing to:
I have no interest in watching a woman racecar driver, whether she crashes on the first turn or wins every race. It has nothing to do with the relative skill of the driver....we could build robotic automobiles which would beat any living driver, but those wouldn't be interesting to watch, either.
J_A_B
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Originally posted by Jackal1
the conditions and obstacles she overcame
the obstacles CREATED BY HER REPEATED DRIVING ERRORS.
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Originally posted by FUNKED1
the obstacles CREATED BY HER REPEATED DRIVING ERRORS.
once again, we all know she's making rookie mistakes. no one is disputing that, Funked.
imagine what she'll be capable of once she learns enough to graduate from dweeb-hood.
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sour grapes or what.
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Originally posted by FUNKED1
the obstacles CREATED BY HER REPEATED DRIVING ERRORS.
Such as?
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jab... I guess you hit on it. I am not interested in watching the heirs to nascar and their life of one big comercial either.
I was kinda watching and participating in the various racing games when the little guy who built em in his garage had a chance. Autocrosses were (and sometimes still are) an informal thing of run whatcha brung... and not on a trailer.. It really wasn't that long ago. women will never do well in that type of racing unless they are simply given the ride... brought out only to drive.
Some racing sports are still like that.. The Camaro Mustang Challenge for instance is geared toward the driveway mechanic and racer.
Competion is good but when it becomes too comercial I lose interest... when people can easily buy a victory it really isn't racing that is worth me watching.
I don't watch any sports tho... If I can't do it.. There is no point in watching a bunch of spoiled athletes doing it. I would never watch a basketball game but I would consider going one on one on a court with a friend.
We now live in a world where even the smallest competition "inspires" someone to spend 10 times more on it than the average... bikes trailered to things like sturgis... parking lot autocrosses with people trailering in their cars...
On reflection.... I guess the racing sports are about ripe for a bunch of women drivers. Just like the world is ready for electric start, softail Harleys ridden by women.
If you never have to use it.... upper body strength is unnecessary.
lazs
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Originally posted by lazs2
I was kinda watching and participating in the various racing games when the little guy who built em in his garage had a chance.
lazs
Oh man, I`m gonna have to agree that is some of the best racing, bar none. Hard to find these days unless you are lucky enough to be around some still small tracks.
Some of the best racing ever around here was at a dirt track stuck back off in the sticks about 15 miles on a sand road back in "the days". Old coupes and such , chopped down and built under shade trees, barns and makeshift garages.
I was also lucky enough to witness the makings of WoO. This was before big money sponsors got involved and turned it into total commercialism as far as backing, etc. goes. Watching Slammin Sammy, King, Madden duke it out when they still did their own thing was awesome.
I still love to watch WoO races, but it`s just not the same now.
We have one track around here that had, until recently mostly homegrown sprints, but it has slowly became big business like the rest. Sort of a shame, but understandable from a business perspective I guess.
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I am kinda getting interested in that camaro mustang challenge thing... You can even have a car built for like 8-10 grand that will be guarenteed to run in the front of the pack... their are sever restrictions on modifications and 40 grand won't make the car any faster than ten. Most are built or at least maintained in the driveway.
You won't be seeing a lot of women in this game. There is no point. Some boyfriend will ineveitably tho... work for months and do all the grunt work and then buy his girlfriend/wife/daughter a helmet and let her run. IMO... she doesn't "deserve" to.
lazs
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Hey look at this, woman beats man in a boxing match.
"In the much hallooed Male vs Female four round match, Margaret MacGregor (127 3/4 lbs) of Bremerton, WA battered Loi Chow (123 lbs) of Vancouver, B.C. and took every round to win a unanimous decision. Three judges all scored it 40-36 for Macgregor. "
http://www.cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/kd1021299.htm
But that's unpossible! :eek:
:D
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Originally posted by Jackal1
Such as?
Such as, she stalled the car in the pits, made contact with a lapped car, then knocked her nose off and took out two cars with a spin during a yellow.
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thrawn... I find it pretty much impossible. I guess asians lack any upper body strength. Don't know much about asians but now I know that even girls can beat em up in a boxing match.
lazs
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Originally posted by FUNKED1
Such as, she stalled the car in the pits, made contact with a lapped car, then knocked her nose off and took out two cars with a spin during a yellow.
Yep, she stalled the car........and recovered from it.
Yep she made contact with a car...and recovered from it. That`s part of racing. Old saying..If you ain`t rubbing, you aint racing. That was the either the 3rd or 4th side brushing contact that was made in the race. She was the only one that regained control without wrecking out. :)
Her nose wing was lost in the restart contact. Allison and another driver in front of her was playing grab bellybutton instead of steadily coming up to speed. He got his butt in a crack and jammed the brakes.
She lost quite a bit of time in the pits and still recovered and ended up back in the front.
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Originally posted by lazs2
thrawn... I find it pretty much impossible. I guess asians lack any upper body strength. Don't know much about asians but now I know that even girls can beat em up in a boxing match.
lazs
Didn't you see *******? Dunn got his bellybutton beat by an asian woman.
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"In the much hallooed Male vs Female four round match, Margaret MacGregor (127 3/4 lbs) of Bremerton, WA battered Loi Chow (123 lbs) of Vancouver, B.C. and took every round to win a unanimous decision. Three judges all scored it 40-36 for Macgregor. "
That is what I was looking at.
I don't think it is a great idea to force the blurring of the sexes. Somebody allways gets hurt.
lazs
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She's too sexy to be true. Unless she's lesbian, just like I am. :rofl
But honestly, I'm too sick of all that female power games. Men are men, and women are women (with a few exceptions).;)