Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: thebest1 on July 14, 2005, 03:21:48 PM
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The Terrain!!!!!!! It seems to me that the terrain engine is alil dated to me but i think it would be a HUGE upgrade and it will bring many more faces to Aces high. Maybe a more 3D ground and itll be wonderful!
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Beach transitions!
I guarantee, that with beach transitions the terrains would suddenly look really great.
My opinion is that there are two largest reasons why people feel AH2 terrain is bad.
1) Even though they might not know what it is exactly, they still can sense that something is wrong when they fly around the terrain.
Frankly, seen from the sky, AH2 terrain isn't that bad at all. It's not as good as IL2/FB, but it's really not that bad.
However, at a glance, immediately your brain notices that something's not right. Something just doesn't look real...
There aren't any beachs around!
Here's a mockup pic I hastily did,
(http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/232_1121380295_default.jpg)
is the current AH2 coastline. The mountains and hills look terrific.. but the beaches.. terrible, I'm, afraid.
There are no beach transitions.. and look at the coast line - it's a "Rias Coastline", otherwise known as a "Sawtooth Coastline". Usually, this kind of 'sawtooth' pattern does not manifest unless seen from very far away. The coastline is way too exaggerated in the 'sawtooth'.
is the hasty mock up. The coast line has been smoothened, and green-beach-water transition has been added. Immediately, it looks a whole lot better.
2) The second problem is a simple one.
The terrain makers exaggerate the variances in terrain levels too much. Mountains are too high. Canyons are too deep. High hills and mounds everywhere.
In short, when we fly through the terrain, it doesn't look like a real-sized terrain. It feels like we're flying through a miniature terrain.
If AH terrain was a city, we're not flying through the skylines in a helicopter sized plane. We're like Godzilla sized planes walking through a city.
The hills and mountains need to more smooth, less exaggerated. High mountains will run smoothly for miles, low hills might not even be noticeable.. however the terrain is so bumpy everywhere that it just doesn't seem like a real world terrain.
You may not realize it, but your eyes and brains realize that no real world terrain would be so exaggerated in such a manner.
For instance, look at the above posted picture. A high, bumpy mountain region, right next to a mass of water.
In real life, for a mountain/hill region right next to an ocean region, to look that way, the scale of the pic would be like 100 miles x 100 miles. However, the above picture is an area not bigger than 5 miles x 5 miles.
We don't see mountains and hilltops shaped like pyramids at that distance... we'd see something like that when we are looking at the Himalayas from the foot hills of Nepal. Not when we fly right on top of them.
The exaggeration of terrain is too high. That's why it doesn't feel realistic.
Correct these two problems, and AH2 would feel a lot better.
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It would also help to delete the lakes off of the sides of the steep mountains.
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Originally posted by Kweassa
is the current AH2 coastline. The mountains and hills look terrific.. but the beaches.. terrible, I'm, afraid.
Being currently in vacation what is trully missing is the half naked girl on the beach.
Is Transition your girl friend ?
:p
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Originally posted by MaddogWx
It would also help to delete the lakes off of the sides of the steep mountains.
Yea thats another thing I hate about the terrains in MA.
The Swamp textures look ugly on steep mountains.
Makes me feel like I am flying in a zero gravity world.
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The terrains are there for simplicity. The more complex you make the terrain, the harder it will be for your computer to run it.
So you're taking a FPS hit for eye candy that really isn't necessary.
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id say keep the terrian as is. Perfect :)
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Originally posted by Kweassa
Beach transitions!
In real life, for a mountain/hill region right next to an ocean region, to look that way, the scale of the pic would be like 100 miles x 100 miles. However, the above picture is an area not bigger than 5 miles x 5 miles.
We don't see mountains and hilltops shaped like pyramids at that distance... we'd see something like that when we are looking at the Himalayas from the foot hills of Nepal. Not when we fly right on top of them.
The exaggeration of terrain is too high. That's why it doesn't feel realistic...
I would agreed with you until after I moved to California, here we have the most vertical landscape I've ever seen. You should view the coast from one of the little turboprop jobs that run between LA and Monterey. Or visit the Sierras around Lake Tahoe or Yosemite. I can tell you it's stunning the first time if all you've seen is the Rockies or the Appalachians.
For game play I'll have to disagree with you, I still remember my first canyon fight in the MA during the two week free trial. Chasing a bandit down through those 'unrealistic canyons' was what hooked me into signing up and I bet I'm not alone.
For RL terrain, you have many provided in the CT/SEA arenas but personally I think most of them would be boring if not for the events; with all the realistically flat plains of central europe for example.
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nah, kweassa is right. another thin that sucks about it is the flat and endless green. we need fields and rods, with random cities and towns. just make the system randomly place some new terrain features like farms, towns. also, it would be really coo if the trees were chnged so that you didnt die intantly if you touch em. then we could park inside the trees. random, unlabeled airfields would also look really great, just small grass strips, with onhly a small rearm pad :)
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Now then, for the beaches, the roads, rivers and lakes, you bet, they could each use some work.
