Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: fscott on June 20, 2001, 12:29:00 AM
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The first pic is just general beauty.
The second pic shows how detailed land battle can be.
The third pic is my 9th kill in one sortie. Notice how there is fire and smoke billowing out his rear.
http://corn555.tripod.com/pic.html (http://corn555.tripod.com/pic.html)
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tripod sucks.
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S!
Looks You got some pretty good FPS there fscott.How is the game now after these new patches released?
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Whats with the grainy low res pix?
You can download Paintshop Pro demo for free, converting them to .jpeg and not have to reduce the quality of screenshots. I can get good ones at 1280X1024 to post at 71K.
I can see your enthusiasm to post WWIIOL stuff, but low res screens just make it look goofy. I can't even read the guages in the aircraft.
Good luck-
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mmmphh.. :D
yer evil.
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Umm.. ahh... how to say this gently so no hearts are broken...
Creamo, that's what the gauges look like in the forward view.
If you want a more defined view, you hit keypad 0 and your head drops vertically to your navel and you stare directly at the instrument panel. You can read them then but you can ONLY see the panel.
Another keypad 0 and you pop your head back up to the top of the spine. This is called "realism". ;)
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You can argue all you want about periphal(SP?) vision and focusing, you can argue that having to switch view to get exact readings simulates the fact that you need to shift focal point of your eyes to read the instruments...
In AH you can keep your focus at the con and read the instruments perfectly fine without shifting focus...and they call that realism *LOL*
I guess you know this, but you blatantly disregard it, because it's fun to dis the 'other sim', maybe because you're a 'AH lemming'?
;)
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How ironic that it's ok to "pop" your eyes down to your navel all for the sake of realism, yet you cannot look behind you.
Hehe, gotta love it! :D
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Hey I just wanted to show some cool pics. Yeah they are garbled but I tried jpg then right. Uhmm, it's much cleaner in the game.
banana, there is no check six in many planes, especially the 109. Yeah you can look behind you, but all you see is the seat. It's possible they may implement a check 6 so you can turn around and see the seat, if that's your thing.
Persaonlly, I wouldn't go back to a check-6 game. I simply love the fact that people cannot just turn their head 180 degrees. Yeah you can do it while sitting in your computer cahir, but have you ever been strapped in 109? I have. Small cockpit, you can HARDLY turn around 180 degrees. And when you do you see the seat.
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Oh...but the Linda Blair head swivel (TM) isn't that realistic either.
There are different opinions on 'realism', a concept that is ridiculos in the context anyway.
Just because two sims take a different approach there's nothing that says that one is wrong, and the other is right.
Remember the everlasting pad-lock arguments (read: flame fests)? Gimme one arguments for, and I'll give you two against.
However, if a WWII vet says he could check his six, ok so be it. Could everyone check their six? Was it cumbersome? Did it require you to strap in a bit loose?
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Originally posted by Jammer:
In AH you can keep your focus at the con and read the instruments perfectly fine without shifting focus...and they call that realism *LOL*
Probably because in an airplane you can look at any instrument you want by simply shifting your eyes quickly, getting a reading and focusing your attention back in front of you.
You do know this is possible, don't you?
:)
-SW
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Yes but on a computer screen your eyes don't have to shift focus...they remain on the same focal point, while IRL going from close distance focusing to 'infinity' focusing take up to a full second...
You know that, don't you?
;)
Do a simple test...hold a book out low on arm lenght distance...focus your view on a distant object (>500m)...try to read the text in the book without shifing focus back to the book...let me know the result.
[ 06-20-2001: Message edited by: Jammer ]
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My point is, to view an instrument you have to shift your focal point (move your eyeballs) to view a single instrument for it to be worth any salt, then you go back to focus on the plane.
Now IRL, I've had no problems focusing on an instrument then focusing back on a companions plane. Eyeballs focus in a matter of milliseconds....
