Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: dtango on December 05, 2001, 04:45:00 PM
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I'm getting more and more stoked and anticipating the opening of FOTR on 12/19!
For you Tolkien fans out there, here is a great site to visit:
www3.tolkienonline.com (http://www3.tolkienonline.com)
I have to say I had been really worried about Peter Jackson really trashing LOTR with a film adaptation at worst or doing a mediocre job with the epic at best. The jury is still out but from what I can tell thus far from early film reviews it appears I can set my fears at ease.
(1) It appears long time fans who have seen early screenings have not been disappointed whatsoever.
(2) It appears for the general movie viewer that the majority of Tolkien virgin film critics have given it glowing praises to the tune of things like:
This review is coming to you from a Tolkien-free zone. I went in to Peter Jackson’s movie—the first of a trilogy—with no preconceptions. I came out, three hours later, sorry I’d have to wait a year to see what happens next in Frodo Baggins’s battle against the Dark Lord, Sauron, and thinking a trip to the bookstore to pick up “The Two Towers” might be in order.
David Ansen - Newsweek
I've certainly had my doubts but the early indications are that we are in for a good show for Tolkien and non-Tolkien fans alike with the upcoming movies.
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I don't know that I've been this excited to see a new release in some time. The more previews I see, the more stoked I get.
AKDejaVu
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It has been a long long time since this amount of stoke-age has been felt by me.
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Man I know what you mean guys!
Here are couple more quotes:
I may have never turned a page of Tolkien, but I know enchantment when I see it.
Lisa Shwarzbaum - Entertainment Weekly
In marked contrast, Jackson’s Ring cycle generates the kind of epic cinema excitement, encountered in the films of Abel Gance (Napoleon), Akira Kurosawa (The Seven Samurai, Ran), David Lean (Lawrence Of Arabia), Stanley Kubrick (2001: A Space Odyssey), and arguably last seen on the American screen in Coppola's Apocalypse Now; it certainly far surpasses the standards of popular epics like Braveheart or Gladiator, the Oscar-winners of 1995 and 2000, respectively. What the trilogy's first installment shares with all those seminal movies is not just expansive breadth, but complex and engaging characters, genuine movie magic via state-of-the-art effects, and, most important of all, a moral and emotional significance, which are terribly missing from other event movies such as Titanic, Star Wars, and Pearl Harbor.
Emanuel Levy - Screen Daily
Heck I've even bought into the fact that the changes they did make to Arwen/Liv Tyler having an expanded role work and that she actually is just sublime in the role!
[ 12-05-2001: Message edited by: dtango ]
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Its nice to have had such an anticipated film made so close to home for a change. Its a 4 or so hour flight for me to get there and a whole day for my US friends ;).
That jibe aside, I cant wait for LOTR. The last movie I got this excited about was SW Episode 1, and that turned out to be quite a dissapointment(especially since i went to the midnight premiere on a work nite). Everything i've seed for LOTR looks so sweet and to think its only 20 days away to an Australian release. I'll be on holiday in Darwin, but I know what i'll be doing that day :).
or the hounds with bees in their mouth, so when they bark they shoot bees at you
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I hope Jackson delivers.
<WARNING: serious Geek/Nerdom ahead!!!>
I'm not bothered by the occasional plate mail seen in the trailer, but I am a bit worried about the glimpse where Arwen seems to take the place of Glorfindel at the Rivendell Fjord, when Frodo is chased by the Nazgul. I hope this is only an isolated incident and that she doesn't become a full member of the party. That would be a bit too much.
Charon
[ 12-05-2001: Message edited by: Charon ]
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Must have posted at the same time dtango, whats the deal with Arwen?
Charon
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you should read "bored of the rings' a satire of lord of the rings , and much better i think
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I am waiting for it, I want to see it as soon as possible, though I know that I will not get a chance to see it in a movie, will need to watch it on video. Still I want it.
To understand what is Tolkien for me you need to imagine how it was to live in a Soviet Union. We could not get it in English, only books which were "Approved" were printed, and it took ages... Hobbit was published quit early, in 60x or 70x, but Lord of the rings was published only in 1982, first book, then in 1985 second, and last one was published in the 1987. Translation was terrible, very loosly based on real book, and even for it we waited for AGES.
I really want to see this movie.
Fariz
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Coming from a total Tolkein freak, yes I too hold reservations about the Arwen deal....by the way, it's Glorfindal at the river not Legolas. I have a feeling, however, that Arwen will not be a regular member of the troop, but she will replace others like Eowyn. I just hope that Jackson does not bastardize this and turn it into the fantasy Pearl Harbor. :eek:
Also, as a side note, I am not the pasty faced Goth....Goth, my call sign, is short for Gothmog who was Lord of the Balrogs. We the Nazgul have taken our squad names from these books.