In RL you can see the roads, rivers and lakes from 35,000 feet but not in AH. Also, roads have intersections in RL but not in AH. Try connecting two roads or two rivers together, it can't be done at present.
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i think the terrain needs to be ROUNDed lol its so sharp and pointy, and the ground is such a lucious green that it doesnt look too real. and i know everyone saying "keep it" just has a crappy computer and will be scared of dropping a few FPS :aok
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You forgot us color blind guys, what green are you talking about. :) Looks fine to me.:D
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Yeah i dont got the best comp in the game, and it would suck if our frames got hurt just cause a few people with Big comps can handle it. If you do it, please have it be able to be turned off or on.
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I don't really need "nicer" looking terrain, or anything other than what we currently have here in terms of graphic detail, but I wouldn't be upset if at some point I saw a map that was covered in snow or had deserts.
I've heard rumors that you all used to have a desert map. Unfortunately, I missed it. I remember the Krait's old program for AW though, and I used to love flying around with the desert terrain.
I wouldn't *think* that it would involve more than switching out one terrain for the other inbetween map switches, which might take a bit longer when you need to load a new one. I wouldn't *think* that this would make your FPS drop necessarily. But I honestly have no idea and if I'm wrong please correct me.
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AH used to have beaches with little beach defence obstacles on them etc.
The problem with Clownie's idea of citys fields etc is that when you fly down near them they turn out tyo be flat blobs of brown or green!! :lol At least they used to be like that in other sims I've tried.
Snow on the high mountains would be good. Global warming seems to have realy kicked in in AH world
Make beaches and snow on Mountain tops but the rest seems ok to me.
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Me fly plane.
No care if ground prettier.
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AH not only had desert maps, but winter ones. everyone's favorite of corse was fin-rus. perfect for winter map. i dont care about beaches. they would be nice but first we need desert and snow terrain. i remember the hedghogs on the beach, those were fun.
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Yes we need snow desert and stuff too. Also give us back nightime so all those night time skins are worth having!
The environment is a big part of the game and the immersion factor. At the moment, whilst there have been many improvements, overall the environment is lacking.
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Originally posted by Skydancer
AH used to have beaches with little beach defence obstacles on them etc.
In AW if you looked closely, sometimes you could see sheep. I'm old and senile but I think you could shoot them too if I recall :)
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Alky you are quite right AW did have sheep and you could shoot em as I recall.
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They also screamed when shot.
I still wake up sometimes, wake up in the dark and hear the screaming of the lambs...
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lasersailor, it doesn't necessarily have to be complex.
The only reason why land-beach-water transition would be a resource hog, is when HT decides put nudie women on them.
Remove the nudies, beachballs, and surfers.. and no reason it would hit FPS.
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My guess on all of this:
HTC has a sort of "Christmas tree" approach to development here. Right now we have the trunk and branches of the tree, and as we go, ornaments will be added. Daddog posted some of what the terrain team were working on a while ago, but there have been some changes with the terrain and object editors. But either way, I'm positive that someone is working on transitions.
-Sik
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I don't use the ground very much, but it would be cool if there were more realistic features on it. I would like to see roads that follow realistic paths over the terrain, and not have them winding all over the place for no reason. I know that they have to be a certain length to make the trucks travel at a certain speed, but that's a whole other topic on how the convoys work. I also think the roads should not climb or decend very steep hills, nor should they have bridges randomly placed for no reason. Why would there be a bridge on a road on flat ground with no water?
The new trees are nice, but they need to be trimmed down in size and removed from runway ends.
Airfield placements seem kind of odd in some cases as well. Like when both ends of a runway face a hill for example.
I certainly don't like how small bodies of water seem to form a pattern when viewed from a couple thousand feet up, nor how some of those bodies of water are magically held in place on the side of a steeply sloped hill.
Snow would be nice at higher elevations.
Finally, sort of a terrain issue is the clouds. They look cool from far away, however they seem to have no effect on vision, as you can see right though them. The upper layer is too flat and you get no feeling of flying through it. You are either under it or over it.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
.....
I still wake up sometimes, wake up in the dark and hear the screaming of the lambs...
...What do you hear, Clarice?....
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we need something like a texture or something, not jusyt a bmp streched over a ground model.
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Originally posted by Kweassa
In short, when we fly through the terrain, it doesn't look like a real-sized terrain. It feels like we're flying through a miniature terrain.
This has been my arguement for years. Anyone who has ever flown through mountains in a single engine plane knows the feeling of being dwarfed by them. Not the other way around.
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By the way guys, I heard that one of out mapmakers-of-doom is currently making a desert map. Quit crying. :lol