Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: tactic on June 01, 2005, 12:57:14 AM
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I would like to know how many people jump Countries when they see a win comming? I could be wrong..... but it Seems to be alot of them and seems to be happening alot lately, its always happened but not to this extent IMO.
I wonder also, how many of these jumpers do not realize they have to be in that country for 12 hours min to gain perks? The impact (ENY) it has sometimes on the one country is terrable , it was huge tuesday night at 10 pm pac time even, ENY was up to 36 at one point for the knights. Not a gripe, just asking. Starts more less even numbers in all three countries, til one gets moving then , seems like the numbers rise on winning country and number lessen in others.
Again, I may be wrong, but the losing country always loses some players they just do, always have. The country in second really didnt lose too many players , because they always try to hault the country in the lead. The winning country usually stayed pretty level in numbers, maybe gaining a few but only because of other countries logging, but gained very few players from jumping most of the time.
There was a few times(in the ol' days) when it seemed alot of people jumped to winning country , but it was not a usual occurance in huge numbers, like it seems now..
For the guys that get there country to that point of winning, are penalized by the ENY, because of those people that jump on the band wagon and it will gain them nothing! notta!! like i said it may just be my perception.
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It did kinda seem that way tonight didn't it?
Hmmm, I wonder too.
But I bet most of the jumpers, don't post or even read the BBS.
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The balance is lost in MA, has nothing to do with country jumping
last year rooks ussed to have #s, now knits have #s most of the time,
last evening we( bish) were outnumbered by knits 2 to 1, and got reset ,
The ENY works, but must be other better ways to keep teams even
do you guys want 2 to 1 and free jets?
join the Bish and get vulched on most of the bases in front line
Enjoy the #s, and the TBMs:aok
ps. country jumpers in close to reset situations ,are just lossers, cowards, deserters
i would hang them from their small ballz on CV's radar tower and shoot them with the 8'' gun
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i think everything is working just fine....my last 5 flights i got like 30 kills because everyone i was fighting was stuck in Spit1s! ahhaha. So we were very outnumberd but they couldnt do much. BTW...i saw the eny hit 40 tonight. =) Poor knits.
Tonight the Knits had more people on than the Rooks and the Bish combined. Ive never seen that before.
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40 eny?
hmmm, I wonder if theres a cap on how far eny limiter goes.
if it ever hits 60 (or 65?), it'll shut a whole country down. with nada to fly or drive.
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Yes 40 ENY last night for Nits. Trying to defend a vh with only
T-34s is hard.
The ENY system sucks.:mad:
SCDR
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the ENY worked as it should and it was fun flying Tempest's for as little as 20 perks :aok
As for the numbers, i think that there were many country jumpers last nite, at one point i looked and the knits had over 160 players while the rooks and bish both had in the 70's :confused:
only good thing is that there are no more whines about the "rook horde" now it's the "knit horde" :rofl
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first off, what makes you think that people are switching countries for the reset, and not just plain logging off.
i know in the past if the country i was in was losing badly, about to be reset, i logged off in frustration, why stay and give away free vulches.
i'm not saying there are no "country switchers" but i have not seen someone i shot down suddenly on my side in a long long time.
thats just my thoughts on it. more people log off in frustration than "switch"
also.. on the ENY thing, it does CAP out at IIRC 40 or 45. it will never disable flight for an entire country.
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Generally, I'll switch over to another country as soon as numbers go awry or definitely when ENY kicks in.
I usually catch some rude comments from some of the arm-chair generals, as if this wasn't a game.
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Originally posted by SCDR
Yes 40 ENY last night for Nits. Trying to defend a vh with only
T-34s is hard.
The ENY system sucks.:mad:
SCDR
LOL:lol
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Originally posted by WarRaidr
the ENY worked as it should and it was fun flying Tempest's for as little as 20 perks :aok
As for the numbers, i think that there were many country jumpers last nite, at one point i looked and the knits had over 160 players while the rooks and bish both had in the 70's :confused:
only good thing is that there are no more whines about the "rook horde" now it's the "knit horde" :rofl
Yeah, ENY works wonders. Lets see what happened last night.
Some people left Bish and Rooks to go fly with the Nits to get the perks even though the ENY would limit their planes. (Oposite result of what the ENY limits were put in place for)
Some people logged off cause they got tired of getting vulched or overwelmed by the Nit hords that the ENY 'eliminated'.
You had fun flying Tempests but thats not related to the ENY.
I had fun flying a KI61 against 2 NIKS 2 SPITs 3 lalas 1 P51 and 3 Tempests waiting overhead for the cherry pick.
When I had enough of that, I had some fun hitting Tigers with an M8. That went really well.
Bish got reset anyway. ENY just made the pain of fighting in those conditions for all Bish rooks and Nits, just last a little longer.
Over all, a great success of the ENY system last night. :rolleyes:
I think it only works when a country is outnumbered, but still has a lot of fields left. When they are down to 10 fields, their forces are consintraited. I don't care what plane is available but having to fight in a 205 or KI61 against 3 Temps wile engaged with Spits and Niks on the deck is kind of redicilus. Maybe ENY should stop at 20 or 25 or what ever. People are not going to switch sides. If they did not in the past 6 months, they are not going to tomorrow.
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Some people left Bish and Rooks to go fly with the Nits to get the perks even though the ENY would limit their planes. (Oposite result of what the ENY limits were put in place for)
But Ded ... they are total tools who have no clue ... jumping sides to gain perks for winning the war will not happen unless you jumped side 12 hours before the reset.
So ... they not only locked themselves into an ENY restriction, they got no perk points either ... like I said ... TOTAL TOOLS.
If you were a Knit and flying under those conditions, you were then flying in an area where the Nit Horde WAS NOT ... and where the opposing team WAS hording.
Chit happens ...
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Funny thing about jumping sides... The side jumpers are never good enough. Side jumping potatos...
Our squad will be on the side with the lowest numbers 95% of the time. Unless they are fairly even, then we can be found flying Knight.
Loyalty to a chess peice has got to be one of the silliest things in the game.
I constantly see people complaining on all sides, "This game sucks, BS ENY limiter... Wont let me fly my plane" on channel 200. Those very same people are also in squads that will boot you out of the squad if you do change sides.
Let me ask you people a question. Where does the "I am a true to life WW2 fighter pilot/bomber/artillery/elite Panzer strike force, loyalty to one side and one side only" stop and the fact that this is only a game pick up?