(http://ukobservers.net/cwm/contrib/blackeye/SMILies.gif)
-SW
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from my experience in ww2, limited as it is, I don't think you need to look at the gauges as flying the planes in there is pretty simple. I really like the way you can kick in the aileron trim and scoot around in a turn like you are turning on a dime. Full speed in a 109 no less. :)
Eagler
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I don't think it's prudent comparing WW2OL's fm to AH's fm and I assume that what's you are doing by stating "you can kick in the aileron trim and scoot around in a turn like you are turning on a dime."
FM debates can go on and on forever with no real winner. It would be too easy to dish AH's numerous fm flaws, as in easy mode takeoffs just to name ONE, but wait..I don't wanna go there. Because it's a pure waste of time.
Instead I like to focus on the combat environment. For me, the better environment is what gets my vote as the better sim. And this will be different for each person because we all like different variables in our environment. I don't mind a few short-cuts in the fm as long as the combat is good. That's why I enjoyed AH for 7 months straight. But I think WW2OL has a great combat environment. It is the most fun I've ever had flying in a furball.
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FWIW, a glance inside at an airspeed indicator in a RL aircraft is far easier and faster than doing the same thing in either WW2OL or AH.
AH is closer to RL in this respect but it still isn't as easy.
But there are those who would rather hang onto the notion that higher difficulty = higher realism. Pyro put this all pretty eloquently in a post that was swallowed up in a BBS burp. Wish that was still around, it was a well done statement.
Anyway, usually I find that these "harder= real-er" guys have never flown anything other than a paper kite on 250 yds of string. :D
[ 06-20-2001: Message edited by: Toad ]
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Originally posted by Jammer:
while IRL going from close distance focusing to 'infinity' focusing take up to a full second...
no it doesnt.
-AKHog
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fscott
Not debating the FM's just stating the fact that in AH I have to check the gauges & trim while in WW2 I do not. Both games have their place in my virtual library, being a WW2 German aircraft nut, AH is my 1st choice :)
Eagler
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HEY!!!
.... wrong topic
[ 06-20-2001: Message edited by: Westy MOL ]
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fscott, do you mean easy mode as in hitting the button for auto takeoff in your setup? Otherwise, you have to give some rudder input to get up safely in AH. Granted it's not as much as WWII, but it's still there.
quick disclaimer, the following is completely my opinion, based on what I perceive in the sims while I'm flying.
Air combat in WWII is fun, though a bit "arcadish", IMO. It's fun because a 1 on 1 can last a LOOOOOONG time in WWII, heck even multi plane furballs last awhile. Right now, it's just two different styles of fun between the two games. I enjoy playing both, and dogfighting in both. I like the immersion from WWII. If I'm in a Spit, I know I'm going to be shooting at 109s and Stukas. In AH, I have no clue what I might run up against. AH to me is "harder" because there's more to keep track of. WWII is much harder with gunnery (at least it is for me) however. In WWII my problem is hitting the planes with enough .303 lead to knock them down. In AH, my problem is dealing with the player in that other plane, judging his E-state, my E-state, knowing how to react to his actions, knowing when to make him react to may actions. AH requires a higher level of SA than WWII (where it seems like you only need to know if someone is on your 6.) So to me, they are both fun in different ways. WWII gives me a immersive roleplaying environment; AH gives me a mentally challenging environment.
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I don't get it either.
In AH, when I'm tracking a con I can't read my guages, because I aint looking at them.
I may see them through peripheral vision, but I have to look down to read them.
When I look down at them, I lose focus on the con I was tracking.
I may see it through peripheral vision, but I have to look back up at it to get a good read on what it's doing.
Just like in RL, no?
So why do I need an extra key stroke to look down at the guages when when by merely just looking down at them with yer eyes has the exact same effect?
It's BS added unneccessary extra keystroke fake realism.
OR (and this is what I honestly believe)...
The RATS merely couldn't code a good enough cockpit that would allow you to clearly read the guages while having the rest of the cockpit make sense. They needed an extra look down view to accomplish it. There's no other reason for it.