;)
[ 12-05-2001: Message edited by: Goth ]
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Hunh.
It's been a loooooong long time.. 40 years?
The Trilogy was forced upon me by a girlfriend; I was a SF nut (Heinlein, Niven, Saberhagen..) and these Bagginsis were a hoot! Seemed like half the time Tolkien was tappin human racial/gene memories or something..
..or it could have been the mushrooms.
(hang wonders if he can find some more mushrooms before the movie gets released)
Was talkin to some folks out here about the books... they all drew a blank look, (one dude said 'those were pretty thick books right??') most had seen the animated cartoon thing some years back.
When they asked if I'd read 'em I said... "well.. dough! yah! Hell; I'm from the west coast... everybody knows they won't let you leave till yah read it."
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(http://lupoweb.supereva.it/frodo.jpg) :D
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that looks like the epic run of merry and pippin with grishnash. Awesome rendition.
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by the way, it's Glorfindal at the river not Legolas
Goth
Yeah, I just noticed and changed it :) Time for a reread I suppose. I was actually thinking, though, that she might somehow end up replacing Leoglas, or otherwise joining the party which would be a deal killer for me.
From what I can tell at the various sites she will perhaps fill in for a number of Elven sub characters including Glorfindal. I suppose that wouldn't be so bad, but having her be a "warrior" certainly changes her basic character (and there's already Eowyn for the warrior princess angle).
Charon
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She doestn replace legolas. Just glorifindal. I dont know if they swapped Eoewn as well. Wouldnt make much sence if the did. might substitute her brothers for her in the last book though.
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more of what LUPO posted here: http://fan.theonering.net/rolozo/images.php?collection=howe (http://fan.theonering.net/rolozo/images.php?collection=howe)
most of them > 1280x1024
[ 12-05-2001: Message edited by: Qnm ]
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In an attempt to answer Charon's and others questions, here's what I've been able to gather on the Arwen, and Eowyn question.
WARNING: SPOILERS AHEAD SO DON'T READ THE FOLLOWING IF YOU DON'T WANT TO READ A COUPLE OF DETAILS ABOUT THE MOVIE.
Arwen takes the place of her brother, Glorfindel as previously stated during the Flight to the Ford. I have to say that I was really taken aback by this and thought that this was a negative change especially in the light of Liv Tyler playing the role.
Several things have actually changed my mind on this.
#1 Peter Jackson really thought that it was going to be really difficult for audiences to buy the deeper love story behind Aragorn and Arwen on screen based just a very fleeting glimpse of Arwen in "1st" book. This is especially important in the light that one of the main reasons Aragorn wants to re-establish his rightful throne is based on his love for Arwen. With that in mind they thought it was necessary to give Arwen a little bit of time so that audiences will develop an emotional attachment with Arwen as well as an emotional connection with Aragorn's motivation as well since this love story has a central part to play. This makes a lot sense to me. I think it actually works out well as well that Arwen in the movie really just takes the place of Glorfindel, her brother anyway. It is conceivable that she could have easily been the rider that carries Frodo across the Ford vs. Glorfindel.
#2 From accounts I've read by Tolkien enthusiasts worried about the same thing, Liv Tyler actually plays the role of Arwen quite well. Of course I haven't seen the performance but I have to say that seeing even the short line she has in the trailer she delivers convincingly and I have to say even for a brief second I was seeing Arwen alive on screen and not Liv Tyler. The jury is still out for me I guess but at this point I think my fears have been relieved.
BTW- Arwen isn't a part of the Fellowship so don't worry about that. And Eowyn is still in the story- played by Miranda Otto.
Tango, 1st Lt.
412th FS Braunco Mustangs
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Ammo:
Just looking at the site posted by Qnm. Actually I think that's Frodo and Sam in the Land of Mordor marching along with one of the orc battalions.
Tango, 1st Lt.
412th FS Bronco Mustangs
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I waded through all the books in the early 70's. All I got was a headache, and a strange sexual attraction to the word elves.
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Eowyn will be played by Miranda Otto... Who was the wife of Pvt. Bell in 'the Thin Red Line'... which is the only place I remember her from.
http://www.theonering.net/movie/cast/otto.html (http://www.theonering.net/movie/cast/otto.html)
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oh... dtango just said that... hehe...