I know the MAW will not allow side switching. Atleast that is what Kakmaw stated the other night. IF a member of that squad does switch sides, they are booted. Which is fine. I guess some people like more rules in a game. But I also see some of these people complain about not being able to fly what they want, when they want, due to the eny limiter.
I know bish, and Nits, who have been on the same side since beta. How boring that must be. Never to fly with the guys who've shot you down, and who you've shot down.
Anyways, its squads and players with that mindset that allow the numbers to get as lopsided as they do.
Btw, Ghi, when was the last time you flew for another country other than Bish? :)
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Originally posted by Morpheus
Funny thing about jumping sides... The side jumpers are never good enough. Side jumping potatos...
Our squad will be on the side with the lowest numbers 95% of the time. Unless they are fairly even, then we can be found flying Knight.
Loyalty to a chess peice has got to be one of the silliest things in the game.
I constantly see people complaining on all sides, "This game sucks, BS ENY limiter... Wont let me fly my plane" on channel 200. Those very same people are also in squads that will boot you out of the squad if you do change sides.
Let me ask you people a question. Where does the "I am a true to life WW2 fighter pilot/bomber/artillery/elite Panzer strike force, loyalty to one side and one side only" stop and the fact that this is only a game pick up?
I know the MAW will not allow side switching. Atleast that is what Kakmaw stated the other night. IF a member of that squad does switch sides, they are booted. Which is fine. I guess some people like more rules in a game. But I also see some of these people complain about not being able to fly what they want, when they want, due to the eny limiter.
I know bish, and Nits, who have been on the same side since beta. How boring that must be. Never to fly with the guys who've shot you down, and who you've shot down.
Anyways, its squads and players with that mindset that allow the numbers to get as lopsided as they do.
Btw, Ghi, when was the last time you flew for another country other than Bish? :)
I'm taking this stance as well. WoT flies rook all the time. There is nothing wrong with that at all, and they are great to fly with, but I've started flying for the side which has the least #'s when I'm on, so I decided to unaffiliate myself with WoT so there wouldn't be any hard feelings (I doubt that there would have been).
I guess what I'm saying is that there are a lot of guys out there who scream "SPY SPY!" when they see someone switch sides when really all they are trying to do is even out the numbers a little bit. There are only three squads I can think of that switch sides on a regular basis to even out numbers. Would be good to see a few more pick up that trait, even though it can be hard for members who are just logging on to track down the rest of the squad if they went country jumping.
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I always go to the low number crowd. I also don't get the loyalty to a chess piece bit. Not much fun being part of the steam roller when the numbers are that far off as they've been the last couple times I've flown.
Then again I don't see much point in winning the start over either.
Dan/CorkyJr
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I will say when the ENY limiter does kick in and I happen to be on that side, I do enjoy flying the higher ENY planes. Most of the time I am in a PJ, or a 47, so I rarely am bothered by any ENY restrictions.
Last night the numbers were so out of proportion that getting a P47D25 out of the hanger was tough. So I started flying SBD's... and planes that clearly have no advantage whatso ever other than maybe a tail gun. But what fun it was to shoot someone down with 2x50 cals.. or use the dive breaks on the SBD to make a spit5 over shoot when you are already doing 150mph.
Sure, you die alot, and may not get as many kills in a plane like that, but it is some great fun.
There are plenty of things in life to piss and maon about. This is a game. One that is here for your enjoyment. To let something so silly as not being able to fly a Nik, a P51, or take a tiger out of the hanger should be the last thing for anyone to get peeved about. Just make the best out of any situation. Laugh when everything is going bad, and you are dying repeatedly. And when you are forced to fly planes that you think suck... think of how fun it will be when you get a chance to shoot someone down with a D3A. :)
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Originally posted by Morpheus
[.
Btw, Ghi, when was the last time you flew for another country other than Bish? :) [/B]
I was talking about players changing side just b4 reset, for 20 perks that's cheap in my oppinion
I fight for my country , i'm soldier not mercenary, not for score or personal glory,
If all bish switch country i don't care i'll be the last 1 to defend,
I love Bishland, sexy sheeps, tall trees, just few reasons to defend it, lol
What to do now? should join the Knits horde, and help them vulch the poor newbs Bish??
I would feel like helping a bunch of horny gangsters rape my handicaped sister
I flew rook,they call me "spy", last year i think, (i was drunk in map room and puke on wrong switches),
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Don;t get me wrong. I am not complaining about not being able to fly what I like. KI61 is fine for me and I don;t really need the ENY to make me fly a 202 or SBD. Just saing, it does not really work. It was a good idea trying to do somethng about a problem. It just did not fix it. Maybe it improved things a little but not fix. Here is why I think it will never fix the problem.
Look at it from the side of the people that want to win the war. Now, half the time, I am not even aware there is a war going on until I get yelled at for not strafing a town, but the majority of the people do. They are in the MA to fight and win the war. (I know we may not like it, but thats how things look to me). Asking a person to switch sides 2 hours before the war he fought so hard for is won, is redicilus. Why would they do it? Some of them spent days milking and porking fields to help in the 'bigger cause'.
So, again, ENY is not going to fix things because of the mentality of the MA (right or wrong is up to you to decide how you like to play the game). As for me, I actually did have fun tring to dodge the pickers and fighters. Lasting 20 or 30 seconds in those conditions is a win in my book :D
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Yep the ENY worked great last night.
Many of my squad members just logged off. When you are in a squad, you can't change sides. If you don't like flying Spit 1's against Tempests, well, you just log off.
And maybe when you log off because of ENY, you will play another game, and maybe you will find you like it more than AH.
I can see ENY getting down to say 10 maybe 12 at max. Or just scrap it. Neither will happen.
Or just find another game to play when you can't play this one.
Tonight the AK's switch to Rook. We will fly with them for a month, no mattter what the ENY value or numbers get to be. That is our reward for being consistantly on one side; we get screwed by the ENY, or banged by the Hordes.
Like most attempts to control human behavior, the innocent get screwed by the laws more than the guilty.
Why should AH2 be any different.???
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Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+
Yep the ENY worked great last night.
Many of my squad members just logged off. When you are in a squad, you can't change sides. If you don't like flying Spit 1's against Tempests, well, you just log off.
And maybe when you log off because of ENY, you will play another game, and maybe you will find you like it more than AH.