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nice fps 50+ wish i had em ;) i got my 22nd
kill today :D 5 ju87s and 18 109s i do find that against a good pilot it is very intese and last 20 min or more very enjoyable
iv put a few pics up to day on our web page at >>>>http://457thbgh.com/photo.htm
for some reasion i couldnt hyperlink it sorry youl have to copy n past :( ill work on it tho
[ 06-20-2001: Message edited by: DRILL ]
[ 06-20-2001: Message edited by: DRILL ]
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109's do stall :D
I have my game setting for "highest preformance" then bumped the res. to 1024/768 , Enalbe mipmapping check box "on" ,
Filters , Mip check box set to "linear"
also took Creamo's advice "somewhat" and used a differant program to change the pic to jpg :cool: , Microsoft's Picture it .
(http://www.e-webgate.com/airsquadron/noncgi/uploads/109falling.JPG)
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AH cockpit might be functional but they are unhistorical, unrealistic and generic.
In RL u can't read the gauges and look out of the windscreen at the same time. In AH you can. Not to speak about the generic, imperial gauges. Not the 109 cockpit I want!! Sure it works but it's not realistic! And who looks at the gauges anyway??? Maybe IFR pilots do but in a aircombat u don't have time for that. IMHO Janes WW2 Fighters had the best (looking, most realistic...) cockpits of all WW2 sims (without the pop up windows and HUD arrows etc.). WW2O cockpits are not perfect but fit my needs better. From the normal POV the gauges give me enough clues to judge my speed, alt etc. (and I can still look out of the window for that matter). If I need more information I just simply press a key which is a matter of milliseconds as well... :)
All other than that u might prefer HUDs and stuff like that - not me!!
[ 06-21-2001: Message edited by: Kirin ]
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Ha - some more pics...
(http://members.tripod.de/Sir_Kirin/Ram_vs_Spit_c.jpg)
(http://members.tripod.de/Sir_Kirin/burning_spit.jpg)
FScott - HOW you get THAT good FPS? What kind of system you have???
Airspro - wooo... more of you Air-guys over there??? Flying allied? Hehe, alright - I'll meet ya up in the skies, spit-boy. ;)
[ 06-21-2001: Message edited by: Kirin ]
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In RL u can't read the gauges and look out of the windscreen at the same time. In AH you can
:rolleyes:
Ok - here's a simple test, it will take you no more than 3 minutes, and then you'll see how incorrect that statement is.
Simply look *anywhere* out of yer windscreen. Can you read any of your guages? No.
Now get a con on yer 12 oclock. Look at yer guages. Can you read the icon? Range? No.
It can't be done.
What do you have to do? You have to change where you look. To read the guages you have to look *at* the guages. To read the con, you have to look *at* the con. You cannot GET any more realistic than that.
And notice one other thing when you do this. The degrees in which your eyes travel from looking out the windscreen to down at your guages are probably going to be pretty darn close to how much they would have to travel in RL.
Yet people wanna argue for the realism of a keystroke to accomplish this?
I don't think so...
Btw, as long as we're showing off ugly screenshots, here's my contribution (they do seem to have a lot in common): :)
(http://cincinnati.com/freetime/games/reviews/hopper/img/rb3d3.jpg)
[ 06-21-2001: Message edited by: Nash ]
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Nash, in RL a glance is waaaay overmodeled. :D
I hear next generation humans will actually have a small pressure point on the temple near the eyes that will shift your eye focal length almost like a keypress works.
Finally, we'll have RL eyes that are as realistic as a PC simulation. :D
But seriously folks.... the idea that the WW2OL gauges in the default res (800) straight ahead cockpit view are "more realistic" :rolleyes: is so bogus it deserves nothing more than this type of comment.
Particularly on the smaller monitors the WW2OL gauges are excruciatingly difficult to read. This is simply NOT the case for the primary instruments in a Warbird.
So.. that's all I have to say about that. ;)
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I no longer play RB3D Nash, but when I did there were several hundreds of end-user modifications floating about that made the campaign awesome and more detailed plane models (an amazing Fokker Dr1 3D model and skin made by vonHelton) and some amazing terrain bitmaps. I can point you to some websites, if you still play RB3D and are interested in making it better, if you like.