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Glorfindel is no relation to Arwen. He is just a Noldor lord with a common name that has been hanging out at elronds house since the the fall of Lindon. Arwens brothers are the twins Elohir and Elohan or something like that. Removing Glorfindel from the story is no big deal really.
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You guys are waiting? You haven't had to put up with LOTR pleebs running round town, setting up set in your favourite fishing spots, having hundreds of zit-ridden-teenage-boys trying to get into bars or clubs cos Liv Tylers there.
Me, I'm off to the movie care of Toshiba on 20/12/01 :) oh and thats GMT+12 so I'll beat yas to it. They are showing on the 19th here but Peter-freaking-Jackson has booked out EVERY theater in town.
Any you boys watched Frighteners or Meet the Feebles? Good insight into his mindset :D
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Glorfindel is no relation to Arwen. He is just a Noldor lord with a common name
Oh boy - what's an uncommon name then? :D
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Originally posted by dtango:
Ammo:
Just looking at the site posted by Qnm. Actually I think that's Frodo and Sam in the Land of Mordor marching along with one of the orc battalions.
Tango, 1st Lt.
412th FS Bronco Mustangs
Oh your right! First glance I thought it was the march in Rohan to Saruman's tower.
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A few links maybe you know, maybe you dont. www.theonering.net (http://www.theonering.net) and www.lordoftherings.net (http://www.lordoftherings.net)
Evidently Tom Bombadil is completely ommited due to film making stuff. Also I believe that the Barrow wights and the barrow downs are also ommited. However everything I have seen or read is great. The movie is well within the original story line. Somehow Peter Jacksons idea of what an Orc looks like was not close to the picture I had painted in my mind. But I imagin after watching this movie, everything will look different for me in my mind in regards to this story :) I have read the 3 book set 9 times since 1991.
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Check this
imo better then LOR (http://www.sapkowski.cz/GFX/FILM/preview01.avi)
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listening to the unabridged CD now (16 CD's)
good, (like Tom Clancy better :)), hope movie moves alittle faster pace
wonder if it'll break the new records set by Harry Potter.
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Aw, thanks for correcting the info on Arwen, Glorfindel, et. al. Pongo! My bad for dissemenating misinformation!
My wife gave me the BBC audio version (13 tapes) for a gift earlier this year. I enjoyed that audio series very much actually.
Tango, 1st Lt.
412th FS Braunco Mustangs
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I remember listening to the BBC series on FM radio back in the early 70's. This is one movie I will gladly stand in line to see. I must have read the 3 book set at least a dozen times. I have fond memories of laying in bed in my college dorm and deciding to blow off a class because I was at a good part.
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this is the one I'mlistening to now:
The Fellowship of the Ring
by J. R. R. Tolkien, Rob Inglis (Reader)
I just finished listening to "The Hobbit" by the same reader so I went with this one over the BBC audio.
I'm sure the movie will be fantastic. A great escape for all.
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Originally posted by -lynx-:
Oh boy - what's an uncommon name then? :D
Just a reference to the other Glorfindel in the Sillmarion and died fighting a Balrog in the sack of Gondolin in the first Age. Never figured out if it was the same guy come back for round two or what.
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Originally posted by -ammo-:
Evidently Tom Bombadil is completely ommited due to film making stuff.
If you think about how many different characters there are in the books, and how confusing it can be just when reading them, it makes sense that they would need to remove characters that don't play directly into the main story to prevent the movie from becoming twice as confusing. For each of us who has read the books, there will be 15 people going to see the movie who haven't, and without knowing who the characters are, I could see how it would turn people off to have that kind of confusion... especially across 3 films in two years.
Think of what happened to Dune... Lynch tried to include everything, and it ended up being 4 and a half hours long... so then the studio chopped it up, and essentially ruined it.
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i dont know how you guy remember this. i got obsessed by the trilogy when i was 9 years old (13 years ago now) and read the whole thing in 1 week, stayed up till like midnight every night reading it. but now i cant remember a damned thing other than golumn and bilbo and frodo and gandolf.. mabye something about a eagle man? and the black horsemen but tahts about all i remember lol. you guys know the river names and suff thats pretty wild.
anyways im really looking forward to the movie :)
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Originally posted by Zigrat:
i dont know how you guy remember this. i got obsessed by the trilogy when i was 9 years old (13 years ago now) and read the whole thing in 1 week, stayed up till like midnight every night reading it. but now i cant remember a damned thing other than golumn and bilbo and frodo and gandolf.. mabye something about a eagle man? and the black horsemen but tahts about all i remember lol. you guys know the river names and suff thats pretty wild.
anyways im really looking forward to the movie :)
dude! ditto 100%.
same thing - i remember walking down the street and reading at the same time. i loved that series. same thing happened with the dark tower series later and of course imagica, everville, etc from barker...
i remember nothing about lotr now except the guys in black that went and stabbed some pillows or something while the good guys escaped...i dont know.
that is wild that you guys are that geeky - i feel better about my chess habit now. ;)
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Never quite understood why JRRT put Bombadil in the book anyway. I guess it was just to tie it all together with his Middle Earth history. I think he wrote the Ode to Tom Bombadil before the trilogy.