I can see ENY getting down to say 10 maybe 12 at max. Or just scrap it. Neither will happen.
Or just find another game to play when you can't play this one.
Tonight the AK's switch to Rook. We fly them for a month. No mattter what the ENY value or numbers get to be. That is our reward for being consistantly on one side. We get screwed by the ENY, or banged by the Hordes.
Like most attempts to control human behavior, the innocent get screwed by the laws more than the guilty.
Why should AH2 be any different.???
Why can't you switch sides if you are in a squad? I see any number of squads that do this and often see guys from the same squad flying for two different sides at the same time.
Dan/CorkyJr
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Dan's right, AKFoder. I've always felt that one of the great innovations of Aces High was allowing squads and squad members to change countries without penalty or difficulty. On some nights where you can't find a fight, you can make a fight.
And fratricide rules!
-- Todd/Leviathn
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Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+
That is our reward for being consistantly on one side; we get screwed by the ENY, or banged by the Hordes.
Why do you need a reward for staing with one side?
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NEVER have switched to the 'winning' side. Most nights like last night, Rooks were badly outnumbered so I switched to Rook. When numbers are basically even I usually fly Knits. I think it is about the same for most BKs.
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Originally posted by Dead Man Flying
Dan's right, AKFoder. I've always felt that one of the great innovations of Aces High was allowing squads and squad members to change countries without penalty or difficulty. On some nights where you can't find a fight, you can make a fight.
And fratricide rules!
-- Todd/Leviathn
The AK's go back well over 10 years. I have been an AK for over 7. We fight together, we protect each other, we have fun together. We are more than just a few guys who have the same squad name. I really don't expect non-AK's to understand. I have cleared AK's sixes and they mine in Flying Circus, Red Baron 3D, and now Aces High. We have shared many a triumph and many a defeat together. I have met many of them in person. I have had the heartbreak of having some of them die.
I seriously don't expect too many of you to understand what it is like to be an Arabian Knight. We decided to keep our name in spite of anti-Arab sentiments after 9-11. We are more than an on-line squad.
We fight together, we fly together. We do have the occasionaly planned even when we fly against each other. But other than planned events we don't kill each other.
To switch sides and fly against our brother and sister AK's would be to spit on all we believe in, and who we are.
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Originally posted by dedalos
Why do you need a reward for staing with one side?
Yep, and the reward we get is having a certain integrity. One that comes from making a commitment. To our fellow squadmates, and to the side we are flying on this month. If you are flying Rook this month, the AKs will be there with you. If you are flying Bishop or Knight, we will have the pleasure of being your opponent. We will not turn against the side we are flying with.
Our American society no longer believes in loyalty or commitment. But it is an AK tradition.
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Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+
The AK's go back well over 10 years. I have been an AK for over 7. We fight together, we protect each other, we have fun together. We are more than just a few guys who have the same squad name. I really don't expect non-AK's to understand. I have cleared AK's sixes and they mine in Flying Circus, Red Baron 3D, and now Aces High. We have shared many a triumph and many a defeat together. I have met many of them in person. I have had the heartbreak of having some of them die.
I seriously don't expect too many of you to understand what it is like to be an Arabian Knight. We decided to keep our name in spite of anti-Arab sentiments after 9-11. We are more than an on-line squad.
We fight together, we fly together. We do have the occasionaly planned even when we fly against each other. But other than planned events we don't kill each other.
To switch sides and fly against our brother and sister AK's would be to spit on all we believe in, and who we are.
Yer serious about this? There are numerous squads that go back 10 years or more. I don't know what that has to do with anything.
Having fun in a game should be what it's all about. The loyalty is to the fun folks are having. Since no one is really dying, what's the differenice?
One of the great things back in Airwarrior for the squad I was a part of was shooting each other down when you least expected it. It made for a good laugh :)
Kinda miss that in AH :)
Ah well, to each his own I guess
Dan/CorkyJr
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Holy way too much seriousness, Batman!
-- Todd/Leviathn
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Originally posted by Dead Man Flying
Holy way too much seriousness, Batman!
-- Todd/Leviathn
Bet they never ever took a mass YAK flight and tried to talk mock Russian the entire time :)
Dan/CorkyJr
Waxing nostalgic for just a sec
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Originally posted by Guppy35
Yer serious about this? There are numerous squads that go back 10 years or more. I don't know what that has to do with anything.
Dan/CorkyJr
Each on-line squad has it's own traditions.
Ours includes loyalty to each other during on-line play.
That does not mean that squads that fly against each other on-line lack loyalty. Certainly how other squads like to have fun, is up to them. If they enjoy such activities as flying against each other in the MA, I certainly have no prejorative opinions of what they are doing.
On the other hand, when it was suggested that we AK's individually switch sides because of HT's ENY or to balance numbers. I just tried to explain to the community that is not what we AK's do.
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Originally posted by Morpheus
LOL:lol
Dweeb!! :D
SCDR
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I was talking about players changing side just b4 reset, for 20 perks that's cheap in my oppinion
Impossible ... YA CAN"T GET PERKS FOR WINNING THE WAR UNLESS YOU JUMP SIDE 12 HOURS PRIOR TO THE RESET.
They are jumping cause they are spineless jellyfish and only feel safe when travelling in a horde ... that can't take the pain of having a horde beat them down.
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Originally posted by Guppy35
Bet they never ever took a mass YAK flight and tried to talk mock Russian the entire time :)
Dan/CorkyJr
Waxing nostalgic for just a sec
Or played "drone" :)
x0037
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i think it works great...was just 100+ nits, 90 bish and less than 50 rooks... i landed 7 kills in 38 G for 111 perks...works great ;) horde mongers die all the same, now you just get more perks for kills...to bad i dont use them to often.
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Originally posted by Guppy35
snip
One of the great things back in Airwarrior for the squad I was a part of was shooting each other down when you least expected it. It made for a good laugh :)
Kinda miss that in AH :)
Ah well, to each his own I guess
Dan/CorkyJr
Yeah, kinda like scenario end-frame silliness where a successful team turns on itself like a pack of jackals, last man to go PNG wins :)
culero
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Due to personal reasons I can't control , I don't get to spend to much time these days flying. While I think the ENY thing has worked for the most part , last night I had a chance to fly when I got home from work. ONLY to find that the plane I like to fly the best wasn't even close to being ENY friendly.