Seriously though, with the mods/enhancements that are floating about for RB3D... it looks 400x better than WW2Ol! ;)
-SW
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In RL u can't read the gauges and look out of the windscreen at the same time. In AH you can.
Kirin you WWIIOL cheerleader, you're absolutely wrong. In real life, you have a very small focus point and a helluva lot of peripheral vision. I cannot both see an enemy plane sharply AND see my speed indicator; I can se one of um sharply at one time, whereas the other is in my "peripheral" or non sharp field of view.
Aces High is closer to reality, because of the artificially extra difficulty added to WWIIOL which demands two clicks on the keyboard to check yer instruments and get back.
In AH: take focus away from bandit, catch instrument in perihperal view, focus on gauge. catch enemy plane in peripheral view, then focus on enemy plane.
In WWIIOL: Hit 0, then find instrument in peripheral view, then focus. Hit 0 again, repeat.
It's just bogus. Do this as an experiment: real the "aces hugh bb>>the o'club>> etc message on the top right of the screen. At the same time, try to make out "instant UBB code". Sorry my squaddie, but yer dead wrong here :).
Not to speak about the generic, imperial gauges. Not the 109 cockpit I want!!
Not arguing with this! :)
And who looks at the gauges anyway??? Maybe IFR pilots do but in a aircombat u don't have time for that.
Ehm, even in a dogfight, I monitor my speed. It's quite doable if you're e fighting.
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Whats with the hoopty sphere containing a 109 surrounded by a compass tape on the aircraft panels?
Oh, and I was goofin on Fscott airpro, as those screens look like toejam no matter what format they are posted.
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Kirin,
I think killshooter is waaay undermodelled in that game. NO way you could survive having Ram in your gunsight :D
Cheers,
Pepe
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Actually, ur right Pepe... ;)
I don't like the 3D floating compass neither - but at least they make it clear it's artificial and don't mesh it into the cockpit... btw, most ugliest cockpits IRL are those warbirds with navigation racks etc. in them... yuck!!
Ok, my RL see gauges/bogey comment was a bit premature... but still I don't like those generic cockpits. What viewsystem is more realistic still open to debate - no doubt the icon system in WW2O is way ahead of AH. And I like the restricted 6 view as well.
Besides, Santa, u only need one click to view gauges and back. Plus u can roughly read the speed gauge even from default position. Hmm, AH teaches you to fly by numbers... not my thing - that's where all the posts like this come from "I was doing this and this at #number, while he was doing this and this at #number when my #number dropped... etc." - in WW2O u have other clues to guess your speed (still LOTS of things missing what makes you feel your plane in RL) but the slats alone (sound and effect) are enough to know when you approach stall speed. And btw. reading perfectly calculated TAS is quite unrealistic for an early WW2 Fighter - but that's what we fly like.
Yes, I am supporting WW2O - not because it's the BEST of BEST - but because it takes some new approaches to things that never been changed since the dawn of online simming. The FM still unrefined but promising. What keeps me in WW2O is the setting, the enviroment, the feeling. The fascination for WW2 avation came to me from what I read in books - WW2O recreats that feeling to a certain extent - AH doesn't. I was playing AH since beta and enjoyed it, but the endless MA deathmatch and some other flaws took the fun out. Maybe AH will attract me again after some updates - but right now my new home is WW2O.
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FM in WWII is a joke but it can still be fun.
I finally decided to play on the German side last night and flew a sortie in a 109 and came back with 9 kills. WAAAAAY to easy.
The FM feels more like FO on easy mode.
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I finally decided to play on the German side last night and flew a sortie in a 109 and came back with 9 kills. WAAAAAY to easy.
Come fly a spit , the guns won't let u get nine kills in it , at least IMO :D
I got to hand it too the 109 pilots in this game , they must meet up with a lot of newbies as all but one has chopped throttle and banked for the overshoot :) they would be much better served to push the stick down , the "one" that did that had my Spit with no gas and he got away clean .
Hey Creamo , the pics really don't look all that good before either !! But I tried it once in 32 bit , man what a diff . Now it hit 4 fps once over some city but it sure looked good , hehe . The clouds in 32 bit look a lot differant , lots better but no can do it and fly IMO on my pc .