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I think just to make it interesting... the books are very episodic, with distinct adventures and characters within those adventures. It was just one of the early trials of the journey.
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I'm just glad I'll finally be able to tell people that I'm "sneakin!" and have them know what the hell I'm talking about :D
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Just looking at the site posted by Qnm. Actually I think that's Frodo and Sam in the Land of Mordor marching along with one of the orc battalions.
Tango, 1st Lt.
412th FS Bronco Mustangs
Of course it is! :)
Happy to discover that a lot of my virtual fellows of AH are also Tolkien fans!!!
I know that many of the names of the saga changed in italian translation. It's nice to read hear the english ones...
Long life to the Hobbits!
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Originally posted by mrfish:
that is wild that you guys are that geeky - i feel better about my chess habit now. ;)
is that chess or chest :)
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Always kinda felt that being a LOTR fan was akin to being able to quote from "Monty Pythons Holy Grail". Both will accelerate your climb towards Dweebish Nerdiness.
Glad to see there is plenty of competition here for the Alpha Nerd position.
:cool:
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Guys.
If you havent read LOTR since you were 9 years old. Its time to crack it again.
I think many people on this board have minds that love detail and that is the trap that Tolkien sets. You cant even dent LOTR with one reading.
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Always kinda felt that being a LOTR fan was akin to being able to quote from "Monty Pythons Holy Grail". Both will accelerate your climb towards Dweebish Nerdiness.
Glad to see there is plenty of competition here for the Alpha Nerd position.
Its not really an official nerd topic until Skuzzy joins in.
Of course, the ultimate in nerd conversations would be either "Magic the Gathering" or "Dungeons and Dragons" stories. I haven't seen people go there yet... so there is still hope. :D
AKDejaVu
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Originally posted by Kratzer:
If you think about how many different characters there are in the books, and how confusing it can be just when reading them, it makes sense that they would need to remove characters that don't play directly into the main story to prevent the movie from becoming twice as confusing. For each of us who has read the books, there will be 15 people going to see the movie who haven't, and without knowing who the characters are, I could see how it would turn people off to have that kind of confusion... especially across 3 films in two years.
Think of what happened to Dune... Lynch tried to include everything, and it ended up being 4 and a half hours long... so then the studio chopped it up, and essentially ruined it.
Yea thats true. To include every character adn every event would be near impossible in the theatre. And Tom was not a *key* character for sure.
I was deployed to desert storm when I first read the books, and then every deployment thereafter I read them again. They never siezed to capture my imagination, each and every time. I just read the set again in July of this year
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BTW, if you like LoR (which obviously every right-thinking human does ;)), try Dennis McKeirnen's Iron Tower trilogy.
Some say it is too much a take-off on LoR, but I found the books to be very enjoyable, fast-moving and different enough to be interesting.
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My latest reading of LOTR was almost exactly a year ago. Before that it was 19 years ago that I last read it. I think it took me 4-6 weeks or something- just before and through the first few weeks of our 1st child being born. It's like reading the Bible for me in the sense that each time I read it I find a new gem, or new angle or thought on something that I didn't see before. 19 years was too long to wait. I'll probably cycle through it every couple of years now.
This last version I bought was the paperback that consists of all three books and and a few appendices that covered language and timelines and short stories on the history of Middle-Earth. I really enjoyed reading through appendices on history and finding about the stories before and after the LOTR story arc.
The story certainly captures my imagination too. The scenes that are painted are certainly majestic and sweeping. I think the theme that I enjoy most about LOTR (and there are many in LOTR that really captivate me!) is the camaradre, loyalty and sense of "fellowship" or whatever you want to call it among the characters. LOTR is certainly a very beautiful and sweeping story.
I think that it is certainly a classic that I hope many others will enjoy into the future. I think that it's too bad that for many the average reader that may not take to the "fantasy" / "mythical" genre have missed a wonderful book by putting LOTR in that class and have missed a truly wonderful book.