I think it got to 40. Now , I don't mind as I said , but not flying very much and then logging in to find that the only things to fly are things I don't enjoy at all , was a bit frustrating.
Just my 2 cents.
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Don't forget another reason for the high ENY was all the people on nits who stayed logged on somewhere to get the perks later but really went to bed. Drives ENY up quite a bit I think, it's quite prevalent to do that. At one time the roster had 170 nits on, I hopped around the active bases, no way were that many in the air or on the ground. My guess woul dbe there were about 120 or so players actually active on nit side.
I think most of the people who've played for a bit know you can't get perks by switching just before the reset, but GOSH DAWG there was a lot of 2 week noobs on nit side last nite. Never seen so many at one time.
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I have met many of them in person. I have had the heartbreak of having some of them die.
I try to help my squadies out as much as I can. The great thing about flying with many of the guys in my squad is that they can handle them selves on their own.
Point being, I try not to let them die if they are in trouble. But I'll laugh my arse off after they're down. And they will do the same for me.
We have yet to hold a memorial service due to a downed BK.
Funny thing about this game. You get as many lives as you wish.
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In regards to the ENY formula, isn't it calculated on the number of players currently out on a sortie, as opposed to total population?
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what I am saying , people switch never realizing the rule for receiving perks for winning the war. I dont think even some of the veteran pilots know that you have to be in a country 12 hours before you can gain perks in a win. Not that Vets switch to get the perks, just think quite a few dont even know. And probley dont care, because they dont jump country for a win.
When you go to other country your there for 12 hours, before you can go back to where you can from, if you wanted to.
I seem to gain knowledge, here and there still, about things i never knew about this game, after playing for years, one thing I learned lately for example. shft right click saves a step in checking on bases<---- never knew that short cut.
Its not the switching countries thats the issue, its the Reason and Time at which they decide to do the deed,.... its not "switch" to other country, but "jump" to other country.
There is a difference ,.. Jumped is >( they never planed on staying in that country because they wanted to now be a Knight, Rook, Bish,.. its because they "think" there gunna get those bulk Perks (25 to be exact). soon as it posted buy the system you have won the war, and after the 12 hours are up, there on the way back to what ever country they came from. 95% of the time i bet.
Switched is... Either you or your squad goes to other country to fly. Period! and the decision is made for reasons other then thinking your on the losing countries side or those bulk perks look so good to ya. Nothing wrong at all, with switching countries, one person or a whole squad.
What makes me think people are jumping is when there are 75-90-65 numbers players on bish-knits-rook respectivly. And the 75b's are losing, and 65r's is not slowing down the 90k's offensive roll of bases. Then all of a sudden the numbers go from 75b's-90k's-65r's and becomes this 45b's-132k's-50r's just seems suspect to me.
If I see it go like this: start # players 75b's-90k's-65r's, then the numbers change to this 45b's-92k's-50r's after a war win looks likley, thats cool, but the other, well, just seems, hummmm suspect.
If i remember right ,this being stuck in a country for 12 hours after jumping was not always the case I think you were able to switch back and forth? long ago eh? I dunno this for sure. so they started this 12 hour thingy? to stop people from jumping.
The Eny is fine, (I guess) I dont like it, but i deal with it, but when it occures because of "Jumpers" it sux.
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Originally posted by RedTop
Due to personal reasons I can't control , I don't get to spend to much time these days flying. While I think the ENY thing has worked for the most part , last night I had a chance to fly when I got home from work. ONLY to find that the plane I like to fly the best wasn't even close to being ENY friendly.
I think it got to 40. Now , I don't mind as I said , but not flying very much and then logging in to find that the only things to fly are things I don't enjoy at all , was a bit frustrating.
Just my 2 cents.
So why didn't you switch to Rook and fly with us? ;)
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Originally posted by Guppy35
Bet they never ever took a mass YAK flight and tried to talk mock Russian the entire time :)
Dan/CorkyJr
Waxing nostalgic for just a sec
LOL! I remember going up with Levi and JDawg in IL2s in AW3, speaking in horrible russian accents on vox. Terrorizing hawaii in Big Pac =)
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Originally posted by Morpheus
We have yet to hold a memorial service due to a downed BK.
Count yourself lucky, but if you stay together long enough, you will lose someone.
Try this url AK Farm Buyer (http://www.aksquad.com/fb.php)
Hans was a fine gentleman. I remember when he came all the way from Sweden to visit the AK's in Dallas and Oklihoma.
He was a Brigade Officer and fellow Hall of Honor member. Note that the AK's do more than just flying SIMs. A bunch are in World of Warcraft now. Many flew in AH2, but have now moved to the WOW sim.
Hanz was severely handicapped physically but certainly not mentally. He was a delightful human being. Hanz died because he was suffering from Duchenne muscular dystrophy that was constantly reducing the strength of his muscles.
I believe that when any AK flys, Hanz is his wingman.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
In regards to the ENY formula, isn't it calculated on the number of players currently out on a sortie, as opposed to total population?
I think your right hub.
It's the players in the air at any given moment that calculates the ENY. If it's not it should be. Who cares if a player is logged on but sound asleep just waiting for the perks?
kj714 it's easy to check the number of players that are currently in the air.
Right click on the map, then click "Country Status" and it will tell you the number of people flying. No guessing involved.
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if Knits have more players than rook and bish combined i think the solution better than ENY=====> rook/bish stop fighting and Gangbang the knits, big time, kill them all:lol
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Originally posted by BigR
LOL! I remember going up with Levi and JDawg in IL2s in AW3, speaking in horrible russian accents on vox. Terrorizing hawaii in Big Pac =)
Rather a Nomadic thing to do don't you think BigR? :)
Dan/CorkyJr
+Tiff
Whatever happened to old JDawg anyway?
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Originally posted by ghi
if Knits have more players than rook and bish combined i think the solution better than ENY=====> rook/bish stop fighting and Gangbang the knits, big time, kill them all:lol
numbers or no, yall already do at times. :p
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Originally posted by Guppy35
Rather a Nomadic thing to do don't you think BigR? :)
Dan/CorkyJr
+Tiff
Whatever happened to old JDawg anyway?
JD played AH for a while but in november EQ2 came out and thats what he plays now.
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orrrr you can just learn how to fly the less superduper planes well enough so the ENY rarely if ever effects you.