All we Allied can do now is fly cover , no bombs :( I really like the icons ( was following a 109 at a distance and looked back to check 6 , then right back , he was gone from view !!! If at distance you don't keep your vision on bandit , he will fade away , hehe , works to your advantage too :)and I always thought that having no radar sucked a big one . But have learned that I was making a BIG mistake on that , seems that I get more one on one fights with out the radar guilding more enemy to me . So far have not had that much trouble finding a scrap either . Lots of newbies plus some vets , you can sure tell the differance in about one turn , hehe .
The best thing is no one can get that big of advantage by having two accounts , no radar , if you get my drift ? I don't know for sure , but this might be pissing some off ? I most likly will get flamed for that statment but how many times has someone come looking for your goon just after he has said were he was on channel 2 ? I know we got so that we wouldn't say toejam were we were at .
I personally think AH is great game , and I am hoping they try out more ideas that seem to work well in this new sim .
cheers
spro
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Originally posted by Kirin:
What viewsystem is more realistic still open to debate
To you perhaps. Certainly not to me.
But I'm glad you are enjoying yourself.
Oh, yeah, please visit the gameplay forum and take a shot at the "visual Realism" test.
:D
[ 06-21-2001: Message edited by: Toad ]
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Keep trying to convince yourself Kirin. It's entertaining.
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Well, Creamo, certainly more entertaining than your random, half-witted comments on every thread.
Actually I convinced myself by BEING in WW2O - something I guess you did not do. I've been in AH probably longer than you and I enjoyed it as long as it lasted. AH grown old to me, was looking for something new - found it!
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Some more pics... :D
(http://members.tripod.de/Sir_Kirin/vulching_c.jpg)
Ah, nothing like a good vulch from time to time
(http://members.tripod.de/Sir_Kirin/panzer_collage.jpg)
Some ground work: blasted away 3 A13s on open field... ;) think the Char coming from the right outside my FOV didn't like it... :D
[ 06-23-2001: Message edited by: Kirin ]
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:D
Here's what a 109 looks like "lightly cooked" hehe .
(http://www.e-webgate.com/airsquadron/noncgi/uploads/109burningupsmall.JPG)
WTG Kirin on the tank kill ! I have so far had no luck at all tanking but it's still fun . Went from Anhee to Dinant last night in a A13 with a trooper and didn't see anything , they had already taken the town by the time we got there .
If you havn't tried this program yet .
If the graft that it shows is true , it's really does free up a lot of memory . I scrubed ram just now and went from 191 to 333 , had the pc on all last night , downloading etc and web surfing playing game and such . I have 384 total with 333 free after the scrub , I see it's only 288 now , lol . Free for a month .
Memory Turbo 2 (http://www.memturbo.com/)
Also did I see that you and a squad mate are going to Duxford ? You could look up some of the air guys , as about 6 or so are going this year .
take care
spro
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How about this for a 109 cockpit
(http://members.home.net/fhmen-temp/images/109G6_cockpit.jpg)
BTW only 9 kills fscott????
I had 10 in 109 in 1 sortie...lol
I`m still losing host a lot,so I`m not in as much as I`d like to
[ 06-23-2001: Message edited by: ~Caligula~ ]
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Tip: If you are trying to sell WWIIOnline, don't post screenshots. It's graphics are not it's best selling point. :)
bowser
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Ooooooh, baby!! :eek: IL2, Caligula?
Ah, wait - is that from B17II? Well, looks nice anyway... ;)
Spro: Wee - that would be great to meet up with you guys! :D Get some of those old birds out of the hangar and give the crowd a good show... ;) Seriously, when are u planning to go there? We gonna be there SAT & SUN!
[ 06-23-2001: Message edited by: Kirin ]
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IL-2,U`ll love it Kirin,it`s WWII flightsim paradise...
I can`t resist to post this pic,hope it won`t be a big deal..
(http://members.home.net/fhmen-temp/images/grab0002.jpg)
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So I guess u in the beta... lucky bastooge... ;)
IL2 looks nice - no doubt...