Tango, 1st Lt.
412th FS Braunco Mustangs
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Tah Gut.
If your on this message board..95 % of the population thinks your a geek allready. Enjoying the best book written in the english language in the 20th century isnt going to hurt your rep at all...Nor is being able to keep the Charecters straight.
"well ahh. I read the lord of the rings once..but I dont remember it...so Im still cool right?"
lol
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Tah Gut.
If your on this message board..95 % of the population thinks your a geek allready.
LOL, I guess that 95% can join my kids in the "Think Tahguts a Geek" club. Aaaaaaahh well, I used to be cool, I swear! It's almost imposssible to convince teenagers that you once actually were part of the "in crowd".
Thanks for cheering me up Pongo :rolleyes:
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Just spent $50 on the Fellowship of the Rings on CD. With a 45 minute drive to work, I might be able to listen to the whole thing before I get a chance to see it :)
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Dune:
Did you get the BBC adaptation or the NPR adaptation?
Tango, 1st Lt.
412th FS Braunco Mustangs
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I read the books long ago, and I still think about the Ents, waybread, the Nazgul and such, from time to time. I also remember some of the vivid descriptions. The Hobbits are a good metaphore for people in general... at times petty and venal, pleasure loving creatures, but mostly good.
I would have liked to meet the old boy who wrote these.
Can't wait for the movie, although I don't expect it to measure up...
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Read the Hobbit then the LR Trilegy back in 1968, since then I've revisted them at least once every 5 years or so. Very much hope this movie can do the books justice.
Hangtime, I see we have quite similar tastes in SF. :)
However I dare any of you to top this.
Anyone else ever gone to a Science Fiction and Fantasy Convention as a Ferengi in full costume? Ohh and won first prize in costume contest to top it off :)
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Bet my neice a buck that LOTR will have a bigger first weekend than Harry Potter.
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Anyone else ever gone to a Science Fiction and Fantasy Convention as a Ferengi in full costume? Ohh and won first prize in costume contest to top it off
All Hail the Alpha Nerd <Bows out of the room humbled and in awe> :D
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LOL Ghosth..
I share Heinliens view of SF, and writing..
Its like sex, best done behind closed doors, and most entertaining if approached with enthusiasm.
Not ONE SF movie has ever been half as entertaining as the book that inspired it.
If you guys that have never read the Trilogy (Lord of the Rings coined that phrase, BTW)like the movie; imagine how good a read you've missed. :)
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When it comes to good SF writers, there are many, but the best to me is H. Beam Piper. His life was short and his books are out of print, but if you can find them, they're fantastic.
Of course, I wouldn't turn down Heinlein, Dickerson, Norton, Drake, Pournelle, or Lamaur.
Oh, btw, I like Frank Herbert too. :)
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and Dick, Asimov, etc?
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H. Beam Piper...
(scrathes head) AHH!
The Pensylvania State Trooper; time shifted... awsome stuff... Conan-ish; as I recall; bringing gunpowder technology to a seiged civilization.
Author committed suicide; work largely unsucessful at the time; late 60's?? Been so long...
Or it could be I got him confused with somebody else. ;)
How about Spider Robinson?? Hehehhe... I actually looking for Calahans.. somehwere out on Route 25 here on Long Island; first thing when I moved here 20 years ago. :D Spider eventualy sold out; and went to Nova Scotia as I recall.
Damn, my nerd hat is glowing again. :D
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Lord Kalvan of Otherwhen!
Exactly Hang! Started the Paratime series.
His best was the Uller Uprising. He used the Sepoy Uprisings in India as a basis for a novel set in space. Damn good.
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BTW, thought you all might be intersted in this pic ;)
(http://ak1.aka.eonline.com/7/1480/1218/0001/www.eonline.com/Features/Specials/Lordrings/Gallery/Images/photo.13b.jpg)
PS, dtango, I'll have to check which version it is. All I know is it's 12 hours long :)
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Hangman said..................
H. Beam Piper... (scrathes head) AHH!
The Pensylvania State Trooper; time shifted... awsome stuff... Conan-ish; as I recall; bringing gunpowder technology to a seiged civilization. Author committed suicide; work largely unsucessful at the time; late 60's?? Been so long...
Or it could be I got him confused with somebody else......................... ...
Nope, right on target :)
Stephons house or something like that was the title. He acutally used the gunpowder thing in 2 places, one a short story, one a fledged out full novel.
Best of all H Beam Piper books still unmentioned though. Little Fuzzy :)
Beat the Ewoks by ohhh 10 years?