I fly mostly the 109F so I've never had the ENY limiter effect me.
That being said
I've never been in favor of the eny limiter.
I've always said "a horde is a horde is a horde"
Be it 50 P51's or 50 P40's.
thats still alot of planes.
But if your really after perkies then switching to the winning side isnt the way to do it.
Stay on the side witht he lower numbers and you get the benifit of being able to fly cheap perk rides as welll as increased perk points per kill.
and if you stay in a less uber ride you get even more
I dont really care about perks one way or the other cept as a source of amusement. But I've had more then a couple flights in the 109F4 when we were outnumbered where even after being shot down and killed I still got 20 perks for the flight for just a few kills.
and had a few landed that have gotten me near 40.
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This discussion has become very deep. Rules, ethics, game play, and nearly as broad. Very serious stuff.:confused:
Very serious.:rolleyes:
Very.:eek:
lol:D
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Ahh yes, just one big happy Aces High family
(http://www.eestec.ethz.ch/bigshow/large/group1_b.jpg)
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Didn't HT also lower the time between country switches to 6 hrs to encourage people to change?
I mean geez if you log on and find your plane isn't available, switch, 6 hrs later you can go back - WHERES THE PROBLEM?
Maybe not enough people realize it.
Maybe it should also be made more known that you have to be on a country for x hours until you can get perks for a reset.
Or once a country gets down to x number of fields, disable country switching, that'll f*** em :) .
'Fractal' map is an anomaly as far as Bish as conscerned, we just don't get it. Therefore we get pushed back lose more fields, people switch and make the numbers difference even worse.
GHI - Bish and Rooks teaming up in situations like few nights ago where Knits had more than than other two sides combined.
Aint ever ever gonna happen, that would take commonsense.
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I absolutely LOVE it! ENY generates almost as many whines as the LA7. There are those who whined when there was no ENY because they were outnumbered. Now they whine because they have numbers and ENY is in effect. How can you beat that? Well, maybe you can add those that SWEAR HTC is out to get THEM with ENY. That's fun too.
Switching sides for reset points? Oh brother. I wouldn't switch sides for 750 perk points, never mind 75.
I fly for the same country, whether we have 5 fields or 205 fields, whether we have 50 flying or 350 flying. I take the good with the bad. I just really don't care. It has nothing to do with "loyalty to a chess piece":rolleyes: .
Other than dragging out an F4U-C or an F4U-4, I almost always fly a plane with an ENY of 15 or higher. Most often, unless I'm flying an F4U, I'm in a plane with an ENY in the 30's. In fact, now that we have the G and J P-38, I don't really care about ENY at all.
But it sure does provide some absolutely beautiful whines.
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Originally posted by killnu
i think it works great...was just 100+ nits, 90 bish and less than 50 rooks... i landed 7 kills in 38 G for 111 perks...works great ;) horde mongers die all the same, now you just get more perks for kills...to bad i dont use them to often.
The ENY limits have nothing to do with how many perks you get.
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Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
I just really don't care. It has nothing to do with "loyalty to a chess piece":rolleyes:
Honest and sincere question, then what is it that makes you stay?
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I dont really care what country, but my squad is Rook at the moment. There are only two countries in my book, the green guys and the red guys, I dont really care which chess peice they fly for. ENY limits dont bother me either, I prefer the high ENY planes like the F4U-1, P-40E, P-47D-11, 109F and such.
What I do find interesting about this whole situation, is the whining about the ENY. Remember the HOWLS when the Rooks had numbers? People were acting like the world was coming to an end so HT added the ENY limiter. Now, nobody says a peep about the Knights when they consistantly have numbers and its as bad or worse than when the Rooks had em. Why is that?
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Originally posted by SuperDud
Honest and sincere question, then what is it that makes you stay?
It's not really something that can be explained in so many words. I just never have cared for jumping from side to side. Staying in "one place" is an experience in itself. I don't move to the side with less advantage, or to the side with more advantage. I stay where I am, come feast or famine. Even when I left the squad almost a year before AW ended, I stayed in the same country.
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Originally posted by Grits
I dont really care what country, but my squad is Rook at the moment. There are only two countries in my book, the green guys and the red guys, I dont really care which chess peice they fly for. ENY limits dont bother me either, I prefer the high ENY planes like the F4U-1, P-40E, P-47D-11, 109F and such.
What I do find interesting about this whole situation, is the whining about the ENY. Remember the HOWLS when the Rooks had numbers? People were acting like the world was coming to an end so HT added the ENY limiter. Now, nobody says a peep about the Knights when they consistantly have numbers and its as bad or worse than when the Rooks had em. Why is that?
LOL Grits. That's the truth, ain't it? According to HiTech, the whines did NOT bring about the ENY system. I guess, if he says so, I'll let it go at that. I said when it started that the ENY system was the wrong way to go about "curing" the "disease", but that it was an easy to use placebo.
Has it equalized the sides? I guess, for a while. To an extent. Has it solved the problem? I don't think so. Was it the right "fix"? I don't think so. Was it possibly the best quick stopgap fix to allow them to concentrate on TOD? Could be. Might even be worth it if TOD was truly accelerated considerably.
Now, the tables are turned, and the knits have the numbers most often. So now they are happy unless they can't get their plane or vehicle of choice. So 1st place in numerical superiority has changed hands, for a while, the previous second place and the previous first place have swapped. What did third place get? For the time being, still stuck in third place most often. Eventually, this too will change. Because of the ENY system? Not hardly. Maybe next time first and third will swap, who knows.
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Captain consider a few very simple items.
With out the ENY. When a side imbalnced happed, the ones complaining most were the underdogs. Could they do anything to help fix the imbalance?
Answere no . Changing sides would just make the problem worse.
With the ENY system. Those complaining , are now the Big side. Can they do somthing to help balance the sides.
Answere yes.
Will normal eb and flow of the arena occasionaly imbalance sides.
Answere yes.
Will the ENY system damapen those peeks, absolutly.
HiTech
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Originally posted by ghi
if Knits have more players than rook and bish combined i think the solution better than ENY=====> rook/bish stop fighting and Gangbang the knits, big time, kill them all:lol
Ghi thats the best sollution I've heard thus far! I've flown for Rooks, Knits, and Bish and its no different on any side. There will be people you like and dislike on each lol.
(http://www.sleepyhollowchamber.com/headless.jpg)
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HiTech you for got something....
Will people always whine no matter what... absolutely...
While I do agree with you on the over all effect of the ENY limmiter I think there is a even bigger problem at hand.
Numbers in one region of the map.
No matter how the server poulation looks there are always hoards at fields with little resistance. This gets even worse when the ENY kicks in.
When it kicks in the pilots on the bigger side hoard up even more because they are in "WAAAAAAAHMBULANCE mode" due to the fact that they are scared to fly a "lesser" plane. So the big side hoards up.
The smaller side cant fight that hoard... at least so they think... which results in them hoarding up at some base the bigger side aint defending... The bigger side doesnt dare to defend against a hoard because they got lesser planes...
What does this result in?
Horrible gameplay.
The options are take on a hoard alone (or with your squadies that are online, still 1 to 5 odds) or fly with a hoard. There are no other fights to find. Trust me I do look hard for the smaller fights. My option is most often to take on a hoard.
I dont know if this could be prevented but a more regional ENY limmiter would be better. I dont know if this is code wise possible within a reasonable time frame (I say it like that because everything can be coded with code;) ).
For example if there are 2-1 odds for the bish vs the knights in a region then the bishes should be ENY capped in that region, no matter how the server popuation looks.
How this region is counted? That is up to you to decide from the code.
But what a cap like this would do is that it would penelize hoards and give incentive for the players to move away from the hoard if its not meeting resistance or fly to the hoard form a field further away.
That imho would rock and help gameplay a great deal.
Tex
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Judging by what I've seen, I don't think it really has dampened the spikes as much. I don't see one country outnumbering the other two combined as being any less of a numbers spike. So maybe it's a different country now, and maybe the new underdog just fights instead of whining.
Further, fighting 5 or more players in ENY 35+ planes alone in an ENY 5 or less plane leaves you still facing 5:1 odds, and just as likely dead, if you are an average player. You MIGHT live a minute or two longer, and maybe even score some hits, or possibly a kill. But you'll still be just as dead. Facing 5 P-40E's in a Spit XI is not a great deal better than facing 5 LA7's in a Spit XI. And even if the ENY system converts it from 5 LA7's to 4 P-40E's, big deal.
When a country with as many people as both of the others smells a reset, or whatever drives them, they'll fly whatever they can to go for the reset. Unless at least one of the other two countries is well organized, they'll still be over run. The best the ENY system offers is a prolonging. Oh, and the opportunity to feel better because you're getting killed in a plane with an ENY rating 1/8 that of your 4 or 5 enemies because they can't have planes with an ENY rating nearly as good as yours.
Hey, you had to do something, so you made a decision and followed through. You could have done worse, or you could have done better. It worked out okay. That makes you human, and a pretty decent business man.
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So last night the Bishes were defending 2 fields and a horde was attacking a third owned by another country?
That twirks me... If those tools attacking the third field had been defending one of the fields instead of racking up kills we could have held out against the swarm of GVs and bombers better; maybe even taken it to the Knights. Instead we "lost".
But had a blast doing so :D
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Base
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Originally posted by Arcades057
So last night the Bishes were defending 2 fields and a horde was attacking a third owned by another country?
That twirks me... If those tools attacking the third field had been defending one of the fields instead of racking up kills we could have held out against the swarm of GVs and bombers better; maybe even taken it to the Knights. Instead we "lost".
But had a blast doing so :D
Only defense in this game is a good offense. Sooner or later that tenacious defense will collapse and if you haven't taken at least one base in the interim, your number of bases will absolutely decrease.
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Sorry, I thought the thread said "Country Humping"
carry on...
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Best way to overcome the one-sided fights is to take the land grab completely out of the game. What is the point to hoarding when you can't get anymore perks?
Then again, I'm fed up with the land grabbing, good for nothing arm-chair generals that get 'wet' from taking unopposed bases with 15 guys while a few sectors away the other side does the same thing.
The object to AH is to enjoy the enviornment while shooting another virtual player down; learning and developing new manuvers to make such an objective easier, is the progression.
Anyone can take a base from day 1, and the skills for doing so don't progress.
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WTF??
The object to AH is to capture the map and win...............
quah???
DA is the place for knife fights
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Originally posted by Howitzer
Only defense in this game is a good offense. Sooner or later that tenacious defense will collapse and if you haven't taken at least one base in the interim, your number of bases will absolutely decrease.
While the theory is true, reality usually turns out way differently.
A few hours before the reset the A1/A2/A5 fiasco proved it. For every single base we took, we lost on average 3.
Why? Because 90% of the Bish were flying against 1 base (A2) that they never took, and in fact lost A1 behind them.
We lost A16, got it back real quickly, but didn't get reinforcements to hold it, therefore within 10 mins we lost it again, and still had 90% of the Bish at A5.
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I can say I personaly enjoy being able to go where I want. I got a thrill out of defending against the horde for a long time, now that I got over the chess piece loyalty I can switch up to make things more enjoyable ( kinda the point). Why stay somewhere when everyone is whining about defense, conversely, why stay somewhere where your in a hoard hoping to get a few rounds off at a plane upping.
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Originally posted by hitech
With the ENY system. Those complaining , are now the Big side. Can they do somthing to help balance the sides.
Answere yes.
HiTech
I think you are right. They can do something about it. But do they? No. Because the game is based on winning the war. The people that fought for a day or two to win, are not going to change. Even if they can't fly what they want, they will complain but not change because they are about to win anyways. It was a great idea, and better than doing nothing about the issue. I just don't think its working the way we wanted to. And, no, I don;t have the solution, we are just talking here. I thought the ENY was going to be it.
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From High Techs answer I glean the following for myself it may effect you differently:
1. Play the game as it is
2. If I don't like the ENY, then log off
3. It ain't gonna change
So basically I just play the game until I don't like what's going on, then I log off and do other things. Or play other games. That will certainly reduce the numbers inbalance. However, having your customers chose to not play your game and do other things seems a bit unwise.
HT gets the subscription money (which at $15 a month is an incredible bargain). But the arena loses another player.
It is numbers in the arena that generate more numbers, which generate more intrest, which generates more paying customers.
As for the ENY system, like the perk system, like LA7's and all the other stuff, it aint' a gonna change boyz n girlz.
So play on the side you are on, switch sides, or log off.
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Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+
From High Techs answer I glean the following for myself it may effect you differently:
1. Play the game as it is
2. If I don't like the ENY, then log off
3. It ain't gonna change
So basically I just play the game until I don't like what's going on, then I log off and do other things. Or play other games. That will certainly reduce the numbers inbalance. However, having your customers chose to not play your game and do other things seems a bit unwise.
HT gets the subscription money (which at $15 a month is an incredible bargain). But the arena loses another player.
It is numbers in the arena that generate more numbers, which generate more intrest, which generates more paying customers.
As for the ENY system, like the perk system, like LA7's and all the other stuff, it aint' a gonna change boyz n girlz.
So play on the side you are on, switch sides, or log off.
Pretty much what it sounds like to me. "BUT" you hve to look at it from his perspective.....
You can make some of the people happy some of the time...
It is IMPOSSIBLE to make everyone happy all of the time.
When and if AH goes the way of AW then well all have to find another sim and it'll be the same thing all over again. There will be whining and crying and bickering and backbiting and pizzin and moanin and on and on and on.......
(http://www.hyland.org/sleepyhollow/images/horse.gif)
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Originally posted by CPorky
The object to AH is to enjoy the enviornment while shooting another virtual player down
Especially shooting fighters down in an Osti! :p
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Easy solution to all the probelms...
Cowbells....we need more cowbells.
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I guess I just don't see what the big deal is.
If the country with the largest numbers can't use ALL the A/C in the inventory big whoop!! If you have numbers you can take a field with five C47's and a bunch of IL2's or 109 something or others.
15-20 planes and two C47's are more threatening than 3 Tempests and one C47.
Just my 2cents
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Originally posted by MOIL
I guess I just don't see what the big deal is.
If the country with the largest numbers can't use ALL the A/C in the inventory big whoop!! If you have numbers you can take a field with five C47's and a bunch of IL2's or 109 something or others.
15-20 planes and two C47's are more threatening than 3 Tempests and one C47.
Just my 2cents
No big deal. It just does not work. We are just having a descusion about it. Just some people assume that if you say something does not work, you are whining about not being able to fly the planes you like or that you don;t want to switch sides.
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Just some people assume that if you say something does not work, you are whining
You are whining if you are igorning the facts, just to try support an argument about somthing that works but you just don't like it.
HiTech
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Dolts
sorry, couldn't resist!
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What Moil said.
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Originally posted by AKFokerFoder+
From High Techs answer I glean the following for myself it may effect you differently:
1. Play the game as it is
2. If I don't like the ENY, then log off
3. It ain't gonna change
So basically I just play the game until I don't like what's going on, then I log off and do other things. Or play other games. That will certainly reduce the numbers inbalance. However, having your customers chose to not play your game and do other things seems a bit unwise.
HT gets the subscription money (which at $15 a month is an incredible bargain). But the arena loses another player.
It is numbers in the arena that generate more numbers, which generate more intrest, which generates more paying customers.
As for the ENY system, like the perk system, like LA7's and all the other stuff, it aint' a gonna change boyz n girlz.
So play on the side you are on, switch sides, or log off.
The amount of people logging due to the ENY restriction placed upon them, I would bet dollars to donuts, is no where near the numbers that were logging when they were being beaten into the ground by the hordes flying P-51s, La-7s, and all the other lower ENY planes.
HT must consider this equation a winner.
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Originally posted by MOIL
I guess I just don't see what the big deal is.
If the country with the largest numbers can't use ALL the A/C in the inventory big whoop!! If you have numbers you can take a field with five C47's and a bunch of IL2's or 109 something or others.
15-20 planes and two C47's are more threatening than 3 Tempests and one C47.
Just my 2cents
Absolutely !!!
Are 10 P-51s more threatening than 10 P-47-D25s (or D11s)... me thinks not !!! They are just as, if not more, devasting.
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Originally posted by SlapShot
Absolutely !!!
1...
Are 10 P-51s more threatening than 10 P-47-D25s (or D11s)... me thinks not !!! They are just as, if not more, devasting.
2....
2. The amount of people logging due to the ENY restriction placed upon them, I would bet dollars to donuts, is no where near the numbers that were logging when they were being beaten into the ground by the hordes flying P-51s, La-7s, and all the other lower ENY planes.
This is just a discussion not a arguement to make enemies.
Ok be cool, i'm just discussing this issue, not flaming or slaming.
Is it me or are these statements (quotes) contradicting?
I agree with the top statement. 1.
10- p47s are just as, if not more Devasting then p-51. P-51s no more a threat then p47s.
Lets change the bottom statement just a little... 2.
I would bet dollars to donuts , is no where near the numbers that were logging when they were being beaten into the ground by the hordes flying P-47's-D25s, p-47-D11s, la-5s and all the other higher ENY planes. <--- ok so whey the ENY limits?
I would like to know whats the Big threat from low eny planes? I really dont understand, Please dont be mean if you have a answer about this question, I dont really know all the exact reasons for these planes to be in the low eny catagory. (I realize the la7 may be faster at 20k or what ever then all other planes)(until you hear the la7 driver say"how is this "p47" catching my la7?") <--- kinda ruins the reason for eny on the la7)
I like 1 plane thats low ENY (under 20), not all of them.
Wonder also, if the plane set was not "rated" would there even be this discussion. It seems like the ENY might cause this syndrome, I'd love to know ,if from the start of AH, if none of the planes were "rated" would the planes rated low ENY now, be a issue? I seriously doubt it.
I dont think 95% of the people would even think twice about being attacked by 10 p-51 no more then 10 p-47s attacking.
HT try this for a week or month.................(i know you wont just something to think about if it did happen)
Remove the ENY on all the planes and lose the perks, make all planes available. I'll bet those that fly 109's 190's p47's 205's all the high eny will not all of a sudden start flying all the low eny planes. Let say they do, well then they be fighting the same plane and have no advantage, except for the knowledge of how to fly that plane better then the other la7 driver ,if they have taken the time to learn that plane more. It would be 262 time for about 2 hours til those realize (If your not Fester you really dont want to fly the 262 because you die alot, and will never slow down enough to land, thats after you finally get the dang thing moving). :p
I discuss this not to be "self-serving" its not that important to me-(self), If that was true, then it would be "self-serving" for the people that argue "for" the ENY . We just differ in opinions. , and I'm throwing in my 2 cents happens only because I got like 5 dollars in pennies. :p :eek:
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Originally posted by hitech
You are whining if you are igorning the facts, just to try support an argument about somthing that works but you just don't like it.
HiTech
On the contrary. I never ignore the fact that if one does not agree with you (right or wrong) then he is a whiner nor that eventually the name calling will start. Just to avoid future confusions, as you have sudgested in the past, if I need to contact you or support I will do it through email. Here, I am only talking to other members of this BBs.
And by the way, it does not work. I though it would, but it did not.
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Making them all free leads to chaos.
When the main MA went down not so long ago people migrated over to the Backup MA.
All you could see were 262s.
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>>first off, what makes you think that people are switching countries for the reset, and not just plain logging off<<
Awww jeez JB! And what makes you think they aren't?
Geez, this has been happening for the past 2 years or so :rolleyes: , and it was happening when you and yer squaddies were flying Rooks. It is not a very attractive action and many do it.
I don't see any way of stopping it either. But, if it is becoming obvious to some, then it is probably getting out of hand. Doesn't mean it aint happening.
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And by the way, it does not work. I though it would, but it did not.
Great opinion with out looking at any facts as to how balanced things realy have been since the implimatation of the ENY.
Realy strange that you don't even consider the current imalance will proably be very short lived do to the ENY.
HiTech
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>>who have been on the same side since beta. How boring that must be. <<
Not boring at all Morpheus ;) With the exceptrion of a brief tour as a Nit just after the beta ended, my squad and I have flown Rook exclusively, through thick and thin.
Now as a Rook, when Rooks had huge numbers most nights, me and my squaddies would know who was a "Rook" and who wasn't; especially when we were close to a reset. We just turned our noses up at em. Hehe, it was kinda funny to have shot down some of em on a previous hop, only to have them resurface behind or in front of while taking off, as friendlies :D
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Originally posted by hitech
Great opinion with out looking at any facts as to how balanced things realy have been since the implimatation of the ENY.
Realy strange that you don't even consider the current imalance will proably be very short lived do to the ENY.
HiTech
Never, ever thought I'd say this, but I for once I agree with HT.
OMG the worlds ending.
Only time you really see numbers swelling is when a reset is in the offing, and yes this is due to jumpers.
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Hell freezing over in 5, 4, 3.....
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Originally posted by hitech
Great opinion with out looking at any facts as to how balanced things realy have been since the implimatation of the ENY.
Realy strange that you don't even consider the current imalance will proably be very short lived do to the ENY.
HiTech
Well, you are right. I did not look at how balanced things were in the past. I was focusing on the few days that the thing went creasy. I think this is how the conversation started and like everything else in here it got out of hand and into a different subject when people started calling opinions whines, assuming they know how everyone else plays the game, knowing when if and what you will be changing etc. Also, I never said things would not balance again.
So, over all you are right, things have been balanced. Was it because of the ENY or just another cycle. I don;t know so I will take your word for it. On those few days that it hit the extreme it did not help enyone.
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Originally posted by HavocTM
Hell freezing over in 5, 4, 3.....
...2 weeks
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Originally posted by ghi
I was talking about players changing side just b4 reset, for 20 perks that's cheap in my oppinion
I fight for my country , i'm soldier not mercenary, not for score or personal glory,
If all bish switch country i don't care i'll be the last 1 to defend,
I love Bishland, sexy sheeps, tall trees, just few reasons to defend it, lol
What to do now? should join the Knits horde, and help them vulch the poor newbs Bish??
I would feel like helping a bunch of horny gangsters rape my handicaped sister
I flew rook,they call me "spy", last year i think, (i was drunk in map room and puke on wrong switches),
ROFLMAO :rofl
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The ENY limits have nothing to do with how many perks you get.
umm, sure it does...if eny limits kick in, that means the perk multiplier is kicking in...
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This is just a discussion not a arguement to make enemies.
Ok be cool, i'm just discussing this issue, not flaming or slaming.
I apologize if you got that impression. I was not trying to argue or slam ... just providing a counter-point ... thats all.
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I'll admit, being a long standing rook I whined when the ENY came out. I still have problems with it in some aspects. When it comes to bombers or vehicles I feel sorry for the side that can only up Ju-88's or T-34's because of the limiter.
Now, as a side that is benefitting from the ENY, all I can say is.................. neener neener! And please, don't everyone jump back on the rook side just to balance, the baby seal bishops need help too.
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I know Slapshot my friend, :) I was kinda just making that statement for future posters, just making sure everyone knew people like you and I and the other people are just having a indepth discussion... lol!
Not being radicals like HavocTM lol :p j/k I'm actually with Havoc on the winter in hell , went and bought some extra coats. I'm thinking hell is the next stop for me, if I dont change my ways. <--- that aint happening)))) yup I'm going to hell!! :p :eek:
Its all good my AH brothers! It will all work out at some point , and the Aces High happiness will flow like a river for all. ( well at least 90% of us as usuall) .
H5!
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Originally posted by tactic
(hope ya dont mind me using your quotes AKFoder)
Not at all, I am quite humbled that you would use them :)
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If memory serves me correctly. The ENY sanction system was put into place to Balance Game Play. It was supposed to work two fold. Either by forcing players to change countries (So all 3 countries can fly the entire plane set) or by ( limiting the numbers advantage country to the planes it can fly.)
Either way I don't think it actually has the desired effect. Why? Because it is easier to rack up the kills flying in a hoard, and vulching bases than it is to fly against equal plane sets. In short, The side jumpers don't give a hoot about "Perk Points" but they do enjoy increasing the Death to Kill ratio and Fighter Ranking the easy way. ;)
And by the way. It isnt working. As i clearly said it wouldnt along with a few other players when the idea was first presented in the BBS.
That is all.
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Originally posted by Kev367th
Didn't HT also lower the time between country switches to 6 hrs to encourage people to change?
I would like to see it down to about an hour.
That may encourage people to change more. That is, you swich sides for a couple of sorties, rather than the rest of the night.
The time limit was brought in to reduce spying. (
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I just switched from Bish to Knight, as it seems the Knights are losing at the moment. I read what a lot of you wrote and it made sense: It's just a game. If everyone wanted to be on the winning team it wouldn't be a very fun game.
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Originally posted by killnu
umm, sure it does...if eny limits kick in, that means the perk multiplier is kicking in...
Perk multiplier kicks in any way. Its always on, calculating.